BIGOD - de ALBINI BRITO - d'AUBIGNY
Peter Bales
and if so how?
I have a Alice de TODENI = Roger BIGOD, whose child Cecily = William I de
ALBINI BRITO.
My prime question is, is the lasts son, William the II, William ALBINI BRITO
or William deAUBIGNY?
And secondly who did he marry.
Any help and info most welcome
Peter
Syd AUST
Richard Borthwick
of the Toulouse and Carcassonne families is a mess - look at Stasser may
indicate why I say this (also see previous discussions on these families in
the GEN-MED archives).
‘N #’ indicates that N’s paternal affiliation is not certain but is
probable. ‘N $’ has a similar meaning for the maternal affiliation. ‘?’
indicates that the following ascription is dubious or contentious. I
suspect I should have wielded these indicators more frequently at some
spots in this ancestor list.
1 William (II) d' AUBIGNY, of Belvoir. Died 1168.
[I J Sanders *English Baronies: A Study of their Origin and Descent*
(Clarendon Press: Oxford, 1963 [1960]) 12]
He married Maud de CLARE, dau. of Robert fitz Richard, of Little Dunmow,
Essex and Matilda de ST-LIZ.
[I J Sanders *English Baronies: A Study of their Origin and Descent*
(Clarendon Press: Oxford, 1963 [1960]) 12 note 4]
2 William (I) Brito d' AUBIGNY, of Belvoir. Died 1133/1155.
[I J Sanders *English Baronies: A Study of their Origin and Descent*
(Clarendon Press: Oxford, 1963 [1960]) 12; J S Moore "Prosopographical
Problems of English libri vitae" in K S B Keats-Rohan (ed) *Family Trees
and the Roots of Politics: The prosopography of Britain and France from the
tenth to the twelfth century* (The Boydell Press: Woodbridge, 1997) 175,
179; K S B Keats-Rohan *Domesday People: A Prosopography of Persons
occurring in English Documents, 1066-1166* (The Boydell Press: Woodbridge,
1999) I:380]
3 Cecily LE BIGOD. Died After 1164. Heir of her mother in Belvoir.
Cecily was alive when her son granted the church of Redmile, Leics to
Belvoir Priory in about 1165.
[I J Sanders *English Baronies: A Study of their Origin and Descent*
(Clarendon Press: Oxford, 1963 [1960]) 12; J S Moore "Prosopographical
Problems of English libri vitae" in K S B Keats-Rohan (ed) *Family Trees
and the Roots of Politics: The prosopography of Britain and France from the
tenth to the twelfth century* (The Boydell Press: Woodbridge, 1997) 175; K
S B Keats-Rohan *Domesday People: A Prosopography of Persons occurring in
English Documents, 1066-1166* (The Boydell Press: Woodbridge, 1999) I:380;
A Wareham "The Motives and Politics of the Bigod Family c.1066-1177" in
*Anglo-Norman Studies* (The Boydell Press: Woodbridge, 1995) XVII:230]
4 Main d' AUBIGNY, L of Saint-Aubin , d'Aubigne.
[J S Moore "Prosopographical Problems of English libri vitae" in K S B
Keats-Rohan (ed) *Family Trees and the Roots of Politics: The prosopography
of Britain and France from the tenth to the twelfth century* (The Boydell
Press: Woodbridge, 1997) 179]
5 Adeleisa de BOHUN.
[J S Moore "Prosopographical Problems of English libri vitae" in K S B
Keats-Rohan (ed) *Family Trees and the Roots of Politics: The prosopography
of Britain and France from the tenth to the twelfth century* (The Boydell
Press: Woodbridge, 1997) 179]
6 Roger (I) LE BIGOD, of Framlingham. Died Sep 1107 in Earsham, England.
Buried in Norwich, Norfolk, England. Held Framlingham, Suffolk, at the
Domesday Survey.
[I J Sanders *English Baronies: A Study of their Origin and Descent*
(Clarendon Press: Oxford, 1963 [1960]) 12; K S B Keats-Rohan *Domesday
People: A Prosopography of Persons occurring in English Documents,
1066-1166* (The Boydell Press: Woodbridge, 1999) I:396-398; A Wareham "The
Motives and Politics of the Bigod Family c.1066-1177" in *Anglo-Norman
Studies* (The Boydell Press: Woodbridge, 1995) XVII:223-229]
7 Adelisa de TOSNY. Died After 1136. Occupation Sister & coheir of William
de Tosny of Belvoir.
Keats-Rohan has argued successfully that Adelisa was the mother of all
Roger's childen. Wareham points out that Henry I's handling of the Bigod
inheritance points to the children being in minority at their father's death.
[I J Sanders *English Baronies: A Study of their Origin and Descent*
(Clarendon Press: Oxford, 1963 [1960]) 12; K S B Keats-Rohan *Domesday
People: A Prosopography of Persons occurring in English Documents,
1066-1166* (The Boydell Press: Woodbridge, 1999) I:380, 396; A Wareham "The
Motives and Politics of the Bigod Family c.1066-1177" in *Anglo-Norman
Studies* (The Boydell Press: Woodbridge, 1995) XVII:231]
10 Humphrey de BOHUN, L of Bohon, Norm. & Tataford, Norf. Died 1080/1093.
[K S B Keats-Rohan *Domesday People: A Prosopography of Persons occurring
in English Documents, 1066-1166* (The Boydell Press: Woodbridge, 1999)
I:272-273]
14 Robert #$ de TOSNY, of Belvoir. Died About 1093. Held Belvoir, Leics,
at the Domesday Survey.
Robert was related to the Tosnys of Flamstead but it is not known for
certain what this relationship was. It is highly likely that he was the son
of the Roger who married Stephanie of Barcelona as he had a brother and a
son both named 'Berengar'.
[I J Sanders *English Baronies: A Study of their Origin and Descent*
(Clarendon Press: Oxford, 1963 [1960]) 12; K S B Keats-Rohan *Domesday
People: A Prosopography of Persons occurring in English Documents,
1066-1166* (The Boydell Press: Woodbridge, 1999) I:164, 380-381]
15 Adelais.
[K S B Keats-Rohan *Domesday People: A Prosopography of Persons occurring
in English Documents, 1066-1166* (The Boydell Press: Woodbridge, 1999) I:380]
20 Richard de MERI. Died Before 1068.
[J Le Melletier *Les Seigneurs de Bohon* (Coutances: Arnaud-Bellee,
1978) UNSIGHTED]
21 Billeheude. Died Before 1068.
[J Le Melletier *Les Seigneurs de Bohon* (Coutances: Arnaud-Bellee,
1978) UNSIGHTED]
28 Roger (I) # de TOSNY. Died Before 1038.
Keats-Rohan distinguishes Roger (I) and Roger (II) and infers that the
latter was the nephew of the former. The distinction is required otherwise
Roger (II) would have been a bigamist.
[K S B Keats-Rohan *Domesday People: A Prosopography of Persons occurring
in English Documents, 1066-1166* (The Boydell Press: Woodbridge, 1999)
I:380-381; T Stasser “Autour de Roger le Vieux: les alliances matrimoniales
des comtes de Carcassonne” in *Annales du Midi* 75 (1963):165-187]
29 Estefania de BARCELONA. Died Before 1066.
The wife of Roger was Estefania/Stephanie (not Adelaide) sister of Ramon
Berenguer I and not his daughter as claimed by Keats-Rohan. The date for
Estefania's marriage is about 1018 and Keats-Rohan indicates that when the
marriage occurred her father was dead. Ramon Borrel I's died in Feb 1018
whereas his son died in 1036. Estefania married secondly Garcia V king of
Navarre in 1038. ES 56 makes Estefania a daughter of Bernad I count of Foix.
[K S B Keats-Rohan *Domesday People: A Prosopography of Persons occurring
in English Documents, 1066-1166* (The Boydell Press: Woodbridge, 1999)
I:380-381; ES II:56, 68, 69; T Stasser “Autour de Roger le Vieux: les
alliances matrimoniales des comtes de Carcassonne” in *Annales du Midi* 75
(1963):165-187]
56 Ralph (I) de TOSNY.
[CP XII/1:754]
58 Ramon Borrel I de BARCELONA, C of Barcelona. Born
0972. Died 25 Feb 1018. He married 0990/0991.
[ES II:68, 69, III/1:145, III/3 145 NEU]
59 Ermesinde de COMMINGES. Died 1 Mar 1057.
[ES II:68, III/1:145, III/3 145 NEU]
112 Hugo de CALVACAMP. Born About 0890.
[CP XII/1:753]
116 Borrell II de BARCELONA, C of Barcelona. Died 30 Sep 0992. He married
0968,
[ES II:68, III/4:763]
117 Ledgarda de TOULOUSE. Died After 0977.
[ES II:68, III/4:763]
118 Roger I de COMMINGES, C of Comminges. Died After Apr 1011. He married
Before Apr 0970.
[ES III/3 145 NEU]
119 Adelais de PONS. Died After Apr 1011.
[ES III/3 145 NEU]
232 Suniario I de BARCELONA, C of Barcelona. Died 15 Oct 0950. He married
0920/0925,
[ES II:68, III/4:763]
233 Richilde de TOULOUSE. Died After 0954.
[ES II:68, III/4:763; T Stasser “Autour de Roger le Vieux: les alliances
matrimoniales des comtes de Carcassonne” in *Annales du Midi* 75
(1963):165-187]
236 Arnaldo de COMMINGES, C of Comminges. Died Before 27 Nov 0957.
[ES III/3 145 NEU]
237 Arsinda de ? CARCASSONNE, ? C of Carcassonne. Died After 0968.
[ES III/3 145 NEU; T Stasser “Autour de Roger le Vieux: les alliances
matrimoniales des comtes de Carcassonne” in *Annales du Midi* 75
(1963):165-187]
Todd A. Farmerie
> 4 Main d' AUBIGNY, L of Saint-Aubin , d'Aubigne.
> 5 Adeleisa de BOHUN.
> 10 Humphrey de BOHUN, L of Bohon, Norm. & Tataford, Norf. Died 1080/1093.
> [K S B Keats-Rohan *Domesday People: A Prosopography of Persons occurring
> in English Documents, 1066-1166* (The Boydell Press: Woodbridge, 1999)
> I:272-273]
I had assumed that Moore was refering to Humphrey I as brother of
Adelisa, but I see that chronology favors H II.
> 14 Robert #$ de TOSNY, of Belvoir. Died About 1093. Held Belvoir, Leics,
> at the Domesday Survey.
> Robert was related to the Tosnys of Flamstead but it is not known for
> certain what this relationship was. It is highly likely that he was the son
> of the Roger who married Stephanie of Barcelona as he had a brother and a
> son both named 'Berengar'.
> [I J Sanders *English Baronies: A Study of their Origin and Descent*
> (Clarendon Press: Oxford, 1963 [1960]) 12; K S B Keats-Rohan *Domesday
> People: A Prosopography of Persons occurring in English Documents,
> 1066-1166* (The Boydell Press: Woodbridge, 1999) I:164, 380-381]
> 28 Roger (I) # de TOSNY. Died Before 1038.
> Keats-Rohan distinguishes Roger (I) and Roger (II) and infers that the
> latter was the nephew of the former. The distinction is required otherwise
> Roger (II) would have been a bigamist.
> [K S B Keats-Rohan *Domesday People: A Prosopography of Persons occurring
> in English Documents, 1066-1166* (The Boydell Press: Woodbridge, 1999)
> I:380-381; T Stasser “Autour de Roger le Vieux: les alliances matrimoniales
> des comtes de Carcassonne” in *Annales du Midi* 75 (1963):165-187]
> 29 Estefania de BARCELONA. Died Before 1066.
> The wife of Roger was Estefania/Stephanie (not Adelaide) sister of Ramon
> Berenguer I and not his daughter as claimed by Keats-Rohan. The date for
> Estefania's marriage is about 1018 and Keats-Rohan indicates that when the
> marriage occurred her father was dead. Ramon Borrel I's died in Feb 1018
> whereas his son died in 1036. Estefania married secondly Garcia V king of
> Navarre in 1038. ES 56 makes Estefania a daughter of Bernad I count of Foix.
> [K S B Keats-Rohan *Domesday People: A Prosopography of Persons occurring
> in English Documents, 1066-1166* (The Boydell Press: Woodbridge, 1999)
> I:380-381; ES II:56, 68, 69; T Stasser “Autour de Roger le Vieux: les
> alliances matrimoniales des comtes de Carcassonne” in *Annales du Midi* 75
> (1963):165-187]
> 58 Ramon Borrel I de BARCELONA, C of Barcelona. Born
> 0972. Died 25 Feb 1018. He married 0990/0991.
> [ES II:68, 69, III/1:145, III/3 145 NEU]
> 59 Ermesinde de COMMINGES. Died 1 Mar 1057.
> [ES II:68, III/1:145, III/3 145 NEU]
This issue has never received sufficient, broad attention. There are
two sources which report the marriage of "Roger" to a spanish lady. One
of them reports the marriage arranged by Ermesende to her daughter (who
I don't think is named in the original). The other reports the marriage
of Roger to Stephanie, who later married Garcia Sanchez of Navarre. On
the Norman side, there were two, presumably related, Tosny (Todeny)
families. The more senior one (Conches) of them traces to Roger de
Tosny, who is known to have been exiled from Normandy, and to have
gained fame in Spain. It is to this Roger that at least one of the
above marriages explicitly refers. (As I have responded elsewhere, this
Roger is found with a wife Adelaide, and later with a wife Godeheut, and
his widow would marry Richard d'Evreux. This is a problem if Roger
married Stephanie, because she certainly wasn't his widow when she
married Garcia.) The junior line, that of Belvoir, is of obscure
origins, but an attempt has been made to derive them from the spanish
marriage based on the appearance of the name Berenger in the family.
There is no other evidence which suggests a spanish connection for this
branch, nor that known ancestor Robert was son of a Roger.
There has been much written in an attept to clarify this whole question,
none of it successful. Evans, for example, suggested that not only did
Roger of Conches marry a Spanish princess, but there must also have been
a connection to Belvoir to explain the name Berenger. He proposed that
Robert of Belvoir was son of another (otherwise unknown) Roger, likewise
exiled to spain and likewise married to a spanish princess. His
solution seemed to be turned on its hat by Musset, who in writing on the
Toeny instead placed the Berengers as members of the Conches family,
eliminating the need for the Todeny branch to be brought into the
equation at all.
Keats-Rohan returns to the Evans theory, but follows Stasser (and
perhaps Evans, I will have to look it up) in making Stephanie, wife of
Garcia Sanchez daughter of Ramon Borrel, Count of Barcelona. This
appears to be an attempt to unify the two theories - making the wife of
Roger and Garcia the daughter of Ermesende, while eliminating the
"widow" problem, since the death of the hypothetical Todeny Roger would
have freed up Stephanie to remarry. There are several problems here.
First of all, all Iberian works with which I am familiar (and as recent
as 1996) are united in calling the Queen of Navarre the daughter, not of
Ramon Borrel and Ermesende, but of her brother Bernard, Count of
Bigorre, and sister of the Queen of Aragon. Likewise the recent work of
Salazar Acha concludes, based on onomastics, that Stephanie had been
previously married to a relative of Queen Constance of France, and there
is hardly room for a marriage to a Tosny in here too.
What do we make of this mess? Well, what I make of it is the folowing.
There was only one spanish marriage, that of the famous Roger of
Conches. (I am not willing to accept this wife as the later widow who
married Richard d'Evreux.) The name Berenger, while present in
Barcelona, also appeared locally, being the name of two Counts of
Brittany, one of them the father-in-law of Rollo, and thus there is no
particular reason to derive it from a Barcelona marriage. There is no
evidence for Roger de Todeny of Belvoir, and he should be discarded.
Who was Roger of Conches' wife? I think a daughter of Ramon Borrel and
Ermesende. Perhaps her name was Stephanie, and this was responsible for
the confusion with Garcia's wife. An alternative is that while the
marriage to the later Queen of Navarre was arranged, it never took
place, and she was left behind in Spain when Roger returned to Normandy.
Now I have to admit, the above is as much speculation as that preceeding
it. Still I think we have taken a simple conflict between two sources
and tried to turn it into two parallel marriages to two parallel
Tosny/Todeny families.
taf