Edgar McCall
Bgr...@cs.com
I received some information I've not been able to verify on Edgar McCall.
He was granted lands of Whitimes and half of Eschetho by the north part, with
their marches and appendages and created an Earl by King David of Scotland.
Where would I go to verify this and does anyone have access to this
information? His name was probably spelled MacCawell or MacCathail at the
time.
Any Help,
Ron McCall
www.clanmccall.org
Bgr...@cs.com
Guffolkland is a large chartered area from Kirkconnel orginally into
Ayrshire. Gilbert McCall became the owner by marriage to a daughter of
"Duncon John" . This was from H.B.McCall's "Some Old Families".
The Earl of Guffolk exists only on tourist maps for Ancient Scotland.
Some believe Guffolk is a corruption of a Welsh word, David.
From earlier information Edgar lost the land to the MacDowells. Later
the MacDowells lost it to the Kennedys.
How does one access the nine volume peerage books?
From the Carolinas
Ron McCall
www.clanmccall.org
Janet Ariciu
Can anyone tell where I can find old Scottish Church records in this time
for Medieval
Janet
The...@aol.com
Good morning Ron,
It seems that a number of different pieces of information, traditional
and otherwise, have been woven together to create quite a problematic quilt.
I recall that there was a family by the name of McGuffolk (or similar),
which may well have had its origins in Galloway or the surrounding area.
Beyond that, if there was recognition of a 'chief of clan Guffolk' or
equivalent [similar to the position of the Kennedy/mac Kennedy and MacDowell
families in the area], it certainly did not give rise to an Earldom .
As to accessing Scots Peerage, there are limited copies about (the one
I am acquainted with being at the Library of Congress, Washington, DC).
Specifically, you are looking for
Sir James Balfour Paul, editor
The Scots Peerage,
Founded on Wood's edition of Sir Robert Douglas' peerage of
Scotland
9 Vols.
Edinburgh: D. Douglas, 1904-1914
LOC Call Number: CS 468. P3
Three additional useful sources re: Scots families (including those not
holding peerages) would be (A) Douglas' Peerage of Scotland, referred to
above; (B) The Baronage of Scotland, also by Douglas; and (C) Nisbet's
Heraldry.
Good luck, and good hunting.
John
Bgr...@cs.com
I received some additional information from a friend in Killin, Scotland
who is researching for Sir John McCall of Kenmore in 1550.
" One other thing that I discovered in my search for John McCall was about
Clan MacDowall (of Galloway) and how variants spread to John McCoull and John
McQuhoull".
So perhaps this may help explain some of the Earl of Carrick confusion.
Thanks Again
Ron McCall
www.clanmccall.org
Tim Powys-Lybbe
The...@aol.com wrote:
<snip>
> As to accessing Scots Peerage, there are limited copies about (the one
> I am acquainted with being at the Library of Congress, Washington, DC).
> Specifically, you are looking for
>
> Sir James Balfour Paul, editor
> The Scots Peerage,
> Founded on Wood's edition of Sir Robert Douglas' peerage of
> Scotland
> 9 Vols.
> Edinburgh: D. Douglas, 1904-1914
>
> LOC Call Number: CS 468. P3
Scots Peerage is also available on CDROM from www.genealogy.demon.co.uk
That firm is called S & N and they scanned the page images for the
Scottish Genealogy Society.
--
Tim Powys-Lybbe t...@powys.org
For a patchwork of bygones: http://powys.org
Bgr...@cs.com
Thanks for that CDrom info on the peerages. That will be easier than
getting it from the Library of Congress.
I'm wrestling with three bits of information tonight that may be answered
by these volumes. One source of information is a History of the McCall Family
that was generated recently for McCalls Ltd in Aberdeen. This has McCalls or
McAllas having the lands of Ardincaple from the time of King Robert II.
I look in my copy of "Scottish Nation" by William Anderson and the
MacDougalls owned Ardincaple.
I received information from a researcher in Killin, Scotland that Clan
MacDowall often used variants of McCoull and McQuhoull. She is looking for
So did Edgar McCall, become MacDowall and MacDougall. Edgar McCall was
in 1135 and Anderson says the first MacDougall was mentioned in history in
1284.
Wow,
Ron McCall
www.clanmccall.org
Tim Powys-Lybbe
Bgr...@cs.com wrote:
> Good Evening Tim,
> Thanks for that CDrom info on the peerages. That will be easier than
> getting it from the Library of Congress.
> I'm wrestling with three bits of information tonight that may be
> answered by these volumes. One source of information is a History of the
> McCall Family that was generated recently for McCalls Ltd in Aberdeen.
> This has McCalls or McAllas having the lands of Ardincaple from the time
> of King Robert II.
There are no McCalls in the index.
Nor McAllas.
> I look in my copy of "Scottish Nation" by William Anderson and the
> MacDougalls owned Ardincaple.
There's about three-quarters of a column of McDougalls in the index.
> I received information from a researcher in Killin, Scotland that Clan
> MacDowall
About half a column of MacDowals in the index.
> often used variants of McCoull and McQuhoull. She is looking for
> Sir John McCall of Kenmore in 1550.
> In Scottish Nation MacDowall, see MacDougall.
> So did Edgar McCall, become MacDowall and MacDougall. Edgar McCall
> was in 1135 and Anderson says the first MacDougall was mentioned in
> history in 1284.
--
Renia
There are 3 Kirkconnel(l)s on my modern map of Scotland, all of them within 50
miles or so of Dumfries, and none of them in Ayrshire.
Renia
Renia
According to "Scottish Clan and Family Names" by Roddy Martine, the MacDowells of
Galloay claim to be descended from the ancient Lords of Galloway. Sir Dugald
McDowall was Sheriff of Dumfries and Constable of Dumfries Castle in 1312.
According to "Scottish Clan And Family Encyclopedia" by George Way MacDowall, the
MacCalls are associated with clan MacDonald. The same book days that the
MacDougalls took their name from Dougall, Somerled's son. Somerled died in 1164
and his son held most of Argyll.
Burke's Landed Gentry 1898 part II, has a short genealogy of the Macaulay family
of Red Hall, co Antrim in Ireland, whose ancestors had Ardencaple in Dumbarton.
It says that the ancient clan of the macAulays of Ardencaple has been traced to
Awlay, a brother of Malduin, Earl of Lennox, who died in the reign of Alexander
III of Scotland.
The Scottish Clan And Family Encyclopedia says that the Macaulay clan is
attributed to one of the branches of the Siol Alpen, from whom also descend the
Macgregors, but that it has also been asseted that they stem from Almhalidh, a
younger son of the Earl of Lennox. It says: "Nisbet, in his commentary on the
Ragman Roll of 1296, states that Maurice de Arncaple, who submitted to Edward I
of England, was the ancestor of the Lairds of Ardincaple, which was to become the
principal Macauley seat."
I presume you have seen this:
http://rmackall.home.mindspring.com/Mackall/Certif.html
Renia
Bgr...@cs.com
Thanks for your reply. The reason I was asking about this is that several
sources including the recent McCall History and H.B McCall's "Some Old
Families" now disclaim the McAulay connection due to earlier McCalls that
they have found. There are books out now that show a separate family back to
Macathail of Hy in 500 AD and earlier.
Guffolkland and the "Makaulis Kerne" owned by McCalls extended from
Kirkconnel in Sanquhar Parish to beyond the Dumfries shire border into
Ayrshire. Surprisingly the local Duke there appears to be worried we may want
it back, since he only borrowed it and never paid for it. His archivist has
officially lost all papers during the last year. He may have read my e-mail
calling him the Mafia when I found out about it in "Some Old Families". The
only defense of the Duke was the Mafia didn't exist in Scotland in 1664.
Thanks again
Ron McCall
www.clanmccall.org
Renia
As the present duke descends from King Charles II, it is highly likely that his
ancestor's grandfather, the king, bestowed the lands, not that he "borrowed"
them. In early medieval times that someone was *of* such-and-such a place, does
not mean they owned it outright. It means they leased it, in effect. The same
family acquired the Earldom of Sanquhar.
The Marquess of Bute descends from Lord Crichton of Sanquhar, created 1488.
Guffolkland still existed in 1881, a farm within the village of Kirkconnell.
Dwelling: Guffockland
Census Place: Kirkconnell, Dumfries, Scotland
Source: FHL Film 0224049 GRO Ref Volume 834 EnumDist 3 Page 1
Marr Age Sex Birthplace
John SYMINGTON M 57 M Ochiltree, Ayr, Scotland
Rel: Head
Occ: Farmer Of 1600 Acres 80 Arable Employing 2 Men And 2 Girls
Jane SYMINGTON M 43 F Sanquhar, Dumfries, Scotland
Rel: Wife
Occ: Farmers Wife
Janet Fallows SYMINGTON 11 F Kirkconnel, Dumfries, Scotland
Rel: Daur
Occ: Scholar
Mary Cuthbert SYMINGTON 9 F Kirkconnel, Dumfries, Scotland
Rel: Daur
Occ: Scholar
Isabella Jane SYMINGTON 5 F Kirkconnel, Dumfries, Scotland
Rel: Daur
Occ: Farmers Daughter
Janet STEELE W 65 F Sanquhar, Dumfries, Scotland
Rel: Mother In Law
Occ: Annuitant
James MARCHBANK U 18 M Holywood, Dumfries, Scotland
Rel: Servant
Occ: Ploughman
Mary Ann MUIR U 16 F Sanquhar, Dumfries, Scotland
Rel: Servant
Occ: General Servant
Janet GRAY U 16 F Catrine, Ayr, Scotland
Rel: Servant
Occ: General Servant (Domestic)
You may have come across this web site, which shows some of the successions for
Guffockland:
http://www.buittle.freeserve.co.uk/mckerlie.htm
There was still a McCall family in Sanquhar in 1881:
Dwelling: Ulzieside
Census Place: Sanquhar, Dumfries, Scotland
Source: FHL Film 0224052 GRO Ref Volume 848 EnumDist 8 Page 1
Marr Age Sex Birthplace
George MC CALL M 61 M Sanquhar, Dumfries, Scotland
Rel: Head
Occ: Farmer Of 2997 Acres Of Which 260 Acres Are Arable Emp 5 Men 1 Boy 3 Women
Alison Johnson MC CALL M 50 F Moffat, Dumfries, Scotland
Rel: Wife
William MC CALL U 19 M Kirkmichael, Dumfries, Scotland
Rel: Son
Occ: Farmers Son
Michael Johnson MC CALL U 14 M Kirkmichael, Dumfries, Scotland
Rel: Son
Occ: Farmers Son Scholar
Elizabeth MC CALL U 13 F Kirkmichael, Dumfries, Scotland
Rel: Daur
Occ: Scholar
Alison Johnson MC CALL U 11 F Kirkmichael, Dumfries, Scotland
Rel: Daur
Occ: Scholar
Samuel George MC CALL U 8 M Kirkmichael, Dumfries, Scotland
Rel: Son
Occ: Scholar
John MC NAUGHT U 23 M Twynholm, Kirkcudbright, Scotland
Rel: Serv
Occ: Farm Servt
Jane KILPATRICK U 24 F Tinwald, Dumfries, Scotland
Rel: House Maid
Occ: Domestic Servt
Agnes HAMILTON U 24 F Sanquhar, Dumfries, Scotland
Rel: Cook
Occ: Domestic Servt
Sarah KERR U 25 F Kirkbean, Kirkcudbright, Scotland
Rel: Dairymaid
Occ: Domestic Servt
Renia