Attila the Hun
Kaare Albert Lie
Ulf Larsson <Ulf.L...@uab.ericsson.se> wrote:
>John Yohalem wrote:
>[snipping)
>>Anders Berg wrote:
>[snipping]
>>> To get back on track, does anyone know anything of Attila's family. Did
>>> he have any known decendents?
>> No.
>Bad, with a name meaning "little father" (in the language of the Gothes)he
>ought to have some. Or maybe he was like a father to the Ostra-Gothesand
>thus not such a bad guy after all :-)
Hmmm .... I have noted that he had (at least) two sons, Chaba and
Ellak. From Chaba goes the line Edus, Vegecus, Elendus, Almus,
Ugyck, Almos, Arpad, Zoltan, Toksun, Michael of Hungary, etc.
(Written down years ago, when I was very sloppy with sources -
sorry!)
Probably highly legendarian, at least before Arpad.
Any comments?
______________________________________________________________
Kåre Albert Lie
ka...@sn.no
Ulf Larsson
John Yohalem wrote:
[snipping)
>Anders Berg wrote:
[snipping]
>> To get back on track, does anyone know anything of Attila's family. Did
>> he have any known decendents?
> No.
Bad, with a name meaning "little father" (in the language of the Gothes)
he
ought to have some. Or maybe he was like a father to the Ostra-Gothes
and
thus not such a bad guy after all :-)
John Yohalem
> Hmmm .... I have noted that he had (at least) two sons, Chaba and
> Ellak. From Chaba goes the line Edus, Vegecus, Elendus, Almus,
> Ugyck, Almos, Arpad, Zoltan, Toksun, Michael of Hungary, etc.
>
> (Written down years ago, when I was very sloppy with sources -
> sorry!)
>
> Probably highly legendarian, at least before Arpad.
>
>
> ka...@sn.no
I'm sure it's every bit as true as the Habsburgs' descent from King Priam
and Julius Caesar's from the goddess Venus. Undoubtedly invented in
Hungary, when the whole national myth that they were the "younger brothers"
of the Huns became popular, the late middle ages. Creative genealogy was
one of the most popular sciences of the time. And it still hasn't faded, as
examination of some of the royal roots on this List has demonstrated.
I mean, is there the slightest testimony to either of these sons of Attila
before the 12th century? I didn't think so.
Jean Coeur de Lapin
ench...@escape.com
Todd A. Farmerie
Kaare Albert Lie wrote:
> Hmmm .... I have noted that he had (at least) two sons, Chaba and
> Ellak. From Chaba goes the line Edus, Vegecus, Elendus, Almus,
> Ugyck, Almos, Arpad, Zoltan, Toksun, Michael of Hungary, etc.
>
> (Written down years ago, when I was very sloppy with sources -
> sorry!)
>
> Probably highly legendarian, at least before Arpad.
>
> Any comments?
>
There is no reason even to think that the Magyars, to which Arpad
belonged, and the Huns were connected in any way. In a Hungarian source
I have seen (but could not read anything but the chart) there is a line
tracing a few generations back of Almos, but I don't think the names are
the same as yours.
taf
RBodine996
According to the biography Attila, King of the Huns - The Man and the
Myth,
by Patrick Howarth, recently reprinted by Barnes and Noble, Attila was
married to a number of wives and had several named sons, including:
Ellak, his eldest son by a wife named Arykan, was killed in 454/5 in a
battle
fought in Pannonia near a river named Nedao against a combined force of
Gepids and allied tribes all under the command of Ardaric, king of the
Gepids.
Dengizik was killed in 469 fighting against a Byzantine force and his
skull
was displayed in Constantinope in revenge for the damage inflicted by his
father.
Ernak, his youngest son, survived his brothers, asked for and received
land
from Emperor Leo I, and settled with his people in the Dobruja area
between
the Danube and the Black Sea in the eastern part of modern Roumania.
There were other children--by his principal wife, Kreka, he had three
sons,
possibly one or two of the above.
Ronny Bodine
RBodi...@aol.com
Chris Bennett
In article <1996110117...@escape.com>, Medieval Genealogy
Discussion List <GEN-ME...@MAIL.EWORLD.COM> wrote:
> > Hmmm .... I have noted that he had (at least) two sons, Chaba and
> > Ellak. From Chaba goes the line Edus, Vegecus, Elendus, Almus,
> > Ugyck, Almos, Arpad, Zoltan, Toksun, Michael of Hungary, etc.
> >
> > (Written down years ago, when I was very sloppy with sources -
> > sorry!)
> >
> > Probably highly legendarian, at least before Arpad.
> >
> >
> > Kere Albert Lie
> > ka...@sn.no
>
> I'm sure it's every bit as true as the Habsburgs' descent from King Priam
> and Julius Caesar's from the goddess Venus. Undoubtedly invented in
> Hungary, when the whole national myth that they were the "younger brothers"
> of the Huns became popular, the late middle ages. Creative genealogy was
> one of the most popular sciences of the time. And it still hasn't faded, as
> examination of some of the royal roots on this List has demonstrated.
>
> I mean, is there the slightest testimony to either of these sons of Attila
> before the 12th century? I didn't think so.
>
> Jean Coeur de Lapin
> ench...@escape.com
Attila had at least three sons recorded in contemporary sources: Ellac,
Dengelic and Ernak. Ernak survived the battle of the Nedao, and his
branch of the Huns became known as the Kutrigur Huns. The first khans of
the Bulgars, as the Kutrigurs eventualy became known, claimed descent from
Ernak, although the old Bulgarian chronicle quoted by Runciman ("The First
Bulgarian Empire") does not give any names between Ernak and khan Kubrat,
the grandfather of Asperukh, who led the Bulgars into Bulgaria, except for
a 2 year reign of a certain "Gostun" who was not of the royal clan.
Byzantine sources mention some Kutrigur khans in the 6th century: Grod,
succeeded by his brother Mugel in 528; a khan Chinial in c555, succeeded
by Zabergan at that time.
So there is a reasonable case that the early Bulgar khans were descended
from Attila, or at least plausibly claimed such descent. However, so far
as I know the line cannot be traced beyond Tervel, khan of Bulgaria
701-718, son of Asparukh, who was engaged at one point to the daughter of
Justinian II.
Incidentally, the coalition that detsroyed Attila's empire at the Nedao
was led by Ardaric, king of the Gepids, who were, in turn destroyed by the
Lombards about a century later. I have found very little about the
Gepids. Does anyone know of any survey of the evidence regarding them?
Chris
THis information comes from Runciman, and frmo Maenchen-Helfen "The World
of the Huns"