Ancestry and descendnts of D. John Dee
Reedpcgen
information I have on Dr. John Dee, Elizabeth I's close confidant. Some of his
descendants were merchants, etc., in Bohemia, Russia, etc.
It is interesting that he is likely a descendant of King Henry I of England,
Llywelyn ao Iorwerth (discussed frequently on this group), and most of the
early rulers of Wales. I'll chart a descent below:
1. Henry I, King of England
2. Robert, Earl of Gloucester, m. Mabel, daughter and heir of Robert Fitz
Hamon, Earl of Gluocester, by Sibyl de Montgomery, daughter of Roger, Earl o9f
Shrewsbury.
3. William Fitz Robert, Earl of Gloucester 1147-83, captured with his wife and
son by "Ivor the Little" in 1158.
4. An illegitimate daughter married Gruffudd ap Ifor Bach, who d. 1211.
5. Nest m. Hywel
6. Rhys ap Hywel
7. Einion Sais, living 1271, [m.] Lleucu f. Hywel
8. Hywel m. Letis f. Cadwaladr
9. Llywelyn ap Hywel
10. daughter m. Gruffudd ap Cadwgon [see below]
11. Meurig m. Margred f. Gruffudd
12. Hywel Blaene
13. Ieuan Blaene m. Maud Wigmore
14. Efa m. Dafydd Ddu
15. Bedo Dee m. Efa f. Llywelyn Goch
16. Rowland Dee m. Jane Wilder
17. Dr. John Dee, m. (1) Catherine Constable, m. (2) Jane Forman
Descent 2:
1. Llywelyn ao Iorwerth, Prince, [m.] Tangwystl
2. Gruffudd ap Llywelyn, m. ["Rhanullt"] daughter of "Rheinallt"], King of Man
3. Gwladus [niece of Gwladys Ddu] m. Rhys Ieuanc, d. 1271, son of Rhys Mechyll
(d. 1244) by his wife Matilda de Braose, daughter of Reginald de Braose [not by
his second wife Gwladys Ddu, but by Grace de Briwere].
4. daughter m. Hywel ap Madog
5. Cadwgon ap Hywel
6. Gruffudd ap Cadwgon [see #10 above]
(Though Rhys Gryg, father of Rhys Mechyll, married a daughter of Richard de
Clare, Earl of Gloucester in 1219, she was not mother of Rhys Mechyll.)
Dr. John Dee's ancestry appears at Bartrum, Rhys ap Tewdwr 14(A).
The good doctor was quite proud of his ancestry, and two 'Genealogical Rolls'
he made of his ancestry survive among the Cotton Charters [British Library,
Department of Manuscripts] at xiii 38 and xiv i.
There are aparently two detailed accounts of his descendants which I have not
seen, which should be checked by those wanting to trace his descendants:
(1) H. B. Wilson, _Genealogical Account of the Descebndants of Bedo Dee_ *1815)
(2) H. B. Wilson, _History of the Merchant Taylors' School_ (1812-14), at pages
1169-71.
There is also apparently an account of the family in the Lacnashire and
Cheshire Antiquarian Magazine (1879) 1:213-17.
Dr. John Dee died indebted, at Mortlake, Surreyin 1608. I saw no probate
record in the Prerogative Court of Canterbury or Archdeaconry of Surrey, but we
do have a list of most of his children. He married his secod wife Jane Fremond
(b. 22 April 1555), daughter of Bartholomew Fremond, Esquire, of East Cheam,
Surrey [5 Feb. 1578 "sponsalia cum Jana Fromonds/5 Sep. 1578 "sponsalia"].
1 - Arthur, his son and heir, was born 13 July 1579 ["Mistres Blanche Pary of
the Privie Chamber his godmother" "Mystres Awbrey was deputy for my cosen
Mistres Blanche Pary"].
2 - Catherie Dee, b. 7 June 1581.
3 - Rowland, bp. 2 February 1582/3
4 - Michael"begone to be weaned" 21 Nov. 1583, d. 13 July 1594
5 - Mary [probably a daughter, as her chamber was mentioned in his diary]
6 - Theodore b. 28 Feb. 1587/8, d. Manchester 1601
7 - Madinia, bp. Mortlake 5 Mar. 1589/90
8 - Frances b. 1 Jan. 1591/2
9 - Margaret, bp. 27 Aug. 1595
10 - ?Anthony [mentioned in his diary]
11 - ? Nicholas
John Dee was supposed to have fathered 11 children.
His eldest son and heir Arthur was born at Mortlake 13 July 1579, and died in
September 1651, will PCC 183 Grey. He called himself a Physician, but was not
a member of the English College. He had attended Oxford University. He
married Isabella Prestwich, said to be daughter of Edward, and they had 7 sons
and 6 daughters, John Dee attending the Merchat Taylors' School in London
1632/3-6 and becoming a merchant in Russia. Arthur only mentioned 3 sons and 3
daughters in his will.
Many of Arthur's children were baptized at Manchester:
1 - Margaret Dee, bp. 6 Apr. 1603
2 - Jane Dee, bp. 4 Apr. 1605
3 - John Dee, bp. 2 July 1606, St. Giles Cripplegate, London
4 - Arthur, bp. 17 March 1607/8
? 5 - Edmunde, bp. 20 March 1609/10, St. Stephen Coleman Street, London
6 - Maria, b. 24 Feb. 1612
7 - Rowland, b. 8 Sep. 1613
8 - Isabel, b. 5 Sep. 1614
9 - Frances, b. 25 Oct. 1615
10 - William, b. 27 Aug. 1617
11 - John Dee, bp. 11 Apr. 1619, St. Andrew Undershaft, London
12 - Edmund Dee, bp. 27 Aug. 1620, bur. 23 Sep. 1621
13 - Anna, bp. 18 Oct. 1621
Rowland Dee, son of Arthur, also became a merchant, and had children baptized
at St. Martin Orgar, London, and St. Mary Woolnoth, London:
1 - Rowland Dee, b. bp. 14 Dec. 1644 [St. Martin], apparently died young
2 - Rowland Dee, b. 25 Mar. 1646, bp. 5 Apr [St. Martin], attended Merchant
Taylors' School 1658-61
3 - Jeane Dee, bp. 16 March 1648 [St. Martin]
4 - Arthur Dee, bp. 4 Nov. 1649 [St. Mary Woolnoth]
5 - Mary Dee, bp. 12 Jan. 1651 [St. Mary]
6 - Alexander Dee, bp. 8 Dec. 1653 [St. Mary]
7 - Duncomb/Duncan Dee, bp. 15 Nov. 1657 [St. Mary]
Duncan Dee was b. 3 Nov. 1657, attended the Merchant Taylors' School 1672-3,
St. John's College, Oxford, 1673, was Common Serjeant of the City of London,
defender of Dr. Sacheverell, etc. [DNB, etc.], and died in 1720, bur. St. Mary
Aldermary, PCC 132 Shaller.
If you get access to the two works by Wilson I reference above (which I haven't
seen), I would be interesting to know what they add.
Paul
R. Battle
<snip>
> There are aparently two detailed accounts of his descendants which I have not
> seen, which should be checked by those wanting to trace his descendants:
>
> (1) H. B. Wilson, _Genealogical Account of the Descebndants of Bedo
> Dee_ *1815)
>
> (2) H. B. Wilson, _History of the Merchant Taylors' School_ (1812-14),
> at pages 1169-71.
<snip>
I have access to the second of these. On pages 1169-1173 there are six
somewhat-related descendancy trees, all of which relate to families
descended from various Dee/Dey individuals. The purpose of these seems to
be that given earlier in the book (pp. 252-4):
"Having risen through a gradation of preferments to the episcopal dignity,
he [Francis Dee, Bishop of Peterborough] gave to the master and seniors of
St. John's College, in Cambridge, after the death of his wife, the
impropriation of Pagham, in Sussex, held by lease from the dean and
chapter of Canterbury, for the maintenance of two fellows and two scholars
for ever, particularly charging, that one fellow and one scholar should be
taken either from Merchant-Taylor's school, or Peterborough school, of his
kindred or of his name, if any such should be fit, and should be offered
to them at their elections [a footnote here quotes his PCC will (dated 28
May 1638) at length]. His lordship died on the 8th of October, 1638. On
the decease of his wife, his benefaction took effect. And, for many
years, St. John's College admitted the claims of candidate's from
Merchant-Taylors', without requiring them to be of the founder's kindred
or name [footnote: 'As candidates from Merchant-Taylors' are now required
to be of the kindred, or name, I have inserted the part of the bishop's
will which points out his relatives, in order to assist the claims of
those who are interested in this bequest.--Should my researches be proved
successful, I shall subjoin to this work the pedigrees of the family of
Dee.']."
Anyway, the pedigrees are as follows: #1 (p. 1169) traces three
generations of Dr. John Dee's descendants, placing him as a son of Rowland
Dee and grandson of Bedo Dee "the Great." #2 (p. 1170) traces three
generations of descendants of Arthur Dee, M.D., the eldest son of Dr. John
Dee. #3 (p. 1171) traces three generations of descendants of David Dee of
Salop (supposedly a grandson of Bedo Dee "the Great" and father of Bishop
Francis Dee). #s 4-6 (pp. 1172-3) trace descendants of Thomas Urrey of
Gatcombe, apparently a great great nephew of Francis Dee.
Here are the details from the first two pedigrees:
Pedigree #1 (p. 1169)
1. BEDO DEE, "surnamed the Great, Standard Bearer to Lord de Ferrars, at
the seige [sic] of Tournay, Ao 1513"
son:
2. i. Rowland Dee.
2. ROWLAND DEE, "Gentleman Sewer to Henry VIII. imprisoned in the Tower,
1553"; m. Johanna, dau. of William Wild.
son:
3. i. Dr. John Dee.
3. DR. JOHN DEE, "of Mortlake, in the county of Surrey, Chancellor of St.
Paul's and Warden of Manchester College, born 13 July 1527, died 1608, at
Mortlake"; m. Jane, dau. of Bartholomew Froumond, Esq., of East Cheam,
Surry.
children:
i. Arthur Dee (continued on pedigree #2)
ii. John Dee, bur. 27 Oct 1617 St. Andrew's Undershaft, London.
4. iii. [possibly; connected by dotted line] Robert Dey
iv-?. "Other children, both sons and daughters"
4. ROBERT DEY, "of the city of Norwich, apothecary. Will proved 30 Oct.
1651."; m. Sarah Skinner, "joint executrix with her daughter Sarah to her
husband's will 1651."
children:
5. i. Prisca Dey
6. ii. George Dey
iii. Joseph Dey, mentioned in father's will
7. iv. Sarah Dey
5. PRISCA DEY, mentioned in father's will; m. Thomas Soame of Fincham,
Norfolk, 1651 [not clear if they married then or if he was "of" there
then].
children:
i. George Soame, [alive] 1664
ii. Ann Soame, [alive] 1664
6. GEORGE DEY, "of the city of Norwich, Gent. 1664"; m. Anne, dau. of
Christopher Godsalve of Norfolk
children:
i. Francis Dey, "son and heir aet. 10, 1664"
ii. Anne Dey, [alive] 1664
7. SARAH DEY, "joint executrix with her mother to her father's will,
1651"; m. ___ Coates.
children:
i. Thomas Coates, "a minor, 1651"
ii. Susan Coates, "a minor, 1651"
Pedigree #2 (p. 1170) (some info about [1] Arthur and wife from p. 1169):
1. ARTHUR DEE, eldest son of Dr. John Dee, M.D., "Physician to King Chas.
I. born 13 July 1579, died at Norwich, Ao 1651, buried at St. George's
Tomblands, there"; m. Isabell (d. 24 Jul 1634), dau. of Edward Prestwych
of Holme near Manchester.
children (sons listed first, in their birth order):
i. son, d. young
ii. son, d. young
iii. Arthur Dee, "of Amsterdam, merchant, born 16 March 1608,
married, as appears by his father's will in 1651."
2. iv. Rowland Dee.
v. William Dee, "of Russia, merchant, born 27 Aug. 1617."
vi. John Dee, "of Russia, merchant, born 30 Mar. 1619, living
1651." (There is a note for him to the effect that it is not clear whether
it was this John Dee or another of that name, nephew of Francis Dee, who
was at the Merchant-Taylors' school from 1633 to 1636.)
vii. son, d. young
viii. Margaret Dee, b. 1603; m. Abraham Ashe, "a Russia merchant."
ix. Maria Dee, b. 1612.
2. ROWLAND DEE, "of London, Merchant, born 8 Sep. 1613, died Ao 1687"; m.
Jane ___, "executrix to her husband's will in 1687; her will was proved in
1698."
children:
i. Rowland Dee, adm. Merchant-Taylors' school 12 May 1658, "of
London, merchant, born 25 Mar. 1646; died 1698, without issue"; m.
Elizabeth ___, "executrix to her husband's will 1698."
3. ii. Duncan Dee.
iii. Mary Dee, "executrix to her mother, 1698"; m. Thos.
Flowerdew; had issue (not named)
3. DUNCAN DEE, adm. Merchant-Taylors' school 12 Apr 1672, "of the city of
London, Common Serjeant of the said city; born 3 Nov. 1657, died Ao 1720,
and was buried in the parish of St. Mary Aldermanbury"; m. Mary ___ (d. 24
Mar 1728 Stoke Newington, Middlesex)
children:
i. Rowland Dee, [alive] 1698
ii. Duncan Dee, [alive] 1698
4. iii. Henry Dee.
iv. Charles Dee, [alive] 1698
v. Jane Dee, [alive] 1698
4. HENRY DEE, "living in 1698, died in Feb. 1725"; m. Sarah ___.
daughter:
i. Sarah Dee, "a minor, 1725."
Pedigree #3 (p. 1171) says that Francis Dee, D.D., "Fellow of St. John's
College, Cambridge, and founder of two fellowships there, Lord Bishop of
Peterborough, died 8 Oct. 1638" was the eldest son of David Dee, "of the
county of Salop: stiled [sic], in the Herald's visitation of the county of
Sussex, Ao 1634, 'one of the grandchildren of Great Bedo Dee,' Rector of
Great St. Bartholomew's, London, where he was buried 3 Feb. 1619-20" by
his wife Martia, dau. of John Rogers. According to a footnote here, the
author indicates that he could not determine whether David Dee was a
brother or first cousin of Dr. John Dee of Mortlake.
-Robert Battle
Reedpcgen
> iv-?. "Other children, both sons and daughters"
>
>4. ROBERT DEY, "of the city of Norwich, apothecary. Will proved 30 Oct.
>1651."; m. Sarah Skinner, "joint executrix with her daughter Sarah to her
>husband's will 1651."
> children:
> 5. i. Prisca Dey
> 6. ii. George Dey
> iii. Joseph Dey, mentioned in father's will
> 7. iv. Sarah Dey
It is curious that this Robert Dey has been attached to the family of Dr. John
Dee. It does not appear that he belongs there. Aside from no son Robert
appearing among the known list of the children of John Dee, and no RObert being
named in the Dr.'s diary, it would appear that some of this information must
have come from the Visitation of Norfolk in 1664.
The version of this visitation annotated by the normally careful A. W. Hughes
Clarke and Arthur Campling [HS, 1933, p. 68], corrects the parentage of Robert
Dey, of Norwich, who married Sarah Skynner and was father of George Dey of the
CIty of Norwich, gentleman, 1664. This Robert was son of Robert Dey of Great
Walsingham and his wife Agnes, not Dr. John Dee. The annotated version gives
Roberts other children as well, Joseph, Priscilla [sic, Prisca?], wife of
Thomas Soame, and Sara, wife of Coats.
Robert Dey left a will proved 30 Oct. 1651 [PCC 183 Gray] and George left a
will proved at Norwich Sep. 1669. George had married Anne, daughter of
Christopher Godslave, and thei son and heir Francis was aged 10 in 1664; a
daughter Anne was also listed in 1664 (age not given).
Paul
Michael Andrews-Reading
> I noticed in a pile of papers that I'd neglected to post some of the
> information I have on Dr. John Dee, Elizabeth I's close confidant. Some of
> his descendants were merchants, etc., in Bohemia, Russia, etc.
>
>
> Dr. John Dee died indebted, at Mortlake, Surrey in 1608. I saw no probate
> record in the Prerogative Court of Canterbury or Archdeaconry of Surrey, but
> 1 - Arthur, his son and heir, was born 13 July 1579 ["Mistres Blanche Pary of
> the Privie Chamber his godmother" "Mystres Awbrey was deputy for my cosen
> Mistres Blanche Pary"].
>
> 3 - Rowland, bp. 2 February 1582/3
>
> 4 - Michael "begone to be weaned" 21 Nov. 1583, d. 13 July 1594
>
> 5 - Mary [probably a daughter, as her chamber was mentioned in his diary]
>
> 6 - Theodore b. 28 Feb. 1587/8, d. Manchester 1601
>
> 7 - Madinia, bp. Mortlake 5 Mar. 1589/90
>
> 8 - Frances b. 1 Jan. 1591/2
>
> 9 - Margaret, bp. 27 Aug. 1595
>
> 10 - ?Anthony [mentioned in his diary]
>
> 11 - ? Nicholas
>
> John Dee was supposed to have fathered 11 children.
>
> His eldest son and heir Arthur was born at Mortlake 13 July 1579, and died in
> September 1651, will PCC 183 Grey. He called himself a Physician, but was not
> a member of the English College. He had attended Oxford University. He
> married Isabella Prestwich, said to be daughter of Edward, and they had 7 sons
> and 6 daughters, John Dee attending the Merchat Taylors' School in London
> 1632/3-6 and becoming a merchant in Russia. Arthur only mentioned 3 sons and
> 3 daughters in his will.
>
Thomas Aubrey in his Brief Lives gives some glimpses of the Dee
family. he refers to Doctor John Dee's son Arthur of Norwich, and the
latter's son Rowland Dee and his wife; he also mentions a daughter of
Dr. John Dee whom he thinks was named Sarah [I note none by this name
appears in the original post above] "married to a flax-dresser, in
Southwarke". Aubrey's great-grandfather, Dr. William Aubrey, was John
Dee's "cousin" - no doubt the "Mrs Awbrey" who was proxy-godmother for
Arthur fits in there somewhere.
Woolley in his recent work "The Queen's Conjuror" says (p 319) that
Dee's daughter Margaret (b 1595)and "Madimi" [cf Madinia supra] both
died at Manchester in 1605, as well as his wife, leaving him with
three surviving children: Arthur, Rowland and Catherine.
Michael Andrews-Reading
> Thomas Aubrey in his Brief Lives gives some glimpses of the Dee
> family. he refers to Doctor John Dee's son Arthur of Norwich, and the
> latter's son Rowland Dee and his wife; he also mentions a daughter of
> Dr. John Dee whom he thinks was named Sarah [I note none by this name
> appears in the original post above] "married to a flax-dresser, in
> Southwarke". Aubrey's great-grandfather, Dr. William Aubrey, was John
> Dee's "cousin" - no doubt the "Mrs Awbrey" who was proxy-godmother for
> Arthur fits in there somewhere.
>
> Woolley in his recent work "The Queen's Conjuror" says (p 319) that
> Dee's daughter Margaret (b 1595)and "Madimi" [cf Madinia supra] both
> died at Manchester in 1605, as well as his wife, leaving him with
> three surviving children: Arthur, Rowland and Catherine.
Mea culpa - I meant to write "John Aubrey", of course!
MAR