Scotland before Pylons
Eh?
Our campaign starts in the area around Ullapool, which is affected by a
proposal to build a high voltage overhead power line to take energy
from wind farms in the Western Isles to cities in the south. This power
line, if built, would be supported on steel pylons 50 metres (164 feet)
high, and would be clearly visible in the view above. The most likely
route of the power line runs from Ardmair, near Ullapool, to Beauly,
passing through areas varying from idyllic coastal, to wild mountains,
to rural farmland - all of which should be protected from what is, in
effect, a major industrial development.
A public consultation last year considered five alternative routes for
the power line, which have now been narrowed down to two. Both traverse
areas of great natural beauty in the Highlands, and affect communities
whose economies depend to a large extent on tourism. It is well known
that a major attraction of the Highlands, to both locals and visitors
alike, is unspoilt scenery, and we are therefore opposed to both of
these possible routes. There are other alternatives that have not been
mentioned in the public consultation document, and it is vital that
these are considered before a preferred route for the power line is
chosen. These best alternative, put simply, is for an undersea cable
taking the electricity south to England, and we will continue to
campaign for this to be considered. Read more about our arguments for
alternatives to pylons.
The Ardmair/Ullapool to Beauly line is just the first link in a very
long chain of transmission lines that is being proposed to take
electricity from the north of Scotland to the south. Beyond Beauly, the
route continues with a new 400kV transmission line running to Denny in
the central belt of Scotland. However, Scotland is currently a net
exporter of electricity, and it will therefore be necessary to
reinforce the network further south through the borders. At the final
destination, work is already in hand in London, with the construction
of a new 400kV line underground - the London Connection.
At a more general level, we are faced with a conundrum. On the one hand
we are firmly in favour of increased use of renewable energy sources.
On the other hand, we believe that Scottish landscapes are a national
asset of immense value, that should not be ruined with industrial
installations. The solution seems increasingly clear - the true future
of renewable energy lies off-shore, with tidal, wave, and off-shore
wind power, and considering this we believe that a system of undersea
cables off both east and west coasts represents the best value for
money in the long term.
HBP is also forming links with communities affected by the Beauly to
Denny power line upgrade, and at the other end of the line, with those
on Lewis affected by the wind farm proposals. If it transpires that a
route is chosen that runs through other areas of the Highlands, we will
work with communities affected, should they wish to oppose the pylons
proposals in their area. On an international scale, HBP has joined
other anti-pylon groups to form a European Federation against High
Voltage Power Lines.
This web site aims to provide what we believe is clear and unbiased
information relating to the core issues, drawn from all sides of the
debate. Once you have had a look, and made your mind up, we hope that
you will feel sufficiently motivated to write a few letters objecting
to the power line proposals.
ib011...@blueyonder.co.uk
You are against new bigger plyons,but you do not follow the logic of
your argument and demand no pylons at all.
Are the current pylons,1950/1960s design I think,attractive and do they
add something positive to the landscape,of course not but even you
people do not want to go back to pre 1940s pre Hydro Board highland
life with almost no electricity.
What about roads,the roads spoil the look of the highlands,lets tear up
all the roads.
In fact lets expel all the people from the highlands,even the English
people with beards who form the majority of people in groups like
yours.
If you don't want bigger pylons,what is the solution?,bury the cables
at great costs and make it harder to repair any faults.
Bet you are against windfarms as well,and mobile phone masks but I bet
you have a mobile phone
Josiah Jenkins
ib011...@blueyonder.co.uk :
>you people annoy me.
Well, at least we got a reaction (no pun intended)
>
>You are against new bigger plyons,but you do not follow the logic of
>your argument and demand no pylons at all.
High tension cables lying on the ground tend to barbecue
the wildlife. This is a "bad thing" (TM)
>
>Are the current pylons,1950/1960s design I think,attractive and do they
>add something positive to the landscape,of course not but even you
>people do not want to go back to pre 1940s pre Hydro Board highland
>life with almost no electricity.
Glory be, he's stopped for breath.
Nowt wrong with oil lamps, when I were a nipper . . . . . . . . . . .
>
>What about roads,the roads spoil the look of the highlands,lets tear up
>all the roads.
Hey, wait a minute, there are speed limits on those roads.
You can't just tear up them at will !
>
>In fact lets expel all the people from the highlands,even the English
>people with beards who form the majority of people in groups like
>yours.
Quite right, the Clearances got rid of most of them,
let's get rid of the rest.
>
>If you don't want bigger pylons,what is the solution?,bury the cables
>at great costs and make it harder to repair any faults.
While you're digging up the roads you could bury them in the holes
left. But what's the point, we just evicted everyone.
>Bet you are against windfarms as well,and mobile phone masks but I bet
>you have a mobile phone
Yeah but it doesn't have a mask.
Where can I buy one ?
-- JJJ
allan connochie
<ib011...@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote in message
news:1128455092.7...@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> In fact lets expel all the people from the highlands,even the English
> people with beards who form the majority of people in groups like
> yours.
Right hands up all you English people with beards :-)
Allan
Rab C Nesbitt
"Josiah Jenkins" <josiah-...@dsl.pipex.com> wrote in message
news:n4s5k19je8pcr22em...@4ax.com...
The Pylons - Stephen Spender
(1933 I think....)
The secret of these hills was stone, and cottages
Of that stone made,
And crumbling roads
That turned on sudden hidden villages.
Now over these small hills, they have built the concrete
That trails black wire;
Pylons, those pillars
Bare like nude giant girls that have no secret.
The valley with its gilt and evening look
And the green chestnut
Of customary root,
Are mocked dry like the parched bed of a brook.
But far above and far as sight endures
Like whips of anger
With lightning's danger
There runs the quick perspective of the future.
This dwarfs our emerald country by its trek
So tall with prophecy:
Dreaming of cities
Where often clouds shall lean their swan-white neck.
Ian Morrison
Eh?
With a tremendous bang.
Just like in Iraq ... no thats oil pipelines.
English women with beards :-) are the pits
Cory Bhreckan
> allan connochie wrote:
>
>> <ib011...@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote in message
>> news:1128455092.7...@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
>>
>>> In fact lets expel all the people from the highlands,even the English
>>> people with beards who form the majority of people in groups like
>>> yours.
>>
>>
>>
>> Right hands up all you English people with beards :-)
>
>
> Me! Me!
>
> (OK, I'm lying...)
>
I could just see you with a beard. Madra Dudh would just *love* you to
have one. A Karl Marx beard or at least a Vladimir (Lenin) Ulyanov (sp?)
one on you would justify his whole world view. No, wait, it would have
to be a weaselly one for taxanomical purposes... I forgot, are weasels
socialists or are socialists weasels, I always get those muddled. Don't
the *nglish call them "stoats"?
I used to have a weaselly beard, back when I had long hair.
Josiah Jenkins
Bhreckan <cbhr...@maelstrom.net> :
But you were never a "stoater", were you ?
-- JJJ
Lachie
sparing prose of Rambaud and displaying the suave and sophisticated
disposition of Archibald Leach, sgrìobh allan connochie
Heavens man, why would you want to put your hands up them and is beard a
euphemism for something else?
--
Lachie.
An t'Airm breac dearg
Adam Whyte-Settlar
"allan connochie" <al...@EASYNET.CO.UK> wrote in message
news:4343...@news.greennet.net...
Not me, I've just shaved. But I've just been informed that I *do* have a
small tuft of hair sticking out the back of my head that I missed with my
hair clippers earlier on today.
Does that count?
A W-S
Lachie
No.
--
Lachie.
'We English, who are a marvellous people, are really very generous to Scotland.'
Margaret Thatcher. The Times, 12 February 1990.
Lesley Robertson
> at great costs and make it harder to repair any faults.
If you bury the cables, they don't fall down every time there's a storm...
Saves money on repair crews and compensation... And the landscape looks
better.
Lesley Robertson
williemeikle
I recently went on holiday to Canada. Beautiful place, no pylons at all
in the areas I went to. They successfully hide their power lines
underground, so I see no reason why we couldn't do the same.
Lachie
Yeah but no but, fast jet jockeys wouldn't have anything to fly under,
therefore inducing a deadly silence later in the mess.
--
Lachie.
He who would learn to fly one day must first learn to stand and walk and run and
climb and dance; one cannot fly into flying.
Freddie Nietzsche
Adam Whyte-Settlar
"Lesley Robertson" <l.a.ro...@tnw.tudelft.nl> wrote in message
news:11927$434394f7$82a1f636$19...@news2.tudelft.nl...
A W-S
Lesley Robertson
"Lachie" <noos@[127.0.0.1]> wrote in message
news:JfLehNK9...@paradise.by.the.dashboard.light...
> sgrìobh Lesley Robertson
>
>>
>><ib011...@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote in message
>>news:1128455092.7...@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
>>> If you don't want bigger pylons,what is the solution?,bury the cables
>>> at great costs and make it harder to repair any faults.
>>
>>If you bury the cables, they don't fall down every time there's a storm...
>>Saves money on repair crews and compensation... And the landscape looks
>>better.
>
> Yeah but no but, fast jet jockeys wouldn't have anything to fly under,
> therefore inducing a deadly silence later in the mess.
>
Lesley Robertson
(who once had a pilot wave to her as he went by below the top of Glas Maol)
Lesley Robertson
"Adam Whyte-Settlar" <grawi...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:4343...@clear.net.nz...
tunnel. Expensive startup costs, but once it's done, it's done.
Lesley Robertson
Cory Bhreckan
I refuse to answer that question on the grounds that I can't remember.
David Hansen
Robertson" <l.a.ro...@tnw.tudelft.nl> wrote this:-
>> You've never tried to dig a trench through solid granite have you?
>>
>You drill a narrow tunnel and put the cables into tubes that go into the
>tunnel. Expensive startup costs, but once it's done, it's done.
Underground runs are rather more complicated than that, according to
http://www.nationalgrid.com/uk/library/brochures/overhead_underground/mn_insulation.html
"So, the underground conductor has to be bigger than its overhead
counterpart to reduce its electrical resistance and hence the heat
produced. This leads to a conductor up to four times bigger for the
same amount of electricity transmitted. As many as 12 separate
cables may be needed for a 400 kV underground transmission circuit.
Each cable needs to be well-spaced from others for good heat
dissipation and installed at a depth of about a metre to ensure
safety. Four separate trenches, each containing three cables, may be
needed to match an overhead line.
"What this means is that installing underground circuits entails
construction activity amounting to the width of a dual carriageway.
The total width required ranges from 15 to 30 metres, depending
mainly on the power to be transmitted, but also on local details
like soil conditions and cable engineering. The amount of soil and
rock excavated is more than 30 times greater than for the equivalent
length of overhead line where only pylon foundations are required."
Since the recent "Englishisation" of the electricity system in
Scotland the company does have some influence here, but their views
can still be regarded as independent of the promoters of the Beauly
- Denny line, which I am in favour of.
--
David Hansen, Edinburgh | PGP email preferred-key number F566DA0E
I will always explain revoked keys, unless the UK government
prevents me by using the RIP Act 2000.
Lesley Robertson
"Custos Custodum" <m...@privacy.net> wrote in message
news:bnj7k1dok5npaeh2n...@4ax.com...
> It's not quite that straightforward. Running AC power cables
> underground is less efficient. The cables will have to be insulated,
> which adds to the initial cost, but perhaps more significantly the
> capacitances between the phases, and to ground, will be that much
> greater because of the cables' closer proximity to each other and to
> ground. Since these capacitances are not 'ideal', there will be
> dielectric losses in them. DC distribution would circumvent this
> problem but it too has drawbacks in the form of higher infrastructure
> and maintenance costs.
>
I wonder how they've managed to do it over here in sunny Europe if it's so
hard.... We've not had a weather-related power failure in all the years I've
been here.
Lesley Robertson
David Hansen
Robertson" <l.a.ro...@tnw.tudelft.nl> wrote this:-
>I wonder how they've managed to do it over here in sunny Europe
Plenty of photographs of electricity pylons in the Netherlands at
http://users.castel.nl/~berka01/home.htm
David Hansen
<willie...@btinternet.com> wrote this:-
>I recently went on holiday to Canada. Beautiful place, no pylons at all
>in the areas I went to. They successfully hide their power lines
>underground, so I see no reason why we couldn't do the same.
The caption that goes with
http://www.gorge.org/pylons/2005/kozicky/4.jpg says that it is the
building of a 500kV line in Canada.
Charles Ellson
The extra costs involved in burying tend to greatly exceed the cost of
repairing whatever gets blown down occasionally otherwise they'd be
buried in the first place. That's without the bother of the legal and
mechanical hassle of digging a dirty great trench (it's not a case of
just chucking the cable in the ground as can be done with
communications cables) and keeping the water out of the cables. IIRC
there's also a requirement for cooling of buried cables, something not
needed if you just string them up in the air.
--
_______
+---------------------------------------------------+ |\\ //|
| Charles Ellson: cha...@e11son.demon.co.uk | | \\ // |
+---------------------------------------------------+ | > < |
| // \\ |
Alba gu brath |//___\\|
Teachdaire
<cbhr...@maelstrom.net> wrote:
>I used to have a weaselly beard, back when I had long hair.
Are you certain it wasn't a "Badger Beard?"
I Prefer Beaver, Myself,
---Teachdaire
Jackie Mulheron
<l.a.ro...@tnw.tudelft.nl> wrote:
>
><ib011...@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote in message
>news:1128455092.7...@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
>> If you don't want bigger pylons,what is the solution?,bury the cables
>> at great costs and make it harder to repair any faults.
>
>If you bury the cables, they don't fall down every time there's a storm...
>Saves money on repair crews and compensation... And the landscape looks
>better.
They should clear it of people and knock down their houses as well to make
it look even better and "unspoilt".
Lachie
They have done that already silly. When the nice men decided the Hielans
needed woolly maggots.
BTW, I was a shepherd I was. Never used my teeth though.
--
Lachie.
It was irritating to have one's physical shortcomings pointed out quite so
plainly twice in one evening, once by a beautiful girl and once by a dying badger.
Tom Holt.
Jackie Mulheron
"Lachie" <noos@[127.0.0.1]> wrote in message
> Capturing in this missive on, Sat, 8 Oct 2005, at 16:55:58, with the
> sparing prose of Rambaud and displaying the suave and sophisticated
> disposition of Archibald Leach, sgrìobh Jackie Mulheron
>
>>On Wed, 5 Oct 2005 10:55:18 +0200, "Lesley Robertson"
>><l.a.ro...@tnw.tudelft.nl> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>><ib011...@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote in message
>>>news:1128455092.7...@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
>>>> If you don't want bigger pylons,what is the solution?,bury the cables
>>>> at great costs and make it harder to repair any faults.
>>>
>>>If you bury the cables, they don't fall down every time there's a
>>>storm...
>>>Saves money on repair crews and compensation... And the landscape looks
>>>better.
>>
>>They should clear it of people and knock down their houses as well to make
>>it look even better and "unspoilt".
>>
>>
> They have done that already silly.
Some seem to have sneaked back in at Dalwhinnie and some various points
north of that. I viewed some running around a field despoiling the landscape
with goal posts and curvy sticks recently.
> When the nice men decided the Hielans needed woolly maggots.
Which, along with their steaming mounds of shit scattered all over the place
and carcasses lying by the road sides and in gullies, somehow don't despoil
the landscape.
Odd that.
> BTW, I was a shepherd I was. Never used my teeth though.
You should have put them in then :-0