DOI, NORMANDY
PEhle...@aol.com
Seneschal of Doi. He married Aveline of Hesdin who was born 1081 in Doi,
Normandy. Alain died ca. 1114 and Aveline died ca. 1126. Can anyone extend
the ancestry for either one or both of these individuals? All help will be
greatly appreciated.
Regards
Phyllis in Louisiana
Todd A. Farmerie
Well, first of all, it's Dol, and it's in Brittany.
Alan fitz Flaald was son of Flaald Fitz Alan, son of Alan Fitz Flaald,
son of Flaald. All of these were Seneschals of Dol. Moriarty
hypothesized that this last Flaald was son of Hamon, Lord of Dinan, but
there is little support other than Flaald appearing in the same document
with Hamon's sons, which shouldn't suprise anyone since, related or not,
Flaald would havebeen one of their foremost vassals.
taf
Cyril Delmas-Marsalet
Cyril Delmas-Marsalet
"La plus grande chose du monde, c'est de savoir être à soi."
Michel Eyquem, seigneur de Montaigne
Les Essais, I (1595)
<PEhle...@aol.com> a écrit dans le message : a583a338...@aol.com...
>Alain II de Doi (FitzFlaad) was born ca. 1078 in Doi, Normandy. He became
the
>Seneschal of Doi. He married Aveline of Hesdin who was born 1081 in Doi,
>Normandy. Alain died ca. 1114 and Aveline died ca. 1126. Can anyone
extend
>the ancestry for either one or both of these individuals? All help will be
>greatly appreciated.
>Regards
>Phyllis in Louisiana
Olivier Cocheril
Royal Family, 1973" Alain Fitzflaad (mort en 1114) était le fils de Flaad
(vivant en 1078 et mort avant 1106), sénéchal de Dol en Bretagne. Il suivit
le roi Henri I en Angleterre, ainsi que de nombreux chevaliers originaires
du nord-est de la Bretagne.
Son grand-père serait peut-être un certain Alain de Dol mais son existence
est incertaine. Quant à celle de son arrière-grand-père Flaad indiqué par
Todd Farmerie elle me paraît peu crédible. Pourrait-il indiquer ses sources
concernant une région, la Bretagne, et une époque, les Xe et XIe siècles, où
elles sont rares.
Alain Fitzflaad eut trois enfants :
- Walter Fitzalan, tige des Stewart d'Ecosse
- William Fitzalan, tige des Comtes d'Arundel en Angleterre
-Jordan, qui eut des descendants à Dol
Quant à sa femme, Aveline (encore vivante en 1126), elle serait la fille
d'Arnulph de Hesdin et de sa femme Emmelina.
Todd A. Farmerie a écrit dans le message <36C087...@po.cwru.edu>...
>PEhle...@aol.com wrote:
>>
>> Alain II de Doi (FitzFlaad) was born ca. 1078 in Doi, Normandy. He
became the
>> Seneschal of Doi. He married Aveline of Hesdin who was born 1081 in Doi,
>> Normandy. Alain died ca. 1114 and Aveline died ca. 1126. >
>Alan fitz Flaald was son of Flaald Fitz Alan, son of Alan Fitz Flaald,
RAY Montgomer
i understand a big part but i lose a lot of it and it looks importante!
Sincerely
RAY
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Todd A. Farmerie
>
> is it possible that some one could translate this.
> i understand a big part but i lose a lot of it and it looks importante!
Briefly (and loosely): Citing Burke, SP, &CP, Alan Fitz Flaad (d. 1114)
was son of Flaad liv. 1078, d.bef.1106) Senechal of Dol, in Brittany.
He was one of a number of knights from N.E. Brittany serving under Henry
I. His grandfather is said to be Alan of Dol, about whom there is
little certain information. Mr. Cocheril puts little faith in my
identification of the great grandfather as Flaad, there being few
sources for 10th and 11th century Brittany. [Note: I will dig out
Moriarty, and if I have time Round, to document this claim.]
Alan Fitz Flaad had:
Walter Fitz Alan, founder of the Scotish Stuarts
William Fitz Alan, from whom come the English Earls of Arundel
Jordan Fitz Alan, who continued the family interest in Dol
Aveline (still living in 1126) was daughter of Arnulf de Hesdin, and his
wife Emmelina.
taf
Todd A. Farmerie
>
> D'après "The Scots Peerage : The Complete Peerage; Burke's Guide to the
> Royal Family, 1973" Alain Fitzflaad (mort en 1114) était le fils de Flaad
> (vivant en 1078 et mort avant 1106), sénéchal de Dol en Bretagne. Il suivit
> le roi Henri I en Angleterre, ainsi que de nombreux chevaliers originaires
> du nord-est de la Bretagne.
> Son grand-père serait peut-être un certain Alain de Dol mais son existence
> est incertaine. Quant à celle de son arrière-grand-père Flaad indiqué par
> Todd Farmerie elle me paraît peu crédible. Pourrait-il indiquer ses sources
> concernant une région, la Bretagne, et une époque, les Xe et XIe siècles, où
> elles sont rares.
The information on the earlier generations comes from an article by
Moriarty in the NEHGR (I don't have the vol., but it was 1962),
pp.21-25, called The Origin of the Stuarts and the Fitz Alans. He
indicates that Round had traced, in his 1901 Studies in Peerage and
Family History, back to the Alan, Dapifer of Dol who was grandfather of
the later Alan, husband of Avalina de Hesdin. In a followup article in
The Genealogist, n.s. 18:1-16, he provided a document in which this Alan
appears on a grant to the nunnery of St. George of Rennes as 'Alanus
filius Flaaldi'. Moriarty then calls attention to a charter from the
abbey of Marmoutier. This document (imprecisely dated to 1032-64)
records a grant by Rhiwallon, Lord of Dol and Combourg. Among those
attesting is a "Fledaldi senescali". We thus have documentation of the
father and predicessor of Alan Fitz Flaald. Moriarty goes on to
speculate that Flaald was a brother, perhaps illegitimate, of Rhiwallon,
but I have reservations about this suggestion.
taf