O' names in Scotland
jkwill
Ireland- or not?
O is the same as Ogha Grandson and Mac is of course son.
Turns out Ogilvie is O' Gillebhuidhe (same name as Bowie), used with a Mac
in Modern Gaelic. It means Yellow lad's grandson
.
Agnew is another- O' gniomhaid- once again with a mac in modern usage. It
means gs of the acter or agent.
Dwelly's lists O' Kean which is O' Cain (name), more usually seen as
mackean, but still listed by Dwelly with the o
All of these are Scottish names.
I believe there are a couple of others, perhaps people can trace them for
me.
Modra Dubh
Conway Caine
--
Ni dheanfach an saol capall ras d'asal
jkwill wrote in message <6tgj88$81$1...@news3.cableinet.co.uk>...
Leona MacDonald
on it is Scottish. My name is MacDonald..typically scottish and I got told
a million times it's Irish. Mac is Irish for son of..that's it. So..take
it or leave it.
--
......
Leona~~jumping up and down with happy now that her Editor is back on-line.
jkwill wrote in message <6thoan$ckq$1...@news3.cableinet.co.uk>...
>MacAoidh is a Scottish name in the form MacKay, but in the form Magee it is
>an Irish name. My point was all of these are Scottish names rather than say
>Jones or Patel which are recent introductions.
>Modra Dubh wrote in message <6th2th$j...@bgtnsc02.worldnet.att.net>...
jkwill
Gregory
> As everybody knows O's are from Ireland and Macs are from both Scotland and
> Ireland- or not?
> O is the same as Ogha Grandson and Mac is of course son.
> Turns out Ogilvie is O' Gillebhuidhe (same name as Bowie), used with a Mac
> in Modern Gaelic. It means Yellow lad's grandson
> .
> Agnew is another- O' gniomhaid- once again with a mac in modern usage. It
> means gs of the acter or agent.
>
> Dwelly's lists O' Kean which is O' Cain (name), more usually seen as
> mackean, but still listed by Dwelly with the o
> All of these are Scottish names.
> I believe there are a couple of others, perhaps people can trace them for
> me.
Mac is not a sign of Scottish origin.
Greig
--
x
Craig Cockburn
<le...@solaseireann.com> writes
>You'd have a real tough time convincing the Irish that any name with a Mac
>on it is Scottish. My name is MacDonald..typically scottish and I got told
>a million times it's Irish. Mac is Irish for son of..that's it. So..take
>it or leave it.
>
--
Craig Cockburn ("coburn"), Port na Banrighinn, Alba. (Queensferry, Scotland)
http://www.scot.demon.co.uk/ mailto:cr...@scot.demon.co.uk
Sgri\obh thugam 'sa Gha\idhlig ma 'se do thoil e.
Chris Hedley
Craig Cockburn <cr...@scot.demon.co.uk> writes:
> Mac is Gaelic for son of and is used in both Scotland and Ireland
You mean like Muttley McLad's father was called "Lad"?
Chris.
Brian McGuiness
>
> Mac is Gaelic for son of and is used in both Scotland and Ireland
I always believed that Mac was Scottish and Mc Irish. You mean I've been
wrong all these years?
Who said 'as usual'?
--
Brian McGuiness
Quirky
Chris Hedley wrote in message <6tigcv$1f3$5...@teabag.demon.co.uk>...
>
>
Yep...he was a chip and gravy off the oul block.
Clement McGann
>In article <uk5+5AA8qL$1E...@scot.demon.co.uk>,
> Craig Cockburn <cr...@scot.demon.co.uk> writes:
>> Mac is Gaelic for son of and is used in both Scotland and Ireland
>You mean like Muttley McLad's father was called "Lad"?
and some O' names are actually saxon english
Robin Hood had a pal called Allan O'Dale
The O' means 'of' - Allan of the Dales
rather than the scots/irish "descendant".
And this is why O names are written as O'
which is incorrect, when the english found O
names they treated them as english O' names
jkwill
cmcgann ag connect buailte ie (Clement McGann) wrote in message
<35fd157f...@enews.newsguy.com>...
professions and the O' (of) names had a placename after them.
jkwill
Brian McGuiness wrote in message <35FD064E...@memex.com>...
>Craig Cockburn wrote:
>>
>> Mac is Gaelic for son of and is used in both Scotland and Ireland
>
>wrong all these years?
Mag, C/G/Qu and M'. Mc is more common in Ireland but is not unknown in
Scotland. I was always taught that Mc was Irish as you say but that isn't
completely true.
jkwill
Gregory wrote in message
<1dfbx2x.17z...@ppp47-149.dial.nildram.co.uk>...Not necessarily, but it can be. It does show that your family came from a
gaelic speaking area.
Muiris Mag Ualghairg
as I know, native to both Irish and Scottish Gaelic. As for Mag being a
mangled form of Mac introduced by the English, well tell that one to my
ancestors who have always being Mag (used in Irish for the northern parts of
Ireland before a vowel for Mac). As well as my own name there is Mag Uidhir,
the modern tendency is to introduce Mac in front of Vowels but maintain the
Mag pronounciation.
Leona MacDonald
>In article <355a6...@newsprime.tidalwave.net>, Leona MacDonald
><le...@solaseireann.com> writes
>>You'd have a real tough time convincing the Irish that any name with a Mac
>>on it is Scottish. My name is MacDonald..typically scottish and I got
told
>>a million times it's Irish. Mac is Irish for son of..that's it. So..take
>>it or leave it.
>>
>Craig Cockburn ("coburn"),
No kidding..*dripping with sarcasm*
Leona
mde...@my-dejanews.com
"jkwill" <jkw...@cableinet.co.uk> wrote:
> You're right but invariably the O' (ogha) names were people's names or
> professions and the O' (of) names had a placename after them.
And what of John O' Groat's? Granted it's a placename now, but depending on
who you believe the Dutch original got his name either because of the coin he
charged for passage on his ferry or because he bore the (quite common) name
de Groot (pronounced "growt", meaning "the big" in Dutch though, as Fr Des
has pointed out, in Dubbelinese "de ting dat's important for de economy").
--
Mark Devlin
mde...@knilniarb.com
www.brainlink.com/~mdevlin/index.html
My opinions, no one's else
-----== Posted via Deja News, The Leader in Internet Discussion ==-----
http://www.dejanews.com/rg_mkgrp.xp Create Your Own Free Member Forum
mde...@my-dejanews.com
cmcgann ag connect buailte ie (Clement McGann) wrote:
> And this is why O names are written as O'
> which is incorrect, when the english found O
> names they treated them as english O' names
Wasn't it a more a matter of treating the fada (alien to English typography)
as an apostrophe (much as the net convention is to render it as O/ if you
can't make an Ó)?
Ó Maolagáin
> Craig Cockburn <cr...@scot.demon.co.uk> writes:
> Mac is Gaelic for son of and is used in both Scotland and Ireland
"Mhic" is the Gaelic. "Ó" refers to grandson of. I was once told that the
"O" prefix was a British invention.
Leona MacDonald
IRISH LESSONS AT......
--
......
Leona~~jumping up and down with happy now that her Editor is back on-line.
Ó Maolagáin wrote in message <6tjtrc$ndd$1...@as4100c.javanet.com>...
Modra Dubh
-Conway
--
Ni dheanfach an saol capall ras d'asal
Muiris Mag Ualghairg wrote in message <35FD6355...@virgin.net>...
Craig Cockburn
<ex...@ime.net> writes
>
>> Craig Cockburn <cr...@scot.demon.co.uk> writes:
>> Mac is Gaelic for son of and is used in both Scotland and Ireland
>
>"Mhic" is the Gaelic.
Mhic is the genitive of Mac.
>"Ó" refers to grandson of.
and "Male descendent"
--
Leona MacDonald
correcting it..
anyhow..
Lets get really techie since everyone seems to want to up stage everyone
else. Gaelic is a group of languages...First off. So what is the "rule"
for one may not be the rule for another. Scottish is not quite Irish and
Irish is not quite Scottish. BUT..if you want to nit pick...I could quote
from one of my learning Irish books. However I'm not going to bore you all
you can look it up. Mac is Irish. I' m just not going to debate that it's
in every single Irish book on the planet. Mc is not in any Irish book.
The English however had this way of fucking up everyone's names. Which is
indeed true. For instance...Breen is actually a bastardization of O'Brien
...by the British. Lots of names happen to have been changed along the way.
So Mc or Mac..doesn't matter..or O' or O..or the lack of a prefix. Linder
is normally considered a Dutch name..but guess what...it's Irish too. It's
rather where the name originated from..not how it's spelled.
Now Ulster names are normally from Scotland. True enough..but do not tell
an Irish person with the name of MacNamara that he's Scottish he's going to
rip your head off for it.
Futher more..for instance..I have an Irish (so they say) ancestor who's name
was Knickerbocker. Well, that's a Dutch name. So we are puzzled ...but the
truth of the matter is..if you went into New York harbor with a name that
sounded Dutch..and the guy at the docks was Dutch descended..you bet you
that you got your name changed unless you knew how to spell it. there is an
Irish name ..forget how it's spelled right now..that sounds very much like
Knickerbocker..it starts with a C..and it's got a bh in it that sounds more
like a v..but to an untrained ear..it sounds like a B. So guess
what..spellings don't mean crap in any of this.
True story. We were looking for my husband's MacDonald family in Michigan.
Low and behold we found them..half the family was McDonald..and the other
half MacDonald. Why? Because when the family came over..the original
emigrant didn't know how to spell his name..so someone spelled it for him.
McDonald. Wrong answer..so the family changed it..but part of the family
couldn't see the reason..so they kept the Mc. If you are going to go on the
prefix of a name..you are doomed to fail. hell if you are going to go for
the apparent spelling at times you will fail. It's not foolproof.
Moran is pronounced Morrin..(am I right..cause I always get that wrong..but
in Ireland I have to spell the name because I don't pronounce it like they
do..we pronounce it More-ann) this point can cause mass confusion if you
only look for the spelling and not the phonetic spelling of a name. Hell
half the time phonetics don't work..as in the states..we just don't speak
Irish/English..and there is such a thing!
Okay I'm boring but it always chaps my hinney when someone thinks they know
the deal and they don't. Mac is Irish..it's Scottish..it's Manx..it's Irish
...do you get my drift? It just is..and there's no flippin pattern to a
particular country. When I tracked back the MacDonald's to
Scotland..Perth..guess what I found..a bivy of McDonalds and MacDonalds.
Some parents were Mac and some of their children were Mc..some of their
cousins were just plain Donald's.
Futher more..branches of families would change thier names..MacDonald
actually encompasses ten names I believe..some not even remotely resembling
MacDonald..I forget all the variations right now and I"m lazy to be arsed
with looking it up. It's the same with many families..a brother may have
moved to England and decided to change his name from an Irish sounding name
to a more English sounding name..they did that in the states too.
you'll find..Moran, Morrin, O'Morrin..etc etc.. there is no rule..
God bless the fucked up English that made it virtually impossible to track
families..AND I MIGHT ADD..that just because a family sailed from Scotland
or Liverpool..doesn't give them a nationality. People moved like mad back
in the pre-1900's in Ireland..they'd cross to Scotland and then move to the
states...doesn't mean they were Scottish.
Okay..done with the sermon.
Leona
--
......
Leona~~jumping up and down with happy now that her Editor is back on-line.
Modra Dubh wrote in message <6tk04e$7...@bgtnsc03.worldnet.att.net>...
Fiach MacHugh
Leona MacDonald wrote in message <355a6...@newsprime.tidalwave.net>...
Fiach MacHugh
Alan Smaill
> Mc was a manuscript shortening for Mac in order to save space and is, as far
> as I know, native to both Irish and Scottish Gaelic.
quite right.
>
--
Alan Smaill, email: A.Sm...@ed.ac.uk
Department of AI tel: 44-131-650-2710
Edinburgh University.
Alan Smaill
> In article <35fd157f...@enews.newsguy.com>,
> cmcgann ag connect buailte ie (Clement McGann) wrote:
>
> > And this is why O names are written as O'
> > which is incorrect, when the english found O
> > names they treated them as english O' names
>
> Wasn't it a more a matter of treating the fada (alien to English typography)
> as an apostrophe (much as the net convention is to render it as O/ if you
> can't make an Ó)?
Well, this would be interesting, if it were true.
It looks like an anachronistic imposition on your part on a bygone age --
isn't it a simple elision?
Gerard Cunningham
>Muiris Mag Ualghairg <muir...@virgin.net> writes:
>
>> Mc was a manuscript shortening for Mac in order to save space and is, as far
>> as I know, native to both Irish and Scottish Gaelic.
>
>quite right.
Sometimes it was shortened even more than that. The Glencolmcille
Rent rolls from last century show lots of M'Cunninghams.
--
Gerard Cunningham abardubh at wwa dot com
http://www.wwa.com/~abardubh/
"Let not the Old Glen be harmed,
The place of the slabs of heaven" ~Colmcille
Neil McEwan
On Mon, 14 Sep 1998 16:28:25 -0400, "Ó Maolagáin" <ex...@ime.net>
wrote:
>> Craig Cockburn <cr...@scot.demon.co.uk> writes:
>> Mac is Gaelic for son of and is used in both Scotland and Ireland
>
>"Mhic" is the Gaelic.
"Mhic" is the genitive case of "Mac" and means "of the son". "Mac"
is what's used in Gaelic surnames, e.g. "Niall MacEòghainn" to take a
random example.
Neil
--
mce...@supercity.ns.ca
mde...@my-dejanews.com
Alan Smaill <sma...@dai.ed.ac.uk> wrote:
> mde...@my-dejanews.com writes:
[...]
> > Wasn't it a more a matter of treating the fada (alien to English typography)
> > as an apostrophe (much as the net convention is to render it as O/ if you
> > can't make an Ó)?
>
> Well, this would be interesting, if it were true.
>
> It looks like an anachronistic imposition on your part on a bygone age --
> isn't it a simple elision?
How so? That might the case for the _English_ "O'" names, the "f" being
elided (or something; perhaps that's not the right technical term). But in
the Gaelic "Ó"/"O'" names, where's the elision? It's just a question of
which little diacritical squiggle gets stuck on the O.
McHamish
<jkw...@cableinet.co.uk> writes:
>>I always believed that Mac was Scottish and Mc Irish. You mean I've been
>>wrong all these years?
>They're both originally Mac, excpet that Anglophones mangled that into Mc,
>Mag, C/G/Qu and M'. Mc is more common in Ireland but is not unknown in
>Scotland. I was always taught that Mc was Irish as you say but that isn't
>completely true.
Mine is actually MacHamish, but I changed it to McHamish so I could sneak onto
this Irish ng unnoticed :-) MacHamish is usually anglicized to Jamieson,
Jamison, Jameson, etc. Mine is actually Jimeson. I don't know how that
happened, but my ancestors came from Scotland. I think a lot of people ended
up with different spellings of their surnames when they emigrated.
Maybe this has already been said. If so, I apologize for repeating it. The O
names in Irish were originally rended as *Ui*, as in the Ui Neill clan of
Ulster, meaning "of the Clan Neill. Or so I've read.
McHamish <or MacHamish, depending on whether I feel voluble or dour>
Iain Ogilvie
>As everybody knows O's are from Ireland and Macs are from both Scotland and
>Ireland- or not?
>O is the same as Ogha Grandson and Mac is of course son.
>Turns out Ogilvie is O' Gillebhuidhe (same name as Bowie)
Token 'O' here....... (Lots of Macs replying to this post, so I thought I'd
even things up a wee bit :o)
I do get fed up with most people (usually English) thinking I'm Irish (I
don't have any particular accent for them to go on).
Slainte!
Iain
jkwill
>> Mac is Gaelic for son of and is used in both Scotland and Ireland
>
>"O" prefix was a British invention.
Mhic is indeed used, but it is an inflected form of Mac
jkwill
mde...@my-dejanews.com wrote in message
<6tk08c$pno$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>...
>In article <6tjk8d$48k$1...@news3.cableinet.co.uk>,
> "jkwill" <jkw...@cableinet.co.uk> wrote:
>
>> You're right but invariably the O' (ogha) names were people's names or
>> professions and the O' (of) names had a placename after them.
>
>And what of John O' Groat's? Granted it's a placename now, but depending
on
>who you believe the Dutch original got his name either because of the coin
he
>charged for passage on his ferry or because he bore the (quite common) name
>de Groot (pronounced "growt", meaning "the big" in Dutch though, as Fr Des
>has pointed out, in Dubbelinese "de ting dat's important for de economy").
>
jkwill
Modra Dubh wrote in message <6tk04e$7...@bgtnsc03.worldnet.att.net>...
>And in "P" Celtic it's "Map", shortened to "Ap"
>-Conway
ap John- Upjohn
ap Huw- Pugh
ap Richard Pritchard
ap Harry- Parry/Barry
jkwill
Fiach MacHugh wrote in message ...
>I thought Mac is Scottish and Mc is Irish (or Anglicised irish)
either side of the North Channel
James C. Woodard
Clement McGann
>Mc was a manuscript shortening for Mac in order to save space and is, as far
>as I know, native to both Irish and Scottish Gaelic. As for Mag being a
>mangled form of Mac introduced by the English, well tell that one to my
>ancestors who have always being Mag (used in Irish for the northern parts of
>Ireland before a vowel for Mac). As well as my own name there is Mag Uidhir,
>the modern tendency is to introduce Mac in front of Vowels but maintain the
>Mag pronounciation.
>
I thought that Mac became Mag to make it easier to pronounce,
As, in english 'a' becomes 'an' before a vowel.
So, Mac before a vowel or a 'c' (can't have two adjacent c's) becomes
Mag
Leona MacDonald
jkwill wrote in message <6tjkdv$4d0$1...@news3.cableinet.co.uk>...
Celtic country..that's all. Lots of people in Gaelic speaking areas don't
have either a Mac Or and O hooked on their names.
Leona
Leona MacDonald
Like Griffen, Breen, Carey, Roche..(Roche oh my god...they are French..kick
their asses out...!)
L.
Leona MacDonald
>>> Mac is Gaelic for son of and is used in both Scotland and Ireland
>>
>>"Mhic" is the Gaelic.
>
>
>is what's used in Gaelic surnames, e.g. "Niall MacEòghainn" to take a
>random example.
>
>
>Neil
Or as in my maiden name Mac Sabhaisigh (there's a fada over that first A)
Watch out Neil soon they'll be saying you are Scottish if there's a fada in
your name.
Damn you should be in my kill file too...damn Microsoft and it's stupid
kernel leak. Maybe it's not the kernel leak at all..it might be some Scot
bug trying to take over my heritage and identity. *getting all ruffled and
in a snit*
Leona
Leona
EAFA
> Not necessarily, but it can be. It does show that your family came from a
> gaelic speaking area.
Interesting, then (and rather ironic) that so many Northern Irish
protestants are Mcs and Macs.
Patrick
Gerard Cunningham
They do speak Gaelic in Scotland, you know.
wayne mccollum
>
> Alan Smaill wrote:
>
> >Muiris Mag Ualghairg <muir...@virgin.net> writes:
> >
> >> as I know, native to both Irish and Scottish Gaelic.
> >
>
> Sometimes it was shortened even more than that. The Glencolmcille
> Rent rolls from last century show lots of M'Cunninghams.
>
> Gerard Cunningham abardubh at wwa dot com
> http://www.wwa.com/~abardubh/
> "Let not the Old Glen be harmed,
> The place of the slabs of heaven" ~Colmcille
MacCallum, MAcCollum, M'Callum Etc, Etc
Modra Dubh
-Conway
--
Ni dheanfach an saol capall ras d'asal
Neil McEwan wrote in message <35fe26b4...@news.supercity.ns.ca>...
> "Mhic" is the genitive case of "Mac" and means "of the son". "Mac"
sean0...@my-dejanews.com
"jkwill" <jkw...@cableinet.co.uk> wrote:
> As everybody knows O's are from Ireland and Macs are from both Scotland and
> Ireland- or not?
> O is the same as Ogha Grandson and Mac is of course son.
> in Modern Gaelic. It means Yellow lad's grandson
> .
Which reminds me of that other famous name - O' Order. I'm told it means
orange pogromist bastards.
> Agnew is another- O' gniomhaid- once again with a mac in modern usage. It
> means gs of the acter or agent.
>
> Dwelly's lists O' Kean which is O' Cain (name), more usually seen as
> mackean, but still listed by Dwelly with the o
> All of these are Scottish names.
> I believe there are a couple of others, perhaps people can trace them for
> me.
>
Sean
Modra Dubh
"McCathan".
-Conway
--
Ni dheanfach an saol capall ras d'asal
L.S.A. Thomas
>
> It is only Ap only before consonants in names otherwise it is always Mab.
No, see further the ab Edmwnds, the ab Owens (whence "Bowen"). You'll
find Ap, Ab, Mab, and Map in various places.
- Ll. apWilliam!
Muiris Mag Ualghairg
Modra Dubh wrote:
> And in "P" Celtic it's "Map", shortened to "Ap"
> -Conway
> --
> Ni dheanfach an saol capall ras d'asal
>
> Muiris Mag Ualghairg wrote in message <35FD6355...@virgin.net>...
> >Mc was a manuscript shortening for Mac in order to save space and is, as
> far
Muiris Mag Ualghairg
refering to was the scribal convention of using Mc as an Irish language
abreviation. In Ulster Irish Mac in surnames often becomes C as it does in Manx as
well.
Gerard Cunningham wrote:
> Alan Smaill wrote:
>
> >Muiris Mag Ualghairg <muir...@virgin.net> writes:
> >
> >> Mc was a manuscript shortening for Mac in order to save space and is, as far
> >> as I know, native to both Irish and Scottish Gaelic.
> >
> >quite right.
>
> Sometimes it was shortened even more than that. The Glencolmcille
> Rent rolls from last century show lots of M'Cunninghams.
>
Neil McEwan
>Or as in my maiden name Mac Sabhaisigh (there's a fada over that first A)
What's the anglicized version of that?
Neil
--
mce...@supercity.ns.ca
Gregory
> > >Mac is not a sign of Scottish origin.
> > Not necessarily, but it can be. It does show that your family came from a
> > gaelic speaking area.
>
> Interesting, then (and rather ironic) that so many Northern Irish
> protestants are Mcs and Macs.
>
> Patrick
The speak a Q-Celtic dialect there.
Greig
--
x
Chris Hedley
nei...@supercity.ns.ca (Neil McEwan) writes:
>>Or as in my maiden name Mac Sabhaisigh (there's a fada over that first A)
>
> What's the anglicized version of that?
My first thoughts were "Black Sabbath." :)
Chris.
jkwill
Muiris Mag Ualghairg wrote in message <35FEF474...@virgin.net>...
>Perhaps so but I would surmise that they were written in English.What I was
>refering to was the scribal convention of using Mc as an Irish language
>abreviation. In Ulster Irish Mac in surnames often becomes C as it does in
Manx as
>well.
that have lost the Mac are, kendrick, Kellar, Guiness (Angusson), Cloud,
Coulthard, Corbett (MacRobert), Kay (although this name has another origin
as well), Cleish, all those Gil- names such as Gilmour, Gilchrist, Quinn
(MacCunn), Quiller (MacKellar) etc
jkwill
>
>jkwill wrote in message <6tjkdv$4d0$1...@news3.cableinet.co.uk>...
>>
>>Gregory wrote in message
>><1dfbx2x.17z...@ppp47-149.dial.nildram.co.uk>...
>>>Mac is not a sign of Scottish origin.
>>Not necessarily, but it can be. It does show that your family came from a
>>gaelic speaking area.
>have either a Mac Or and O hooked on their names.
jkwill
RUC an Irish one. Both Ian Paisleys names are Gaelic.
EAFA wrote in message <35FE8E...@uea.ac.uk>...
>> >Mac is not a sign of Scottish origin.
>> Not necessarily, but it can be. It does show that your family came from a
>> gaelic speaking area.
>
Leona MacDonald
jkwill wrote in message <6toh20$foi$1...@news3.cableinet.co.uk>...
>Even stranger that Gerry Adams has an English surname and the head of the
>RUC an Irish one. Both Ian Paisleys names are Gaelic.
NEVER..ever..ever..take a name by how it looks..*talking to myself again I
see*...Adams is an Irish name...
MacAdam.."This name has several origins in Ireland. In Co. Cork it was an
Irish patronymic, Mac Adaim, assumed by a branch of the Norman Barrys; in
Co. Armagh it is a synonym of MacCadden; In co. Cavan it can be for MacCarw:
Ballymacadam in Clanmorris barony, Co Mayo, locates a family there. This
place-name occurs also in Kerry and south Tiperary. In Dublin and Belfast
MacAdam is often Scottish."
Adams.."this well known English name has been used synonymously with Aidy
and Eadie in Co. Down."
AND again I state never take a name by how it looks now days. Paisley isn't
an Irish name at all...
Paisley.." A Scottish toponymic (Renfrewshire). It is fairly numerous in
Ulster since the first half of the seventeenth century. Some families of
the name were Quakers."
Leona MacDonald
>
>
> What's the anglicized version of that?
>
>
>--
>mce...@supercity.ns.ca
Savage (The Savages of the Ards Mac an t-Sabhaisigh is the Irish form used
by the four masters, The great family of Savage of the Ards was planted in
1177....came from points unknown..They became hibernicized and from the
fifteenth century onward were prominent on the Irish side of the wars
against England. A branch is in Co. Kilkenny...other forms of the name in
Ireland are Savin, O'Savhain, O'Savin and Sage)...
I have this book here that has all the Irish Spellings of Irish names and
another with histories. It's really amazing. I saw a book that I'm picking
up next time I'm in Dublin..it's called Ulster families. It is so detailed
that I couldn't believe it. Not only does it give the Irish spellings it
goes into great detail into first occurrences of names and dates..famous
family members. Where detailed archives can be found and if they can be
found. All sorts of stuff.
Leona
Neil McEwan
>Neil McEwan wrote in message <35ff3724...@news.supercity.ns.ca>...
>> What's the anglicized version of that?
>Savage
Oh, I didn't even know "Savage" was Irish. Interestingly Nova
Scotia's last premier was a Welshman named John Savage.
>[...]
>I have this book here that has all the Irish Spellings of Irish names and
>another with histories. It's really amazing. I saw a book that I'm picking
>up next time I'm in Dublin..it's called Ulster families. It is so detailed
>that I couldn't believe it. Not only does it give the Irish spellings it
>goes into great detail into first occurrences of names and dates..famous
>family members. Where detailed archives can be found and if they can be
>found. All sorts of stuff.
I compiled a big list of Irish names, their meanings and their
anglicized equivalents a while back and posted it to Celtic-L. I have
it on disk sitting around somewhere so when I find it I'll put it up
at my website and post the URL here.
Neil
--
mce...@supercity.ns.ca
Alan D Red
>jkwill wrote in message <6toh20$foi$1...@news3.cableinet.co.uk>...
>>Even stranger that Gerry Adams has an English surname and the head of the
>>RUC an Irish one. Both Ian Paisleys names are Gaelic.
>NEVER..ever..ever..take a name by how it looks..*talking to myself again I
>see*...Adams is an Irish name...
And whats EVE?
~~~~~~~~~~~
Goldenhole
#############
Gregory
A three lettered word beginning with E and ending in E and with V in the
middle. V is for vagina I think. It is freudian maybe.
Greig
Chris Hedley
fla...@dnet.co.uk (Alan D Red) writes:
> And whats EVE?
It's a text editor for VMS. I prefer using EDT, personally.
Chris.
jkwill
Leona MacDonald wrote in message <355dc...@newsprime.tidalwave.net>...
>AND again I state never take a name by how it looks now days. Paisley
isn't
>an Irish name at all...
It's not Irish, but it comes from the other Gaelic according to some people
Alan Smaill
> > > Wasn't it a more a matter of treating the fada (alien to English
> > > typography)
> > > as an apostrophe (much as the net convention is to render it as O/ if you
> > > can't make an Ó)?
> >
> > Well, this would be interesting, if it were true.
> >
> > It looks like an anachronistic imposition on your part on a bygone age --
> > isn't it a simple elision?
>
> How so? That might the case for the _English_ "O'" names, the "f" being
> elided (or something; perhaps that's not the right technical term). But in
> the Gaelic "Ó"/"O'" names, where's the elision? It's just a question of
> which little diacritical squiggle gets stuck on the O.
Well, of course I don't know how it came about (or if elision is the
right term).
I have noticed in Scottish etymologies given for some "O'" names, the
corresponding Irish root is given with "Ua", when there would
presumably be something to elide; sometimes the Irish root is given
with "O'", and with Irish spelling for the rest of the name, rather
than the anglicised version. (This in Black's book, which is fairly
old.)
Anyone know how the Irish "O'" form developed?
I see an Elizabethan reference to "Oneale", for example.
> --
> Mark Devlin
--
Alan Smaill, email: A.Sm...@ed.ac.uk
Department of AI tel: 44-131-650-2710
Edinburgh University.
Gerard Cunningham
>Anyone know how the Irish "O'" form developed?
>I see an Elizabethan reference to "Oneale", for example.
Speeling wasn't as rigid then as now. I know of about ten different
spellings of my home town, for instance.
Another variation: Eoghan Ruadh Ó Néill once wrote "Draft of the
propositions of General Owen O'Neile, the Lords, Gentry, and Commons
of the Confederate Catholics of Ulster, to the most potent Parliament
of Ulster." There are probably excamples of several other spellings
from him throughout his career too.
Gerard Cunningham
>Another variation: Eoghan Ruadh Ó Néill once wrote "Draft of the
>propositions of General Owen O'Neile, the Lords, Gentry, and Commons
>of the Confederate Catholics of Ulster, to the most potent Parliament
>of Ulster."
Sorry. Parliament of England..
mde...@my-dejanews.com
Alan Smaill <sma...@dai.ed.ac.uk> wrote:
> I have noticed in Scottish etymologies given for some "O'" names, the
> corresponding Irish root is given with "Ua", when there would
> presumably be something to elide; sometimes the Irish root is given
> with "O'", and with Irish spelling for the rest of the name, rather
> than the anglicised version. (This in Black's book, which is fairly
> old.)
>
> Anyone know how the Irish "O'" form developed?
> I see an Elizabethan reference to "Oneale", for example.
The "Ua" form, so far as I know, is simply an older form that gradually
evolved into the "O/" of modern Irish. Pronunciation and orthography change
over time in every language, though spelling usually takes some time to catch
up and usually retains some archaicisms (more in some langauges than others).
By suggesting that the long accent indicates elision (or whatever the proper
term is, I don't know it either), then, I assume you mean it serves a role
analogous to that of the circumflex acent in French, which usually means
"there used to be an "s" just to the right". IOW, "Ua" became (in
pronunciation) *[U'], the "U" with time becoming an "O", and the fada used to
show that there was once a bit more there.
This is close to the function of the apostrophe in the English "O'" names: it
shows that there was once something following that we are now going to skip
over and go directly to the next bit. The fada, though, is just an indicator
of the length of the vowel. It might be fair to say the vowel is long
because a long vowel was the result of the truncation of the diphthong, so
there may well be a relation between the fact of the change in pronunciation
and the presence of a diacritical mark, but in this case the diacritical in
question does not, like the apostrophe, directly denote the truncation.
--
Mark Devlin
mde...@knilniarb.com
www.brainlink.com/~mdevlin/index.html
My opinions, no one's else
Alan Smaill
> In article <fweaf3y...@oich.dai.ed.ac.uk>,
> Alan Smaill <sma...@dai.ed.ac.uk> wrote:
>
> > I have noticed in Scottish etymologies given for some "O'" names, the
> > corresponding Irish root is given with "Ua", when there would
> > presumably be something to elide; sometimes the Irish root is given
> > with "O'", and with Irish spelling for the rest of the name, rather
> > than the anglicised version. (This in Black's book, which is fairly
> > old.)
> >
> > Anyone know how the Irish "O'" form developed?
> > I see an Elizabethan reference to "Oneale", for example.
>
> The "Ua" form, so far as I know, is simply an older form that gradually
> evolved into the "O/" of modern Irish.
> Pronunciation and orthography change
> over time in every language, though spelling usually takes some time to catch
> up and usually retains some archaicisms (more in some langauges than others).
>
> By suggesting that the long accent indicates elision (or whatever the proper
> term is, I don't know it either), then, I assume you mean it serves a role
> analogous to that of the circumflex acent in French, which usually means
> "there used to be an "s" just to the right". IOW, "Ua" became (in
> pronunciation) *[U'], the "U" with time becoming an "O", and the fada used to
> show that there was once a bit more there.
In French, elision is used for forms like "j'accuse", rather than
"je accuse", which was more what I had in mind. Your suggestion sounds
plausible for the introduction of the diacritical.
Malcolm Ogilvie
<ia...@nildram.net> writes
>jkwill wrote in message <6tgj88$81$1...@news3.cableinet.co.uk>...
>>As everybody knows O's are from Ireland and Macs are from both
Scotland and
>>Ireland- or not?
>>O is the same as Ogha Grandson and Mac is of course son.
>>Turns out Ogilvie is O' Gillebhuidhe (same name as Bowie)
>>, used with a Mac in Modern Gaelic. It means Yellow lad's grandson
>
Does it? Or "From the glen of the yellow wood"?
>
>Token 'O' here....... (Lots of Macs replying to this post, so I thought I'd
>even things up a wee bit :o)
>
Definitely not a token - there's me, too!
>I do get fed up with most people (usually English) thinking I'm Irish (I
>don't have any particular accent for them to go on).
>
Another "Me, too"! And I have received letters addressed to O'Gilvie,
which as far as I am aware, doesn't exist even in Ireland - anyone know
differently?
--
Malcolm
Isle of Islay
Leona MacDonald
anything but a variance. Could we have another senseless lecture now?
--
......
Leona~~jumping up and down with happy now that her Editor is back on-line.
mde...@my-dejanews.com wrote in message
<6tt9bp$8rv$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>...
>In article <fweaf3y...@oich.dai.ed.ac.uk>,
> Alan Smaill <sma...@dai.ed.ac.uk> wrote:
>
>> I have noticed in Scottish etymologies given for some "O'" names, the
>> corresponding Irish root is given with "Ua", when there would
>> presumably be something to elide; sometimes the Irish root is given
>> with "O'", and with Irish spelling for the rest of the name, rather
>> than the anglicised version. (This in Black's book, which is fairly
>> old.)
>>
>> Anyone know how the Irish "O'" form developed?
>> I see an Elizabethan reference to "Oneale", for example.
>
>The "Ua" form, so far as I know, is simply an older form that gradually
>evolved into the "O/" of modern Irish. Pronunciation and orthography change
>over time in every language, though spelling usually takes some time to
catch
>up and usually retains some archaicisms (more in some langauges than
others).
>
>By suggesting that the long accent indicates elision (or whatever the
proper
>term is, I don't know it either), then, I assume you mean it serves a role
>analogous to that of the circumflex acent in French, which usually means
>"there used to be an "s" just to the right". IOW, "Ua" became (in
>pronunciation) *[U'], the "U" with time becoming an "O", and the fada used
to
>show that there was once a bit more there.
>
Leona MacDonald
<35FE9B...@sw.boeing.com>...
>Gerard Cunningham wrote:
>>
>> Alan Smaill wrote:
>>
>> >Muiris Mag Ualghairg <muir...@virgin.net> writes:
>> >
>> >> Mc was a manuscript shortening for Mac in order to save space and is,
as far
>> >> as I know, native to both Irish and Scottish Gaelic.
>> >
>> >quite right.
>>
>> Sometimes it was shortened even more than that. The Glencolmcille
>> Rent rolls from last century show lots of M'Cunninghams.
>>
>> Gerard Cunningham abardubh at wwa dot com
>> http://www.wwa.com/~abardubh/
>> "Let not the Old Glen be harmed,
>> The place of the slabs of heaven" ~Colmcille
>MacCallum, MAcCollum, M'Callum Etc, Etc
*giggles*...fun stuff eh?/
Leona
Leona MacDonald
Ogilvie...see under Gilbey
Gilbey...(O Gilboy) Of dual origin; an English toponymic, or an anglicizied
form of " Gilloa Bhuidhe (buidhe, yellow) which is usually anglicizied
Gilboy, but sometimes Ogilvy,. The name of the Scottish clan Ogilvie is
actually taken from a place called so.
*takes a bown and comments if there's a Mac it sure was turned around into
an O at some point*
And in another book of Gaeilge spellings of Irish names...
Mac Gilvie (Gilwee) = Mac Giolla Bhui
O'Gilvie = O Giolla Bhui.
*takes another bow*...
Leona
--
......
Leona~~jumping up and down with happy now that her Editor is back on-line.
Malcolm Ogilvie wrote in message ...
Leona MacDonald
>"Leona MacDonald" <le...@solaseireann.com> writes:
>
>> Funny my Irish Dictionary said Ua=O with a fada over it. Doesn't look to
be
>> anything but a variance.
>
>
>Is this a variance in time or space?
>Which came first, and where did the present convention come from?
>
>We were asking questions, not giving lectures.
>
>
>--
>Alan Smaill
Tough crowd..you can't even joke with them. Must be the Scottish thing.
Leona
Leona MacDonald
>it's the way you tell them.
>
>
>--
>Alan Smaill
Oh dear another critic..!
Alan Smaill
> Funny my Irish Dictionary said Ua=O with a fada over it. Doesn't look to be
> anything but a variance.
Yes, we were talking variances.
Is this a variance in time or space?
Which came first, and where did the present convention come from?
We were asking questions, not giving lectures.
--
Alan Smaill
> Alan Smaill wrote in message ...
> >"Leona MacDonald" <le...@solaseireann.com> writes:
> >
> >> Funny my Irish Dictionary said Ua=O with a fada over it. Doesn't look to
> be
> >> anything but a variance.
> >
> >Yes, we were talking variances.
> >
> >Is this a variance in time or space?
> >Which came first, and where did the present convention come from?
> >
> >We were asking questions, not giving lectures.
> Tough crowd..you can't even joke with them. Must be the Scottish thing.
>
> Leona
it's the way you tell them.
Gerard Cunningham
>Another "Me, too"! And I have received letters addressed to O'Gilvie,
>which as far as I am aware, doesn't exist even in Ireland - anyone know
>differently?
There is the surname Galway, it may have had a Ó in times past.
Alynn
You left out McLaughlin,MacLochlan and plain old Lochlan, but then there
are 350 ways to spell the name.
Is your web site up yet?
Micheil Rob Mac Phàdruig
>Another "Me, too"! And I have received letters addressed to O'Gilvie,
>which as far as I am aware, doesn't exist even in Ireland - anyone know
>differently?
No - but I did talk to a Canadian on the phone called Ohara (a common
Japanese name) and I couldn't resist asking if he was an Irish or a
Japanese O'Hara/Ohara. He was quite amused; he said he was from the
Japanese branch of the clan in (he spelled it out) O'Saka!
I do enjoy Asian humour. I was once teasing a Chinese man that his
name (Wong Jin) could be translated as Goldman and that his ancestors
probably came from Warsaw. He considered this for a while, then asked
if Scottish names had meanings. I said, yes, and translated Campbell
as an example: "Twisted Mouth". He looked at me innocently and said,
"Oh, I always thought Campbell meant Soup..."
Ever notice how people from Galway always reply to a question with a
question? As in:
Me: Why do people from Galway always reply to a question with a
question?
Galwegian: What man told ye that?
And where else but in Galway could I be stopped by a Garda (policeman)
asking for my driving licence, and when I reached for it, be told,
"That's all right; don't bother. Mind ye, if ye didn't have one, I'd
be wanting to see it!"
In Galway you're never sure when you're being codded, as they say.
Měcheil Rob Mac Phŕdruig
"Faire faire dhuin' ňig
cia do bharantas mór?
'N i do bharail bhith
beň 's nach eug thu?"
Leona MacDonald
Chris Hedley wrote in message <6tnncn$1v6$1...@teabag.demon.co.uk>...
>In article <35ff3724...@news.supercity.ns.ca>,
> nei...@supercity.ns.ca (Neil McEwan) writes:
>>>Or as in my maiden name Mac Sabhaisigh (there's a fada over that first A)
>>
>> What's the anglicized version of that?
>
>My first thoughts were "Black Sabbath." :)
>
>Chris.
HA!! Yea probably. *sulk*
Leona
seamus....@nowhere.com
Phŕdruig) wrote:
>Malcolm Ogilvie wrote:
>
>>Another "Me, too"! And I have received letters addressed to O'Gilvie,
>>which as far as I am aware, doesn't exist even in Ireland - anyone know
>>differently?
>
>No - but I did talk to a Canadian on the phone called Ohara (a common
>Japanese name) and I couldn't resist asking if he was an Irish or a
>Japanese O'Hara/Ohara.
In the Australian Parliament we have/had (an election on at the
moment) a Senator Bill O'Chee. Of Irish-Japanes descent.
Jim
jkw...@cableinet.co.uk
Micheil Rob Mac Phŕdruig wrote in message
<3604325d...@news.whidbey.com>...
>Malcolm Ogilvie wrote:
>
>>Another "Me, too"! And I have received letters addressed to O'Gilvie,
>>which as far as I am aware, doesn't exist even in Ireland - anyone know
>>differently?
>
>No - but I did talk to a Canadian on the phone called Ohara (a common
>Japanese name) and I couldn't resist asking if he was an Irish or a
>Japanese branch of the clan in (he spelled it out) O'Saka!
>Ever notice how people from Galway always reply to a question with a
>question? As in:
>
>Me: Why do people from Galway always reply to a question with a
>question?
>Galwegian: What man told ye that?
Scotch fashion"? (Why have you?)
bluebottle
seamus....@nowhere.com wrote in message
<3604f5b5...@news.cowan.edu.au>...
>>
>>>Another "Me, too"! And I have received letters addressed to O'Gilvie,
>>>which as far as I am aware, doesn't exist even in Ireland - anyone
know
>>>differently?
>>
>>No - but I did talk to a Canadian on the phone called Ohara (a common
>>Japanese name) and I couldn't resist asking if he was an Irish or a
>>Japanese O'Hara/Ohara.
>moment) a Senator Bill O'Chee. Of Irish-Japanes descent.
>Jim
Someone called Tim O'Shenko wrote a letter to the Irish News in Belfast
last week.
bluebottle
Big Mac
wrote:
>As everybody knows O's are from Ireland and Macs are from both Scotland and
>Ireland- or not?
You forgot the Mabs, from Wales.
Leona
jkwill wrote in message <6togvk$fm3$1...@news3.cableinet.co.uk>...
>Leona MacDonald wrote in message <355c3...@newsprime.tidalwave.net>...
>>
>>jkwill wrote in message <6tjkdv$4d0$1...@news3.cableinet.co.uk>...
>>>
>>>Gregory wrote in message
>>><1dfbx2x.17z...@ppp47-149.dial.nildram.co.uk>...
>>>>jkwill <jkw...@cableinet.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>Mac is not a sign of Scottish origin.
>>>Not necessarily, but it can be. It does show that your family came from a
>>>gaelic speaking area.
>>Celtic country..that's all. Lots of people in Gaelic speaking areas don't
>>have either a Mac Or and O hooked on their names.
>True, but if it you have a Mac it says there was Gaelic in there once.
>
>
"in there" ?? *chuckle*
Leona
Modra Dubh
-Conway
--
Ni dheanfach an saol capall ras d'asal
Big Mac wrote in message <36067b93...@news.xara.com>...
Muiris Mag Ualghairg
of mab when I should have typed Ab. I am well aware of the use of Ap/Ab, being
a Welsh teacher! The original poster said that the form 'map' existed. It did
in middle Welsh but not since. As I have said it was the quality of the final
consonant which I was addressing not the M at the beginning. By the way you
state that 'Map' can be seen in various places, this is not a possible form in
modern Welsh and I would be most interested to see an example from this
century.
Yr eiddoch yn gywir ac ati ac ati (wedi diflasu ar y drafodaeth hon)
Muiris Mag Ualghairg
L.S.A. Thomas wrote:
> Muiris Mag Ualghairg wrote:
> >
> > It is only Ap only before consonants in names otherwise it is always Mab.
>
> No, see further the ab Edmwnds, the ab Owens (whence "Bowen"). You'll
> find Ap, Ab, Mab, and Map in various places.
>
> - Ll. apWilliam!
Randy Kehrt
OGHA GHILLE BHUIDHE
Grandson of the yellow(-haired) Servant
It seems that the root of OGHA is O\G.
Yes, like BOWIE (BUIDHE)
And "BOUEY", the guy on Canadian money.
Liam Mac an Chnuic
Malcolm Ogilvie wrote in message ...
>In article <35fe6...@scooby.nildram.co.uk>, Iain Ogilvie
><ia...@nildram.net> writes
>>jkwill wrote in message <6tgj88$81$1...@news3.cableinet.co.uk>...
>>>As everybody knows O's are from Ireland and Macs are from both
>Scotland and
>>>Ireland- or not?
>>>O is the same as Ogha Grandson and Mac is of course son.
>>>Turns out Ogilvie is O' Gillebhuidhe (same name as Bowie)
>>>, used with a Mac in Modern Gaelic. It means Yellow lad's grandson
>>
>
>Does it? Or "From the glen of the yellow wood"?
>>
>>Token 'O' here....... (Lots of Macs replying to this post, so I thought
I'd
>>even things up a wee bit :o)
>>
>Definitely not a token - there's me, too!
>
>>I do get fed up with most people (usually English) thinking I'm Irish (I
>>don't have any particular accent for them to go on).
>>
>Another "Me, too"! And I have received letters addressed to O'Gilvie,
>which as far as I am aware, doesn't exist even in Ireland - anyone know
>differently?
>
Randy Kehrt
Muiris Mag Ualghairg wrote in message <35FEF474...@virgin.net>...
>Perhaps so but I would surmise that they were written in English.What I was
>refering to was the scribal convention of using Mc as an Irish language
>abreviation. In Ulster Irish Mac in surnames often becomes C as it does in
Manx as
>well.
>
>Gerard Cunningham wrote:
>
>> Alan Smaill wrote:
>>
>> >Muiris Mag Ualghairg <muir...@virgin.net> writes:
>> >
>> >> Mc was a manuscript shortening for Mac in order to save space and is,
as far
>> >> as I know, native to both Irish and Scottish Gaelic.
>> >
>> >quite right.
>>
>> Sometimes it was shortened even more than that. The Glencolmcille
>> Rent rolls from last century show lots of M'Cunninghams.
>>
>> Gerard Cunningham abardubh at wwa dot com
>> http://www.wwa.com/~abardubh/
>> "Let not the Old Glen be harmed,
>> The place of the slabs of heaven" ~Colmcille
>
Fair enough Muiris (shw mae, Muiris - Liam sy 'ma)
Mac becomes C sometimes because the genetive MHIC is shortened to 'IC much
like AB/AP in Welsh.
sla/n,
Mrs. Doyle
> >You forgot the Mabs, from Wales.
Really? I thought they were just called Cunts.
--
Shero. (Son of Unki)
Leona
Gregory wrote in message
<1dfi57k.149...@ppp47-47.dial.nildram.co.uk>...
>Alan D Red <fla...@dnet.co.uk> wrote:
>
>> "Leona MacDonald" <le...@solaseireann.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> >jkwill wrote in message <6toh20$foi$1...@news3.cableinet.co.uk>...
>> >>Even stranger that Gerry Adams has an English surname and the head of
the
>> >>RUC an Irish one. Both Ian Paisleys names are Gaelic.
>>
>>
>> >NEVER..ever..ever..take a name by how it looks..*talking to myself again
I
>> >see*...Adams is an Irish name...
>>
>>
>> And whats EVE?
>
>
>
>
>A three lettered word beginning with E and ending in E and with V in the
>middle. V is for vagina I think. It is freudian maybe.
>
>Greig
I was going to say dangerous!!!
Leona
Da Quirksta
Leona wrote in message <35657...@newsprime.tidalwave.net>...
>
>I was going to say dangerous!!!
>
...but your husband finally managed to gag you?
Leona
Da Quirksta wrote in message <6u8vcg$qen$1...@news.indigo.ie>...
>
>Leona wrote in message <35657...@newsprime.tidalwave.net>...
>
>>
>>I was going to say dangerous!!!
>>
>
>
>...but your husband finally managed to gag you?
>
>
mmfmflluffhsslmeioijfando
Leona
Gregory
>
> >A three lettered word beginning with E and ending in E and with V in the
> >middle. V is for vagina I think. It is freudian maybe.
> >
> >Greig
>
> I was going to say dangerous!!!
>
> Leona
I knew a girl from Subic who had a snake but she was called Imaculata I
think. I dread to think what she'd do with the apple.
Greig
Fiach MacHugh
bluebottle wrote in message <6u3q2o$d0...@kirk.tinet.ie>...
|
|seamus....@nowhere.com wrote in message
|<3604f5b5...@news.cowan.edu.au>...
|>On Sat, 19 Sep 1998 22:58:58 GMT, mik...@whidbey.com (Micheil Rob Mac
|>Phŕdruig) wrote:
|>
|>>Malcolm Ogilvie wrote:
|>>
|>>>which as far as I am aware, doesn't exist even in Ireland - anyone
|know
|>>>differently?
|>>
|>>Japanese name) and I couldn't resist asking if he was an Irish or a
|>>Japanese O'Hara/Ohara.
|>In the Australian Parliament we have/had (an election on at the
|>moment) a Senator Bill O'Chee. Of Irish-Japanes descent.
|>Jim
|
|Someone called Tim O'Shenko wrote a letter to the Irish News in Belfast
|last week.
|
WJP White
he's of Iroquois descent.
If so, watch out , we recently had some tricky problems with Mohawks ( an
Iroquois nation ) up here. ;-)
--
Cairdiúl, Slán Go Foi !
William Jean-Pierre White, ( de Faoite )
Trois-Rivières, Québec,
CANADA
Murar féidir leat iad a chloí, bí leo, agus bris a ndroim le déirc !
Alan D Red
>Leona wrote in message <35657...@newsprime.tidalwave.net>...
>>
>>I was going to say dangerous!!!
>>
>...but your husband finally managed to gag you?
I wonder what with?
wayne mccollum
>
> wayne mccollum <" virgil.mccollum"@sw.boeing.com> > wrote in message
> <35FE9B...@sw.boeing.com>...
> >Gerard Cunningham wrote:
> >>
> >> Alan Smaill wrote:
> >>
> >> >Muiris Mag Ualghairg <muir...@virgin.net> writes:
> >> >
> >> >> Mc was a manuscript shortening for Mac in order to save space and is,
> as far
> >> >> as I know, native to both Irish and Scottish Gaelic.
> >> >
> >> >quite right.
> >>
> >> Sometimes it was shortened even more than that. The Glencolmcille
> >> Rent rolls from last century show lots of M'Cunninghams.
> >>
> >> --
> >> Gerard Cunningham abardubh at wwa dot com
> >> http://www.wwa.com/~abardubh/
> >> "Let not the Old Glen be harmed,
> >> The place of the slabs of heaven" ~Colmcille
> >MacCallum, MAcCollum, M'Callum Etc, Etc
>
> *giggles*...fun stuff eh?/
>
> Leona
Yeah!! We is jest a blast here!
Me/WMC
Leona
wayne mccollum <" virgil.mccollum"@sw.boeing.com>
>>
>> *giggles*...fun stuff eh?/
>>
>> Leona
>Yeah!! We is jest a blast here!
>Me/WMC
Well, much more fun than some threads and newsgroups..*L*
Leona
wayne mccollum
MacCallum, M'Callum, Etc..
jkw...@cableinet.co.uk
Leona wrote in message <35648...@newsprime.tidalwave.net>...
>
>jkwill wrote in message <6togvk$fm3$1...@news3.cableinet.co.uk>...
>>>have either a Mac Or and O hooked on their names.
>>True, but if it you have a Mac it says there was Gaelic in there once.
>>
>>
>
>"in there" ?? *chuckle*
I've done worse bloopers