Re: Savile of Thornhill and Copley: a Plantagenet descent
Claud...@aol.com
Here is the Fitzwilliam documentation I promised earlier.
Sir Brian de Thornhill (1298-1369) married Joan Fitzwilliam (ca. 1320-Feb.
22, 1382/3).
They were married before 1347.
Nottinghamshire Archives: Savile of Rufford: Deeds and Estate Papers
Catalogue Ref. 157 DD/SR
FILE [no title] - ref. DD/SR/26/61 - date: 21 Edw III [1347-8]
[from Scope and Content] Quitclaim by Richard son of Thomas de
Popilwell' in favour of Sir Brian de Thornehill' knight and Lady Joan his wife of his
claim to lands and tenements in the fee of Gomersal' (Gomersall, Yk) which he
had previously granted to Brian and Joan, and also to an annual rent of 12d
from lands there.
Joan was the daughter of Isabel D'Eincourt(?) and Sir William Fitzwilliam.
Baildon & the Baildons by William Paley Baildon, Chapter Eleven - The
Fitzwilliams of Emley and Sprotborough, page 355:
1348 July 25 - Will of Isabel, widow of Sir William Fitzwilliam of Emley. To
be buried in the chapel of St. Thomas the Martyr at Sprotborough. Mentions her
sons: Sir John and Thomas, and her daughters Margaret, Joan, Isabel and
Agnes. Sir William Deyncourt and Sir John Deyncourt, her Godson [filiolus].
Executors her son Sir John FitzWilliam, Sir William Trussebut and Sir Brian de
Thornhill. [Testamenta Ebor. Vol. 1, No. 50]
Thoroton, Antiquities of Nottinghamshire, Vol. III, page 135: [sub Plumptre
and Normanton]
There was a fine levied, 18 Edward II, between William, son of William, Quer.
and Edmund, parson of the church of Plumtre, deforc. of the manor of Plumtre,
with the Appurtenances, and the advowson of the church of the same manor,
whereby it was settled on the said William Fitz-William, and the heirs of his
body; Remainder to John son of the said William and the heirs male of his;
Remainder to Thomas, brother of John in like fort; Remainder to Joan, sister of
Thomas, and the heirs male of her body; Remainder to Agnes, and to Isabel, her
sisters respectively in the same manner; remainder to the right heirs of the said
William.
Reference: WWM/D/26,27
Licence
Creation dates: 27 Dec 1324
Extent and Form: Two copies
Scope and Content
To William Fitzwilliam and Isabel, his wife, to levy a fine to Edmund
Deyncourt.
In the manor of Emeleye, held of the King, as of his manor of Wakefield; and
his manor of Darthington, held of the King as of his Honour of Pontefract, as
the King is informed by Inquisition made by Simon de Grymmesby, escheator for
the counties of York, Westmoreland, Northumberland and Cumberland.
To be to the use of William and Isabella. On default of a male heir, then to
the use of John Fitzwilliam, and thereafter to specified uses.
The consideration is to be 12 marks.
At Nottingham, 27 December, 1324
Seal: Great Seal of King Edward II
Obverse: King enthroned in majesty: open crown of three points fleury,
sceptre ensigned with dove and branch. Throne of elaborate tabernacle work, with
back, rising sides, and front pieces adorned with arcading. Foot board, or
corbel, ornamented with foliage and rings. Under foot, two small lions couchant
guardant; and, at each side of the throne, lion leaping up towards the king.
...ANGLIE DOMINUS H...NIE DUX AQUITANIE
Reverse: Equestrian, King on horse to right, in haubert of chain mail with
crown, surcoat, spur, broad sword elevated and shield or arms of England.
Bardings of neck and flank of horse charged with same arms reversed.
...WARDUS DEI GRATIA REX ANGLIE DNS H...
Round, red wax.
11 Edward II [1317-1318] Fine. Middlesex. William fil William de Emeleye
grants to Edmund Deincourt 1 messuage, 312 acres, 3 roods of land, 1 acre, 3 roods
of meadow and 21s. 4d. rent in Elmton for his life; remainder to Hamon de
Masci and Joan his wife; remainder to Isabella fil Edmund fil John Deincourt.
C143/175/13:
William son of William to settle the manors of Emley and Darrington on
himself, Isabel his wife, and the heirs of their bodies with successive remainders
to John, son of William, Thomas, his brother, and the heirs male of their
bodies, remainder to the heirs of William, son of William, retaining the manors of
Dalton and Sprotbrough, co. York and Plumtree and Hucknall, co. Nottingham.
Dated 17 Edward II [1324].
Reference: WWM/D/34
Confirmation
Creation dates: 20 Nov 1345
Scope and Content
John Fitzwilliam of Emlay, knight, to William Frankys de Cateby and John de
Gray.
Confirming a grant made by his mother, Isabella de Emlay, of 20 acres of land
and a third part of one toft, with appurtenances, in Sprotburgh and Cateby.
Witnesses: John de Raddeklyf, parson of the Church of Sprotburgh, Hugh de
Sandall, Thomas de Huntyngfeld, William de Estfeld.
At Sprotburgh, Sunday after the octave of St Martin in winter (11 November)
1345.
Seal: armorial, shield, 6 lozenges.
Round, 3 cms. red, only centre part remaining, on tag.
Reference: WWM/D/32
Release
Creation dates: 9 Mar 1344
Language: French
Scope and Content
Thomas Flemyngs of Clifton to John Fitzwilliam, of all burdens, dues and
services due in his 3 weekly court for the manor of Wath.
For a red rose at the Nativity of St John the Baptist (24 June).
Witnesses: Bryan de Thornhill, William de Fyncheden, Elis de Bryton, John de
Dranfeld, John de Wodehall de Wath.
At Emley, Sunday before St Gregory (12 March), 1343/4.
The above show that Isabel D'Eincourt married Sir William FitzWilliam between
1317 and before 17 December 1324. As John Fitzwilliam came into the lands in
Darthyngton, Emley and Sprotborough, it is apparent that there was no male
issue of the second marriage. It is significant that the executors of the will
of Isabel D'Eincourt were her stepson John Fitzwilliam, Brian de Thornhill who
married her daughter Joan, and William Trussebut.
As to the birth date of Joan Fitzwilliam we know that she was married before
1347 to Sir Brian de Thornhill. From the ages of her children Margaret, who
married Sir Gerard de Ufflete [see below] and Simon de Thornhill who we have
recorded in documents as early as 1369 [see original post] they were probably
born 1340-1350. The marriage settlement for Margaret gives us a date of
1357-1358 but many of these settlements occurred when the children were adolescents
which is no indication of the age of the parents.
Reference: DD/SR/209/124
Creation dates: 1357 - 1358
Scope and Content
Chirograph: Marriage settlement - Henry de Nuhill clerk to Brian of Thornhill
on marriage of Gerald son of Gerard de Ufflet and Margaret daughter of Brian,
lands etc in Swanland and Ufflet.
Joan died in 1382/3 and had her first children 1340-1350 it would appear that
she was born no earlier than 1320. As for the following document:
Baildon & the Baildons by William Paley Baildon, Chapter Eleven - The
Fitzwilliams of Emley and Sprotborough, page 354:
1327 Sir William FitzWilliam of Hemeley, John his son and Brian de Thornhill,
fled for the death of Sir Richard Plaiz, killed at Helaw. [Exchequer K.R.
Misc., bundle 904 No. 1]
Joan Fitzwilliam may have been married to Sir Brian de Thornhill as a child
[at least age 7].
It is obvious from the fine cited in Thoroton that all the Fitzwilliam
children were born before 1324-1325 when the fine above was recorded.
If Isabel D'Eincourt were the mother of Joan Fitzwilliam then there would be
a line to Henry I through her mother Isabel de Mohun.
Henry I
/
Robert de Caen de Mellent
/
Maud Fitzrobert of Gloucester
/
Hugh de Keveliock, Earl of Chester
/
Agnes le Meschines
/
William de Ferrers
/
Isabel de Ferrers
/
Isabel de Mohun
/
Isabel D'Eincourt
There is no documentation showing Joan Fitzwilliam to be the child of anyone
but Isabel D'Eincourt and chronologically it is very probable that she was her
daughter.
MichaelAnne
The...@aol.com
Dear MichaelAnne,
Many thanks for that superb and detailed post!
In re: the placement of Joan FitzWilliam, wife of Sir Brian
de Thornhill, my prior post in the thread seems to gone astray -
I have copied it below. The involvement of Sir Brian de
Thornhill in 1327 with Sir William FitzWilliam and his son John
(coupled with Sir Brian being an executor of the will of Lady
Isabel (D'eyncourt) FitzWilliam in 1348) make it rather certain
that Sir Brian' wife was a daughter of Sir William FitzWilliam
and Lady Isabel, and not a granddaughter.
On the subject of a possible descent through the Mohun family
from Henry I of England, there is a problem concerning the
traditional position (see CP IV:120, sub _Deincourt_) that
Isabel de Mohun, wife of Sir Edmund Deincourt, was a daughter of
Sir Reynold de Mohun by his 2nd wife Isabel de Ferrers. Chris
Phillips noted a while back (medievalgenealogy.org.uk) that the
Ferrers ancestry for Isabel de Mohun is erroneous:
'The issue of Isabel de Ferrers had certainly failed by April
1327, when an inquisition was taken after the death of John
Meriet, who had married her granddaughter. But at this time at
least two of Edmund's children were alive or had surviving issue
(his son John and his daughter Margaret - see Willoughby, volume
12, part 2, page 658). Clearly, either his wife Isabel was not
the daughter of Isabel de Ferrers, or he had another wife who
was the mother of these children. '
It would seem then that Isabel de Mohun was likely a daughter
of Hawise, daughter of Geoffrey fitz Piers, Earl of Essex (d.
1213) by his 2nd wife Aveline de Clare. This fouls up the Henry
I descent: however, via the Tosny family there is a descent from
Lambert of Lens and Adelaide, sister of the Conqueror, as well as
from Richard III, Duke of Normandy via the vicomtes of the
Bessin.
Cheers,
John
_____________________________________
Tuesday, 7 September, 2004
Dear MichaelAnne,
Good to hear from you; and, thanks in advance for your plans
re: posting on Dronsfeld, Wentworth & c. as relates to the
Thornhills of Thornhill.
As to the issue of the parentage of Joan (FitzWilliam) de
Thornhill, I had not dealt with the placement and chronology as
per the source (Wallop) cited by Brice Clagett; however, it did
seem more likely that Sir Brian de Thornhill's wife Joan would
have been a daughter of Sir William FitzWilliam, and not a
granddaughter. I cited in my post the following from the PRO:
record dated 1327:
' Gaol delivery at York Castle, Wm son of William of Emley,
kt, John his son and Brian of Thornhill, accused of killing
Richard Playce at Dringhouses, put themselves on the county*
are found not guilty ' - PRO, Nottinghamshire
Archives: Savile of Rufford: Deeds and Estate Papers
[DD/SR/216 - DD/SR/237], DD/SR/231/52
* [should read 'on the country']
For Sir Brian to have been 'mixed up' with his father-in-law
and brother-in-law in some possibly shady business ca. 1327 would
seem to make more sense than with his father-in-law and
grandfather-in-law. John FitzWilliam (murdered in 1385?), son
of John, was born in 1327 according to CP, so again it would seem
more likely Sir Brian de Thornhill was married to his aunt, not
his sister.
Cheers,
John
John Ravilious
Dear MichaelAnne,
Cheers,
John
_____________________________________
Tuesday, 7 September, 2004
Dear MichaelAnne,
are found not guilty ' - PRO, Nottinghamshire
Archives: Savile of Rufford: Deeds and Estate Papers
[DD/SR/216 - DD/SR/237], DD/SR/231/52
* [should read 'on the country']
For Sir Brian to have been 'mixed up' with his father-in-law
and brother-in-law in some possibly shady business ca. 1327 would
seem to make more sense than with his father-in-law and
grandfather-in-law. John FitzWilliam (murdered in 1385?), son
of John, was born in 1327 according to CP, so again it would seem
more likely Sir Brian de Thornhill was married to his aunt, not
his sister.
Cheers,
John
Claud...@aol.com wrote in message news:<1ca.2a61e6...@aol.com>...
> Dear John,
>
> Here is the Fitzwilliam documentation I promised earlier.
>
> Sir Brian de Thornhill (1298-1369) married Joan Fitzwilliam (ca. 1320-Feb.
> 22, 1382/3).
> They were married before 1347.
>
> Nottinghamshire Archives: Savile of Rufford: Deeds and Estate Papers
>
> Catalogue Ref. 157 DD/SR
>
> FILE [no title] - ref. DD/SR/26/61 - date: 21 Edw III [1347-8]
> [from Scope and Content] Quitclaim by Richard son of Thomas de
> Popilwell' in favour of Sir Brian de Thornehill' knight and Lady Joan his wife of his
> claim to lands and tenements in the fee of Gomersal' (Gomersall, Yk) which he
> had previously granted to Brian and Joan, and also to an annual rent of 12d
> from lands there.
>
> Joan was the daughter of Isabel D'Eincourt(?) and Sir William Fitzwilliam.
>
> Baildon & the Baildons by William Paley Baildon, Chapter Eleven - The
> Fitzwilliams of Emley and Sprotborough, page 355:
>
> 1348 July 25 - Will of Isabel, widow of Sir William Fitzwilliam of Emley. To
> be buried in the chapel of St. Thomas the Martyr at Sprotborough. Mentions her
> sons: Sir John and Thomas, and her daughters Margaret, Joan, Isabel and
> Agnes. Sir William Deyncourt and Sir John Deyncourt, her Godson [filiolus].
> Executors her son Sir John FitzWilliam, Sir William Trussebut and Sir Brian de
> Thornhill. [Testamenta Ebor. Vol. 1, No. 50]
>
<<<<<<< regretable snip of useful material >>>>>>>
Claud...@aol.com
Thanks for the information on the Mohun descent. I must have missed the post
from Chris and will get it from the archives. I wanted to mention one other
thing in reference to my post of yesterday. It appears that Margaret
Fitzwilliam who married William Bingham must be a definite daughter of Isabel
D'Eincourt and Sir William Fitzwilliam. Margaret is not mentioned with the other
Fitzwilliam children in the fine of 18 Edward II and she is mentioned in her
mother's will of 1348. I erroneously stated that all the children of Sir
William Fitzwilliam were mentioned in this fine and therefore born before
1324-1325, but missed Margaret Fitzwilliam in my analysis. If anyone has more
information on Margaret Fitzwilliam and her descendants I would be greatly
interested.
Thanks for opening this discussion. The Wentworth family of Emsall is
descended from Brian de Thornhill and Joan Fitzwilliam through Jane Mirfield who
married Thomas Wentworth,esq., North Emsall, co. York. Jane Mirfield was the
daughter of Oliver Mirfield by Isabel Saville, daughter of Sir John Saville
by Alice Gascoigne.
Thomas Wentworth and Jane Mirfield are ancestral to both Thomas Wentworth of
Charles County, Maryland and the New England Wentworth line as their eldest
son Roger Wentworth is the direct ancestor of Thomas Wentworth and their son
Oliver Wentworth is the ancestor of the New England Wentworth family.
MichaelAnne
Chris Phillips
> Thanks for the information on the Mohun descent. I must have missed the
post
> from Chris and will get it from the archives.
John was quoting a brief summary in the "Complete Peerage" section of my
website:
http://www.medievalgenealogy.org.uk/cp/p_deincourt.shtml
The page also contains notes of when this had been discussed on the
newsgroup, and by whom, which should help you to track down the relevant
posts.
Chris Phillips
The...@aol.com
Dear MichaelAnne,
Thanks again, also for the added details re: Mirfield, Wentworth
& c.
FYI, here is one later post by Chris Phillips in the thread on SGM
concerning the Ferrers descent, and identification of Isabel de Mohun's
(possible) ancestry.
Cheers,
John
_______________________
From: Chris Phillips (cgp...@cgp100.dabsol.co.uk)
Subject: Re: Solution to the identity of Iseult. wife of Hugh de Audley
View: Complete Thread (18 articles)
Original Format
Newsgroups: soc.genealogy.medieval
Date: 2002-01-28 12:54:56 PST
Douglas Richardson wrote:
> I've checked the chronology of the Deincourt and Mohun families. If
> Edmund Deincourt's wife Isabel was the daughter of Reynold de Mohun,
> then she almost certainly would be by his second marriage to Isabel de
> Ferrers. If doesn't seem possible for Edmund's wife to have been a
> daughter of Reynold de Mohun's lst wife, Hawise Fitz Geoffrey.
>
> However, as you note, Complete Peerage sub Derby, vol. 4, pg. 199,
> states that the issue of Isabel de Ferrers, wife of Reynold de Mohun,
> failed in 1324. This statement stands in conflict with the account of
> the Deincourt family in the same volume, which shows that the
> descendants of Isabel de Ferrers' daughter, Isabel (de Mohun)
> Deincourt, continued beyond 1324. I checked Complete Peerage, vol.
> 14, for a possible correction to this matter but found nothing under
> either Deincourt or Derby.
>
> VCH Bedford, 2 (1908): 351 sub Luton shows that Isabel de Ferrers'
> share of Luton, co. Bedford fell to her her son, William's daughter,
> Mary de Mohun, wife of John de Meriet. On John de Meriet's death in
> 1327, the Mohun share of Luton was redistributed to the heirs of
> Isabel de Ferrers' sisters, suggesting that her issue had indeed
> failed by that date. VCH Bedford cites as its source, Cal. IPM, 1
> Edward III, No. 51, which I haven't examined.
>
> If correct, then it is clear that Edmund Deincourt's wife was not
> Isabel de Ferrers' daughter, or if he did marry Isabel's daughter, her
> issue likewise failed in or before 1327. This would mean that Edmund
> Deincourt either never married Isabel de Ferrers' daughter, or that he
> had his surviving children by a different wife of whom we have no
> knowledge.
I've now looked at John de Meriet's inquisitions post mortem (Calendar of
Inquisitions Post Mortem, vol.7, no 46; pp.20-22). It does seem clear from
these that, as Complete Peerage states, the descendants of Isabel de Ferrers
were extinct by this time. John was holding lands of the inheritance of his
dead wife Mary, by the courtesy of England, in several counties, including
Bedfordshire. In these counties, the heirs are said to be Henry [fitz Piers]
and John de Beauchamp the elder of Somerset (these two being the
representatives of Maud de Kyme), John de Bohun of Sussex, John de Mohun* of
Dunster and Hugh de Mortimer of Chelmarsh. (*John de Mohun appears here -
confusingly - in his capacity as the grandson of John de Mohun, who married
Joan de Ferrers, another of the sisters. This grandfather John thus married
his stepmother's sister.) These are exactly the heirs we should except from
the table showing the descendants of the Ferrers sisters in Complete
Peerage, vol.4, p.199.
> There is another avenue, however, which needs to be examined before we
> conclude that Isabel de Ferrers' issue failed before 1327. Sir H.C.
> Maxwell Lyte's book, History of Dunster, 1 (1909): 32-33 shows that
> Isabel de Ferrers had ten hides of land at Mildenhall, co. Wilts on
> her marriage to Reynold de Mohun. He also states that Isabel's son,
> Sir William de Mohun, inherited the manors of Mildenhall, in
> Wiltshire, and Greywell, in Hampshire "through his mother."
>
> If these statements are correct, then tracing the history of
> Mildenhall and Greywell might well be instructive. If the Deincourt
> family was later in possession of these estates, then it would appear
> that they were probably blood descendants of Isabel (de Ferrers) de
> Mohun.
This is slightly more confusing. John de Meriet's Hampshire inquisition post
mortem says that Greywell belong to a certain Reynold de Mohun, to him and
his heirs in fee, and that he gave it to William, his younger son, and the
heirs of his body. After stating that William's two daughters were dead,
leaving no issue, the inquisition adds that through the failure of William's
issue, the manor ought to revert to one John de Mohun, as kinsman and heir
of the said Reynold. John (aged 40 years and more) is said to be the son of
John, who was the son of John, who was the son of Reynold. (Again, this
agrees with the table in Complete Peerage - judging from the article on
Mohun, John must actually have been in his late 50s.)
A similar statement is made about the manor of Mildenhall in Wiltshire. (Not
realising this was the Mildenhall in Wiltshire, I looked in Copinger's
Manors of Suffolk (vol.4, p.188). Copinger made the same mistake (!), and
refers to an associated order to the escheator (Close Rolls 1 Edward III, pt
ii 24). Copinger was puzzled by which of the Mildenhall manors this was -
not surprising, as it was a manor in a different Mildenhall, in a different
county!)
Were it not for Maxwell Lyte's statement that Mildenhall came to the Mohuns
on Reynold's marriage with Isabel de Ferrers, those records would read as
implying that it was originally Mohun property that was settled on a younger
son, and when his issue became extinct reverted back to the head of the
family.
At any rate, it does seem clear that the Deincourts, and John de Willoughby,
could not be descendants of Isabel de Ferrers. This means that the proposal
that Iseult, the wife of Hugh Audley, was the daughter of Hugh de Mortimer
and Agatha de Ferrers doesn't account for James Audley's stated relationship
to John de Willoughby. (In fact - if we assume that Iseult had _some_ sort
of relationship with the Mortimers - it accounts for the relationship with
only one of the four men mentioned - Ralph de Ferrers.)
Chris Phillips
Louise Staley
>
> Thanks for the information on the Mohun descent. I must have missed the
> post
> from Chris and will get it from the archives. I wanted to mention one
> other
> thing in reference to my post of yesterday. It appears that Margaret
> Fitzwilliam who married William Bingham must be a definite daughter of
> Isabel
> D'Eincourt and Sir William Fitzwilliam. Margaret is not mentioned with
> the other
> Fitzwilliam children in the fine of 18 Edward II and she is mentioned in
> her
> mother's will of 1348. I erroneously stated that all the children of Sir
> William Fitzwilliam were mentioned in this fine and therefore born before
> 1324-1325, but missed Margaret Fitzwilliam in my analysis. If anyone
> has more
> information on Margaret Fitzwilliam and her descendants I would be
> greatly
> interested.
Dear MichaelAnne,
Do you have a source for Margaret marrying William Bingham? I ask because
I have this Margaret married to Sir Henry Pierrepont. The source is pretty
dodgy though being a 1913 history of the Pierreponts which makes Margaret
the daughter of Sir William Fitzwilliams (sic) and "Maude, dau. of Edmund,
Baron Deincourt" so hardly the most reliable.
If Margaret did marry Sir Henry Pierrepont I think she is ancestral to the
Sir Henry Pierrepont d. 1452 who married Ellen Longford of the Longfords
recently discussed in this forum. Although again, the sources for this are
poor.
regards
Louise
--
Quod dixi dixi
Louise Staley
>
> Thanks for the information on the Mohun descent. I must have missed the
> post
> from Chris and will get it from the archives. I wanted to mention one
> other
> thing in reference to my post of yesterday. It appears that Margaret
> Fitzwilliam who married William Bingham must be a definite daughter of
> Isabel
> D'Eincourt and Sir William Fitzwilliam. Margaret is not mentioned with
> the other
> Fitzwilliam children in the fine of 18 Edward II and she is mentioned in
> her
> mother's will of 1348. I erroneously stated that all the children of Sir
> William Fitzwilliam were mentioned in this fine and therefore born before
> 1324-1325, but missed Margaret Fitzwilliam in my analysis. If anyone
> has more
> information on Margaret Fitzwilliam and her descendants I would be
> greatly
> interested.
<snip>
Sutliff
FWIW Payling:238 and Vist. Notts [1569]:55 apparently agree that Margaret
FitzWilliam was married to Henry Pierrepont. Sorry I do not have further
time to check into this just now.
Hap
"Louise Staley" <car...@bigpond.com> wrote in message
news:IcS%c.24352$D7....@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
,snip.>
Claud...@aol.com
You are both correct and I mistakenly stated Margaret Fitzwilliam, daughter
of Sir William Fitzwilliam and Isabel D'Eincourt, married William Bingham. She
was married to Henry Pierpointe making their descendants the only documented
heirs of Isabel D'Eincourt and Sir William Fitzwilliam.
Margaret Fitzwilliam was the only daughter of Sir William Fitzwilliam not
named in the fine of Edward II cited in Thoroton:
Thoroton, Antiquities of Nottinghamshire, Vol. III, page 135: [sub Plumtree]
There was a fine levied, 18 Edward II, between William, son of William, Quer.
and Edmund, parson of the church of Plumtre, deforc. of the manor of Plumtre,
with the Appurtenances, and the advowson of the church of the same manor,
whereby it was settled on the said William Fitz-William, and the heirs of his
body; Remainder to John son of the said William and the heirs male of his;
Remainder to Thomas, brother of John in like fort; Remainder to Joan, Sister of
Thomas, and the heirs male of her body; Remainder to Agnes, and to Isabel, her
sisters respectively in the same manner; remainder to the right heirs of the said
William.
Margaret Fitzwilliam is named in Isabel D'Eincourt's will of 1348 as her
daughter along with the other daughters listed above. Margaret Fitzwilliam must
have been born after 1324-1325.
If you have other information on this line I would appreciate seeing the
descent to the Longford family of Derby.
Isabel Fitzwilliam, sister of Margaret Fitzwilliam, married William Bingham.
As I stated earlier Isabel fits the same chronological probability as Joan
Fitzwilliam that she [Isabel] may also be a daughter of Isabel D'Eincourt.
Sorry for the mixup.
MichaelAnne
Claud...@aol.com
I thought it would be a good idea if we saw the actual will of Isabel
Fitzwilliam instead of just the summary by Bailidon.
Tesatamenta Ebor. Vol. I, Surtees Society, Pages 50-52.
XL. Testamentum Isabelle quae fuit uxor Domini Willielmi Filii Willielmi de
Emeley Militis. (1)
In Dei nomine, Amen. Ego Isabella, quae fui uxor Domini Willielmi filii
Willielmi de Emelay militis, die Veneris in festo Sancti Jacobi Apostoli, Anno
Domini MCCCXLVIII, condo testamentum meum in hunc modum. In primus lego animam
meam Deo et beatae Mariae, et omnibus Sanctis, et corpus meum ad sepelliendum in
capella Sancti Thomae Martiris in ecclesia Sprotburgh cum meliori averio meo
nomine principalis. Item lego luminari circa corpus meum, die sepultarae
meae, viii torches cerae, una cum viii vestibus pro octo hominibus illa
portantibus. Item in distribucione pauperum die sepulturae meae X quarteria frumenti.
Item in oblacionibus et convocacione amicorum, scilicet in esculentis et
poculentis, die sepulturae meae et octava die XX sterlingorum. Item quatuor
presbiteris ad celebrandum pro anima mea in ecclesia de Sprotburgh primo anno XX mar
c. Item Fratribus Minoribus de Doncastre dimidium marcae. Item Fratribus
Predicatoribus de Lincoln' dim' marc. Item fratribus de Tiklid dim. marc. Item
Fratribus Carmel. Ebor. dim. marc. Item Johanni filio meo melius jumentum
equicii mei post principale, cum pullano, unum lectum purpureum cum tapetis, et
unum mazerium cum pede argenti. Item Dominae Johannae uxori ejusdem
Johannisfilii mei unum firmaculum onheled. Item Margaretae filiae meae tercium jumentum
melius equicii cum pullano. Item Johannae filiae meae quartum jumentum melius
cum pullano, carrum meum cum harnes, et unum equum nigrum griseum in illo
tractante, unum lectum de Inde cum tapetis, unum psalterium et unam bibliotecam
novam. Item Isabellae filiae meae quintum melius jumentum cum pullano et unum
album quylt. Item Agneti filiae meae sextum melius jumentum cum pullano et
tercium lectum cum tapeto. Item Johanni et Willielmo filiis Johannis filii mei
duos pullanos de duobus annis meliores de equicio meo. Item Elizabethae
filiae Johannis filii mei ii vaccas cum vitulis et XX marcas quae sunt in manibus
Johannis filii mei, pro diversis rebus per ipsum et uxorem suam emptis de bonis
et catallis Domini mei defuncti. Item Agneti filiae Thomae filii mei C s.
quos idem Johannes filius meus habuit de redditu meo apud Rodington de termino
Paschae ultimo preterito. Item Domino Willielmo TRussebuot melius octavum
jumentum cum pullano. Item Dominae Johannae uxori ejusdem Domini Willielmi unum
cohopertorium de blueto furratum minuto veru et meliorem robam meam nigram cum
mantello. Item Domino Willielmo Trussebuot XX s. Item Johannae Basily de
Radolf unam robam mellet' cum mantello. Item Domino Willielmo Deyncourt unum
anulum cum peridod imposito. Item Domino Johanni Deyncourt filiolo meo septimum
jumentum melius cum pullano. Item Agneti filiae Thomae filii mei i [one]
tapetum i [one] canevac' i [one] materaz ii [two] linthiamina. Item Johannae de
Trnnhill terciam robam meam de brounemelly, duas vaccas cum vitulis, i [one]
tapetum i [one] materaz, et ii [two] linthiamina. Item Elizabethae filiae Domini
Adae de Newemarche moniali unum mantellum de brounemelly. Item Johannae
uxori Willielmi Faukes robam yemalem. Item dominae Johannae Anachoritae mantellum
ejusdem sectae. Item altari capellae Sancti Thomae in eccelesia de
Sprotburgh melius vestimentum meum integrum cum ii teuellis, unum missale, alium
vestimentum pro diebus ferialibus, et minorem calicem. Item altari Sancti Johannis
in eccelesia de Sprotburgh tercium vestimentum. Item Vicario de Doncastre ii
d. Item cuilibet capellano interessenti ad dirige iiii d. Item fratri Roberto
de Shefeld XL d. Item fratri Stephano de Doncastre XL d. Item Johanni filio
Johannis filii mei XX s. Item Willielmo fratri suo XX s. Item Magistro
Willielmo de Auston XX s. Item Hugoni de Sandale XX s. Item Willielmo Gerard XX s.
Item Johanni Turnhill XX s. Item Johanni de Huton XX s. Item Willielmo
Spincer X s. Item Willielmo Coco X s. Item Johanni Hare X s. Item Ricardo
Colteman X s. Item Willielmo Sharpe X s. Item Willielmo Wodelward X s. Item
Roberto de Floberton dim. marc. Item Johanni Broune dim. marc. Item Thomae del
Stable dim. marc. Item Willielmo Soink dim. marc. Item Ricardo Hare dim.
marc. Item Rogero Porter dim. marc. Item Elenae de Pilley X s. Item Johanni
Wrboston iii s. Item Roberto Waferer iii s. Item Johanni pae de coquina iii s.
Item Willielmo page de stabulo iii s. Item Johanni famulo Ricardi Colmane
iii s. Item lego residuum omnium bonorum meorum non legatorum in celebracione
missarum. Et ad istam executionem fideliter faciendam ordino et constituo
executores meos, videlicet, Johannem filium meum et dominum Willielmum Trussebut
et Brianum de Thornhill milites. Item lego C s. sterling fabricae capellae
Sancti Thomae in eccelesia de Sprotburgh, secundum dispositionem rectoris ejusdem
recipiendos annuatim de Hugone de Elmeshall videlicet XX s. Item lego Hugoni
de Elmesale melius pullanum post pullanos legatos Johanni et Willielmo filiis
Johannis filii mei. Item Herberto nuper servienti Domini mei defuncti tunc
melius pullanum mei equicii. Item Willielmo Gerard duos boviculos meliores.
Item Johannae uxori Willielmi Frankis unum pullanum femellum. Datum apud
Emelay die et Anno Domini supradictis.
Memorandum quod Domina Isabella quae fuit uxor Domini Willielmi filii
Willielmi militis legavit post factionem et consingnacionem testamenti sui ultimo
facti rectori ecclesiae de Emelay melius jumentum equicii sui cum pullano nomine
principalis sui ibidem. Item legavit domino Johanni filio suo pelvem
argenteam meliorem, secundum melius vestimentum capallae suae et unum calicem meliorem
et unum missale melius. Item Johannae uxori Willielmi Frankis unam suem
secundum meliorem. Item Henrico Flysch iii s. Item Thomae Fysch iii s. iiii d.
Item Johanni Ingland Vi d. Item Domino Johanni Capellano suo et familiari
unum par semls unum chafnet et unum superpellicum. Item legavit residuum omnium
bonorum suorum non legatorum in celebracione missarum secundum ordinacionem
suam expressam executoribus in predicto testamento suo nominatis.
(1) Sir William Fitz William, Lord of Elmley and Sprotborough, and lineal
ancestor of the present Earl Fitz William, to whose pedigree this will makes
numerous and important additions, and affords much authentic information relative
to the rank and wealth of this antient family at its peiod. The testatrix was
one of the family of Deyncourt, and her name was not Maud, but Isabel.--V.
Hunter's South Yorkshire, I. 336, and II. 93.
The date of July 25, 1348 used by Bailidon was the date the will was written
and not the date of death. She also mentions many people not listed in the
summary in the will.
MichaelAnne
The...@aol.com
Dear MichaelAnne,
Many thanks (and lots of liniment) for posting the will of Lady Isabel
(D'eincourt) FitzWilliam into this thread.
I think certain individuals require no added identification (e.g. Isabel
herself, her husband the deceased Lord William FitzWilliam of Emley and
Sprotborough). The will does identify John FitzWilliam of Emley (later to
die
in 1349) and Thomas as her sons; her daughter in law, 'Lady Johanna' [aka
Jane
de Reresby); and in order, Margaret, Joan, Isabel and Agnes as her daughters.
Other individuals identified in this will:
1. Sir John FitzWilliam of Emley and Sprotborough, fl. 1327-1385, son of
her son John;
" Johanni et Willielmo filiis Johannis filii mei "
2. William FitzWilliam, brother of #1 John; ibid.
3. Elizabeth FitzWilliam, sister of #1 and #2 above;
" Elizabethae filiae Johannis filii mei "
4. Agnes FitzWilliam, daughter of her son Thomas;
" Agneti filiae Thomae filii mei "
5. William Deincourt, Lord Deincourt (fl. 1300-1364), her nephew;
" Domino Willielmo Deyncourt "
6. John Deincourt, brother of #5, her nephew and godson;
" Domino Johanni Deyncourt filiolo meo "
* 7. Joan de Thornhill, evidently a granddaughter (daughter of her daughter
Joan by Sir Brian de Thornhill);
" Johannae de Trnnhill "
* 8. Elizabeth de Newmarch, evidently a granddaughter (daughter of her
daughter Agnes by Adam de Newmarch);
" Elizabethae filiae Domini Adae de Newemarche "
* 9. John de Thornhill, later a clerk, evidently a grandson (younger son of
her daughter Joan, and brother of #7 above);
" Item Johanni Turnhill XX s "
I would hypothesize that certain individuals (noted above, *) were
grandchildren, to whom Lady Isabel was a godparent - hence the added gifts in
her will. Certain others may well have been godchildren, without a blood
relationship.
Any other individuals I can identify (again not among the obvious), I
will advise.
Thanks again!
Cheers,
John