Idiotic Lawsuit in Israel

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Joseph Hertzlinger

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Jun 25, 2000, 3:00:00 AM6/25/00
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See http://biz.yahoo.com/rf/000622/l20352235_2.html

Apparently an "internal Philip Morris memo" is being used an an excuse
for an $8 billion lawsuit brought on behalf of the Clalit national
health fund in Israel. The memo said the fertilizers used for growing
tobacco were slightly radioactive and there is a possibility some of
the radioactivity could contaminate the cigarettes.

The same fertilizers are used for growing other plants. Even the
heaviest smokers consume far more radioactive material by eating than
by smoking. (I think I just ate a radioactive pizza.)

Low doses of radioactivity might not even be dangerous anyway. People
in the Rock Mountains ("where the scenery's attractive and the air is
radioactive" --- Professor Tom Lehrer) have relatively low cancer
mortality rates.

Besides, nukes were a ZOG invention.

Polar

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Jun 25, 2000, 3:00:00 AM6/25/00
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On 25 Jun 2000 03:47:12 GMT, jher...@ix.netcom.com (Joseph
Hertzlinger) wrote:

About 15 years ago, when it was discovered (I believe in a Colorado
lab) that tobacco contained ionizing radiation (alpha particles,
IIRC), *scientists* stopped smoking in a BIG hurry. They understood
the implications. Haven't looked up the details in quite a few years,
but it made big news in the non-smokers' rights movement.

--
Polar

Joseph Hertzlinger

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Jun 25, 2000, 3:00:00 AM6/25/00
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On Sun, 25 Jun 2000 00:27:51 -0700, Polar <sme...@mindspring.com> wrote:

>About 15 years ago, when it was discovered (I believe in a Colorado
>lab) that tobacco contained ionizing radiation (alpha particles,
>IIRC), *scientists* stopped smoking in a BIG hurry.

There were still scientists smoking 15 years ago?

Polar

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Jun 25, 2000, 3:00:00 AM6/25/00
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On 25 Jun 2000 14:54:18 GMT, jher...@ix.netcom.com (Joseph
Hertzlinger) wrote:

Alas. It is a VERY addictive drug. It would be very interesting to
learn whether foreign scientists still do -- considering how prevalent
smoking still is abroad for the general public. How best construct
such a study??

I had some (non-smoking) [1] Hungarian guests few months ago. We're
walking down the local Promenade when the husband stopped short and
said "I just noticed something amazing. Nobody's smoking!! Back home,
everybody would have a cigarette."

(I'll have to check whether it was 15 or 20 years when the first
ionizing radiation research emerged. Sure was a wake-up call!)

[1] Long since I decided no more smoking in the house no matter
who you are.

--
Polar

mei...@qqqerols.com

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Jun 25, 2000, 3:00:00 AM6/25/00
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In soc.culture.jewish on Sun, 25 Jun 2000 13:24:47 -0700 Polar
<sme...@mindspring.com> posted:

>On 25 Jun 2000 14:54:18 GMT, jher...@ix.netcom.com (Joseph
>Hertzlinger) wrote:
>
>>On Sun, 25 Jun 2000 00:27:51 -0700, Polar <sme...@mindspring.com> wrote:
>>
>>>About 15 years ago, when it was discovered (I believe in a Colorado
>>>lab) that tobacco contained ionizing radiation (alpha particles,
>>>IIRC), *scientists* stopped smoking in a BIG hurry.
>>
>>There were still scientists smoking 15 years ago?
>
>Alas. It is a VERY addictive drug. It would be very interesting to
>learn whether foreign scientists still do -- considering how prevalent
>smoking still is abroad for the general public. How best construct
>such a study??
>
>I had some (non-smoking) [1] Hungarian guests few months ago. We're
>walking down the local Promenade when the husband stopped short and
>said "I just noticed something amazing. Nobody's smoking!! Back home,
>everybody would have a cigarette."

They had someone on the news a few weeks ago who had moved from the US
to France just because he could smoke anywhere he wanted there.

>(I'll have to check whether it was 15 or 20 years when the first
>ionizing radiation research emerged. Sure was a wake-up call!)
>
>[1] Long since I decided no more smoking in the house no matter
>who you are.

I offer ashtrays, or I would but in fact no one I know smokes. I
definitely draw the line at their dropping their ashes on the carpet.


mei...@QQQerols.com
e-mail by removing QQQ

Joseph Hertzlinger

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Jun 26, 2000, 3:00:00 AM6/26/00
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On Sun, 25 Jun 2000 13:24:47 -0700, Polar <sme...@mindspring.com> wrote:

>On 25 Jun 2000 14:54:18 GMT, jher...@ix.netcom.com (Joseph
>Hertzlinger) wrote:
>
>>On Sun, 25 Jun 2000 00:27:51 -0700, Polar <sme...@mindspring.com> wrote:
>>
>>>About 15 years ago, when it was discovered (I believe in a Colorado
>>>lab) that tobacco contained ionizing radiation (alpha particles,
>>>IIRC), *scientists* stopped smoking in a BIG hurry.
>>
>>There were still scientists smoking 15 years ago?
>
>Alas. It is a VERY addictive drug.

Apparently, the actions of these scientists did not reflect their
understanding of science before a lab in a high-radiation part of the
U.S. found evidence of alpha emitters in tobacco smoke. Maybe their
actions afterward also did not reflect such an understanding.

Michael Shimshoni

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Jun 26, 2000, 3:00:00 AM6/26/00
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In article <8j56eq$8eq$1...@slb6.atl.mindspring.net%
jher...@ix.netcom.com (Joseph Hertzlinger) writes:

%On Sun, 25 Jun 2000 00:27:51 -0700, Polar <sme...@mindspring.com> wrote:
%
%>About 15 years ago, when it was discovered (I believe in a Colorado
%>lab) that tobacco contained ionizing radiation (alpha particles,
%>IIRC), *scientists* stopped smoking in a BIG hurry.
%
%There were still scientists smoking 15 years ago?

Is that what is meant by savant idiot?

Michael Shimshoni

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Jun 26, 2000, 3:00:00 AM6/26/00
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In article <B2976ES...@weizmann.weizmann.ac.il#
MA...@weizmann.weizmann.ac.il (Michael Shimshoni) writes:

#In article <8j56eq$8eq$1...@slb6.atl.mindspring.net%
#jher...@ix.netcom.com (Joseph Hertzlinger) writes:
#
#%On Sun, 25 Jun 2000 00:27:51 -0700, Polar <sme...@mindspring.com> wrote:
#%
#%>About 15 years ago, when it was discovered (I believe in a Colorado
#%>lab) that tobacco contained ionizing radiation (alpha particles,
#%>IIRC), *scientists* stopped smoking in a BIG hurry.
#%
#%There were still scientists smoking 15 years ago?
#
#Is that what is meant by savant idiot?

Correction. I just realized that the correct form is
idiot savant. Sorry.

Michael Shimshoni

Amitai Halevi

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Jun 26, 2000, 3:00:00 AM6/26/00
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On Mon, 26 Jun 2000, Michael Shimshoni wrote:

; In article <B2976ES...@weizmann.weizmann.ac.il#


; MA...@weizmann.weizmann.ac.il (Michael Shimshoni) writes:
;
; #In article <8j56eq$8eq$1...@slb6.atl.mindspring.net%
; #jher...@ix.netcom.com (Joseph Hertzlinger) writes:
; #
; #%On Sun, 25 Jun 2000 00:27:51 -0700, Polar <sme...@mindspring.com>

; #%wrote:
; #%


; #%>About 15 years ago, when it was discovered (I believe in a Colorado
; #%>lab) that tobacco contained ionizing radiation (alpha particles,
; #%>IIRC), *scientists* stopped smoking in a BIG hurry.
; #%
; #%There were still scientists smoking 15 years ago?
; #
; #Is that what is meant by savant idiot?
;
; Correction. I just realized that the correct form is
; idiot savant. Sorry.

;
To pick a nit, I prefer "savant idiot" for a scientist
who smokes. I am prepared to be corrected by a knowledgeable
francophone (Is Esther Bosse' Pfeffer still around?), but
as I see it:
idiot savant = "an idiot who knows", i.e., an intellectually
limited person who has one oustanding mental skill,
e.g., multiplication of large numbers.
savant idiot = "a learned person who is an idiot", to judge
from his/her behavior..

Amitai

*--------------------------------------------------------------------*
| E. Amitai Halevi <chr...@aluf.technion.ac.il> |
| Department of Chemistry, Technion-Israel Institute of Technology |
| http://www.technion.ac.il/technion/chemistry/staff/halevi |
| |
| "`Od yenuvun be-seva, deshenim ve-ra`ananim yihyu", Psalms 92,15 |
*--------------------------------------------------------------------*

; Michael Shimshoni
;
;


Michael Shimshoni

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Jun 27, 2000, 3:00:00 AM6/27/00
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In article <Pine.OSF.4.10.100062...@aluf.technion.ac.il%
Amitai Halevi <chr...@aluf.technion.ac.il% writes:

%On Mon, 26 Jun 2000, Michael Shimshoni wrote:
%
%; In article <B2976ES...@weizmann.weizmann.ac.il#
%; MA...@weizmann.weizmann.ac.il (Michael Shimshoni) writes:
%;
%; #In article <8j56eq$8eq$1...@slb6.atl.mindspring.net%
%; #jher...@ix.netcom.com (Joseph Hertzlinger) writes:
%; #
%; #%On Sun, 25 Jun 2000 00:27:51 -0700, Polar <sme...@mindspring.com>
%; #%wrote:
%; #%
%; #%>About 15 years ago, when it was discovered (I believe in a Colorado
%; #%>lab) that tobacco contained ionizing radiation (alpha particles,
%; #%>IIRC), *scientists* stopped smoking in a BIG hurry.
%; #%
%; #%There were still scientists smoking 15 years ago?
%; #
%; #Is that what is meant by savant idiot?
%;
%; Correction. I just realized that the correct form is
%; idiot savant. Sorry.
%;
%To pick a nit, I prefer "savant idiot" for a scientist
%who smokes. I am prepared to be corrected by a knowledgeable
%francophone (Is Esther Bosse' Pfeffer still around?), but
%as I see it:
%idiot savant = "an idiot who knows", i.e., an intellectually
% limited person who has one oustanding mental skill,
% e.g., multiplication of large numbers.
%savant idiot = "a learned person who is an idiot", to judge
% from his/her behavior..

As my French is minimal, I would not like to argue with my mentor
Amitai on such a matter. After having posted my original
savant idiot, I had some doubts and looked in several dictionaries
and could not find this sequence. Eventually I found in one
dictionary the idiot savant form so I quickly posted my correction.

I know that the fact that I have not found the first combination
does not proof it fully, as yag`ata ve lo matsata al ta'amin.

% Amitai

Michael Shimshoni

Amitai Halevi

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Jun 27, 2000, 3:00:00 AM6/27/00
to
On Tue, 27 Jun 2000, Michael Shimshoni wrote:

; In article


;<Pine.OSF.4.10.100062...@aluf.technion.ac.il%
; Amitai Halevi <chr...@aluf.technion.ac.il% writes:
;
; %On Mon, 26 Jun 2000, Michael Shimshoni wrote:
; %
; %; In article <B2976ES...@weizmann.weizmann.ac.il#
; %; MA...@weizmann.weizmann.ac.il (Michael Shimshoni) writes:
; %;
; %; #In article <8j56eq$8eq$1...@slb6.atl.mindspring.net%
; %; #jher...@ix.netcom.com (Joseph Hertzlinger) writes:
; %; #
; %; #%On Sun, 25 Jun 2000 00:27:51 -0700, Polar <sme...@mindspring.com>
; %; #%wrote:
; %; #%
; %; #%>About 15 years ago, when it was discovered (I believe in a

; %; #%>Colorado lab that tobacco contained ionizing radiation (alpha particles,

;
In this rare case, yaga`ta ve lo matsata ... ta'amin!
I had the `hutzpah - non-Francophone that I am - to authorize
the use of "savant idiot" in the sense that you gave it
originally, since "idiot savant" means something else.
I might have appended "TM" to it, but what right had _I_
to take credit for _your_ invention?!

Amitai

*--------------------------------------------------------------------*
| E. Amitai Halevi <chr...@aluf.technion.ac.il> |
| Department of Chemistry, Technion-Israel Institute of Technology |
| http://www.technion.ac.il/technion/chemistry/staff/halevi |
| |
| "`Od yenuvun be-seva, deshenim ve-ra`ananim yihyu", Psalms 92,15 |
*--------------------------------------------------------------------*

; % Amitai
;
; Michael Shimshoni
;
;


mos...@mm.huji.ac.il

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Jun 27, 2000, 3:00:00 AM6/27/00
to
Polar <sme...@mindspring.com> writes:

> I had some (non-smoking) [1] Hungarian guests few months ago. We're
> walking down the local Promenade when the husband stopped short and
> said "I just noticed something amazing. Nobody's smoking!! Back home,
> everybody would have a cigarette."
>

> (I'll have to check whether it was 15 or 20 years when the first
> ionizing radiation research emerged. Sure was a wake-up call!)
>
> [1] Long since I decided no more smoking in the house no matter
> who you are.

One thing we totaly agree on.

Moshe Schorr
It is a tremendous Mitzvah to be happy always! - Reb Nachman of Breslov
--
Voting is now taking place in news.announce.newgroups for
soc.culture.jewish.moderated.
Please take a few minutes out of your day to go and vote. Thanks so much!

mei...@qqqerols.com

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Jun 27, 2000, 3:00:00 AM6/27/00
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In soc.culture.jewish on Tue, 27 Jun 00 10:36:26 +03
MA...@weizmann.weizmann.ac.il (Michael Shimshoni) posted:

>Amitai said:
>%;
>%To pick a nit, I prefer "savant idiot" for a scientist
>%who smokes. I am prepared to be corrected by a knowledgeable
>%francophone (Is Esther Bosse' Pfeffer still around?), but
>%as I see it:
>%idiot savant = "an idiot who knows", i.e., an intellectually
>% limited person who has one oustanding mental skill,
>% e.g., multiplication of large numbers.
>%savant idiot = "a learned person who is an idiot", to judge
>% from his/her behavior..
>
>As my French is minimal, I would not like to argue with my mentor
>Amitai on such a matter. After having posted my original
>savant idiot, I had some doubts and looked in several dictionaries
>and could not find this sequence. Eventually I found in one
>dictionary the idiot savant form so I quickly posted my correction.
>
>I know that the fact that I have not found the first combination
>does not proof it fully, as yag`ata ve lo matsata al ta'amin.

I thought Amitai was saying you coined a new expression. I liked it
too. If they are both nouns??, I would think you are as free to
rearrange them, as some French guy was to coin the phrase.

And heck, even if they're not both nouns. No worse than other
foreignisms in English. (The dictionary implies savant is a past
participle.)


>% Amitai
>
> Michael Shimshoni

mos...@mm.huji.ac.il

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Jun 27, 2000, 3:00:00 AM6/27/00
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Amitai Halevi <chr...@aluf.technion.ac.il> writes:
> 2000, Michael Shimshoni wrote:
> ; MA...@weizmann.weizmann.ac.il (Michael Shimshoni) writes:

> ; #jher...@ix.netcom.com (Joseph Hertzlinger) writes:
> ; #%On Sun, 25 Jun 2000 00:27:51 -0700, Polar <sme...@mindspring.com>
> ; #%wrote:
> ; #%
> ; #%>About 15 years ago, when it was discovered (I believe in a Colorado
> ; #%>lab) that tobacco contained ionizing radiation (alpha particles,

> ; #%>IIRC), *scientists* stopped smoking in a BIG hurry.
> ; #%

> ; #%There were still scientists smoking 15 years ago?
> ; #

> ; #Is that what is meant by savant idiot?
> ;
> ; Correction. I just realized that the correct form is
> ; idiot savant. Sorry.
> ;
> To pick a nit, I prefer "savant idiot" for a scientist
> who smokes. I am prepared to be corrected by a knowledgeable
> francophone (Is Esther Bosse' Pfeffer still around?), but
> as I see it:

> idiot savant = "an idiot who knows", i.e., an intellectually
> limited person who has one oustanding mental skill,
> e.g., multiplication of large numbers.
> savant idiot = "a learned person who is an idiot", to judge
> from his/her behavior..

I was refering to this in my one-liner. Amitai does it better.

mos...@mm.huji.ac.il

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Jun 27, 2000, 3:00:00 AM6/27/00
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MA...@weizmann.weizmann.ac.il (Michael Shimshoni) writes:
> MA...@weizmann.weizmann.ac.il (Michael Shimshoni) writes:
> #jher...@ix.netcom.com (Joseph Hertzlinger) writes:
> #%On Sun, 25 Jun 2000 00:27:51 -0700, Polar <sme...@mindspring.com> wrote:
> #%
> #%>About 15 years ago, when it was discovered (I believe in a Colorado
> #%>lab) that tobacco contained ionizing radiation (alpha particles,
> #%>IIRC), *scientists* stopped smoking in a BIG hurry.
> #%
> #%There were still scientists smoking 15 years ago?
> #
> #Is that what is meant by savant idiot?
>
> Correction. I just realized that the correct form is
> idiot savant. Sorry.

And I thought it was a clever play on words.

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