Re: Forthcoming Exhurst-Stoughton article in the October NEHGR

[Douglas Richardson]

On Nov 22, 10:34 am, Johnny Brananas <ravinmaven2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

< Scratch this .... the October NEHGR is finally online, and it looks
< like a very great deal has changed since I saw the article!  The
< Brudenell, Bulstrode, and Waller lines were behind a first wife from
< whom the Stoughtons ... alas do _not_ descend.  Oh well ...  Can you
< say "bait and switch"?

Not bait and switch, John. The author(s) are just being accurate.
Accuracy is what counts, even if we lose a few royal descents like
those that have been alleged behind immigrants such Thomas Newberry,
John Drake, Thomas Wingfield, Anthony Savage, Thomas Norton, and
Edward Fitz Randolph.

When I first got started years ago, I thought I had three gateway
ancestors with valid royal ancestry. I disproved all three of them.
So I was back to zero. Eventually in time I proved four new gateways
ancestors with valid royal ancestry. So I now have valid royal
ancestry again. Yahoo!

Fortunately a lot of the literature is now stable, as the major lines
have been vetted in recent decades. In time a few new proposed lines
will fail, but others will stand the test of time.

By the way, thanks for posting your line of descent from Isabel de
Vermandois. Much appreciated.

Best always, Douglas Richardson, Salt Lake City, Utah

[John Dobson]

Hi John,

I'm sorry I wasn't in a position to discuss the matter of the Exhurst-Stoughton article when you raised the matter a few weeks ago.

It was a considerable surprise to my coauthors and me when we discovered, after producing the version of the draft you saw, that the Stoughtons' ancestress Mary Exhurst was a daughter of Joan Roberts rather than Alice Waller. But we were receiving so many requests for information while the work was in progress that we were forced to put them off and focus our efforts on finishing the article.

Thanks to Douglas Richardson for characterizing our approach as an attempt at accuracy, which it certainly was! We will be very interested in hearing readers' responses to the piece.

Best wishes,
John Blythe Dobson



>>> Johnny Brananas <ravinma...@yahoo.com> 22-Nov-11 1:39 PM >>>
Yes, I know, Doug. Can you say "jokesy"?

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[John Dobson]

Thanks, John. This is interesting, and I hadn't seen it.

Best wishes,
John Blythe Dobson

(one of the coauthors of the Exhurst-Stoughton article)

>>> Johnny Brananas <ravinma...@yahoo.com> 23-Nov-11 11:17 AM >>>
Here is a legal matter involving Rev. Thomas Stoughton, the father of
the New England immigrants:

http://books.google.com/books?id=_Ik0AAAAIAAJ&pg=PA122&dq=suffolk+%22thomas+stoughton%22&hl=en&ei=wOZnTsaCC82Wtwf3r7WQDQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=6&ved=0CEIQ6AEwBTgo#v=onepage&q=suffolk%20%22thomas%20stoughton%22&f=false

[John Dobson]

Hi John,

No harm done. We were forced to make some pragmatic decisions as to how much to share of our interim results, as we had already been surprised once, and various factors, including delays in receiving copies of documents, meant that some of our conclusions remained tentative until distressingly late in the research process. We hope readers will find the result worth the three-year wait!

I should add that one of my coauthors, Janet Chevalley Wolfe, is not on this list (that I know of), and Adrian Benjamin Burke is presently out of the U.S. and without regular access to his email. I don't mean to be presumptuous in speaking on their behalf, particularly as Jan is the corresponding author.

Best wishes,
John


>>> Johnny Brananas <ravinma...@yahoo.com> 23-Nov-11 2:45 PM >>>

> I'm sorry I wasn't in a position to discuss the matter of the Exhurst-Stoughton article when you raised the matter a few weeks ago.
>
> It was a considerable surprise to my coauthors and me when we discovered, after producing the version of the draft you saw, that the Stoughtons' ancestress Mary Exhurst was a daughter of Joan Roberts rather than Alice Waller. But we were receiving so many requests for information while the work was in progress that we were forced to put them off and focus our efforts on finishing the article.
>
> Thanks to Douglas Richardson for characterizing our approach as an attempt at accuracy, which it certainly was! We will be very interested in hearing readers' responses to the piece.

I regretted making that posting, fearing that something had
drastically changed or that the schedule had been delayed. I suppose
I got what i deserved.

[Nathaniel Taylor]

At 11:17 AM -0800 11/22/11, Douglas Richardson wrote:
>
>Accuracy is what counts, even if we lose a few royal descents like
>those that have been alleged behind immigrants such Thomas Newberry,
>John Drake, Thomas Wingfield, Anthony Savage, Thomas Norton, and
>Edward Fitz Randolph.

I have not seen Thomas Wingfield re-examined in the recent
literature. As we know, his old circumstantial case raises
considerable question marks. Herndon's 1952 VMHB article takes it as
given that the man in New Kent County, Virginia who had six or seven
children recorded at St. Peter's parish there, is the same as the man
mentioned in a tabular pedigree in Viscount Powerscourt's _Muniments
of the Ancient Saxon Family of Wingfield_, which includes a statement
which looks like it ought to have come from an English source about a
cadet, aged 21 in 1691, on York River who was "supposed to have died
unmarried" -- but there is no source given for this (i.e., no known
deed, probate, letter, or pedigree reference from the year in
question, that I'm aware of). Despite the dubious origin of this
statement in Powerscourt's _Muniments_, the baptism of an 'Owen
Wingfield' at St. Peter's, New Kent Co., in 1719 (perhaps as an
illegitimate son of Thomas the settler's daughter Mary) seems to
support the presumed identity (Owen being the surname of the apparent
mother of the Virginia man, and used as a forename by a brother).
There has also been raised the question of whether the adult
Wingfield men found elsewhere in the next generation in Virginia who
are traditionally said to have been the boys baptised at St. Peter's
as sons of this particular planter are the same men. The thin spots
in the circumstantial case have been ably and clearly shown in an
online essay from 2002 by Abigail Ann Young:

http://homes.chass.utoronto.ca/~young/genealogy/Thomas.wingfield.html

She also comments clearly on the inadequacies and ambiguities of DNA
testing, pointing out particularly the ambiguity of the
low-resolution testing done by 2002. Nevertheless, more recent and
higher-resolution testing, which is available in a rather garish and
confusing webpage here --

http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~leepreston/index.html

-- (last updated in 2007) does show fairly close matches between some
descendants of Thomas of New Kent County, and a descendant of their
putative English uncle. Descendants of his three putative sons who
had issue (Robert, John, and Thomas), match each other 26 for 26
(some descendants of John & Robert exhibit downstream mutations);
their obvious mode matches the one English-line control 25 for 26.
The other English-line controls with remoter apparent common ancestor
show more discrepancies or downstream mutations.

So this is an interesting anomaly: a traditional circumstantial
identity which is by itself unconvincing, but which is shown to be
consistent with (though not proved by) the recent DNA evidence. Has
there been anything new published on this since the more recent DNA
has come in, either about the DNA evidence, or about anything else
that might have come to light, or reapraising the case?

Nat Taylor

[Nathaniel Taylor]

I wrote:

>. . . Herndon's 1952 VMHB article takes it as

>given that the man in New Kent County, Virginia who had six or seven
>children recorded at St. Peter's parish there, is the same as the man
>mentioned in a tabular pedigree in Viscount Powerscourt's _Muniments
>of the Ancient Saxon Family of Wingfield_,

Oops -- as Dr. Young's essay underscores, the register at New Kent
County only records the daughters and the anomalous possible son or
possible bastard grandson Owen; this is another important point of
hesitation about the alleged other three sons.

Nat Taylor
a genealogist's sketchbook:
http://nltaylor.net/sketchbook/

[taf]

On Nov 25, 6:49 pm, Nathaniel Taylor <nltay...@nltaylor.net> wrote:

> She also comments clearly on the inadequacies and ambiguities of DNA
> testing, pointing out particularly the ambiguity of the
> low-resolution testing done by 2002. Nevertheless, more recent and
> higher-resolution testing, which is available in a rather garish and
> confusing webpage here --

You ain't kiddin'. I have a headache now.

taf

[North Star]

On Nov 23, 2:58 pm, Johnny Brananas <ravinmaven2...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> John, maybe we could weasel out of you which of Walter Roberts' three
> wives was the mother of Joan Exherst?    :-)

Isabell Culpepper?

[Janet Wolfe]

We are pleased to see the interest in our article, "The Exhurst Ancestry of
the Stoughton Siblings of New England," published in the October 2011 issue
of the New England Historical and Genealogical Register.

No additional information about the contents of the second part of the
article can be posted at this time. A requirement of articles to be
published in the Register is that the material has not previously been
published elsewhere, including on the web. The ancestry of Walter Roberts
and of each of his three wives is discussed in the second part of the
article. The analysis is somewhat complex, and we hope that the material
presented will encourage further research.

The first part of the article suggests several areas for further research,
such as identifying Godleva (____) Exhurst Christmas and her first husband
or determining whether John Exhurst’s wife was the Alice Sepham named in the
1421 will of John Sepham. We have even wondered whether John Sepham’s wife
Alice was a daughter of William and Constance (Ellis) (Septvance) Nutbeam.
While we know of no evidence for such a supposition, chronologically it is
possible.

If many people directed their efforts to transcribing and translating the
documents on the AALT website, http://aalt.law.uh.edu/, lots of interesting
pieces of information might be discovered. People interested in such an
effort could consider posting their transcriptions and translations of these
documents on the AALT wiki, WAALT at
http://www.uh.edu/waalt/index.php/Main_Page. Links to documents and
transcriptions of interest to this group could be posted here.

>>> Johnny Brananas <ravinma...@yahoo.com> 23 Nov 2011 12:58:46 -0800
(PST) >>>

John, maybe we could weasel out of you which of Walter Roberts' three wives
was the mother of Joan Exherst?    :-)

[Wjhonson]

"Forthcoming" in "October"
That's a contradiction. We're about to enter December says my calender.

John, maybe we could weasel out of you which of Walter Roberts' three wives
was the mother of Joan Exherst? :-)

[Janet Wolfe]

We are pleased to see the community's continued interest in the subject of
the ancestry of Mary Exhurst, grandmother of the New England Stoughton
immigrants. The research reported in the continuation of our article in the
October issue, scheduled for publication in the January issue of the
Register, does indeed make use of each of the sources mentioned in the
previous post quoted below. When readers have before them our analysis of
these and other sources, we will be most pleased to have our conclusions
carefully scrutinized by all interested researchers. Indeed, we are hoping
that our report will stimulate further research that may eventually lead to
additional documents or insights that may provide definitive answers to some
remaining questions.

Meanwhile, we would be most pleased if interested researchers focused first
on several questions that remain unanswered in part 1 of the article: What
was the maiden name and who were the parents of John Exhurst's mother
Godleva (___) (Exhurst) Christmas? What was the given name of Godleva's
Exhurst husband? Who was Alice, the wife of John Exherst? She is called
Alice, daughter of William Sepham, in the 1619 Kent visitation pedigree. As
discussed in footnote 16, could Alice have been the daughter of a John
Sepham who wrote his will in 1421? If so, could this John Sepham's wife
Alice have been a daughter of William and Constance (Ellis) (Septvance)
Nutbeam, providing a "reason" for the claim of a Nutbeam descent in the
visitation pedigree? Is there some other way a Nutbeam could have married
into the Exhurst line? Or is there no basis at all for the Nutbeam claim in
the visitation pedigree? Speaking of stray people in visitation pedigrees,
perhaps some readers have noticed that there is another Exhurst child listed
in the 1619 visitation pedigree, a "Matheus" who Barry called "Martha" in
his version of this pedigree. Now that we know from a CP case that the
youngest Exhurst daughter, Elizabeth, married an Alan Mathew, it seems
likely that this "Matheus" was supposed to be listed as Elizabeth's husband
and somehow got misplaced in successive transcriptions of the notes of
various heralds. The 1619 Kent visitation is online at
http://uk-genealogy.org.uk/england/Kent/visitation/index.html.

-----Original Message-----
From: gen-mediev...@rootsweb.com
[mailto:gen-mediev...@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Johnny Brananas
Sent: Thursday, December 15, 2011 12:03 PM
To: gen-me...@rootsweb.com
Subject: Re: Forthcoming Exhurst-Stoughton article in the October NEHGR

It seems to be the first wife, Margaret Penn, though several people
(including one of the authors) made haste to email me indicating the
second wife, Culpepper.

http://library.uwinnipeg.ca/people/dobson/genealogy/ff/Exherst.cfm

This is the Roberts family treated in Robert Tittler, Archive of
the Roberts family of Boarzell in Ticehurst and the Dunn family of
Stonehouse (Sussex Record Society, vol. 71, 1979), full text available
at http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/a2a/records.aspx?cat=179-dun. On
Walter Roberts see Thomas Wotton, English Baronetage, 3 vols. (London,
1741), 1:403-11, at pp. 406-08 (an unacknowledged source of many later
account of this family); Hasted, The History and Topographical Survey
of the County of Kent, 1:197 (for the record of his service as
sheriff); I.S. Leadam, "An Unknown Conspiracy against King Henry VII,"
Transactions of the Royal Historical Society, new series, 16 (1902):
133-58, answered by James Gairdner, "A Supposed Conspiracy Against
Henry VII," Ibid., new series, 18 (1904): 157-94, pp. 167ff. being a
reply by Leadam. His long and complicated will (P.C.C. 28 Maynwaring;
modern archival reference P.R.O. Prob/11/20), dated 11 Feb. 13 Hen.
VIII [1522], and proved 18 October following, mentions among many
others "John Roberthe my ffather," "Alyce my wyff," and "Johan [i.e.
Joan] Horden my dowghter." The Visitations of Kent taken in the years
1530-1 by Thomas Benolte, Clarenceux and 1574 by Robert Cooke,
Clarenceux, ed. W. Bruce Bannerman (Publications of the Harleian
Society, vols. 74 & 75, 1923, 1924), 2:23-25, at p. 24 (where
"Exherst" is erroneously printed "Epherst"); 1619 Visitation of Kent,
ed. Hovenden, pp. 93-4, earlier published in Berry's County
Genealogies - Kent, p. 177 (where however the information is somewhat
garbled).
His daughter Joan is missed in the Roberts pedigree in The
Visitations of the county of Sussex made and taken in the years 1530 .
and 1633-4 (Harleian Society, vol. 53, 1905), 68, a reference kindly
pointed out by Adrian Benjamin Burke. Whether she was really a
daughter of her father's first marriage to Margaret Penn it seems
impossible to say with certainty.
Wotton, English Baronetage, as cited above, at p. 407, citing
Chauncey's Hertfordshire (1700), p. 494, describes the first wife as
"Margaret, daughter and heir of John Penn, of Penn's place, in the
parish of Aldenham, in Hertfordshire, who was squire to the Duke of
Clarence," and states that she married Walter Roberts on 23 Oct. 1463,
and died 6 May 1480. However, the John Penn who is called "Sqwire with
the Duc of Clarence" on his tombstone at Aldenham d. 18 June 1471
[Weever, Ancient Funerall Monuments (1631), p. 592), and as will be
seen below was clearly her brother, not her father. It would also be
more accurate to describe her as her father's eventual heiress in her
issue, for his immediate heir was his son Ralph, who outlived
Margaret. Crucial to the proof of Margaret's parentage is the Roberts
pedigree in the 1574 visitation of Kent, cited above, which shows her
as the mother of, among other children, "John Robertes [who] mar. Mary
daught. of Rich: Sackeuille," who was in turn father of "Dyonyce
[Robertes] mar. to Tho: Mannocke of Essex." Now the Victoria History
of the County of Hertford, vol. 2 (1908), in its account of the parish
of Aldenham, pp. 149-161, describes a piece of land called Aydens or
Eydens which "was held by Ralph Penne when he died in 1486 [actually 3
Oct. 1485]" and which, though he had intended it to be used to found a
chantry, instead "passed with one-fourth of the manor of Charings to
Dionisia daughter of John Roberts and wife of Thomas Mannok, who
conveyed it with her share of Charings to John Coningsby in 1546 [Feet
of Fines, Herts, Michaelmas 38 Hen. VIII]." The will of "Raufe Penne
of the county of Hertford, gentilman," evidently an unmarried man,
which is dated "the last day of Septembyr" 1485 (P.C.C. 27 Logge), is
not in itself very genealogically informative, except that it makes a
bequest to "euerich [i.e. every] of my cosyns fferbeis" [see J. Henry
Lea, "Genealogical Gleanings, contributory to a History of the Family
of Penn," pt. 1, Pennsylvania Magazine of History and Biography 14
(1890): 50-63, at pp. 53-54]. It does not even name the "John Robarth,
consanguineus & next heir, aged 16 years & more" who was subsequently
determined to be his heir (inquisition post mortem, 4 November, 2 Hen.
VII [1486], printed in The Herts Genealogist and Antiquary 2 [1897]:
23-24, and in Calendar of Inquisitions Post Mortem, Henry VII,
1:79-80, where however consanguineus is unjustifiably rendered as
"cousin"). However, the connection to Margaret Penn is made by the
will of this man's father, which was probably first published in an
anonymous work entitled A Pedigree and Genealogical Notes, from Wills,
Registers, and Deeds of the Highly Distinguished Family of Penn.
(London, 1871), p. 15. The will of "John Penne, Citizen and Mercer of
London," of St. Alban Wodestrete, London, and of Aldenham, Herts.,
proved 7 Sept. 1450 (P.C.C. 12 Rous), requests burial in the parish
church of St. Albans de Wode Strete, London, and names wife Alice,
sons Ralph, John, and Thomas Penne, and daughters Alice, Mary, and
Margaret. It was witnessed by a Thomas ffereby, who (in the
trancription at least) is called the testator's "wife's father." On
the basis of these transcriptions one would thus infer that the wife
of John Penn was an Alice Fereby, but perhaps Thomas Fereby was only
her stepfather, for the Victoria History of the County of Hertford, as
above, states that the manor of Aldenham was held in 1449 "by John
Hale, citizen of London and brother of John Hale of Aldenham [Close
Rolls, 27 Hen. VI, pt. 1, m. 17d]," and in 1472 "was in the tenure of
his daughters, Alice widow of John Penne, citizen and mercer of
London, and wife of William Brayne, and Agnes wife of John Thrale, who
united in settling it on Ralph Penne, son of Alice [Feet of Fines,
Herts., 12 Edw. IV, No. 33; Close Rolls, 15 Edw. IV, membrane 20]." I
have not attempted to resolve this discrepancy.

[John Dobson]

I fully endorse the message from Janet Wolfe. The web page cited by John Brandon, at http://library.uwinnipeg.ca/people/dobson/genealogy/ff/Exherst.cfm, does not establish the identity of the mother of Joan Roberts (second wife of Richard Exhurst and ancestress of the Stoughton siblings of New England). It reflects an early stage of my research, prior to the three-year collaboration with Janet and our coauthor Adrian Benjamin Burke. The page will be revised after the conclusion of the article has appeared.

Yours Sincerely,
John Blythe Dobson


>>> "Janet Wolfe" <janw...@umich.edu> 15-Dec-11 4:48 PM >>>

[North Star]

Follow up article just published in the January 2012 Register.
Evidence for the identity of the mother of Joan Roberts is
inconclusive. Margaret Penn or Isabel Culpeper


On Dec 16 2011, 10:44 am, Johnny Brananas <ravinmaven2...@yahoo.com>
wrote:
> > I fully endorse the message from Janet Wolfe. The web page cited by John Brandon, athttp://library.uwinnipeg.ca/people/dobson/genealogy/ff/Exherst.cfm, does not establish the identity of the mother of Joan Roberts (second wife of RichardExhurstand ancestress of the Stoughton siblings of New England). It reflects an early stage of my research, prior to the three-year collaboration with Janet and our coauthor Adrian Benjamin Burke. The page will be revised after the conclusion of the article has appeared.
>
> > Yours Sincerely,
> > John Blythe
>
> Please go ahead and remove all instances of my name from your
> webpage.  I do not know what the benefit is supposed to have been of
> my seeing an early, wildly incorrect draft of your article.  In
> genealogy, being taken in by a convincing imposture is of course far
> worse than having "no information" at all.

[jsgal...@mail.fhsu.edu]

where do I find the above stated article? I also have lineage through Thomas Stoughton and could not verify some information but it sounds like this article might be of some help to me.

Thanks
Jessica

[leslie...@gmail.com]

-------------- Another royal descent that is commonly accepted is
for John Throckmorton of Rhode Island. The study of his proposed
ancestry was published by George Moriarty, based on work done
by J. Gardner Bartlett.

They focused all their research on one person, John Throckmorton
from Norwich, who had the right age, same education & status
as the New England colonist. A lawsuit from the 1640s stated that
the family did not know if John was living.

John Throckmorton's wife Rebecca Farrand is documented as being
from Hatfield Broadoak, Essex.
Roger Williams, the founder of Rhode Island, who knew something of John Throckmorton's background in England, was married in the parish of High Laver, Essex, adjacent to Hatfield Broadoak.

The records collected by Charles Edward Banks, early last century,
noticed some Throckmorton baptisms in a parish next to High Laver.

About ten years ago, I was looking through parish registers in Essex, and noticed a John Throckmorton baptized between 1600 and 1610. As I remember, the parish was Newport, Essex, or an adjacent parish. This other John Throckmorton might be the New England colonist.


Leslie

[zabl...@gmail.com]

Planning to buy a Water Softener at Gurgaon,Delhi, Faridabad Just get in touch with Benbell Water Softeners and you shall get the best product and After Sales Service at the best price.

[Jason Quick]

re "The first part of the article suggests several areas for further research,

such as identifying Godleva (____) Exhurst Christmas and her first husband
or determining whether John Exhurst’s wife was the Alice Sepham named in the
1421 will of John Sepham. We have even wondered whether John Sepham’s wife
Alice was a daughter of William and Constance (Ellis) (Septvance) Nutbeam.
While we know of no evidence for such a supposition, chronologically it is
possible."

Possible breadcrumbs to the Christmas (Christemasse) Family and Godleva

https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C7448729 C 1/58/47
Short title: Turke v Excerst. Plaintiffs: Thomas Turke, citizen and fishmonger of London, feoffee to the uses of the will of Stephen Cristemasse, esquire.
Defendants: John Excerst of Exhurst, co-feoffee with complainant, and William Colyns, husband of Benet, sister of the said Stephen. Subject: Messuages and land in Sutton Valence, East Sutton, Bromfield, Staplehurst, Merden, and Frittenden. Kent. 3 documents

C 1/39/115 Description: Short title: Cristemasse v Atte Wode.
Plaintiffs: Steven Cristemasse, son of Jane, sister of Alice, mother of Robert Blosme. Defendants: Herry atte Wode, surviving feoffee to uses. Subject: Lands, etc in the dene of Heryngden in Staplehurst (Stapilherst), late of the said Robert Blosme. Kent Note:

Pedigree of the family (Proceedings in the court of chancery up to c. 1460 by Margaret Elizabeth Avery pg. 120-121) https://books.google.com/books?id=otUGAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA560&dq=%22east+sutton%22+christemasse&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwj716_WsO3iAhXoslQKHYS9BEAQ6AEIMDAB#v=onepage&q=%22east%20sutton%22%20christemasse&f=false

[Jason Quick]

the correct link for the Margaret Avery source is https://repository.royalholloway.ac.uk/file/bc5f04de-148a-4403-b6c6-8e60a44667bf/1/10107226.pdf

[Jan Wolfe]

Thanks for posting these cases and comments, Jason.

We briefly discussed the first case you mention, C1/58/47-49, and a related case, C1/55/140-142, at the end of part 1 of the article in which we stated, "A connection between John Exhurst and the Christmas family is suggested in a court case dated 1475–80 or 1483–85 in which Thomas Turke, feoffee of Stephen Christmas, disputes the intentions of the will of Stephen Christmas with “William Colyns of Otham, yeoman, and Benette,” his wife, sister and heir of “Stephen Crystemas” and fellow feoffee John Exhurst.[52] John supports the contentions of William and Bennett in his answers to the complaints."

Images of C1/58/47-49 are available at AALT: http://aalt.law.uh.edu/AALT4/ChP/C1no58/IMG_0086.htm, http://aalt.law.uh.edu/AALT4/ChP/C1no58/IMG_0087.htm, http://aalt.law.uh.edu/AALT4/ChP/C1no58/IMG_0088.htm

Images of C1/55/140-142 are available at AALT:
http://aalt.law.uh.edu/AALT4/ChP/C1no55/IMG_0207.htm, http://aalt.law.uh.edu/AALT4/ChP/C1no55/IMG_0209.htm, http://aalt.law.uh.edu/AALT4/ChP/C1no55/IMG_0210.htm

Perhaps a careful re-reading of these cases using the excellent AALT images may provide additional clues.

TNA dates the next case, C1/39/115 "1433-1443, or more likely 1467-1472." The link to the description at TNA is https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C7444909. Images of C1/39/115 are available on AALT:
http://aalt.law.uh.edu/AALT4/ChP/C1no39/IMG_0154.htm
This case appears to provide some information about the mother of Stephen Christmasse. The document is written in old French. At a quick glance, I think I saw where it said that Jane was the sister of Alice who was the mother of Robert Blosme, but I didn't immediately see the part about Stephen Christmasse being the son of Jane.
Margaret Elizabeth Avery, Proceedings in the court of chancery up to c. 1460, p. 120-121, (https://repository.royalholloway.ac.uk/file/bc5f04de-148a-4403-b6c6-8e60a44667bf/1/10107226.pdf#page=131) discusses yet another case, C1/26/57. The TNA description is here: https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C7441618. The AALT image is here: http://aalt.law.uh.edu/AALT4/ChP/C1no26/C1no26nos1-200/IMG_0083.htm (This one looks difficult to read.)
Folio 58 is here: http://aalt.law.uh.edu/AALT4/ChP/C1no26/C1no26nos1-200/IMG_0086.htm (There appear to be two sets of folio numbers on these folios.)
A related case is C1/26/59. The TNA description is here: https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C7441619. The AALT image is here: http://aalt.law.uh.edu/AALT4/ChP/C1no26/C1no26nos1-200/IMG_0087.htm
TNA and Avery appear to have different opinions about the surname of the husband of Agnes.

Perhaps some careful reading of these three cases will clarify the family of Stephen Christmasse.