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C.P. Addition: Marriage date of Thomas Stanley, 1st Earl of Derby [died 1504], and Eleanor Neville
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Douglas Richardson
Aug 16, 2013, 4:35:17 PM8/16/13
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Dear Newsgroup ~
Complete Peerage, 4 (1916): 205–207 (sub Derby) has a good account of King Henry VII's famous step-father, Sir Thomas Stanley, K.G., 1st Earl of Derby [died 1504].
Regarding Sir Thomas Stanley's first marriage to Eleanor Neville, the following information is provided on page 207:
"He married, 1stly, apparently after 10 May 1457, Eleanor, sister of Richard, Earl of Warwick (the celebrated King Maker), 4th daughter of Richard (Neville), Earl of Salisbury, by Alice, daughter and h. of Thomas (Montagu), Earl of Salisbury. She was buried at St. James's, Garlickhithe, London." END OF QUOTE.
In footnote a on the same page, the following additional information is provided:
"She [Eleanor] is named as a legatee in her father's will of that date [i.e., 10 May 1457] without any indication that she was then married, though her married sister is spoken of therein as Countess of Arundel. V.G." END OF QUOTE.
On the surface, the deduction made by Vicary Gibbs [V.G.] sounds logical to the modern mind, except for the fact that medieval fathers were not required to provide marital data on all of their daughters in their last wills and testaments, let alone even mention them. Hence the statement that Thomas Stanley and Eleanor Neville were "apparently" married after 10 May 1457 is utterly baseless.
Leaving the 1457 will of Eleanor's father aside, elsewhere I find that Michael Hicks, who is certainly a competent historian, recently stated that "Eleanor [Neville] probably married Thomas, the future Lord Stanley, about 17 December 1454, when Hawarden Castle in Flintshire was resettled." [Reference: Hicks, Warwick the Kingmaker (2008): 25].
http://books.google.com/books?id=t6v8mzfcxFQC&pg=PA25&dq=1454+Stanley+Thomas+Eleanor&hl=en&sa=X&ei=lIUOUvzIIMfKqAHm8IGYAQ&ved=0CDkQ6AEwAg#v=onepage&q=1454%20Stanley%20Thomas%20Eleanor&f=false.
Obviously Hicks did not accept Complete Peerage's analysis as to the date of this marriage.
Even so, it appears that Thomas Stanley and Eleanor Neville were actually married in the chapel of Middleham Castle, Yorkshire in 1451, as indicated by the following license published in the book, Exchequer K.R. Ecclesiastical Documents (List & Index Society, Volume 2 (1965): 67:
"Reference: 24/74
Date: 1451
License by the vicar general of the archbishop of York for the abbot of Jervaulx and Ralph Skipton, rector of Middleham, to solemnize the marriage of Thomas son of Thomas Staveley, knight, and Eleanor daughter of Richard, earl of Salisbury, in the chapel of Middleham castle, York dioc." END OF QUOTE.
Thus the correct date of the marriage of Thomas Stanley and Eleanor Neville is evidently 1451, at which date Thomas Stanley was approximately 16 years of age. And that makes sense.
Best always, Douglas Richardson, Salt Lake City, Utah
Complete Peerage, 4 (1916): 205–207 (sub Derby) has a good account of King Henry VII's famous step-father, Sir Thomas Stanley, K.G., 1st Earl of Derby [died 1504].
Regarding Sir Thomas Stanley's first marriage to Eleanor Neville, the following information is provided on page 207:
"He married, 1stly, apparently after 10 May 1457, Eleanor, sister of Richard, Earl of Warwick (the celebrated King Maker), 4th daughter of Richard (Neville), Earl of Salisbury, by Alice, daughter and h. of Thomas (Montagu), Earl of Salisbury. She was buried at St. James's, Garlickhithe, London." END OF QUOTE.
In footnote a on the same page, the following additional information is provided:
"She [Eleanor] is named as a legatee in her father's will of that date [i.e., 10 May 1457] without any indication that she was then married, though her married sister is spoken of therein as Countess of Arundel. V.G." END OF QUOTE.
On the surface, the deduction made by Vicary Gibbs [V.G.] sounds logical to the modern mind, except for the fact that medieval fathers were not required to provide marital data on all of their daughters in their last wills and testaments, let alone even mention them. Hence the statement that Thomas Stanley and Eleanor Neville were "apparently" married after 10 May 1457 is utterly baseless.
Leaving the 1457 will of Eleanor's father aside, elsewhere I find that Michael Hicks, who is certainly a competent historian, recently stated that "Eleanor [Neville] probably married Thomas, the future Lord Stanley, about 17 December 1454, when Hawarden Castle in Flintshire was resettled." [Reference: Hicks, Warwick the Kingmaker (2008): 25].
http://books.google.com/books?id=t6v8mzfcxFQC&pg=PA25&dq=1454+Stanley+Thomas+Eleanor&hl=en&sa=X&ei=lIUOUvzIIMfKqAHm8IGYAQ&ved=0CDkQ6AEwAg#v=onepage&q=1454%20Stanley%20Thomas%20Eleanor&f=false.
Obviously Hicks did not accept Complete Peerage's analysis as to the date of this marriage.
Even so, it appears that Thomas Stanley and Eleanor Neville were actually married in the chapel of Middleham Castle, Yorkshire in 1451, as indicated by the following license published in the book, Exchequer K.R. Ecclesiastical Documents (List & Index Society, Volume 2 (1965): 67:
"Reference: 24/74
Date: 1451
License by the vicar general of the archbishop of York for the abbot of Jervaulx and Ralph Skipton, rector of Middleham, to solemnize the marriage of Thomas son of Thomas Staveley, knight, and Eleanor daughter of Richard, earl of Salisbury, in the chapel of Middleham castle, York dioc." END OF QUOTE.
Thus the correct date of the marriage of Thomas Stanley and Eleanor Neville is evidently 1451, at which date Thomas Stanley was approximately 16 years of age. And that makes sense.
Best always, Douglas Richardson, Salt Lake City, Utah
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