Methodological Issues - Katherine Stradling
Charles Carpenter
Correct me if I am wrong, but the state of the art prior to January 2004 was that Maurice Dennis' first wife was thought to have been a bastard daughter of E. Stradling. This seems to be based on a 19th century reference to E Stradling's many bastard children. Even if one now accepts that this reference was to a different E Stradling -- and coming to that conclusion seems to be the "new research" here -- we are still lacking anything but mere supposition that K was the daughter of Joan.
Maybe "the truth is out there" still, but this Deighton descendant reluctantly concludes that we're not quite there yet.
Gryphon801
Dennis married (1) Katherine, daughter of Sir Edward Stradling, and on page 435
he idscusses Sir Edward Stradling without mentioning Katherine among his
children but referring to Sir Edward's many bastards. So there is no support
here for the theory that Sir Walter Dennis was a grandson of Jane Beaufort.
Louise Staley
You are quite right about the Gloucestershire Visitation not
mentioning Joan Beaufort. I made a mistake about the reference in the
Dennis pedigree. "Morrys Dennys [1] = Katherine d. of [Sr] Edward
Stradling [K. 1 wiffe]"
I thought the "1 wiffe" at the end referred to Edward Stradling and
was saying Katherine was the daughter of Sir Edward by his first wife.
I now realise the "1 wiffe" must mean Katherine was Maurice Dennis'
first wife.
Clearly this means the Gloucester Visitation needs to be moved into
the category of "References that show Katherine Stradling was the
daughter of Sir Edward Stradling and the wife of Maurice Dennis but DO
NOT mention her mother." This brings the count in that category to 4
and eliminates entirely the category of references that show Joan
Beaufort was Katherine Stradling's mother.
Of the 15 references in PA3 about Katherine Stradling, none mention
who her mother was at all. Given that this is the crucial relationship
that determines whether the line stands or fails, and is the point of
departure from current thinking, it would seem to me that failing a
contemporary (or other) source, some explanation is required to
demonstrate why Katherine is the daughter of Joan.
Louise
> Charles Carpenter wrote ...
Peter Stewart
> I have two comments on Ms. Staley's excellent summary of
> the evidence with regard to Katherine Stradling. First,
> G.T. Clark, Limbus Patrum MorganiĂŚ et GlamorganiĂŚ
> (1886): 381-382 (sub Dennis) cannot both give K Stradling
> as the daughter of E Stradling, and not give K. Stradling
> as the daughter of E Stradling. Ms. Staley has listed it
> twice -- I guess someone would have to look at the book,
> if this was the key missing element.
Louise was correctly setting out two statements from other people's
posts: mine of 31 January ("she isn't listed as daughter of Sir Edward
Stradling in Peter Bartrum's 'Welsh Genealogies', or in G.T. Clark's
'Limbus Patrum Morganić et Glamorganić...'") and Douglas Richardson's
of 17 February ("I believe Katherine Stradling is mentioned as
Maurice Dennys' wife on pages 381-382. I haven't double checked to
make sure, however").
So it isn't Louise - or Clark - who is in error, if there is indeed an
error, but myself and/or Douglas Richardson on two different aspects
of the matter, Katherine's paternity and her marriage; and he was not
certain of the point, for a change, but just going by a single instead
of double check. Of course, that is still one more than he appears to
have given some of the other sources claimed as supporting his view.
Peter Stewart