Clifford Confusion: Daughters of the 1st Earl of Cumberland
Brad Verity
Cumberland and his 2nd wife Margaret Percy were:
1) Catherine (d. 1598), m. 1st, John, 8th Lord Scrope of Bolton; m.
2nd, Sir Richard Cholmley, of Whitby, Yorkshire.
2) Maud, m. John, Lord Conyers of Hornby
3) Elizabeth, m. 1533, Sir Christopher Metcalfe of Nappa
4) Jane, m. Sir John Huddlestone of Millom, Cumberland
Collins' Peerage has the same four, but calls Elizabeth's husband Sir
Richard Metcalf. In the 1563 Visitation of Yorkshire, there are only
three daughters: "Elisabeth=Sir Crystofer Metcalff, Kateryn wyff to
John Lord Scrope of Bolton, Mawde wyff to The Lord Conyers". A
footnote states that the first earl of Cumberland is said to have had
another daughter Jane, wife of Sir John Huddleston of Millom.
CP states that the 1st Earl and Margaret Percy were married about 1516.
She died in 1540 and he died in 1542. In his will, dated April 1542,
Elizabeth is not yet married, so the above 1533 date for her marriage
to Christopher Metcalf has to be incorrect.
The only Sir John Huddleston of Millom Castle, Cumberland appears to be
the son and heir of Sir John Huddleston of Millom and Southam,
Gloucestershire (d. 1 January 1512), and his 2nd wife Joan Stapleton.
He was born about 1488, and died in 1547. He was married to Jane
Seymour, the aunt of Henry VIII's wife Jane Seymour, by whom he had
three sons and one daughter. He also was married to Joyce Prickley of
Worcestershire, by whom he had another two sons and a daughter. His
eldest son and heir Anthony Huddleston was born in 1518. I suppose its
possible he was also married to Joan Clifford, but she would have to be
his second or third wife.
Does anyone know what evidence exists for the existence and marriage of
a daughter of the 1st Earl of Cumberland to a Huddleston of Millom?
Here is chronology for the remaining daughters of the 1st Earl:
1) Catherine Clifford, eldest daughter, married 1st, about 1530, John,
8th Lord Scrope of Bolton (d. 22 June 1549), and was a mother in the
early 1530s. She married 2nd, by 1556, Sir Richard Cholmley of Whitby
(d. 17 May 1583), and died 1598, having had issue by both husbands.
[Note: she likely married Cholmley and had his three children in the
early 1550s, as she would be in her forties after 1556.]
2) Maud Clifford, married before October 1539, John Conyers, 3rd Lord
Conyers (b. 1524, d. June 1557), and had three daughters. Date of
death unknown.
3) Elizabeth Clifford, youngest daughter, married about 1545-50, Sir
Christopher Metcalfe, of Nappa (b. 1 August 1513; d. 9 May 1574),
eldest son and heir of Sir James Metcalfe of Nappa and Margaret Pigot,
and had four sons and two daughters. Date of death unknown.
Cheers, ----------Brad
WJho...@aol.com
royald...@hotmail.com writes:
<< The only Sir John Huddleston of Millom Castle, Cumberland appears to be
the son and heir of Sir John Huddleston of Millom and Southam,
Gloucestershire (d. 1 January 1512), and his 2nd wife Joan Stapleton.
He was born about 1488, and died in 1547 >>
Living Descendents of Blood Royal, Vol 2, "Volborth", pg 786-789; Count
d'Angerville; World Nobility, London. 1962
says this line goes like this
John /Huddleston/ of Millum and Jane (Joan) /Stapleton/, dau of Miles
/Stapleton/ d 1466
had a son
John /Huddleston/ d abt 1511 married Joan /FitzHugh/
I don't see a chronological problem having another John generation in here.
This last John would then be the father of the John that you're hypothecizing
married Jane Clifford
Will Johnson
Brad Verity
> Living Descendents of Blood Royal, Vol 2, "Volborth", pg 786-789; Count
> d'Angerville; World Nobility, London. 1962
>
> says this line goes like this
> John /Huddleston/ of Millum and Jane (Joan) /Stapleton/, dau of Miles
> /Stapleton/ d 1466
> had a son
> John /Huddleston/ d abt 1511 married Joan /FitzHugh/
Dear Will,
The source above is incorrect. The Sir John Huddleston of Millom who
married Jane Stapleton was the following:
Sir JOHN HUDDLESTON, born about 1440/45, 2nd son of Sir John Huddleston
(c.1420-1493), of Millom Castle. As a younger son, he forged a path in
Gloucestershire, where he purchased the manor of Southam, and was
constable of Sudeley Castle 1478, sheriff of Gloucestershire 1482 &
1499. At the death of his childless nephew (only son of his elder
brother Sir Richard) in 1503, he inherited Millom Castle, which was
entailed to male heirs, and so could not be inherited by his two
nieces. Sir John married 1st, Joan, daughter of Henry, 5th Lord
Fitzhugh & Alice Neville, and a first cousin to Margaret, wife of his
older brother Sir Richard. Joan d.s.p. He married 2nd, about 148-,
Jane Stapleton (born about 1444), widow of Sir Christopher Harcourt, of
Great Ashby, and younger daughter & co-heir of Sir Miles Stapleton, of
Ingham, Norfolk. Sir John died 1 January 1512, Joan died May 1519.
They are buried at Hailes Abbey, Gloucestershire. They had (from what
I could find so far) a son and a daughter:
B1) Sir JOHN HUDDLESTON, of Millom Castle and Southam, Gloucestershire,
born about 1488.
B2) ELIZABETH HUDDLESTON, married 1st, ---- Leigh, of Isel Hall,
Cumberland; married 2nd, about 1509, Sir Edward Redman (d. 27 September
1510), of Harewood, Yorkshire, and died about 1529.
> I don't see a chronological problem having another John generation in here.
> This last John would then be the father of the John that you're hypothecizing
> married Jane Clifford
The Sir John Huddleston of Millom (c.1488-1547) who was the son and
heir of the elder Sir John and Jane Stapleton, is the husband assigned
to Joan Clifford in several online pedigrees, with Joan as his first
wife. But this is problematical. Joan Clifford, if she existed, could
not have been born before 1518/20, as her parents were married about
1516 and her eldest brother was born about 1517. So she would have
been at least thirty years younger than this Sir John Huddleston.
The woman given in online pedigrees as Sir John's second wife after
Joan Clifford was no doubt his first wife. She is Joan Seymour,
daughter of Sir John Seymour of Wolf Hall, Wiltshire, by his wife
Elizabeth Darrell. She was the aunt of Jane Seymour who married Henry
VIII in 1536, as well as aunt to Lord Protector Somerset. No doubt
this helped the Huddlestons of Millom. Sir John and Joan Seymour had 3
sons & 1 dau. Sir John had another wife after Joan Seymour. She was
Joyce Prickley of Worcestershire, by whom he had 2 sons and 1 dau.
ANTHONY HUDDLESTON, the eldest son of Sir John Huddleston and Joan
Seymour, inherited Millom Castle on his father's death. Anthony was
born 1518, so chronologically a much better fit for a daughter of the
1st Earl of Cumberland. There is record of Anthony's marriage at
Little Haseley, Oxfordshire in 1541 to Mary Barantyne, daughter of Sir
William Barantyne of Little Haseley and his 2nd wife Anne Eton.
[Fittingly, Mary's elder half-sister Margaret Barantyne married Sir
John Harcourt, a descendant of the first marriage of Joan Stapleton,
Anthony's grandmother.] So, as Anthony was age 23 at his marriage to
Mary, there is time for a childhood previous marriage to a Clifford.
One of the sons of Sir John Huddleston by his wife Joyce Prickley was
Andrew Huddleston, who was born about 1532, married the heiress to the
manor of Hutton-John, and founded that line of Huddlestons. Given that
Joan Clifford could not have been born before 1518, and that Sir John
and his wife Joan Seymour had three children after 1518, then she died,
and he had a child by wife Joyce Prickley about 1532, Joan Clifford
could not have married Sir John between these two wives. We don't know
whether or not Joyce Prickley survived her husband.
So, to sum up as I see it so far. If a daughter of the 1st Earl of
Cumberland named Joan existed and married into the Huddlestons of
Millom, it could have been as:
1) The much-younger third and final (not first, as is usually given)
wife of Sir John Huddleston (c.1488-1547).
2) The early childhood first wife of Anthony Huddleston (1518-1598).
Either way, she apparently left no issue.
Cheers, -----Brad
Mark B
> Does anyone know what evidence exists for the
> existence and marriage of
> a daughter of the 1st Earl of Cumberland to a
> Huddleston of Millom?
Brad,
Nicolson & Burn agree with this. Number 12 on their
lineage of Hudleston of Millom is:
"John, [son of Sir John Hudleston and Joan Fitz Hugh],
married to his first wife Jane daughter of Henry lord
Clifford knight of the garter, and first earl of
Cumberland, by whom he had no issue. He married to his
second wife Joan, sister of Sir John Seymour knight,
father of the lady Jane Seymour, wife to king Henry
the eighth. To his third wife he married Joyce
daughter of Mr. Richley of Prickley in the county of
Worcester.--By his second wife he had issue two sons,
Anthony who continued the family at Millum, and Andrew
who married one of the coheirs of Thomas Hutton of
Hutton-John esquire, and was ancestor of the present
family at Hutton-John."
Take it for what it's worth. Nicolson and Burn was
published in 1777, 200 years or so after the marriage
in question.
Best regards,
Mark Briscoe
Nicolson & Burn have her as his first, producing no
issue. Not to say they are correct (they provide no
sources), but why do you say she would have to be his
second or third wife?
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John Higgins
Cumberland and Westmorland appears to confuse the various John Hudlestons
and their wives. It lists the brothers Richard, John and William, but says
that they are sons of Sir John and Jane Stapleton. The younger Sir John
(one of the three brothers) is said to have mar. a FitzHugh daughter, and
his son Sir John is shown as having three wives: (1) a Clifford, (2) a dau.
of Sir John Seymour, (3) Joyce Prickley, who was the mother of his children.
The Sir John (father of the three brothers) who is said here to have mar.
Jane Stapleton is also indicated as having two daughters : Anne, 1st wife of
Thomas Curwen (d. 1522), and Mary (d. 20 May 1525) who mar. 1483 John
Pennington of Muncaster (d. 28 June 1516). This John Hudleston is said to
be son and grandson of two Richard Hudlestons and great-grandson of another
Sir John who mar. a Fenwick. I suspect that these earlier generations, as
well as the various Sir Johns, have been confused in the visitation
pedigree - at least as compared with the Burke's pedigree.