Thornhill of Thornhill, and Thornhill of Fixby
The...@aol.com
Hello All,
The recent research and SGM posts by MichaelAnne Guido, Rosie Bevan and
others has provided added impetus to resolve (to the extent possible) the
pedigrees of several Yorkshire families. Following is the (my) current
reconstruction of the family of Thornhill, specifically the two 'primary'
branches: Thornhill of Thornhill, and Thornhill of Fixby. [Please note: the
order of seniority shown for the sons of Essulf is conjectured, and not
proven to my knowledge.]
The relationship indicated to the family of Birkin of Birkin is that
established by Clay [1]. The descent of the manor of Thornhill as given by
Foster [2] is essentially correct: we have recently seen the correct
identification of the father (if not the mother) of Joan, daughter of Sir
William FitzWilliam of Emley and Sprotborough (d. aft 4 Mar 1338/39) [3].
One particular correction to the pedigree given in Foster is concerning
the parentage of Thomas de Thornhill, husband of Margaret de Lacy.
Foster shows Thomas as a younger son of Sir Brian de Thornhill and his wife
Joan FitzWilliam: the chronology provided by the documents concerning Thomas
de Thornhill make it evident that he could not have been a son of Sir Brian,
but was rather a younger brother of Sir Brian. The FitzWilliam (and thereby
Plantagenet) descent thereby is lost to the descendants of Thomas de
Thornhill (that is, Thornhill of Fixby).
The second post in this thread will provide a more detailed pedigree
with the related documentation and extracts (from the PRO site and
elsewhere). Any relevant comment, criticism or added documentation will be
welcome.
Cheers,
John *
___________________________
1. Essulf of Birkin, Shitlington and Tong, co. Yorks.
1. Peter fitz Asolf(-<1143) [ancestor of BIRKIN of Birkin]
2. Richard de Tong [ancestor of TONG]
3. Jordan fitz Essulf, of Thornhill and Hunsworth, co. Yorks.
1. Richard de Thornhill
2. Jordan de Thornhill
1. Sir John de Thornhill, d. bef 1260
+ Olivia de la Mare
1. Sir Richard de Thornhill, d. 1287
+ Maud de Fixby
1. Sir John de Thornhill, d. bef 9 July 1322
+ Beatrice Talboner
1. Sir Brian de Thornhill, d. aft 20 July 1372
+ Joan FitzWilliam
1. Simon de Thornhill, d. aft 1369
+ Elizabeth [ de Babthorpe ?]
1. Elizabeth de Thornhill, heiress
+ Sir John de Savile
1. Thomas Savile of Thornhill
2. Henry Savile of Copley
2. William de Thornhill, d.s.p.
2. Elizabeth de Thornhill
+ Sir Henry Musters of Kirklington
3. Joan de Thornhill
4. Margaret de Thornhill
+ Gerald [or Gerard] de Ufflet
5. John de Thornhill, clerk
2. Thomas de Thornhill, of Sandeholme in Horbury
+ Margaret de Lacy
1. Richard de Thornhill
+ Margaret de Toothill, heiress of Fixby
1. William de Thornhill, of Fixby, d. 1443
+ Barbara de Hopton
1. Brian de Thornhill, d.v.p.
2. Robert
3. Richard
4. John
5. Laurence
6. Isabel
7. Joan
2. John de Thornhill, rector of Thornhill
3. Robert de Thornhill
3. Agnes de Thornhill
+ John de Dronsfield, d. bef 25 May 1348
1. John de Dronsfield, d. 1369
4. John de Thornhill, parson of Thornhill, d. aft
1354
2. Henry de Thornhill, clerk
3. Brian de Thornhill, rector of Bedale
4. Peter de Thornhill, of Thornhill Lees, co. Yorks.
1. Richard de Thornhill, of Thornhill Lees, co.
Yorks.
2. Sarah de Thornhill
+ Sir Richard de Tankersley
1. Johanna de Tankersley
+ Sir Hugh de Eland
2. Alice de Tankersley
+ Richard le Tyes
4. John fitz Essulf
NOTES
[1] Sir Charles Clay, ed., "Early Yorkshire Families," The Yorkshire
Archaeological Society, Record Series), 1973, Vol. CXXXV.
[2] "Pedigrees of the County Families of Yorkshire," compiled by Joseph
Foster,
W. Wilfred Head, London, 1874.
[3] See the complete SGM thread, <Re: Savile of Thornhill and Copley: a
Plantagenet descent>, September 2004. In particular, see MichaelAnne
Guido, <Re: Savile of Thornhill and Copley: a Plantagenet
descent>, 7 September 2004, which cites various PRO
extracts; Baildon & the Baildons by William Paley Baildon, Chapter
Eleven - The Fitzwilliams, p. 355, Thoroton, Antiquities of
Nottinghamshire, Vol. III, page 135; and other sources.
* John P. Ravilious
The...@aol.com
Hello All,
Following is Part 1 of the detailed pedigree, previously promised.
Please note that there is ongoing research related to this family (esp.
as
regards the wives assigned to the 15th century Thornhill of Fixby family).
Cheers,
John
__________________________________________
1 Essulf
----------------------------------------
of Birkin, co. Yorks.
also held lands in Shitlington and Tong, co. Yorks. during the reign of
Henry I (1100-1135)
cf. Clay, pp. 90-91[1]
Children: Peter fitz Asolf(-<1143) [ancestor of BIRKIN of Birkin]
Richard de Tong [ancestor of TONG]
Jordan (->1194)
John (->1184)
1.1 Jordan fitz Essulf
----------------------------------------
Death: aft 25 Jan 1194[1]
of Thornhill and Hunsworth, co. Yorks.
' Jordan son of Essulf', constable of Wakefield, 1174-78
' On 25 January 1194-5 he and his son Richard were granted by final concord
the land of Thornhill, Hunsworth and East Bierley by Richard de Tong for the
service of a quarter of a knight's fee and 10s yearly. ' [Clay p. 91, cites
EYC iii, no. 1767[1]]
Children: Richard
Jordan (->1215)
1.1.1 Richard de Thornhill
----------------------------------------
' Richard son of Jordan ', witness to a grant [dated c1199-c1216]to his
brother Jordan [PRO, West Yorkshire Archive Service, Calderdale:
Papers of the Armytage family of Kirklees Hall [KM/1 - KM/857], KM/2[2] ]
1.1.2 Jordan de Thornhill[3]
----------------------------------------
Death: aft 1215[2]
of Thornhill and Hunsworth, co. Yorks.
grant dated c1199-c1216:
' Grant by William, son of Pain de Denebj, to Jordan, son of Jordan de
Thornhill, of two bovates of land in Denebj, held of Simon, son of Michael
de Denebi, paying annually half a pound of cumin, or two-pence.
Witnesses, John de Birkin, and Roger his brother, Germanns de Thornhill,
Richard, son of Jordan, William son of Thomas, William son of John, Robert
son of Dolrin, Adam de Mirefield, Simon de Denebj, John de Thornhill, who
wrote the Charter.' - PRO, West Yorkshire Archive Service, Calderdale:
Papers of the Armytage family of Kirklees Hall [KM/1 - KM/857], KM/2[2]
' Grant by Richard son of Henry de Tofteschath to Jordan de Thorenhill of all
his land etc in Tofeschath' (Toftshaw, Yk) ' - PRO, Nottinghamshire
Archives: Savile of Rufford: Deeds and Estate Papers [DD/SR/13 - DD/SR/205],
DD/SR/28/1/7[2]
Children: Sir John (<1203-<1260)
1.1.2.1 Sir John de Thornhill[4]
----------------------------------------
Birth: bef 1203[3]
Death: bef 1260[2]
knight, of Thornhill and Hunsworth, co. Yorks.[3]
2nd husband of Olivia[5]
record of the presentation by Sir John de Thornhill of Master Gilbert to the
living, of Thornhill church, in inquest dated 17 Oct 1290:
' Inquisition concerning the institution of Master Wm de Burgo to the
church of Thornhill by presentation of John son of Ric de Thornhill.
Recording that the vacancy was caused by the death of master Gilbert,
formerly rector; that John de Thornhill, s & h of Sir Ric de Thornhill,
was the true patron; and that Sir John, grandfather of John, made the
last presentation. The value of the church of Thornhill is 40 marks;
it renders 40s yearly to the church of Dewsbury for sundry tithes '
- PRO, DD/SR/36/10[2]
Spouse: Olivia de la Mare [2],[3]
Father: [probable] William de la Mare (-ca1203)
Mother: [probable] Mabel Malherbe
Children: Sir Richard (-1287)
Sarah
1.1.2.1.1 Sir Richard de Thornhill
----------------------------------------
Death: 1287[3]
of Thornhill and Hunsworth, co. Yorks.
' Sir Richard Thornhill, of Thornhill, Knt., ob. 1287. = Matilda, daughter
of Thomas de Fixby. ' [pedigree of Thornhill, of Fixby and Riddlesworth:
Foster's Yorkshire Pedigrees[3]]
Grant by his mother of her lands in Cawthorne, co. Yorks.,
undated [est. 'Middle of 13th century' ] :
' Grant by Olyva de la Mare, widow, to Richard de Thornil, her son, of all
her land in Galthorn namely all that land which she had of Geoffrey de
Nevill and Mabel, his wife, in exchange for land in Culgarth, in accordance
of a deed of quit claim which the said Richard has from William de Arci, the
said Olyva's son and heir.
Witnesses, John de Lungvilers, Robert de Stapelton, William de Brettona,
Adam de Mirfeud, Adam de Preston, knights, Richard de Tanoreslay [sic:
Tancreslay, or Tankersley].' - PRO, West Yorkshire Archive Service,
Yorkshire Archaeological Society: Clarke Thornhill of Fixby Collection,
DD12/II/3/10[2]
record of grant (undated):
' Grant: Robert de Teleby knight to Richard de Thornhill knight, son of John
de Thornhill 1 bovate arable in Teleby. ' - PRO, Nottinghamshire Archives:
Savile of Rufford: Deeds and Estate Papers [DD/SR/206 - DD/SR/215],
DD/SR/209/114[2]
record of grant (undated):
' Grant: Thomas Worre of Thornhill to Lord Richard of Thornhill and Matilda
his wife house, toft and croft in Thornhill. ' - PRO, Nottinghamshire
Archives: Savile of Rufford: Deeds and Estate Papers [DD/SR/206 - DD/SR/215],
DD/SR/209/114[2]
record of quitclaim dated 1260 :
' Chirograph: Registering of Quit claim Richard of Thornhill to Lord John de
Sothill & others, before court Adam de Mirfield & others & Henry Walens
Steward of Pontefract, claim to lands in Mixenden, Yorks. '
- PRO, Nottinghamshire Archives: Savile of Rufford: Deeds and Estate Papers
[DD/SR/1/1 - DD/SR/12/102], DD/SR/A11/1[2]
release dated c1216-c1272:
' Release by Adam le Harpur of Deneby to Richard de Thorenhill, of homage and
service in Deneby.
Witnesses, Richard de Tang (?), John de Sotill, William de Thorenhill,
Heclar (?) de Brertwissel, knights, John de Batelay, Hugh de Rastrik,
William son of Thomas de Mirfeld, Robert de Popelay.' [PRO, KM/10: Deeds
relating to DENBY[2]]
' Richard de Thornhyll ', attended court at Halifax, Tuesday before the feast
of a Luke the Evangelist [Oct. 18th], Edward I [18 Oct 1274]:
' RASTRIK [Rastrick] .--Simon the Grave of Hipperholme, John de Stanclif,
Mathew de Sundreland, Alecok del Clif, Richard de Northouerum [Northowram],
Roger the Fuller, Waiter de Schepeley [Shepley], Elias del Grene, Gilbert
Bothe, Henry son of Richard de Northouerum, Richard de Thornhyll [Thornhill],
John del Wode Roger son of Walter, Adam Stel, Henry son of William Leysing,
John son of Hanne son of Ketyl Henry the late Grave, Thomas Undreclif Peter
Pil´ Adam and John del Botherode give 20 marks for having the mill of
Raastrik this year, payable half at pentecost and half at Michaelmas, under
their own pledge. ' [6]
' HYPERUM. --Jordan de Schakeltonstal, Nelle de Wynter John Luvekyn and
William son of Elkoe de Schakeltonstal, accused of taking a stag, remain
under the surety of Sir Richard de Thornhyll until the next Court at
Wakefield. '[6]
' Quitclaim by William son of William de Wath to Sir Richard de Thornhill'
(Thornhill,Yk) of all claim to the manor which William de Langefeud holds
in Thornhill' Green wax seal bearing the legend 'S' WILLELMI DE WAHT' '
- PRO, Nottinghamshire Archives: Savile of Rufford: Deeds and Estate Papers
[DD/SR/1/1 - DD/SR/12/102], DD/SR/1/25/M8[2]
Spouse: Maud de Fixby [3]
Father: Thomas de Fixby [3]
Children: Sir John (-<1322)
Henry
Brian
Peter
1.1.2.1.1.1 Sir John de Thornhill[4]
----------------------------------------
Death: bef 9 Jul 1322[2]
of Thornhill and Hunsworth, co. Yorks.
' Sir John Thornhill, of Thornhill, 35 K. Ed. I, held lands in Thornhill,
Tong,
Ovenden, Hundesworth, and Bierley (see Kirbys inquest), and was dead
in 15 Ed. 2. He granted to the prior and convent of Lewes, in Sussex,
and their successors, to attach their mill dam of Heptonstall. = Beatrice,
(?)
daughter of Sir William Talboner. ' [pedigree of Thornhill, of Fixby and
Riddlesworth: Foster's Yorkshire Pedigrees[3]]
statements dated 14 Aug 1290:
' Renunciation and disclaimers by Nicholas de Leycestr' of his right and
interest in the advowson and presentation of Thornhill church in favour of
John de Thornhyll. Three small seals on tongues ' - PRO, Nottinghamshire
Archives: Savile of Rufford: Deeds and Estate Papers [DD/SR/13 - DD/SR/205],
DD/SR/36/11[2]
' John de Thornhill ', witness (together with Sir William FitzWilliam
FitzThomas, Sir Hugh de Eland, Sir John de Sotehill and others) to grant
by Thomas de Horbyri, brother and heir of John of Horbyri to Sir Nicholas
de Wortelay of the manor of Shetelingthon [Shitlington], ca. 1300 [PRO,
Sheffield Archives: Wharncliffe Muniments [Wh M/D/01 - Wh M/P/13],
Wh M/D/627[2]
grant dated St Martin's Day, 1305 [12 Nov 1305]:
' Grant under conditions of a messuage and six acres by John de Thornehill
to William son of Ellis de Waddisw' and Agnes his wife' - PRO,
Nottinghamshire Archives: Savile of Rufford: Deeds and Estate Papers,
DD/SR/27/1/7b[2]
grant dated 3 June 1310:
' Grant and Quitclaim by Jordan de Denay to John de Thornehill' (Thornhill,
Yk) his lord of 1½ acres in Thornehill' - PRO, Nottinghamshire Archives:
Savile of Rufford: Deeds and Estate Papers [DD/SR/1/1 - DD/SR/12/102],
DD/SR/1/25/M9[2]
' In 1322 John de Thornhill held the manors of Thornhill and Hunsworth of
the heir of Richard de Tong, a minor in the kg's wardship, each by the
service
of 1/8 k.f. (Y.A.J., xxix, 302-3).' [Clay p. 91[1]]
he d. before 9 July 1322, date of record of his widow's dower [PRO,
Nottinghamshire Archives: Savile of Rufford: Deeds and Estate Papers
[DD/SR/1/1 - DD/SR/12/102], DD/SR/1/25/M10[2] ]
Spouse: Beatrice Talboner [3]
Death: aft 1334[2]
Children: Sir Brian (->1365)
Thomas
Agnes (->1355)
John (->1349)
1.1.2.1.1.1.1 Sir Brian de Thornhill
----------------------------------------
Death: aft 8 Dec 1365[2]
Occ: lord of Thornhill
of Thornhill and Hunsworth, co. Yorks.
' Sir Bryan Thornhill, of Thornhill, one of the knights of the shire for
York, 29 and 31 Ed. 3, held lands in East Keswick, in the
wapentake of Skyrak, 9 Ed. 2, and witness to a charter by which
Adam de Copley founded a chantry in the south choir of Batley
Church, dated at Batley, 13 Oct., 1334. = Joan, daughter of
Sir John Fitz-William, Knt. ' [pedigree of Thornhill, of Fixby and
Riddlesworth: Foster's Yorkshire Pedigrees[3]]
succeeded his father before 9 July 1322, probably as a minor:
date of agreement as to his mother's dower :
' Record of the Grant to Beatrice widow of Sir John de Thornhill' by William
de Knol', attorney of Brian son & heir of the said Sir John, as her dower,
of the manor of Thornhill' called Le Grenehalle with all appurtenances except
the advowson of Thornhill, with the boat ferry in Thornhill on the Kelder,
with the lands, tenements, rents and services of the said Sir John in
Whitteley, Brettewysel, Farneley Tyas, Soutz Deneby and Waddesworth' with
their mills and the vaccaries of Wydehope and Smaleshagh' with their
pastures except a meadow called Thorne Risshes; also the said Sir John's
tenements in Haytheby with half an acre of land at Walcote Heuedland and
half an acre of land in Daly with half a perch, and at Hundehill' half an
acre of land and at Cazehow one acre of land, with 5 acres of meadow in
Colby, Halton' and Flickesburgh, with rents and services from the tenants
of the said Sir John in Colby, Halton', Theuelby, Haytheby and Burton' except
for an annual rent of 6d in Haytheby and an annual rent of 14s 4d on a
tenement in Colby. Beatrice reserves the right to claim dower on the manor
which Thomas de Langefeld in Thornhill' Green wax seal with the legend'
....BEATRIC...' (Thornhill, Yk Wheatley Kelder Briestwistle Farnley Tyas
Denby Wadsworth Wydehope Smaleshagh Thorne Risshes Haythby Walcote Heuedland
Daly Hundehill Cazehow Colby, Li Halton, Li Flixborough, Li Thealby,
Li Burton, Li) '
- PRO, Nottinghamshire Archives: Savile of Rufford: Deeds and Estate Papers
[DD/SR/1/1 - DD/SR/12/102], DD/SR/1/25/M10[2]
' Brian de Thornehill ', witness to grant dated Nov 25 1325 :
' Grant by Adam de Everingham, knight, to John de Metheley of Thornhill,
of the Manor of Middelshiteligton, etc.
Witnesses, Dom. John de Eland, John de Flemming, Robert de Bellomonte,
knights, Brian de Thornehill, ---- de Borton. ' - PRO, West Yorkshire
Archive Service, Calderdale: Papers of the Armytage family of Kirklees Hall
[KM/1 - KM/857], Deeds relating to MIDDLESTOWN: KM/39[2]
' Ct Roll of Ct held at Hundeswrth (Hunsworth, Yk) 22 Apr 1326;
Do. of Ct. of Brian de Thornhill at Thurleston (Thurlestone) 25 Apr 1326'
- PRO, Nottinghamshire Archives: Savile of Rufford: Deeds and Estate Papers
[DD/SR/1/1 - DD/SR/12/102], DD/SR/1/6/2[2]
imprisoned in 1327, together with his father-in-law and brother-in-law:
' Gaol delivery at York Castle, Wm son of William of Emley, kt, John his son
and Brian of Thornhill, accused of killing Richard Playce at Dringhouses,
put themselves on the county are found not guilty ' - PRO, Nottinghamshire
Archives: Savile of Rufford: Deeds and Estate Papers [DD/SR/216 - DD/SR/237],
DD/SR/231/52[2]
grant dated Feast of St Gregory,1328 [12 Mar 1328]:
' Grant by Brian de Thornehill to John son of Thomas de Halifax of lands and
tenements (Ovenden and Illingworth, Yorks.) ' - PRO, Nottinghamshire
Archives:
Savile of Rufford: Deeds and Estate Papers, DD/SR/27/1/7d[2]
Grant dated Sund' before day of St Guthlac [9 April 1329]:
' Grant by Brian de Thornehill of half a bovate to Robert le Mortemere '
- PRO, Nottinghamshire Archives: Savile of Rufford: Deeds and Estate Papers,
DD/SR/27/1/7e[2]
grant dated 1331:
' Grant: John son of Mathew de Bosco of Skircoates to Brian of Thornhill
lands etc in Skircoates. ' - PRO, Nottinghamshire Archives: Savile of
Rufford: Deeds and Estate Papers [DD/SR/206 - DD/SR/215], DD/SR/209/202[2]
grant dated 1332:
' Grant of a place by Brian de Thornehill to Henry de Bronneshurst (Ovenden
Brock, Yk) ' - PRO, Nottinghamshire Archives: Savile of Rufford: Deeds and
Estate Papers, DD/SR/27/1/8[2]
grant dated 1336 - 1337:
' Grant: Ralph de Manflete of Tolby and Alice his wife to Brian of Thornhill
knight half part of lands in fields of Walcote.' - PRO, Nottinghamshire
Archives: Savile of Rufford: Deeds and Estate Papers [DD/SR/206 - DD/SR/215],
DD/SR/209/9[2]
grant dated 1342:
' Grant of 2 acres by Brian de Thornehill to William son of John de Ovendene
(Ovenden Wood, Yk) ' - PRO, Nottinghamshire Archives: Savile of Rufford:
Deeds and Estate Papers, DD/SR/27/1/10[2][2]
In 17 Edw. III [1343/44], John de Heton of Mirfield, claiming the wardship
of John, son and heir of John de Quernby, brought a new suit against ' Brian
de Thornhill, Master Thomas de Morton and John de Cromwellbothum, who are the
executors of the will of Brian de Thornhill, parson of Bedale.' [McCall
p. 111, cites De Banco 17th Edw. III, m. 27 and 165 d.[7]]
' Bryan de Thornhill ', witness (together with his brother-in-law John de
Dronsfield) to a release dated 9 March 1343/44 :
' Thomas Flemyngs of Clifton to John Fitzwilliam, of all burdens, dues and
services due in his 3 weekly court for the manor of Wath. For a red rose at
the Nativity of St John the Baptist (24 June).
Witnesses: Bryan de Thornhill, William de Fyncheden, Elis de Bryton, John
de Dranfeld, John de Wodehall de Wath. At Emley, Sunday before St Gregory
(12 March), 1343/4.' [PRO, WWM/D/32[2] ]
' Ct. Roll of Ct. of Brian de Thornhill held at Hundesworth' (Hunsworth, Yk)
30 Jul 1347; Do. of Ct. held at Hundesworth 15 Jan 1348 '
- PRO, Nottinghamshire Archives: Savile of Rufford: Deeds and Estate Papers
[DD/SR/1/1 - DD/SR/12/102], DD/SR/1/6/6[2]
quitclaim dated 21 Edw III [1347-8] :
' Quitclaim by Richard son of Thomas de Popilwell' in favour of Sir Brian de
Thornehill' knight and Lady Joan his wife of his claim to lands and tenements
in the fee of Gomersal' (Gomersall, Yk) which he had previously granted to
Brian and Joan, and also to an annual rent of 12d from lands there.' [ PRO,
Nottinghamshire Archives: Savile of Rufford: Deeds and Estate Papers,
DD/SR/26/61[2]; MichaelAnne Guido, <Re: Savile of Thornhill and Copley: a
Plantagenet descent>[8] ]
' Sir Brian de Thornhill ', executor (together with Sir John FitzWilliam) of
the will of Isabel Deincourt [his mother-in-law] dated 25 July 1348
[ MichaelAnne Guido, cites Baildon & the Baildons by William Paley Baildon,
Chapter Eleven - The Fitzwilliams of Emley and Sprotborough, page 355;
Testamenta Ebor. Vol. 1, No. 50][8]
Grant dated 1349-50:
' Sir Brian of Thornhill to Lord John, rector of Thornhill and Thomas his
brother Greenhall manor, Thornhill with advowson, Langfeld Hall etc. '
- PRO, Nottinghamshire Archives: Savile of Rufford: Deeds and Estate Papers
[DD/SR/206 - DD/SR/215], DD/SR/209/41[2]
witness to a grant dated 13 Jan 1355:
" Grant by John son of John de Eland, knight, to John de Eland, knight, and
Alina his wife, of the manor of Bryghowse, with all appurtenances and
members,
and to their heirs male.
Witnesses, Sir Brian de Thornhill, Sir John Flemyng, knights, Adam de
Hopton, Thomas Lacye, Thomas de ffenton. " - PRO, West Yorkshire Archive
Service, Calderdale: Papers of the Armytage family of Kirklees Hall
[KM/1 - KM/857], Deeds relating to CLIFTON: KM/64[2]
d. after 8 Dec 1365 :
' Brian de Thornhill, Knight ', witness :
' Grant by Edmund de Dronsfeld to Adam de Methlay of Thornhill, of the Manor
of Brertwysill.
Witnesses, Brian de Thornhill, Knight, John de Dronsfeld, John de Amyas,
John Denay, Robert de Neusum, Hugh Masun, Richard de Bynglay, and others.
With seal. ' - PRO, West Yorkshire Archive Service, Calderdale: Papers of
the Armytage family of Kirklees Hall [KM/1 - KM/857], Deeds relating to
BRIESTFIELD: KM/71[2]
' Grant by Brian Thornyll, knight, to John Haldworth and the heirs male of
his body of a messuage and land in Haldworth hamlet in Ovenden, and a close
called le Hayne, reserving rents of 5s. to himself and 3s. to Sir Edmund de
Langlay. 20 July 1372.' - PRO, West Yorkshire Archive Service, Yorkshire
Archaeological Society: Clarke Thornhill of Fixby Collection, DD12/II/3/10[2]
Spouse: Joan FitzWilliam
Father: Sir William FitzWilliam, knt., of Emley and Sprotborough(->1338)
Mother: [probable] Isabel Deincourt (->1348)
Marr: 1334[9]
Children: Simon
Elizabeth
Joan
Margaret
John
1.1.2.1.1.1.1.1 Simon de Thornhill
----------------------------------------
of Thornhill and Hunsworth, co. Yorks.
' Sir Simon Thornhill, of Thornhill, died 43 Ed. 3, at which date he held of
the lord in Stansfeld, Skircoat, Ovenden, and Wadsworth certain
tenement and lands in soccage. = Mary, or Elizabeth, daughter and
co-heiress of Edward Babthorpe, of Babthorpe. ' [pedigree of Thornhill, of
Fixby and Riddlesworth: Foster's Yorkshire Pedigrees[3]]
succeeded his father in 1371 or before:
grant dated 1371:
' Grant: John de Crousfeld of West Bretton to Simon of Thornhill manor
of Hundesworth, Thornhill, Reswike and Langfeldhall. Hunsworth.' - PRO,
Nottinghamshire Archives: Savile of Rufford: Deeds and Estate Papers
[DD/SR/206 - DD/SR/215], DD/SR/209/3[2]
grant dated 1369:
' Grant: John of Stansfield, John of Wortley, Richard Brande clerk and
Richard of Catcham clerk to Elizabeth wife of Simon son of Brian of Thornhill
knight, manor of Hunsworth.' - PRO, Nottinghamshire Archives: Savile of
Rufford: Deeds and Estate Papers [DD/SR/206 - DD/SR/215], DD/SR/209/5[2]
Grant dated 1369 :
' Simion of Thornhill to William de Connall lands in Skircoates ' - PRO,
Nottinghamshire Archives: Savile of Rufford: Deeds and Estate Papers
[DD/SR/206 - DD/SR/215], DD/SR/209/204[2]
Spouse: Elizabeth
Children: Elizabeth (->1414)
William
1.1.2.1.1.1.1.1.1 Elizabeth Thornhill
----------------------------------------
Death: aft 1414[2]
heiress of her father
' Elizabeth, daughter and heiress, married to Henry Savile, Esq., of
Thornhill.'
[pedigree of Thornhill, of Fixby and Riddlesworth: Foster's Yorkshire
Pedigrees[3]]
appointment of attorneys dated 14 Rich II [1390-91]:
' Appointment by Henry Sayvill' de Thornhill' and Elizabeth his wife of
Thomas Burdon' de Halton' and Richard de Colby as their attorneys for livery
of seisin in their manor of Colby and all their lands etc in Halton',
Burton',
Flekysburgh, Haytheby, Theleby, Walcoytes, Frisby and elsewhere in the county
of Lincoln to William de Thornhill' son of Simon de Thornhill (Halton, Li
Coleby, Li Flixborough, Li Haytheby, Li Thealby, Li Walcot, Li Firsby, Li)'
- PRO, Nottinghamshire Archives: Savile of Rufford: Deeds and Estate Papers
[DD/SR/13 - DD/SR/205], DD/SR/28/3/4 [2]
Grant dated 14 Rich II [1390-91]:
' Grant by Henry Sayvill' de Thornhill' and Elizabeth his wife to William de
Thornhill' son of Simon de Thornhill' of their manor of Colby etc and of all
their other lands etc presently held in Halton, Burton, Flekysburgh',
Haytheby, Theleby, Walcoytes, and Frisby, and else-where in the county of
Lincoln (Coleby, Li Halton, Li Burton, Li Flyxborough, Li Haytheby, Li
Thellby, Li Walcot, Li Firsby, Li) ' PRO, Nottinghamshire Archives: Savile
of Rufford: Deeds and Estate Papers [DD/SR/13 - DD/SR/205], DD/SR/28/1/35 [2]
Grant dated 13 Hen IV [1411-12]:
' Demise of a messuage etc by Elizabeth widow of Henry Savill to Richard de
Ovendeynwod' - PRO, Nottinghamshire Archives: Savile of Rufford: Deeds and
Estate Papers [DD/SR/13 - DD/SR/205], DD/SR/27/1/18[2]
d. after grant dated 2 Hen V [1414-1415]
' Grant by Elizabeth Sayvyll' mistress of Thornhill to William de Thornyll'
rector of the church of Thornhill and Richard de Staynton' chaplain of all
his messuages etc in Rydylsdeyn', Okeworth', Morton', and Haneworth' and
also of all that part of the lordship (dominium) which she has in them
(Riddlesden, Yk Oakworth, Yk Morton, Yk Hainworth, Yk) ' - PRO,
Nottinghamshire Archives: Savile of Rufford: Deeds and Estate Papers
[DD/SR/13 - DD/SR/205], DD/SR/28/1/36[2]
Spouse: Henry Savile of Eland
Death: bef 1413[2]
Father: Sir John Savile (-<1399)
Mother: Isabel Eland
Children: Thomas Savile of Thornhill(-<1450)
Henry Savile of Copley(->1437)
The...@aol.com
Hello All,
Following is Part 2 of the detailed pedigree, including sources.
Cheers,
John
__________________________________________
1.1.2.1.1.1.1.2 Elizabeth de Thornhill
----------------------------------------
' Elizabeth Thornhill, married to Henry Musters, Esq., of Kirklington.'
[pedigree of Thornhill, of Fixby and Riddlesworth: Foster's Yorkshire
Pedigrees[3]]
' daughter Elizabeth married Sir Henry Musters of Kirklington '
[McCall p.111[7]]
Spouse: Sir Henry Musters
1.1.2.1.1.1.1.3 Joan de Thornhill
----------------------------------------
1.1.2.1.1.1.1.4 Margaret de Thornhill
----------------------------------------
record of marriage settlement dated 1357-58:
' Chirograph: Marriage settlement - Henry de Nuhill clerk to Brian of
Thornhill
on marriage of Gerald son of Gerard de Ufflet and Margaret daughter of Brian,
lands etc in Swanland and Ufflet. ' - PRO, Nottinghamshire Archives: Savile
of Rufford: Deeds and Estate Papers [DD/SR/206 - DD/SR/215], DD/SR/209/124[2]
Spouse: Gerald de Ufflet
1.1.2.1.1.1.1.5 John de Thornhill
----------------------------------------
clerk
' Letter of Attorney, Isabelle widow of William FitzWilliam kt, to Hugh of
Elmessale to give seisin to John, son of Brian of Thornhill, clerk, of the
hospital of St Edmund's Chapel Doncaster. Anglo-Norman, seal missing ' - PRO,
Nottinghamshire Archives: Savile of Rufford: Deeds and Estate Papers
[DD/SR/216 - DD/SR/237], DD/SR/231/53[2]
1.1.2.1.1.1.2 Thomas de Thornhill
----------------------------------------
of Sandeholme in Horbury, co. Yorks.
' Thomas Thornhill, living 1374 = Margaret, daughter of ... Lacy, of
Cromwellbotham.' [pedigree of Thornhill, of Fixby and Riddlesworth: Foster's
Yorkshire Pedigrees[3]]
' Grant by Robert, son of Thomas de Wythley, to Thomas de Thornehille,
Margaret, his wife, and Richard, their son, of meadow in le Meres,
Sehytelyngton, and land in the field called Baddeswrth. Friday after St.
Lucy, c1324.' - PRO, West Yorkshire Archive Service, Yorkshire Archaeological
Society: Clarke Thornhill of Fixby Collection, DD12/II/3/10[2]
Bond dated 12 May 1325:
' Of John Cler' of Astay to Thomas de Thornhill and Margaret his wife in 7
mks.'
[ Publication Note: Yorkshire Archaeological Society Yorkshire Deeds Vol iii
no 53 ] - PRO, West Yorkshire Archive Service, Yorkshire Archaeological
Society: Clarke Thornhill of Fixby Collection, DD12/II/1/17(h)[2]
Gift dated Cromwell Botham, Tuesday after All Saints, 1334 :
' Gift by Thomas de Thornhill and Margaret de Lasci to Richard, their son, of
all their goods and chattels in Yorkshire.' - PRO, West Yorkshire Archive
Service, Yorkshire Archaeological Society: Clarke Thornhill of Fixby
Collection, DD12/II/3/10[2]
grant by Henry de Sothill dated Sunday before Michaelmas, 1334 :
' Grant by Henry son of Sir John de Sothill, knight, to Thomas de Thornhill
and Margaret his wife, of land in Ovenden, viz. 12a land at Brouneshirste
and 2a meadow at Mixenden.
Witnesses, Richard de Crumwelbotham, Henry de Crumwelbothum, Matthew de
Bosco, Richard del Den and others. ' - PRO, West Yorkshire Archive Service,
Yorkshire Archaeological Society: Clarke Thornhill of Fixby Collection,
Clarke
Thornhill Papers: Miscellanea, DD12/II/30/37[2]
' Thomas de Thornhill', witness (together with John de Eland) to grant by
Sir John le Fleming of Wath, dated c1327-c1352 - PRO, West Yorkshire
Archive Service, Calderdale: Papers of the Armytage family of Kirklees Hall
[KM/1 - KM/857], KM/24[2]
Chirograph dated 1339 :
' Grant: Richard son of Peter of Thornhill to Thomas son of Lord John of
Thornhill knight messuage in Thornhill leghes.' - PRO, Nottinghamshire
Archives: Savile of Rufford: Deeds and Estate Papers [DD/SR/206 - DD/SR/215],
DD/SR/209/36[2]
record of grant dated 1343:
' Grant: William son of John de Fery of Wakefeld to Thomas son of Lord John
of Thornhill kt piece of land called Sandeholme in Horbury '
- PRO, Nottinghamshire Archives: Savile of Rufford: Deeds and Estate Papers
[DD/SR/1/1 - DD/SR/12/102], DD/SR/A11/32[2]
grant dated c. 1334-1412:
' Grant by Henry son of Sir John de Sothill, knight, to Thomas de Thornhill
and Margaret his wife, of land in Ovenden, viz. 12a land at Brouneshirste
and 2a meadow at Mixenden. Witnesses, Richard de Crumwelbotham, Henry de
Crumwelbothum, Matthew de Bosco, Richard del Den and others.' - PRO, Clarke
Thornhill of Fixby Collection, DD12/II/30/37[2]
Grant dated 1349-50:
' Sir Brian of Thornhill to Lord John, rector of Thornhill and Thomas his
brother Greenhall manor, Thornhill with advowson, Langfeld Hall etc. '
- PRO, Nottinghamshire Archives: Savile of Rufford: Deeds and Estate Papers
[DD/SR/206 - DD/SR/215], DD/SR/209/41[2]
Spouse: Margaret de Lacy
Father: John de Lacy of Cromwellbotham, co. Yorks.(->1304)
Mother: Margaret de Eland
Children: Richard (-<1406)
1.1.2.1.1.1.2.1 Richard de Thornhill
----------------------------------------
Death: bef 10 Jan 1406[2]
of Fixby and Toothill, co. Yorks. [de jure uxoris]
' Richard Thornhill, of Fixby and Toothill, j. u. = Margaret ' [pedigree
of Thornhill, of Fixby and Riddlesworth: Foster's Yorkshire Pedigrees[3]]
Gift dated Cromwell Botham, Tuesday after All Saints, 1334 :
' Gift by Thomas de Thornhill and Margaret de Lasci to Richard, their son,
of all their goods and chattels in Yorkshire.' - PRO, West Yorkshire Archive
Service, Yorkshire Archaeological Society: Clarke Thornhill of Fixby
Collection, DD12/II/3/10[2]
Commission by King Henry [IV], dated 10 Jan 1407:
' To William Gascoigne and Thomas Tildesley to take an assize of mort
d'auncester which Margaret late the wife of Richard de Thornhill has
arraigned against Robert Dyconson, Mathewson (i.e. son of Matthew Dyconson),
concerning 16 acres of land in Ovendene. ' [Publication Note: Yorkshire
Archaeological Society Yorkshire Deeds Vol iii ] - PRO, West Yorkshire
Archive Service, Yorkshire Archaeological Society: Clarke Thornhill of
Fixby Collection, DD12/II/1/18(a)[2]
Spouse: Margaret de Toothill
Birth: aft 1325[2]
Father: William de Toothill of Toothill and Fixby(-<1339)
Mother: Sibyl
Children: William (-1443)
John
Robert
1.1.2.1.1.1.2.1.1 William Thornhill
----------------------------------------
Death: 1443[3]
of Fixby and Toothill, co. Yorks.
' William Thornhill, of Fixby and Toothill, married 1392,
died 1443. = Barbara, daughter of Richard Hopton,
of Swillington, Esq. ' [pedigree of Thornhill, of Fixby and
Riddlesworth: Foster's Yorkshire Pedigrees[3]]
Receipt of Deed dated Sunday after Michaelmas, 1404 :
' Of Richard de Altham, proctor of the dean and college of St. Stephen's
Westminster, to William Thornhill of Fixby for 50s. for the tithes of
Hyperom, Rastryk, Bryghous, Fekesby and Skamenden for a year. ' - PRO, West
Yorkshire Archive Service, Yorkshire Archaeological Society: Clarke Thornhill
of Fixby Collection, DD12/II/4/18/1[2]
Grant dated 8 August 1438 :
' By William Thornhyll, esquire, to his son Robert in tail of the messuage
called Lyghtrydge with its appurtenances in Fekesby with successive
remainders
in tail to Robert's brothers Richard, John and Laurence and reversion to the
grantor's right heirs.' [ Publication Note: Yorkshire Archaeological Society
Yorkshire Deeds Vol. iii no. 117 ] - PRO, West Yorkshire Archive Service,
Yorkshire Archaeological Society: Clarke Thornhill of Fixby Collection,
DD12/II/3/9/13[2]
Spouse: Barbara Hopton
Marr: 1392[3]
Children: Brian (-1484)
Robert
Richard
John
Laurence
Isabel
Joan
1.1.2.1.1.1.2.1.1.1 Brian Thornhill
----------------------------------------
Death: Mar 1484[3]
Esq., of Fixby and Toothill, co .Yorks.
' Bryan Thornhill, of Fixby and Toothill, Esq., married (? when 15 years
old), 1408, appointed a supervisor under the will of Sir Richard Copley,
of Batley, pr. 28 September, 1434, and died March, 1484. = Jennet '
[pedigree of Thornhill, of Fixby and Riddlesworth: Foster's Yorkshire
Pedigrees[3]]
Spouse: Jennet Calton
Marr: 1408[3]
Children: John (-<1484) [ancestor of THORNHILL of FIXBY]
Diones
1.1.2.1.1.1.2.1.1.2 Robert Thornhill
----------------------------------------
of Lightridge in Fixby, co. Yorks.
Grant dated 8 August 1438 :
' By William Thornhyll, esquire, to his son Robert in tail of the messuage
called Lyghtrydge with its appurtenances in Fekesby with successive
remainders
in tail to Robert's brothers Richard, John and Laurence and reversion to
the grantor's right heirs.' [ Publication Note: Yorkshire Archaeological
Society Yorkshire Deeds Vol. iii no. 117 ] - PRO, West Yorkshire Archive
Service, Yorkshire Archaeological Society: Clarke Thornhill of Fixby
Collection, DD12/II/3/9/13[2]
1.1.2.1.1.1.2.1.1.3 Richard Thornhill
----------------------------------------
named in grant by his father, dated 8 August 1438 [PRO, West Yorkshire Archive
Service, Yorkshire Archaeological Society: Clarke Thornhill of Fixby
Collection, DD12/II/3/9/13[2] ]
1.1.2.1.1.1.2.1.1.4 John Thornhill
----------------------------------------
named in grant by his father, dated 8 August 1438 [PRO, West Yorkshire Archive
Service, Yorkshire Archaeological Society: Clarke Thornhill of Fixby
Collection, DD12/II/3/9/13[2] ]
1.1.2.1.1.1.2.1.1.5 Laurence Thornhill
----------------------------------------
named in grant by his father, dated 8 August 1438 [PRO, West Yorkshire Archive
Service, Yorkshire Archaeological Society: Clarke Thornhill of Fixby
Collection, DD12/II/3/9/13[2] ]
1.1.2.1.1.1.2.1.1.6 Isabel Thornhill
----------------------------------------
1.1.2.1.1.1.2.1.1.7 Joan Thornhill
----------------------------------------
1.1.2.1.1.1.2.1.2 John de Thornhill
----------------------------------------
rector of Thornhill
Grant dated 1 July 1393:
' By John de Thornhill, parson of the church of Thornhill, and John de
Wath, vicar of the church of Hudersfeld [Huddersfield, co. York], to Brian
de Stapilton, 'chivaler', of the reversion of the manor of Qwernby and lands
and tenements in Lynlay and Wodhous. The said premises were those of William
de Quernby and are held by Hugh de Aneslay and Joan his wife for the life of
Joan. ' [ Publication Note: Yorkshire Archaeological Society Yorkshire Deeds
Vol. iii no 266 ] - PRO, West Yorkshire Archive Service, Yorkshire
Archaeological Society: Clarke Thornhill of Fixby Collection, DD12/II/1/1[2]
1.1.2.1.1.1.2.1.3 Robert de Thornhill
----------------------------------------
1.1.2.1.1.1.3 Agnes de Thornhill
----------------------------------------
Death: aft 1355[4]
" Agnes widow of John de Dronfeld", party to feoffment of 25 May 1348 - PRO,
West Yorkshire Archive Service, Bradford: Spencer-Stanhope Manuscripts
[SpSt/1 - SpSt/4], SpSt/4/11/9/21[2]
Spouse: John de Dronsfield
Death: bef 25 May 1348[2],[4]
Father: Thomas de Dransfield (-<1316)
Children: John de Dronsfield(->1369) [ancestor of DRONSFIELD]
1.1.2.1.1.1.4 John de Thornhill
----------------------------------------
Death: aft 1349[2]
parson of Thornhill
' John Thornhill, rector of Thornhill, 1354. ' [pedigree of Thornhill, of
Fixby and Riddlesworth: Foster's Yorkshire Pedigrees[3]]
Grant dated 1349-50:
' Sir Brian of Thornhill to Lord John, rector of Thornhill and Thomas his
brother Greenhall manor, Thornhill with advowson, Langfeld Hall etc. '
- PRO, Nottinghamshire Archives: Savile of Rufford: Deeds and Estate Papers
[DD/SR/206 - DD/SR/215], DD/SR/209/41[2]
' DD/SR/A11/31 - date: 23 Edw III [1349-50]
' Chirograph. Grant John of Thornhill, parson of Thornhill & Thomas his
brother to Lord Brian of Thornhill kt manor of Thornhill, Yorks., called
Grenehall '[2]
1.1.2.1.1.2 Henry de Thornhill
----------------------------------------
clerk
record of grant (undated):
' Grant: William son of John of Witteley to Henry son of Richard of Thornhill
clerk, lands on Thornhill called Mikkelroade and Rikaedrode 17 acres at 1d
p.a. ' - PRO, Nottinghamshire Archives: Savile of Rufford: Deeds and Estate
Papers [DD/SR/206 - DD/SR/215], DD/SR/209/123[2]
1.1.2.1.1.3 Brian de Thornhill
----------------------------------------
rector of Bedale, co. Yorks.
record of appointment dated 2 May 1316:
' Appointment by Brian de Thornhill', rector of the church of Bedal', for
the term of his life, of John de Langley to take seisin of all messuages,
lands, rents, meadows, tenements, and of all neifs, chattels and belongings,
and of all services of free men, lordships and services with all profits and
appurtenances in Ridellesdene granted him by Sarah widow of Thomas de Eltoft
(Riddlesden, Yk) ' - PRO, DD/SR/1/25/M12[2]
1.1.2.1.1.4 Peter de Thornhill
----------------------------------------
of Thornhill Lees, co. Yorks.
record of grant, undated [est. c 1300] :
' Grant for 20 marks sterling by William the Chaplain ('Capellanus') son of
Adam de Leys to Peter son of Sir Ric de Thornhill of all the lands tenements
etc which he once held of the said Sir Ric within the bounds of Thornhilleys;
the grantee tendering yearly to Sir Richard 6s 6d of silver and a half penny
of silver 'for the fine of the wapentake', for all secular (save forinsec)
services etc ' - PRO, DD/SR/36/12 [2]
Children: Richard (->1338)
1.1.2.1.1.4.1 Richard de Thornhill
----------------------------------------
Death: aft 1338[2]
of Thornhill Lees, co. Yorks.
Chirograph dated 1339 :
' Grant: Richard son of Peter of Thornhill to Thomas son of Lord John of
Thornhill knight messuage in Thornhill leghes.' - PRO, Nottinghamshire
Archives: Savile of Rufford: Deeds and Estate Papers [DD/SR/206 - DD/SR/215],
DD/SR/209/36[2]
1.1.2.1.2 Sarah de Thornhill[4]
----------------------------------------
Spouse: Sir Richard de Tankersley[4]
Father: Sir Henry de Tankersley
Children: Johanna, m. Sir Hugh de Eland
Alice, m. Richard le Tyes
1. Sir Charles Clay, ed., "Early Yorkshire Families," The Yorkshire
Archaeological Society, Record Series), 1973, Vol. CXXXV.
2. "Public Record Office Archives," http://www.a2a.pro.gov.uk/
3. "Pedigrees of the County Families of Yorkshire," compiled by Joseph Foster,
W. Wilfred Head, London, 1874.
4. "The Visitation of Yorkshire," Harleian Soc., William Flower, Esquire,
Norroy King of Arms, Harleian Series, Vol. 16, Mitchell and Hughes,
Printers, London, 1881
5. Paul C. Reed, "De La Mare," Feb 24, 1999, GEN-MED...@rootsweb.com
6. "Court Rolls of The Manor of Wakefield, 1274-1297,"
http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/source/1274wakefield-courtrolls.html
Medieval Sourcebook:, Paul Halsall email hal...@fordham.edu, also
given at http://members.tripod.com/~midgley/wakeroll.html
7. H. B. McCall, "The Early History of Bedale : in the North Riding of
Yorkshire," London: E. Stock, 1907.
8. MichaelAnne Guido, "Re: Savile of Thornhill and Copley: a Plantagenet
descent," 7 September 2004, email Claud...@aol.com, cites PRO
extracts; Baildon & the Baildons by William Paley Baildon, Chapter
Eleven - The Fitzwilliams, p. 355, Thoroton, Antiquities of
Nottinghamshire,
Vol. III, page 135; and other sources.
9. Brice Clagett, "Sothill chronology," 17 Oct 2001, email
bcla...@cov.com, cites Watney's "The Wallop Family" 2:333.
Louise Staley
Many thanks for posting these. 2 Questions & one comment interspersed.
> On Mon, 20 Sep 2004 13:52:54 +0000 (UTC), <The...@aol.com> wrote:
>
> Monday, 20 September, 2004
>
>
<snip>
>
> 1. Essulf of Birkin, Shitlington and Tong, co. Yorks.
> 1. Peter fitz Asolf(-<1143) [ancestor of BIRKIN of Birkin]
> 2. Richard de Tong [ancestor of TONG]
> 3. Jordan fitz Essulf, of Thornhill and Hunsworth, co. Yorks.
> 1. Richard de Thornhill
> 2. Jordan de Thornhill
> 1. Sir John de Thornhill, d. bef 1260
> + Olivia de la Mare
> 1. Sir Richard de Thornhill, d. 1287
> + Maud de Fixby
> 1. Sir John de Thornhill, d. bef 9 July 1322
> + Beatrice Talboner
> 1. Sir Brian de Thornhill, d. aft 20 July 1372
> + Joan FitzWilliam
> 1. Simon de Thornhill, d. aft 1369
> + Elizabeth [ de Babthorpe ?]
> 1. Elizabeth de Thornhill, heiress
> + Sir John de Savile
* * * Elizabeth married Sir HENRY SAVILE as per your later messages &
sources * *
> 1. Thomas Savile of Thornhill
> 2. Henry Savile of Copley
> 2. William de Thornhill, d.s.p.
> 2. Elizabeth de Thornhill
> + Sir Henry Musters of Kirklington
* * * Aren't these the parents of Elizabeth Musters who married Alexander
Mowbray?
* * * Sorry, but who do you think the parents of Joan, Margaret & John
below are?
> 3. Joan de Thornhill
> 4. Margaret de Thornhill
> + Gerald [or Gerard] de Ufflet
> 5. John de Thornhill, clerk
> 2. Thomas de Thornhill, of Sandeholme in Horbury
> + Margaret de Lacy
<snip>
regards
Louise
--
Quod dixi dixi
David Mowbray
>Dear John,
>
>Many thanks for posting these. 2 Questions & one comment interspersed.
>
>> On Mon, 20 Sep 2004 13:52:54 +0000 (UTC), <The...@aol.com> wrote:
>>
>> Monday, 20 September, 2004
>>
>>
><snip>
>>
>> 2. Elizabeth de Thornhill
>> + Sir Henry Musters of Kirklington
>* * * Aren't these the parents of Elizabeth Musters who married Alexander
>Mowbray?
Hi Louise,
This Alexander Mowbray is unknown to me and I just wonder if you can
place him by date and location and perhaps by parentage?
David ( with an obvious interest!)
--
David Mowbray |Mowbray One-Name Study (GOONS 986) |
Cheltenham, UK |Also need HERBERT(GLS)+ TANK(STS) |
web: http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/mowbrayfh
Louise Staley
>
> Our valued member Louise Staley <car...@bigpond.com> writes
>>> 2. Elizabeth de Thornhill
>>> + Sir Henry Musters of Kirklington
>> * * * Aren't these the parents of Elizabeth Musters who married
>> Alexander Mowbray?
> <Snip>
>
> Hi Louise,
> This Alexander Mowbray is unknown to me and I just wonder if you can
> place him by date and location and perhaps by parentage?
>
> David ( with an obvious interest!)
Dear David,
I am sorry I don't know much about these Mowbrays either but I think they
are the Kirklington ones.
The source for Alexander marrying Eilzabeth Musters is Foster's Yorkshire
Pedigrees, so not reliable. However I see there is an article: Moriarty,
George Andrews. "Mowbray of Kirklington." NEHGR 120 (July 1966):170-74
which I haven't seen that may be helpful here.
Henry Sutliff posted on this 7 Feb 2000 and relayed the relevant part of
the Moriarty article. (BTW I think you also posted in that thread)
"Please see NEHGR, vol. 120 (July 1966) for article "Mowbray of
Kirklington" by
G. Andrews Moriarty , pp. 170-3.
Alexander was the son of John de Mowbray of Kirklington and Margaret,
sister of
Sir Alexander de Percy of Ormesby. Elizabeth Mowbray was mother of William
Gascoigne's son and heir William, but it was William's first wife Joan de
Pickering who was mother of Agnes, wife of Robert Constable of Flamborough,
Yorks."
The parents of Alexander are often seen as John Mowbray and Margaret Percy
(daughter of William Percy Lord of Kildale) but I haven't got a source for
this and I don't know if these were the parents of Sir Alexander Percy of
Ormesby, reputed brother of Margaret.
If you do have the Kirklington Mowbray line I would appreciate you posting
it.
Gordon Kirkemo
Perhaps I can be of some help as I have the line from the Moriarty article
as follows:
1. Elizabeth de Mowbray (d. 1396) m. (1386) William Gascoigne
2. Alexander de Mowbray of Kirklington, York d. 1368/69
3. Elizabeth Musters
4. John de Mowbray d. c1373
5. Margaret de Percy (sister of Alexander de Percy of Ormsby)
6. Henry Musters
8. William de Mowbray d. c1320 m. bef 1312
9. Agnes Depden
16. William de Mowbray d.1293 (murdered by Nicholas Meinill)
17. Elena ______ d.1293
18. John de Depden
19. Elizabeth Waleys
32. William de Mowbray d. c1290
38. Stephen Waleys
64. Walter de Mowbray d. bef 1252
128. William de Mowbray d. bef 1234
129. Osanna de Tanton d. aft 1234
The source of the article is the NEHGS Register Vol.120, pages 170-174.
I hope this is helpful.
Sincerely,
Gordon Kirkemo
Louise Staley
Thanks for this. If we add in John's original Fitzwilliam line and the
Deincourt line from the supposed identification of Joan Fitzwilliam as a
daughter of Isabel Deincourt then a few more numbers can be filled in for
Elizabeth Mowbray's ancestry.
> On Wed, 22 Sep 2004, Gordon Kirkemo <kir...@comcast.net> wrote:
>
> Louise and David,
>
> Perhaps I can be of some help as I have the line from the Moriarty
> article
> as follows:
>
Generation 1
> 1. Elizabeth de Mowbray (d. 1396) m. (1386) William Gascoigne
Generation 2
> 2. Alexander de Mowbray of Kirklington, York d. 1368/69
> 3. Elizabeth Musters
Generation 3
> 4. John de Mowbray d. c1373
> 5. Margaret de Percy (sister of Alexander de Percy of Ormsby)
> 6. Henry Musters
7. Elizabeth Thornhill
Generation 4
> 8. William de Mowbray d. c1320 m. bef 1312
> 9. Agnes Depden
10. William Percy, Lord of Kildale
14. Sir Brian Thornhill, Lord of Thornhill (d. aft. 20 Jul 1372)
15. Joan Fitzwilliam
Generation 5
> 16. William de Mowbray d.1293 (murdered by Nicholas Meinill)
> 17. Elena ______ d.1293
> 18. John de Depden
> 19. Elizabeth Waleys
28. Sir John Thornhill (d. bef. 9 Jul 1322)
29. Beatrix Talboner
30. Sir William Fitzwilliam of Sprotborough & Emley (d. aft. 4 Mar 1338)
31. Isabel Deincourt (d. aft. 25 Jul 1348)
Generation 6
> 32. William de Mowbray d. c1290
> 38. Stephen Waleys
56. Sir Richard Thornhill (d. 1287)
57. Maud Fixby
60. Sir William Fitzwilliam of Sprotborough (d. aft. 1280 v.p.)
61. Agnes Methan
62. Sir Edmund Deincourt, 1st baron Deincourt (d. 6 Jan 1327)
63. Isabel Mohun
<snip>
Gordon Kirkemo
And thanks to you and especially to John. In keeping with the momentum you
both started, let me add a little more to our list. I have a few additional
Percys thanks to GeeGee Hughes and Robert O'Connor (from the archives). I
can add some additional names below:
Dear Gordon,
20. William de Percy d. c1294, Lord of Kildale
21. Nichola _____
28. Sir John Thornhill (d. bef. 9 Jul 1322)
29. Beatrix Talboner
30. Sir William Fitzwilliam of Sprotborough & Emley (d. aft. 4 Mar 1338)
31. Isabel Deincourt (d. aft. 25 Jul 1348)
Generation 6
> 32. William de Mowbray d. c1290
> 38. Stephen Waleys
40. Walter de Percy, Lord of Kildale
56. Sir Richard Thornhill (d. 1287)
57. Maud Fixby
60. Sir William Fitzwilliam of Sprotborough (d. aft. 1280 v.p.)
61. Agnes Methan
62. Sir Edmund Deincourt, 1st baron Deincourt (d. 6 Jan 1327)
63. Isabel Mohun
Generation 7
80. William de Percy d. 1204, Lord of Kildale
81. Agnes de Flamville d. aft 1204
<snip>
<Louise
<--
<Quod dixi dixi
Perhaps others will benefit from the additions.
Sincerely,
Gordon