More brainwashed, naive, stupid euro idealists.
Blunt Force Trauma
poor misunderstood, but nice fellas.
Holding a knife to your throat is just their way of telling you how much
they love you.
The two Simonas say terrorism is perfectly OK. It's just resisting. It's
natural to blow up 40 little kids instead of resisting at the ballot box,
don't you know? Maybe the two Simonas are gonna start their own Red
Brigades?
Italy would have been better off if they had both been beheaded. They should
leave the cowardly appeasement to the Germans, French and Spanish.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/3710736.stm
All those ETA guys...let them out of jail! They was just kiddin' around when
they blew up that train. It's just resitance. It's OK.
Beslan? Can't you Russians take a joke? It was just resistance. It's OK.
DeMaisonneuve
"Blunt Force Trauma" <yryr...@bvcbcbc.com> wrote in message
news:c1R7d.28219$kq6.17...@news4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net...
Not that I have particularly good feelings toward muslims in general, but in
this case (Irak, not Chechnia), I understand the resistance. If an army
decided to illegally invade my homeland to steal its ressources and
destroyed its infrastructures, I would certainly have some toughts about
joining the resistance. Maybe French should not have resisted the German
invasion in WW2? Is that what you suggest?
Blunt Force Trauma
"DeMaisonneuve" <lu...@me.ca> wrote in message
news:1cT7d.678$Ii....@fe51.usenetserver.com...
Most of them didn't.
Most of the ETA terrorists live in France. Iguess they figure France is a
safe haven for terrorists?
>
>
>
Montesquiou
"Blunt Force Trauma" <yryr...@bvcbcbc.com> a écrit dans le message de news:
JuT7d.28322$kq6.17...@news4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net...
You have no idea how stupid is your post : )
http://edition.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/europe/10/03/france.eta.ap/
"ETA militants have long crossed into the peaceful Basque provinces of
southwest France to take refuge or make plans. French and Spanish
authorities closely cooperate to hunt them down."
The cooperation between France and Spain against terrorism is exemplar since
several years. Even during the Asnar Gvnt.
France and Spain are doing what Bu$h fail to do : To fight terrorism by
cooperation of the international Intelligence.
It is why I don't believe the fight of terrorism to be a priority of Bu$h
: )
Blunt Force Trauma
"Montesquiou" <Monte...@Montesquiou.org> wrote in message
news:41600854$0$25462$8fcf...@news.wanadoo.fr...
The large numbers of ETA terrorists now being picked up in France merely
highlights how little France has done previously. These terrorists did not
beam down from the starship Enterprise. They are there because the French
are soft on terrorism and they have been there for a long time.
Of course the French are now cooperating with the Spanish. The Spanish
wimped out on Iraq. The French would not be helping the Spanish cowards if
they were still in Iraq. It also doesn't look good when the Spanish go to
the UN and accuse the French of harboring terrorists.
Montesquiou
LOL !
I like it when morons show how stupid and bad informed they are : )
http://www.onwar.com/aced/data/sierra/spain1968.htm
"In 1986 about 200 active terrorists were believed to be living among the
large Basque population in the adjacent provinces of France, using French
territory as sanctuary and as a base for terrorist missions. Two years
later, their numbers had been reduced to a few dozen as a result of
intensified cooperation between Spanish and French security authorities."
1988 ! What was USA doing in 1988 ?
Well, let remember ......... It is not when USA was helping Bin Laden in
Afganistan !!! LOL
Paolo Pizzi
> "In 1986 about 200 active terrorists were believed to be living among the
> large Basque population in the adjacent provinces of France, using French
> territory as sanctuary and as a base for terrorist missions. Two years
> later, their numbers had been reduced to a few dozen as a result of
> intensified cooperation between Spanish and French security authorities."
>
> 1988 ! What was USA doing in 1988 ?
Providing their ally Saddam Hussein with thousands of
tons of Halliburton-made lethal gas, to be used against
Iranians and Kurds. Of course by then right-wing
Americans didn't give a shit about thousands of Kurdish
civilians being brutally murdered, just like they don't care
now about the Iraqis, despite what they PRETEND to
feel about them.
Paolo Pizzi
news:c1R7d.28219$kq6.17...@news4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net...
> All those ETA guys...let them out of jail! They was just kiddin' around
> when they blew up that train. It's just resitance. It's OK.
Even Aznar (belatedly) recognized the ETA had nothing to
do with the Madrid bombing. As usual, right-wingers don't
know much about anything...
Blunt Force Trauma
"Paolo Pizzi" <paolopizz...@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:qzW7d.23652$QJ3....@newssvr21.news.prodigy.com...
We are doing a much better job of pretending than the Europeans. We are on
the ground providing security and rebuilding infrastructure.
BTW...the USA is also the biggest donor in Darfur.
France...for a country of their imagined stature, they are conspicuously
absent from most of the world's troublespots.
Blunt Force Trauma
...and the Spanish people's answer was to run away and hide. This is
standard procedure for the cowardly Europeans though. They have prospered in
the 50+ years the USA has provided security. Now the spoiled brats will not
lift a finger when another people desires their freedom. So much for
European humanitarian fairy tales!
DeMaisonneuve
France fights terrorism, not by invading irrelevant countries, but by using
effective intelligence, which obviously is lacking in USA. You know, French
intelligence specifically warned USA about imminent airplane hijacks by
terrorists before 9/11. But you guys didn't listen. French intelligence knew
that there were no links between Iraq and international terrorism. But you
guys didn't listen. Instead, you chose bashing the French, those who make
all possible efforts to keep you out of trouble. But you prefer not to
listen. In the end, WTC is down and Eifel tower is still up. L'orgueil, mon
ami, l'orgueil. Voila ce qui vous perdra.
Blunt Force Trauma
Dude, nobody cares about the Eiffel tower. France had the chance to show
their intelligence at the UN. They didn't so there is no record of French
smart guys.
If France is so great, why did they have to murder Greenpeace guys with
limpet mines? The guys weren't even armed but "superpower" France had to
bring in their delta force to handle troublesome protesters and to engage in
cold blooded murder.
France only fights terrorism from under their blankets. Chirac better be
careful anyway cuz his loyal muslim subjects may give him the Caucescu
treatment if he's not careful.
Felsenmeer
> France...for a country of their imagined stature, they are conspicuously
> absent from most of the world's troublespots.
>
>
Many would argue that the US is conspicuously *present* at many of the
world's troublespots because they're the troublemakers in the first place.
It's easy to be the first guy to scream "FIRE" when you're the one who lit
it in the first place.
Paolo Pizzi
>> Even Aznar (belatedly) recognized the ETA had nothing to
>> do with the Madrid bombing. As usual, right-wingers don't
>> know much about anything...
>>
>
> ...and the Spanish people's answer was to run away and hide.
Look, I have already PROVEN you don't know what you're
talking about, so stop mentioning countries you don't even
know where they are on a map, let alone what their policies
against terrorism are.
John of Aix
> "DeMaisonneuve" <lu...@me.ca> wrote in message
> news:1cT7d.678$Ii....@fe51.usenetserver.com...
>> Maybe French should not have
>> resisted the German invasion in WW2? Is that what you suggest?
> Most of them didn't.
Maybe you're right but that doesn't answer the question. Are you saying
that the French should not have resisted the Germans?
> Most of the ETA terrorists live in France. Iguess they figure France
> is a safe haven for terrorists?
I guess you should check your facts a little.
John of Aix
Do you know you would well advised to think about what you post before
sending it. Everyone writes bollocks from time to time but sensible
people try to weed it out. You don't seem to. Your previous post was the
biggest load of claptrap I've ever seen from someone who evidently knows
nothing whatsoever about the situation in the Basque country, in France
or in Spain, and as far as I can see know little about anything at all.
I like to have fun with idiots like you for a while but they eventually
get boring unless they at least have something to say, some cogent
arguments even if I don't agree with them. You have none of these, you
don't bother trying to arrange your replies so that they are readable
and in general show yourself to be a slob. You are teetering on the edge
of my killfile so this may be my last message to you. As I go through
these posts I may well come across some more of your messages, if I find
one more example of such utter stupidity as you have shown here and
elsewhere, well goodbye.
John of Aix
> The two Simonas say people that kidnap others and behead innocents
> are just poor misunderstood, but nice fellas.
No they don't.
> Holding a knife to your throat is just their way of telling you how
> much they love you.
>
> The two Simonas say terrorism is perfectly OK. It's just resisting.
> It's natural to blow up 40 little kids instead of resisting at the
> ballot box, don't you know?
No they don't.
> Maybe the two Simonas are gonna start
> their own Red Brigades?
Taking your fantasies for reality again little one?
> Italy would have been better off if they had both been beheaded. They
> should leave the cowardly appeasement to the Germans, French and
> Spanish.
>
> http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/3710736.stm
>
> All those ETA guys...let them out of jail! They was just kiddin'
> around when they blew up that train. It's just resitance. It's OK.
ETA? You are ex-Spanish PM Aznar and I claim My Five Pounds
DeMaisonneuve
The real story is that the US lackey did not act according to his people's
will and was thrown out during elections and replaced by another who
promised to stop supporting the evil empire in its agressions. Great
democracy in action! The Spanish are now amoung the great majority of the
planet who understood the mislead of the empire.
Blunt Force Trauma
"John of Aix" <j.mu...@nospamlibertysurf.fr> wrote in message
news:416051e9$0$21348$8fcf...@news.wanadoo.fr...
Shiver me timbers!
Cavalier Body
"Blunt Force Trauma" <yryr...@bvcbcbc.com> ha scritto nel messaggio
news:c1R7d.28219$kq6.17...@news4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net...
> The two Simonas say people that kidnap others and behead innocents are
just
> poor misunderstood, but nice fellas.
I do not think they are stupid or bad persons. I think their ideals have led
Simona and Simona to a paradoxal situation after their liberation.
Ulvesang
> in the 50+ years the USA has provided security.
the US in these magical 50+ years is since economic cooperation has taken
off. And what security has the USA provided, exactly? I'm sure the US
military base near Keflavik, Iceland is a beacon of defense fighting off all
the horrible rabid zombie-communists, and all the other "security" you have
provided. Oh, and you weren't forced to place your forces all over the globe
like a game of Risk. You wanted to "protect" Europe, whether Europe wanted
or needed it or not.
Now the spoiled brats will not
> lift a finger when another people desires their freedom. So much for
> European humanitarian fairy tales!
Now who would it be who desires their freedom? I'm sure America is doing a
great job at resisting oppression from the poor, distant Iraqis. If you mean
Iraq, Europe is actually working in the interest of Iraq. The people Iraq
are fighting is to free themselves from the oppression of the US, and Europe
is cutting all support and relations from the US, and publicly condemning
its actions. This is standard procedure for all superpower takeovers. If the
US gets more ambitious even after trade embargos and diplomacy, then the
rest of the world will have to resort to warfare. If you mean freedom from
terrorists, we're all working on it, only the US is the retarded,
glue-sniffing team member that is hurting the project but everyone has to
make up for his mistakes because otherwise they'll fail the class. As Bush
loves to put it "if you're not with us, you're against us." Well if you're
not part of the solution, you're part of the problem, right? The US is
definitely not part of the solution, so they're a problem that needs to be
dealt with.
--Ulvesang
Ulvesang
am continually reassured in the ability of our Peugeot-making friends to
adapt and think properly as I meet more and more educated, free-thinking
Frenchmen, understanding international issues. I'd rather have France on my
side during a conflict than the US. At least they're careful to make sure
they go after the right people before shooting and arresting. France is
still a nationalist, backwards country in my eyes, but is shaping up quite
nicely, and the US is getting worse, not better.
Thank you, good Frenchmen like Montesquiou, DeMaisonneuve, and the French
people I've gotten to know in real life.
--
-Ulvesang
"Blunt Force Trauma" <yryr...@bvcbcbc.com> wrote in message
news:1MW7d.28614$kq6.18...@news4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net...
bu...@bulba.com
<ulvesang@DELETE_THISyahoo.com> wrote:
>Now the spoiled brats will not
>> lift a finger when another people desires their freedom. So much for
>> European humanitarian fairy tales!
>Now who would it be who desires their freedom? I'm sure America is doing a
>great job at resisting oppression from the poor, distant Iraqis.
You mean Sadrists?
Or Muhabarat, the Hussein's covert network designed to destabilize
Iraq after US takes it over, bc Hussein knew he could not stop US, so
he tried to make it impossible to occupy, if he could not stop Iraq
from being conquered?
>If you mean
>Iraq, Europe is actually working in the interest of Iraq.
Right, right, esp. Russia and France, taking kickbacks from
Hussein in oil for vetoes in Security Council, signing significant
oil contracts with Hussein signed that were their only real
reason of opposing the war in Iraq, Europe pissing on the
suffering of Iraqis under Hussein, etc. Yes, I can see how
Europe has been actually working in the interest of Iraq.
Get real, man! Europe wouldn't bother to lift a finger
to help Iraqis if it didn't have to!
>The people Iraq
>are fighting is to free themselves from the oppression of the US, and Europe
>is cutting all support and relations from the US, and publicly condemning
>its actions. This is standard procedure for all superpower takeovers.
Are you naive or drunk?
Altruism in politics doesn't apply. The smaller the country, actually,
the more vicious and selfish it tends to be. And when on top of it,
it becomes over-ambitious and frustrated like France, it is outright
evil. France is playing _totally_ cynical games. Ask the political
analysts.
Sorry for being abrasive, but you sound, to put it mildly, somewhat
naive.
>As Bush
>loves to put it "if you're not with us, you're against us." Well if you're
>not part of the solution, you're part of the problem, right? The US is
>definitely not part of the solution, so they're a problem that needs to be
>dealt with.
US is part of the solution. They're practicing enlightened
self-interest, I stress enlightened, even if not entirely
competent. They obviously didn't go to war to help Iraqis,
but regardless of the motive, what they are doing is both
in the interest of Iraqis and in the long-term interest of
Europe actually. Even if at the moment they do what they
do only for their own interest.
---
The comical value of sheer, pure absurdity of Mr. Chomsky
describing himself as "The American Dissident" can be
fully appreciated only by a person who lived under under
the Soviet system. It is the claim that is almost as
tragi-farcical as life under the Soviet system itself was.
bu...@bulba.com
You've been had. French politics is skillful (hence it deceived
you), not altruistic.
On Sun, 3 Oct 2004 17:12:39 -0700, "Ulvesang"
<ulvesang@DELETE_THISyahoo.com> wrote:
>As much as I don't like France, they're still light-years ahead of the US. I
>am continually reassured in the ability of our Peugeot-making friends to
>adapt and think properly as I meet more and more educated, free-thinking
>Frenchmen, understanding international issues. I'd rather have France on my
>side during a conflict than the US. At least they're careful to make sure
>they go after the right people before shooting and arresting. France is
>still a nationalist, backwards country in my eyes, but is shaping up quite
>nicely, and the US is getting worse, not better.
>
>Thank you, good Frenchmen like Montesquiou, DeMaisonneuve, and the French
>people I've gotten to know in real life.
---
Ulvesang
everything is political? Read my post. Did I ever use any political-specific
words in my message? The only controversial one is "nationalist" which can
be political or cultural.
My judgments are based on what French people think, say, and do. Not
government policy. Government is fucked up everywhere, and it never properly
represents anyone. I'd think an American would recognize that better than
anyone else.
"Loyalty to the country always, loyalty
to the government when it deserves it."
-Mark Twain
I guess if Americans are unable to differentiate between them (their
country, people, and culture) and their government, they are one and the
same: everyone is perfectly happy in America and won't change a thing. Why
even have votes then? And even though I was born in the US with a US
citizenship, if my country is my government, then I am loyal to neither.
Which is why I am not, and never will be. I like "my country" better, not my
government. So I rail against Americans now.
I am a Eurotrash Anti-American liberal hippie traitor who was born in
America, but am not American any more, and no longer will be officially
either. Try to support OR fight that sentence. I dare you. If you can, the
gates of Hell have opened because it's not correct or incorrect, it's fact.
But wait: haven't the gates of Hell already opened?
--
-Ulvesang
<bu...@bulba.com> wrote in message
news:du61m099deck226ur...@4ax.com...
Enzo Michelangeli
causing a brawl: the amount of stupidity of which he makes display could
not possibly fit in a human-sized skull without violating basic physical
laws. Perhaps the Bushistas are getting nervous about the coming
elections, and rushing to the Last Refuge of a Scoundrel.
Enzo
"John of Aix" <j.mu...@nospamlibertysurf.fr> wrote in message
news:416051e9$0$21348$8fcf...@news.wanadoo.fr...
Ulvesang
the ''infidels," in any way humanly possible. Europe, or unfortunately
emerging Eurabia, has its own problems. As does the entire rest of the
world. But I still don't see how someone can play chess pieces with a
country of people, many of whom are simple, peaceful, isolated Muslims, can
assist in "destabilizing all the cleptocrat-theocratic (Saudi Arabia) and
theocratic-cleptocrat (Iran) regimes in the region." That is the effect of
someone breaking into your home and beginning to reorganize your finances
and raise your children differently, saying they know better than you and
are working in your best interest.
As for these ulterior motives, I agree with you entirely that France has
ulterior motives. I'm sure that being taken over by violent Muslims and
having bombings in the UK and Spain where their borders are all open to are
exactly what they're looking for. Wakie wakie! Eggs n' bacie! Europe is
under this Islamist "attack" as well. You think 9/11 was the "beginning of
the war on terror" like Shrub likes to say publicly?
Also, you keep saying how Hussein was so horrible. And the replacement
Dogmatic Islamist force trying to take over Iraq is better? Hussein was an
atheist, and modelled himself after Stalin. He smashed Islam as often as he
could to keep it in line, because he knew they were his only threat to
power. And we'll just forget about all the economic treaties and alliances
the US has with Iran and the UAE. Politics is fucked up everywhere.
Personally I think government as we know it needs to be abolished and
reconstructed, as representation simply doesn't work anymore. Neocons are
simply the new strain of virus that needs to be put in check. Bush is a
crazed evil moron, but the word "moron" connotates he couldn't engineer this
cruelly brilliant plan of interest himself. He is the prime glue-sniffing
retard in the US: The neocons could even do better with a more apt
President.
The horrific perfection of this system is that everyone is getting what they
want: The Jihadists get their war, as does Bush, the Neocons, and all the
other war-crazy people in the US. Corporate interests (read: Neocons) get
their money, and Israel (read: Neocons) gains security for its state. Oil
companies (read: Neocons) get more money: after all, every time this
"terrorist warning level" bullshit rises, so does oil. But there is no
difference at the wells or refinery. Weapons manufacturers (read: Neocons)
get their money... everything in this conflict is all about some guys that
figure out how to line their pockets even more. It is so amazingly
interwoven I could spend months searching out every motive and effect this
situation is having. It's far more than just the war: the war has just
culminated it into an easily identifiable bloody horror.
Even in Europe the same thing is happening: the difference is that the
governments haven't perfected the art of controlling their people into
accepting, robotic, contradictive, nationalistic stupidity yet. It's getting
close, but not quite perfect yet.
And no, not naive, just idealistic and tentatively hopeful that someone
realizes how fucked-up the system is and is trying to change it, slowly but
surely. But my faith in humanity plummets every day.
-Ulvesang
<bu...@bulba.com> wrote in message
news:2q51m0la02mr67o0c...@4ax.com...
tw
"Montesquiou" <Monte...@Montesquiou.org> wrote in message
..as well as raising money for the IRA and treating these criminal
terrorists as heroes..
John of Aix
> You've been had. French politics is skillful (hence it deceived
> you), not altruistic.
Bulba knows best. Listen O World.
John of Aix
> I'm sure the US military base near Keflavik, Iceland is a
> beacon of defense fighting off all the horrible rabid
> zombie-communists
No, it's to stop the Vikings getting out, they represent an imminent
threat to the world, they're all hiding and waiting to be activated by
their leader Harald bin Bluetooth.
John of Aix
> "Paolo Pizzi" <paolopizz...@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
> news:qDW7d.23657$QJ3....@newssvr21.news.prodigy.com...
>> "Blunt Force Trauma" <yryr...@bvcbcbc.com> wrote in message
>> news:c1R7d.28219$kq6.17...@news4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net...
>>
>>> All those ETA guys...let them out of jail! They was just kiddin'
>>> around when they blew up that train. It's just resitance. It's OK.
>>
>> Even Aznar (belatedly) recognized the ETA had nothing to
>> do with the Madrid bombing. As usual, right-wingers don't
>> know much about anything...
>>
>
> ...and the Spanish people's answer was to run away and hide.
In other words "I am completely wrong but intend to spout some more
bollocks anyway".
Blunt Force Trauma
Nope. You're both wrong. It's a logistical stop-over for aircraft flying
to/from Europe.
Ken Leander
Bubba does know best!
USA --- GDP/capita $37,800 ~28% taxation ~5-6% unemployment
France - GDP/capita $27,500 ~ 42% taxation ~10 % unemployment
Saddam is in prison. USA controls Pakistan nukes, and has strong alliances
with Saudi oil.
France still has their extended lower lip. That, at least, is something.
Paolo Pizzi
news:cjs0od$p98$1...@geraldo.cc.utexas.edu...
> Bubba does know best!
>
> USA --- GDP/capita $37,800 ~28% taxation ~5-6% unemployment
> France - GDP/capita $27,500 ~ 42% taxation ~10 % unemployment
Let's look at some OTHER statistics.
Reality is a lot different than you might think:
FRANCE US
Population below median income 8% 17%
Population below poverty line 6.7% 12.4%
Education spending 5.6% 4.7%
Math aptitude grade 12 523 461
Murders (per year) 1,051 12,658
Assaults (per year) 106,404 2,238,480
CO2 pollution per capita (tons) 6 20
Infant mortality rate 4.41 6.69
Life expectancy (years) 79.28 77.14
AIDS deaths (per 100,000 people) 1 5
People living with AIDS (ditto) 166 309
(source: nationmaster.com)
> Saddam is in prison.
Irrelevant: Iraq is in utter chaos...
> USA controls Pakistan nukes
You wish!! Musharraf is in the same exact position as Saddam
was at the end of the eighties. No doubt in a few years he will
do something to upset Washington and he will quickly become
an "enemy." (Or a "turrurist" maybe...) Suddenly the Pakistani
people -- currently suffering from a regime as oppressive as
Saddam's -- will become an issue and the neocons will want
to "liberate" them. Deja vu all over again...
> and has strong alliances with Saudi oil.
Suuuuure, we "control" so much the world's oil, a barrel of
crude is now way past $50... Is there a SINGLE thing Bush
did not fuck up?
bu...@bulba.com
<ulvesang@DELETE_THISyahoo.com> wrote:
>Granted we need to stop Jihad. They will never stop at trying to eradicate
>the ''infidels," in any way humanly possible. Europe, or unfortunately
>emerging Eurabia, has its own problems. As does the entire rest of the
>world. But I still don't see how someone can play chess pieces with a
>country of people, many of whom are simple, peaceful, isolated Muslims, can
>assist in "destabilizing all the cleptocrat-theocratic (Saudi Arabia) and
>theocratic-cleptocrat (Iran) regimes in the region."
It's horrible, I grant that. This is real world, this is what real
politics is like. But doing nothing is even worse. Every
action should be accompanied with the calculation: what
the cost of NOT doing it is to us.
>That is the effect of
>someone breaking into your home and beginning to reorganize your finances
>and raise your children differently, saying they know better than you and
>are working in your best interest.
I grant there's a conflict. MOST of the time, fortunately, we
can reconcile universal values with the local cultural values.
But not ALWAYS. We don't allow the parents to do _anything_
they want with the children just because they have this
sort of cultural/religious lifestyle in this particular house.
It's a terrible problem and I'm not going to pretend I have
a costless solution.
Most of them seem to have this terrible cultural secret:
they know their religion, or more like social-political
doctrine embedded in religion has something bad
about it. They can't dump it because they feel they
have to accept the whole package. Some have
speculated Islam needs pope, some have speculated
Islam needs Reformation. I don't know which, but
it definitely is in the need of something.
>As for these ulterior motives, I agree with you entirely that France has
>ulterior motives. I'm sure that being taken over by violent Muslims and
>having bombings in the UK and Spain where their borders are all open to are
>exactly what they're looking for. Wakie wakie! Eggs n' bacie! Europe is
>under this Islamist "attack" as well. You think 9/11 was the "beginning of
>the war on terror" like Shrub likes to say publicly?
Nonsense (and I do agree Bush is dim as hell, I just see the neocons
behind him, not him really)
>Also, you keep saying how Hussein was so horrible. And the replacement
>Dogmatic Islamist force trying to take over Iraq is better?
Nope. If hamburger munchers let it happen, they indeed will fuck
up Iraq for good.
>Hussein was an
>atheist, and modelled himself after Stalin. He smashed Islam as often as he
>could to keep it in line, because he knew they were his only threat to
>power.
He not so smashed Islam as played it, beating it when convenient,
using it when convenient: he urged his subjects to write the Quran
in blood (which is a heresy by Islamic standards). He showed himself
on TV praying.
>And we'll just forget about all the economic treaties and alliances
>the US has with Iran and the UAE. Politics is fucked up everywhere.
>Personally I think government as we know it needs to be abolished and
>reconstructed, as representation simply doesn't work anymore. Neocons are
>simply the new strain of virus that needs to be put in check.
There are dangers to them, I won't say there are not. See for
yourself:
http://www.newamericancentury.org/
Robert Kagan in particular makes me think of Soviet Politbiuro
apparatchiks, articulate but without knowledge in depth good
enough. Even some American air force officers pointed it
out in their professional periodicals (that shows how critically
important freedom of speech is in practice, people have no
idea how important is such theoretical stuff).
>figure out how to line their pockets even more. It is so amazingly
>interwoven I could spend months searching out every motive and effect this
>situation is having. It's far more than just the war: the war has just
>culminated it into an easily identifiable bloody horror.
War, as Clausewitz put it, is extension of politics with other
means. It's usually simmering there without exploding, but
now we see the other case, when it does.
>Even in Europe the same thing is happening: the difference is that the
>governments haven't perfected the art of controlling their people into
>accepting, robotic, contradictive, nationalistic stupidity yet. It's getting
>close, but not quite perfect yet.
I beg to disagree on this one: it's that populations in Europe are
less diverse, there's more of public consensus because you
think of the next guy as "somebody like you". In the diverse
societies like America this doesn't apply. Hence politics is
different. Maybe more vicious, I don't know.
>And no, not naive, just idealistic and tentatively hopeful that someone
>realizes how fucked-up the system is and is trying to change it, slowly but
>surely. But my faith in humanity plummets every day.
Mine not - I think it always has been not only that bad, but a lot lot
worse, and now the shit is not so much created as uncovered. Peter
Drucker has pointed some examples out in his later books.
People do live longer, we are better informed, we are wealthier
and less tolerant of bullshit from politicians than ever before.
Govts now cannot get away with things like they did in the past.
They're much more constrained. It's a fucked up world, but
when facts are compared per case basis, it demonstrably got
better.
Anyway, it's been a pleasure to "talk" to you!
Ken Leander
"Delila" <aqu...@widomaker.com> wrote in message
news:41618...@corp.newsgroups.com...
>
> "Ken Leander" <kenle...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:cjs0od$p98$1...@geraldo.cc.utexas.edu...
> >
> >
> > France - GDP/capita $27,500 ~ 42% taxation ~10 % unemployment
>
>
> out for Americans (Usually after six months) they don't get counted
> anymore
> as 'unemployed', even if they still are without a job. The true
> unemployment
> figure in the US is probably quite similar to the European numbers.
>
>
> D.
People that don't want to work shouldn't be counted as unemployed.
Otherwise, I won't argue your analysis. I have no incentive to do so. If
Europeans endorse their welfare state, then who am I to object. Under the
circumstances, Europeans are easier for Americans to compete against.
Bush just passed another tax cut yesterday. He just keeps climbing in the
polls. Republicans are expected to gain control of the Senate, House, and
Presidency. It seems the American middle class wants to work and compete in
the world marketplace.
Maybe in the next election, Europeans can induce American socialist
leadership. In the meantime, keep coming up with creative accounting
methods. I find your explanations entirely believable and clearly a sign of
our (USA) eminent economic demise. In four years, we can chat again. I
suspect your arguments will remain resolute.
Blunt Force Trauma
"Delila" <aqu...@widomaker.com> wrote in message
news:41618...@corp.newsgroups.com...
>
> "Ken Leander" <kenle...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:cjs0od$p98$1...@geraldo.cc.utexas.edu...
> >
> >
> > France - GDP/capita $27,500 ~ 42% taxation ~10 % unemployment
>
>
> out for Americans (Usually after six months) they don't get counted
> anymore
> as 'unemployed', even if they still are without a job. The true
> unemployment
> figure in the US is probably quite similar to the European numbers.
>
>
> D.
>
Yes, France is the capital of welfare benefits. No job, no problem. The
state will take care of you forever. Too bad reality is now starting to
creep into France.
Hardly a day goes by without some Europeans protesting that they will now
have to work for a living. Oh, so sad.
Maybe the Chinese will send you a bag of rice for food?
>
>
>
>
> -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----
> http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
> -----== Over 100,000 Newsgroups - 19 Different Servers! =-----
bu...@bulba.com
<paolopizz...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>Let's look at some OTHER statistics.
>Reality is a lot different than you might think:
> FRANCE US
>
>Population below median income 8% 17%
>Population below poverty line 6.7% 12.4%
>Education spending 5.6% 4.7%
>Math aptitude grade 12 523 461
>Murders (per year) 1,051 12,658
>Assaults (per year) 106,404 2,238,480
>CO2 pollution per capita (tons) 6 20
>Infant mortality rate 4.41 6.69
>Life expectancy (years) 79.28 77.14
>AIDS deaths (per 100,000 people) 1 5
>People living with AIDS (ditto) 166 309
Be careful with above stats, for instance, think
about consequences of high number of in vitro
and women having children later in life, the
crime stats apparently have not been calculated
per capita, plus most of that is black-on-black and
Hispanic-on-Hispanic (read: drug dealing) and
thanks to higher GDP per capita even the lower
share of education expenditures in GDP can actually
yield more money (in PPP terms) for education
per student (that abstracting from quality,
obviously, which in USA does seem to suck).
bu...@bulba.com
wrote:
> > USA --- GDP/capita $37,800 ~28% taxation ~5-6% unemployment
> > France - GDP/capita $27,500 ~ 42% taxation ~10 % unemployment
> These numbers don't tell the whole story. Once unemployment benefits run
>out for Americans (Usually after six months) they don't get counted anymore
>as 'unemployed', even if they still are without a job.
You just repeated the urban legend: pretty much every developed
country uses some variation of standard ILO measure for unemployment,
which is more or less "those who seek work and could not find it in
the last 4 weeks".
That is to discount people like most of students, but to include
those students that really need to work and thus look for work
(which with arbitrary "student == not unemployed" would exclude
them).
Govts DO cook those numbers: for instance, in UK the govt
cooks the number by increasing the number of "health
problem related payments", a good portion of which is
actually a hidden unemployment benefit; just money
comes from a different pocket, so it can be managed
in a different way.
>The true unemployment
>figure in the US is probably quite similar to the European numbers.
Given the lower unemployment benefits it is likely that Americans
look for work harder than Europeans (they simply have to), so
probably the true unemployment rate in America is even lower,
or the figure for Europe relatively higher.
Unemployment problem in Europe really sucks.
bu...@bulba.com
<yryr...@bvcbcbc.com> wrote:
>Yes, France is the capital of welfare benefits. No job, no problem. The
>state will take care of you forever.
Erm, no, it won't. My aunt lives in France. And CLAIMS (don't
know if it is true) that the unemployment benefits in France
are actually rather low and do tend to run out.
bu...@bulba.com
<ulvesang@DELETE_THISyahoo.com> wrote:
>"Loyalty to the country always, loyalty
>to the government when it deserves it."
> -Mark Twain
Now THAT I agree with all the way. Thanks for a quote,
I'm going to remember it.
>I guess if Americans are unable to differentiate between them (their
>country, people, and culture) and their government, they are one and the
>same: everyone is perfectly happy in America and won't change a thing. Why
>even have votes then?
Because it could get worse?
>And even though I was born in the US with a US
>citizenship, if my country is my government, then I am loyal to neither.
>Which is why I am not, and never will be. I like "my country" better, not my
>government. So I rail against Americans now.
>I am a Eurotrash Anti-American liberal hippie traitor who was born in
>America, but am not American any more, and no longer will be officially
>either. Try to support OR fight that sentence. I dare you.
Hmm... Shall we decide it via, say, a boxing match? ;-) I could
at least get you shut up about the statement, which politically is
just as good as solving the riddle? ;-)
>If you can, the
>gates of Hell have opened because it's not correct or incorrect, it's fact.
>But wait: haven't the gates of Hell already opened?
Not really. It's just like in this Monty Python's song, "always
look at the bright side of life", if you know what I mean.
Ken Leander
>
> "Delila" <aqu...@widomaker.com> wrote in message
> news:41618...@corp.newsgroups.com...
>>
>> "Ken Leander" <kenle...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:cjs0od$p98$1...@geraldo.cc.utexas.edu...
>> >
>> >
>> > USA --- GDP/capita $37,800 ~28% taxation ~5-6% unemployment
>> > France - GDP/capita $27,500 ~ 42% taxation ~10 % unemployment
>>
>>
>> These numbers don't tell the whole story. Once unemployment benefits run
>> out for Americans (Usually after six months) they don't get counted
>> anymore
>> as 'unemployed', even if they still are without a job. The true
>> unemployment
>> figure in the US is probably quite similar to the European numbers.
>>
>>
>> D.
>>
>
> Yes, France is the capital of welfare benefits. No job, no problem. The
> state will take care of you forever. Too bad reality is now starting to
> creep into France.
>
> Hardly a day goes by without some Europeans protesting that they will now
> have to work for a living. Oh, so sad.
>
> Maybe the Chinese will send you a bag of rice for food?
China states they have only 10% of their population below the poverty line.
Unfortunately, the line is ill defined. It varies from country to country.
If the USA had to make do with the Chinese $5000 GDP/capita, we would feel
deprived.
That's the wonderful benefit of socialism. No matter how poor or desperate,
happiness abounds in socialist countries. Is it not kind of socialists to
share their happiness with the wealthier of this planet?
Pakistan is about the size of California. Yet their population is 160
million people. Their birth rate suggests a straight line extrapolation to
450 million people by 2050. Since we (in the USA) have soured our
relationship with the Muslims, I suppose the impoverished Paks will simply
have to migrate illegally to Europe and Asia.
So to summarize our dour situation, we capitalists in the USA cannot expect
the happiness and poverty that socialist countries enjoy. If anything, our
situation is getting worse. We cannot hope for the hordes of Muslim
immigrants that Europeans can soon expect. Our unhappy loneliness is the
price we pay for the mistakes made by the present evil Republican
administration. Woe is us.
Delila
<bu...@bulba.com> wrote in message
news:lp73m057lurt85vtn...@4ax.com...
>
> Unemployment problem in Europe really sucks.
So maybe the solution to this problem is to deport a lot of the foreigners
they let in to work and give those jobs back to the Europeans. If they don't
want to do the work, then it's bye-bye unemployment benefits. Simple, no?
D.
Blunt Force Trauma
For Chinese, if they have plenty of dirt to eat, they are well fed and have
nothing to complain about. Those people who would not fall below the Chinese
poverty line.
Blunt Force Trauma
>
> <bu...@bulba.com> wrote in message
> news:lp73m057lurt85vtn...@4ax.com...
> >
> > Unemployment problem in Europe really sucks.
>
>
> So maybe the solution to this problem is to deport a lot of the
> foreigners
> they let in to work and give those jobs back to the Europeans. If they
> don't
> want to do the work, then it's bye-bye unemployment benefits. Simple, no?
>
>
> D.
>
The answer is to kill everyone in France, then you have lebensraum for the
rest and as a bonus, Europe has ridded itself of a cancer.
bu...@bulba.com
wrote:
> > Unemployment problem in Europe really sucks.
> So maybe the solution to this problem is to deport a lot of the foreigners
>they let in to work and give those jobs back to the Europeans. If they don't
>want to do the work, then it's bye-bye unemployment benefits. Simple, no?
No, because together with foreigners the good portion of the market
demand will go. People who work both take jobs and by spending
money create jobs for other people. The point is if taxman
doesn't skim too much money on the way or else the good portion
of consumption demand for real economy is gone. Which means
unemployment.
By your reasoning, the bigger the country, the bigger the unemployment
should be, and the smaller, the smaller unemployment should be.
Strange that relatively small Switzerland has small unemployment
and much bigger Russia has a lot worse unemployment problems.
E.F.Schelby
>
>"Delila" <aqu...@widomaker.com> wrote in message
>news:41618...@corp.newsgroups.com...
>>
>> "Ken Leander" <kenle...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:cjs0od$p98$1...@geraldo.cc.utexas.edu...
>> >
>> >
>> > USA --- GDP/capita $37,800 ~28% taxation ~5-6% unemployment
>> > France - GDP/capita $27,500 ~ 42% taxation ~10 % unemployment
>>
>Under the
>circumstances, Europeans are easier for Americans to compete against.
Really? Is that why our exports are so meager and Euro Exports so
much higher?
Blunt Force Trauma
"E.F.Schelby" <sch...@swcp.com> wrote in message
news:eqe3m0tosi141r5pq...@4ax.com...
Americans have lots of disposable income and can spend it on any crap they
want.
>
>
E.F.Schelby
>People who work both take jobs and by spending
>money create jobs for other people. The point is if taxman
>doesn't skim too much money on the way or else the good portion
>of consumption demand for real economy is gone. Which means
>unemployment.
This is the recipe - fresh from a bumper sticker:
Picture of American flag, and: "buy more crap."
Cheers,
ES
Blunt Force Trauma
Yep. While Americans are buying sail boats, second houses and Learjets,
Europeans are busy figuring out how they are gonna pay the rent.
John of Aix
> "Delila" <aqu...@widomaker.com> wrote in message
> news:41618...@corp.newsgroups.com...
>>
>> "Ken Leander" <kenle...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:cjs0od$p98$1...@geraldo.cc.utexas.edu...
>> >
>> >
>> > USA --- GDP/capita $37,800 ~28% taxation ~5-6% unemployment
>> > France - GDP/capita $27,500 ~ 42% taxation ~10 % unemployment
>>
>>
>> These numbers don't tell the whole story. Once unemployment
>> benefits run out for Americans (Usually after six months) they don't
>> get counted anymore
>> as 'unemployed', even if they still are without a job. The true
>> unemployment
>> figure in the US is probably quite similar to the European numbers.
>>
>>
>> D.
>>
>
> Yes, France is the capital of welfare benefits. No job, no problem.
> The state will take care of you forever. Too bad reality is now
> starting to creep into France.
>
> Hardly a day goes by without some Europeans protesting that they will
> now have to work for a living. Oh, so sad.
>
> Maybe the Chinese will send you a bag of rice for food?
OK; thats enough
PLONK
John of Aix
Oh OK then , despite these statistics that all show the USA lagging
behind France, the USA is in fact far better in all these fields, except
education, is that it? I don't know what we'd do without such an
intelligent fellow nearby to explain everything to us.
Tu as encore raté une bonne occasion de te taire?
John of Aix
> "Delila" <aqu...@widomaker.com> wrote in message
> news:41618...@corp.newsgroups.com...
>>
>> "Ken Leander" <kenle...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:cjs0od$p98$1...@geraldo.cc.utexas.edu...
>> >
>> >
>> > USA --- GDP/capita $37,800 ~28% taxation ~5-6% unemployment
>> > France - GDP/capita $27,500 ~ 42% taxation ~10 % unemployment
>>
>>
>> These numbers don't tell the whole story. Once unemployment
>> benefits run out for Americans (Usually after six months) they don't
>> get counted anymore
>> as 'unemployed', even if they still are without a job. The true
>> unemployment
>> figure in the US is probably quite similar to the European numbers.
>>
>>
>> D.
>
> People that don't want to work shouldn't be counted as unemployed.
Why not, they are unemployed aren't they. Unemployment statistics should
be on the unemployed, there are other statistics for knowing how many
receive benefits.
> Otherwise, I won't argue your analysis. I have no incentive to do
> so. If Europeans endorse their welfare state, then who am I to
> object. Under the circumstances, Europeans are easier for Americans
> to compete against.
> Bush just passed another tax cut yesterday. He just keeps climbing
> in the polls.
Bwahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha<gasp>hahahahahahahahahahaha<Fx:
falls off chair. Fx: sounds off> hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha.
Paolo Pizzi
news:rf73m0tnsjr6bqv09...@4ax.com...
> Be careful with above stats, for instance, think
> about consequences of high number of in vitro
> and women having children later in life
Sorry, that does NOT apply to infant mortality.
> the crime stats apparently have not been calculated
> per capita
Irrelevant, the crime rate in the US is still much higher.
France is not exactly a small country...
> plus most of that is black-on-black and
> Hispanic-on-Hispanic
Meaning exactly what? That blacks and hispanics
are NOT Americans? Or that non-whites should
not count because you're a racist? You know what,
my little fascist, France also has a large population
of non-white people, but obviously you've never
been there, so I couldn't really expect you to know
that...
> thanks to higher GDP per capita even the lower
> share of education expenditures in GDP can actually
> yield more money (in PPP terms) for education
> per student
Keep spinning, it still doesn't fly...
Paolo Pizzi
> Bush just passed another tax cut yesterday. He just keeps climbing in
> the polls.
You're dreaming. Bush got CREAMED in the debate and his
numbers are quickly going south. And that should have been
his "best" debate, being on international issues...
Blunt Force Trauma
That will be decided on November second. You have no say in that.
Paolo Pizzi
> Yep. While Americans are buying sail boats, second houses and Learjets,
> Europeans are busy figuring out how they are gonna pay the rent.
Evidently, understand simple statistics is
too much of a challenge for you.
FRANCE US
Population below median income 8% 17%
Population below poverty line 6.7% 12.4%
Meaning that a lot more people in the US than in France
are actually busy figuring out how to make ends meet.
DeMaisonneuve
> >
> >> All those ETA guys...let them out of jail! They was just kiddin' around
> >> when they blew up that train. It's just resitance. It's OK.
> >
> > Even Aznar (belatedly) recognized the ETA had nothing to
> > do with the Madrid bombing. As usual, right-wingers don't
> > know much about anything...
> >
>
> ...and the Spanish people's answer was to run away and hide. This is
> standard procedure for the cowardly Europeans though. They have prospered
in
> the 50+ years the USA has provided security. Now the spoiled brats will
not
> lift a finger when another people desires their freedom. So much for
> European humanitarian fairy tales!
>
>
Spaniards can be proud today. What a great choice have they made in last
elections. When they were fighting terrorism the American way: Terrorists
acts occured in Spain, the government was acting against the will of its
people, no real terrorist was captured, they were cating illegaly and
without UN approval, no terrorist organisation was dismanteled, etc... In
other words, totally useless and inefficient way of fighting terrorism.
Now that Spain is fighting terrorism the french way, and with help of french
intelligence services, probably the most efficient in the world: No
terrorist acts occur in Spain, government is acting democratically,
terrorists are captured, Spain is acting legally, terrorist organisations
are dismanteled, etc... In other words: Precise, concise, clean actions. No
need to invade everyone and get the most hated nation of the world. Instead
of bashing everywhere blindfolded, France uses its intelligence services to
get to the real terrorists and prevent any terrorist acts before it happens.
Note that they also prevented some attacks in other countries who take
France's advices seriously.
http://www.lemonde.fr/web/article/0,1-0@2-3226,36-381620,0.html
As for oil or any other energy ressources, France always succeeded in having
energy. The European market in which they are part is a larger economy than
USA and is an economic unity. EU will not end up in position of getting out
of energy while China and others would have. Besides, Total is now owner of
a part of Russian oil companies. I'm not sure that the France based oil
giant would sell to China and leave France out of ressource.
http://www.total.com/en/press/press_releases/pr_2004/040922_Russia_5430.htm
http://www.total.com/en/press/press_releases/pr_2004/040423_Venezuela_Yucal_Placer_4711.htm
And so many more...
Only the USA might become unwilling to provide ressources to France.
Everyone who was in good terms with France before US bashing are still or
even in better terms. No government is defeated in elections for supporting
France. The opposite is not as true. But, in any case, there is not a single
ressource that only USA controls. Except for human grease, of course, that
only Unitedstatesians produce in sufficient quantity to fullfill its
energetical needs forever. I have to give it to you, the French didn't think
about that one. This time USA is ahead of France.
Blunt Force Trauma II
Who needs statistics?
Europe is all about a few people who work some small fraction of time and
pay for the rest of the people who sit around and do nothing except drink
espesso and sit on the piazza and make racist remarks at the people passing
by.
My only questions: Is the time you spend posting considered as work and
shouldn't you be picking up your welfare check now?
Europe is like a prison whose only walls are the Mediteranean and the
Atlantic. The criminals are free to mill about but not much is expected of
them. At periodic intervals, someone comes along and slides a tray of food
under the door. The only thing a Euro can claim as an achievement is a
successful bowel movement.
Paolo Pizzi
news:KZj8d.8728$g%5.26...@news4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net...
>
> "Paolo Pizzi" <paolopizz...@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
> news:KNj8d.6433
>
> Who needs statistics?
People more intelligent than you.
> Europe is all about a few people who work some small fraction of time and
> pay for the rest of the people who sit around and do nothing except drink
> espesso and sit on the piazza and make racist remarks at the people
> passing by.
Let me guess, you've never been there...
Blunt Force Trauma II
I've been there many times. How do you think I know European are pathetic
losers?
ZW
> "Delila" <aqu...@widomaker.com> wrote in message
> news:41618...@corp.newsgroups.com...
> >
> > "Ken Leander" <kenle...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> > news:cjs0od$p98$1...@geraldo.cc.utexas.edu...
> > >
> > >
> > > USA --- GDP/capita $37,800 ~28% taxation ~5-6% unemployment
> > > France - GDP/capita $27,500 ~ 42% taxation ~10 % unemployment
> >
> >
> > These numbers don't tell the whole story. Once unemployment benefits run
> > out for Americans (Usually after six months) they don't get counted
> > anymore
> > as 'unemployed', even if they still are without a job. The true
> > unemployment
> > figure in the US is probably quite similar to the European numbers.
> >
> >
> > D.
> >
>
> Yes, France is the capital of welfare benefits. No job, no problem. The
> state will take care of you forever. Too bad reality is now starting to
> creep into France.
>
> Hardly a day goes by without some Europeans protesting that they will now
> have to work for a living. Oh, so sad.
>
> Maybe the Chinese will send you a bag of rice for food?
>
However, I think the welfare champion in Europe is Germany, not France.
ZW
> news:41618347$1$3033$8fcf...@news.wanadoo.fr...
> > bu...@bulba.com wrote:
> >> You've been had. French politics is skillful (hence it deceived
> >> you), not altruistic.
> >
> > Bulba knows best. Listen O World.
> >
>
> Bubba does know best!
>
> USA --- GDP/capita $37,800 ~28% taxation ~5-6% unemployment
> France - GDP/capita $27,500 ~ 42% taxation ~10 % unemployment
>
> Saddam is in prison. USA controls Pakistan nukes, and has strong alliances
> with Saudi oil.
>
> France still has their extended lower lip. That, at least, is something.
Your fanatism equals the one of Al Quaida. I guess you must be a good
W supporter.
I hope you enjoyed W brillant appearance on TV the other day; god, W
is such a leader, so smart, so tall, such a good and clear speaker. W
is not a chimps, oh no. W is not a self-destruction machine for the
US.
bu...@bulba.com
<paolopizz...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>> Be careful with above stats, for instance, think
>> about consequences of high number of in vitro
>> and women having children later in life
>Sorry, that does NOT apply to infant mortality.
It does: those are much more likely statistically
to be "prematurely born".
Plus, it doesn't account for a lot more uneducated
immigrants coming to United States than to
Europe. Such people are not going to have very
"healthy" lifestyles for at least a first generation.
>> the crime stats apparently have not been calculated
>> per capita
>Irrelevant, the crime rate in the US is still much higher.
>France is not exactly a small country...
But not comparable in population to US, is it?
>> plus most of that is black-on-black and
>> Hispanic-on-Hispanic
>Meaning exactly what?
Meaning exactly that.
>That blacks and hispanics
>are NOT Americans? Or that non-whites should
>not count because you're a racist?
Nope. It means that America has more racial
groups and divisions than Europe. With all
the consequences of that.
>You know what,
>my little fascist, France also has a large population
>of non-white people, but obviously you've never
>been there,
Wrong.
>so I couldn't really expect you to know
>that...
...how Arabs are perceived for instance in France.
>> thanks to higher GDP per capita even the lower
>> share of education expenditures in GDP can actually
>> yield more money (in PPP terms) for education
>> per student
>Keep spinning, it still doesn't fly...
You fool yourself. The numbers don't lie, you do.
bu...@bulba.com
wrote:
>>> > USA --- GDP/capita $37,800 ~28% taxation ~5-6% unemployment
>>> > France - GDP/capita $27,500 ~ 42% taxation ~10 % unemployment
>>Under the
>>circumstances, Europeans are easier for Americans to compete against.
>Really? Is that why our exports are so meager and Euro Exports so
>much higher?
Bad econ, see "pop internationalism" by Paul Krugman.
bu...@bulba.com
wrote:
Better than a bumper sticker with EU flag and
the sentence "Unemployed forever".
Blunt Force Trauma II
<bu...@bulba.com> wrote in message
news:7mo3m0lg7d3ka25iq...@4ax.com...
> On Mon, 04 Oct 2004 15:16:51 -0600, E.F.Schelby <sch...@swcp.com>
> wrote:
>
>>bu...@bulba.com wrote:
>>
>>>People who work both take jobs and by spending
>>>money create jobs for other people. The point is if taxman
>>>doesn't skim too much money on the way or else the good portion
>>>of consumption demand for real economy is gone. Which means
>>>unemployment.
>
>>This is the recipe - fresh from a bumper sticker:
>
>>Picture of American flag, and: "buy more crap."
>
> Better than a bumper sticker with EU flag and
> the sentence "Unemployed forever".
>
Every Euro should have a bumper sticker showing Chirac getting his butt
kicked by George Bush.
bu...@bulba.com
<paolopizz...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
> FRANCE US
>Population below median income 8% 17%
>Population below poverty line 6.7% 12.4%
>Meaning that a lot more people in the US than in France
>are actually busy figuring out how to make ends meet.
No, that is merely meaning that the top incomes in USA are much
higher (income disparity is bigger) and that poverty line definitions
are pretty arbitrary: poverty line in France is something
different (gee, how could you expect French politicians not to
meddle with the definitions like they did meddle with definition of
unemployment to cook the stats) than elsewhere. "poverty line"
depends on what you see as poverty: this is highly arbitrary
and relative to the standard you're used to. As such, it will be
cooked by the govt, one way or the other.
However, money in hand - that stat is much harder to meddle
with. And the society where 69% of people live in their own
standalone houses cannot generally be poor.
See following for views from both sides of debate.
http://ambit.typepad.com/ambit/2003/09/the_economist_f.html
bu...@bulba.com
<yryr...@bvcbcbc.com> wrote:
>>>>People who work both take jobs and by spending
>>>>money create jobs for other people. The point is if taxman
>>>>doesn't skim too much money on the way or else the good portion
>>>>of consumption demand for real economy is gone. Which means
>>>>unemployment.
>>
>>>This is the recipe - fresh from a bumper sticker:
>>
>>>Picture of American flag, and: "buy more crap."
>>
>> Better than a bumper sticker with EU flag and
>> the sentence "Unemployed forever".
>Every Euro should have a bumper sticker showing Chirac getting his butt
>kicked by George Bush.
Don't equate Europeans with French. Not everyone here is that
dim.
Blunt Force Trauma II
<bu...@bulba.com> wrote in message
news:6ep3m0d5661asufm2...@4ax.com...
> On Tue, 05 Oct 2004 00:00:58 GMT, "Blunt Force Trauma II"
> <yryr...@bvcbcbc.com> wrote:
>
>>>>>People who work both take jobs and by spending
>>>>>money create jobs for other people. The point is if taxman
>>>>>doesn't skim too much money on the way or else the good portion
>>>>>of consumption demand for real economy is gone. Which means
>>>>>unemployment.
>>>
>>>>This is the recipe - fresh from a bumper sticker:
>>>
>>>>Picture of American flag, and: "buy more crap."
>>>
>>> Better than a bumper sticker with EU flag and
>>> the sentence "Unemployed forever".
>
>>Every Euro should have a bumper sticker showing Chirac getting his butt
>>kicked by George Bush.
>
> Don't equate Europeans with French. Not everyone here is that
> dim.
>
Sorry. I forgot the French are really scraping the bottom of the barrel.
Paolo Pizzi
news:fao3m05cmqucamrqb...@4ax.com...
> On Mon, 04 Oct 2004 21:50:33 GMT, "Paolo Pizzi"
>>Sorry, that does NOT apply to infant mortality.
>
> It does: those are much more likely statistically
> to be "prematurely born".
If they're born, they're not dead.
Look up the word "mortality."
> Plus, it doesn't account for a lot more uneducated
> immigrants coming to United States than to
> Europe.
Bullshit, Europe is as much a target of immigration
from third world countries as the US.
>>Irrelevant, the crime rate in the US is still much higher.
>>France is not exactly a small country...
>
> But not comparable in population to US, is it?
Check those numbers, is the US population
20 times that of France? You lose again.
>>> plus most of that is black-on-black and
>>> Hispanic-on-Hispanic
>
>>Meaning exactly what?
>
> Meaning exactly that.
>
>>That blacks and hispanics
>>are NOT Americans? Or that non-whites should
>>not count because you're a racist?
>
> Nope. It means that America has more racial
> groups and divisions than Europe.
Aside from revealing your blatant racism, what exactly
does that prove?
>>You know what,
>>my little fascist, France also has a large population
>>of non-white people, but obviously you've never
>>been there,
>
> Wrong.
Then you're contradicting yourself.
>
>>so I couldn't really expect you to know
>>that...
>
> ...how Arabs are perceived for instance in France.
By racist people like you...
You see, that's the problem with idiots like you: you
believe an entire nation thinks alike. You honestly
think that all Americans are right-wing fascists like
you and that all French are your enemies. Basically
you think like a five year old.
>>Keep spinning, it still doesn't fly...
>
> You fool yourself. The numbers don't lie, you do.
Right, the numbers I QUOTED don't lie, you do,
while pathetically trying to spin them your way.
FRANCE US
Population below median income 8% 17%
Population below poverty line 6.7% 12.4%
Paolo Pizzi
>> Let me guess, you've never been there...
>>
>
> I've been there many times.
Interesting, and you've learned absolutely nothing...
> How do you think I know European are pathetic losers?
Let me guess, Faux News? Rush Oxycontin Limbaugh?
Paolo Pizzi
news:7oo3m01qsjhhdkrhi...@4ax.com...
> On Mon, 04 Oct 2004 22:04:26 GMT, "Paolo Pizzi"
> <paolopizz...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>
>> FRANCE US
>
>>Population below median income 8% 17%
>>Population below poverty line 6.7% 12.4%
>
>>Meaning that a lot more people in the US than in France
>>are actually busy figuring out how to make ends meet.
>
> No, that is merely meaning that the top incomes in USA are much
> higher (income disparity is bigger) and that poverty line definitions
> are pretty arbitrary
Amazing how right-wingers are capable of shooting their own
foot. You got it right, income disparity is bigger, that's EXACTLY
what it means, only you don't quite get it...
Blunt Force Trauma II
> <bu...@bulba.com> wrote in message
> news:fao3m05cmqucamrqb...@4ax.com...
>> On Mon, 04 Oct 2004 21:50:33 GMT, "Paolo Pizzi"
>
>>>Sorry, that does NOT apply to infant mortality.
>>
>> It does: those are much more likely statistically
>> to be "prematurely born".
>
> If they're born, they're not dead.
> Look up the word "mortality."
>
>> Plus, it doesn't account for a lot more uneducated
>> immigrants coming to United States than to
>> Europe.
>
> Bullshit, Europe is as much a target of immigration
> from third world countries as the US.
>
That's why Europe is building a series of 5 concentration camps on the
northern coast of Africa. It's a scam to incarcerate indefinitely anyone who
wants to come to Europe.
BTW...Most of the group that Italy just sent back drowned in the
Mediterannean.
>>>Irrelevant, the crime rate in the US is still much higher.
>>>France is not exactly a small country...
>>
>> But not comparable in population to US, is it?
>
> Check those numbers, is the US population
> 20 times that of France? You lose again.
>
20 times? Interesting. Did our greatest dreams come true? Did a whole bunch
of Frenchmen commit suicide.
Are you counting Germans as loyal French subjects?
tw
>
> "Paolo Pizzi" <paolopizz...@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
> news:Lum8d.4705$JG2....@newssvr14.news.prodigy.com...
> > <bu...@bulba.com> wrote in message
> > news:fao3m05cmqucamrqb...@4ax.com...
> >> On Mon, 04 Oct 2004 21:50:33 GMT, "Paolo Pizzi"
> >
> >>>Sorry, that does NOT apply to infant mortality.
> >>
> >> It does: those are much more likely statistically
> >> to be "prematurely born".
> >
> > If they're born, they're not dead.
> > Look up the word "mortality."
> >
> >> Plus, it doesn't account for a lot more uneducated
> >> immigrants coming to United States than to
> >> Europe.
> >
> > Bullshit, Europe is as much a target of immigration
> > from third world countries as the US.
> >
>
> That's why Europe is building a series of 5 concentration camps on the
> northern coast of Africa.
Luckily there's nothing lke that near the Mexican border eh?
> It's a scam to incarcerate indefinitely anyone who
> wants to come to Europe.
So you concede the point that Europe is as much a target of immigration as
the US then. Good.
> BTW...Most of the group that Italy just sent back drowned in the
> Mediterannean.
That's astonishing. Especially seeing as they went by air.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/3714922.stm
> >>>Irrelevant, the crime rate in the US is still much higher.
> >>>France is not exactly a small country...
> >>
> >> But not comparable in population to US, is it?
> >
> > Check those numbers, is the US population
> > 20 times that of France? You lose again.
> >
>
> 20 times? Interesting. Did our greatest dreams come true? Did a whole
bunch
> of Frenchmen commit suicide.
So you concede the point again. The US as roughly 6 times the population of
France, yet manages a twenty fold increase in crime
> Are you counting Germans as loyal French subjects?
How do you manage to insert your foot so deeply in your mouh and still be
able to shoot it?
Elisabetta
"John of Aix" wrote:
> Ulvesang wrote:
> > I'm sure the US military base near Keflavik, Iceland is a
> > beacon of defense fighting off all the horrible rabid
> > zombie-communists
>
> No, it's to stop the Vikings getting out, they represent an imminent
> threat to the world, they're all hiding and waiting to be activated by
> their leader Harald bin Bluetooth.
*Chokes on espresso while sitting on the piazza watching people pass by, and
fiddling with her Ericsson*
LOLOL!
E
Enzo Michelangeli
"Blunt Force Trauma" <yryr...@bvcbcbc.com> wrote in message
news:o6j8d.8095$g%5.24...@news4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net...
>
> "E.F.Schelby" <sch...@swcp.com> wrote in message
> news:eqe3m0tosi141r5pq...@4ax.com...
> > "Ken Leander" <kenle...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >>
> >>"Delila" <aqu...@widomaker.com> wrote in message
> >>news:41618...@corp.newsgroups.com...
> >>>
> >>> news:cjs0od$p98$1...@geraldo.cc.utexas.edu...
> >>> >
> >>> >
> >>> > France - GDP/capita $27,500 ~ 42% taxation ~10 % unemployment
> >>>
> >>Under the
> >>circumstances, Europeans are easier for Americans to compete against.
> >
> > Really? Is that why our exports are so meager and Euro Exports so
> > much higher?
> >
>
> crap they want.
What pays for import is not "disposable income", it's foreign investment,
which (for obvious accounting reasons) mirrors the current account
deficit. Look at its trend at
http://research.stlouisfed.org/fred2/series/BOPBCA/14/Max : the latest
figure is US$ 166.77 billion. And a good chunk of it is not even real
investment: it's simple purchase of US government debt (total:
http://research.stlouisfed.org/fred2/series/FYGFD/5/Max , don't get dizzy)
by foreign governments, mostly China and Japan. According to
http://research.stlouisfed.org/fred2/series/FDHBFIN/5/Max , between end
June 2003 and end June 2004 the amount of federal debt held by foreign and
investor and institutions has risen by $368.4 billion. So, when you say:
> Maybe the Chinese will send you a bag of rice for food?
...you should really be speaking to your government.
But be quick, it may not last long.
Enzo
bu...@bulba.com
<paolopizz...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
><bu...@bulba.com> wrote in message
>news:fao3m05cmqucamrqb...@4ax.com...
>> On Mon, 04 Oct 2004 21:50:33 GMT, "Paolo Pizzi"
>
>>>Sorry, that does NOT apply to infant mortality.
>>
>> It does: those are much more likely statistically
>> to be "prematurely born".
>If they're born, they're not dead.
>Look up the word "mortality."
And when they die, they're infants that become
dead, look up the word "mortality".
>> Plus, it doesn't account for a lot more uneducated
>> immigrants coming to United States than to
>> Europe.
>Bullshit, Europe is as much a target of immigration
>from third world countries as the US.
Except it doesn't have anything comparable to big
and illegal immigration from Mexico, that US
does (some half a million estimated every year).
>>>Irrelevant, the crime rate in the US is still much higher.
>>>France is not exactly a small country...
>> But not comparable in population to US, is it?
>Check those numbers, is the US population
>20 times that of France? You lose again.
I don't lose anything, maniac, the real world
is the way it is regardless of how any of us
is presenting it. Sure US has more crime
than Europe, but not drastically more, not
that more as you present it. Another
problem is that in the countries with
the breakdown of rule of law lots of
crime simply doesn't get reported: the
very fact that crime gets reported
massively to US justice system means
it gets fought massively. As such, that
itself is not a problem, but a root of
that crime is rather a problem in US.
Which you just don't bother to look for,
because you fall over yourself to scream
about some obsession of yours, using
the very first number you come across
for as a rallying cry.
>>>> plus most of that is black-on-black and
>>>> Hispanic-on-Hispanic
>>>Meaning exactly what?
>> Meaning exactly that.
>>>That blacks and hispanics
>>>are NOT Americans? Or that non-whites should
>>>not count because you're a racist?
>> Nope. It means that America has more racial
>> groups and divisions than Europe.
>Aside from revealing your blatant racism, what exactly
>does that prove?
Oh my hypocrisy! Oh my blatant racism!
Figure it out yourself.
bu...@bulba.com
<paolopizz...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>>> FRANCE US
>>>Population below median income 8% 17%
>>>Population below poverty line 6.7% 12.4%
>>>Meaning that a lot more people in the US than in France
>>>are actually busy figuring out how to make ends meet.
>> No, that is merely meaning that the top incomes in USA are much
>> higher (income disparity is bigger) and that poverty line definitions
>> are pretty arbitrary
>Amazing how right-wingers are capable of shooting their own
>foot.
Woe my foot, woe!
>You got it right, income disparity is bigger, that's EXACTLY
>what it means, only you don't quite get it...
Meaning what? That you don't distinguish between relative
and absolute poverty?
According to Swedish Trade Research Institute, the median
Swedish income, including gross welfare transfers, is
about equal to the median income of blacks in USA.
Sure it abstracts from crime and other conditions of living for
instance, so the "median" Swede lives better than a "median"
black in USA. Nevertheless, when it comes to _purchasing power_
of people's income, which is the best measure of strictly material
poverty you can find, you try to invent non-existent problem.
bu...@bulba.com
<yryr...@bvcbcbc.com> wrote:
>>>Every Euro should have a bumper sticker showing Chirac getting his butt
>>>kicked by George Bush.
>> Don't equate Europeans with French. Not everyone here is that
>> dim.
>Sorry. I forgot the French are really scraping the bottom of the barrel.
The Germans should do something about them definitely, the French
farmers basically ride on the backs of the German taxpayers.
Sometimes I have the impression that the whole EU is treated
by the French as its own personal farm, for which Germans, because
who else, should just pay and shut up. At some point the Germans
might get a wrong idea what to do about it (I'm joking of course).
John of Aix
> On Mon, 04 Oct 2004 21:50:33 GMT, "Paolo Pizzi"
> <paolopizz...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>> Keep spinning, it still doesn't fly...
>
> You fool yourself. The numbers don't lie, you do.
OK, I believe you. PP gives facts, you give red herrings, you win, that
is obvious.
bu...@bulba.com
<j.mu...@nospamlibertysurf.fr> wrote:
>>> Keep spinning, it still doesn't fly...
>>
>> You fool yourself. The numbers don't lie, you do.
>
>OK, I believe you. PP gives facts, you give red herrings, you win, that
>is obvious.
Get away from me, you maniac.
Bobby Fischler
> > The two Simonas say people that kidnap others and behead innocents are
> just
> > poor misunderstood, but nice fellas.
> >
> > Holding a knife to your throat is just their way of telling you how much
> > they love you.
> >
> > The two Simonas say terrorism is perfectly OK. It's just resisting. It's
> > natural to blow up 40 little kids instead of resisting at the ballot box,
> > don't you know? Maybe the two Simonas are gonna start their own Red
> > Brigades?
> >
> > Italy would have been better off if they had both been beheaded. They
> should
> > leave the cowardly appeasement to the Germans, French and Spanish.
> >
> > http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/3710736.stm
> >
> > All those ETA guys...let them out of jail! They was just kiddin' around
> when
> > they blew up that train. It's just resitance. It's OK.
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> Not that I have particularly good feelings toward muslims in general, but in
> this case (Irak, not Chechnia), I understand the resistance. If an army
> decided to illegally invade my homeland to steal its ressources and
> destroyed its infrastructures, I would certainly have some toughts about
> joining the resistance. Maybe French should not have resisted the German
> invasion in WW2? Is that what you suggest?
Infrastructure? What infrastructure did Saddam build? He built a lot
of palaces for himself and his sons. The Iraqis got fed into plastic
shredders.
Paolo
news:4161e601$1...@newsgate.hknet.com:
>
>> >>> > USA --- GDP/capita $37,800 ~28% taxation ~5-6% unemployment
>> >>> > France - GDP/capita $27,500 ~ 42% taxation ~10 %
>
> What pays for import is not "disposable income", it's foreign
> investment, which (for obvious accounting reasons) mirrors the current
> account deficit.
Note also that measures of unemployment vary, see:
http://www.gillespieresearch.com/cgi-bin/s/article/id=264
and probably using the same measures US employment would be equivalent or
higher than European.
Cheers
John of Aix
> On Tue, 5 Oct 2004 16:39:37 +0200, "John of Aix"
> <j.mu...@nospamlibertysurf.fr> wrote:
>
>>>> Keep spinning, it still doesn't fly...
>>>
>>> You fool yourself. The numbers don't lie, you do.
>>
>> OK, I believe you. PP gives facts, you give red herrings, you win,
>> that is obvious.
>
> Get away from me, you maniac.
What's the matter son, don't you like to be told when you're talking
bollocks?
John of Aix
> China states they have only 10% of their population below the poverty
> line. Unfortunately, the line is ill defined. It varies from country
> to country. If the USA had to make do with the Chinese $5000
> GDP/capita, we would feel deprived.
You aren't very bright are you? If a meal in a restaurant in China costs
the equivalent of 1 dollar say and it costs ten dollars in the USA, then
the US American would need to earn 50,000 dollars to have an equivalent
relative income.
John of Aix
> On Mon, 04 Oct 2004 18:35:25 GMT, "Blunt Force Trauma"
> <yryr...@bvcbcbc.com> wrote:
>> Yes, France is the capital of welfare benefits. No job, no problem.
>> The state will take care of you forever.
>
> know if it is true) that the unemployment benefits in France
> are actually rather low and do tend to run out.
They are proportional to the income one was receiving before
unemployment, (I think) up to 80% depending on the circumstances but
only last for a year normally with an extension of another year in
certain cases. However should unemployment benefit come to an end, the
person will have a right to various other social security payments
which, while not as high, are reasonable and enough to live on for
anyone but profligates
John of Aix
> It's horrible, I grant that. This is real world, this is what real
> politics is like. But doing nothing is even worse. Every
> action should be accompanied with the calculation: what
> the cost of NOT doing it is to us.
And what *doing* it costs. By the irrational, unnecessary and illegal
action of the USA the cost has been far, far, far higher than if it had
kept its nose out of somthing that was none of its business, that is to
say the internal affairs of the sovereign countyr Iraq.
>> As for these ulterior motives, I agree with you entirely that France
>> has ulterior motives. I'm sure that being taken over by violent
>> Muslims and having bombings in the UK and Spain where their borders
>> are all open to are exactly what they're looking for.
Frances motives in this affair are the rule of international law (as
well as simple common sense), nothing more, nothing less and I defy you
to prove the contrary.
John of Aix
> On Tue, 05 Oct 2004 01:08:59 GMT, "Paolo Pizzi"
> <paolopizz...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>
>> <bu...@bulba.com> wrote in message
>> news:fao3m05cmqucamrqb...@4ax.com...
>>> On Mon, 04 Oct 2004 21:50:33 GMT, "Paolo Pizzi"
>>
>>>> Sorry, that does NOT apply to infant mortality.
>>>
>>> It does: those are much more likely statistically
>>> to be "prematurely born".
>
>> If they're born, they're not dead.
>> Look up the word "mortality."
>
> And when they die, they're infants that become
> dead, look up the word "mortality".
Yes we know that dear but infant mortality is infant mortality, what
they die of is neither here nor there. The fact of the matter is simple,
France's record on infant mortality is better than that of the USA.
>
>>> Plus, it doesn't account for a lot more uneducated
>>> immigrants coming to United States than to
>>> Europe.
>
>> Bullshit, Europe is as much a target of immigration
>> from third world countries as the US.
>
> Except it doesn't have anything comparable to big
> and illegal immigration from Mexico, that US
> does (some half a million estimated every year).
I think you ought to try reading a newspaper here or there or watch
a news channel (obviously not Fox as it isn't a news channel). Europe
hasthousands upon thousands of illegal immigrants. I won't make an
estimate because it is pointless as estimates are always only estimates
without proof. I could have said Europe has an estimated two million
illegal immigrants a year and you wouldn't be able to prove the
contrary but I'm more honest than you.
> I don't lose anything, maniac, the real world
> is the way it is regardless of how any of us
> is presenting it. Sure US has more crime
> than Europe, but not drastically more, not
> that more as you present it.
The last time I checked the figures San Diego was the only major town
that had less murders per year than any European *country*. I would call
that drastically more wouldn't you?
> Another
> problem is that in the countries with
> the breakdown of rule of law lots of
> crime simply doesn't get reported: the
> very fact that crime gets reported
> massively to US justice system means
> it gets fought massively.
And? Do you think that in Europe crime doesn't get repressed massively?
> As such, that
> itself is not a problem, but a root of
> that crime is rather a problem in US.
>
> Which you just don't bother to look for,
> because you fall over yourself to scream
> about some obsession of yours, using
> the very first number you come across
> for as a rallying cry.
I think a whole series of figures that prove beyond any shadow of a
doubt that the USA lags behind France can hardly be called 'the first
number you come across'.
Why not forget it, you cannot win, the facts are there and all your
bluster, red-herrings and subject changes won't make them go away.
John of Aix
> On Mon, 04 Oct 2004 15:09:19 -0600, E.F.Schelby <sch...@swcp.com>
> wrote:
>
>
>>>> > USA --- GDP/capita $37,800 ~28% taxation ~5-6% unemployment
>>>> > France - GDP/capita $27,500 ~ 42% taxation ~10 % unemployment
>
>>> Under the
>>> circumstances, Europeans are easier for Americans to compete
>>> against.
>
>> Really? Is that why our exports are so meager and Euro Exports so
>> much higher?
>
> Bad econ, see "pop internationalism" by Paul Krugman.
Are EU exports towards the USA far greater than the other way round?
They are, so what exactly is your point?
John of Aix
> On Mon, 04 Oct 2004 22:04:26 GMT, "Paolo Pizzi"
> <paolopizz...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>
>> FRANCE
>> US
>
>> Population below median income 8% 17%
>> Population below poverty line 6.7% 12.4%
>
>> Meaning that a lot more people in the US than in France
>> are actually busy figuring out how to make ends meet.
>
> No, that is merely meaning that the top incomes in USA are much
> higher
If I earn 100 dollars a day and I spend 90 dollars on housing, food etc,
am I richer or poorer than someone in a country that earns 50 dollars a
day and spends 40 dollars on food and housing? They are the same aren't
they, so the level of income has nothing to do with it, it is how far
that income goes in the country in which it is earnt and spent that
counts.
Blunt Force Trauma II
"Elisabetta" <betta.vR...@btinternet.com> wrote in message
news:cju4gr$f2k$1...@hercules.btinternet.com...
It probably was a Nokia. BTW...Have they gone out of business yet?
> E
>
>
Blunt Force Trauma II
"John of Aix" <j.mu...@nospamlibertysurf.fr> wrote in message
news:4162b6ae$0$17775$8fcf...@news.wanadoo.fr...
PP is a bend over and fuck me Italian pacifist. My bet is that he is an
unemployed Parmalat of Fiat loser.
Blunt Force Trauma II
Europe can't buy anything. All they can do is pay the rent and maybe buy
some food. A reasonable person wouldn't expect the beggars to be buying
much. Why do you think they scape together a few euros to buy a micro-sized
cup of coffee and then they spend the entire day drinking it while watching
all the American tourists go by?
>
>
Ken Leander
eaten in weeks. I couldn't afford $22000 shoes and rice too. Woe is us.
And don't forget the happiness of socialism! China is even happier than
the French. About 50 million unhappy Chinese were killed so the others
would enjoy life. Sad but necessary.
The French are so wise. Power to the people!
Ken Leander
...
>> Bad econ, see "pop internationalism" by Paul Krugman.
>
> Are EU exports towards the USA far greater than the other way round?
> They are, so what exactly is your point?
The point is you are working for us. Thanks. Send more shoes. We will
give you more of our paper money.
Ken Leander
That's too complicated for us stupid Bu$hites. If we earn $100 and buy
French food, we could eat like kings. The French could eat our paper money.
True?
Ken Leander
Nothing could be more fair than the trial of Slobodon Milosovich. It is
proof of European superior simple common sense. Also, the political failure
of the USA is increasingly evident concerning USA meddling in the affairs of
Adolf Hitler. All of these USA mistakes are clear failures of the prime
directive established by the United Federation of Planets.
Paolo
news:9EF8d.24$7K2....@news4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net:
> Europe can't buy anything. All they can do is pay the rent and maybe
> buy some food. A reasonable person wouldn't expect the beggars to be
> buying much. Why do you think they scape together a few euros to buy a
> micro-sized cup of coffee and then they spend the entire day drinking
> it while watching all the American tourists go by?
LOL, you would make a great standup act (reminds me of Denis Leary a bit).
I'd bet you'd never even been to Europe, or if you have, you were drunk
most of the time (that's what we see American tourist do)
Cheers
bu...@bulba.com
<j.mu...@nospamlibertysurf.fr> wrote:
>> It's horrible, I grant that. This is real world, this is what real
>> politics is like. But doing nothing is even worse. Every
>> action should be accompanied with the calculation: what
>> the cost of NOT doing it is to us.
>And what *doing* it costs. By the irrational, unnecessary and illegal
>action of the USA the cost has been far, far, far higher than if it had
>kept its nose out of somthing that was none of its business, that is to
>say the internal affairs of the sovereign countyr Iraq.
You really think somebody will be stupid enough to believe in those
lies?
Get over it, France lost the politics of it. You lost your politics
when the Security Council resolution was pissed on by everybody,
as usual. You delude yourselves.
>>> As for these ulterior motives, I agree with you entirely that France
>>> has ulterior motives. I'm sure that being taken over by violent
>>> Muslims and having bombings in the UK and Spain where their borders
>>> are all open to are exactly what they're looking for.
>Frances motives in this affair are the rule of international law (as
>well as simple common sense), nothing more, nothing less and I defy you
>to prove the contrary.
French officials have been taking bribes from Hussein in "oil
vouchers", the UN officials have been getting bribes in cash
on the oil tankers for "not seeing certain things". There is
official investigation on that in the UN now plus the Iraqi
Oil Ministry has uncovered some documents experts say
they are authentic, that document the corruption of lots of
officials from France, Russia and UN. Maybe missed it
in the news? Are you blind or smth? Plus France and Russia
have signed big oil contracts withHussein before the war,
on the premise that they would protect Hussein diplomatically
in the Security Council by vetoing any efforts of US to get
the war blessed by UN - with this sort of vetoes being
unprecedented - because they didn't think US would have
enough guts to go to war without UN blessing.
The calculation was obviously proven wrong, this is the
reason why France and Russia were so totally mad at the
beginning of Iraqi Freedom - not only they lost the oil
contracts and oil kickbacks, but all the more of knowledgable
people laughed while covering their faces, about the failure
of France and Russia. France and Russia lost face over that
diplomatically speaking, their politics was proven impotent,
so that was insult on top of political and economic injury they
suffered.
Russia, France and UN have been proven to be thoroughly
corrupt. Many commentators have expressed their
amazement, that as cynical as they were, they didn't
expect the international system to be THAT corrupt.
You're a child, John of Denseville.