New Light on John Saint John, Esq. (died before 1490), uncle of King Henry VII of England

[Douglas Richardson]

Dear Newsgroup ~

King Henry VII's maternal grandmother, Margaret Beauchamp (died 1482), Duchess of Somerset, Countess of Kendale, had three marriages in all: (1st) Oliver Saint John, Knt., (died 1437), of Fonmon and Penmark, Glamorgan, Wales, and Paulerspury, Northamptonshire; (2nd) John Beaufort, K.G. (died 1444), Duke of Somerset; and (3rd) Lionel (or Leo) Welles, K.G. (died 1461), 6th Lord Welles. Full details of these marriages can be found in my book, Royal Ancestry (2013).

Duchess Margaret had issue by all three of her marriages. By her 1st marriage to Sir Oliver Saint John, she had two sons, John and Oliver, Esq., and five daughters, Edith (wife of Geoffrey Pole, Esq.), Mary (wife of Richard Frogenale [or Frogenall]), Knt.), Elizabeth (wife of William Zouche, Knt., 5th Lord Zouche of Harringworth, and John Scrope, K.G., 5th Lord Scrope of Bolton), Agnes, and Margaret [Abbess of Shaftesbury].

Margaret Beauchamp's eldest son and heir was John Saint John, born c.1432-7, who is thought to have been a knight. As an adult, he held the manors of Bletsoe and Keysoe, Bedfordshire, and Paulerspury, Northamptonshire, as well as the manors of Fonmon and Penmark, Glamorgan, Wales. He is alleged to have been aged 40 and more in 1482, which age is presumably taken from his mother's inquisition dated that year [Reference: National Archives, C 140/82/7 (Inq. p.m. of Margaret, Duchess of Somerset dated 1482)]. John Saint John's death date seems to be unknown. There doesn't seem to be a will or an inquisition post mortem for him.

Four separate visitation records attest that John Saint John married Alice Bradshagh, daughter of Thomas Bradshagh, of Haigh, Lancashire:

1. Charles, Vis. of Huntingdon 1613 (Camden Soc. 43) (1849): 2 (St. John ped.: "Joh'es St. John de Bletso, miles. = Alicia, filia Tho. Bradshaw de Haugh in com. Lanc.").

2. Flower, Vis. of Yorkshire 1563-4 (H.S.P. 16) (1881): 62-63 (Clifford ped.: "John Saint John. = ... doughter of Thomas a Bradshaw.").

3. Harvey et al., Vis. of Bedfordshire 1566, 1582, 1634 & 1669 (H.S.P. 19) (1884): 51-54 (Saint John ped.: "Sr John Saint John of Bletneshoe in com. Bedf. K sonne and heire = Alice daughter of Sr Thomas Bradshawe of Hawe in com. Lanc. K.").

4. St. George et al. Wiltshire Vis. Peds. 1623, 1628 (H.S.P. 105-6) (1954): 167-170 (sub St. John ped.: "Johannes St John de Bletzo filius et heres miles = Alicia filia Tho Bradshaw de Haw militis").

In three of the above records, John Saint John is styled a knight. Other than the names of their children, little else is known of the life of John Saint John and his wife, Alice Bradshagh.

Elsewhere, in a pedigree of the Saint John family, Peter Bartrum alleges that John Saint John, husband of Alice Bradshagh, married (2nd) Elizabeth Mathew, daughter of William Mathew Fawr, by whom he had one son, Moris, who died without issue, and one daughter, NN, wife of Sir .... Newton. Reference: Bartrum, Welsh Genealogies 1400-1500 9 (1983): 1567, which is available at the following weblink:

http://cadair.aber.ac.uk/dspace/bitstream/handle/2160/6495/ST.%20JOHN%201_1567.png?sequence=1

The source for Mr. Bartrum's information is possibly a published pedigree of the Matthew family published in Archaeologia Cambrensis 5th Ser. 1 (1884): Genealogies of Glamorgan foll. 355, which read as follows:

"William Mathew Vaur, m. Llecci, d. of Griff, ap Nicholas, and had ... Elizabeth, m. John St. John and had Maurice and a dau., m. Sir Newton kt." END OF QUOTE.

However, there is nothing by Peter Bartrum or Archaeologia Cambrensis which actually identifies Elizabeth Mathew's husband, John Saint John. The Visitation of Bedfordshire does provide John Saint John of Bedfordshire and Northamptonshire with a son named "Morys" Saint John. However, this Morys is assigned as a child of John Saint John's marriage to Alice Bradshagh.

As for the alleged daughter of John Saint John and Elizabeth Mathew, she is seemingly mentioned in a pedigree of the Newton family in the visitation of Gloucestershire:

"Elizabeth St John. = Thomas Newton. = Alianor da. to the L. Dawbeney." Reference: Chitting & Phillipot, Vis. of Gloucester 1623, 1569 & 1582-3 (H.S.P. 21) (1885): 113-116 (Newton ped.).

So did John Saint John, husband of Alice Bradshagh, actually marry (2nd) Elizabeth Mathew, by whom he had a son, Maurice (or Moris) and a daughter married to a Newton?

To answer that question, I turned to the online records of the Court of Common Pleas on the AALT website. In short order, I was able to locate three lawsuits which conclusively establish that John Saint John, esquire (not knight) died before 9 Feb. 1489/90, and was survived by a wife, Elizabeth, who re-married Richard Newton. In 1490 and again in 1492 Richard and Elizabeth sued for her dower in lands held by her previous husband, John Saint John. Brief abstracts of the lawsuits are provided below.

In 1490 Richard Neweton and his wife, Elizabeth, widow of John Saint John, Esq., sued her step-son, John Saint John, Knt., in the Court of Common Pleas regarding her reasonable dower in free tenements in Bletsoe and Keysoe, Bedfordshire and Paulerspury, Northamptonshire. In 1492 Richard Neuton and his wife, Elizabeth, widow of John Saint John, Esq., sued Richard Emson and William Risley in the Court of Common Pleas regarding her dower in the third part of the manor of Paulerspury, Northamptonshire.

The references for the above lawsuits are:

1. Court of Common Pleas, CP40/911, image 307f (available at http://aalt.law.uh.edu/AALT3/H7/CP40no911/aCP40no911fronts/IMG_0307.htm).
2. Court of Common Pleas, CP40/911, image 679f (available at http://aalt.law.uh.edu/AALT3/H7/CP40no911/aCP40no911fronts/IMG_0679.htm).
3. Court of Common Pleas, CP40/919, image 1035d (available at http://aalt.law.uh.edu/AALT4/H7/CP40no919/bCP40no919dorses/IMG_1035.htm).

Further research has established that Elizabeth Mathew's 2nd husband was Richard Newton, Esq., of Wyke juxta Yatton, Aldwick, Ston Easton, Midsomer Norton, North Curry, Thorn Falcon, Ubley, and Walton-in-Gordano, Somerset, South Carleton, Devon, Child Okeford, Dorset, Aust and Down Hatherley, Gloucestershire, etc., son and heir of John Newton, Knt., by Isabel, daughter and co-heiress of Thomas Cheddar, Esq. He was born about 1468 (aged 30 and more in 1498). They had one daughter, Jane (or Jenet) (wife of Thomas Griffin, Knt.). Richard Newton died 26 Sept. 1500. In 1516 his widow, Elizabeth, presented to the church of Exford, Somerset. She died in 1524.

Complete Peerage 7 (1929): 459 (sub Latimer) states that Sir Thomas Griffin, de jure Lord Latimer, married "Jane, younger daughter and coheiress of Richard Newton, of Court of Wick in Yatton, Somerset. She died in 1558." END OF QUOTE.

Complete Peerage does not identify Jane Newton's mother, Elizabeth Mathew, nor mention the connection to the Saint John family. So the information above would be a new addition to Complete Peerage.

For a charter of Sir Thomas Gruffyn and Jenet Newton his wife dated 1540, see Clark, Cartæ et Alia Munimenta de Glamorgancia 5 (1910): 1924-1926.

The above information also corrects the Visitation of Gloucestershire which identified the husband of Elizabeth (Mathew) Saint John as being Thomas Newton. Elizabeth Mathew, widow of John Saint John, actually married Richard Newton, not Thomas Newton.

As for Maurice Saint John, he evidently existed as claimed. In 1501 I find he acted as carver at a breakfast the day following the marriage of Arthur Tudor, Prince of Wales, and Katherine of Aragón. Reference: Cobbett's Complete Collection of State Trials 1 (1809): cols. 299-368, esp. cols. 326-327 (Procs. rel. the dissolution of the marriage of King Henry VIII and Katherine of Aragón), which may be viewed at the following weblink:

http://books.google.com/books?id=zAcyAAAAIAAJ&pg=PA325

Maurice Saint John was a first cousin of King Henry VII, which would readily explain his presence as carver at the breakfast following the wedding of Arthur Tudor in 1501.

I've copied below my current file account of John Saint John, Esq. I note that his surviving widow, Elizabeth (Mathew) (Saint John) Newton, left a PCC will proved in 1524, which I haven't yet examined. For the time being, I've assigned his son, Maurice Saint John, to his marriage with Elizabeth Mathew.

For interest's sake, the following is a list of the 17th Century New World immigrants who descend from John Saint John, Esq. (died before 9 Feb. 1489/90), and his 1st wife, Alice Bradshagh:

Barbara Aubrey, William Bladen, George & Nehemiah Blakiston, Thomas Booth, Elizabeth, John, and Thomas Butler, Hannah, Samuel & Sarah Levis, Joseph & Mary Need, Elizabeth Saint John, Mary Johanna Somerset.

Best always, Douglas Richardson, Salt Lake City, Utah

+ + + + + + + + +

I. JOHN SAINT JOHN, Esq., of Bletsoe and Keysoe, Bedfordshire, Paulerspury, Northamptonshire, Fonmon and Penmark, Glamorgan, Wales, etc., son and heir, born about 1432-7 (aged 40 and more in 1482). He married (1st) ALICE BRADSHAGH (or BRADSCHAGH), daughter of Thomas Bradshagh, of Haigh, Lancashire. They had one son, John, K.B., and five daughters, Anne, Elizabeth (wife of Thomas Kent, Esq.), Eleanor, Margaret (wife of John ap Morgan), and _____ (nun at Shaftesbury). He married (2nd) ELIZABETH MATHEW, daughter of William Mathew Fawr, by Lleucu, daughter of Gruffudd ap Nicholas. They had one son, Maurice. JOHN SAINT JOHN, Esq., was living in 1482 (date of mother's inquisition post mortem), and died before 9 Feb. 1489/90 (date of lawsuit). His widow, Elizabeth, married (2nd) before 9 Feb. 1489/90 (date of lawsuit) (as his 2nd wife) RICHARD NEWTON, Esq., of Wyke juxta Yatton, Aldwick, Ston Easton, Midsomer Norton, North Curry, Thorn Falcon, Ubley, and Walton-in-Gordano, Somerset, South Carleton, Devon, Child Okeford, Dorset, Aust and Down Hatherley, Gloucestershire, etc., son and heir of John Newton, Knt., by Isabel, daughter and co-heiress of Thomas Cheddar, Esq. He was born about 1468 (aged 30 and more in 1498). They had one daughter, Jane (or Jenet) (wife of Thomas Griffin, Knt.). In 1490 Richard and his wife, Elizabeth, widow of John Saint John, Esq., sued her step-son, John Saint John, Knt., in the Court of Common Pleas regarding her reasonable dower in free tenements in Bletsoe and Keysoe, Bedfordshire and Paulerspury, Northamptonshire. In 1492 Richard and his wife, Elizabeth, widow of John Saint John, Esq., sued Richard Emson and William Risley in the Court of Common Pleas regarding her dower in the third part of the manor of Paulerspury, Northamptonshire. RICHARD NEWTON, Esq., died 26 Sept. 1500. He left a will dated 24 Sept. 1500, proved 3 March 1500/1 (P.C.C. Moone). His widow, Elizabeth, was assigned dower 11 June 1501. In 1516 she presented to the church of Exford, Somerset. In 1518 James Perceval, Esq., bought a quare impedit against Elizabeth, widow of Richard Newton and others regarding the church of Exford, Somerset. Elizabeth died in 1524. She left a will proved August 1524 (P.C.C.). In the period, 1532-38, Henry Capell and Thomas Gryffyn, Knts., and Jane, wife of the latter, sued Richard Bydwell, Gent., and another, executors of Nicholas, brother of Richard Newton, Esq., deceased in Chancery regarding the detention of deeds relating to the manor of Down Hatherley, Gloucestershire and other lands, late of the said Richard Newton, father of the said Jane, and grandfather of the said Sir Henry. In 1553-55 Thomas Gryffyn, of Braybrooke, Northamptonshire, sued Henry Capell and William Dale, of Yatton, Somerset, yeoman, in Chancery regarding the goods of Elizabeth, late the wife of Richard Newton, in her house at Wyke, Somerset.

References:

Collins, English Baronetage 4 (1741): 174-179 (sub Saint John). Anderson, Gen. Hist. of the House of Yvery 1 (1742): 416-419. Bridges, Hist. & Antiqs. of Northamptonshire 1 (1791): 311. Collinson, Hist. & Antiqs. of Somerset 3 (1791): 587-588. Betham, Baronetage of England 3 (1803): 384-389 (sub St. John). Fosbrooke, Abs. of Recs. & MSS Respecting the County of Gloucester 2 (1807): 79. Brydges, Collins' Peerage of England 5 (1812): 104; 6 (1812): 42-61 (sub St. John Viscount Bolingbroke and St. John), 741-751 (sub St. John, Lord St. John of Bletshoe). Gentleman's Mag. 94 (1824): 513-517, 588-591. Coll. Top. et Gen. 1 (1834): 310-311 (St. John ped.: "John Saint John, Esq. = [left blank]"), 314 (Daubeney ped.: "Alianor [Daubeney], first wed. to Simon Blount, aft. to Rd. Newton, Esq. for the King's Body."). Charles, Vis. of Huntingdon 1613 (Camden Soc. 43) (1849): 2 (St. John ped.: "Joh'es St. John de Bletso, miles. = Alicia, filia Tho. Bradshaw de Haugh in com. Lanc."). Annual Rpt. of the Deputy Keeper 30 (1869): 193. Harvey, Hist. & Antiqs. of the Hundred of Willey (1872-8): 488-489. Flower Vis. of Yorkshire 1563-4 (H.S.P. 16) (1881): 62-63 (Clifford ped.: "John Saint John. = ... doughter of Thomas a Bradshaw."). Arch. Cambrensis 5th Ser. 1 (1884): Genealogies of Glamorgan foll. 355 (ped. of Mathew of Llandaff: "William Mathew Vaur, m. Llecci, d. of Griff, ap Nicholas, and had ... Elizabeth, m. John St. John and had Maurice and a dau., m. Sir Newton kt."). Harvey et al., Vis. of Bedfordshire 1566, 1582, 1634 & 1669 (H.S.P. 19) (1884): 51-54 (Saint John ped.: "Sr John Saint John of Bletneshoe in com. Bedf. K sonne and heire = Alice daughter of Sr Thomas Bradshawe of Hawe in com. Lanc. K."). Chitting & Phillipot, Vis. of Gloucester 1623, 1569 & 1582-3 (H.S.P. 21) (1885): 113-116 (Newton ped.: "Elizabeth St John. = Thomas Newton. = Alianor da. to the L. Dawbeney."). Weaver, Somerset Incumbents (1889): 367. Watson, Ashmore, co. Dorset (1890): 8-11. Baines, Hist. of the County Palatine and Duchy of Lancaster 4 (1891): 291-292. Genealogist n.s. 8 (1891): 179-180 (Zouche ped.). Procs. of Somersetshire Arch. & Nat. Hist. Soc. 44 (1898): 55-62. Genealogical Mag. 8 (1904): 91-104 (Daubeney ped.). Index of Inqs. 1 (PRO Lists and Indexes 23) (1907): 198. Clark, Cartæ et Alia Munimenta de Glamorgancia 5 (1910): 1924-1926 (charter of Sir Thomas Gruffyn and Jenet Newton his wife dated 1540). VCH Bedford 3 (1912): 41, 136-137. C.P. 2 (1912): 206 (sub Bolingbroke); 7 (1929): chart between 452-453, 459 (sub Latimer). Burke, Gen. & Heraldic Hist. of the Peerage & Baronetage (76th ed., 1914): 262-264 (sub Bolingbroke). Cal. IPM Henry VII 2 (1915): 158, 223-224, 251, 259-260, 291, 343-344. Genealogists' Mag. 5 (1929): 355-359; 16 (1970): 244. Jacobus, Bulkeley Gen. (1933): 29-33. St. George et al., Wiltshire Vis. Peds. 1623, 1628 (H.S.P. 105-6) (1954): 167-170 (sub St. John ped.: "Johannes St John de Bletzo filius et heres miles = Alicia filia Tho Bradshaw de Haw militis"). Paget, Baronage of England (1957) 45: 1-4 (sub Beauchamp of Bletsoe). C.C.R. 1500-1509 (1963): 1. VCH Oxford 9 (1969): 59-60. Bartrum, Welsh Gens. 1400-1500 3 (1983): 394 [Cydifor Fawr 15 (A1)]; 9 (1983): (1983): 1496 [Rhydderch ap Iestyn 4(A2)]; 1567 [St. John 1: "Sir John St. John (1) = Alice f. Thomas Bradshaw, (2) = Elizabeth f. William Mathew Fawr")]. Jones, King's Mother (1992). Inv. of the Ancient Monuments in Glamorgan 3(1b) (2000): 147-150. Eales & Tyas, Fam. & Dynasty in Late Medieval England (Harlaxton Medieval Studies n.s. 9) (2003): 193-210. Court of Common Pleas, CP40/911, image 307f (available at http:// aalt.law.uh.edu/AALT3/H7/CP40no911/aCP40no911fronts/IMG_0307.htm). Court of Common Pleas, CP40/911, image 679f (available at http:// aalt.law.uh.edu/AALT3/H7/CP40no911/aCP40no911fronts/IMG_0679.htm). Court of Common Pleas, CP40/919, image 1035d (available at http:// aalt.law.uh.edu/AALT4/H7/CP40no919/bCP40no919dorses/IMG_1035.htm). National Archives, C 140/82/7 (Inq. p.m. of Margaret, Duchess of Somerset dated 1482); C 1/753/44; C 1/1352/71-74; C 1/1352/75-76; C 1/1429/77-88; C 78/22/43 (available at www.catalogue.nationalarchives.gov.uk/search.asp). Somerset Archive & Rec. Service: Deeds for the manor of Aldwick, DD\X\BDN/6 (available at www.a2a.org.uk/search/index.asp).

[Jan]

On Friday, September 12, 2014 4:26:13 PM UTC-4, Douglas Richardson wrote:
> Dear Newsgroup ~
...

> I've copied below my current file account of John Saint John, Esq. I note that his surviving widow, Elizabeth (Mathew) (Saint John) Newton, left a PCC will proved in 1524, which I haven't yet examined. For the time being, I've assigned his son, Maurice Saint John, to his marriage with Elizabeth Mathew.

...

The testament of Elizabeth Newton is available on Ancestry.com
http://interactive.ancestry.com/5111/40611_311120-00384/867969

She describes herself as "Ego Elizabeth Newton ordinis pallij et anuli Meneuen' Dioc compos ment[i]s ..." [Meneuensis is the Latin name for the Diocese of St David's in Pembrokeshire in Wales]

She asks to be buried "in cancello dnii Nicholai apud Monkton" and bequeaths to various religious people and places in Pembroke including "Sancti Nicholai apud Monkton."

She gives instructions to "Thome Gruffith et Johanne filie mee" and names them as her executors.

The date of Elizabeth's will is 8 June 1524, and the probate date is (blank) August 1524.

See also "Some Original Documents Relating to the South Part of Pembrokeshire" in the Journal of the British Archaeological Association (pp. 156-57 and 166-67).
https://archive.org/stream/journalofbritish41brit#page/156/mode/2up/
https://archive.org/stream/journalofbritish41brit#page/166/mode/2up/

[Douglas Richardson]

Dear Jan ~

Thanks so much for posting an abstract of the will of Elizabeth (Mathew) (Saint John) Newton, and also the reference you found for her in Journal of the British Archaeological Association. Much appreciated.

In my previous post, I should have stated that Elizabeth's 2nd husband, Richard Newton, Esq., was of Monkton, Pembrokeshire when he wrote his will in September 1500. I assume this was his chief seat, although he had considerable property in England.

Since my original post, I've located another English lawsuit for Richard Newton as follows:

In 1500 Richard Neuton, Esq., executor of Isabel Neuton, widow, sued Thomas Haket, of Wyke (in Yattton), Somerset, chaplain in the Court of Common Pleas regarding a trespass [vi et armis] at Wyke, Somerset.

Reference: Court of Common Pleas, CP40/951, image 29d (available at http://aalt.law.uh.edu/AALT1/H7/CP40no951/bCP40no951dorses/IMG_0029.htm).

By any chance, do you know what the "Order of the Pall and the Ring" is? It was mentioned in connection with Elizabeth (Mathew) (Saint John) Newton. I've never heard of it.

[Jan]

I, too, had not heard of the "Order of the Pall and the Ring" of St. David's Diocese before reading Elizabeth's will. The author of the journal article mentioned that he, too, had not heard of it and was not able to discover anything about it.

[Kevan Barton via]

http://www.mocavo.com/Journal-of-the-British-Archaeological-Association-1885
-Volume-41/762287/225

Perhaps you have the above. Not sure it helps.

Cheers,
Kevan

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[johnmw...@gmail.com]

Hi Douglas,

I am sure it is not the "Order of the Pall and Ring", but the order of the pall and ring. It has something to do with a widow's vow of chastity to a bishop, which included the wearing of a veil (pall?) and a ring. No doubt someone with more knowledge of these things will correct me.

Regards,
John

[Jan]

On Thursday, September 18, 2014 2:44:06 AM UTC-4, johnmw...@gmail.com wrote:
...

> > By any chance, do you know what the "Order of the Pall and the Ring" is? It was mentioned in connection with Elizabeth (Mathew) (Saint John) Newton. I've never heard of it.

...

> Hi Douglas,
>
> I am sure it is not the "Order of the Pall and Ring", but the order of the pall and ring. It has something to do with a widow's vow of chastity to a bishop, which included the wearing of a veil (pall?) and a ring. No doubt someone with more knowledge of these things will correct me.
>
> Regards,
> John

Yes, that must be the meaning of the words in Elizabeth's will.

The symbols of the veil and ring in the widow's chastity vow are discussed in Virginia Blanton, Signs of Devotion: The Cult of St. Æthelthryth in Medieval England, 695-1615 (2010), p. 206-208
http://books.google.com/books?id=UqzkLzFJdn8C&pg=PA206

"Prostrating herself before the bishop, the vowess submits publicly to his authority and is veiled, whereupon she kisses the bishop's ring, the symbol of his ecclesiastical position. No longer bound by the authority of her husband, she moves from under the authority of the king to living under the authority of her bishop. A widow's vow of chastity offers a social ritual that places her under the protection and authority of the highest ecclesiast in her region--a protection symbolized by the veil, the ring, and her dark clothing. Spatial enclosure, however, was not a requirement for vowesses as it was for professed nuns. They could continue to live a public life or retire to a female community as a lay boarder, but even then the widow would not be required to remain within the convent walls. Spatially, the vowess could traverse the confines of the nunnery to the outside world and back again." (The book discusses the example of the vow taken by Isabella de Beauchamp widow of John Lestrange and William de Ufford.)

[Brian Hessick]

Here is a document I am sure you have seen before, but I wanted to provide my own transcription. It became of interest to me since it's the earliest document I have referencing a Wriothesley (Writh).

The will of Oliver Saint John Esquire, written 2 March 1497, and proven 10 April 1497.

PROB 11/11/179

In the name of God Amen, this is the last will of me Oliver SAINT JOHN Esquire, son to the emollient Duchess of SOMERSET. First I bequeath my soul to Almighty God, and to our Lady St. Mary, and to the saints of heaven; and my body to be buried in the quere* a fore St. Andrew in the parish church of Stoke. Also I will that my wife have during her life all my lands and tenements in Lydiard Tregoze and Poulton with the manor of Borwood and Whatfild Hall (sic) which is mine by the reason and gift of my Lady, my mother, with a place which I purchased in the lordship of Ashmore called Hillis Thing in Dorset shire. Also I will that my wife have all such lands as by mine by the reason and gift of the King's grace as Hatfield Peverel with the terms and ways course with Deptford and Deptford Strond otherwise called West Greenwich. Also I will that she have the lordship of Garsington and that after her decease, all the foresaid lordships, lands, and tenements return unto my son John and to his heirs. Also I will that my wife have the lordship of Lollam, the which I purchased, to give and sell as in fee simple. Moreover I will that Ralph ROCHFORD have all such lands and tenements as I purchased within the lordship of South Stoke and North Stoke. Also I will that my wife have all my goods, movable and unmovable, and that she occupy as my exex sole by herself and to dispose all my goods for the health of my soul as she thinks best. These being witnesses Master Thomas ISEHAM, Master Richard BULLOK, Sir John WRITH, Henry BIGOTT, and Ralph ROCHFORD, with other yeomen, and made the 2nd day of March in the year of our Lord God 1496.

The above written testament was proved before the Lord at Lambeth on the 10th day of April Anno Domini 1497, by the oath of Sir Richard BULLOK and Henry BIGOTT witnesses etc. and entered etc. and a commission was granted the relic and appointed exex in the same testament in the person of Christopher MIDDLETON proctor etc. sworn on the Holy Gospels to well and faithfully admin the same, and to exhibit a full and true inventory etc. before the feast of the Nativity of St. John the Baptist next to come, and also to render a plain and true account of the same etc.

[Richard Carruthers via]

Quere is likely a variant of quire which is an archaic spelling for
the architectural part of a church in which the choir resides, between
the nave and the sanctuary. It still has currency in certain
ecclesiological circles.

On 22/09/2014, Brian Hessick via <gen-me...@rootsweb.com> wrote:
> Here is a document I am sure you have seen before, but I wanted to provide
> my own transcription. It became of interest to me since it's the earliest
> document I have referencing a Wriothesley (Writh).
>
> The will of Oliver Saint John Esquire, written 2 March 1497, and proven 10
> April 1497.
>
> PROB 11/11/179
>
> In the name of God Amen, this is the last will of me Oliver SAINT JOHN
> Esquire, son to the emollient Duchess of SOMERSET. First I bequeath my soul
> to Almighty God, and to our Lady St. Mary, and to the saints of heaven; and
> my body to be buried in the quere* a fore St. Andrew in the parish church of
> Stoke. Also I will that my wife have during her life all my lands and
> tenements in Lydiard Tregoze and Poulton with the manor of Borwood and
> Whatfild Hall (sic) which is mine by the reason and gift of my Lady, my
> mother, with a place which I purchased in the lordship of Ashmore called
> Hillis Thing in Dorset shire. Also I will that my wife have all such lands
> as by mine by the reason and gift of the King's grace as Hatfield Peverel
> with the terms and ways course with Deptford and Deptford Strond otherwise
> called West Greenwich. Also I will that she have the lordship of Garsington
> and that after her decease, all the foresaid lordships, lands, and tenements

> return unto my son John an!

> d to his heirs. Also I will that my wife have the lordship of Lollam, the
> which I purchased, to give and sell as in fee simple. Moreover I will that
> Ralph ROCHFORD have all such lands and tenements as I purchased within the
> lordship of South Stoke and North Stoke. Also I will that my wife have all
> my goods, movable and unmovable, and that she occupy as my exex sole by
> herself and to dispose all my goods for the health of my soul as she thinks
> best. These being witnesses Master Thomas ISEHAM, Master Richard BULLOK, Sir
> John WRITH, Henry BIGOTT, and Ralph ROCHFORD, with other yeomen, and made
> the 2nd day of March in the year of our Lord God 1496.
>
> The above written testament was proved before the Lord at Lambeth on the
> 10th day of April Anno Domini 1497, by the oath of Sir Richard BULLOK and
> Henry BIGOTT witnesses etc. and entered etc. and a commission was granted
> the relic and appointed exex in the same testament in the person of
> Christopher MIDDLETON proctor etc. sworn on the Holy Gospels to well and
> faithfully admin the same, and to exhibit a full and true inventory etc.
> before the feast of the Nativity of St. John the Baptist next to come, and
> also to render a plain and true account of the same etc.
>
>

[Brian Hessick]

Right you are. This transcription is part of a larger body of work. All words with (*) is an indication that the word can be found in the glossary.

[Suzanne St. John]

Thank you for addressing this topic. I certainly gave up a long time ago. I wonder if there were multiple marriages with St. Johns and Newtons?

Richard Newton is said to be alias, Richard Craddock (The Visitation of the County of Gloucester: Takes in the Year 1623, with Pedigrees from the Herald's Visitations of 1569 and 1582-3 (1885), Maclean, John, (Publications of the Harleian Society: Visitations, volume 21. London: [Harleian Society], 1885), FHL book 942 B4h volume 21., p. 115.) and Also Thomas Newton (British Genealogy (filmed 1950), Evans, Alcwyn Caryni, (Books A to H. National Library of Wales MSS 12359-12360D. Manuscript filmed by the Genealogical Society of Utah, 1950), FHL microfilms 104,355 and 104,390 item 2., book 8 p. H42.)

Richard Newton is said to have married Elsbeth St. John, daughter of John St. John of Gwyr and Lleucu ferch Gruffudd; granddaughter of Alexander St. John of Highlight and Margery Johns or Johanna Craddock (different sources give his wife a different name).

Bartrum questions the placement of this John St. John of Gwyr but doesn't explain his issue. This Elsbeth has a brother John St. John m. Ellen Dwnn. From my own research, the real problem is the merging of the Fonmon de Port-St. Johns with the Highlight St. Johns as one family with persons of similar name or life-span.

I have not been able to resolve this conflict with John de Port-St. John's second wife Elizabeth Mathew, mother of Morris and NN daughter. Your information helps clarify that.

Cardiff Central Library MS 5.6 fol. 496 has the daughter of John de Port-St. John and Elizabeth Mathew (Morris's sister) as the one who married Sir ____ Newton, Kt. (not the widow Elizabeth Mathew St. John - maybe there wasn't a daughter?)

MS 5.6 fol. 357 has Elizabeth Mathew m. John St. John with two kids Morris St. John, no issue; D. m. Sr _____ Newton, Kt. then written above the entry for the daughter is viscil 2nd Hen 8vi Adom 1517

The de Port-St. Johns of Fonmon have been mixed with individuals in the St. Johns of Uchel-olau (Highlight) family so it wouldn't surprise me to see this type of duplicity again here.

I tried researching this John St. John of Gwyr as the son of Alexander of Higlight. I suspect he may be mixed with Alexander's father, John St. John d. after 1429 not to be confused with John de Port-St. John d. 1425.

Warm Regards,

Suzanne St. John