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C.P. Addition: Elizabeth Cobham, wife of John Harpenden, Knt., Richard Strange, Knt., Lord Strange, and Roger Kynaston, Knt.
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Douglas Richardson
May 20, 2013, 4:13:27 PM5/20/13
to
Dear Newsgroup ~
Complete Peerage 12(1) (1953): 355-356 (sub Strange) has an account of
Sir Richard le Strange, 7th Lord Strange of Knockin, who died in 1449.
Regarding his second marriage, the following information is provided:
"He married, 2ndly, on or before 26 August 1439, Elizabeth ... [She]
died on or before 17 March 1453." END OF QUOTE
Footnote a on page 356 gives the following source for this marriage:
"Cal. Close Rolls, 1435-41, p. 359; Cal. Patent Rolls, 1436-41, pp.
307-08. Possibly the transaction there mentioned was in the nature of
a marriage settlement. Dugdale, Baronage, vol. i, p. 666, says she
was the da. of Reginald Lord Cobham of Sterborough Castle, Kent." END
OF QUOTE.
Complete Peerage 14 (1998): 596 (sub Strange) indicates that
Elizabeth, widow of Richard le Strange, "married 2ndly Sir Roger
Kynaston, of Hordley, co. Salop. She died on or before 11 Feb.
1453/4." The source cited for this information is J.K. L'Estrange,
"L'Estrange of Knokyn," in Notes & Queries, vol. 199, pp. 325, 326.
The parentage for Elizabeth Cobham as provided by Dugdale is elsewhere
given by Paget, Baronage of England (1957) 508: 8, where Paget cites
Glover’s Coll. as his source.
So we have statements in print that Elizabeth, 2nd wife of Sir Richard
le Strange, was the daughter of Reynold Cobham, Knt., [3rd] Lord
Cobham of Sterborough, and, that following the death of Sir Richard le
Strange, she married (2nd) Sir Roger Kynaston. So far, so good.
However, it would appear that Elizabeth Cobham had a hitherto
undetected first marriage to John Harpenden (or Harpeden), Knt., who
died in 1438. This marriage is disclosed by a lawsuit dated 1440:
CP40no717, 1696d
London debt
Plaintiff: Wotton, John, of London, draper, on his own account
Defendants: Straunge, Richard, knight, lord of Colham, and Elizabeth,
his wife, formerly wife of John Harpden, knight.
The original record of this lawsuit may be viewed at the following
weblink:
http://aalt.law.uh.edu/AALT1/H6/CP40no717/bCP40no717dorses/IMG_1696.htm
The place Colham named in this lawsuit is Colham (in Hillingdon),
Middlesex, which was a Strange family property.
Sir John Harpenden is better known to historians and genealogists as
the 5th and surviving husband of Joan [de la] Pole, Lady Cobham, who
died in 1434 [see Complete Peerage 3 (1913): 345 (sub Cobham)]. Sir
John Harpenden's marriage to Elizabeth Cobham would also be an
addition to the Complete Peerage account of Sir John's first wife,
Joan [de la] Pole.
Although sources differ as to Sir John Harpenden's death date, it
appears that he died in May 1438, and was buried in Westminster
Abbey. For an account of Sir John Harpenden's monument in Westminster
Abbey, see the following source:
Moule, Antiquities in Westminster Abbey (1825): 25–27.
This source may be viewed at the following weblink:
http://books.google.com/books?id=KPHfAAAAMAAJ&pg=PA25
As for Sir John Harpenden's life history, I find that he obtained a
general pardon in 1422. On 28 March 1422 he had license to cross over
to England with the corpse of dame Eleanor de Courtenay for interment.
See for the following references for this information:
Annual Report of the Deputy Keeper 42 (1881): 326, 380, 440, 447.
This record of Lady Eleanor Courtenay's death in France is likewise an
addition to Complete Peerage 4 (1916): 326 (sub Devon). Eleanor
Courtenay mentioned here was Eleanor Mortimer, widow of Sir Edward
Courtenay. She was the sister of Anne Mortimer, wife of Richard of
York, Knt., Earl of Cambridge, which couple are the paternal
grandparents of King Edward IV of England. For further particulars of
Eleanor Courtenay's death in France, see Coss & Tyerman, Soldiers,
Nobles & Gentlemen (2009): 208.
I might point out that the 2nd husband of Sir Richard le Strange's
mother, Maud Mohun [died 1400], was Nicholas Hauberk, Knt. Following
Maud Mohun's death, Sir Nicholas Hauberk became the 3rd husband of
Joan [de la] Pole, Lady Cobham [died 1434], which lady is the same
woman who later married Sir John Harpenden. The tangled web of
marriages between these families is quite interesting needless to say.
Further particulars on all these people can be found in my new book,
Royal Ancestry, which is now available for purchase on Amazon. If you
pre-ordered the book, I'm nearly finished shipping out those orders.
The book is in five volumes and is almost 4,000 pages in length. For
orders outside of the United States, please contact me personally.
Best always, Douglas Richardson, Salt Lake City, Utah
Complete Peerage 12(1) (1953): 355-356 (sub Strange) has an account of
Sir Richard le Strange, 7th Lord Strange of Knockin, who died in 1449.
Regarding his second marriage, the following information is provided:
"He married, 2ndly, on or before 26 August 1439, Elizabeth ... [She]
died on or before 17 March 1453." END OF QUOTE
Footnote a on page 356 gives the following source for this marriage:
"Cal. Close Rolls, 1435-41, p. 359; Cal. Patent Rolls, 1436-41, pp.
307-08. Possibly the transaction there mentioned was in the nature of
a marriage settlement. Dugdale, Baronage, vol. i, p. 666, says she
was the da. of Reginald Lord Cobham of Sterborough Castle, Kent." END
OF QUOTE.
Complete Peerage 14 (1998): 596 (sub Strange) indicates that
Elizabeth, widow of Richard le Strange, "married 2ndly Sir Roger
Kynaston, of Hordley, co. Salop. She died on or before 11 Feb.
1453/4." The source cited for this information is J.K. L'Estrange,
"L'Estrange of Knokyn," in Notes & Queries, vol. 199, pp. 325, 326.
The parentage for Elizabeth Cobham as provided by Dugdale is elsewhere
given by Paget, Baronage of England (1957) 508: 8, where Paget cites
Glover’s Coll. as his source.
So we have statements in print that Elizabeth, 2nd wife of Sir Richard
le Strange, was the daughter of Reynold Cobham, Knt., [3rd] Lord
Cobham of Sterborough, and, that following the death of Sir Richard le
Strange, she married (2nd) Sir Roger Kynaston. So far, so good.
However, it would appear that Elizabeth Cobham had a hitherto
undetected first marriage to John Harpenden (or Harpeden), Knt., who
died in 1438. This marriage is disclosed by a lawsuit dated 1440:
CP40no717, 1696d
London debt
Plaintiff: Wotton, John, of London, draper, on his own account
Defendants: Straunge, Richard, knight, lord of Colham, and Elizabeth,
his wife, formerly wife of John Harpden, knight.
The original record of this lawsuit may be viewed at the following
weblink:
http://aalt.law.uh.edu/AALT1/H6/CP40no717/bCP40no717dorses/IMG_1696.htm
The place Colham named in this lawsuit is Colham (in Hillingdon),
Middlesex, which was a Strange family property.
Sir John Harpenden is better known to historians and genealogists as
the 5th and surviving husband of Joan [de la] Pole, Lady Cobham, who
died in 1434 [see Complete Peerage 3 (1913): 345 (sub Cobham)]. Sir
John Harpenden's marriage to Elizabeth Cobham would also be an
addition to the Complete Peerage account of Sir John's first wife,
Joan [de la] Pole.
Although sources differ as to Sir John Harpenden's death date, it
appears that he died in May 1438, and was buried in Westminster
Abbey. For an account of Sir John Harpenden's monument in Westminster
Abbey, see the following source:
Moule, Antiquities in Westminster Abbey (1825): 25–27.
This source may be viewed at the following weblink:
http://books.google.com/books?id=KPHfAAAAMAAJ&pg=PA25
As for Sir John Harpenden's life history, I find that he obtained a
general pardon in 1422. On 28 March 1422 he had license to cross over
to England with the corpse of dame Eleanor de Courtenay for interment.
See for the following references for this information:
Annual Report of the Deputy Keeper 42 (1881): 326, 380, 440, 447.
This record of Lady Eleanor Courtenay's death in France is likewise an
addition to Complete Peerage 4 (1916): 326 (sub Devon). Eleanor
Courtenay mentioned here was Eleanor Mortimer, widow of Sir Edward
Courtenay. She was the sister of Anne Mortimer, wife of Richard of
York, Knt., Earl of Cambridge, which couple are the paternal
grandparents of King Edward IV of England. For further particulars of
Eleanor Courtenay's death in France, see Coss & Tyerman, Soldiers,
Nobles & Gentlemen (2009): 208.
I might point out that the 2nd husband of Sir Richard le Strange's
mother, Maud Mohun [died 1400], was Nicholas Hauberk, Knt. Following
Maud Mohun's death, Sir Nicholas Hauberk became the 3rd husband of
Joan [de la] Pole, Lady Cobham [died 1434], which lady is the same
woman who later married Sir John Harpenden. The tangled web of
marriages between these families is quite interesting needless to say.
Further particulars on all these people can be found in my new book,
Royal Ancestry, which is now available for purchase on Amazon. If you
pre-ordered the book, I'm nearly finished shipping out those orders.
The book is in five volumes and is almost 4,000 pages in length. For
orders outside of the United States, please contact me personally.
Best always, Douglas Richardson, Salt Lake City, Utah
Douglas Richardson
May 20, 2013, 8:48:35 PM5/20/13
to
Dear Newsgroup ~
Below is the record of the inquisition post mortem for Sir John
Harpenden, who died in 1438.
An abstract of this inquisition post mortem should be in print. If
someone has access to the published inquisition, perhaps they would be
kind enough to post the pertinent details from it here on the
newsgroup.
Best always, Douglas Richardson, Salt Lake City, Utah
+ + + + + + + +
Harpeden, John, kt: Oxon, Berks, Hunts
Chancery: Inquisitions Post Mortem, Series I, Henry VI. Harpeden,
John, kt: Oxon, Berks, Hunts.
Collection: Records created, acquired, and inherited by Chancery,
and also of the Wardrobe, Royal Household, Exchequer and various
commissions
Date range: 01 September 1437 - 31 August 1438
Reference:C 139/86/28
Subjects:Landed estates
Below is the record of the inquisition post mortem for Sir John
Harpenden, who died in 1438.
An abstract of this inquisition post mortem should be in print. If
someone has access to the published inquisition, perhaps they would be
kind enough to post the pertinent details from it here on the
newsgroup.
Best always, Douglas Richardson, Salt Lake City, Utah
Harpeden, John, kt: Oxon, Berks, Hunts
Chancery: Inquisitions Post Mortem, Series I, Henry VI. Harpeden,
John, kt: Oxon, Berks, Hunts.
Collection: Records created, acquired, and inherited by Chancery,
and also of the Wardrobe, Royal Household, Exchequer and various
commissions
Date range: 01 September 1437 - 31 August 1438
Reference:C 139/86/28
Subjects:Landed estates
John Watson
May 20, 2013, 9:51:32 PM5/20/13
to
Here's a couple more references for you.
1 August 1438, Robert Croxforde and Henry Benyfelde to Elizabeth who
was wife of John Harpden knight. Quitclaim of the manor of Harpden co.
Oxford. Dated 1 August 16 Henry VI.
Calendar of Close Rolls, Henry VI: volume 4: 1441-1447 (1937), p. 35
30 June 1441, Grant by Richard Lestraunge, knight, lord of Knokyn,
Mohun, and Harpden, and Elizabeth his wife, to their servant, William
Spencer, of a tenement in Henley on Thames, called 'Cardemakeres,'
late of John Harpden, knight, near Brookstrete; rent, 12d. Witnesses:—
John Elmez, warden of Henle, John Devene and Roger Tannere, bailiffs,
and others (named). 30 June, 19 Henry VI. Two seals one with a grass
ring.
A Descriptive Catalogue of Ancient Deeds: Volume 6 (1915), pp.
353-366, No. C. 6594
Regards,
John
Jan
May 20, 2013, 10:32:26 PM5/20/13
to
John Harpeden, Knight
34. Writ 12 May 1438 ... Northamptonshire. Inquisition. Rockingham. 12 June 1438 ... He held no lands ... in chief ... He died on 8 May last. Isabel, wife of Robert Olyver, esquire, is his kin and next heir, as the daughter of Elizabeth daughter of Gilbert brother of John father of John Harpeden. She is aged 40 years and more.
35. Writ 4 July 1438 ... Bedfordshire ... 28 October 1438 ... Findings as in 34.
36 Writ 12 May 1438 ... Essex. ... 23 June 1438. ... Findings as in 34.
37. Writ 12 May 1438. ... Kent. ... 24 June 1438. ... He held no lands ... of the king ... He died on 8 May last. Identity of the next heir, unknown.
38. Writ 12 May 1438 ... Oxfordshire ... 3 June 1438. ... Robert Aleyn, parson of Rotherfield Greys, and Henry Bynfeld of Shiplake were seised ... of the manor of Harpsden. On 1 April 1415, they granted it to John Harpeden, knight ... to hold at he will of Robert and Henry. John thus entered ... and died seised of this estate and no other. After his death, Robert and Henry entered ... and by their charter, dated at Harpsden on 20 May 1438, granted it to the most excellent prince, lord Humphrey, duke of Gloucester ... Date of death and heir as in 34.
39. ... Berkshire. ... 3 June 1438. ... He was seised of the following in demesne as of fee. Wargrave ... held of Henry, bishop of Winchester ... Cookham ... held of the duke of Gloucester ... He granted the messuage ... by charter to the most excellent prince, lord Humphrey, duke of Gloucester ... The charter was dated on 29 April 1438 ... The duke was thus seised ... and so seised, he granted the messuage, tenement etc to John Harpeden, to hold at the will of the duke. The grant was made on 1 May 1438. John thus entered the lands ... He died seised of this estate and no other and, after his death, the duke entered the lands ... Date of death and heir as in 34.
40. Writ. 20 October 1438. ... Huntingdonshire. ...24 November 1438. ... He held the following for life by demise of Thomas Brook, knight, and Joan his wife, with reversion to Thomas and Joan, and their heirs and assigns. Offord, the manor in Offord Darcy, with advowson of the church, held of the honour of Huntingdon by knight service. ... Everton, the manor in Everton, held of John, duke of Norfolk, by knight service. ... He died on 7 May 1438. Joan, wife of Thomas Brook, is his next heir, and aged 24 years and more. Memorandum that this inquisition was delivered to court on 20 December 1438.
John Watson
May 21, 2013, 12:25:42 AM5/21/13
to
CP 25/1/191/28, number 15.
Link: http://aalt.law.uh.edu/CP25%281%29/CP25%281%29191Oxon/IMG_0786.htm
County: Oxfordshire.
Place: Westminster.
Date: One month from Easter, 22 Henry VI [10 May 1444].
Parties: Humphrey Forster, esquire, querent, and Richard Lestraunge,
knight, and Elizabeth, his wife, late the wife of John Harpeden',
knight, William Faukoner, esquire, and Robert Olyver, esquire, and
Isabel, his wife, deforciants.
Property: The manor of Harpeden' and 16 messuages, 4 tofts, 4
virgates of land, 5 acres of meadow, 20 acres of pasture and 33
shillings and 4 pence of rent in Harpeden', Henle, Ritherfeld' Grey
and Ritherfeld' Pippard' and the advowson of the church of Harpeden'.
Action: Plea of covenant.
Agreement: Richard and Elizabeth, William, Robert and Isabel have
acknowledged the manor, tenements and advowson to be the right of
Humphrey, as those which he has of their gift, and have remised and
quitclaimed them from themselves and the heirs of Elizabeth to him and
his heirs for ever.
Warranty: Warranty.
For this: Humphrey has given them 500 marks of silver.
http://www.medievalgenealogy.org.uk/fines/abstracts/CP_25_1_191_28.shtml#15
Regards,
John
Douglas Richardson
May 21, 2013, 10:58:31 AM5/21/13
to
Dear Newsgroup ~
I wish to thank Jan and John for posting additional information
regarding Sir John Harpenden/Harpeden [died 1438]. It's very much
appreciated.
I've copied below three additional records relating to Sir John
Harpenden/Harpeden. The first two items below concern a debt of £300
which he owed in 1412-1415 to two London merchants. The second of the
two items specifies that he then owned the manor of Harpsden,
Oxfordshire, which fact agrees with the inquisition post mortem taken
following his death in 1438.
The third item below is a Parliamentary petition which he and his
wife, Joan [de la] Pole, Lady Cobham submitted about 1430, concerning
a manor which Lady Cobham previously held with her 1st husband, Sir
Robert de Hemenhale.
I note that the 1438 inquisition post mortem of Sir John Harpenden
mentions Humphrey of Lancaster, Duke of Gloucester, uncle of King
Henry VI of England. The reason for this is quite simple. At the
time of Sir John Harpenden's death in 1438, his wife was then
Elizabeth Cobham, whose sister, Eleanor Cobham, was then the wife of
Duke Humphrey.
Best always, Douglas Richardson, Salt Lake City, Utah
+ + + + + + + + +
1. Request a quotation for a copy to be digitised or printed and sent
to you.
Order a copy
View at The National Archives for free
Reference:
C 241/206/35
Description:
Debtor: John Harpeden, esquire.
Creditor: Henry London, and Richard Everard, citizens and mercers
[merchants] of London.
Amount: £300
Before whom: Richard Whittington, Mayor of the Staple of Westminster.
When taken: 26/07/1412
First term: 24/12/1412
Last term: 24/12/1412
Writ to: Sheriff of Oxon, Berks
Sent by: Richard Whittington, Mayor of the Staple of Westminster.
Endorsement: Oxon' 't Berk'. Coram d'no Rege in Cancellar' sua in
Octav' s'ti Martini.
Date:
1413 Oct 17
+ + + + + + + + + +
2. Reference: C 131/59/9
Description:
Debtor: John Harpsden, esquire [of Harpsden, Binfield Hundred, Oxon.].
Creditor: Henry London, and Richard Everard, citizens and mercers of
London.
Amount: £300.
Before whom: Richard Whittington, Mayor of the Westminster Staple
[Middx].
When taken: 26/07/1412
First term: 24/12/1412
Last term: 24/12/1412
Writ to: Sheriff of Oxon. & Berks
Sent by: Chancery.
Endorsement: John Golofre, Sheriff [of Oxon. & Berks.], replies that
John Harpsden was not found in the bailiwick; he has extended his
lands as appears in the extent.
Note:
Inquisition and return: Date given for the return to Chancery:
06/10/1415. Here follows the heading: "The extent of the lands, goods,
and chattels of John Harpsden of Harpsden [in Binfield Hundred] in
Oxon." Attached is the extent made at Henley [a borough in Oxon.] on
Fri., 20/09/1415, before John Golofre, Sheriff [of Oxon. & Berks.]:
John Harpsden had at Harpsden a manor, called Harpsden, lying in
Harpsden, Rotherfield Peppard [in Binfield Hundred, Oxon.] and Henley
[on Thames], which is worth £10 after expenses; he has no more lands
or tenements in Oxon. Dorse: memorandum that on 11/10/1415 the manor
was handed over to Thomas Wadden and William Grove to hold.
Date: 1415 Aug 28
+ + + + + + + + + +
3. Reference: SC 8/29/1405
Description:
Petitioners: John Harpeden, knight, and Joan Oldecastell (Oldcastle),
widow of John Oldecastell
Name(s): Harpeden; Oldecastell (Oldcastle), John; Joan
Addressees: Commons of parliament
Nature of request: John Harpeden, knight, and Joan, widow of John
Oldecastell request the restitution to Joan of the manor of Burnham,
which she had held jointly with her former husband Robert de
Hemenhale, and which was lost by the forfeiture of her later husband,
John Oldecastell. Henry V later granted it to Lewis de Robessard, but
on his deathbed asked him to surrender it so that it could be returned
to Joan: Lewis has done so, and it is now in the king's hand.
Nature of endorsement: They are entrusted to the justices.They are to
sue at common law.
Places mentioned: Cooling, [Kent]; Wortham, [Suffolk]; Brunham
(Burnham), Norfolk; Hemenhale (Hempnalls Hall), Suffolk; Melom (Melun)
[Isle de France, France]; Polsted Hall, [Norfolk]
People mentioned: John Oldecastell (Oldcastle), Lord Cobham, knight;
John Muriel, parson of Wortham; Robert [de Hemenhale (Hempnalls)],
knight; Ralph de Hemenhale (Hempnalls), knight, father of Robert de
Hemenhale; John de la Pool, father of Joan Oldecastell; William [de
Hemenhale (Hempnalls)], son of Robert and Joan de Hemenhale; Ralph de
Hemenhale (Hempnalls), esquire, kinsman of William de Hemenhale;
Thomas [de Hemenhale (Hempnalls)], father of Ralph de Hemenhale;
Edward [of York], Duke of York; Louis de Robessard (Robesart), knight;
Henry [V], King of England
Date derivation: This petition must be some years after SC 8/29/1406
and CPR 1422-9 pp.90-91 (dated at Westminster, 4 January 1423) as
Louis de Robessard has now surrendered the manor, and Joan Oldcastle
has remarried. CPR 1422-9 p.487, dated at Westminster, 7 May 1428,
suggests that he is still in possession - or has come back into
possession. CCR 1422-9 pp.403-4, dated at Westminster, 1 May 1428,
concerning an otherwise unrelated matter, mentions Joan as being the
wife of John Harpeden. A date around 1430 is therefore suggested.
Note:
This petition must be some years after SC 8/29/1406 and CPR 1422-9 pp.
90-91 (dated at Westminster, 4 January 1423) as Louis de Robessard has
now surrendered the manor, and Joan Oldcastle has remarried. CPR
1422-9 p.487, dated at Westminster, 7 May 1428, suggests that he is
still in possession - or has come back into possession. CCR 1422-9 pp.
403-4, dated at Westminster, 1 May 1428, concerning an otherwise
unrelated matter, mentions Joan as being the wife of John Harpeden. A
date around 1430 is therefore suggested.
Date: 1430
Related Material:
For a later petition by Lady Cobham on the same matter see SC
8/84/4197
An earlier petition from Joan on the same subject is SC 8/29/1407
An earlier petition from Joan on the same subject is SC 8/29/1406
Former references:
in its original department: Parliamentary Petition 4058
Language: French
Publication note: Calendar of Patent Rolls, Hen VI, vol. I, 1422-1429
pp.90-91 (commission to enquire into Joan's rights in the manor of
Burnham) & p.487 (exemplification, at his request, of letters patent
granting the manor of Burnham to Louis de Robessard) Rotuli
Parliamentorum; ut et Petitiones, et Placita in Parliamento, vol. V,
Hen VI and Edw IV pp.397b-398b (no.10) (full edition of original
petition) & pp.401a-403a (no.1) (full edition of an earlier petition
on the same subject).
I wish to thank Jan and John for posting additional information
regarding Sir John Harpenden/Harpeden [died 1438]. It's very much
appreciated.
I've copied below three additional records relating to Sir John
Harpenden/Harpeden. The first two items below concern a debt of £300
which he owed in 1412-1415 to two London merchants. The second of the
two items specifies that he then owned the manor of Harpsden,
Oxfordshire, which fact agrees with the inquisition post mortem taken
following his death in 1438.
The third item below is a Parliamentary petition which he and his
wife, Joan [de la] Pole, Lady Cobham submitted about 1430, concerning
a manor which Lady Cobham previously held with her 1st husband, Sir
Robert de Hemenhale.
I note that the 1438 inquisition post mortem of Sir John Harpenden
mentions Humphrey of Lancaster, Duke of Gloucester, uncle of King
Henry VI of England. The reason for this is quite simple. At the
time of Sir John Harpenden's death in 1438, his wife was then
Elizabeth Cobham, whose sister, Eleanor Cobham, was then the wife of
Duke Humphrey.
Best always, Douglas Richardson, Salt Lake City, Utah
1. Request a quotation for a copy to be digitised or printed and sent
to you.
Order a copy
View at The National Archives for free
Reference:
C 241/206/35
Description:
Debtor: John Harpeden, esquire.
Creditor: Henry London, and Richard Everard, citizens and mercers
[merchants] of London.
Amount: £300
Before whom: Richard Whittington, Mayor of the Staple of Westminster.
When taken: 26/07/1412
First term: 24/12/1412
Last term: 24/12/1412
Writ to: Sheriff of Oxon, Berks
Sent by: Richard Whittington, Mayor of the Staple of Westminster.
Endorsement: Oxon' 't Berk'. Coram d'no Rege in Cancellar' sua in
Octav' s'ti Martini.
Date:
1413 Oct 17
+ + + + + + + + + +
2. Reference: C 131/59/9
Description:
Debtor: John Harpsden, esquire [of Harpsden, Binfield Hundred, Oxon.].
Creditor: Henry London, and Richard Everard, citizens and mercers of
London.
Amount: £300.
Before whom: Richard Whittington, Mayor of the Westminster Staple
[Middx].
When taken: 26/07/1412
First term: 24/12/1412
Last term: 24/12/1412
Writ to: Sheriff of Oxon. & Berks
Sent by: Chancery.
Endorsement: John Golofre, Sheriff [of Oxon. & Berks.], replies that
John Harpsden was not found in the bailiwick; he has extended his
lands as appears in the extent.
Note:
Inquisition and return: Date given for the return to Chancery:
06/10/1415. Here follows the heading: "The extent of the lands, goods,
and chattels of John Harpsden of Harpsden [in Binfield Hundred] in
Oxon." Attached is the extent made at Henley [a borough in Oxon.] on
Fri., 20/09/1415, before John Golofre, Sheriff [of Oxon. & Berks.]:
John Harpsden had at Harpsden a manor, called Harpsden, lying in
Harpsden, Rotherfield Peppard [in Binfield Hundred, Oxon.] and Henley
[on Thames], which is worth £10 after expenses; he has no more lands
or tenements in Oxon. Dorse: memorandum that on 11/10/1415 the manor
was handed over to Thomas Wadden and William Grove to hold.
Date: 1415 Aug 28
+ + + + + + + + + +
3. Reference: SC 8/29/1405
Description:
Petitioners: John Harpeden, knight, and Joan Oldecastell (Oldcastle),
widow of John Oldecastell
Name(s): Harpeden; Oldecastell (Oldcastle), John; Joan
Addressees: Commons of parliament
Nature of request: John Harpeden, knight, and Joan, widow of John
Oldecastell request the restitution to Joan of the manor of Burnham,
which she had held jointly with her former husband Robert de
Hemenhale, and which was lost by the forfeiture of her later husband,
John Oldecastell. Henry V later granted it to Lewis de Robessard, but
on his deathbed asked him to surrender it so that it could be returned
to Joan: Lewis has done so, and it is now in the king's hand.
Nature of endorsement: They are entrusted to the justices.They are to
sue at common law.
Places mentioned: Cooling, [Kent]; Wortham, [Suffolk]; Brunham
(Burnham), Norfolk; Hemenhale (Hempnalls Hall), Suffolk; Melom (Melun)
[Isle de France, France]; Polsted Hall, [Norfolk]
People mentioned: John Oldecastell (Oldcastle), Lord Cobham, knight;
John Muriel, parson of Wortham; Robert [de Hemenhale (Hempnalls)],
knight; Ralph de Hemenhale (Hempnalls), knight, father of Robert de
Hemenhale; John de la Pool, father of Joan Oldecastell; William [de
Hemenhale (Hempnalls)], son of Robert and Joan de Hemenhale; Ralph de
Hemenhale (Hempnalls), esquire, kinsman of William de Hemenhale;
Thomas [de Hemenhale (Hempnalls)], father of Ralph de Hemenhale;
Edward [of York], Duke of York; Louis de Robessard (Robesart), knight;
Henry [V], King of England
Date derivation: This petition must be some years after SC 8/29/1406
and CPR 1422-9 pp.90-91 (dated at Westminster, 4 January 1423) as
Louis de Robessard has now surrendered the manor, and Joan Oldcastle
has remarried. CPR 1422-9 p.487, dated at Westminster, 7 May 1428,
suggests that he is still in possession - or has come back into
possession. CCR 1422-9 pp.403-4, dated at Westminster, 1 May 1428,
concerning an otherwise unrelated matter, mentions Joan as being the
wife of John Harpeden. A date around 1430 is therefore suggested.
Note:
This petition must be some years after SC 8/29/1406 and CPR 1422-9 pp.
90-91 (dated at Westminster, 4 January 1423) as Louis de Robessard has
now surrendered the manor, and Joan Oldcastle has remarried. CPR
1422-9 p.487, dated at Westminster, 7 May 1428, suggests that he is
still in possession - or has come back into possession. CCR 1422-9 pp.
403-4, dated at Westminster, 1 May 1428, concerning an otherwise
unrelated matter, mentions Joan as being the wife of John Harpeden. A
date around 1430 is therefore suggested.
Date: 1430
Related Material:
For a later petition by Lady Cobham on the same matter see SC
8/84/4197
An earlier petition from Joan on the same subject is SC 8/29/1407
An earlier petition from Joan on the same subject is SC 8/29/1406
Former references:
in its original department: Parliamentary Petition 4058
Language: French
Publication note: Calendar of Patent Rolls, Hen VI, vol. I, 1422-1429
pp.90-91 (commission to enquire into Joan's rights in the manor of
Burnham) & p.487 (exemplification, at his request, of letters patent
granting the manor of Burnham to Louis de Robessard) Rotuli
Parliamentorum; ut et Petitiones, et Placita in Parliamento, vol. V,
Hen VI and Edw IV pp.397b-398b (no.10) (full edition of original
petition) & pp.401a-403a (no.1) (full edition of an earlier petition
on the same subject).
Douglas Richardson
May 21, 2013, 1:24:17 PM5/21/13
to
Dear Newsgroup ~
In my first post in this thread, I mentioned that Sir John Harpenden/
Harpeden was buried in Westminster Abbey. A good account of Sir John
Harpenden's monument in Westminster Abbey can be found in the
Lady Cobham, which he discussed at length. But he was unaware of Sir
John's marriage to Elizabeth Cobham. As such, he didn't know Sir John
Harpenden had any connection to Humphrey, Duke of Gloucester, whose
wife, Eleanor Cobham, was the sister of Elizabeth Cobham.
Moule states that the inscription was entirely rased from this tomb,
but that it had retained four shields of arms. He then went onto
describe the shields.
The first shield shows the Harpenden arms impaling quarterly first and
fourth Mortimer, and second and third Ulster.
The second shield bears the coat of Harpenden impaling Cobham of
Sterborough, which stands for Sir John Harpenden's last marriage to
Elizabeth Cobham.
The third shield is charged with Harpenden imaling Cobham of Cobham,
which stands for Sir John Harpenden's marriage to Joan [de la] Pole,
Lady Cobham.
The fourth shield bears Harpenden alone.
Elsewhere Archaeologia Cantiana 11 (1877): 99 states that Sir John
Harpenden was "connected by descent with the Cobhams of Sterborough,
and with the family of Mortimer, as appears by the arms on his tomb."
But this statement is erroneous, as the arms on Sir John Harpenden's
monument are impalements which stand for his marriages, not arms with
quarterings which would reflect his ancestry,
We can account for the two Harpenden-Cobham impalements which reflect
Sir John's two known marriages, but that leaves the Mortimer/Ulster
impalement to be explained.
In this case, the Mortimer/Ulster arms are quite distinctive. They
suggest that Sir John Harpenden likely married a daughter or
granddaughter of Sir Edmund de Mortimer, Knt., Earl of March and
Ulster [died 1381], by his wife, Philippe, daughter and heiress of
Lionel of Antwerp, K.G., Duke of Clarence, Earl of Ulster (son of King
Edward III of England).
Due to chronological concerns, it can be ruled out that Sir John
Harpenden was married to a daughter of Sir Edmund de Mortimer and his
wife, Philippe of Clarence. That leaves us with a Mortimer
granddaughter.
We know that Edmund and Philippe had two sons, Roger Mortimer, Knt.,
Earl of March and Ulster, Lord Mortimer, and Edmund Mortimer, Knt.
Did either of this sons have a daughter who could have married Sir
John Harpenden? The answer is yes.
The following information regarding the younger Edmund Mortimer, Knt.,
is taken from my new book, Royal Ancestry:
EDMUND MORTIMER, Knt., of Narberth, Pembrokshire, and St. Clear (in
Trayne), Carmarthenshire, 2nd son, born at Ludlow, Shropshire 10 Dec.
1376. He was a legatee in the 1380 will of his father. Edmund was
taken prisoner by Owain Glyn Dŵr, Prince of Wales at the Battle of
Bryn Glas fought at Melienydd, Radnorshire 12 June 1402. King Henry
IV of England refused permission to pay a ransom, in consequence of
which Edmund joined the rebellion of Owain Glyn Dŵr. He married about
30 Nov. 1402 KATHERINE FERCH OWAIN GLYN DŴR, daughter of Owain Glyn
Dŵr, Prince of Wales, by Margaret, daughter of David Hanmer, Knt.
They had one son, Lionel, and three daughters. In 1404 King Henry IV
granted the Welsh lands of Edmund Mortimer, then in rebellion, to
Thomas Carew, Knt. for life. SIR EDMUND MORTIMER died during the
Siege of Harlech Castle (or immediately thereafter) apparently in Jan.
1409. His widow, Katherine, and their children, together with her
mother, were taken to London and held in custody by the king.
Katherine and her two unnamed daughters were buried in late 1413 in
the church of St. Swithin, London.
References: Nichols, Coll. of All the Wills (1780): 104–117 (will of
Edmund de Mortimer, Earl of March and Ulster). Malone, Plays & Poems
of William Shakspeare 6 (1790): 153. Ellis, Original Letters Ill. of
English Hist. 2nd Ser. 1 (1827): 24–29 (letter of Sir Edmund
Mortimer). Devon, Issues of the Exchequer (1837): 321, 327. Wylie,
Hist. of England under Henry IV 1 (1884): 281–282, 344–348, 358.
Bradley, Owen Glyndwr & the Last Struggle for Welsh Independence
(1902). Usk, Chronicon Adæ de Usk 1377–1421 (1904): 246–247 (“Sir
Edmund [Mortimer] … is known by common report to have wedded the
daughter of the same Owen [Glyn Dŵr]; by whom he had a son, Lionel,
and three daughters, all of whom, except one daughter, along with
their mother are now dead.”). C.P.R. 1401–1405 (1905): 384. Oman
Hist. of England (1906): 176, 178, 213. C.P.R. 1405–1408 (1907):
139. Boswell-Stone, Shakespeare’s Holinshed: the Chronicle & the
Historical Plays Compared (1907): 131, 133–139, 257–258. Taylor,
English Hist. Lit. in the 14th Cent. (1987): 299 (Wigmore Chron. sub
1376: “Eodem anno IIII idus decembris X die eiusdem mensis … apud
lodelow natus est filius domino Edmundo de Mortymer comes marchie ex
philippa uxore sua nomine Edmundus.”). Davies, Revolt of Owain Glyn
Dŵr (1995). Leese, Blood Royal (1996): 143–149. Myers & Douglas,
English Hist. Docs. 1327–1485 (1996): 192 (letter of Edmund Mortimer
dated 1402).
We find above that Sir Edmund Mortimer [died 1409] and his wife,
Katherine, had four children, including three daughters. Katherine
and her two unnamed daughters were buried in late 1413 in the church
of St. Swithin, London.
Adam of Usk states that the one remaining daughter was still living in
1421, when he wrote his chronicle. So yes there was one Mortimer
daughter living in 1421 probably in London who was available to be
married to Sir John Harpenden. As far as I can tell, this is the only
available female member of the Mortimer-Ulster family that could have
married Sir John Harpenden. The lands of Edmund Mortimer had been
confiscated in 1404, and were never restored to the family. So
whoever the Mortimer girl was, she was a landless heiress.
Is there any other evidence that Sir John Harpenden's wife was the
daughter of Sir Edmund Mortimer? The answer is yes. In 1415 and
again in 1416 Sir John Harpenden was granted letters of protection, he
then being in France in the retinue of John Cornewall, Knt. [Annual
Rpt. of the Deputy Keeper, 44 (1883): 561, 589]. In 1422, while still
in France, he obtained a general pardon. In 1422 he had license to
cross over from France to England with the corpse of dame Eleanor de
Courtenay for interment.
Lady Courtenay was the daughter of Roger Mortimer, Knt., Earl of March
and Ulster, by Eleanor, daughter of Thomas de Holand, K.G., 2nd Earl
of Kent. As such, she would have been a first cousin of Sir John
Harpenden's proposed wife. Such a marital connection would explain
why Sir John Harpenden was selected to bring the body of Lady
Courtenay from France back to England.
As for Sir John Harpenden, we know that he was an adult in 1412 and
was not married to Joan [de la] Pole, Lady Cobham, until about 1428.
That leaves a period from 1412 to 1428 during which he could have
contracted his Mortimer marriage. We have only one Mortimer
granddaughter living in 1421 who could have married Sir John
Harpenden.
The chronology fits. The arms on Sir John Harpenden's tomb fits. His
connection to Lady Courtenay is explained.
In my first post in this thread, I mentioned that Sir John Harpenden/
Harpeden was buried in Westminster Abbey. A good account of Sir John
Harpenden's monument in Westminster Abbey can be found in the
following source:
Moule, Antiquities in Westminster Abbey (1825): 25–27.
This source may be viewed at the following weblink:
http://books.google.com/books?id=KPHfAAAAMAAJ&pg=PA25
Moule was aware of Sir John Harpenden's marriage to Joan [de la] Pole,
Moule, Antiquities in Westminster Abbey (1825): 25–27.
This source may be viewed at the following weblink:
http://books.google.com/books?id=KPHfAAAAMAAJ&pg=PA25
Lady Cobham, which he discussed at length. But he was unaware of Sir
John's marriage to Elizabeth Cobham. As such, he didn't know Sir John
Harpenden had any connection to Humphrey, Duke of Gloucester, whose
wife, Eleanor Cobham, was the sister of Elizabeth Cobham.
Moule states that the inscription was entirely rased from this tomb,
but that it had retained four shields of arms. He then went onto
describe the shields.
The first shield shows the Harpenden arms impaling quarterly first and
fourth Mortimer, and second and third Ulster.
The second shield bears the coat of Harpenden impaling Cobham of
Sterborough, which stands for Sir John Harpenden's last marriage to
Elizabeth Cobham.
The third shield is charged with Harpenden imaling Cobham of Cobham,
which stands for Sir John Harpenden's marriage to Joan [de la] Pole,
Lady Cobham.
The fourth shield bears Harpenden alone.
Elsewhere Archaeologia Cantiana 11 (1877): 99 states that Sir John
Harpenden was "connected by descent with the Cobhams of Sterborough,
and with the family of Mortimer, as appears by the arms on his tomb."
But this statement is erroneous, as the arms on Sir John Harpenden's
monument are impalements which stand for his marriages, not arms with
quarterings which would reflect his ancestry,
We can account for the two Harpenden-Cobham impalements which reflect
Sir John's two known marriages, but that leaves the Mortimer/Ulster
impalement to be explained.
In this case, the Mortimer/Ulster arms are quite distinctive. They
suggest that Sir John Harpenden likely married a daughter or
granddaughter of Sir Edmund de Mortimer, Knt., Earl of March and
Ulster [died 1381], by his wife, Philippe, daughter and heiress of
Lionel of Antwerp, K.G., Duke of Clarence, Earl of Ulster (son of King
Edward III of England).
Due to chronological concerns, it can be ruled out that Sir John
Harpenden was married to a daughter of Sir Edmund de Mortimer and his
wife, Philippe of Clarence. That leaves us with a Mortimer
granddaughter.
We know that Edmund and Philippe had two sons, Roger Mortimer, Knt.,
Earl of March and Ulster, Lord Mortimer, and Edmund Mortimer, Knt.
Did either of this sons have a daughter who could have married Sir
John Harpenden? The answer is yes.
The following information regarding the younger Edmund Mortimer, Knt.,
is taken from my new book, Royal Ancestry:
EDMUND MORTIMER, Knt., of Narberth, Pembrokshire, and St. Clear (in
Trayne), Carmarthenshire, 2nd son, born at Ludlow, Shropshire 10 Dec.
1376. He was a legatee in the 1380 will of his father. Edmund was
taken prisoner by Owain Glyn Dŵr, Prince of Wales at the Battle of
Bryn Glas fought at Melienydd, Radnorshire 12 June 1402. King Henry
IV of England refused permission to pay a ransom, in consequence of
which Edmund joined the rebellion of Owain Glyn Dŵr. He married about
30 Nov. 1402 KATHERINE FERCH OWAIN GLYN DŴR, daughter of Owain Glyn
Dŵr, Prince of Wales, by Margaret, daughter of David Hanmer, Knt.
They had one son, Lionel, and three daughters. In 1404 King Henry IV
granted the Welsh lands of Edmund Mortimer, then in rebellion, to
Thomas Carew, Knt. for life. SIR EDMUND MORTIMER died during the
Siege of Harlech Castle (or immediately thereafter) apparently in Jan.
1409. His widow, Katherine, and their children, together with her
mother, were taken to London and held in custody by the king.
Katherine and her two unnamed daughters were buried in late 1413 in
the church of St. Swithin, London.
References: Nichols, Coll. of All the Wills (1780): 104–117 (will of
Edmund de Mortimer, Earl of March and Ulster). Malone, Plays & Poems
of William Shakspeare 6 (1790): 153. Ellis, Original Letters Ill. of
English Hist. 2nd Ser. 1 (1827): 24–29 (letter of Sir Edmund
Mortimer). Devon, Issues of the Exchequer (1837): 321, 327. Wylie,
Hist. of England under Henry IV 1 (1884): 281–282, 344–348, 358.
Bradley, Owen Glyndwr & the Last Struggle for Welsh Independence
(1902). Usk, Chronicon Adæ de Usk 1377–1421 (1904): 246–247 (“Sir
Edmund [Mortimer] … is known by common report to have wedded the
daughter of the same Owen [Glyn Dŵr]; by whom he had a son, Lionel,
and three daughters, all of whom, except one daughter, along with
their mother are now dead.”). C.P.R. 1401–1405 (1905): 384. Oman
Hist. of England (1906): 176, 178, 213. C.P.R. 1405–1408 (1907):
139. Boswell-Stone, Shakespeare’s Holinshed: the Chronicle & the
Historical Plays Compared (1907): 131, 133–139, 257–258. Taylor,
English Hist. Lit. in the 14th Cent. (1987): 299 (Wigmore Chron. sub
1376: “Eodem anno IIII idus decembris X die eiusdem mensis … apud
lodelow natus est filius domino Edmundo de Mortymer comes marchie ex
philippa uxore sua nomine Edmundus.”). Davies, Revolt of Owain Glyn
Dŵr (1995). Leese, Blood Royal (1996): 143–149. Myers & Douglas,
English Hist. Docs. 1327–1485 (1996): 192 (letter of Edmund Mortimer
dated 1402).
We find above that Sir Edmund Mortimer [died 1409] and his wife,
Katherine, had four children, including three daughters. Katherine
and her two unnamed daughters were buried in late 1413 in the church
of St. Swithin, London.
Adam of Usk states that the one remaining daughter was still living in
1421, when he wrote his chronicle. So yes there was one Mortimer
daughter living in 1421 probably in London who was available to be
married to Sir John Harpenden. As far as I can tell, this is the only
available female member of the Mortimer-Ulster family that could have
married Sir John Harpenden. The lands of Edmund Mortimer had been
confiscated in 1404, and were never restored to the family. So
whoever the Mortimer girl was, she was a landless heiress.
Is there any other evidence that Sir John Harpenden's wife was the
daughter of Sir Edmund Mortimer? The answer is yes. In 1415 and
again in 1416 Sir John Harpenden was granted letters of protection, he
then being in France in the retinue of John Cornewall, Knt. [Annual
Rpt. of the Deputy Keeper, 44 (1883): 561, 589]. In 1422, while still
in France, he obtained a general pardon. In 1422 he had license to
cross over from France to England with the corpse of dame Eleanor de
Courtenay for interment.
Lady Courtenay was the daughter of Roger Mortimer, Knt., Earl of March
and Ulster, by Eleanor, daughter of Thomas de Holand, K.G., 2nd Earl
of Kent. As such, she would have been a first cousin of Sir John
Harpenden's proposed wife. Such a marital connection would explain
why Sir John Harpenden was selected to bring the body of Lady
Courtenay from France back to England.
As for Sir John Harpenden, we know that he was an adult in 1412 and
was not married to Joan [de la] Pole, Lady Cobham, until about 1428.
That leaves a period from 1412 to 1428 during which he could have
contracted his Mortimer marriage. We have only one Mortimer
granddaughter living in 1421 who could have married Sir John
Harpenden.
The chronology fits. The arms on Sir John Harpenden's tomb fits. His
connection to Lady Courtenay is explained.
Brad Verity
May 23, 2013, 8:33:13 PM5/23/13
to
On May 21, 10:24 am, Douglas Richardson <royalances...@msn.com> wrote:
> In 1415 and
> again in 1416 Sir John Harpenden was granted letters of protection, he
> then being in France in the retinue of John Cornewall, Knt. [Annual
> Rpt. of the Deputy Keeper, 44 (1883): 561, 589]. In 1422, while still
> in France, he obtained a general pardon. In 1422 he had license to
> cross over from France to England with the corpse of dame Eleanor de
> Courtenay for interment.
I'm really appreciative you uncovered this, Douglas. I'd always
> In 1415 and
> again in 1416 Sir John Harpenden was granted letters of protection, he
> then being in France in the retinue of John Cornewall, Knt. [Annual
> Rpt. of the Deputy Keeper, 44 (1883): 561, 589]. In 1422, while still
> in France, he obtained a general pardon. In 1422 he had license to
> cross over from France to England with the corpse of dame Eleanor de
> Courtenay for interment.
wondered what happened to Eleanor Mortimer Courtenay. She seemed so
important dynastically because it was the Mortimer line of succession
that led to the Wars of the Roses. Some sources (IIRC 'Royal Daughters
of England' (1910) by Henry Murray Lane is one) even state she became
a nun. CP was little help, and all I ever uncovered was that she was
alive in the 1419 IPM of the 3rd Earl of Devon (her father-in-law) and
dead in the 1422 IPM of the 4th Earl (her brother-in-law).
The fact that she was in France in early 1422 is interesting. The new
Queen, Katherine of Valois, was in England at the time, so Eleanor was
not in France in attendance upon her. Her husband Lord Courtenay had
died in 1418, so she was not there with him on campaign.
> Lady Courtenay was the daughter of Roger Mortimer, Knt., Earl of March
> and Ulster, by Eleanor, daughter of Thomas de Holand, K.G., 2nd Earl
> of Kent. As such, she would have been a first cousin of Sir John
> Harpenden's proposed wife. Such a marital connection would explain
> why Sir John Harpenden was selected to bring the body of Lady
> Courtenay from France back to England.
Harpenden, and died in France because he was on campaign there. She
would be referred to still as Lady Courtenay because it was a higher
status than that of Harpenden, a mere knight.
Great find!
Cheers, -------Brad
Douglas Richardson
May 24, 2013, 3:05:16 AM5/24/13
to
On May 23, 6:33 pm, Brad Verity <royaldesc...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> Or, Eleanor Mortimer Courtenay had been the wife of Sir John
> Harpenden, and died in France because he was on campaign there. She
> would be referred to still as Lady Courtenay because it was a higher
> status than that of Harpenden, a mere knight.
>
> Great find!
>
> Cheers, -------Brad
Brad ~
> Or, Eleanor Mortimer Courtenay had been the wife of Sir John
> Harpenden, and died in France because he was on campaign there. She
> would be referred to still as Lady Courtenay because it was a higher
> status than that of Harpenden, a mere knight.
>
> Great find!
>
> Cheers, -------Brad
Actually I like your solution above much better than the one I
proposed. It makes perfect sense. And, yes, you are correct:
Eleanor Mortimer would have been called Lady Courtenay in preference
to Harpeden if she was the wife of Harpeden at the time of her death.
I find that Sir Edward Courtenay died in France shortly before 9 June
1418; on 10 July 1418, Thomas, Earl of Salisbury, was appointed Keeper
of New Forest in his place [see Annual Report of the Deputy Keeper 41
(1880): 694, 711, 715, 717–718, 720]. It is entirely possible that
Sir Edward Courtenay had his wife, Eleanor, with him in France at the
time of his death. Sir John Harpeden was certainly in France in 1418.
Below is an item from Google snippet view which shows that Courtenay
arms occur impaled with arms of March [i.e., Mortimer] and Ulster
[i.e., Burgh] in an unnamed church in England. The author believes
this is a reference to "Edward Lord Courtenay" who married Eleanor
Mortimer, which is doubtless correct.
Courtney Chronicle - Volumes 9-11 - Page 118
1991
"And in the Church, next in place, I found the Arms of March and
Ulster impaled also with Courtenay 's, which made me ... before his
father« and it is highly probable, that this was that Edward Lord
Courtenay that married Eleanor Mortimer." END OF QUOTE.
As for Sir John Harpeden, here are some additional particulars of his
life. I find that he was closely associated in his early career with
John Cornwall, Knt., afterwards Lord Fanhope, whose wife, Elizabeth,
was the sister of King Henry IV. He and Cornwall fought together at
the Battle of Agincourt in 1415. In March 1418 Sir John Harpeden was
granted a castle in Normandy, but by Sept. 1420, he was considered a
rebel, and his lands were re-granted to John, Lord Gray [afterwards
Count of Tancarville]. In 1422 he was granted a pardon in France and
was immediately granted permission to bring the body of Lady Eleanor
de Courtenay from France back to England for interment.
I can't determine why Sir John Harpeden was considered a rebel. I
suppose his lands might have been forfeited for his having married a
widow in the king's gift without first having the king's permission.
But that's just a guess.
Be that as it may, I agree with you that it makes sense that Sir John
Harpeden's wife was Eleanor Mortimer, widow of Sir Edward Courtenay.
That Sir John Harpeden had a marriage to a Mortimer female of this
family is confirmed by the arms on his tomb at Westminster Abbey.
I should add that the name Harpeden sometimes occurs as Harpeden, and
sometimes as Harpenden. Either spelling seems to have been acceptable
in this time period.
Best always, Douglas Richardson, Salt Lake City, Utah
+ + + + + + + + + +
SIR JOHN HARPEDEN (or HARPENDEN)
In 1415 and again in 1416 he was granted letters of protection, he
then being in France in the retinue of John Cornwall, Knt. He and
John Cornwall fought at the Battle of Agincourt in 1415. In July 1417
he and Cornwall contracted to raise 53 lances and 121 archers for the
army being mustered for King Henry V’s expedition to France. In March
1418 he was granted the Castle and lordship of Chanteloup and the
manors of Appily and Créances within the comtés of Coutances and
Avranches in Normandy; in Sept. 1420, he then being a rebel, these
lands were re-granted to John, Lord Gray. In 1422 he obtained a
Douglas Richardson
Aug 24, 2013, 12:02:36 PM8/24/13
to
Dear Newsgroup ~
The following newly discovered Common Pleas record relates to Sir John Harpeden (or Harpenden), of Harpsden, Oxfordshire, who died in 1438. In this record, we find him with his 2nd wife, Joan [de la] Pole, Lady Cobham.
In 1430 John Harpeden, Knt. and his wife, Joan, alias Joan, Lady Cobham, sued Roger Thomas, of Ascot, Oxfordshire, husbandman in the Court of Common Pleas regarding a debt.
Reference: Court of Common Pleas, CP40/678, rot. 877d (available at http://aalt.law.uh.edu/AALT1/H6/CP40no678/bCP40no678dorses/IMG_0877.htm).
The following newly discovered Common Pleas record relates to Sir John Harpeden (or Harpenden), of Harpsden, Oxfordshire, who died in 1438. In this record, we find him with his 2nd wife, Joan [de la] Pole, Lady Cobham.
In 1430 John Harpeden, Knt. and his wife, Joan, alias Joan, Lady Cobham, sued Roger Thomas, of Ascot, Oxfordshire, husbandman in the Court of Common Pleas regarding a debt.
Reference: Court of Common Pleas, CP40/678, rot. 877d (available at http://aalt.law.uh.edu/AALT1/H6/CP40no678/bCP40no678dorses/IMG_0877.htm).
Monica Kanellis
Aug 24, 2013, 8:16:32 PM8/24/13
to Douglas Richardson, GenMedieval
Was she the Joan who married 5 times and whose previous husband was roasted
alive?
MK
On Sat, Aug 24, 2013 at 12:02 PM, Douglas Richardson
<royala...@msn.com>wrote:
> -------------------------------
> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to
> GEN-MEDIEV...@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the
> quotes in the subject and the body of the message
>
alive?
MK
On Sat, Aug 24, 2013 at 12:02 PM, Douglas Richardson
<royala...@msn.com>wrote:
> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to
> GEN-MEDIEV...@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the
> quotes in the subject and the body of the message
>
Douglas Richardson
Sep 14, 2013, 3:18:32 PM9/14/13
to
On Saturday, August 24, 2013 6:16:32 PM UTC-6, Monica Kanellis wrote:
> Was she the Joan who married 5 times and whose previous husband was roasted
>
> alive?
>
>
>
> MK
Yes indeed.
> Was she the Joan who married 5 times and whose previous husband was roasted
>
> alive?
>
>
>
> MK
DR
Douglas Richardson
Sep 14, 2013, 3:39:22 PM9/14/13
to
Dear Newsgroup ~
The Common Pleas lawsuit below relates to Sir John Harpeden (or Harpenden), of Harpsden, Oxfordshire [died 1438], who married (1st) Eleanor Mortimer, Lady Courtenay [died 1422] [great-aunt of King Edward IV of England]; (2nd) Joan [de la] Pole, Lady Cobham [died 1434]; and (3rd) Elizabeth Cobham [died 1453].
In 1417 Thomas Secheford, Citizen and mercer of London, sued John Harpinden, of Harpinden in county Oxford knight in the Court of Common Pleas regarding a debt [Reference: Court of Common Pleas, CP40/624, rot. 81f].
The above record may be viewed at the following weblink:
http://aalt.law.uh.edu/H5/CP40no624/aCP40no624fronts/IMG_0081.htm
The Common Pleas lawsuit below relates to Sir John Harpeden (or Harpenden), of Harpsden, Oxfordshire [died 1438], who married (1st) Eleanor Mortimer, Lady Courtenay [died 1422] [great-aunt of King Edward IV of England]; (2nd) Joan [de la] Pole, Lady Cobham [died 1434]; and (3rd) Elizabeth Cobham [died 1453].
In 1417 Thomas Secheford, Citizen and mercer of London, sued John Harpinden, of Harpinden in county Oxford knight in the Court of Common Pleas regarding a debt [Reference: Court of Common Pleas, CP40/624, rot. 81f].
The above record may be viewed at the following weblink:
http://aalt.law.uh.edu/H5/CP40no624/aCP40no624fronts/IMG_0081.htm
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