Joanne Percy (wife of Arthur Harris of Prittlewell?)

[Rob]

Below is a copy of an old thread from 4 Mar 1999 posted by Jeff
Snavely:

I have spent some time gathering information on the Harris family from
Prittlewell that are claimed to be ancestors of Capt. Thomas Harris
and his
brother John Harris of VA as I hope to one day connect my Harris's to
that
family in some way. I keep finding the wife of Arthur Harris of
Prittlewell
(c.1475-after 1537) as Johanna/Joan Percy descendant of Henry Algernon
Percy, but the dates make this seem impossible.

The estimated birth date I have seen for Johanna/Joan Percy is c.1525
but
Arthur Harris's brith estimate is c.1475 (a 50 year age difference!)

The birth date of her claimed father Sir Thomas Percy (1497-Jun 2,
1537) is
a generation younger than Arthur's birth date when they should be
close to
the same age.

The estimated marriage year I have seen for Arthur and Johanna is
Before
1520 (she wasn't even born yet!).

I can think of a few possible answers to this problem:

1) Arthur Harris's wife is a different Johanna/Joan Percy who should
be from
about the same generation as Henry Algernon Percy. Where would she
fit into
the Percy family?

2) The estimated birth years for the members of the Harris family are
too
early and need to be adjusted. What are some more accurate dates?
What are
the earliest recorded dates for events in the lives of these Harris's?

I have also seen a couple messages on the archives of the Gen-Medieval
list
saying that Capt. Thomas Harris could not be son of William Harris of
Crixse
and thus not descended from Arthur Harris and Johanna/Joan Percy at
all.
Does anyone know the details?

-- Jeff Snavely <mailto:jsnav...@oecadvantage.net> or
<mailto:jsnav...@geocities.com>
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.genealogy.medieval/browse_thread/thread/db45256878d4bca/667a1061c96f0b44?lnk=gst&q=Joanne+Percy#667a1061c96f0b44
00-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------00

Since no one respond to his thread, I shall follow this up on the
subject of Joanne (Johanna) Percy, supposedly (but maybe doubtfully)
the wife of Arthur Harris of Prittlewell (or his son, Arthur). Jeff
suggested Joanne was the daughter of Sir Thomas Percy, the second son
of Henry Algernon Percy, 5th Earl of Northumberland and his wife
Catherine Spencer. Joanne's mother is supposedly Eleanor Harbottle.

However, a glance at pg 417 of A General and Heraldic Dictionary of
the Peerages of England, Ireland and Scotland (etc, etc) by John Burke
(pub. 1831), shown no such daughter descended from Sir Thomas Percy
(left only two sons).
http://books.google.com/books?id=aB0IAAAAQAAJ&pg=PP9&source=gbs_selected_pages&cad=0_1#PPA417,M1

Although, that's only one book from 1831. I went to look for later
editions or different books on the subject of Sir Thomas Percy and his
children, so this is what I pulled up so far:
http://books.google.com/books?id=pjMEAAAAIAAJ&pg=PA367&dq=Sir+Thomas+Percy+and+Eleanor+Harbottle&ei=jbe9SamLH4zKM7zgwZQL#PPA244,M1

Then another source made it all the more curiouser and curiouser:
http://books.google.com/books?id=SxYYAAAAYAAJ&pg=RA2-PR29&dq=Arthur+Harris+and+Joanne+Percy&ei=2Li9SaK3EYzKM7zgwZQL
(From searching Google Books based on Arthur Harris and Joanne Percy:
http://books.google.com/books?q=Arthur+Harris+and+Joanne+Percy&btnG=Search+Books)

A website about the Harris Legacy: http://www.theharrislegacy.com/
shown nothing of any relationship between Arthur Harris and Joanne
Percy (click on the Harris Family of Essex, England, scroll down for
Arthur Harris, who had a different wife).

Is it conclusive that there is no such marriage between Arthur Harris
and Joanne Percy? Or is there something's missing from that
relationship?

Thanks.

[tiffan...@gmail.com]

Very interesting post. I enjoyed reading the links (recognized some of them too!) I too am working through the details. While it would be very awesome to claim I am a direct descendant of Edward III - the facts have yet to support that - mainly dates. Concerning the Percy/Harris relation I did find this: Living Descendants of Blood Royal London: World Nobility and Peerage, 1959. Vol. 4 page 417. It does list (Johanna) Joan Percy and the Arthur Harris she married was specified as Arthur Harris of Prittlewell, Essex - son of William and Anne.
As for the huge age difference - in the Tudor/Elizabethan era marriages were seldom a union of love and were more of a business nature. Not to say marriages based on love didn't exist, but it was much different for the upper class.
I am not surprised that we do not see Joan's name much in books. The females were simply members of the family to be married off, hopefully into an advantageous marriage. She was, according to that book, the third daughter.
This Harris link is something I continuously come back to. It is all very interesting stuff!

Cheers!

[billy...@gmail.com]

I think the problem is that you have latched onto the wrong Thomas Percy. Johanna Percy was born about 1460, the same year that her father, Thomas Percy, Lord of Egremont was killed at the Battle of Northampton. William and Arthur names alternate for several generations of the Harris family. She married Arthur Harris of Prittwell, born about 1473. It is believed that both the Harris and Percy families were Norman.

[katebr...@gmail.com]

I too am doing research on this lady and spotted the same discrepancy. In my digging, I found a reference to the fact that Sir Henry Algernon Percy (often listed as her grandfather) is probably her father instead, and the Thomas listed as her father is her brother. There is a reference to Sir Henry having a daughter named Joan - could this be Joanne??

[taf]

On Saturday, August 25, 2018 at 6:30:03 PM UTC-7, katebr...@gmail.com wrote:

> I too am doing research on this lady and spotted the same discrepancy. In
> my digging, I found a reference to the fact that Sir Henry Algernon Percy
> (often listed as her grandfather) is probably her father instead, and the
> Thomas listed as her father is her brother. There is a reference to Sir
> Henry having a daughter named Joan - could this be Joanne??

Could they be the same? Well, the names Joan and Joanne (and the Johanna named earlier in the thread) all represent the same given name. However, as I am sure you know, it takes more than having the same given name to be the same person. What is the evidence that she was 'probably' the daughter of Henry Algernon?