I would rather read a book
ace...@my-dejanews.com
going? Well, I want to know what you all read. What books have influenced
your views of Japan. There are quite a number out there, and I am afraid of
reading the wrong one. It is an important choice, no? Of course there is Ruth
Benedict's work which is hailed as seminal, but I found it frighteningly
outdated and incapable. I have tried to read Japanese Society by Chie Nakane,
and started reading a book by David Mura. Somehow, I checked myself before
finishing these and subsequently subscribing to them. We are talking about
people here, race, and stereotypes; I don't want junk that will impair my
outlook. There is quite a lot out there, if you don't believe me take a trip
through the voluminous Amazon.com. What has been helpful to all of you? I
just want some pointers, thanks.
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Gavin Keir
read. I think she has published others.
____________________________________
ace...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
>[snip] I have tried to read Japanese Society by Chie Nakane,
>and started reading a book by David Mura. Somehow, I checked myself before
>finishing these and subsequently subscribing to them. We are talking about
>people here, race, and stereotypes; I don't want junk that will impair my
>outlook. [snip]
J.Bottema
Dutch journalist based in Japan. It's translated in English too.
On second place is the book called "Shinohata, a portrait of a Japanese village",
by Ronald P. Dore. If you want to learn about social structures within a village,
this is it.
But I haven't found my 'bible' yet. I'm looking for a book(s) that has
'everything' about social and cultural aspects of Japan.
Jeroen
>
The Wrights
>
> I am a big fan of books. I am a big fan of Japan. Do you see where I am
> going? Well, I want to know what you all read. What books have influenced
> your views of Japan. There are quite a number out there, and I am afraid of
> reading the wrong one. It is an important choice, no? Of course there is Ruth
> Benedict's work which is hailed as seminal, but I found it frighteningly
> outdated and incapable.
Outdated but historically valid and puts a historical perspective on
what else you might read. There are lots of books about Japanese
history, customs, etc. These get insufferably dry after awhile.
> I have tried to read Japanese Society by Chie Nakane,
> and started reading a book by David Mura.
"Becoming Japanese", interesting and approachable book about an American
born guy of Japanese ancestry who graduates from high school knowing
more Yiddish than Japanese. He goes to Japan and thereby hangs a tale.
I found it interesting, but you have to realize that he is looking at
things from his own perspective and is not an expert on Japanese stuff.
It is still worthwhile reading I thought. Another one I enjoyed was
"Speed Tribes" which gives a little bit of the underside of Japanese
society. Also I enjoyed "Adventures in the Water Trade" or some such
title (I'm sure someone will correct me) which is about a white guy
living in Japan. All of these three books are subject to lots of
interpretation. There is one other series of books that I found
fascinating. They were written by a guy from Oregon who was just
interested in Japanese stuff and ended up by transplanting his family to
Japan for two years while he taught school. The books are from a small
Oregon publisher and the titles were "Mo Ichido", "Sutained Grasu" and I
don't remember the name of the first one, but I think it was "Gaijin
Gaijin". Interesting and realistic reading about real people in a real
society.
> Somehow, I checked myself before
> finishing these and subsequently subscribing to them.
Take most things with a grain of salt.
> We are talking about
> people here, race, and stereotypes; I don't want junk that will impair my
> outlook.
Read Tanaka Tomoyuki's FAQ and take a lot of salt with it because most
of it is his own impression of things. The scj FAQ is a good document
to read also (although it has a weak plot :-).
> There is quite a lot out there, if you don't believe me take a trip
> through the voluminous Amazon.com. What has been helpful to all of you? I
> just want some pointers, thanks.
Just think what kind of things you read about the United States and
compare it to what you really know.
Carl
J.Bottema
The Wrights schreef:
> ace...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
> >
> > Also I enjoyed "Adventures in the Water Trade" or some such
> title (I'm sure someone will correct me) which is about a white guy
> living in Japan.
Yes. I read that book. "Pictures from the watertrade" by John David Morley. A
strange storie. It telss about a western guy in Japan. The first half of the book
reads like a novel, and before you know it you are reading a thesis about the
'watertrade'.
Jeroen
Charles Eicher
> I am a big fan of books. I am a big fan of Japan. Do you see where I am
> going? Well, I want to know what you all read. What books have influenced
> your views of Japan.
I particularly like "Lost Japan" by Alex Kerr. It was originally published
in Japan as "utsukushi nihon no zanzo" (afterimage of a beautiful Japan)
and it won the Shincho Gakugei Literature Prize (the first time a foreigner
had ever won this prize). I highly recommend it to everyone interested in
Japan. Its published by Lonely Planet Press (ISBN 0-86442-370-5). I've
recommended this book to several people, all of them loved the book.
If you're interested in a more scholarly approach, I like "Postwar Japan as
History" (ISBN 0-500-07475-0). It has many interesting essays, divided into
four parts: Contexts; Political Economy; Mass Culture and Metropolitan
Society; Democratic Promise and Practice. This book was used at my
University a couple of years ago, in a course on Japanese postwar history.
The book is published by UC Berkeley, so you can be assured of a
non-conventional approach.
If you are more interested in art and culture, one excellent book is
"Japanese Culture" by H. Paul Varley. It is published by Tuttle Books, but
my edition is quite old and perhaps a new edition is available. My edition
(1984, 3rd edition) is ISBN 0-8048-1516-X. Perhaps you can locate a new
edition at the Tuttle website: <http://www.tuttle-periplus.com/> and many
Tuttle books are available through US vendors (like amazon.com)
Another good book on art is "The Art and Architecture of Japan" by Robert
Treat Paine and Alexander Soper. Its part of the Pelican History of Art
series, ISBN 0-14-056108-0. This book is not strictly about art and
architecture, it discusses art in a cultural context. This book is one of
the standard references on the subject, it is very highly regarded.
I myself have entered the study of Japanese Culture through my language
studies. It is impossible to be fully fluent in Japanese without some
understanding of the culture. I know of a few good books that discuss
interesting language topics in relation to culture, without requiring the
readers to know the language. Here are a few:
Different Games, Different Rules: Why Americans and Japanese Misunderstand
Each Other, by Haru Yamada (ISBN 0-19-509488-3)..
The Japanese Have a Word For It - This book was formerly published as the
"NTC Dictionary of Japanese Cultural Codewords" by Boye Lafayette de Mente,
but was mercifully retitled, since it is DEFINITELY not a dictionary, but a
collection of essays on Japanese culture, centered around a single Japanese
word or concept.
These are all books I would recommend to you, but not necessarily the
entire list of the "books that influenced my views." For example, I read
Benedict, I recognize the book's limitations, but I still think that many
parts of it hold up well. It is by no means a canonical study of Japanese
culture, it is more of a sociological case study.
----------------
Charles Eicher
cei...@inav.net
----------------
ian...@email.msn.com
> But I haven't found my 'bible' yet. I'm looking for a book(s) that has
> 'everything' about social and cultural aspects of Japan.
Yes, I think that is what I have been looking for, a 'bible.' I want the
sociological, and the psychological, and the cultural, and the modern, and
historical all bundled in an easy to read package. But I should probably
buckle down and make some room on my bookshelf for a few volumes.
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Erik
reading-- if you can get your hands on them. As I live in the Portland
area, they are a little easier to find in bookstores here than they are
elsewhere, but a recent check with Amazon indicated that they have the
ability to special order them from Cross Cultural Press for you if you wish.
Gaijin! Gaijin!
Mo Ichido
The Wrights wrote in message <361289...@lafn.org>...
Gavin Keir
any better.
__________________________________________________
cei...@inav.net (Charles Eicher) wrote:
>[snip] "Lost Japan" by Alex Kerr. It was originally published..[snip]
>[snip] I like "Postwar Japan as History" [snip] .
>[snip] one excellent book is "Japanese Culture" by H. Paul Varley.
>..etc.
David Ladley
<6urpgk$e17$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>...
> ... started reading a book by David Mura.
I picked up a book by David Mura once called "Turning Japanese" or
something containing that. It's his journal of his from his move to Japan.
I take him to be a rather bitter man (definitely not one I'd ever want to
meet), and found parts of his book, remarks he made, rather hurtful.
Basically, here's the main theme of "Turning Japanese", as I see it:
Mura slowly discovers a new kind of joy at being reunited with his
biological roots. He sees a place for himself among them, and at the same
time, slowly develops (or unearths from his subconscious) a deep hatred for
the White race.
Dave Ladley
"Sometimes, I find it's easy to be myself
Sometimes, I find it's better to be somebody else."
-- Dave Matthews Band
David Ladley
> going? Well, I want to know what you all read. What books have influenced
of
> reading the wrong one. It is an important choice, no?
OK, here's my schpiel on books about Japan:
They're abundant. My college library has at least 30 shelf sections devoted
to nothing but them. I think there ought to be a whole Library of Congress
classification devoted to Analyses of Japan. This seems to be a topic that
a lot of writers feel the need to rant about.
They're repetitive. Most of them say basically the same things about the
country, just phrased differently. Eventually, comparing Reischauer's view
of Japan with DeMenthe's view of Japan becomes almost like comparing 2
different brands of copier paper. Maybe with the economic problems there
now, new books on Japan might get a *small* breath of fresh air.
They're cold, hard, and depressing. Most books that I've skimmed through on
Japan have not made me want to go there and learn more -- they've
temporarily made me want to never have anything more to do with the damn
place. Keep in mind, though, I'm a sensitive reader, who doesn't like to
read books that are stiff, lacking in hope, or dealing with unresolvable
issues.
Therefore, I would rather NOT read a book. I've found that the best method
for learning more about Japan is to become close friends with someone from
there, and converse.
Dave Ladley
Ian David Garlick
that doesn't sound quite write I'll read up on it but usually by the
time I know enough about the subject to hold my own the subject has
past. With that in mind the books I have recently read are "Bushido -
The Soul of Japan" by Nitobe Inazo, "Cha no Hon" by Okabura Tenshin,
"All She was Worth" by Miyuki Miyabe and "Myths and Legends of Japan" by
F. Hadaland Davis.
Ian D.G.
ace...@my-dejanews.com
"David Ladley" <lad...@panther.middlebury.edu> wrote:
> They're cold, hard, and depressing. Most books that I've skimmed through on
> Japan have not made me want to go there and learn more -- they've
> temporarily made me want to never have anything more to do with the damn
> place.
This is the sentiment that pushed me to ask what everyone was reading. I feel
very disconnected with the books I have read about Japan. I think I find the
same ones unappealing as most of the people who have replied to my post, which
is good, maybe I'll find the thumbs-up books worthwhile. There seems to be
something inherently flawed in all of them.
> Therefore, I would rather NOT read a book.
You are so right, books in this case have paled in comparison to the thing
they are trying to do justice to. That I would rather read a book is just a
sort of catch phrase I use loosely.
> I've found that the best method
> for learning more about Japan is to become close friends with someone from
> there, and converse.
I couldn't agree more. I went to Japan this summer, and nothing I read
before, or have read after, seemed to have much relevance. For one I was told
of scores of caveats, but the weird "western" things I did I would have done
regardless of whatever "how to know the Japanese, overnight" book I read. And
thats what most of them are, and that is impossible I think. And I think many
of us have read the same books, which has disappointed me. I get the feeling
that most books out there are written in "romaji" if you know what I mean.
(Extending the metaphor) I think I am just going to have learn the "kanji,"
by that I mean, as you have said, David, by doing what actually brings in the
lacking third dimension, meaningfull encounters with the people.
Here is a quotation the mode of thinking of which I think the authors of many
a Japanese study subscribe to.
In fact, the whole of Japan is a pure invention. There is no such country,
there are no such people. . . . The Japanese people are . . . simply a mode of
style, an exquisite fancy of art.
Oscar Wilde
The Columbia Dictionary of Quotations is licensed from Columbia University
Press. Copyright © 1993, 1995 by Columbia University Press. All rights
reserved.
Charles Eicher
>
>In article <01bdefc4$3a870e80$aecc...@scuttlebutt.middlebury.edu>,
> "David Ladley" <lad...@panther.middlebury.edu> wrote:
>
>> They're cold, hard, and depressing. Most books that I've skimmed through on
>> Japan have not made me want to go there and learn more -- they've
>> temporarily made me want to never have anything more to do with the damn
>> place.
>
>This is the sentiment that pushed me to ask what everyone was reading. I feel
>very disconnected with the books I have read about Japan. I think I find the
>same ones unappealing as most of the people who have replied to my post, which
>is good, maybe I'll find the thumbs-up books worthwhile. There seems to be
>something inherently flawed in all of them.
let me acknowledge that you are both, to a degree, correct. However, let me make
an argument in defense of books, since I am a bibliophile (lets see Tanaka make
some sexual innuendo out of THAT one!)
Books pale in comparison to the real experience, but they are the most efficient
channel through which we can attain indirect knowledge. Perhaps we learn more
about the author's mind than we do about Japan, in this case, you have to be
selective about whose perspective you chose to read. However, I consider all new
information to be useful. Let me give a specific example..
Before I went to Japan for the summer, I took a Japanese art history course. It
involved a lot of reading, and a lot of study of illustrations of famous
artworks. I learned a lot, but I was unsatisfied. When I got to Japan, I went to
the Tokyo National Museum, and to my delight, the very same artworks I had just
studied were on display. I was much better prepared to interpret and understand
them thanks to my previous reading, but of course, nothing can compare to seeing
and experiencing the real thing. And when I got back to school, 2 days after
revisiting the museum, I sat down in the first day of a Japanese literature
class, the teacher for some reason showed slides of the same ancient artworks I
had just seen in the museum. I felt like I was the only person in the classroom
that had any real understanding of what was being shown.
Of course, this cuts both ways. I heard stories of how Japanese artists during
the Meiji era had studied modern western artworks from illustrations in books.
But these were poor B&W illustrations, and they made a few mistaken conclusions
about these artworks based on the poor reproductions. Some of these same artists
went to Europe to see and study these artworks, but when they got there, some of
them were sorely disappointed, the artworks were nothing like they had expected.
>> Therefore, I would rather NOT read a book.
>
>You are so right, books in this case have paled in comparison to the thing
>they are trying to do justice to. That I would rather read a book is just a
>sort of catch phrase I use loosely.
>
>> I've found that the best method
>> for learning more about Japan is to become close friends with someone from
>> there, and converse.
>
>I couldn't agree more. I went to Japan this summer, and nothing I read
>before, or have read after, seemed to have much relevance.
Oftentimes, my friends and I discuss our experiences in Japan, but its not
something that passes in words. I say something like "Did you ever.." and they
reply "Yeah, I did that.." and we only exchange about one sentence on the
subject. We understand that we both know what its REALLY about, without having
to explain it. And it would be futile to try to explain it..
So.. Yeah, books are secondhand experience, but they're a lot cheaper than a
ticket to Narita. Just read the books, and take them for what they are worth.
Most "expert" points of view are just that, a point of view. Read the books,
consider them background material. Even the books written in Japanese, by
Japanese authors, are still just an interpretation. But realize that Japan has
an intensely deep cultural background, its something that all Japanese people
learn from their days as a child, but it is something that takes us gaijin a
long time to even realize its importance and universal application. You might do
better to read "Chuushingura" or "Genji" than those "learn all about Japan in an
hour" books..
In closing, I will say one thing: studying the Japanese language and culture is
a long-term pursuit. It takes years, one does not become educated overnight. It
takes long persistence, and at times, even the most devoted of us lose our
motivation, and occasionally we need some help to keep our motivation high.
Books are a great aid to keeping up my spirits at times. I can almost always
find something in a book that spurs me on to deeper studies, even if the book
itself is lousy. There will be times when YOUR motivation may be low, and at
those times, a good book is your best remedy.
Philip Brown
>...[lots of good stuff snipped]
>So.. Yeah, books are secondhand experience, but they're a lot cheaper than a
>ticket to Narita. Just read the books, and take them for what they are worth.
>In closing, I will say one thing: studying the Japanese language and culture is
>a long-term pursuit. It takes years, one does not become educated overnight. It
>takes long persistence, and at times, even the most devoted of us lose our
>motivation, and occasionally we need some help to keep our motivation high.
To give you a bit of experience from the beginning side of things :-)
I took two semesters of "extension courses" after work, to learn japanese.
It was two times a week. I enjoyed it, but thought I would get more out of it
if it was shorter, but three times a week or something.
Then I changed jobs, and didn't have time to take the classes any more.
Nowadays, I take the train to work. And I now try to have a children's book in
Japanese with me. (Hey, I like children's stories, okay? :-) I don't get much
reading done at one time. Just a few pages, of really really large characters
;-) But I feel that doing this on a more regular basis makes me more...
involved?.. than if I sat down for 2 hours a week and tried to swallow a whole
book.
If you want a computer analogy, it's like keeping my Japanese module in-cache
;-)
So that's what's keeping me motivated, currently.
--
[trim the no-bots from my address to reply to me by email!]
--------------------------------------------------
"initiating.. 'getting the hell out of here' maneouver" - Lennier, babylon5