Value of Thalers in 1840

[Greg Rehme]

My greatgrandfather came to America about 1840 with 450 thalers. Can anyone
tell me what they were worth in 1840 US Dollars? Was this considered a
substantial amount of money in Hesse in 1840?

Thanks for reading.
Greg Rehme

[dnnrstg428]

You'd be amazed what I found here that will answer you question:
http://holgermetzger.de/pix/bart.jpg

""Greg Rehme"" <greg...@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:410-220054...@mindspring.com...

[Cristoir]

Greg,

I can help with this question for an unusual reason. My previous
employer was with an academic library that began operations in 1850. One
of the first collections the institution purchased was the personal
library of a famed academic. The collection sold for 3,200 Thalers,
which was equivalent at the time to $2,300 US. You can do the math.
$2,300 was considered a lot of money then, so much so that they had to
scurry to find funders willing to lend so vast a sum.

So, 450 Thalers would be worth about $325 US (19th century). A goodly
sum, it probably was the yearly middle class salary (in contemporary
terms maybe $30,000 -- enough to get oneself started right, but not
enough to live on for the rest of one's life).

Hope this helps.

Cris...@rochester.rr.com

[Bernd Hoch]

Greg Rehme schrieb:

Yes absolutely 450 thalers was substantial amount of money
(by the way : one hessen thaler from 1837 costs 50,00 Euros
today - if u by the coin)

[Roy Johnson]

It's pretty complicated. Germany was not a country in 1840 and different
sections used different currencies with different values. But it appears to
me 450 Thalers would be a substantial amount in any currency, since the
following indicates annual income for a laborer was abou 30 Thalers at one
point:

Ernest Thode schrieb:
>
>>
> A "Taler" is a major unit of money, a "dollar." Indeed, the word "dollar"
is
> cognate with the German word "Taler." (It had different relative values
in
> different time periods.)

The Taler was official coin money in Germany til 1908. The weight was
about 37 grain compared to the 25,8 grain of the "old" silver dollar.
Thus depending on the time a sum of 800 Taler may have been a fortune.
The annual compensation for a worker was about 30 Taler in 1875.

mfg
BJK

Also, Germany was not a unified country in 1770s and it would depend on
which German state. The following lengthy discussion which I also saved
shows the complexity of the subject:

Like everything in the history of "Germany" you can't answer this question
with one sentence. And like everything it depends on the time and the region
it came from.
In 1566 the "Reichtaler" was installed as an uniform currency unit for trade
in the areas of "Kreuzer" and "Groschen" in the old German Empire. It was a
silver coin. In each state it was divided in other or similar smaller coins.
This coin - the "Reichstaler" or "Reichsspeziestaler" - disappeared until
around 1700. In none of the German states there was a "state currency" until
the 18. century
In 1750 Prussia started a reform of their currency and created a new
"Reichstaler"; in use until 1821 but not with the meaning that each
inhabitant of Prussia had to use the same coins.
Three years later Austria and Bavaria followed with their reform. They
agreed on the "Konventionsfuss" and with this tried to install a new
Speziestaler the "Konventionstaler". But there were difficulties, which
prevented currency unification in the southern states. Only at the end of
the 7 years war -around 1761 - the "Rheinische Gulden" became a leading
currency.
So Germany was divided in 2 regions with a guide currency. Only Hamburg,
Bremen and Luebeck had their own "historical" currency also in these times.
During the area of Napoleon there were no changes in northern Germany but in
the southern part the "Rheinische Gulden" was replaced around 1792 by the
"Kronentaler" from Netherlands. The Kronentaler was in use until 1830-1840.
In 1821 Prussia started a new currency reform along with other reforms to
rebuild the state after the defeat of Napoleon. There were no longer
internal custom frontiers and Prussia became one economic area. The new
official currency for Prussia was: one "Preussischer Taler" = 30
"Silbergroschen", 1 "Silbergroschen" = 12 "Pfennige".
In 1833 the "Deutsche Zollverein" was founded. The first members were the
southern German states, without Austria. They started the "Rheinische
Rechnungsgulden" as an leading currency: 1 "Rechnungsgulden" = 60 "Kreuzer",
1 Kreuzer = ??? (different in each state).
In northern Germany the "Preussische Taler" became more and more important.
In 1838 the "Dresdener Muenzkonvention" fixed: 2 "(Preussische) Taler"
(northern Germany) = 3,5 "Gulden" (southern Germany)
Taler and Gulden were always a silver currency.
After the German Empire was founded in 1871 a law about one currency passed
the Reichstag on 4. Dec. 1871. It was a gold currency called "Mark". But the
old silver "Taler" and "Doppeltaler" stayed in use also. 1 Taler = 3 Mark
(gold) or 1 Doppeltaler = 6 Mark (gold).
An Imperial order from 22. Sept.1875 stated that with 1. Jan. 1876 the
German currency was: 1 Mark = 100 Pfennige".
Other coins or currency units in the German states were: Albus, Batzen,
Pfennig, Denar, Dukat, Floren, Gulden, Gutergroschen, Groschen, Gröschel,
Groten, Gosle, Heller, Kaisergroschen, Konventionstaler, Mariengulden,
Mariengroschen, Mark, Matthier, Neugroschen, preuss. Taler, Reichsgroschen,
Reichstaler, Silbergroschen, Stueber (Stuever), Schwaar, Schilling, Taler,
Weisspfennig, Weissgroschen, Witte, Kreuzer and Rechnungstaler.

Axel.

Roy Johnson
Researching Schnake/Schnacke of Minden, Westfalen andworldwide
SchnakeNet home page http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~schnake

Here is information that I have gleaned from the Internet.

""Greg Rehme"" <greg...@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:410-220054...@mindspring.com...

[Greg Rehme]

Thanks to all who helped me with my question about the value of a Thaler.
Regards and thanks again
Greg Rehme

[Ray]

I would like to second Greg's thanks.
My ancestors sold 1,100 morgans in the early 1800s near Prenzlau,
Brandenberg for 40,000 Thalers. I have always wondered about the amount.

""Greg Rehme"" <greg...@mindspring.com> wrote in message

news:410-2200551...@mindspring.com...

[victorg...@gmail.com]

After the Prussian victory over Austria in 1866, Prussia rewarded Bismarck with a gift of 40,000 thaler, according to Fritz Stern's book "Gold and Iron". That would be the equivalent of just over 10 million USD today.

[to.sveta...@gmail.com]

Dear All, and especially Victor,
Thank you for your replies here.

Victor's reply from March 27, 2019, helped me as well.

I come from Klaipeda (Memel before 1923). In 1862 a very wealthy Memel merchant-filantropist Julius Ludwig Wiener died and left most of his money to Memel town - namely 313 789 Prussian thalers.

So, using numbers in Victor's reply, in today's terms it would be equivalent to approx. 69 840 000 EUR. Wow!