Cherishing all the children of the nation equally
kfuzzbox
>
> The minister of State, Mr Eamon Ó Cuiv, is to urge the Government to
> give greater powers and more funding to the Western Development
> Commission to enable it to tackle the widening prosperity gap between
> east and west.
The more I read about what O Cuiv has to say the more I like the man. He
makes a lot of sense most of the time.
> With the support of Mr Ó Cuiv, the commission would renew its efforts
> to achieve real commitment on a wide range of long-standing
> priorities. New proposals would name what needed to be done in areas
> such as roads, telecommunications, rail, air access and power, he
> said.
I think that the interconnection between different parts of the West
should be just as important as all their connnections to Dublin. They
should reopen the Sligo to Limerick railway as soon as they can and take
the congestion off the N17. Mary O'Rourke has to understand that the
West shouldn't be given the choice between a gas feed, or a rail line,
or a motorway along the west coast - we them all. I would also start by
stopping this bungalow sprawl between Limerick and Galway and Sligo and
stop turing it in one big suburb. Planning permission in rural Ireland
is a joke. It makes no sense at all.
Offonmyown
device of tying any cause you back to the welfare of children.
Doctúir Chuil-Phiast
>
>Did Hillary Clinton think up the name of this thread?
God forbid that someone should post something to do with Ireland on SCI, instead
of Yank shite.
http://www.ucc.ie/ucc/depts/history/multitext/1916/poblacht.html
Offonmyown
instead of Yank shite.<
You have a stercoraceous mindset, but I plead innocent to your implied charge.
I was criticizing the use of Hillary-like debating tricks in an Irish
discussion.
kfuzzbox
> Maybe we should form an SCI Interested-in-Ireland Users Group. I think
> we'd easily have ten or eleven if we left out the multiples and weirdos.
Hold on, I made a valid contribution to this thread all you did on this
thread yourself was come in a complain that SCI isn't Irish enough and
then you have the nerve to demand a more Irish (whatever that implies?)
newsgroup...
You point out to me any group of Irish people that does not contain a
multiples and weirdos and you might have something to complain about.
Besides, anytime I post stuff on Ireland it is ignored. Nobody pays any
attention to anything I have to say about Ireland. They don't even say
"that's bullshit" or "you're wrong" or anything. Who on SCI actually
posts anything that takes reflects life in Ireland as most people see it
right now.
Lets see: westprog Ger Me Cat The Sage Tommy Murphy Father Des Derek
Bell Brendan Heading Goldenarse (yes I am serious) and a few others I
can't think of now.
The rest are mostly entertaining ex-pats who who have their own slant on
things here, a load of nordies having their sectarian turf wars and
various overseas on-lookers and hanger ons. The Celticy crowd can have
soc.culture.celtic, there are other groups that are devoted to all
ranges of Irish interest from music to GAA. There is a lot of
piss-taking and role playing around here and the vast majority of it is
very entertaining. I post trollish shite and everybody gets involved, I
bring up serious stuff and nobody is interested. I gave up writing short
stories to SCI because nobody seemed interested. Alright, I don't have
any talent as a writer and my stories are mostly rubbish but they
certainly belong in a forum entitled soc.culture.irish. I have been on
SCI for years and I think that I have offered up everything from current
events, short stories, jokes, row, flame wars, satire and everything
else you could imagine. What's the problem? Some of us give value for
money and many others want to sit there and offer nothing but
complaints. I have no problem with SCI the way it is. Half the reason
most of us are here is because it's eccentric and odd. Go over to
ie.general and tell me that's not boring.
Tom Walsh
> Did Hillary Clinton think up the name of this thread?
It's from a sentence in the 1916 Proclamation:
"The republic guarantees religious and civil liberty, equal rights and equal
opportunities to all its citizens, and declares its resolve to pursue the
happiness and prosperity of the whole nation and of all its parts, cherishing
all the children of the nation equally, and oblivious of the differences
carefully fostered by an alien government, which have divided a minority from
the majority in the past."
Westprog++ quoting Dev, me quoting the Proclamation; what _is_ the world
coming to?
westprog++
Tom Walsh <t...@lysithea.ucd.ie> wrote:
..
> Westprog++ quoting Dev, me quoting the Proclamation; what _is_ the world
>coming to?
When I quoted Connolly I was roundly abused for it - quoting Dev doesn't
have the same effect. Not many Dev-otees left.
J/
SOTW: "Something's Gone Wrong Again" - Buzzcocks
Doctúir Chuil-Phiast
>You have a stercoraceous mindset, but I plead innocent to your implied charge.
>I was criticizing the use of Hillary-like debating tricks in an Irish
>discussion.
I'm only an ignorant muck-savage and thought you were using it as an opportunity
to take a swipe at a Yank politician. I offer my fulsome apologies.
Offonmyown
Ah, thank you.
I suppose it makes sense that not all the children of the nation should have to
crowd into Dublin to make a living.
Tom Walsh
> ...leaving out the multiples and weirdos - oh sorry, I did say that
> already, thought so,
(Y F) = (F (Y F)) indeed.
kfuzzbox
> >The more I read about what O Cuiv has to say the more I like the man. He
> >makes a lot of sense most of the time.
>
> He built a huge reputation for himself in the Gaeltachts in his time
> as junior minister there. Many were sorry to see him go, across the
> party lines.
Why you first look at him, he bears such an uncanny resemblance to 'long
fella' that you think "uh oh!" But then the man starts talking and just
about everything he says makes sense.
> [...]
> >I would also start by
> >stopping this bungalow sprawl between Limerick and Galway and Sligo and
> >stop turing it in one big suburb. Planning permission in rural Ireland
> >is a joke. It makes no sense at all.
>
> Which would be much eased of course if rich jackeens didn't keep
> coming in and buying up the existing housing stock :)
Actually most of the ones around here are English. The number of English
families living in the West never ceases to amaze me. I am the only
Jackeen in this whole area from what I can tell. The real issue is that
you can get planning permission for anything no matter how out of place
it looks. The whole region between Galway and Sligo is turning into West
Dublin. I certainly don't live in a rural area anymore. This is townie
country these days.
--
kfuz...@tinet.ie
kfuzzbox
> Scríobh kfuzzbox <2001051814...@p127.as1.sligo1.eircom.net> :
> Which may not have reached Donn's server by the time she replied...
Fair enough.
> FWIW, I'd read you more if you dropped the trolls & posted more of the
> Irish issues & stories. With what you post, you choose your audience.
I am not going to drop the trolls or the off-topic stuff because I am
really good at it. But I do have a load of original writing that will
never get published anywhere else and I'll start doing this more often
from now on.
Tom Walsh
> Tom Walsh wrote:
> > (Y F) = (F (Y F)) indeed.
>
> I don't know any geeky type languages. ;)
Oh Gawd, not another Delphi programmer...
> Chromosomes, Fridays or friends?
All of them. None of them.
Tom
--
Smith & Wesson: the original point-and-click interface
Offonmyown
thread.<
You are probably the most parochial, ethnocentric, solipsistic obsessive
posting here. Fortunately, you have no power to enforce your dictatorial
proclivities.
Offonmyown
them are so self-involved they assume every reference is an American reference,
& can't stop themselves pissing about their own domestic concerns in clearly
Irish thread<
Bullshit. At least half the posts by Irish are about the US. You don't like
that, but that's the way it is. Now back to your browser.
Offonmyown
elsewhere.<
Take your arrogant, condescending, nitpicking, control-freak attitude and stuff
it.
Tom Walsh
> > Oh Gawd, not another Delphi programmer...
>
> Is that what you call people it's all Greek to?
They don't call it lambda calculus for nothing.
> I'll just pretend: Ay-uh, shocking state of affairs really.
Sorry, reading Scheme code tends to make me go all Zen.
'Tsall good,
Tom
Tony Cooper
> No habitually off-topic American chatter....need
> reply.
I had a really good reply to your post in mind until I came to this
last line.
--
Tony Cooper aka: Tony_Co...@Yahoo.com
Provider of Jots & Tittles
Tony Cooper
> No habitually off-topic American chatter....need
> reply.
You used the word "America" ten times in your post.
"Ireland" was tied with "Outer Mongolia" in frequency. There's
something Seussian there, but I can't quite put my finger on it.
Offonmyown
serious board regarding Irish life and topics, and is genuinely offended that
Americans muck it up in various ways. She is fair enough to point out that it
is also Irish weirdos and trolls who ruin it for her.
I'm afraid that if every single American withdrew from SCI, it would still be
dominated by non-serious posts, and a good many of the topics would have to do
with the US. There are Irish here who write incessantly about it, including
some of those who complain about the US being off-topic. Some of this is just
baiting, but not all. Anyway, people like Šonn I suppose can use the
killfile, as she plans to do.
Tony Cooper
> Anyway, people like Ðonn I suppose can use the
> killfile, as she plans to do.
If she killfiles me, I hope she has the courtesy to tell me first. I
may want to start talking about her behind her back, and I wouldn't
want her to read the stuff. She sounds like a very strong person and
I wouldn't want a public tongue lashing from her.
Also, I have a piece I'm working on about William Howard Taft (27th
President of the United States) and his "Miracle White House Diet"
that I'd like to get in before I'm stricken off.
Offonmyown
President of the United States) and his "Miracle White House Diet"
that I'd like to get in before I'm stricken off.<
Can you relate it somehow to IRA fundraising on Pennsylvania Avenue?
Tony Cooper
No, but his grandson, William Howard Taft III, was Ambassador to
Ireland and Mozambique. (Not at the same time, you understand) It is
assumed that he preferred his assignment in Ireland over Mozambique
since Mozambique is the 6th poorest nation in the world and has been
devasted by floods and cyclones. On the plus side, Mozambique has
better coffee.
I think that makes the whole thing rather topical, don't you?
Offonmyown
participates in, or even crossposts a 'non-serious' post.
Non-serious is not at issue. At issue is that sci is an Irish Culture NG
(which includes the diaspora, but only as it relates to Irishness.)Not an
American one. Cop on.<
I'm afraid you are the one who doesn't get it, and need to "cop on". Having
Irish parents, I started reading SCI some time ago out of curiosity about what
Irish people were discussing. I found, and continue to find, that SCI
discussions regarding the US are quite rarely started by Americans. For the
most part, they are started by Irish.
Naturally, Americans join in. Check it out, and please, please, "cop on".
Offonmyown
yours epitomises the attitude of the majority of the Americans who post
here.
What I've said above is entirely my own opinion, by the way.
I am however genetically privy to the Irish mindset and so far the way the
bees are manoeuvering it doesn't look good.<
While most of the above is totally incomprehensible, I have some comments on
the Irish mindset. If it were a genetic thing, I'd have it, being of Irish
parents, but of course it's not; it's a product of upbringing and environment.
Anyway, there is something rather morose about the Irish mindset, at least that
of some strata of the population. Many SCIers seem to live in a kind of
suppressed rage, which erupts from time to time. I do not find this true of my
Irish cousins, who are humorous, intelligent, civilized, and seem to be in a
good mood about 99% of the time. But then they do not depend on their PCs for a
social life.
Offonmyown
Mozambique. (Not at the same time, you understand) It is assumed that he
preferred his assignment in Ireland over Mozambique
since Mozambique is the 6th poorest nation in the world and has been
devasted by floods and cyclones. On the plus side, Mozambique has better
coffee.
I think that makes the whole thing rather topical, don't you?<
I think you've made a strong case that would convince any fair-minded person,
but then they're hard to find here. I've commented elsewhere about the
prevailing angry mood of many SCI stalwarts; do you think it's the weather over
there? Do they need Light Therapy?
Turlough
Tony Cooper wrote:
> I think that makes the whole thing rather topical, don't you?
You guys are writing as if you had no idea who Donn Earraigh is. Tell me
it ain't true, please.
Turlough
Offonmyown
ain't true, please.<
Sorry, it's true.
Offonmyown
Clare <
I think I started reading it regularly last year during a long convalescence,
and occasionally before that, but am not certain. Sometime I'll check the
archives and see when I first posted, but I know I read it for some time before
posting anything. I tend to skim it now that I'm out a lot and traveling
again. It presents a picture of Ireland that seems rather unrepresentative of
the real thing - a disproportionate number of angry young men. There's humor,
but of a bitter rather than fun-loving kind. I find it diverting, but can't
take it all very seriously.
Séimí mac Liam
Clare <Cl...@dontbother.net> wrote in message
news:0smcgtgifos7dt0nb...@4ax.com...
> yours.
>
> I've been reading and posting here for three years (off and on --
more
> on than off.) I've been through flame wars and food fights, the
Good
> Friday Agreement and Garvaghy Road. Sometimes merks are baited, but
> not often. How about if I put it like this -- we 'over-join' into
> discussions with the Irish when they've mentioned America (or
> something about American culture) and we're guilty of *too much*
> thread-drift.
>
> Note the number of Americans who come here with 'questions'. Note
how
> many Irish respond with a legitimate answer rather than some
flippant
> remark. Why? Because I think they're tired of the rest of the
world
> (mostly I-Am's looking for their roots) thinking sci is little more
> than a repository of geneological information open 24 hours a day,
> staffed by Irish people who have nothing better to do than to
function
> as an arm of Bord Fáilte!
>
I think the name of the group doesn't fit. Close but not quite.
soc.culture.irish.modern would be more appropriate. I came here just
a short time before you did. I was looking for information and
discussion of medieval Irish culture. I saw the rude smart-assed
behavior of some(most of whom are still here doing the same thing) and
the heated, propaganda laden posts about the North(which has tapered
off quite a bit). I turned on my heel and left. I was not looking
for genealogical information. There is a newsgroup for that. I was
having trouble getting a picture of the world inhabited by those of my
ancestors who came to or lived in Ireland in the 10th, 11th, and 12th
centuries. Every question I asked was ignored or given a flippant
answer. Just abut the time you arrived a friend from another
newsgroup encouraged me to give it another try and as there was quite
a bit of crossposting going on, I now was familiar with some of the
regular posters and was reading about half of the posts to this group
anyway. so I subscribed. About that time someone put out the advice
to fight your own corner and understand that every thing was not
always as it seemed. Among other things, I have learned you should
always, repeat always, say things in such a way as to make at least
two(preferably more) interpretations possible. One of these
interpretations should have a sharp, critical but humorous edge to it,
another should be utterly common place and innocent. You should
always force the reader to guess at what you mean and if they ask,
always answer with a question. Every thing you say here should be
geared at making you look smarter, wittier, more savvy and generally a
better person then anyone else here. Modesty should only be practiced
as a sham, worn like a burlesque comedian's costume, with a twinkle in
the eye that's says, "I know I'm really better than all of you."
Never, never give a straight answer to a straight question... unless
you can convince everyone listening that it's not a straight answer.
Oh yes, one more thing, Americans and the English are always in the
wrong, most especially when they aren't. I am not at all sure I'll be
staying much longer.
Séimí mac Liam
> On Sat, 19 May 2001 08:54:15 -0400, Turlough
<turlo...@excite.com>
>
No, this year that would be me. Though, I do know who you mean and
yes, that is correct.
Offonmyown
place where 'things Irish' can be discussed (which is why it is so annoying to
the Irish when the 'things Irish' suddenly become 'things American'. <
Yes, it's a very simple concept, and I have pointed out several times, with no
response from you, that US topics are for the most part posted by Irish, not by
Americans. Isn't that also a simple concept?
thoir agus thair
>I tend to skim it now that I'm out a lot and traveling again. It
>presents a picture of Ireland that seems rather unrepresentative of the
>real thing - a disproportionate number of angry young men.
I live in Ireland and I have to say that there is a lot of angry young
men in Ireland and always has been. Do you ever wonder if the whole
"craic" thing might be a cover or a smokescreen for a lot of Irish
people? Go out to any town or city in Ireland at the weekends and you
will see loads of young lads drinking as much alcohol as they can. At
closing time when the drink runs out they start beating the shit out of
each other. That's if they can take a break from puking their guts up.
This is not representative of all Irish young blokes, but it's fairly
common.
The biggest killer of young men in Ireland today is suicide. I'd say a
lot of them must have an internal anger in them that makes then this
way. Maybe diet as well might have something to do with it as well? Or
all these things. Depression is also very common in Ireland. I think the
weather plays a big part in this as well.
I think that the Irish people, although they are friendly and outgoing
folk to strangers can be very suspicious and resentful towards the
people closest to them. Lack of communication is also a big problem as
well. Irish fathers generally don't say anything to their sons other
than when they criticise them. You always have to be "tough" and "cop on
to yourself" in Ireland. This means that a lot of people who are dealing
with depression, insecurity, homosexuality, loneliness and so on bottle
it up inside them. It comes out on the streets of Irish towns and cities
on the weekends in the form of puke and blood covered streets, or in
high suicide rates or emmigration. We are a nation of talkers but we are
not the best listeners for the most part.
>There's
>humor, but of a bitter rather than fun-loving kind. I find it
>diverting, but can't take it all very seriously.
Then don't read it. Get yourself a video like The Quite Man or Hear My
Song and believe what you want to about us. Ireland and Irish people are
human beings and not cartoons. We are just as complex and can be just as
fucked up as anybody else. Allow us to be human and fucked up and you'll
get it.
--
thoir agus thair
Tony Cooper
> You guys are writing as if you had no idea who Donn Earraigh is.
Tell me
> it ain't true, please.
Do you mean the real identity of the poster calling herself Donn
Erraigh? I have no idea. I respond to what is written if it
interests me to respond. I don't worry about raincoats or spend any
thought guessing who's in them. I can't think of anyone it could be
that would've affected anything I said.
Tony Cooper
"cop on".
I have just read an exchange of 14 posts by Americans arguing about
who does or doesn't cop on about this being a NG dedicated to Irish
culture. It reminds me of people walking down the street looking on
the ground for cracks not to trip over and getting hit by a bus
because they didn't look up.
Offonmyown
(but then he baits everybody, the dear lad) the point remains thateven when an
Irish person does post something about America, it is usually an off-hand
remark -- rhetorical if you will -- certainly not
intended to continue the debate in a merkin vein. That's the point,>none
other. >
Your claim is not true, IMHO. There have been extensive postings by Irish
regarding purely american topics, like our presidential elections and gun
control issues, for example. Some are off-hand and some are far from off-hand.
Naturally they generate responses from US readers.
I think you are complaining to the wrong people. If you really care about this,
try monitoring posts by Irish on American subjects and admonishing these
people.
Peace.
Offonmyown
Ireland and always has been. Do you ever wonder if the whole "craic" thing
might be a cover or a smokescreen for a lot of Irish people?<
You paint a pretty sad picture of some people who are in depression, despair,
alcoholism, alienation. Unfortunately, they can be found in all countries, not
just Ireland. (I recall that you've traveled and know this.)There are many
causes, but I wasn't kidding when I said that one of them is the weather and
joked about Light Therapy.
Tony Cooper
> I think, while somewhat interesting, the 'Sambo" thread(s) could
> have born some relationship to everyone's concern about racism -- to
> the ND Lep for instance (if it had evolved that direction.)
This is like your proposed reading group....structured adult play
time. Usenet's a conversation, and it shouldn't be directed or
controlled. It should go where the participants feel like going.
To expand the analogy, SCI is a party with many separate
conversations. You can join in one, or you can find it uninteresting
and wander off to the next one. There shouldn't be topics that are
barred. There shouldn't be a conversational director.
I have maintained all along that the Irish are not a provincial group
that wish to talk only of Irish matters. If so, they can form there
own conversational group. Otherwise, they can check out the non-Irish
conversations and decide if they want to participate.
SCI is an expandible forum. There's not a limit to the number of
threads or postings. A "Sambo" thread does not bump off another
thread. I make it easy for anyone that wants to killfile me or ignore
my postings since I use the same name all the time.
I admit cheerfully to being the worst offender in SCI in off topic and
Yank orientated posts. I doubt if Telmey or Paul Linehan have ever
read one of my posts, and I move on from their conversational group.
Other than the expected rumblings from Ger, no one has specifically
complained about me.
I think, Clare, you give the Irish too little credit for being
ordinary people with a wide range of interests.
thoir agus thair
> You paint a pretty sad picture of some people who are in depression,
> despair, alcoholism, alienation. Unfortunately, they can be found in all
> countries, not just Ireland.
Isn't that my point?
-- thoir agus thair
Tony Cooper
> I don't have the same axe to grind as they do about this --
> but I definitely see their "point". :)
>
I think they grind an aiocht.
Chris Hedley
> Sorry, Tony. I think the group was formed (and I didn't always think
> this) to provide a provincial forum unique to Irish chatter, not yank
> chatter.
ISTR one of the main reasons beind its creation was to get the large
volume of posts about Irish political issues off soc.culture.celtic,
where there was a lot of complaining that they swamped discussions of
other Celtic things. Now we've gone full-circle and other groups are
perhaps more appropriate forums for Irish politics, arguably (I had to
use that last word! :)
Chris.
--
//USENET01 JOB (CBH,ISA),'TALKING BOLLOCKS',REGION=4000K,CLASS=F,
// MSGCLASS=A,PASSWORD=WIBBLE,USER=CBH,COND=(04,LT)
K. E. Dennis
[snipped a great deal of technical expertise applied to ng reading that makes
my own use of killfiles & brute self control look like parish level comogie]
> .... before you put your feet up with a cup of tea after a long
> American day and read your most favourite virtual people in the world..
Like this one? [tho I can vouch for it that she's very real indeed, I've
actually met her.*]
~~~
Primavera
Nuala Ní Dhomhnaill
D’athraigh gach aon ní nuair a ghaibh sí féin thar braid.
Bhainfeadh sí deora áthais as na clocha glasa, deirim leat.
Na héanlaithe beaga a bhí go dtí seo faoi smal,
d’osclaíodar a scornach is thosnaigh ag píopáil
ar chuma fadóige stain í láimh gheocaigh, amhail
is gur chuma leo sa diabhal an raibh nó nach raibh nóta acu.
Bláthanna fiaine a bhí chomh cúthail, chomh humhal
ag lorg bheith istigh go faichilleach ar chumhaiseanna
na gceapach mbláth, táid anois go rábach, féach an falcaire fiain
ag baint radharc na súl díom go hobann lena réiltíní craorag.
Bhíos-sa, leis, ag caoi go ciúin ar ghéag,
i bhfolach faoi dhuilleog fige, éalaithe i mo dhú dara,
ag cur suas stailce, púic orm chun an tsaoil.
Thógfadh sé i bhfad níos mó ná meangadh gáire
ó aon spéirbhean chun mé a mhealladh as mo shliogán,
bhí an méid sin fógartha thall is abhus agam roimh ré.
Ach do dhein sí é, le haon searradh amháin dá taobh,
le haon sm éideadh meidhreach, caithiseach, thar a gualainn
do chorraigh sí na rútaí ionam, is d’fhág mé le míobhán
im’ cheann, gan cos ná láimh fúm, ach mé corrathónach, guagach.
~~~
Primavera [trans., Medbh McGuckian]
Her ladyship hitting the scene
has fairly banjaxed me –
I swear, she’d split the sides laughing
of the dourest oul’ stone.
The weeest birds that had to toe the line
have all got a licence to sing their hearts out;
like a fourteen-year-old with a tinwhistle
they couldn’t care less if they haven’t a note
between them.
The wild flowers that butter wouldn’t melt
in their mouth, hanging around
the borders, having taken over the beds;
there’s the pimpernel, knocking the eye
from my head with its ruddy fireworks.
I wasn’t at myself at all, feeling out
of it, my bushel under a fig-leaf,
down in the dumps, a chip on my shoulder,
fed up to the teeth.
And the world and its granny knew
it would take a damn sight more
than a sexy smile from a bit of stuff
to get my defences down.
But she did the trick; with a single squirl
and one casual, suggestive sideglance,
she wiped the floor with me, took the feet
from under me, put my wits astray
till I’m stuck wide-eyed and legless.
~~~
Primavera
Nuala Ní Dhomhnaill
An tEach Uisce /The Water Horse
1999, The Gallery Press
~~~
*of course, some might argue there's little empirical evidence that *I* exist
in the RW, so take this for what it's worth.
respectfully submitted,
|Karen E. Dennis den...@mail.montclair.edu
|My employer is not responsible for my opinions,
|regardless of how sensible they are.
K. E. Dennis
> If economic disparities in Ireland between east
> and west bore the shite out off you, go start a thread of your own
> somewhere. To some of us, this matters.
Indeed it does, tho it's not solely an E/W issue.
http://www.ireland.com/newspaper/ireland/2001/0517/hom6.htm
Irish Times > Ireland > Midlands Report
Thursday, May 17, 2001
> Figures issued by the Central Statistics Office, ...show average disposable
> incomes among householders in Co Offaly are the lowest in the State...
> average disposable incomes in the county were Ł7,794 in 1998, the latest
> year for which statistics are available. The average in the State was
> Ł9,324, while Dubliners were top of the earnings table with average
> disposable incomes per household of Ł10,825.
Considering that Tullamore is now viewed as w/in commuting distance of
Dublin, this is pretty sobering evidence of the patchiness of economic
revival.
thoir agus thair
> Considering that Tullamore is now viewed as w/in commuting distance of
> Dublin, this is pretty sobering evidence of the patchiness of economic
> revival.
This whole thing with places such as Mullingar, Tullamore, Navan etc
being considered within commuting distance of Dublin is little more than
an invention of the property sections of Irish newspapers. These
developers would tell you that Rockall is within commuting distance of
Dublin if they were building houses on it. Mullingar has only something
like 5 trains to Dublin a day and the N4 between there and Dublin is one
monster traffic jams most day. Tullamore is going to be destroyed and
turned into a dormatory town. Navan doesn't even have a train service
other than the Tara Mines goods trains. The only places that can be
truly considered withing commuting distance of Dublin are inside the
M50. I have come to the conclusion that property developers are the
modern curse of rural Ireland.
--
thoir agus thair
Terry McT
thair <kfuzzbo...@tinet.ie> wrote:
Not that property developers don't deserve a good bit of blame, but it
would seem that this is also a by-product of the economic upturn of the
last, what, twenty or so years.
Terry
K. E. Dennis
> K. E. Dennis <den...@mail.montclair.edu> wrote:
>
> > Considering that Tullamore is now viewed as w/in commuting distance of
> > Dublin, this is pretty sobering evidence of the patchiness of economic
> > revival.
>
> This whole thing with places such as Mullingar, Tullamore, Navan etc
> being considered within commuting distance of Dublin is little more than
> an invention of the property sections of Irish newspapers. These
> developers would tell you that Rockall is within commuting distance of
> Dublin if they were building houses on it. [...] The only places that can
> be
> truly considered withing commuting distance of Dublin are inside the
> M50. I have come to the conclusion that property developers are the
> modern curse of rural Ireland.
All too true. OTOH, but I've actually *seen* people boarding the trains &
buses @ Tullamore to commute to Dublin jobs, so it's not entirely hype. A
reflection, perhaps, of the problem of finding jobs in the Midlands &
affordable housing any closer.
But I tend to agree that property developers are the spawn of Satan.
Tony Cooper
>
> That doesn't mean I care about the funny story you heard while
waiting
> in the K-Mart checkout yesterday.
>
Why do you want to silence Eddie Wall?
Turlough
> I think that the Irish people, although they are friendly and
> outgoing folk to strangers can be very suspicious and resentful
> towards the people closest to them.
I've never understood the curious sense of *begrudgery* I've witnessed
between members of some Irish families that have emigrated to the US.
I'm not talking about 2nd generation and further I'Ams, I mean fathers,
sons, and brothers who were Irish born and came here. The families of
most groups such as the Italians, Chinese, Polish, etc, hang together
tightly and support each other so that everyone stays afloat. The Irish,
however, seem to be more independent and self sustaining, even to the
point of denying their needs rather than leaning on a family member for
support. This isn't 100% or absolute, but I've seen it so many times
that it has made an impression on me. The Irish are great at running
sole proprietorship businesses. A fellow owns the business, makes all
the decisions, and sinks or swims alone. When sons and fathers or
brothers team up as partners, fights and hard feelings seem to surface.
It's almost as if one man begrudges the other for doing better or having
more success. Ironically, I can name hundreds of very successful
partnerships when the Irish guy teams up with an Italian, Jew, or
whatever. Again, this is not an absolute, as I can also name many fine
Irish partnerships. It's just that it sticks out like a sore thumb when
you see so many brothers, fathers and sons, seemingly estranged over
failed or tense and tenuous business relationships. Am I imagining these
things or does any of it sound familiar?
Turlough
Doctúir Chuil-Phiast
>> .... before you put your feet up with a cup of tea after a long
>> American day and read your most favourite virtual people in the world..
>
>Like this one? [tho I can vouch for it that she's very real indeed, I've
>actually met her.*]
>
>~~~
>Primavera
>Nuala Ní Dhomhnaill
"Who are the Irish writers working today who will be read in one hundred years
time? Mike Murphy presents Reading the Future a unique freeze-frame of Ireland's
literary culture at the turn of the century and provides fascinating insights
into the shaping influences on the lives, minds and working methods of twelve
great writers."
http://www.rte.ie/radio/readingthefuture/nidhomhnaill.html
http://www.rte.ie/rams/radio/readingfuture200101.ram
thoir agus thair
> All too true. OTOH, but I've actually *seen* people boarding the trains &
> buses @ Tullamore to commute to Dublin jobs, so it's not entirely hype. A
> reflection, perhaps, of the problem of finding jobs in the Midlands &
> affordable housing any closer.
Tullamore has a half-decent rail service because it is on the main Cork
line. I know people commute from places as far away as Gorey in Wexford
to Dublin. The vast majority of these people drive as the public
transport policy makers in this country seem to assume that people only
need the bus or train one a week to get to the market and nobody travels
at night. It's a complete joke.
> But I tend to agree that property developers are the spawn of Satan.
There is this pretty little village about 5 miles from here called
Cloonacool nestled between the Ox Mountain the the upper reaches of the
Moy. It's only has one shop/post office and a pub. A few houses and it's
very quite. It has two lovely victorian cottages at the cross roads with
roses growing up the side and the whole place has serene and gentle
feeling. A developer is trying to build 60 new houses (there is only
about 15 houses in the village now). So that's at least 60 new cars
getting there and back on the quite roads which are filled with birds
and other wildlife. That it''s be all destroyed by the increase traffic.
It's probably be name 'Ascot Manor' or 'Sailbury's Downs' or some other
anglophilia marketing phrase. This is happening everywhere in Ireland.
Gated communities will be the norm next.
--
thoir agus thair
thoir agus thair
> Not that property developers don't deserve a good bit of blame, but it
> would seem that this is also a by-product of the economic upturn of the
> last, what, twenty or so years.
True, but like everything else that happens as a result of the market
place particularly in English speaking countries, nobody stops and says
"are we doing the correct thing here?". Much of the English speaking
world is still lost in the post WWII mentality of "It's good for
progress".
Look at a city like Bradford in England. A former industrial mill town
it had some of the most striking examples of Victorian architecture to
be found anywhere. In the 1960's they tore down the city centre and
replaced it with prefabricated shopping districts and other concrete
monstrosities. Only a few streets of the old city survive. This is now
the main showpiece area of the city with the old mills restored and
converted into apartments and shop etc. The Bradford City council are
now on a quest to tear down the 1960's buildings and replaced them with
copies of the original Victorian building that were on the site. I saw
an interview with the mayor of Bradford and he was going on about
everybody in the 1960's was mouthing off about progress and everybody
believing it. The whole thing was being driven along by a few land
developers and a city was destroyed for the next 40 years and it only
now coming back. Bulldozers are aren't designed to be considerate.
--
thoir agus thair
thoir agus thair
> Am I imagining these
> things or does any of it sound familiar?
No, that's all true. I think you hit the nail on the head.
--
thoir agus thair
Terry McT
agus thair <kfuzzbo...@tinet.ie> wrote:
You can't stop progress, but you can corral it in some and save some of
the beauty, history, and way of life.
This reminds me of another conversation we have her on sci with fair
regularity. I found out a couple of years ago that the site of where
my family lived along the southern coast of Ireland is probably now a
golf course. It would be really, really nice if I could go there and
see at least the remains of how it used to be, but time has gone on
there no matter how much I'd like the place to match my image of it.
The culture/economy/etc has changed/improved/moved on/etc.
Terry
Terry McT
agus thair <kfuzzbo...@tinet.ie> wrote:
> Terry McT <mcti...@earthlink.net.spamfree> wrote:
>
>
> > Not that property developers don't deserve a good bit of blame, but it
> > would seem that this is also a by-product of the economic upturn of the
> > last, what, twenty or so years.
>
> True, but like everything else that happens as a result of the market
> place particularly in English speaking countries, nobody stops and says
> "are we doing the correct thing here?". Much of the English speaking
> world is still lost in the post WWII mentality of "It's good for
> progress".
I agree. We need to go to the places we've already heavily impacted,
the old abandoned neighborhoods and put them into a liveable form
before taking over farms, wild areas, and the like. The governor of
my state is pushing a program to do pretty much this, encourage
(through a few means) developers to work in the already urban/suburban
areas and give the green areas a break.
>
> Look at a city like Bradford in England. A former industrial mill town
> it had some of the most striking examples of Victorian architecture to
> be found anywhere. In the 1960's they tore down the city centre and
> replaced it with prefabricated shopping districts and other concrete
> monstrosities. Only a few streets of the old city survive. This is now
> the main showpiece area of the city with the old mills restored and
> converted into apartments and shop etc. The Bradford City council are
> now on a quest to tear down the 1960's buildings and replaced them with
> copies of the original Victorian building that were on the site. I saw
> an interview with the mayor of Bradford and he was going on about
> everybody in the 1960's was mouthing off about progress and everybody
> believing it. The whole thing was being driven along by a few land
> developers and a city was destroyed for the next 40 years and it only
> now coming back. Bulldozers are aren't designed to be considerate.
It happens around the world.
Terry
thoir agus thair
> This reminds me of another conversation we have her on sci with fair
> regularity. I found out a couple of years ago that the site of where
> my family lived along the southern coast of Ireland is probably now a
> golf course. It would be really, really nice if I could go there and
> see at least the remains of how it used to be, but time has gone on
> there no matter how much I'd like the place to match my image of it.
> The culture/economy/etc has changed/improved/moved on/etc.
Where is it?
--
thoir agus thair
thoir agus thair
> In article <2001052011...@p138.as1.sligo1.eircom.net>, thoir
> I agree. We need to go to the places we've already heavily impacted,
> the old abandoned neighborhoods and put them into a liveable form
> before taking over farms, wild areas, and the like. The governor of
> my state is pushing a program to do pretty much this, encourage
> (through a few means) developers to work in the already urban/suburban
> areas and give the green areas a break.
There is a lot more of "old America" left to be seen these days than
there is of "old Ireland" from what I've experienced from knowing both
countries very well. I am serious about this. When you first see this
country as it is today you could be forgiven in most parts of it for
believing that people have only lived here for the last 25 years. I
think that here is Ireland we were so poor and miserable in the past
that we just wanted to forget about it. That seems to be changing now a
little bit.
I complain about this a lot but there are examples in Ireland that I
like. The new waterfront in Carrick-On-Shannon is a good example. The
buildings had facades that are traditional to Irish towns but yet they
are sort of modern as well. They are a tasteful hybrid of both tradition
and functionality. Here in Tubbercurry loads of the 1950 and 1960's
structures are being demolished and the traditional facades are being
reintroduced. This is happened all over Ireland.
I also do not have a problem with Irish town buildings being painted in
bright "latin" type colours. I quite like it actually. Although they
were never like this in the "old Ireland", it does suit them and with
our dull climate the colour adds a bit of life to the towns. About five
years back I visited the island of Burano near Venice and when I got off
the ferry and saw all these little houses painted bright colours with
white trim around the windows. I thought I had landed in Dingle by
mistake.
--
thoir agus thair
Offonmyown
K-Mart checkout yesterday.>>
Does it mean that others want to read your reflections on life in Chicago?
mickeymickiewicz
kfuzzbo...@tinet.ie (thoir agus thair) wrote:
>Terry McT <mcti...@earthlink.net.spamfree> wrote:
>
>> In article <2001052011...@p138.as1.sligo1.eircom.net>, thoir
>
>> I agree. We need to go to the places we've already heavily impacted,
>> the old abandoned neighborhoods and put them into a liveable form
>> before taking over farms, wild areas, and the like. The governor of
>> my state is pushing a program to do pretty much this, encourage
>> (through a few means) developers to work in the already urban/suburban
>> areas and give the green areas a break.
>
>
>There is a lot more of "old America" left to be seen these days than
>there is of "old Ireland" from what I've experienced from knowing both
>countries very well. I am serious about this.
I also do not have a problem with Irish town buildings being painted in
>bright "latin" type colours. I quite like it actually. Although they
>were never like this in the "old Ireland", it does suit them and with
>our dull climate the colour adds a bit of life to the towns. About five
>years back I visited the island of Burano near Venice and when I got off
>the ferry and saw all these little houses painted bright colours with
>white trim around the windows. I thought I had landed in Dingle by
>mistake.
>
>
They're selling loads of lingerie in the shops in Dingle?
mm
>--
>thoir agus thair
--
[Posted at boards.ie]
http://www.boards.ie/
Ireland's Bulletin Boards, News Groups, Chat Rooms
After Hours - Games - Technology - Work - For Sale
thoir agus thair
> And of the curse of statistical averages. With most workers wages
> held to the increases mandated under the wage agreements, and the
> might of government and employer propaganda painting any demand for a
> pay increase as an unpatriotic betrayal of the nation, the fruits of
> the boom are spread unevenly.
Not to mention an Irish trade union movement which is devoted to
increasing the profits of multinational corporations by demanding lower
taxes and thus saving the employers the trouble of giving them a pay
raise. The economic agenda of SIPTU leadership would put the editorials
of The Economist to shame.
--
thoir agus thair
thoir agus thair
> They're selling loads of lingerie in the shops in Dingle?
I don't know. I never bought lingerie for a woman in my life as I've
always thought that was a kind tacky thing for a bloke to do. If I am
ever in the mood to purchase a pair of satin knickers for myself, I'll
certainly considering looking for a "An Aine Samhradh siopa" in Dingle.
--
thoir agus thair
Séimí mac Liam
Gearóid Mac Cuinneagáin <Ger@r.d> wrote in message
news:tfqfgtgsg54httvio...@4ax.com...
> Scríobh Séimí mac Liam <ynvN6.82$V22....@typhoon.aracnet.com> :
>
> >I think the name of the group doesn't fit. Close but not quite.
> >soc.culture.irish.modern would be more appropriate.
>
> <FLIPPANT>
> This says more about your attitude than ours. I expect this group
to
> be about the Ireland I see every day, not some Quiet Man fantasy.
If
> you want to discuss piseogs and leprauchans, then I suggest you go
set
> up soc.culture.peig.. If you ask here, you *might* get a straight
> answer, but there's no obligation on the part of any poster to give
> you one.
I know this is <FLIPPANT> but I never was overly interested in Leps or
similar, other than wishing to know what the real folktales were as
opposed the the new-age fantasies. I was merely trying to get a
handle on the context and teminology of the period surrounding the
Norman entrance into Ireland. As so much of what is written of the
period makes referrence by alegory to those old legends, in order to
understand the meaning of similies and such it is neccessary to know
the folktales and legends and understand their meaning. You and
others treat every query as though it comes from some clueless AOL or
webtv poster whose head is filled with popular media dreck. Some of
us don't like the lack of respect implied by that behaivor. Some of
us return it in kind. Some of you can dish it out but not take it.
>
> > I came here just
> >a short time before you did. I was looking for information and
> >discussion of medieval Irish culture.
>
> <SERIOUS>
> I'd say soc.culture.celtic is a better bet for that, though its not
> much of a group these days, mostly filled with new-agers. There are
> some decent historical mailing lists owned by MAQQI at
> http://groups.yahoo.com if you're interested.
I had been to bothe soc.culture.celtic and alt.druid prior to coming
here and both were filled with new-agers then. That's why I came
here. I assumed(yes, I know what assuming does) that at least some of
the posters here were educated in Ireland and that the educational
system in Ireland taught some rudimentary history of the island. I
found people interested in taking the mickey and spouting anti-English
rhetoric. Damn few real answers, though admittedly you provided most
of the real answers.
I hate, nay despise mailing lists. They are just one more oportunity
to recieve trojans, worms and viruses, especially if you want them in
digest form so you don't have your mailbox cluttered with lots of
e-mails from strangers. I get enough strange e-mails from people
seeking info on my ancestors to keep me busy answering and deleting
for a large segment of the time alloted as it is.
--
James C. Woodard
"Too many laws make scofflaws of all"
http://www.aracnet.com/~gwyddon/
gwy...@aracnet.com
thoir agus thair
> Scríobh thoir agus thair
> <2001052014...@p101.as1.sligo1.eircom.net> :
>
> >I also do not have a problem with Irish town buildings being painted in
> >bright "latin" type colours. I quite like it actually. Although they
> >were never like this in the "old Ireland", it does suit them and with
> >our dull climate the colour adds a bit of life to the towns.
>
> I'm not sure if this is true. There are shops & farmhouses that I can
> remember all my life being painted bright pastel shades of yellow,
> pink, blue, etc... I don't know how far back you want to go before
> something is considered traditional, but its certainly not something
> that just happened n the last decade.
I was once looking through an old tourist book on Ireland from the
1950's that had loads of pictures of Irish towns in colour. The town
buildings if not exposed stone, are nearly all painted white. There was
some shots of Clonakilty, Dingle and loads of other places. Today the
building in these towns are generally done in the bright colours. So I
was just assuming that with cheaper and better quality exterior paints
available in the last 20 years or so that this fad was fairly recent. I
am sure Tidy Towns Competitions played a big part in this as well.
Either way, it's something I like and it has really brightened up a lot
of once dreary country towns.
--
thoir agus thair
John McMenamy
Gearóid Mac Cuinneagáin <Ger@r.d> wrote in message
news:uoqfgt48hcnd0bk8q...@4ax.com...
>
> You should try to make it to a SCI-CON sometime. We don't sit around
> flaming each other at them, we have the crack.
The session on cutlery etiquette was particularly interesting at the last
sci-con I attended.
John.
Séimí mac Liam
Gearóid Mac Cuinneagáin <Ger@r.d> wrote in message
> Scríobh Séimí mac Liam <gMSN6.132$V22....@typhoon.aracnet.com> :
>
> > I get enough strange e-mails from people
> >seeking info on my ancestors to keep me busy answering and deleting
> >for a large segment of the time alloted as it is.
>
> patience with the newbies who show up expecting us to act like a
free
> reference library.
>
It is not necessary to try to make them look like fools, just don't
answer. Everyone was once a beginner or uninformed. Deriding them
surreptitiously by exploiting their ignorance, making fun of them to
your friends in such a manner that your know they won't know they are
being made fun of, diminishes you not them. It makes you look like a
bunch of arrested adolescents. And it turns them into an enemy not a
friend. People may not understand the joke but they have an uncanny
sense of when they are being ridiculed. When someone writes me asking
for information, I don't have am always apologetic for not being able
to help, but they only get to be rude to me one time. Whether I have
the information or no. It costs me nothing to give people the
information I have, even though it may have cost me a lot in time,
effort and money to acquire it. To withhold that information from
someone asking nicely for it because the last person to ask was rude
or presumptuous would make me a jerk.
Terry McT
agus thair <kfuzzbo...@tinet.ie> wrote:
The tip of a peninsula, in County Kerry I believe. I was trying to
track it down a couple of years ago, but my only clue was a colorful
statement by a relative. My great grandfather used to say he could
piss in the Atlantic on one side of the property and the Irish Sea on
the other side of the place. (Yes, I know St. George's Channel or
whatever you want to call it is there) It sounds more like he was
from County Cork, but his place of origin was listed as Kerry on some
official paperwork, so there you go.
When I first came to sci in late 1995 or early 1996, I exchanged quite
a few emails with a very nice fellow in Ireland (long gone from sci)
who was intrigued at my claim that my batch of McTigues came from the
south coast rather than up by Galway or Clare. He tracked some
information down for me from census records and the like and proved we
were down there, but we were never able to pin point the farm. He did
tell me that the most likely location was slated to become a golf
course. I assume by now that bogeys, eagles, and strangely dressed men
abound there.
Terry
Séimí mac Liam
Gearóid Mac Cuinneagáin <Ger@r.d> wrote in message
> >others treat every query as though it comes from some clueless AOL
or
> >webtv poster whose head is filled with popular media dreck.
>
request
> seriously for instance, but occasionally I'll give them a Niffrig
> translation, and sometimes I just ignore it because I can't be
arsed.
> Same goes for everyone. It depends on what kind of day we're
having,
> and what kind of day SCI is having. I saw people try to talk sense
to
> Blair Ritger for nearly a month in soc.culture.celtic for instance,
> despite her stubborn refusal to learn. I know its unfair that the
ire
> people feel at her should then get aimed at newbies in general, but
> there's a reason why newbies are advised to lurk and read FAQs.
>
I know, I was one of them. That tried to talk to Blair, that is. But
I didn't get rude with her. I just stopped talking and when she came
over here, I just ignored her. There is one over at
soc.genealogy.medieval right now. I didn't get rude to her until she
started sending emails to me. I ignored her on the group. She didn't
stop sending rude, abusive e-mails until I threatened to post them all
to the group if she sent another.
Séimí mac Liam
Gearóid Mac Cuinneagáin <Ger@r.d> wrote in message
> Scríobh Séimí mac Liam <UZVN6.134$V22....@typhoon.aracnet.com> :
>
> >Gearóid Mac Cuinneagáin <Ger@r.d> wrote in message
> >news:bdufgt4khq1i3ailu...@4ax.com...
> >> Scríobh Séimí mac Liam <gMSN6.132$V22....@typhoon.aracnet.com>
:
> >>
> >> > I get enough strange e-mails from people
> >> >seeking info on my ancestors to keep me busy answering and
deleting
> >> >for a large segment of the time alloted as it is.
> >>
> >> Apply that to SCI, & you'll understand why many of us have little
> >> patience with the newbies who show up expecting us to act like a
> >free
> >> reference library.
> >>
> >It is not necessary to try to make them look like fools, just don't
> >answer.
>
> service. Being polite to arrogant idiots may be part of American
> culture, it isn't necessarily part of ours.
>
> [snip nasty Irish SCIers]
>
> This is usenet,not Ireland, even if it is an Irish part of usenet.
> Its the responsibility of any newbie to educate themselves before
> posting here.
Within reason, Yes.
> If they don't, and they get ridiculed, then they have
> only themselves to blame. You yourself said you don't like email
> lists and didn't ask questions there, but the truth is, Maqqi's
lists
> are moderated, focussed, and would have been the best place to ask
> your questions. You chose to ask in an unmoderated forum yourself.
> Dn't blame the scorpion because it stings the frog.
>
The scorpion likewise should not blame the frog when it's tongue
begins to flicker reflexively.
Séimí mac Liam
Gearóid Mac Cuinneagáin <Ger@r.d> wrote in message
> Scríobh Séimí mac Liam <9UWN6.137$V22....@typhoon.aracnet.com> :
>
> >> This is usenet,not Ireland, even if it is an Irish part of
usenet.
> >> Its the responsibility of any newbie to educate themselves before
> >> posting here.
> >
> >Within reason, Yes.
>
> they log on. Lurk.
>
> >> If they don't, and they get ridiculed, then they have
> >> only themselves to blame. You yourself said you don't like email
> >> lists and didn't ask questions there, but the truth is, Maqqi's
> >lists
> >> are moderated, focussed, and would have been the best place to
ask
> >> your questions. You chose to ask in an unmoderated forum
yourself.
> >> Dn't blame the scorpion because it stings the frog.
> >>
> >The scorpion likewise should not blame the frog when it's tongue
> >begins to flicker reflexively.
>
>
Seems to bother sdome more than others Rice Suds or Porter.
westprog++
Gearóid Mac Cuinneagáin <Ger@r.d> wrote:
>Scríobh John McMenamy <eZVN6.1106$Fk7....@news.indigo.ie> :
>A mere curtain-raiser. Westprog's recitation of "Rockall Rockall
>You'll Never Fall" was the highlight of the night.
Not tuneful perhaps, but a passionate belief in a righteous cause can
overcome such handicaps.
I was shocked at the vehemence with which you and Gerry Doyle debated
the correct order of precedence between a Bishop and the eldest son of
an Earl. Luckily good humour was restored and no harm done.
J/
SOTW: "Bad Wisdom" - Suzanne Vega
The Pirate Queen
"Gearóid Mac Cuinneagáin" <Ger@r.d> wrote in message
> >de dhroim dhroichead Scáthaigh
>
> >I'm a dead hero leaping
> >from the edge of the bridge of fear -
>
> "I leap bravely into heaven from the back of the bridge of Scathach"
>
> Scathach was a war goddess. Cú Chullain wanted to learn from her, so
> he travelled to her home. When he got there, he found that she was on
> her island, and the only way to reach her was across "the Pupils'
> Bridge". The bridge was booby-trapped, crossing it was the final test
> the Scathach gave to her apprentices. Cú Chullain tried to cross
> three times and failed, then the war spasm came over him, and he
> crossed successfully, using a manoeuvre called the Salmon Leap.
I love this! But I'm remembering the trick of the Ga Bolga which I thought
was some type of weapon as what he used to get across the bridge? Do I have
things mixed up?
PQ
KateH
> Actually, I don't know about Kinsella. If he's at the Bob the Builder
> stage it may be too advanced for him. Maybe some of the posters with
> weans can recommend something. FWIW, I'be been buying the Harry
> Potter books for the nephew over the last year or so, and I'd
> recommend them if you havent got them yet.
How old Eddie? Bob The Builder ...........means nothing to me.
KateH :)
KateH
> "KateH" wrote:
> >How old Eddie? Bob The Builder ...........means nothing to me.
> >KateH :)
> >
Picture books then? "The Selkie Girl"......retold by Susan Cooper is very
nice and Tommy de Paola did "Fin M'Coul (WB Yeats' spelling, not mine) The
Giant of Knockmany Hill". My son loved these when he was little. One of
our first loooooooong books was "Dinotopia".
There are a couple of good "faery tale" books with Irish stories........I'll
see if I can't dig them up.
KateH :)
Tuba Foreman
"Gearóid Mac Cuinneagáin" wrote:
>
> I *think* either Lady Gregory or Sinead de Valera (wife of the Long
> Fella) might have written Irish legends suitable for kids. They might
> be a bit dated by now though. You could always read ahead & tell your
> own versions too. You might even be abe to sell them somewhere.
Lady G reads like Bullfinch: the tales feel abridged and hurried. Made me want
to find more (never got around to it). Probably okay for a basic
intro/primer/starting point.
--
Pete
KateH
> Lady G reads like Bullfinch: the tales feel abridged and hurried. Made me
want
> to find more (never got around to it). Probably okay for a basic
> intro/primer/starting point.
Fairy and Folk Tales of Ireland........by WB Yeats.
Very readable, but too old for Eddie's wee one.
Kate(where's Breathnach, he'll know the answer to this one)H
Paul Carr
"Gearóid Mac Cuinneagáin" <Ger@r.d> wrote in message
news:jri9gtghmmvm6uqdf...@4ax.com...
<snip>
I certainly agree with Mr O'Cuiv. I might be wrong here, but I think, in a
county-to-county basis, Galway already has the seventh highest wealth per
capita in the country. The six counties in front of Galway, I think, are all
in Lenister, and, of course, include Dublin...
But, it is , of course, true that there is a weath gap between the West of
Ireland (and the mid-lands and borders too - as well as to a lesser extent,
the south-east of Ireland) on the one hand, and the Dublin hinterland,
including Meath, Louth, Kildare, Wicklow on the other..
In fact, I read somewhere that the poorest counties in the Irish Republic on
a county to county basis are, in fact, Westmeath/Offaly.. Yes, I recall
reading this in an article written by Garrett Fitzgerald, a former Éire
Taoiseach for Fine Gael in the 1980s., in, I presume the Irish Times..
Certainly, I agree there should be more funding and powers given to the
Western Development Commission..
My concern, as a Donegal-man, is what I see as a wilful neglect of the
North-West by successive Éire governments. I mean in the sense of inadequate
infrastructure being laid down. I understand that the Governments are going
to engage over the next ten years and beyond in an extensive programme of
dual carriage-way and motorway construction or upgrade. It's important that
the N3 trunk road is included in this scheme, as that is the road, which,
ultimately connects Dublin and Donegal. Also, in contrast, I fear, to the
present situation, it is vitally important that digital broadband is piped
into the north-west to encourage companies/multinationals to set up there.
That, of course, will also need to be backed up with adequate local
electricity generation and supply of a sufficient voltage...
Paul Carr
--
"They can not because they do not do it well and cause hell in the chain of
command" - Hippo
Paul Carr
"Gearóid Mac Cuinneagáin" <Ger@r.d> wrote in message
news:4heagtop1vv3ncr0t...@4ax.com...
> Scríobh kfuzzbox
> <2001051710...@p399.as1.prp.dublin.eircom.net> :
> >Gearóid Mac Cuinneagáin <Ger@r.d> wrote:
>
> >> The minister of State, Mr Eamon Ó Cuiv, is to urge the Government to
> >> give greater powers and more funding to the Western Development
> >> Commission to enable it to tackle the widening prosperity gap between
> >> east and west.
> >
> >The more I read about what O Cuiv has to say the more I like the man. He
> >makes a lot of sense most of the time.
>
> He built a huge reputation for himself in the Gaeltachts in his time
> as junior minister there. Many were sorry to see him go, across the
> party lines.
I understand he has been replaced by a Donegal woman, Mary Coughlan, a FF
representative for Donegal South-West (my mum votes for her on a regular
basis, if not exclusively so). Then, when Mike Noonen became leader of Fine
Gael, well, lo and behold, he appoints a Donegal man , a FG representative
from the very same constituency as Mary Coughlan, Dinny McGinley, to shadow
Mrs Coughlin in opposition on this very same portfolio. It is almost as
though, Donegallers were exclusively cut out to serve this one portfolio.
We've got Jim Mc Daid, (a FF TD for Donegal North-East), admittedly, too as
Minister for Sport which used to have a mickey-mouse budget, but which has
greatly increased, way ahead of inflation, since the present FF/PD coalition
took office... It has increased something like 10 times..
<snip>
Paul Carr
"Gearóid Mac Cuinneagáin" <Ger@r.d> wrote in message
news:tcldgtkb5p290h534...@4ax.com...
<snip>
> >Why you first look at him, he bears such an uncanny resemblance to 'long
> >fella' that you think "uh oh!" But then the man starts talking and just
> >about everything he says makes sense.
>
> Its even worse when he talks. Listening to him, its like the Long
> Fella came back from the dead.
Finton O'Toole, on a Questions and Answers show on RTÉ about 2 months ago,
called Eamon O'Cuiv , who was also on the panel, a "man of integrity", I
recall. Strong praise indeed..
K. E. Dennis
> K. E. Dennis wrote:
> >"Ðonn Earraigh" wrote:
> [snipped]
> >> .... before you put your feet up with a cup of tea after a long
> >> American day and read your most favourite virtual people in the world..
> >
> >Like this one? [tho I can vouch for it that she's very real indeed, I've
> >actually met her.*]
>
> Really? What's she like to talk to?
Well, perhaps if I hadn't been struck mute by admiration, I might be able to say I
talked to her As it is, I can only tell you she's marvellous to listen to. She
has just the sort of voice you'd imagine - warm & resonant & w/ a slight smile in
it.
> I would like to meet up with her some day, or at the very least be a fly on
> the wall while she's talking to some other writers and poets.
That's more or less what I experienced - I heard her @ a poetry reading in NY, her
own works & some of the Irish orig'ls of poems pub'd [in translation] in the vol.
"Irish love poems : Dánta Grá.*" & her very witty commentary on some of the
themes in those works & how they've influenced her own.
[*ed., Paula J. Redes; 1996, Dublin : Roberts Books | New York : Hippocrene
Books]
[snipped]
> >Primavera [trans., Medbh McGuckian]
>
> Imagine the sheer fun of working with Nuala Ní D., translating! [...snips]
> An tEach Uisce!
> Oh-oh, another Amazon bill and another bookshelf crisis looms..
All the poems in the vol. are translated by either McGuckian or Eiléan Ní
Chuilleanáin - so there's this wonderful play of words among their respective
voices as you go back & forth. Well worth a look, IMHO. & if you're worried
about the bookshelf [or the floor] giving way, I say it's time to shore up the
foundations of the house. Or get rid of furniture. Some things are just more
important.
respectfully submitted,
|Karen E. Dennis den...@mail.montclair.edu
|My employer is not responsible for my opinions,
|regardless of how sensible they are.
K. E. Dennis
> I don't really want to quibble with a translation by Michael Hartnett,
> he did a very fine job, but I'd just like to post on a few points
> where Nuala refers to Irish history and myth.
[snipped exegesis of "Manach," by Ní Dhomhnaill, as translated by Michael
Hartnett]
Thanks for that.
I noticed the elision of Skellig Mhichil as a mere hermitage, & so on...
it feels as tho Hartnett was trying for a certain bland universalism in
the trans., perhaps on the assumption that non Irish readers might not
catch the refs [many of the poems are pub'd in trans. by Wake Univ. Press
here in the States].
A pity, really, as it loses some of the power, loosening the link btwn
Nuala's modern imagination & the historical /mythological tales - all of
which are deeply ambivalent about women's sexuality.
> >Mise Temptation,
>
> >I am Temptation.
>
> Nuala is being very naughty here, suggesting that Temptation is purely
> a foreign thing :)
An alien Saxon implant? tsk, tsk. Can't you just hear the priest
fulminating agin it?
K. E. Dennis
He would, too.
In addition to Lady Gregory & WBY, both of which suffer from the now archaic
sounding language, there's a relatively more recent text, edited by Henry
Glassie: "Irish Folk Tales," pub'd 1983 by Pantheon.
Many of the latter tales would be suitable for a youngster, if you took Ger's
advice about reading ahead & putting some of the narratives in simpler
language. A warning, tho - some of the stories might upset the more sensitive
or suggestible kiddies.
OTOH, who doesn't know the wee creature w/ a voracious taste for creepy ghost
tales? [who 2 hrs later will be standing in your bedrm doorway asking, in a
small voice, to climb in w/ you because its so *dark*...]
ISTR there's a wee text out, possibly pub'd by Penguin, called "Irish Sagas,"
that's an English prose trans. of many of the classic myths [I thought I had
that lying about here, but I can't find it right now. Might be under the
stack of journals I haven't read in the past 43 mos....] - lots of stirring
tales. But I don't know about ready-to-read stuff for little ones.
K. E. Dennis
> Gearóid Mac Cuinneagáin <Ger@r.d> wrote:
>
> > Scríobh thoir agus thair...
They might originally have been the brighter colours, for all that. Much like
late 19th c. houses here, which all have been whitewashed for many generat'ns
but turn out to have been originally quite spectacularly garish.
In the town where I was @ college, for example, in the process of restoring
this great big rambling American Gothic/Victorian era house that was being
used as a residence hall, they discovered the orig'l 19th c. paint scheme.
All the fancy woodwork of the trim & porches & such had been painted in @
least 4 different colours - deep slate blue, bright mustard yellow, mauve
[apparently quite a popular colour @ the end of that century] & a pine green -
which when restored took some getting used to, but made the place look for all
the world like a gingerbread house.
The Victorians weren't as Victorian as we sometimes think - & the Georgian
were even less so. After all, they had no neon to jazz up those shopfronts -
why not paint them cherry red & bright green if you could?
Yet it would have been expensive to keep up w/ that sort of thing yr in & out
- not to mention it going out of fashion in the early 20th c. to be so
flamboyant & overdressed as it were.
Shiny Boots of Leather
>he travelled to her home. When he got there, he found that she was on
>her island,
Wasn't she actually scottish? I seem to recall that she lived in Alba....
but I've never had the honour of being able to read the original (something I
am working to correct, but it's damned hard to teach yourself out of a book).
Cyn
westprog++
Five is typically a bit young for Harry Potter though.
J/
SOTW: "Bad Wisdom" - Suzanne Vega
westprog++
Talking of shiny boots - I heard I'll Be Your Mirror and The Black
Angel's Death Song playing in a garage this morning - one of the shiny
new Esso
shops.
Howard Beale
Paul Carr <carr...@iol.ie> wrote in message
news:6QiO6.33889$PF4....@news.iol.ie...
>
>
> "Gearóid Mac Cuinneagáin" <Ger@r.d> wrote in message
> > >
> > as junior minister there. Many were sorry to see him go, across the
> > party lines.
>
> I understand he has been replaced by a Donegal woman, Mary Coughlan, a FF
> representative for Donegal South-West
She was only elevated to help her position at the next election, when Pat
'idiot
name' Gallagher is expected to return and sweep up. Not that she'll be too
worried if she loses, Europe beckons.....
>(my mum votes for her on a regular basis, if not exclusively so).
You really should have a long chat with your mum :-)
--
Howard Beale
"I'm as mad as hell and I'm not going to take it anymore"
Shiny Boots of Leather
>as Scottish though, for the people who created her didn't. At the
>time, they covered the territory of Ireland and part of Scotland. Its
>a mistake to impose modern borders on the tales.
That's exactly my mistake :) I've got to colour outside the lines now....and
all those years learning to stay in them gone to waste...
Cyn
The Pirate Queen
"Gearóid Mac Cuinneagáin" <Ger@r.d> wrote in message
> >>Don't think of her
> >>as Scottish though, for the people who created her didn't. At the
> >>time, they covered the territory of Ireland and part of Scotland. Its
> >>a mistake to impose modern borders on the tales.
> >
> >That's exactly my mistake :) I've got to colour outside the lines now....
>
> Its a regular hazard when you deal with Irish issues.
>
> >and
> >all those years learning to stay in them gone to waste...
>
> Never wasted. Besides, she mightn't have been Scottish at all. Alba
> might just be a euphemism for "somewhere far away". Or it might be a
> very archaic part of the Táin, when Alba meant the entire island. The
> Scathach might have been English.
oh hell and where was this enlightened attitude when I first said she was
Scottish and you declared she was an Ulsterwoman of course!!! ;-)
PQ
Shiny Boots of Leather
>very archaic part of the Táin, when Alba meant the entire island. The
>Scathach might have been English.
I'm quite fascinated by her- have been since my first run through of the Tain.
Namely her function as a sort of prophetess (the only woman in there that
doesn't seem to have some sort of premonitions is Medbh- she needs to have
someone else "tell her fortune").
Useful to have a different look at her.
Cyn
"What the hell *is* a gumby cat, anyhow?"
Howard Beale
Gearóid Mac Cuinneagáin <Ger@r.d> wrote in message
> Scríobh Howard Beale <b2AO6.34025$PF4....@news.iol.ie> :
>
> >> I understand he has been replaced by a Donegal woman, Mary Coughlan, a
FF
> >> representative for Donegal South-West
> >
> >
> >She was only elevated to help her position at the next election, when Pat
> >'idiot name' Gallagher is expected to return and sweep up. Not that
she'll be too
> >worried if she loses, Europe beckons.....
>
It's a bit daft don't you think? Anyhow, it's just my sense of humour, the
same as I refer to Mary as 'The Babe'.
>The Co-operative movement was a noble idea.
Indeed, but he's capitalising on it in an ignoble way.
BTW, I've no time for either of them, but I'd far rather have The Babe than
Gallagher. You never know, some of her father's decency might eventually rub
off on her.
Tony Cooper
> "What the hell *is* a gumby cat, anyhow?"
>
Dunno where I heard it, but I think it means an ordinary or alley cat.
Not a special breed of cat.
--
Tony Cooper aka: Tony_Co...@Yahoo.com
Provider of Jots & Tittles
Howard Beale
Gearóid Mac Cuinneagáin <Ger@r.d> wrote in message
> Scríobh Howard Beale <0lCO6.34088$PF4....@news.iol.ie> :
>
> >
> >Gearóid Mac Cuinneagáin <Ger@r.d> wrote in message
> >news:f7klgtc8hpdbg0hqb...@4ax.com...
> >> Scríobh Howard Beale <b2AO6.34025$PF4....@news.iol.ie> :
> >>
> >> >> I understand he has been replaced by a Donegal woman, Mary Coughlan,
a
> >FF
> >> >> representative for Donegal South-West
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >She was only elevated to help her position at the next election, when
Pat
> >> >'idiot name' Gallagher is expected to return and sweep up. Not that
> >she'll be too
> >> >worried if she loses, Europe beckons.....
> >>
> >> What have you got against his name?
> >
> >
> >It's a bit daft don't you think?
>
>
> >Anyhow, it's just my sense of humour, the
> >same as I refer to Mary as 'The Babe'.
>
>
> >>The Co-operative movement was a noble idea.
> >
> >Indeed, but he's capitalising on it in an ignoble way.
>
>
> >BTW, I've no time for either of them, but I'd far rather have The Babe
than
> >Gallagher. You never know, some of her father's decency might eventually
rub
> >off on her.
>
Yes.
Shiny Boots of Leather
>> "What the hell *is* a gumby cat, anyhow?"
>>
>Dunno where I heard it, but I think it means an ordinary or alley cat.
>Not a special breed of cat.
Oh, sorry...it's a sig file left over from when I was being a pretentious
student. T.S. Eliot and all.
Cyn
Howard Beale
Howard Beale <how...@REMOVEmad-as-hell.com> wrote in message news:...
Sorry, I didn't mean to be so abrupt, the painkillers are making my head a
bit fuzzy. What I meant to say, was: Yes, Cathal was a good friend.
Séimí mac Liam
Gearóid Mac Cuinneagáin <Ger@r.d> wrote in message
> Scríobh Clare <cjgqgtotodshfohr9...@4ax.com> :
>
> >What is your equivalent of 'minimum wage' these days?
>
> £4.40 per hour. About US$4.80
>
Is that by law or just the going rate for enrty level service workers?
Séimí mac Liam
Clare <iubh...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:f9fqgt8mdrsnf59ve...@4ax.com...
>
> I can chat with you on email about this if you'd like. :)
>
> Clare
I wrote you a big long e-mail and the damned computer locked up just
as I was signing my name. e-mail me if you want to talk by phone and
I'll tell you all about it.
Séimí mac Liam
> On Sat, 19 May 2001 20:36:43 GMT, Šonn Earraigh <e.@.c.h.u.i.s.c.e>
> wrote:
>
>
> > I know it's
> >difficult because you're more likely to be friends and have more in
common
> >with people from your own country, so the temptation to do Merkan
chat is
> >only natural.
>
> *Ptooey*. Almost sounds apologetic, and I'm not having any of
*that*,
> Donn. (My knee cartiledge is torn and I'm cranky). I'd prefer
> keeping my countrymen/women on the hook a bit longer, thanks. ;
>
> Clare (The tea, however, sounds like a good idea...)
I just want to know why if it is ok for Si to talk about his tits in
England, it's not ok to talk about my swallows in Oregon? Is it an
anti gay bias. Do the Irish have an anti gay bias? If I spit would
it then be ok?