Sir John Stile/Style d. 1500

[Monica Kanellis]

I'm hoping gen-med can help me with a possible confusion of people
named John Stile.

Who was the Sir John Stile who was ambassador to Spain in the early
16th century?

Burke's General Armory has this entry:

Style (Langley, co. Kent, bart., extinct 1659; descended from John
Style, a distinguished diplomatist, whose son, Sir Humphrey Style,
Knt., of Langley, Sheriff co. Kent 1543, one of the Esquires of the
Body to Henry VIII, etc.

But under "Wolston" we have "Wolston (Sir Guy Wolston, temp Edward
IV.; his daughter and heir Elizabeth, m. John Stile, Esq. of
Beckenham, co. Kent, and was mother of Sir Humphrey Stile, who was
knighted by Henry VIII., when his Majesty was going to Boulogne,
ancestor of Style, Bart., of Wateringbury. Visit. London, 1563).
Quarterly, 1st and 4th, ar. a wolf pass. sa.; 2nd, ar. three
turnstiles sa. a mullet for diff.; 3rd, ar. on a chev. sa. betw. three
rams heads erased az. as many billets or."

No mentioned of a a knighthood or being a diplomat

He can't be the Sir John Stile in Stow's Survey of London, draper of
London, as that Stile was buried in 1500 unless the date has been
misread. The Sir John Stile/Style who was a diplomat was alive well
after 1500 as he was ambassador of Spain 1517-1518 and was sent to the
low countries c 1528 (can't seem to track down reference for latter).

Historical notes. 1509-1714, Volume 1, Francis Sheppard Thomas, p 11

Interestingly, there is a mention that "In 1502, for some unknown
reason, John Stile [the diplomat] seems to have fallen temporarily
into disgrace, as there is a mention of a pardon being granted him on
June 16 of that year."

The dictionary of English history, ed. by S. J. Low and F. S. Pulling

This may connect to the following note on a webpage about Beckenham
House, a property of in the family by the time of Sir Humphrey Stiles,

<A document dated 1503 was also found relating to a petition to Henry
VIII, following a murder trial, in which John Style, of Langley, was
acquitted; the scene of the alleged crime was Kent House.>

http://www.beckenhamhistory.co.uk/kenthouse.html

So was John Stile, father of Sir Humphrey Stile, the same as Sir John
Stile the diplomat?

British History online has the following (no mention of being a
diplomat, and no mention of him being alive to be pardoned in 1503)
which seems to conflate him with the Sir John in the Survey of London,
buried 1500.

<He was the son of William Style of Ipswich, was afterwards knighted,
and of the Drapers company, and dying in 1500, was buried in
Allhallows Barking church, London. He married Elizabeth, daughter and
coheir of Sir Guy Wolston of London, by whom he had Sir Hum- phrey
Style, of Langley, who was one of the esquires of the body to king
Henry VIII. and sheriff of this county in the 35th year of the same
reign. He died in 1557, and was buried in Beckenham church. He
procured a grant from Sir Thomas Wriothesley, garter principal king at
arms, reciting, that not being willing to bear arms in prejudice to
the other branches of his family, he had petitioned for a coat, with a
proper difference, which the said king at arms, in 1529, granted,
under his hand and seal, viz. Sable, a fess engrailed between three
fleurs de lis, within a bordure or, the fess fretted of the field.>

http://www.british-history.ac.uk/report.aspx?compid=53788

Also, is it John Stile, father of Sir Humphrey, the Stile c 1510 (no
mention of knighthood) referenced in this note in British History
online below? I haven't found any date for the birth of Humphrey (d
1557), who seems to have been an only son.

<Langleypark.

Hasted supposes the manor of Lasela, described in Doomsday, to be the
same estate which is now called Langley-park (fn. 26) . I think that
the orthography seems too remote, even had the name of Langley been
more ancient; but it appears that it derived its present name from a
family who purchased lands in Beckenham of Henry de Cliffe, about the
year 1350 (fn. 27) . Ralph Langley, who died in 1451, directed this
estate to be sold: the purchaser was John Violett (fn. 28) , whose
descendants enjoyed it till about the year 1510, when it was conveyed
to John Style, Esq. (fn. 29) Elizabeth, the daughter and sole heir of
Humphrey Style, the last heir-male of that family, married Sir John
Elwill, Bart. who died in 1727.>

So who was the Sir John Stile buried in Allhallows Barking? If he was
Stile of Langley and Beckenham, who was the John Stile who acquired
the latter circa 1510? And what, if any connection is there to this
family and Sir John Stile the diplomat?

best,

MK

[WJho...@aol.com]

I don't know if he was Sherriff in 1543 but this source states that when he
was knighted in Oct 1544, he was then Sheriff

http://books.google.com/books?id=l4xUsPyL6koC&pg=RA1-PA56

[WJho...@aol.com]

We can push the date for John being an ambassador back to Jun 1505 when he
was one of three men given instructions to go take a look at the widowed
Queen of Naples as a possible wife to H7

There is an extant letter which, now Sir, John Stile wrote Feb 1518 to
Henry VIII, so he was living. His widow had already remarried by 1527, so he
was then dead.

[WJho...@aol.com]

This particular John stayed in Spain for some time, *while* his wife (in
1512) and children were living in Plymouth. He writes about it then, but she
evidently did or wanted to join him. He is probably the one who with his
wife Elizabeth were granted monies out of something in Plymouth (I didn't
quite catch what). Which would make sense as they'd already been tied to that
place in another letter.

I'm now not so certain that she is the *same* person who as widow of John
Stile married Sir James Yarford who died testate Jun 1527. Perhaps this was
the one you say is the other John who died in 1500.

[Monica Kanellis]

Hi Will,

Thanks for all this information. I find I can access The Knights of
England using a proxy. (Oddly this doesn't work for The Rise of the
Barristers, is that available to others?)

Is there any indication when Elizabeth Wolston Stiles married James
Yarford (d. 1527)? An early date would rule her out as wife as the
ambassador.

Would it have been usual, if her John Stile of Langley/Beckingham was
the one in Spain, for them to move to Plymouth? Any chance the
children were named in his letters from abroad?

best

MK

[WJho...@aol.com]

In a message dated 1/31/2011 7:41:29 AM Pacific Standard Time,
monica....@gmail.com writes:

> Would it have been usual, if her John Stile of Langley/Beckingham was
> the one in Spain, for them to move to Plymouth? Any chance the
> children were named in his letters from abroad?
>

Actually in his letter, written FROM Spain, he states that his "wife and
children" and THEN living in Plymouth. And destitute or something to that
effect, not able to support themselves on the few shillings they get etc etc.

We could perhaps assume that they moved to Plymouth in order to be close to
where a ship might dock... coming from Spain... or something like that.
Makes some kind of sense. Doesn't mean there's any evidence for it.

There does seem to be some kind of source, fuzzy, that tries to make him
the same man *mentioned* in some role in the Low Countries in 1528 which would
rule him out as the man whose widow married again to a man who died testate
in 1527!

So either we have an earlier one, or we must have a later one. I don't
know exactly how to resolve this. I think it was mentioned in another thread a
while ago. And there seems to some problem the various daughters of this
man or these two men, calling them "heiress" or "co-heiress" at times.

So perhaps tracking down the sources for calling the daughters "heiress"
might firm up the time-line and number of daughters, which would then seperate
the *man* into two *men* or whatever.

It's still fuzzy. Apparently in the 1527 will he mentions his
step-daughter, so tracking that down exactly might help as well.

Will

[Mal Mitchell]

John Stile of Langley died in 1505 and his will is viewable via Prerogative Court of Canterbury records which mentions Langley and Bekynham sic. The John Stile who was ambassador lived on for some considerable time. Maybe the ambassador Stile was an uncle or cousin of the Langley one but difficult to establish any relationship. Humphrey Stile was the surviving son, I believe there was a son John mentioned in the 1505 will but both sons were minors at Stile's death. John Stile's widow Elizabeth married secondly James Yarford who had been a witness to Stile's will. There was some scandal as John Stile was convicted then acquitted of the murder of Elizabeth Fincham over the possession of Kent House as Stile had lent henry Fincham £100 which he failed to repay. There were other 'John Stiles' around this time which add to the confusion and Stile was said to be a common name.
Humphrey is said to have been a squire of the body to Henry VIII but I can't find corroborating evidence. A Sir John Stile died at Greenwich (1527?)
www.beckenhamplaceparkfriends.org.uk for additional info on history pages