Maanafaay
Burhaan Warsame
Is it accurate to say that 'Maanafaay', the book by Maxamed Daahir Afrax,
was the first novel published in the Somali language? If not, can we
ascertain which novel should be graced with that honour?
Also, what were some of the memorable novels you read in the mother
tangue? Who wrote them? Please comment on the production and content
quality of those books (i.e. the physical "look" of the book -including
print, binding, cover design, etc.- and the storyline, its effectiveness)
Thanks in advance..
---
bwarsame
Burhaan Warsame
Ahmed Madar
In article <5el87q$5...@morgoth.sfu.ca>, bwar...@sfu.ca says...
Waxaan filayaa in ay jiraan buugaag badan oo lagu qorey afsomali,
laakiin buugii iigu horeeyey ee aan afsomali ku akhriyey wuxuu ahaa
"Ayaan daran" runahaantii qofkii qorey garan maayo laakiin wuxuu
ahaa buug aad iyo aad u qiime badan oo weliba ku reebey nolosheyda raad
aan la ilaawin karin. Wuxuu ku saabsanaa inan' yar oo miyi ka timi
dabadeed xamar tagtey oo halkaa kala kulantey mashhaakil iyo
dhibaatooyin fra badan.
Buuggii labaad ee aan akhriyey waxaa la yidhaahdaa "Nin miyi iyo
markab" waxaanuu ahaa buug layaab badan oo weliba muujinaya in qofka
binu'aadamka ahi haddi uu ficil la yimaado ay wax kastaa suurogal
tahey.
Buugu wuxuu ku saabsanaa nin reer miyi ah oo dabadeed magaalo iminaya
ka dibna Cadan u dhoofaya oo halkaa ka bilaabaya noloshiisa waxaana
buugga qorey ninkaa isaga ah. Waxa ugu yaabka badani waxey aheyd markii
uu markab Cadan ka iibsadey dabadeed ay lacagi ka dhinaatey, dabadeed
ku noqdey Somaliya, dabadeed lagula taliyey inuu miyi tago si
reermiyigu ay xoolo ugu ururiyaan. Waxayaabihii qabsadey ninkaa waxa ka
mid ahaa iney ku adkaatey inuu ka dhaadhiciyo odayaashii reer miyiga
ahaa waxa uu yahey markab; qaar ka mid ahi waxey yidhaahdeen lacagta
waxbaanu ka bixineynaa haddii bahalkan aad sheegeysaa uu waqtiga
abaaraha uu biyo noo dhaaminayo, mida kale waxan aad ka hadleyso ee aad
leedahey badda soo dhaafi maayo waa maxey YAAB!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Runahaantii buugaa waxaa u maleynayaa in laga helayo carigga ingriiska,
waxaanaan kula talin qofkii raba inuu wax ka yara bedelo jawigan aynu
soo galey ee ina wareeriyey ha akhriyo buuggaa.
>bwarsame
Mohamed Abdi
ahmed...@basalmed.uio.no (Ahmed Madar) wrote:
Waxaan xassuustaa markii ugu horeysey (80?) noovelkaasi Maanafaay
socotay ee jaraai'dka habka "installments" loogu soo qorayaye iyo
siduu caanka u ahaa iyo xiisaha aadka u fara badan ee loo qabey. Ma
aha dadka dugsiyada dhigta uun ee dad-weynaha caadiga ah ayaa xataa u
badna dadka sheekeda si xiiso badan maalin kasta u sugayey.
Anigu ma arag noovelkaas oo buug laga dhigey nasiibna uma yeelan
inaan akhriyo, hase yeeshe waxaan hubaa kii ugu horeeyey ee afka
soomaaliga ku soo baxa inuunan ahyn. Waxa ka horeeyey "aqoon daro
waa u nacyb jacyl"
Nabadaeey
M. Abdi
Burhaan Warsame
Mohamed Abdi (moh...@atl.mindspring.com) wrote:
: Waxaan xassuustaa markii ugu horeysey (80?) noovelkaasi Maanafaay
Waxaan u malaynayaa in 70s ay ahayd. Haddii 80s ay ahayd, ilama aha in
Maanafaay lagu dari karo buugaggii ugu horeeyay ee af-Soomaaliga lagu
daabacay. Sanado ayaa u dhaxaysay markii Maanafaay jaraa'idka lagu
taxay iyo markii buug ahaan loo daabacay (after the installments).
: socotay ee jaraai'dka habka "installments" loogu soo qorayaye iyo
: siduu caanka u ahaa iyo xiisaha aadka u fara badan ee loo qabey. Ma
: aha dadka dugsiyada dhigta uun ee dad-weynaha caadiga ah ayaa xataa u
: badna dadka sheekeda si xiiso badan maalin kasta u sugayey.
Waxaan maqlay in waqtigaas dadku intooda badani ay jaraa'idka u gadan
jireen kaliya si ay sheekadaas ula socdaan, oo saf dheer loo gali jiray.
Does that mean that the printed word has already impacted our culture in a
big way, that we could no longer be considered truly oral.
: Anigu ma arag noovelkaas oo buug laga dhigey nasiibna uma yeelan
: inaan akhriyo, hase yeeshe waxaan hubaa kii ugu horeeyey ee afka
: soomaaliga ku soo baxa inuunan ahyn. Waxa ka horeeyey "aqoon daro
: waa u nacyb jacyl"
Goormaa la daabacay Aqoon Darro Waa u Nacab Jacayl?
Lama sugi karo waqtiyada waayo ma hayno the actual printing records,
laakiin waxaan dhihi karnaa novelkii ugu horeeyay waxaa la daabacay
xawaaliga 1972 (markii afka la qoray). Sababta aan sidaa u leeyahayna waa
iyadoo aan u malaynayo in ay jireen sheekooyin xiiso leh oo aan qornayn,
markii qoraalka afka-hooyo la sugayna waxaan qiyaasayaa in sheekooyinkaas
(jiray laakiin aan qornayn) madbacadda loola orday.
Just my estimation, I could be wrong.
---
bwarsame
Burhaan Warsame
Axmed, waad ku mahadsantahay sidaad noola qaybsatay dareenkaada ku saabsan
buugaagtaas (Ayaan Daran, Nin Miyi & Markab). Waxaad tiri Nin Miyi.. waxaa
qoray ninkay sheekada ku dhacday, ma xasuusataa magaciisa?
Labada buug, Ayaan Daran uun baan akhriyay, waana la dhacay. Waxaan
xasuustaa dad oran jiray buuggaas waxuu ku salaysan yahay sheeko dhab ah.
Waxayba magacaabi jireen gabadha iyo Generalka ay aakhirka is
baranayaan (sheekada si fiican uma wada xasuusto).
Hadday arintaasi run tahay, labada buugba waa qisooyin dhacay.
Are 'true stories' a pattern of the Somali novel?
---
bwarsame
Mohamed Abdi
bwar...@sfu.ca (Burhaan Warsame) wrote:
Dear Burhaan,
>Waxaan maqlay in waqtigaas dadku intooda badani ay jaraa'idka u gadan
>jireen kaliya si ay sheekadaas ula socdaan, oo saf dheer loo gali jiray.
>Does that mean that the printed word has already impacted our culture in a
>big way, that we could no longer be considered truly oral.
I wish it had became a sweeping pop(ular) culture. I really don't know
why we haven't seen more novels. Probably it is that those who write
those novels could barely read and write themselves and without the
involvement of the Somali intelectuals it became a plane without
a pilot.
>Goormaa la daabacay Aqoon Darro Waa u Nacab Jacayl?
>Lama sugi karo waqtiyada waayo ma hayno the actual printing records,
>laakiin waxaan dhihi karnaa novelkii ugu horeeyay waxaa la daabacay
>xawaaliga 1972 (markii afka la qoray). Sababta aan sidaa u leeyahayna waa
>iyadoo aan u malaynayo in ay jireen sheekooyin xiiso leh oo aan qornayn,
>markii qoraalka afka-hooyo la sugayna waxaan qiyaasayaa in sheekooyinkaas
>(jiray laakiin aan qornayn) madbacadda loola orday.
>Just my estimation, I could be wrong.
I hope others who have this book or know the subject would share their
opinions with us.
Mohamed Abdi
>---
>bwarsame
Abdullahi Abukar
bwar...@sfu.ca (Burhaan Warsame) wrote:
: Is it accurate to say that 'Maanafaay', the book by Maxamed Daahir Afrax,
: was the first novel published in the Somali language? If not, can we
: ascertain which novel should be graced with that honour?
Dear Burhaan,
I do not think Maanafaay was the first in Somali novel. The first Somali
novel was printed early in the seventies, and was "Aqoondarro Waa U Nacab
Jacayl" by AHN Farah M.J. Cawl. Insha Allah, I will verify the exact date
of the first edition very soon.
: Also, what were some of the memorable novels you read in the mother
: tangue? Who wrote them? Please comment on the production and content
: quality of those books (i.e. the physical "look" of the book -including
: print, binding, cover design, etc.- and the storyline, its effectiveness)
I am not good with names and dates, so please bear with me since my
comments are all from recollections. I don't even know if I will enjoy as
much now adays books I read when I was young. Anyways, one of the most
memorable Somali novels I read was "Adeegto". "Adeegto" was very well
written (at least at that time). The story is about the life struggle of a
nomad lady who runs away from home insearch of a better life in the city
of Mogadisho. Published in the eighties in Mogadisho by Akademiyaha
Dhaqanka, this book was a soft covered. People who judge books by thier
covers will never touch this one ;-). Absolutely great book. Good
charater development. Moving/emotional story. Is there anyone who knows
the author of "Adeegto" BTW?
Also, "Aqoondarro waa u nacab jacayl" was excellent. It is the about a
love story between Calimaax and Cawrala. Calimaax saves Cawrala's life
from a sinking boat. She falls madly in love with Calimaax. After they
reached their destination, they went on to their seperate ways, but
promised each other to get married one day. It tells about the dynamics of
a love between seperated couple and how it effected their lives through
out the years. This book was published early in the seventies; paperback.
Another book, which was a nonfiction, and is profoundly memorable to me is
"Ma dhabbaa jacayl waa loo dhintaa?". Its the story of Cilmi Boodhari and
his love for Hodan. The biography of this celebrated Somali legend of
love has been written by Rashiid Maxamed Shabeele, the son of Hodan Cabdi.
Isn't that something? It has been published in mid seventies; paperback.
Burhaan, I do not understand your interest about the "looks" of the books.
I would say the last two books were gorgeous ;) Beutiful arts on the
cover. Binded professionaly, they were great to have them around ... :D
Nabaadiino,
Cabdullaahi Abuukar.
--
o ______"Xornimo, barwaaqo, iyo horumar
/\_ _| | waxay ku xiran yihiin *nabad*"
_\__`[________|
] [ \, ][ ][
AHirad
Abdullahi:
I concur with your assertion, I think "Aqoondarro Waa u Nacab Jacayl,"
might have been earlier than Maanafaay. I remember reading it in 1974 in
a small city called Leheley (Dairy Farm) about 30 miles south of Kismayo,
when I was in the second grade.
Regards,
Hirad
J. Gabobe
Dear Burhaan: Hirad is right about the publication date of Aqoondarro Waa
U Nacab Jacayl. It was published in 1974 by Wasaaradda Hiddaha iyo
Tacliinta Sare (Ministry of Culture and Higher Education). B.W.
Andrzejewski, in his introduction to this novel which he translated into
English in 1982 calls it "the first full-scale novel to be published; it
was preceded only by two much shorter ones printed in booklet form."
Unfortunately, he does not mention the titles of those shorter novels.
Prof. Andrzejewski also claims that this novel was based on a real event,
which the author later embellished and amplified. Andrezejewski writes,
"The story told here is a true one, even though it is presented in
fictionalized form. The hero, Cali Maxamed Xasan, popularly known as
Calimaax, 'Cali the Seafarer', and the heroine, Cawrala Barre, were
real people, and the memory of what happened in their lives is still
preserved among older people in the Sanaag region of Somalia. The
author has used material from their oral testimonies in his novel,
constructing on this basic framework his own fabric of invented
detail and dialogue."
Therefore, this novel does fit into the tendency of Somali novelists
basing their novels on real events, which you've mentioned.
Other tendencies in Somali writing which I discussed in previous postings
is the prevalence of the country to city (Miyi to Magaalo) theme, and the
use of poetry in prose. Somali writing in Somali also tends to have a
moral or political message. L'art pour l'art (art for art's sake) is
virtually non-existent in Somali literature.
Finally, I really don't want to unnecessarily politicise this discussion.
Still, I must point out that it's difficult to talk about books published
during Siyad Barre's days without mentioning the obvious: Barre's regime
had its own agenda, and since the regime controlled the printing press,
it generally only allowed the publication of works that fit its agenda
or those it perceived as non-threatening. For instance, could you imagine
Barre's government publishing works by Hadrawi, Abdi Qays, Nuruddin Farah,
or Haabil (Mohammed Abdille Hassan's nemesis)?
The use of extra-literary criteria such as ideology, and later on, clan
affiliation, in deciding who gets published and who doesn't, prompted
my friend and fellow writer Abdillahi Hargeisa to suggest renaming The
Somali Academy of Arts and Sciences as "Qabrigii Fanka iyo Cilmiga
Somaaliyeed (The Grave of Somali Arts and Sciences)."
Thank you for initiating a very stimulating discussion.
Jamal
J. Gabobe
Dear Warsame: I saw this posting after I sent my first reply, and I
decided to save Mr. Abukar the effort. I hope he doesn't mind.
Like most Somali writers, Faarax Maxamed Jaamac Cawl is not a professional
writer. Born in 1937, he was first educated at Hargeysa Trade School in
Somalia and then obtained a scholarship to study at the Chelsea College
of Aeronautical and Automobile Engineering in London (1959-62). On
his return he first worked as a technical instructor and then in 1964
joined the Somali Police Force, where he was responsible for motor
transport, and reached the rank of Lieutenant-Colonel... In 1979 Faarax
M.J. Cawl was seconded to the National Transport Agency and is its General
Manager. In spite of all his responsibilities he has found time to write a
second novel, Garbaduubkii Gumeysiga (`The Shackles of colonialism'),
published in Mogadishu in 1978, in which he develops further his technique
of poetic inserts and makes extensive use of oral history, a subject in
which he takes great interest both through private research and through
his contacts with the scholars of the Somali Academy of Arts and Sciences
in Mogadishu. Ignorance Is The Enemy of Love, Zed Press (1982), p.xviii.
On 26 Feb 1997, Burhaan Warsame wrote:
> Abdullahi Abukar (cc...@torfree.net) wrote:
>
> : I do not think Maanafaay was the first in Somali novel. The first Somali
> : novel was printed early in the seventies, and was "Aqoondarro Waa U Nacab
> : Jacayl" by AHN Farah M.J. Cawl. Insha Allah, I will verify the exact date
> : of the first edition very soon.
>
>
> Great! Please do that. As Hirad testified reading it in 1974, Aqoondarro
> must be one of the first, if not THE first. What does the AHN before the
> author's name stand for? Could you give us a short bio. of Mudane Cawl?
> Is this his only novel or has he written others?
>
>
> : I am not good with names and dates, so please bear with me since my
> : comments are all from recollections. I don't even know if I will enjoy as
> : much now adays books I read when I was young. Anyways, one of the most
> : memorable Somali novels I read was "Adeegto". "Adeegto" was very well
> : written (at least at that time). The story is about the life struggle of a
> : nomad lady who runs away from home insearch of a better life in the city
> : of Mogadisho. Published in the eighties in Mogadisho by Akademiyaha
> : Dhaqanka, this book was a soft covered. People who judge books by thier
> : covers will never touch this one ;-). Absolutely great book. Good
> : charater development. Moving/emotional story. Is there anyone who knows
> : the author of "Adeegto" BTW?
>
> : Also, "Aqoondarro waa u nacab jacayl" was excellent. It is the about a
> : love story between Calimaax and Cawrala. Calimaax saves Cawrala's life
> : from a sinking boat. She falls madly in love with Calimaax. After they
> : reached their destination, they went on to their seperate ways, but
> : promised each other to get married one day. It tells about the dynamics of
> : a love between seperated couple and how it effected their lives through
> : out the years. This book was published early in the seventies; paperback.
>
> : Another book, which was a nonfiction, and is profoundly memorable to me is
> : "Ma dhabbaa jacayl waa loo dhintaa?". Its the story of Cilmi Boodhari and
> : his love for Hodan. The biography of this celebrated Somali legend of
> : love has been written by Rashiid Maxamed Shabeele, the son of Hodan Cabdi.
> : Isn't that something? It has been published in mid seventies; paperback.
>
>
> Must have been embarassing for Rashiid to write about his mother's love
> affair :), but then, he must have also felt proud to be the son of an
> enduring love icon.
>
>
> : Burhaan, I do not understand your interest about the "looks" of the books.
> : I would say the last two books were gorgeous ;) Beutiful arts on the
> : cover. Binded professionaly, they were great to have them around ... :D
>
>
> Cover designs have been shown by numerous studies as being a major
> factor in selling a book (hence the saying: "judging a book by its
> cover"), so I was just wondering what sort of an illustration or design
> were/are used on books published in the underdeveloped world.
> Now, when you say "beautiful arts on the cover", are you being sarcastic
> or serious? :)
>
> I didn't read any of the books you mentioned above, but I do remember
> seeing Aqoondarro waa u Nacab Jacayl because of its cover. It had a
> hand-drawn illustration of a bare-chested man carrying a beautiful woman
> from the sea. I wonder if they were going for the Harlequin look? :)
>
> ---
> bwarsame
>
>
>
>
> : --
faisal hassan
On Tue, 25 Feb 1997, J. Gabobe wrote:
> The use of extra-literary criteria such as ideology, and later on, clan
> affiliation, in deciding who gets published and who doesn't, prompted
> my friend and fellow writer Abdillahi Hargeisa to suggest renaming The
> Somali Academy of Arts and Sciences as "Qabrigii Fanka iyo Cilmiga
> Somaaliyeed (The Grave of Somali Arts and Sciences)."
Jamal.
Dear Jamal,
Nabad
Did he also stolen the Somali Academy of Arts and Science's
literature/material and adapted the mentality of destruction rather than positive
devolpment of Somali literature? Who is Abdillahi Hargeisa? Was he also a
member of the Somali Academy of Arts and Science? Allow me to use his
own preference "The grave of Somali Arts and Sciences"? To criticize a
"regime" is one thing. However, to assume all member of Somali Academy of
Arts and Science as supporters of the 'regime' is a really mistake which
your friend Abdullahi Hargeisa has made and still thinks that NONSENSE
title of his. The Somali Academy of Arts and Scieces deserve better
than that, and it had produced some many Somali writers.
Mr. Gabobe, You've shared with us the work of Margaret Lawrence and her
observation among the Somali clans in Somalia? Did anyone questioned your
preference of her story because she wrote in Carro Isaaq? No, I did
enjoyed her work and it was excellent books and it could have been any
Somali Carro, period.. So, why your friend Abdullahi is dis-missing the
whole Somali Academy of Arts and Science as merely "The grave of Somali
Arts and Science". This will impact the writer Abdullahi's future work and
alot of Somalis would view him as "Anti-Somali literature development".
Take easy Mr. Gabobe.
Nabad
Faisal Hassan.
MUHAMMED HUSSEIN
In article <19970225153...@ladder02.news.aol.com> ahi...@aol.com
(AHirad) writes:
Hirad,
Are you kidding me ? You read "Aqoondarro Waa u Nacab Jacayl" when you
were "in the second grade" ? And you wish to unseat me from my candidacy
for the Presidency Of Somalia ;-).? Eh!
Regards,
Udub.
--
A. H. H. Hirad
Burhan:
For the two times I went back to Somalia (1993 and 1995), besides coming
back with a bleeding heart, I tried to rescue any Somali Literature that
I could get my hands on (either buying them or bililiqaysi). Please,
note some of the following and see if they can respond to your inquiry:
Axmed Farax, Taariikhda Afrika, Madbaqada Qaranka (MQ), Xamar 1975.
Cabdi Maxamud, Geeddiga Wadaay, MQ, Xamar 1974.
Cabdiqadir F. Bootaan, Murti & Sheekooyin, MQ, Xamar 1973.
Cali A. Bootaan, Khayraaka Dhulkeena, Xamar 1973.
Dahabo Faarax & Raaqiya X. Ducaale, Hooyada & Halaheeda, MQ, Xamar 1973.
*Faarax M. Cawl, Aqoondarro Waa U Nacab Jacayl, MQ, Xamar 1974.
Jaamac Cumar Ciise, Diwaankii SMCX, MQ, Xamar, 1974.
Muuse Cumar Islan, Sheekooyin Soomaliyeed, MQ, Xamar, 1973.
Shire Jaamac, Halgankii Nolosha, MQ, Xamar, 1973.
___Rooxaan, MQ, Xamar, 1974.
___Waari Meyside War Hakaa Hadho, MQ, Xamar, 1974.
Yuusuf Meygaag, Madhaafaanka Murtida, Nairobi, Kenya.
Yuusuf Xirsi & Yuusuf Sh. Cali, Aasaaska Aqoonta Caafiimaadka, MQ,
Xamar, 1974.
---
Wixii kaloo abaarahaas la daabacay, waan soo gudbin. Maanafaay anigu ma
hubo goorta la daabacay! Sidaan Cabdullahi ugu sheegayba, "Aqoondarro
Waa u Nacab Jacayl," ayaa waxaa i siiyey nin karaani ka ahaa Dairy Farm
aan deganayn oo Kismaayo koonfurta ka xigta. 1974 ama 75-kii ayay
ahayd. Murti badan ayaa buuggan ku jirtey.
Jeldiga waxaa ku sawiran Cali Maax oo sida Cawraloo suuxsan ka dib
markay doontu la gadoontay. Sawirkaa gabadha quruxda badan ee dhaclaha
xiran waa mid aan marnaba xusuustayda ka baxayn. Runbaa moodi jirey
inuu sawirku yahay.
Haddaan casarkii dhiil la culay caano kugu siiyo
Oon cishihii sarar cusbo leh kugu cashaysiyo
Oo aanad ... iigu hayn, Caliyow yeelkaaye
--Cawrala--
---
Nabadeey,
"Yaa Maali jirayeey, maalntii lagu muraaqooday(?)
Burhaan Warsame
Burhaan Warsame
Mohamed Abdi (moh...@atl.mindspring.com) wrote:
: bwar...@sfu.ca (Burhaan Warsame) wrote:
: >Waxaan maqlay in waqtigaas dadku intooda badani ay jaraa'idka u gadan
: >jireen kaliya si ay sheekadaas ula socdaan, oo saf dheer loo gali jiray.
: >Does that mean that the printed word has already impacted our culture in a
: >big way, that we could no longer be considered truly oral.
: I wish it had became a sweeping pop(ular) culture. I really don't know
: why we haven't seen more novels. Probably it is that those who write
: those novels could barely read and write themselves and without the
: involvement of the Somali intelectuals it became a plane without
: a pilot.
Mohamed, I think writing stories that capture people's imagination is the
domain of the creative, not the intellectual. Intellectuals are too
boring and most of them lack the life-experiences that produce the
creative urge.
If you doubt my assertion, just count the authors whose stories intrigued
or excited you, and then check their background. You'll find that many of
them didn't even get a secondary education. Mark Twain comes to mind.
In regards to reading and writing, it may be true that many of our
creative people were/are illiterate, but then our literature has mostly
been oral -not requiring writing. Also, one can learn in hours how to
read and write the Somali script, but it takes a lifetime (maybe an
inborn trait) to be creative.
I think the reason there are not many novels published in the Somali
language has to do with lack of resources, not lack of content.
---
bwarsame
Abdirahman Osman
Hirad,
Did you understand the context of the book at that age? If you
understood, did it affect your love life?
Abdirahman.
AHirad wrote:
>
> Abdullahi:
>
> I concur with your assertion, I think "Aqoondarro Waa u Nacab Jacayl,"
> might have been earlier than Maanafaay. I remember reading it in 1974 in
> a small city called Leheley (Dairy Farm) about 30 miles south of Kismayo,
> when I was in the second grade.
>
> Regards,
>
> Hirad
AHirad
A/rahman:
When u r young, you hardly know anything about luv. However, there is
something called crash which I think happens during teenage times and then
later ages develops into mature luv (if there is a such thing). So, the
answer to your Q is: not at all, but, any young lad with keen sense of
imagination would like to see that picture of Cawrala's proportional body.
I hope you have seen the picture I am talking about?
Nonetheless, I was more of a dreading the horrifying ordeals of the boat
and what those people were feeling when the boat was capsizing, especially
an old lady whom I think was one of the passengers. So, I understood only
the adventurous part of the story, not the Somali Love Story.
Regards,
Hirad
Mohamed Omer
Excellent analysis; Jamal.
Hayan.
On Tue, 25 Feb 1997, J. Gabobe wrote:
> The use of extra-literary criteria such as ideology, and later on, clan
> affiliation, in deciding who gets published and who doesn't, prompted
> my friend and fellow writer Abdillahi Hargeisa to suggest renaming The
> Somali Academy of Arts and Sciences as "Qabrigii Fanka iyo Cilmiga
> Somaaliyeed (The Grave of Somali Arts and Sciences)."
>
Abdirahman Osman
Thanks to Burhan for bringing up this subject.
Hirad,
Thanks. I asked you the question because the first Somali novel I read
affected my life. I think it was Manafay. I don't know if you read it
but my super hero was a general in the military who married the main
character of the story. I believed the story was real at the time and I
wished to have a couple of coffee with the general.
Before I read that novel, I believed love and romance were for girls and
those mama's boys who are not allowed to go out and play soccer. Then
the book came, one of my older brothers and sisters brought it home.
First, it was a reading contest for me. I had to prove how fast I could
read to my friends but it attracted me and I couldn't stop reading until
I finished it at least four times.
The author was great. He portrayed the real life in Mogadishu and how
easy it was for young ladies to fall into deadly traps. The book was
well written and fantastic. For me, it taught me many things my parents
and teachers never bothered.
I missed Aqoondaro Waa Unacab Jaceyl and its attractive cover page but I
heard it was the best thriller ever!
My first crash was for my grade VI classmate. We didn't get along
because we were both immature and irresponsible. Also, both of us were
under curfew after sunset! I saw her afterwards but her parents married
her to a Janale from Saudi Arabia with big bucks whom I could't
challenge.
Abdirahman.
Burhaan Warsame
J. Gabobe (jam...@u.washington.edu) wrote:
: Dear Burhaan: Hirad is right about the publication date of Aqoondarro Waa
: U Nacab Jacayl. It was published in 1974 by Wasaaradda Hiddaha iyo
: Tacliinta Sare (Ministry of Culture and Higher Education). B.W.
: Andrzejewski, in his introduction to this novel which he translated into
: English in 1982 calls it "the first full-scale novel to be published; it
: was preceded only by two much shorter ones printed in booklet form."
: Unfortunately, he does not mention the titles of those shorter novels.
Thanks Jamal for your informed contribution to this topic.
This clarifies things even further; now the task is to find more about the
two short novels that preceded Aqoondarro and we will know exactly the
first novel ever published in the Somali language.
: Prof. Andrzejewski also claims that this novel was based on a real event,
: which the author later embellished and amplified. Andrezejewski writes,
: "The story told here is a true one, even though it is presented in
: fictionalized form. The hero, Cali Maxamed Xasan, popularly known as
: Calimaax, 'Cali the Seafarer', and the heroine, Cawrala Barre, were
: real people, and the memory of what happened in their lives is still
: preserved among older people in the Sanaag region of Somalia. The
: author has used material from their oral testimonies in his novel,
: constructing on this basic framework his own fabric of invented
: detail and dialogue."
: Therefore, this novel does fit into the tendency of Somali novelists
: basing their novels on real events, which you've mentioned.
Probably the reason why so many Somali novels are based on true stories is
because the 'real story' genre is somewhat safer for authors who don't
have prior models or styles to work with. The Somali novelists in the 70s
were true pioneers and reality gave them a workable structure to follow.
: Other tendencies in Somali writing which I discussed in previous postings
: is the prevalence of the country to city (Miyi to Magaalo) theme, and the
: use of poetry in prose. Somali writing in Somali also tends to have a
: moral or political message. L'art pour l'art (art for art's sake) is
: virtually non-existent in Somali literature.
Precisely! Though the realism and the moral message in many Somali
writings is noble, I suspect people read novels to escape reality.
There should be at least some novels meeting the escapist or
the "out of this world" requirement.
: Finally, I really don't want to unnecessarily politicise this discussion.
: Still, I must point out that it's difficult to talk about books published
: during Siyad Barre's days without mentioning the obvious: Barre's regime
: had its own agenda, and since the regime controlled the printing press,
: it generally only allowed the publication of works that fit its agenda
: or those it perceived as non-threatening. For instance, could you imagine
: Barre's government publishing works by Hadrawi, Abdi Qays, Nuruddin Farah,
: or Haabil (Mohammed Abdille Hassan's nemesis)?
You raised an important point (don't worry about politicising this
discussion). True, the Barre regime allowed only the publication of
materials it approved of. I'm not surprised because that is the pattern
of all dictatorial regimes. Even in democracies you'd encounter some
"owners" who'd rather stifle others than allow them a hearing. The
difference is that in a democracy the "owners" are many, wheraes in a
dictatorship the only option resides with the regime in power. So let's
hope that if the people you mentioned were denied, as you said, a hearing,
they would soon get it from you and I in a future democracy.
: The use of extra-literary criteria such as ideology, and later on, clan
: affiliation, in deciding who gets published and who doesn't, prompted
: my friend and fellow writer Abdillahi Hargeisa to suggest renaming The
: Somali Academy of Arts and Sciences as "Qabrigii Fanka iyo Cilmiga
: Somaaliyeed (The Grave of Somali Arts and Sciences)."
The Somali Academy of Arts and Sciences has performed valuable deeds, but
this is not to say that it's above criticism. Abdillahi Hargeisa and
others have every right to criticize it if they think it didn't do its
job. Personally, I think cultural and educational institutions like SAAS
should be completely independent from the government.
: Thank you for initiating a very stimulating discussion.
: Jamal
Thank you for participating in it.
Also, thanks for providing Mudane Cawl's short bio.
---
bwarsame
Abdullahi Abukar
Burhaan Warsame (bwar...@sfu.ca) wrote:
: Cover designs have been shown by numerous studies as being a major
: factor in selling a book (hence the saying: "judging a book by its
: cover"), so I was just wondering what sort of an illustration or design
: were/are used on books published in the underdeveloped world.
: Now, when you say "beautiful arts on the cover", are you being sarcastic
: or serious? :)
I agree with you that many people judge books by their covers.
Illustrations/arts/pictures of books are what we first see in a book
store. However, there are other factors that sell books in which you
haven't mentioned in your initial post. For instance, so many people will
buy a book if they enjoyed the previous work of an author, and thus
"judging a book by its author" :). I might belong to this group whatever
the ramifications. So I wasn't happy about the fact that you left us out
of your quiries and that was not fair :)
Anyways, as you may have known, the major printing house in Somalia was
the National Press (Madbacadda Qaranka). The printing machines used
earlier or in the seventies where Lithographs/letterpress and using
lino/monotype typesetting machines. If you are familiar with the graphic
designes, this is a laborous process. There is less creative designs and
printers has to follow certain preestablished formats to make a
publication. Later in mid eighies, most of the publications were printed
by rotary presses (Offset), which takes a full advantage of the computer
typesettings and graphic design softwere or by hand. If you see books or
other publications from the seventies, you will notice the similarities in
font and page layout. In fact, in earlier publications the dominating font
was the "Roman", and leter "Arial" became more common. On the other hand,
covers where printed mainly in 4 clour process, or one colour process.
Needles to say, books printed at Madbacadda had the same
layout/design/binding, and their differences in print being the time of
production.
I started publishing in 1985 using different method than the conventional
printers to publish books. At the time Madbacadda wasn't producing anymore
books, for lack of material, and the Academy of Arts were not accepting
anymore manuscripts, for lack of funds. By using simple duplicating
machines and regular A4 papers, we were able to come up with a new page
layout by deviding the paper into four areas (pages). Then the pages were
typed on stencils using regular typewriters. Most of the work in binding
was done manually, and all the materials were available at the stationary
strores. That is when the new wave of books came out, most of them romance
novels. This process was started by two young writers Cabdishakuur Mire
Aadan "Cobol" and Maxamed Gurxan. I teamed up with Cabdishakuur and others,
after Gurxan left the country, and we literally floaded the city with more
titles than people can memorise. The techniques has been improved over the
times, and we were able to produce better quality books when we switched
to "photostencils" (instead of typing or drawing on a paper stencils,
designed pages were transfered onto a plastic stencils). Photostencils
gave us the ability to proofread/edit text and reuse layout/illustrations
intead of throwing away stencils anytime there is a mistake. We also
published the works of other writers. In fact untill now, the same
principle is used in almost all publications books, newspapers in all
parts of Somalia. The advantage of this system was that, it was much
cheaper than conventional printing, and the material was always available.
The major disadvantage being that if the book is read several times, it
will fall apart, and that made them harder to keep or archive. However,
at the time we thought that was to our advantage since our target readers
had tendencies to pass single book through the whole neighborhood or
friends.
In general, Burhaan, I think the supply and demand for Somali literature
is still unbalanced. It doesn't matter how you publish as long as you
have readers, and that is how things are up till now in Somalia. Today, in
Mogadisho alone, there are about 10 different papers published
daily/weekly, and they all use small duplicating machines. Anyways, I hope
that I gave you general idea about publishing in Somalia.
Take care,
Abdullahi Abukar.
: ---
Jamal Hussein
Hirad,
I agree with you guys. "Aqoondaro waa u nacab jacayl" was
earlier than "Maanafaay" according to my recollections. I read
both books. Another interesting book was "Ayaandarro". In mid
eighties, there were a dozen of interesting books. Most of them
were based on real stories. Any body knows about these books?
Regards
Jamal Hussein
Amina Mire
Dear brother Burhan,
I read Aqoon darro waa u nacab Jacyl in 1974.
The story of Calimaxaa and his heroine, Cawrala. It was about 1974.
I gues girls have different sensibility than boys of the same age
group because, even though I was too young to grasp the core of the Sory,
I understood the meaning of the tragic and doomed love between
Calimaax and Cawrala. the rest of the story for me only formed the background.
But as for your statment that intellectuals are too boring to have the
creative impulse which is the hall mark of a writer, what kind kinds
of the intellectual do have in mind?
Some of my great intelltucal heroes/heroines happen to be writers as
well as intellectuals. This list include: Heinrich Mann, his brother
Thomas Mann, Iris Murdoch, Franz Kafka, Dostoevsky, George Orwell, Ngugi Wa Thiongo,
Oscar Wilde, Ben Okri, Publo Nerude, and many others. These are both
intelletuals and writers who registered the intellectual concerns of
their historical moments.
I will include above list the author of Aqoon darro wa u nacab Jayl
for he grasped so vividely the universal story of human beings perpetual
longing for love and eternal peace!
Sincerely,
Amina mire
Burhaan Warsame (bwar...@sfu.ca) wrote:
Burhaan Warsame
Hirad, thanks!
I'll be knocking on your door soon :)
---
bwarsame
A. H. H. Hirad (ahi...@gmu.edu) wrote:
: Burhan:
: For the two times I went back to Somalia (1993 and 1995), besides coming
: back with a bleeding heart, I tried to rescue any Somali Literature that
: I could get my hands on (either buying them or bililiqaysi). Please,
: note some of the following and see if they can respond to your inquiry:
: Axmed Farax, Taariikhda Afrika, Madbaqada Qaranka (MQ), Xamar 1975.
: Cabdi Maxamud, Geeddiga Wadaay, MQ, Xamar 1974.
: Cabdiqadir F. Bootaan, Murti & Sheekooyin, MQ, Xamar 1973.
: Cali A. Bootaan, Khayraaka Dhulkeena, Xamar 1973.
: Dahabo Faarax & Raaqiya X. Ducaale, Hooyada & Halaheeda, MQ, Xamar 1973.
: *Faarax M. Cawl, Aqoondarro Waa U Nacab Jacayl, MQ, Xamar 1974.
: Jaamac Cumar Ciise, Diwaankii SMCX, MQ, Xamar, 1974.
: Muuse Cumar Islan, Sheekooyin Soomaliyeed, MQ, Xamar, 1973.
: Shire Jaamac, Halgankii Nolosha, MQ, Xamar, 1973.
: ___Rooxaan, MQ, Xamar, 1974.
: ___Waari Meyside War Hakaa Hadho, MQ, Xamar, 1974.
: Yuusuf Meygaag, Madhaafaanka Murtida, Nairobi, Kenya.
: Yuusuf Xirsi & Yuusuf Sh. Cali, Aasaaska Aqoonta Caafiimaadka, MQ,
: Xamar, 1974.
: ---
: Wixii kaloo abaarahaas la daabacay, waan soo gudbin. Maanafaay anigu ma
: hubo goorta la daabacay! Sidaan Cabdullahi ugu sheegayba, "Aqoondarro
: Waa u Nacab Jacayl," ayaa waxaa i siiyey nin karaani ka ahaa Dairy Farm
Burhaan Warsame
Abdullahi Abukar (cc...@torfree.net) wrote:
: Burhaan Warsame (bwar...@sfu.ca) wrote:
: : Cover designs have been shown by numerous studies as being a major
: : factor in selling a book (hence the saying: "judging a book by its
: : cover"), so I was just wondering what sort of an illustration or design
: : were/are used on books published in the underdeveloped world.
: : Now, when you say "beautiful arts on the cover", are you being sarcastic
: : or serious? :)
: I agree with you that many people judge books by their covers.
: Illustrations/arts/pictures of books are what we first see in a book
: store. However, there are other factors that sell books in which you
: haven't mentioned in your initial post. For instance, so many people will
: buy a book if they enjoyed the previous work of an author, and thus
: "judging a book by its author" :). I might belong to this group whatever
: the ramifications. So I wasn't happy about the fact that you left us out
: of your quiries and that was not fair :)
Yes, author recognition is another major sales point. In fact, in the long
run, it is more crucial than attractive covers; one may be fooled by the
"look" of the book, but if the content is not good, he/she is likely to
always avoid the author who wrote it. The sales strategy, therefore,
should be to lure readers in with the design and then built readership
loyalty through superb content.
Of course, brand name authors like Steven King don't require flashy covers
to sell their books because they have already stablished a presence or
readership loyalty, but unknown authors could use the help of good design
to introduce them to audiences.
: Anyways, as you may have known, the major printing house in Somalia was
: the National Press (Madbacadda Qaranka). The printing machines used
: earlier or in the seventies where Lithographs/letterpress and using
: lino/monotype typesetting machines. If you are familiar with the graphic
: designes, this is a laborous process. There is less creative designs and
: printers has to follow certain preestablished formats to make a
: publication. Later in mid eighies, most of the publications were printed
: by rotary presses (Offset), which takes a full advantage of the computer
: typesettings and graphic design softwere or by hand. If you see books or
: other publications from the seventies, you will notice the similarities in
: font and page layout. In fact, in earlier publications the dominating font
: was the "Roman", and leter "Arial" became more common. On the other hand,
: covers where printed mainly in 4 clour process, or one colour process.
: Needles to say, books printed at Madbacadda had the same
: layout/design/binding, and their differences in print being the time of
: production.
You're knowledgeable in the printing process.
I noticed the uniform production formats of books produced by
Madbacadda Qaranka but I couldn't determin the technology level used.
Incidentally, a year ago I came across a 90 page government document in
Somali, dated 1987, with glossy cover that was well laid-out, using a
contemporary serif font, and, to my surprise, it had the MQ label.
I though they printed it outside of the country and just asked to have the
MQ label there, but now I know, thanks to you, that MQ had actually
upgraded its presses in the 80s.
: I started publishing in 1985 using different method than the conventional
: printers to publish books. At the time Madbacadda wasn't producing anymore
: books, for lack of material, and the Academy of Arts were not accepting
: anymore manuscripts, for lack of funds. By using simple duplicating
: machines and regular A4 papers, we were able to come up with a new page
: layout by deviding the paper into four areas (pages). Then the pages were
: typed on stencils using regular typewriters. Most of the work in binding
: was done manually, and all the materials were available at the stationary
: strores. That is when the new wave of books came out, most of them romance
: novels. This process was started by two young writers Cabdishakuur Mire
: Aadan "Cobol" and Maxamed Gurxan. I teamed up with Cabdishakuur and others,
: after Gurxan left the country, and we literally floaded the city with more
: titles than people can memorise. The techniques has been improved over the
: times, and we were able to produce better quality books when we switched
: to "photostencils" (instead of typing or drawing on a paper stencils,
: designed pages were transfered onto a plastic stencils). Photostencils
: gave us the ability to proofread/edit text and reuse layout/illustrations
: intead of throwing away stencils anytime there is a mistake. We also
: published the works of other writers. In fact untill now, the same
Heeey, it's really good to know that we have in our midst someone who
worked in publishing inside Somalia. I have seen some of the
independently published new wave of novels in the 80s, and boy were they
something! They were of much much much lower quality than those with
Academy of Arts backing in terms of editing as well as production, but
they signified, at least to me, a new opening up of pub. in Somalia.
Thank you for having been part of that process. How was the market?
Were people buying enough to sustain the producers?
: principle is used in almost all publications books, newspapers in all
: parts of Somalia. The advantage of this system was that, it was much
: cheaper than conventional printing, and the material was always available.
: The major disadvantage being that if the book is read several times, it
: will fall apart, and that made them harder to keep or archive. However,
: at the time we thought that was to our advantage since our target readers
: had tendencies to pass single book through the whole neighborhood or
: friends.
Usually some copies are kept solely for archival purposes; those wouldn't
be falling apart.
: In general, Burhaan, I think the supply and demand for Somali literature
: is still unbalanced. It doesn't matter how you publish as long as you
: have readers, and that is how things are up till now in Somalia. Today, in
: Mogadisho alone, there are about 10 different papers published
: daily/weekly, and they all use small duplicating machines. Anyways, I hope
: that I gave you general idea about publishing in Somalia.
Of the 10 you mentioned, I have seen probably the biggest two: Qaran and
Xog-ogaal. I have also seen some from other cities. They are all typed
on 81/2 x 11 pages, approxiamtely 6-14 pages. Very basic letters with,
sometimes, photocopied pictures, but people read them and that is what
matters.
---
bwarsame
Mohamed O. Musa
Amina Mire (am...@chass.utoronto.ca) writes:
> Some of my great intelltucal heroes/heroines happen to be writers as
> well as intellectuals. This list include: Heinrich Mann, his brother
> Thomas Mann, Iris Murdoch, Franz Kafka, Dostoevsky, George Orwell, Ngugi Wa Thiongo,
> Oscar Wilde, Ben Okri, Publo Nerude, and many others. These are both
> intelletuals and writers who registered the intellectual concerns of
> their historical moments.
As-salamu alaikum.
Dear Amina, I wonder why there are no muslims in your list of favourite
intellectuals. Or there no such things as muslim intellectuals?
--
Mohamed,
Nabadgelyo.
Abdirisak Doktorand
Mohamed O. Musa wrote:
> Amina Mire (am...@chass.utoronto.ca) writes:
> > Some of my great intelltucal heroes/heroines happen to be writers as
> > well as intellectuals. This list include: Heinrich Mann, his brother
> > Thomas Mann, Iris Murdoch, Franz Kafka, Dostoevsky, George Orwell, Ngugi Wa Thiongo,
> > Oscar Wilde, Ben Okri, Publo Nerude, and many others. These are both
>
> As-salamu alaikum.
>
> Dear Amina, I wonder why there are no muslims in your list of favourite
> intellectuals. Or there no such things as muslim intellectuals?
>
> --
> Mohamed,
> Nabadgelyo.
AL_Akh Mohamed;
Instead of posing a sarcastic question, you could have
made the constructive approach of suggesting complementary further
readings in islamic intellectual works.
The fact that Amina consumed the books of the above
mentioned people is not only impressive, but also an asset.
Recall the fact that the history of mankind witnessed, whenever
cultures, empires or civilizations close themselves to the outside
world, they are doomed to perish. It is the active interaction with
(instead of passive adoption) and assimilation of foreign ideas that
keep a culture alive.
I am looking forward to your list of recommendable
writings of islamic intellectuals. Jazaa-akallah...
Salaam Alaikum,
Abdirisak.
Mahmoud Abib
Salaam calaykum,
Amina wrote:
> Some of my great intelltucal heroes/heroines happen to be writers as
> well as intellectuals. This list include: Heinrich Mann, his brother
> Thomas Mann, Iris Murdoch, Franz Kafka, Dostoevsky, George Orwell,
> Ngugi Wa Thiongo, Oscar Wilde, Ben Okri, Publo Nerude, and many others.
> These are both intelletuals and writers who registered the intellectual
> concerns of their historical moments.
M.Musa replied:
> Dear Amina, I wonder why there are no muslims in your list of favourite
> intellectuals. Or there no such things as muslim intellectuals?
Mr. Musa,
Do you have faith detecting machines which enables you to tell who is a
muslim and who is not? Do you have inside knowledge about the faith
and/or the state of believe of these men? Or is it because they carry
non-Arab names, they are automatically considered non-muslims?
Your defenition of a muslim is totally confused. Please read Quran: 2:62
and 5:69.
M.Abib
Burhaan Warsame
Amina Mire (am...@chass.utoronto.ca) wrote:
: Dear brother Burhan,
: I read Aqoon darro waa u nacab Jacyl in 1974.
: The story of Calimaxaa and his heroine, Cawrala. It was about 1974.
: I gues girls have different sensibility than boys of the same age
: group because, even though I was too young to grasp the core of the Sory,
: I understood the meaning of the tragic and doomed love between
: Calimaax and Cawrala. the rest of the story for me only formed the background.
I don't know much about the sensibility of different genders, but Hirad
read the book when he was at the second grade and he was moved by it.
That says much for the sense and sensibility of men. No? :)
For me, I never read the book, and if what Saciid Suugaan recently posted
(regarding Cawrala's letter) is any indication, I probably wouldn't have
liked it. I mean, what is with the poetry? I though Aqoondarro was a
novel/story, not a poetic theater. It may be a great book, but somehow I
have a hard time beleiving that all the protagonists are also poets.
This kind of book will probably work for those who enjoy Indian movies
where everyone bursts into song, including the Kaaba-laadar or the main
villian. Talk about being realistic! :)
: But as for your statment that intellectuals are too boring to have the
: creative impulse which is the hall mark of a writer, what kind kinds
: of the intellectual do have in mind?
: Some of my great intelltucal heroes/heroines happen to be writers as
: well as intellectuals. This list include: Heinrich Mann, his brother
: Thomas Mann, Iris Murdoch, Franz Kafka, Dostoevsky, George Orwell, Ngugi Wa Thiongo,
: Oscar Wilde, Ben Okri, Publo Nerude, and many others. These are both
: intelletuals and writers who registered the intellectual concerns of
: their historical moments.
: I will include above list the author of Aqoon darro wa u nacab Jayl
: for he grasped so vividely the universal story of human beings perpetual
: longing for love and eternal peace!
I see what you mean. We have a semantic mixup.
I used the word "intellectual" in the sense I though Mohamed Abdi meant,
i.e. those with (formal) higher education. There is no corralation between
education level and creativity. In fact, as is the case with the Somali
example, more creative people have less education. Maybe because their
mind is free from the rigid structures of formal education (the "this is
THE way to do it" mentality).
If, however, by "intellectual" we mean anyone with a great mind, then the
list will INCLUDE some with higher/formal education, and many without any.
The list will EXCLUDE all the Phd baffoons and the pretentious small minds
who can ONLY repeat what the prof. told them.
Thanks,
---
bwarsame
Amina Mire
Dear brother Abdirisak,
thank you for the kind words, indeed there are great Muslim thinkers in
every age and every epoc. There are many Muslim thinkers who profound
impacted on my
thinking about human dignity and social justice.
Such list include, Sayed Qutb, Mariam Jamileh, Lamya al Faruqi, Alija
Ali Iztbegic and others. Islam embraces all that is good. The people I
have mentioned in my previous post have all struggled to come
to terms with the human condition. I do not see why their thoughts
should not be appreciated by all includding mulims.
Dear brother Musa, as brother Abdirisak so aptly noted , Islam spreaded
throughout world in its initial stage so fast that historican seem to
mis the real reason. It was because muslims embraced all that was good
in other cultures and incorporated it into their religion. If we lose
sight of what made Islam a great religion in the first place, then we will not succeed.
As Abdirisak noted no empire, no religion and no power, however powerful,
ever survived in history by sealing itself to outside influences. What
needs to be understood is how to take what is good in other cultures and
then incorporete them into the living culture of Islam!
Sincerely,
Amina Mire
Abdirisak Doktorand (Abd...@maserv.mathematik.uni-karlsruhe.de) wrote:
: Mohamed O. Musa wrote:
:
: > Amina Mire (am...@chass.utoronto.ca) writes:
:
: > > Some of my great intelltucal heroes/heroines happen to be writers as
: > > well as intellectuals. This list include: Heinrich Mann, his brother
: > > Thomas Mann, Iris Murdoch, Franz Kafka, Dostoevsky, George Orwell, Ngugi Wa Thiongo,
: > > Oscar Wilde, Ben Okri, Publo Nerude, and many others. These are both
: >
: > As-salamu alaikum.
: >
: > Dear Amina, I wonder why there are no muslims in your list of favourite
: > intellectuals. Or there no such things as muslim intellectuals?
: >
: > --
Mohamed Hebaan
Mahmoud Abib <eb7...@goodnet.com> wrote:
> Mr. Musa,
> Do you have faith detecting machines which enables you to tell who is a
> muslim and who is not? Do you have inside knowledge about the faith
> and/or the state of believe of these men? Or is it because they carry
> non-Arab names, they are automatically considered non-muslims?
> Your defenition of a muslim is totally confused. Please read Quran: 2:62
> and 5:69.
> M.Abib
M.Abib,
Brother Mohamed Musa asked a valid question, and I beleive
that sister Amina Mire won't have a difficulty in responding
to it particularly she hasn't displayed, as far as I know,
any hostility or opposition to Islam, to the Islamic law, or
to Islam as a comprehensive way of life. On the contrary, her
writings, on various occasions, indicated she is supportive of
Islamic rules and principlas.
Thus, my point is that before you accuse brother Mohamed of
being superficial who judges things by their names(Arab
or non-Arab), did it ever occur to you that he may actually
read the works of these writers and is thereby familiar with
whether they were Muslims or not??
Abib, for the thousand time, look before you leap!
Heebaan
Mohamed O. Musa
Mahmoud Abib (eb7...@goodnet.com) writes:
Mohmoud,
If you think I made a mistake in my judgement that the people listed by
sister Amina are not muslims, then please feel free to correct me. (I still
maintain my previous position though). You seem to start conjecturing about
what is in the minds of others, do you?
Now coming to your question if I had a faith detecting machine, my simple
answer is no! (I might have a light detecting machine though.) But do
you think that a faith detecting machine is NECESSARY to tell what faith
the listed people embrace?
And regarding the definition of a muslim, can you show from my
earlier statements (attached) where I had stated such a defintion?
Finally, on confusion, do think that there is more confused a person than
you in this so-called cave? When, not long ago, I ask you in a very clear
manner if you belonged to the Submitters your answer was an unequivocal
"MAYA". However, in response to Bashir Ali(?) it became clear that you are
not only a Submitter but a Submitter with a certain amount of authority
(having a secretary etc). The obvious conclusion that one arrives from
these two facts is that you are a liar. But then, who is more confused
than a liar, for in the process of lying there is not only dishonesty but
confusion as well.
> Mr. Musa,
> Do you have faith detecting machines which enables you to tell who is a
> muslim and who is not? Do you have inside knowledge about the faith
> and/or the state of believe of these men? Or is it because they carry
> non-Arab names, they are automatically considered non-muslims?
> Your defenition of a muslim is totally confused. Please read Quran: 2:62
> and 5:69.
>
>
> M.Abib
>
> Salaam calaykum,
>
> Amina wrote:
>
>> Some of my great intelltucal heroes/heroines happen to be writers as
>> well as intellectuals. This list include: Heinrich Mann, his brother
>> Thomas Mann, Iris Murdoch, Franz Kafka, Dostoevsky, George Orwell,
>> Ngugi Wa Thiongo, Oscar Wilde, Ben Okri, Publo Nerude, and many others.
>> These are both intelletuals and writers who registered the intellectual
>> concerns of their historical moments.
>
> M.Musa replied:
Mohamed O. Musa
Abdirisak Doktorand (Abd...@maserv.mathematik.uni-karlsruhe.de) writes:
As-salamu alaikum.
Br. Abdirisak, I did not consider my question sarcastic at all and if I
am not mistaken, sister Amina will be offended in no way. The reason I
have chosen this method is that I hold that people often take questions more
seriously than suggestions.
And with regard to your other point, I wonder why you think that I am
suggesting for Amina to throw her books away. Anyhow, my point was not
to discourage the sister to learn from these people, but to remind her that
there are other sort of intellectuals that share with her more than what
she shares with the listed ones.
Finally, I currently have no available list of muslim intellectual works,
but in general the works of Mouduudi, S. Qutb, A.A.H. al-Nadvi represent an
islamic perspective of the the major events of this century and are mostly
translated into english (and other languages) and are available in many
university libraries around the world. These books are specifically
available in any university that has an Islamic/Middle East studies
department.
Abdirisak Doktorand (Abd...@maserv.mathematik.uni-karlsruhe.de) writes:
> Mohamed O. Musa wrote:
>
>> Amina Mire (am...@chass.utoronto.ca) writes:
>
>> > Some of my great intelltucal heroes/heroines happen to be writers as
>> > well as intellectuals. This list include: Heinrich Mann, his brother
>> > Thomas Mann, Iris Murdoch, Franz Kafka, Dostoevsky, George Orwell, Ngugi Wa Thiongo,
>> > Oscar Wilde, Ben Okri, Publo Nerude, and many others. These are both
>
>>
>> As-salamu alaikum.
>>
>> Dear Amina, I wonder why there are no muslims in your list of favourite
>> intellectuals. Or there no such things as muslim intellectuals?
>>
>> --
>> Mohamed,
>> Nabadgelyo.
>
>
> AL_Akh Mohamed;
>
> Instead of posing a sarcastic question, you could have
> made the constructive approach of suggesting complementary further
> readings in islamic intellectual works.
>
> The fact that Amina consumed the books of the above
> mentioned people is not only impressive, but also an asset.
> Recall the fact that the history of mankind witnessed, whenever
> cultures, empires or civilizations close themselves to the outside
> world, they are doomed to perish. It is the active interaction with
> (instead of passive adoption) and assimilation of foreign ideas that
> keep a culture alive.
>
> I am looking forward to your list of recommendable
> writings of islamic intellectuals. Jazaa-akallah...
>
> Salaam Alaikum,
>
> Abdirisak.
--
Mohamed,
Nabadgelyo.
Amina Mire
My dear brothers,
I wonder why should my believe in Islam is at question here at all?
The fact I read Heinrich Mann or Dostoevsky has nothing to do my values and my
believe in Islam. I was raised in the home of one of the greatest
Mulsm family and I grew up reading and hearing Islamic texts read by
scholars and not by those who come to public forums to censor other
people's utterances. I am amazed how norraw minded some people are
here in this forum. Dear brothers, I really do not need anyone's
aprroval or disaprroval here.
My faith in Allah and last day is beyond scrutiny of anyone. I have
respect for all my brothers here but with due all respect it is better
you know who you are dealing with before passing unsubstaniated
judgment. I read literature because, love to read and I love to know,
to grasp and to understand. It is a gift from Allah,the Almightty. It
is not the business of the "gate keepers" of scs to question the books
I read or the discourse I enagage. Do you also have problems that I
read Plato, Aristotle, Thomas Hobbes, Nietzche and Michel Foucault,
Non of which are Muslim?
Please mine your business and I sahll mine mine, it seems that your minds are
closed to the world of ideas!
Sincerely
Amina Mire
Mohamed O. Musa (dj...@FreeNet.Carleton.CA) wrote:
Mahmoud Abib
dj...@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Mohamed O. Musa) wrote:
>If you think I made a mistake in my judgement that the people listed by
>sister Amina are not muslims, then please feel free to correct me. (I
>still maintain my previous position though).
First, only Allah knows the state of belief the people listed by sister
Amina are in or on what state they will be in when they die. Secondly,
the minimum requirements for salvation are listed in the Quran (2:62,
5:69). And thirdly, if you consider muslim, one who DOES NOT believe the
Quran ALONE is sufficient for our guidance, why don't you give the
benefit of the doubt those who carry non-Arab names? What is to a name? I
had even met a Christian Arab, who believed Jesus is god, whose name was
Abdullah! Now Musa, do you have a first hand knowledge about the belief
of these people sister Amina listed? Did you meet any of them? Did they
tell you that they do not believe in Allah (God)?
>Finally, on confusion, do think that there is more confused a person >than you in this so-called cave? When, not long ago, I ask you in a
>very clear manner if you belonged to the Submitters your answer was an >unequivocal "MAYA".
And it is still UNEQUIVOCAL MAYA. The so-called Submitters are on a
mission of substituting Rashad Khalifa in place of Prophet Muhammad.
The exact same way the early so-called muslims left their stone idols and
subsituted Prophet Muhammad in place of Alla't and Manaat. This is very
deep, but if you worship Allah Alone, you will have no trouble
understanding what I am saying. Perhaps this example will ease your
dilemma:
1) Submitters claim they heard from Rashad Khalifa that Qiblah towards
the Sacred Mosque from North America is South East. But we discovered
that this does not make sense, and it must be N.East. They say, "Do you
think God's messenger was wrong and that He will let him face the wrong
direction?" Hence, they accuse me of disobeying the messenger and being a
kaafir.
2) The Muslims (your camp) claim they heard from someone who heard the
Prophet say, "If a fly dives in your soup, make sure you dunk it
completely for the fly carries germ on one wing and the cure on the
other." I say the prophet never preached such nonsense. You accuse me of
being Kaafir who does not obey the Prophet!
Conclusion: idolators to both of you. Allah Alone and His words are not
sufficient. Without a doubt, hell will be your eternal abode.
>However, in response to Bashir Ali(?) it became clear that you are
>not only a Submitter but a Submitter with a certain amount of authority
>(having a secretary etc). The obvious conclusion that one arrives from
>these two facts is that you are a liar. But then, who is more confused
>than a liar, for in the process of lying there is not only dishonesty
>but confusion as well.
Only an idiot will derive such conclusion from such an incomplete story.
I never claimed any authority nor do I have a personal secretary.
Now who is lying Mr. Musa?
Soo bari,
M.Abib
Amina Mire
Dear Mr. Mr. Abiib,
Please I'm not part of "Quran Alone Project", so I would appreciate
if you do not "enlist me in your fight with certain Muslim brothers Here!
Thank you
Amina Mire
Mahmoud Abib (eb7...@goodnet.com) wrote:
: Salaam calaykum,
: Amina wrote:
: > Some of my great intelltucal heroes/heroines happen to be writers as
: > well as intellectuals. This list include: Heinrich Mann, his brother
: > Thomas Mann, Iris Murdoch, Franz Kafka, Dostoevsky, George Orwell,
: > Ngugi Wa Thiongo, Oscar Wilde, Ben Okri, Publo Nerude, and many others.
: > These are both intelletuals and writers who registered the intellectual
: > concerns of their historical moments.
: M.Musa replied:
: > Dear Amina, I wonder why there are no muslims in your list of favourite
: > intellectuals. Or there no such things as muslim intellectuals?
: Mr. Musa,
Abdirisak
Mohamed O. Musa wrote:
>
> Finally, I currently have no available list of muslim intellectual works,
> but in general the works of Mouduudi, S. Qutb, A.A.H. al-Nadvi represent an
> islamic perspective of the the major events of this century and are mostly
> translated into english (and other languages) and are available in many
> university libraries around the world. These books are specifically
> available in any university that has an Islamic/Middle East studies
> department.
>
Thank you for the information on the literature.
I remember a talk in this thread about boring intellectuals and fiction
writers having an empty intersection as sets.To refute that, it would
have sufficed to show that there exists at least one member that belongs
to both sets. Amina delivered several european ones, because I presume
there were no muslim intellectuals who used fiction to convey their
islamic message.
Another reason may have to do with the language and the verbal
associations we make. If we are conversing in somali, and someone talks
about "Culimo", I would think of a Sheikh or "Xerta shiikh maxamed
rabiic", although a physicist in Los Alomos belongs to the "Culimo" in
the strict sense of the word.
If we learned something from one another (I did), and got things cleared,
then my posting has achieved its goal.
Thank you both brother Mohamed and Sister Amina.
sincerely,
Abdi_Risak.
P.S : Our news server has problems; I maynot be able to follow further
discussions.
quran_and_hadith_followers
In article <5fg8qr$1794$1...@news.goodnet.com>, Mahmoud says...
Abib , why are you afraid to say that " I AM RASHID KHALIFA FOLLOWER'.
If you are not a submitter , why is your email under the SUBMITTER's home
page , especially where the books are ordered? you are responsible for
distributing the submitter's books. you claim to follow the Quran and you
are telling a lie.
Shame on you ,
your email is also under this homepage and I have deleted the articles that where
under this page
MASJID TUCSON United
Submitters International
PO Box 43476 Tucson AZ
85733-3476
Tel/Fax: (520) 323 7636
internet home page:
http://www.mv.com/ipusers/submission/submit.html
e-mail:eb7...@goodnet.com
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ABIB'S EMAIL"
>And it is still UNEQUIVOCAL MAYA. The so-called Submitters are on a
>mission of substituting Rashad Khalifa in place of Prophet Muhammad.
>The exact same way the early so-called muslims left their stone idols and
>subsituted Prophet Muhammad in place of Alla't and Manaat. This is very
>deep, but if you worship Allah Alone, you will have no trouble
>understanding what I am saying. Perhaps this example will ease your
>dilemma:
In the name of God, Most Gracious, Most Merciful
Submitters Perspective
Monthly Bulletin of International Community of Submitters. Published by Masjid Tucson. Sha'ban 1416
Satan: The Master Hypnotist
Part I
Mark Your Calendar
1996 Conference
August 9-11, 1996
Houston, Texas
God willing,
QURAN
The Final Testament
Authorized English Version
.........................................
Translated From the Original
by
................. Rashad Khalifa, Ph. D.
.................
Paperback, 538 Pages
Index, Appendices
English Text Only
[Eds. note: The political and religious oppression in the country where the author of this article lives
makes it difficult for us to publish the author's name. We point out the following verses to these
so-called Muslim scholars and government officials who do not give people their God-given religious
free-dom: Oppression is worse than murder.... (2:191) There shall be no compulsion in
religion.... (2:256)]
MASJID TUCSON United
Submitters International
PO Box 43476 Tucson AZ
85733-3476
Tel/Fax: (520) 323 7636
internet home page:
http://www.mv.com/ipusers/submission/submit.html
e-mail:eb7...@goodnet.com
Mohamed O. Musa
Amina Mire (am...@chass.utoronto.ca) writes:
> My dear brothers,
> I read or the discourse I enagage. Do you also have problems that I
> read Plato, Aristotle, Thomas Hobbes, Nietzche and Michel Foucault,
> Non of which are Muslim?
As-salamu alaikum, sister Amina.
I am not sure who you are addressing in this post, since you have mentioned
no names, but I have got from it the impression that you might be
addressing me, Mohamed O. Musa. If you think I am right in thinking so,
please let me know; in fact I am somewhat intrigued by the cause of your
reaction.
--
Mohamed,
Nabadgelyo.
Mahmoud Abib
Dear Hadith followers,
Which hadith other than Allah and His Aayats (45:6, 52:34, 39:23) do you
believe?
>Abib , why are you afraid to say that " I AM RASHID KHALIFA FOLLOWER'.
I am follower of Allah and what He revealed in the Quran Alone. No
humans, no mullahs and no crooked sheikhs.
>why is your email under the SUBMITTER's home page , especially where the
> books are ordered? you are responsible for distributing the
>submitter's books.
That for me to know and for you to find out. Stay in your confusion
blundering and blinded idolworship.
Good bye,
M.Abib
Follower of Quran Alone.
Mahmoud Abib
am...@chass.utoronto.ca (Amina Mire) wrote:
>Dear Mr. Mr. Abiib,
>Please I'm not part of "Quran Alone Project", so I would appreciate
>if you do not "enlist me in your fight with certain Muslim brothers
>Here!
No one said that you are part of "Quran Alone project" and no one
solicited your help nor support for "Quran Alone project."
To fight falsehood and to expose satanic lies takes a major effort.
Those who enlist themselves in this great cause and choose to fight this
holy war are aware of the fact that they may loose thier lives in the
process. They are willing to kill and get killed. That is not a place for
a coward to be in.
Regards,
M.Abib
Mohamed Hebaan
Mahmoud Abib <eb7...@goodnet.com> wrote:
> No one said that you are part of "Quran Alone project" and no one
> solicited your help nor support for "Quran Alone project."
> To fight falsehood and to expose satanic lies takes a major effort.
> Those who enlist themselves in this great cause and choose to fight this
> holy war are aware of the fact that they may loose thier lives in the
> process. They are willing to kill and get killed. That is not a place for
> a coward to be in.
>
> Regards,
> M.Abib
.....................
M.Abib,
Those who enlist in the "Qu'an alone project" whom you are talking
about are the very ones who believe PART of the Qur'an is FABRICATED!!!
Aren't they?????????
They are those who call the Islamic law barbaric! Aren't they???
They are those who unabashedly lie in a public forum and claim they
are not submitters or Rashad Khalifa's followers and then declare
they are high ranking officials in the same deviated cult! Aren't they???
What a chameleon who can claim to be something and its opposite in
the very consecutive posts!!!
Abib, you are in the wrong newsgroup, for Somalis are too smart to
be deceived by such Khalifite crap.
Heebaan
Ahmed Yusuf
Br. or Sister:
Excellent work in posting further proofs that Abib is a follower of the man who
claimed to be a messenger (Rasuul) and the Int'l community of submitters. Those
who refused to accept the truth about this deviant cult will have to live with
their concious.
Ahmed Yusuf
In article <5fhkt8$n...@lana.zippo.com>, QuranandHadithFollowers says...
>
>In article <5fg8qr$1794$1...@news.goodnet.com>, Mahmoud says...
>
> Abib , why are you afraid to say that " I AM RASHID KHALIFA FOLLOWER'.
>If you are not a submitter , why is your email under the SUBMITTER's home
>page , especially where the books are ordered? you are responsible for
Daud7
Bro Ahmed Yusuf;
Asalamu alaikum;
Do we need further illustration about this deviant cult who had sold his
hereafter for few pennies?. We fought hard to save our readers from such
devil thinking who be happy to misuse some quranic veres -after taking
out of its context- for Rashad Khalifa's ends.
It's honor to defend the sunah the second source of islamic sharia.
Btw, as always would be at the time of fitna, some simple minded people
fell in trap. With his smoke screening Abib and his deviant Kalifate not
only introduce his kufr agenda in foggy way into the this open forum , but
also gain to recruite into his camp some men whom their knowledge yet to
take off from ground. These men thought before that they were with rakbal
islaami, but this action and others had proven to all that they stand
alone in empty valley.
Let ducaads put enough attention to those Somalis who hide (or shade)
behind Cult Abib. It's time of flashing out these men before they infeject
their virus to healthy society.
Brothers, Ahme Yusuf, Heebaan, Waylac, Sh. Omar Khatib, M. Musa etc
etc!!? WHERE ARE YOU from this serious consequences?.
Abdi Isse Da'ud
Mohamud Cisman
Hallo,All.
This subject "Maanafaay" is wonderful. I didn´t read Maanafaay I have
to admit,but the discussion this article generated has been a
fascinating one. I thank the initiator.
I read "Ayaan daran" and "Cali maax" I didn´t read "Maanafaay" and
"Adeegto" However,I heard of them to be excellent works of arts.
From mid-eights new wave of books came to the market.Admittedly,most of
them were rubbish.There were some fine ones however which I would like
to share with you guys.
Has anyone read "Qiso kalgacal" wrote by Gurxan (I don´t know his full
name) I would to hear your criticism on the book. I read the book ,and
it was absolutely wonderful.The story was well-put together. It was so
good that ,by the time you finish,you become sick of love.I am not
exaggerating.The was a guy here in this discussion who said he knew
Gurxan and his friend/colleague Abdishakuur mire cobol.He may have read
the book and I would like to hear his criticism on the book.
Another book,which was equally excellent,was "Waan gefay" I read it in
1988 .I don´t remember the writer.It was really good book.The other
books I thoroughly enjoyed include "Ilin kulul" and "Murug jaceel"
"Ilin kulul" I have to admit, was a bit too melodramic but in a nice and
likeable way.The story was absorbing; it was kind of story that make you
cruise in another World.
Of the fifteen or so books I read, "Qiso kalgacal" and "Waan gefay"
were the best.The two books plus "Ayaan daran" were,I think,The best
fiction stories ever written in Somali language.The writers of these
three books deserve medals of honour for their contribution to the
Somali literature.
Most of the books that came to the market from Mid-eights onward had
poetries. For example, a book called "Shil jaceel" There were too much
poeties in that book. I don´t personally think it is such a good idea to
include poems in a fiction story.Poems and fiction stories should be
separated.Peace of poetry in a prose,this doesn´t happen in a real life
situation.I know it is wonderful if we can have one "geeraar" to say to
our girlfriends once in a while,but we have to construct it in advance
or borrow from someone. I mean,most of us can´t compose it the moment we
set eye on her .If the story is to fit in to a realism catogary,poems
should be excluded.
SOO BARI
MOHAMUD.
faisal hassan
On Sat, 8 Mar 1997, Mohamud Cisman wrote:
> =09Has anyone read "Qiso kalgacal" wrote by Gurxan (I don=B4t know his fu=
ll
> name) I would to hear your criticism on the book. I read the book ,and
> it was absolutely wonderful.The story was well-put together. It was so
> good that ,by the time you finish,you become sick of love.I am not
> exaggerating.The was a guy here in this discussion who said he knew
> Gurxan and his friend/colleague Abdishakuur mire cobol.He may have read
> the book and I would like to hear his criticism on the book.
Dear Cisman,
Hello once again. I personally happen to know Mr. Gurhan. His name is
Micheal Abraham Gurhan, formerly know as Mohamed Ibraahim Gurhan. I
haven't read his books but know that he was an excellent Somali writer. I
haven't heard of him for almost 10 years. (Therefore, I used in the past
tense) He is also a real good guy and a very creative human being. Do have
in your possession in this particular book or any of his other books? I
would like to read them?=20
Nabad
faisal hassan.
Mohamud Cisman
Hallo,Faisal.
I am sorry I don´t have any of his books in my possession.You knew Mr
Gurxan. Well,as I said in my previous post he was a hell of a writer.
There were other fine writers,too.Cisman cabdinuur xaashi was one of
them.He wrote short stories for Radio Muqdisho(He should not be confused
with Cabdinuur Sheekh Maxamed Isxaaq of BBC,who used to be Radio
Muqdisho reporter)He was the presenter of Radio Muqdisho´s "Sheeko
gaaban" that was aired Wednesday afternoons.The programme was very
popular indeed.The way he told the stories,he was a master of
description.
There was another fellow who wrote short stories for the "Xiddigta
Oktoobar" His name is Awees cabdulle. He was also marvalous.
Anyone knows these guys????.
SOO BARI
MOHAMUD.
faisal hassan
On Sun, 9 Mar 1997, Mohamud Cisman wrote:
> Hallo,Faisal.=20
>I am sorry I don=B4t have any of his books in my possession.You knew Mr
> Gurxan. Well,as I said in my previous post he was a hell of a writer.
Dear Cisman,
Do you know where Mr. Gurhan lives today? What's he doing? Still writing
those fine books; as you described in your writing? Do you also know my
old friend Micheal Abharam Gurhan?
> There were other fine writers,too.Cisman cabdinuur xaashi was one of
> them.
I knew someone whose name starts with Abdi but I have lost contact and not
know his ful name. He could be Cabdinuur or Cabdinasir?
I knew so many talented writers in old days in Qoryooleey and Mogadishu?
Do you write short stories and novels? Are you planing to set up your own
publications? Then, I can help you find talented writers. I am
self-oppointed agent for my old friends! If wish to attract
Somali writers please contact me. I read first and recommend for
publications. If you are not interested and would like to exchange ideas
of composing stories and its development stages and publication. Still, we
can exchange opinion, and viewpoints.
Nabad
faisal hassan.
Abdullahi Abukar
Burhaan Warsame (bwar...@sfu.ca) wrote:
: Abdullahi Abukar (cc...@torfree.net) wrote:
: : In general, Burhaan, I think the supply and demand for Somali literature
: : is still unbalanced. It doesn't matter how you publish as long as you
: : have readers, and that is how things are up till now in Somalia.
Today, in
: : Mogadisho alone, there are about 10 different papers published
: : daily/weekly, and they all use small duplicating machines. Anyways, I
hope
: : that I gave you general idea about publishing in Somalia.
: Of the 10 you mentioned, I have seen probably the biggest two: Qaran and
: Xog-ogaal. I have also seen some from other cities. They are all typed
: on 81/2 x 11 pages, approxiamtely 6-14 pages. Very basic letters with,
: sometimes, photocopied pictures, but people read them and that is what
: matters.
Precisely Burhaan.
The publishing market in Somalia now and then is, IMO, one of the most
competative markets in the country. There never was any goverment
involvement such as regulations etc after the manuscript passes the
cencorship department of the NSS. Authors were their own promoters,
publishers, producers, and distributors. I am sure you can imagine the
hardwork which involves in all that, but if you consider the reward, its
all worth it. If you know how to deal with vendors at newstands and at the
Afar- irdoodka, you can make decent living out of it.
Burhaan, I think many Somalis who could have been great contributors to
our culture do not know that it doesn't take many thousands of dollars or
big publishing firms to publish for the Somali audience. Some of them
specially some socalled "big shots" are really out of touch with the
public since their books are not for Somalis. I don't know if their idea
of writing is solely for monetary purposes. However, all sorts of Somali
literature such as children's books, education material in all fields,
history, cooking books etc. are all needed in our bookshelves. The
question is how to make market for these new subjects?
Nabaadiino,
Cabdullaahi Abuukar.
Ps. Thanks Burhaan for a wonderful topic. I think you should be awarded
"The Host of The Month" for this particular thread. I believe it is much
to do with carrying conversation rather than presenting a topic.
: ---
: bwarsame
--
o ______"Xornimo, barwaaqo, iyo horumar
/\_ _| | waxay ku xiran yihiin *nabad*"
_\__`[________|
] [ \, ][ ][
Abdullahi Abukar
Dear Mohamud,
I agree with you that "Qiso Kalgacal" was an excellent story. Gurxan's
stories are really cupturing and stylish. The one I liked most by Gurxan
was "Walaashay Shukri" (Muqdisho 1988; Taxanaha Iftiin). The other
writter you mentioned from "Xiddigta Oktoobar" was Aweys Xuseen Xasan
"Shiino" who wrote many short stories such as the popular "Bayer No. 8".
Aweys Shiino is the undisputed king of short stories, and was my
menthor-:)
By the way, I agree with you that many of the books that come out in the
80s were poorly written. Many inexperienced writers were able to publish,
but there was an exclusive club called "Taxanaha Iftiin" which consisted
some of the best writers in the business.
I will comment leter , insha Allah, the other point that you made about
the poems in the stories. Thanks for sharing your thoughts about Somali
stories.
Nabaadiino,
Cabdullaahi Abuukar.
Ps. Mohamud, was Xaashi the guy who sounds like Idaajaa? He was an
excellent story teller though.
Mohamud Cisman (mohamud...@pp.kolumbus.fi) wrote:
: Hallo,Faisal.
: I am sorry I don´t have any of his books in my possession.You knew Mr
: Gurxan. Well,as I said in my previous post he was a hell of a writer.
: There were other fine writers,too.Cisman cabdinuur xaashi was one of
: them.He wrote short stories for Radio Muqdisho(He should not be confused
: with Cabdinuur Sheekh Maxamed Isxaaq of BBC,who used to be Radio
: Muqdisho reporter)He was the presenter of Radio Muqdisho´s "Sheeko
: gaaban" that was aired Wednesday afternoons.The programme was very
: popular indeed.The way he told the stories,he was a master of
: description.
: There was another fellow who wrote short stories for the "Xiddigta
: Oktoobar" His name is Awees cabdulle. He was also marvalous.
: Anyone knows these guys????.
:
: SOO BARI
: MOHAMUD.
Mohamud Cisman
The other
> writter you mentioned from "Xiddigta Oktoobar" was Aweys Xuseen Xasan "Shiino"
You are right. He was Aweys Xuseen Xasan "Shiino" Thanks for correcting
me.Mr "Shiino was a great writer. I am not sure whether I read the"Bayer
No.8" I don´t remember the title. May be I read it without any order.The
ones I read very regularly include"Alla maxaa i fududeeyey" It was a
well-written story. Very entertaining indeed.I followed that series from
the begining to the very ending: to the very bitter ending indeed.You
may have read it. Just in case you don´t remember the title,let me tell
you very brief extract.
The story begins with a young nurse, who lives with her aunt in
Mogdisho. Her family lives in Marka. She becomes involved with a
Doctor,who is from Marka as well.He has a wife and children in Marka,but
he lives in playboy lifestyle in Mogdisho. He tells her that he is
free,ie no wife no kids.In time she becomes deeply in love with him.One
thing leads to another, and they end up in bed.She becomes pregnant.As a
result, her aunt kicks her out.One afternoon she visits him.He has
already given her a key, so she lets herself in only to catch him
sleeping with another woman.Then as she finds out that nobody cares her
in Mogdisho,she decides to go back to Marka.She knows in advance that
her parents won´t wellcome her. Fortunately,an old friend ( a lady whose
husband lives in Mogdisho for work) wellcomes
her.She moves in with her.She learns with great shock,however, that her
friend´s husband is the very man-Doctor-who has gotten her pregnant; the
very man who has become the reason why she has had to leave Mogdisho.
Now she faces a dilemma; she can´t leave because she has nowhere else
to live;she can´t stay with the family whose breadwinner has gotten her
pregnant.However, she decides to stay on regardless. After the initial
shock she considers what to do next; to tell her friend the whole story
or not.It becomes apparent to her that if she tells her friend, it would
be the end of that family.So she decides to keep silent.To make a long
story short ,the Doctor learns that she lives with his wife ,and that
she hasn´t told what happened to anyone.Later,he is transferred back to
Marka.
One day he calls her in to the living room to ask forgiveness.In the
meantime,his wife,who is about to enter the living room,overheard the
conversation and stops behind the curtain.She listens all the story.She
explodes at him like a bomb.Needless to say the fimaly gets
divorced.That is what she has been avoiding!!!!
I excluded many details,and the story is not as entertaining as it
would have been,if Mr Shiino wrote it.But that is the story in a
netshell.
You may have read it.If not, enjoy it now(and I will bill you
later,KAFTAN) as you were a great fan of Mr Shiino.
> Ps. Mohamud, was Xaashi the guy who sounds like Idaajaa?
Yes, he was that guy.
SOO BARRI:
MOHAMUD:
PS; piracy isn´t it,laakin bililiqo waa banaantahay waqtigaan.KAFTAN:
Mohamud Cisman
faisal hassan wrote:
>
> On Sun, 9 Mar 1997, Mohamud Cisman wrote:
> > Hallo,Faisal.
> >I am sorry I don´t have any of his books in my possession.You knew Mr
> > Gurxan. Well,as I said in my previous post he was a hell of a writer.
>
>
> Do you know where Mr. Gurhan lives today? What's he doing? Still writing
> those fine books; as you described in your writing? Do you also know my
> old friend Micheal Abharam Gurhan?
>
>
> I knew someone whose name starts with Abdi but I have lost contact and not
> know his ful name. He could be Cabdinuur or Cabdinasir?
> I knew so many talented writers in old days in Qoryooleey and Mogadishu?
> Do you write short stories and novels? Are you planing to set up your own
> publications? Then, I can help you find talented writers. I am
> self-oppointed agent for my old friends! If wish to attract
> Somali writers please contact me. I read first and recommend for
> publications. If you are not interested and would like to exchange ideas
> of composing stories and its development stages and publication. Still, we
> can exchange opinion, and viewpoints.
> Nabad
> faisal hassan.
Hallo,Faisal.
I don´t know Mr Gurxan.I just read his books.I have wanted for quite
some time to write a book.But I haven´t started yet,because I am too
busy for the time being.I appreciate your offer though.Thanks.
SOO BARRI:
MOHAMUD;
agu...@aol.com
bwar...@sfu.ca (Burhaan Warsame) writes:
>Hirad, thanks!
>I'll be knocking on your door soon :)
Burhan, Hirad and others;
Don't you think it would be better if we buy an entry level web server, a router and a phone line (I will pay my share), scan the books Hirad said are in his possesion and store them on the server making them available to everyone? The server would even pay for itself eventually if the Somali businesses in N. America buy some of the space.
I read only about three or four of the books which were discused in his thread and would like to read another two or three though I am not a fan of fiction. However, I can't go all the way to the US and knock the door of a man who once flamed me beyond reason :-)
I would be better off if I contribute some money for the purchase of the server and read those books online.
We could create a Somali virtual library (remember we have a virtual parliament already) and improve the communication skills of many youngesters who never had any chance to read Somali literature. I know some young people who can read and write the Somali language despite the fact that they are born in this country! That, I think, is due to the efforts of their good parents. Some of them are in universities now and would appreciate more online Somali literature.
A. Gulled
faisal hassan
On Tue, 11 Mar 1997, Mohamud Cisman wrote:
=2EI have wanted for quite
> some time to write a book.But I haven=B4t started yet,because I am too
> busy for the time being.I appreciate your offer though.Thanks.
Dear Cisman,
You are most welcome.
nabad
faisal hassan.
faisal hassan
On 11 Mar 1997 agu...@aol.com wrote:
>
> Don't you think it would be better if we buy an entry level web server,
>a router and a phone line (I will pay my share), scan the books Hirad
>said are in his possesion and store them on the server making them
>available to everyone? The server would even pay for itself eventually if
the Somali businesses in N. America buy some of the space.
Dear Gulled,
Bad idea to store all those interesting and well written Somali
literature. What about the COPY RIGHTS. Whose property is it? I don't
think your proposal is reasonable at all.
Why don't we encourage Somali "duukaankayda" to invest Somali books and
bring the newly and old published books in Somali so that those who can
afford buy them in the neighborhood store!
Don't forget the time, energy, and resources these writers put into those
literatures. Recently, A Somali friend visited Toronto and I have asked
him to bring a Somali "Hees" cajalad. I have asked him to bring newly
released Somali songs. To my surprise he told me new Somali bands who are
using the "songs" of well known Musician and NO ONE IS SAYING ANYTHING
ABOUT IT.AND THESE INDIVIDUALS ARE USING THE CREATIVITY AND THE COPY
RIGHTS OF OTHERS WITH OUT THE CONSENT OF THE OWNERS OF THESE SONGS.Too
bad for these Somali musicians whose songs is taken away from them. Waxa
kale oo la yaabay markaan dhagastay hees uu qof dumar ahi ay gaadi jiray
oo ay iminka ay gaadayaan (Wiil) is-moodaya in uu yahay (fanaan).
We should not allow these kind of (criminal act) in the Somali literature
such as books etc. The writers COPY RIGHT AND THE WRITERS FULL PERMITIONS
MUST BE OBTAINED BEFORE ANYONE TAKES ANY INTERNET LIBARARY OF THE WORK OF
OTHERS.
nabad
faisal hassan.
agu...@aol.com
In article <Pine.NEB.3.95.970310...@callisto.uwinnipeg.ca>, faisal hassan <fha...@callisto.uwinnipeg.ca> writes:
>Subject: Re: Maanafaay
>From: faisal hassan <fha...@callisto.uwinnipeg.ca>
>Date: Mon, 10 Mar 1997 09:58:35 -0600
>
>
>
>On Sun, 9 Mar 1997, Mohamud Cisman wrote:
>> Hallo,Faisal.=20
>>I am sorry I don=B4t have any of his books in my possession.You knew Mr
>> Gurxan. Well,as I said in my previous post he was a hell of a writer.
>
>Dear Cisman,
>
>Do you know where Mr. Gurhan lives today? What's he doing? Still writing
>those fine books; as you described in your writing? Do you also know my
>old friend Micheal Abharam Gurhan?
>
>> There were other fine writers,too.Cisman cabdinuur xaashi was one of
>> them.
>
>I knew someone whose name starts with Abdi but I have lost contact and not
>know his ful name. He could be Cabdinuur or Cabdinasir?
>I knew so many talented writers in old days in Qoryooleey and Mogadishu?
Faisal;
Are you Jama Barruur's son? I didn't know you were from Qoryooleey really.
A. Gulled
faisal hassan
On 12 Mar 1997 agu...@aol.com wrote:
> Faisal;
> Are you Jama Barruur's son? I didn't know you were from Qoryooleey really.
> A. Gulled
I am not Jama Baruur's son. In Qoryooleey, Boarding school i.e, Qoryooleey
High School. I am the Son of Ahmed Hassan Doble.
Nabad
faisal hassan.
agu...@aol.com
In a message dated 3/11/97 11:58:11PM, you write:
The writers COPY RIGHT AND THE WRITERS FULL PERMITIONS
>MUST BE OBTAINED BEFORE ANYONE TAKES ANY INTERNET LIBARARY OF THE WORK OF
>OTHERS.
>nabad
faisal hassan.
I could never agree with you more. How could I forget about the intellectual property laws? Of course we have to seek the permission of the authors first . Thank you for remindimg me.
A. Gulled
faisal hassan
Folks, Cavers, netters and ladies and gentlemen:
Subject: The problem in Somalia: All you need is a Kazoo and a dream.
Written by UNKNOWN WRITER. So critize, analysis, and a Kazoo and a dream;
is it enough? Isn't what Somalis are loking for?
Earlier in the week, Joe, who you could the producer of Feff world (myself
being the talent), suggested that I should write a weekly Whack on
censorship on the internet. After he uploaded me a series of graphs and
pie charts showing how such a Whack would appeal to a large number of
people on the Web, I thought it may be a good idea to do it. But then I
figured, the hell with that, I don't feel like wasting my time defending
my rights as an American, so if you want to learn about censorship go to
the Usenet or something. As for now, let's talk about Kazoos and the
trouble in Somalia.
As you may remember, back to that one month the press still cared, there
were a bunch of starving people in Somalia and we sent troops there as
part of an U.N. effort. As many U.N. ventures, nothing was accomplished,
and we lost money and lives. Well, being an armchair U.N. ambassador, I
drew up a plan on how we could really solve the problem in Somalia.
To put my plan in effect, all is needed is for all of the members of the
U.N. to chip in and build a series of Kazoo factories in Mogadishu (God
bless you). In these factories, all the woman in Somalia, over the age of
21, will be employed on the assembly line making the Kazoos, bringing home
a sack of rice each month. Then, we wouldn't sell the finished product,
but give them away to all male Somalians (Somalis) over the age of 21. Now
the U.N. would lose a lot of money in this program, but they don't care
since most of it is coming from USA anyway. O.K., so now we have Somalian
(Somalis) women working in the factory, and Somalian (Somalis) men with a
Kazoo that they don't have the slightest clue what it is or how to use it.
Well, my next step in my plan would be to send in the Peace Corps to give
lessons on how to play the Kazoo to the males (citizen of Somalia). But
while they were there, the peace corps would also build a boardwalk on the
coast that would be loaded with White owned and operated Casinos and
brothels (prostitute houses for sexual pleasures). This would boost up the
tourist industry in Somalia greatly. People from all over the world would
come to Somalia to gamble and clean out their pipes, without worrying
about being hassled by the natives who would be too busy working in a
factory, or playing the Kazoo.
Now you may be wondering how this plan would help the people of Somalia.
You see, the white owners of the Casinos and brothels would become so
indepedently wealthly that a great deal of money would surely trickle down
to the starving Somalians (Somalis) in the form of CHARITY. All that these
backward third-world countries need is a good dose of Reagan-nomics.
So, in conclusion, censorship is wrong, the USA should get out of the U.N.
and its about time that gambling and prostitution are made legal
thoughout America, and the world.
--------End of his discussion----------
Paternalism, Prostitution, gambling is the solution to our problems. I'll
try to bring you the perspective of this STRATEGIST PERSON. Who is
advocating the end of Somalia, we know it. Get involve and oppose these
kinds of STRATEGISTS. What do you think his analysis, rationale and logic.
Nabad
Faisal Hassan.
ELGAAB
Faisal,
With due all respect; how can we talk about "copy rights", while in
Somalia the human rights don't even exist?
Bye
Abdi
Atlanat, GA
faisal hassan
On 14 Mar 1997, ELGAAB wrote:
> Faisal,
> With due all respect; how can we talk about "copy rights", while in
> Somalia the human rights don't even exist?
Dear ELGAAB,
Human rights issues and "COPY RIGHTS" are two different subjects. Ha isku
gasin caano iyo caro. Labadu isma raacaane.
nabad
faisal hassan.
Mohamud Cisman
> I just finished Baadidon Jaceyl and I think it was super!
Hallo Sahra.
The name seems to be familiar. I am not too sure. Was it written in the
diaspora,or back in Somalia? In either case,I would love to read it.If
it was written in the diaspora,can you tell me where I can get it. I
really love Somali novels. You said that Abukar writes stories. Has he
ever published any story in the diaspora to your knowledge? If yes,I
would like to know where I can get it.
SOO BARI
MOHAMUD.
cod...@gmail.com
> Is it accurate to say that 'Maanafaay', the book by Maxamed Daahir Afrax,
> was the first novel published in the Somali language? If not, can we
> ascertain which novel should be graced with that honour?
>
> Also, what were some of the memorable novels you read in the mother
> tangue? Who wrote them? Please comment on the production and content
> quality of those books (i.e. the physical "look" of the book -including
> print, binding, cover design, etc.- and the storyline, its effectiveness)
>
> Thanks in advance..
>
> ---
> bwarsame
Buugaas Nin miyi iyo markab waxaan akhriyay anoo aha class ka 8aad dadayduna ahayd 15 jir aad baanay u adkayd in buug noocaas oo kalaa aad akhridaa wakhtigaa 2005 magaalada Hargeisa, wuxuuna ahaa book aan aad uga helay saamayn na ku yeeshay naftayda hadadan aan qoraalkan soo post garaynayo waxaan raadinayay meel aan ka heli karo book gaas oo aad ilaahada naftaydu u raadinayso wallahi waa buug intaan akhriyay buugaag ka qiimo badan aniga naftayda waana buugii u horeeyeen noloshayda akhriyo ee novel ah, mana ilaawi doono noloshayda waxaanan u baahanay inaan book gaas aan helo please meel aan ka heli karo cid garanaysaa haday jirto wllo ha ila soo socodsiiso meelkastaba hayaalee waan u baahanay insha allah.
