Le Strange of Walton D'Eiville: Maureward, Oddingseles connections?

[Andrew Lancaster]

According to his History of Parliament biography, Sir Thomas Maureward (c.1358-1424) married "bef. 1397, Elizabeth, da. of Sir John Oddingseles (d.1380) of Long Itchingdon, Warws. wid. of John, s. of Sir John Strange of Walton Deyville, Warws." This Sir John seems easy to identify but had another wife, Mabel, who does not appear to have remarried. Perhaps whatever has happened here is a lead to the ancestry of Mabel.

Specifically HOP says:

"In keeping with his standing as a landowner of substance, Maureward married into a prominent Warwickshire family (that of Oddingseles), no doubt in the expectation that his bride would bring him the properties at Tysoe, Pillerton and Loxley, Warwickshire, Alkerton and Wroxton, Oxfordshire, and ‘Schevyndon’, Gloucestershire, which had been settled on her as jointure in 1376-7 on the occasion of her earlier marriage to a member of a collateral branch of the Stranges of Knockin. However, the Maurewards’ tenure of these Strange estates was to be disputed in 1397, and it is unclear whether they were able to retain them for the rest of Elizabeth’s life."

URL: http://www.historyofparliamentonline.org/volume/1386-1421/member/maureward-sir-thomas-1358-1424

There does not appear to be any source given which confirms this, and all online pedigrees mentioning this marriage seem to be derived from this biography. I do not find any record for a marriage settlement in 1376, but I do find (in the Close Rolls, and in Feet of Fines) that it was in 1376 that John le Strange of Walton D'Eiville, son of John, gave over some of these same properties to his relative Roger Lestraunge, who had been contesting them since 1367, at least according to Cecil L'Estrange Ewen (1946) "Observations on the Le Stranges".

In 1367 John was, according to L'Estrange Ewen, abroad and already married to Mabel, who survived and was still a widow in 1402 long after Thomas Maureward had supposedly married his widow named Elizabeth. [See her in https://www.british-history.ac.uk/inquis-post-mortem/vol18/pp20-35]

Documents which might help:
1. I am not sure which documents L'Estrange Ewen used concerning the events of 1367, where John Lestrange was apparently overseas, already married.
2. What record of marriage might exist in 1376? I otherwise suspect there is some kind of misunderstanding in VCH.

[Andrew Lancaster]

I should have added...

3. It would also help to know what documents describe the dispute in 1397. I have not yet traced these either.

4. It might be pointed out that the 1376 records do not necessarily show a transfer of possession to Roger Lestrange, who may in fact be an intermediary in, for example, a marriage. This is correct although it is suggested by VCH. Probably it is suggested because a transfer to him did occur in 1373, which may not be known to everyone who is interested in this family. It explains to some extent how the two Lestrange families ended up with certain possessions. See https://www.british-history.ac.uk/cal-close-rolls/edw3/vol13/pp594-605

(L'Estrange Ewen obviously saw something earlier than 1373 though.)

[Andrew Lancaster]

For the sake of anyone looking at these same questions in the future I'll at least add my notes, although I have not worked this out.

1350. For anyone interested it seems that the first John Lestraunge of Walton d'Eiville, husband of Ida, may have died before 1350, when Ida appeared representing family interests. See http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C9440253

1367. A reference to John Le Straunge "of Walton" going overseas, or at least being allowed to assign attorneys, can be found in the Patent rolls for that year. No mention of a wife yet, neither a Mabel nor an Elizabeth, at least in the calendar. https://hdl.handle.net/2027/mdp.39015031081105?urlappend=%3Bseq=17

1376. The references in HOP and BHOL are both to the calendars of the Close Rolls. These were both done in Itchington, the manor of the Oddingseles, which makes the HOP explanation very believable, but surely the writer must have looked at some other records not being cited? The calendars do not mention any contracts being attached concerning marriages. The grants are superficially from one branch of Lestranges to another, and the two branches had done some swaps in the past.

"Writing of John Lestraunge lord of Walton, being a letter of attorney appointing John Huwet and Richard Warner of Walton to deliver to Roger Lestraunge, Philip vicar of Wellesborne and William de Offechirche clerk seisin of all the lands, rents, services and reversions which he the said John Lestraunge had in Alcrynton, Balscote and Wroxton co. Oxford, Shenyndon co. Gloucester, Tysho, Pylardynton and Lockesleye co. Warrewyk, Totebache, Bradele, Evesham and Goldecote co. Worcester, according to his charter to them made. Dated Long Ichynton co. Warrewyk, Thursday after St. Bartholomew 50 Edward III.
Memorandum of acknowledgment, 8 November."

"Charter of John Lestraunge lord of Walton, giving to Roger Lestraunge, Philip vicar of Wellesburne and William de Ofchurch clerk, their heirs and assigns, all the lands, rents, services and reversions which he had in Alcrinton, Balscote and Wroxston co. Oxford, Shemyndon co. Gloucester, Tysho, Pilardynton and Lokesleye co. Warrewyk, Totebache, Bradele, Evesham and Goldecote co. Worcester. Witnesses: Sir John Oddyngseles knight, Sir John Verdoun knight, Richard Boteler, William Palmer, John Baylli of Southam. Dated Long Ichinton co. Warrewyk, Thursday after St. Bartholomew 50 Edward III.
Memorandum of acknowledgment, 18 October."

Another record comes from the Feet of Fines. http://www.medievalgenealogy.org.uk/fines/abstracts/CP_25_1_288_50.shtml
CP 25/1/288/50, number 796.
Date: One week from St Martin, 50 Edward III [18 November 1376].
Parties: Roger Lestrange, Philip, the vicar of the church of Wellesburne, and William Offechurch', clerk, querents, and John Lestrange of Walton' and Mabel, his wife, deforciants.
Property: 8 messuages, 4 tofts, 12 virgates of land, 6 acres of meadow and 6 shillings and 8 pence of rent in Alcrynton', Balscote and Wroxton' in the county of Oxford and 1 messuage, 4 virgates of land and 4 acres of meadow in Shenyndon' in the county of Gloucester and 2 messuages, 5 tofts, 9 virgates of land and 14 acres of meadow in Euesham, Totebache, Bradle and Goldcote in the county of Worcester.
Action: Plea of covenant.
Agreement: John and Mabel have acknowledged the tenements to be the right of Philip, and have remised and quitclaimed them from themselves and the heirs of John to Roger, Philip and William and the heirs of Philip for ever.
For this: Roger, Philip and William have given them 200 marks of silver.

As mentioned already, even if a marriage was being arranged it does not seem to make sense that it would be the marriage of John Lestrange of Walton, who was married already and whose widow survived him.

1397. What happened in 1397? I can find nothing explaining the HOP comment "However, the Maurewards’ tenure of these Strange estates was to be disputed in 1397, and it is unclear whether they were able to retain them for the rest of Elizabeth’s life." The footnotes are in awkward blocks, and to secondary sources. The only one I can't check is Farnham's Leicestershire Village Notes II.75. Does anyone have access to that?

The Lestranges of D'Eiville were a junior branch of the main Knockin line, who eventually "daughtered out" but the two heiresses married into the better known junior line, the one in Hunstanton, Norfolk. For this reason they will have many modern descendants, although they are not well-known. The line goes:
1. John https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Strange-850
2. John (son) https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Strange-852
3. Alan (son) who died overseas with Henry V. https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Strange-853
4. Thomas (brother) https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Strange-854

This Thomas's son Thomas died at Bosworth, it seems, and it was his daughters who married into the Hunstanton family.

[Andrew Lancaster]

An awkward side issue, unless I am missing something. Again anyone interested in the Lestranges of Walton D'Eyville may be interested:

It seems that the first Sir Thomas (brother and heir of Sir Alan) has a memorial in Walton clearly stating that he died 3 May 1426, giving both an AD year and a regnal year, and clearly describing him as a late constable in Ireland. A full transcription appears in VCH, but also other sources.

However the HOP and other histories have this same Thomas continuing to take commissions in England and Ireland until 1436, and that his wife lived into the 1480s. (Indeed, VCH does the same, apparently not noticing the problem with the memorial.)

It appears there was a sequence of 3 Thomases, not 2?

[Andrew Lancaster]

I found a source, perhaps the one L'Estrange Ewen used, for John Lestraunge already being married to Mabel already in 1367. It is in Wrottesley's Pedigrees from the Plea Rolls. https://hdl.handle.net/2027/uc2.ark:/13960/t6542rp7k?urlappend=%3Bseq=104

This is one of the documents where he disputes his rights of Myddle with the senior line. As L'Estrange Ewen pointed out, this same year, he was going overseas.

[Andrew Lancaster]

Dear List

I can home in on one simple request/question. Does anyone have access to Farnham? The reference HOP mentions is "Leics. Village Notes, ii. 75"

I would appreciate it very much if anyone could have a peak to see if this page mentions anything about Oddingseles of Itchington, Lestraunge of Walton, or Maureward.

Best Regards
Andrew

[Andrew Lancaster]

Can anyone look up Farnham "Leics. Village Notes, ii. 75" ?