The Scottish Competitors

[mike stone]

I have a confused recollection that I recently saw (either in a book or on a
website) a genealogical tree showing *all* thirteen "competitors" for the
Scottish throne in 1290 - even including the ones descended from royal
bastards.

Has anyone else seen it? If so I should appreciate a reminder of where it is.

--
Mike Stone - Peterborough England

"The English people are like the English beer.

Froth on top, dregs at the bottom, the middle excellent" - Voltaire

[Brant Gibbard]

On 17 Nov 1999 12:35:20 GMT, mws...@aol.com (mike stone) wrote:

>I have a confused recollection that I recently saw (either in a book or on a
>website) a genealogical tree showing *all* thirteen "competitors" for the
>Scottish throne in 1290 - even including the ones descended from royal
>bastards.
>
>Has anyone else seen it? If so I should appreciate a reminder of where it is.

There is a chart of that type (not the best though: no dates or names of
spouses) in the introductory material to Caroline Bingham's "Robert the
Bruce". I think her source is CP.

Brant Gibbard
bgib...@inforamp.net
http://home.inforamp.net/~bgibbard/gen
Toronto, Ont.

[John Ravilious]

mike stone wrote:
>
> I have a confused recollection that I recently saw (either in a book or on a
> website) a genealogical tree showing *all* thirteen "competitors" for the
> Scottish throne in 1290 - even including the ones descended from royal
> bastards.
>
> Has anyone else seen it? If so I should appreciate a reminder of where it is.
>

> --
> Mike Stone - Peterborough England
>
> "The English people are like the English beer.
>
> Froth on top, dregs at the bottom, the middle excellent" - Voltaire

Wednesday, November 17, 1999

Unfortunately, I have not seen the tree you are referring to - the
closest I find (which is not close at all) is table entitled _the
Succession, 1290-1292_ provided by Professor Barrow [Robert Bruce and
the Community of the Realm in Scotland, Edinburgh, 1965], which shows
the relationship of 5 of the competitors.

There were in fact 13 competitors, if one discounts the claim
Edward I of England allegedly made for form's sake (supposedly as
great-uncle of the late Queen Margaret, and not from his own descent
from Malcolm III). In the order my notes reflect them (which is
supposedly the order in which they were recorded in August 1291), they
were:

Competitor Descended from:

1. Floris V, Count of Holland Henry, Earl of Huntingdon
(through daughter Ada)
2. Patrick de Dunbar, Earl
of March (7th Earl) William _the Lion_
(illegitimate through
his daughter Ada)
3. William de Vesci William _the Lion_
(illegitimate through
his daughter Margaret)
4. William de Ros, 2nd Lord
Ros William _the Lion_
(illegitimate through
his daughter Isabel)
5. Robert de Pinkeney Henry, Earl of Huntingdon
(illegitimate through
daughter Marjory)
6. Nicholas de Soules Alexander II
(illegitimate through
his daughter Marjory)
7. Patrick de Galithly William _the Lion_
(illegitimate through
his son Henry de Galithly)
8. Roger de Mandeville William _the Lion_
(illegitimate through
his daughter Aufrica)
9. John de Comyn, Lord of
Badenoch (the _Black_ Comyn) Domnall III or _Donalbane_
king of Scots ca 1094-1097
(through daughter Bethoc)
10. John de Hastings, 2nd
Lord Hastings David, Earl of Huntingdon
(through daughter Ada)
11. John de Balliol, Lord of
Galloway (afterward
John, King of Scots) David, Earl of Huntingdon
(through eldest daughter,
Margaret)
12. Robert de Brus or Bruce,
Lord of Annandale
(grandfather of _the_ Bruce) David, Earl of Huntingdon
(through daughter Isabel)
13. Eric II, King of Norway Margaret, Queen (d. 1290)
(as father and heir)

I do not have the above in table or chart form. However, if there
is any need or interest, please let me know.

Nemo me impune lacessit.

John

[Leo van de Pas]

In "The Lion in the North" by John Prebble, on page 327.
There is a tree which shows the links between the following contenders
John Balliol 1249-1315
Robert Bruce 'The Competitor' (grandfather of Robert The Bruce)
John Hastings

Floris V, Count of Holland

Robert Pinkney

I know there were more.
Leo van de Pas

----- Original Message -----
From: Brant Gibbard <bgib...@inforamp.net>
To: <GEN-MED...@rootsweb.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 17, 1999 10:58 PM
Subject: Re: The Scottish Competitors

> On 17 Nov 1999 12:35:20 GMT, mws...@aol.com (mike stone) wrote:
>
> >I have a confused recollection that I recently saw (either in a book or
on a
> >website) a genealogical tree showing *all* thirteen "competitors" for the
> >Scottish throne in 1290 - even including the ones descended from royal
> >bastards.
> >
> >Has anyone else seen it? If so I should appreciate a reminder of where it
is.
>

[Eric Thompson]

mike stone (mws...@aol.com) wrote on 17 Nov 1999 12:35:20 GMT:

> I have a confused recollection that I recently saw (either in a
> book or on a
> website) a genealogical tree showing *all* thirteen "competitors"
> for the
> Scottish throne in 1290 - even including the ones descended from
> royal bastards.
>
> Has anyone else seen it? If so I should appreciate a reminder

There is an outline chart on page 131 of the first volume of 'A Source
Book of Scottish History' by Croft Dickinson, Donaldson, and Milne
(Nelson, second edition, 1958).

A more detailed chart is given on pages 282-3 of Dunbar's 'Scottish
Kings' (Douglas, second edition, 1906).

A fuller pull-out table is at the end of the first volume of 'Edward I
and the Throne of Scotland' by Stones and Simpson (OUP, 1978)

--
Eric Thompson