PHILIP BASSET

[Richard Borthwick]

Kay Allen sought evidence for the claims made by Douglas Richardson
regarding the family of Alan Basset's wife, Aline. Here are some bits and
pieces I have been able to glean from the materials I have available. This
may focus on what is missing (for me at least) by way of authority.

Philip Gay, presumably the father-in-law of Alan Basset, of Wycombe, is
called Philip de Gal in CP IX:76 and XII/1:608. CP XIV has nothing to say
on this under Montagu or Talbot. Round does not name Alan Basset's wife
[DNB I:1296].

Stephen Gay married before 1155 Aline possibly the daughter of Walter
Pipard (d.<1130) "a minor Wiltshire baron" [CP X:526 note (c), App.G p.95
note (b)]. CP thinks Painter too readily took as fact that Walter was
Aline's father [CP X: App.G, p.95 and note (a); S Painter *William Marshal,
knight-errant, baron, and regent of England* (John Hopkins University
Press, 1933), p.41]. Aline was separated (by divorce or annulment) from
John the Marshal by about 1141 [CP X: App.G, p.95].

David Crouch's book on William Marshal may have more material. I will have
a look at it.

I consulted VCH Wilts but our library does not have the crucial vol.2 which
evidently gives details of the relevant fee successions. I have no evidence
for the affiliation of Philip Gay or for the name of his wife or for the
identification of Philip de Gal and Philip Gay. The transmission of the
name 'Aline' looks promising as do the little I have gotten so far from
VCH. I look forward to seeing the clinching evidence.

Richard Borthwick

[Adrian Channing]

I have not been following this thread, but does the following help - from
the Bradenstoke Cartulary:

Littlecott
26 [1229 x 1232] 2 Gift in alms by Alan Basset, at the instance of Aline
de
Gay his wife, of all the land held by Ethelwin in Littlecott, together with
Ethelwin and all his family. To be held of Alan and his heirs, free of all
but
royal service and a rent of 5s. payable annually to the house of [Monkton]
Farleigh at the feast of St. Mary in Mar. and at Michaelmas. Warranty.
Seals of Alan and Aline. Witnesses: Sir Wal. abbot of Stanley, Gilb.
Basset.

Adrian (Surrey, UK) ACha...@CompuServe.Com

Richard Borthwick wrote

-

[P. Freeman]

In article <3.0.1.32.1999062...@cyllene.uwa.edu.au>,
rg...@cyllene.uwa.edu.au (Richard Borthwick) wrote:

<snip>

>Stephen Gay married before 1155 Aline possibly the daughter of Walter
>Pipard (d.<1130) "a minor Wiltshire baron" [CP X:526 note (c), App.G p.95
>note (b)]. CP thinks Painter too readily took as fact that Walter was
>Aline's father [CP X: App.G, p.95 and note (a); S Painter *William Marshal,
>knight-errant, baron, and regent of England* (John Hopkins University
>Press, 1933), p.41]. Aline was separated (by divorce or annulment) from
>John the Marshal by about 1141 [CP X: App.G, p.95].
>
>David Crouch's book on William Marshal may have more material. I will have
>a look at it.

By coincidence, I happen to have Crouch's book with me.
The index playfully lists characters under their first name, so
there is no entry for "Gay"; but he is there, under "Stephen".

Aline (here "Adeline") is referred to on p.15 :
(first wife of John Marshal, William Marshal's father;
John divorced her on the grounds of a relationship
within the prohibited degree of kinship in order to
marry Sybil, sister of Patrick (of?) Salisbury. Adelina
went on to be "honourably remarried to an obscure character,
by name Stephen Gay.")

"Her identity is not fully established.Painter suggests
that she was the heiress of the Wiltshire baron, Walter
Pipard, for the control of whose marriage John was paying
the king in 1130, but that cannot be assumed automatically,
even though one of her sons carries the name of the putative
father. For her remarriage see 'Regesta Regum Anglo-Normannorum
III 1135-1154' (ed. H.A. Cronne & R.H.C. Davis, OUP 1969) no.339."

Alan Bassett is mentioned in passing on pp. 163 & 195. Crouch mentions
his son Thomas as one of William Marshal's proteges, but nothing more.

Peter Freeman
University of Leeds

[Dcrdcr4]

Dear Adrian and Richard:

The name of Philip de Gay's wife, Cecily/Sedzilia, comes from a court record
which record dates about 1185. I don't have the specific citation for this
record in front of me.

As for Philip de Gay's parentage being Stephen de Gay and Aline Pipard, this is
based on the descent of Aline's inheritance in Wiltshire which passed from
Walter Pipard (father of Aline) to Aline Pipard (wife of John le Marshal and
Stephen de Gay), then to Philip de Gay, then to Philip de Gay's two daughters,
Aline (Basset) and Cecily. Although Complete Peerage expresses some
reservations, I am confident that Walter Pipard was the father of John le
Marshal's first wife, Aline, as the Pipe Rolls showed he owed money for having
the lands and heir of Walter Pipard. .
William Marshall, Earl of Pembroke, was the son of John le Marshall's second
wife, Sibyl. As such, William Marshall and Philip de Gay would have been
step-siblings of a sort. John le Marshal divorced Aline Pipard to marry
Sibyl.

I have no particulars on Stephen de Gay and would appreciate any information
which anyone might be able to share regarding him.

My information on the Gay family is based on original research on my part.
Eventually I hope to publish an article on the matter. Best always, Douglas
Richardson