"Black Babies" and Morality-Based Extortion
Tommy
professional beggars walking Irish streets telling us what miserable
scum we are if we do not turn over our money to some overseas charity?
In light of the recent scandals involving a high-profile Irish charity
is it time to rid our streets of this moral protection racket that is
essentially a confidence trick operated by the catholic clergy and other
knee-jerk speculators?
Why does the catholic church feel it has an obligation to force Irish
school children (against their will in most cases) to raise money for
third-world charities when we have loads of people in this country who
need help? Why must the catholic church turn Irish school children into
street beggars as part of their schooling? I for one am sick of people
like John O'Shea of GOAL at yet another Gala Celebrity Dinner at the
Berkeley Court telling us to fork-up. When was the last time John O'Shea
went into Fatima Mansion or Ballymun with a bag of money and a sob story
for the cameras?
Don't get me wrong I am just sick and tired as an Irish person being
told I have an obligation to help people in the third world. What
obligation? How many countries in the third world were ex-Irish colonies
that we bled dry? Why should we have to pay for the bullshit created by
the British, French, Belgians, Portuguese and Spanish? My dearest wish
is that these countries can be developed and turned into normal
societies. It kills me to see little children staving to death, but why
should I be made feel it is my fault by a member of a theocratic Empire
lavished with gold and riches? Where were the vatican during our Famine
in the last century?
I'll feel obliged to support the professional beggars on the streets of
this country when the Bank of Vatican City opens it books. Then we can
see who really see who is the miserable tight-fisted bastard.
--
tommy - kfuz...@tinet.ie
GoldenArse
>told I have an obligation to help people in the third world. What
>obligation? How many countries in the third world were ex-Irish colonies
>that we bled dry? Why should we have to pay for the bullshit created by
>the British, French, Belgians, Portuguese and Spanish? My dearest wish
>is that these countries can be developed and turned into normal
>societies. It kills me to see little children staving to death, but why
>should I be made feel it is my fault by a member of a theocratic Empire
>lavished with gold and riches? Where were the vatican during our Famine
>in the last century?
You have an obligation as a human being you selfish cunt. So you won't give
because Ireland wasn't helped in the famine? Maybe that's enough reason why you
*SHOULD* give. Give only the price of a pint. It won't break you.
GoldenArse
SCI Street Beggar
Niall McAuley
>Am I the only person in this country sick and tired of these
>professional beggars walking Irish streets telling us what miserable
>scum we are
I'm an ordinary Irish person, I'm not sick and tired of anything
at all, and I'm sick and tired of people suggesting that I am.
--
Niall [real address ends in se, not es]
Rose
I never thought I'd find myself agreeing with GoldenArse, but I do.
No, it's not your fault, but, if your dearest wish is that these
countries be developed, then don't complain if someone asks you to
help. Yes, these countries should be held primarily responsible.
Doesn't mean the rest of us can't pitch in.
--
Rose
*********************************************
See my webpage at: http://www.nd.edu/~jrose1/
*********************************************
mango...@my-dejanews.com
Charity begins at home...
Regards,
Dave
Email me at mor...@valinor.freeserve.co.uk
====================================================================
WWW:http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Alley/5885/index.html
(The Legions of the Black Moon - the unofficial Bal-Sagoth homepage)
-----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------
http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own
Sheela na Gig
wrote:
>Am I the only person in this country sick and tired of these
>professional beggars walking Irish streets telling us what miserable
>scum we are if we do not turn over our money to some overseas charity?
>In light of the recent scandals involving a high-profile Irish charity
>is it time to rid our streets of this moral protection racket that is
>essentially a confidence trick operated by the catholic clergy and other
>knee-jerk speculators?
I have supported a number of charities with either my time or money
but I always research them first. I understand what you mean; I used
to get accosted on a regular basis usually outside the ILAC center.
When I wouldn't cough up to complete strangers for unknown charities,
a couple of times they got downright rude and aggressive. I don't
think these people were scammers either (I can at least understand
extortion as a means of theft and/or begging) they were
representatives of some charity who thought I was a lying selfish
bitch because I didn't go for their pitch in the street. I thought
one guy was going to clock me one day.
_______________________________________________
Behind every great fortune lies a great crime.
Tommy
> I have supported a number of charities with either my time or money
> but I always research them first. I understand what you mean; I used
> to get accosted on a regular basis usually outside the ILAC center.
Both my wife give-up for local charities here in Sligo. I give money to
things like breast cancer groups, rape crises centres, worthwhile
idegious cultural and employment efforts. I use to give money to
Trocaire and GOAL but after that catholic priest made the statement on
RTE a while back about Irish people being "misers" and seeing endless
photo-ops of John O'Shea in tuxedos I said 'fuck it'. No more. I am not
going to be blackmailed with spritual or moral guilt.
tommy - kfuz...@tinet.ie
Robert Fahey
<She...@prehension.com> writes
>>Am I the only person in this country sick and tired of these
>>professional beggars walking Irish streets telling us what miserable
>>scum we are if we do not turn over our money to some overseas charity?
>>In light of the recent scandals involving a high-profile Irish charity
>>is it time to rid our streets of this moral protection racket that is
>>essentially a confidence trick operated by the catholic clergy and other
>>knee-jerk speculators?
>
>I have supported a number of charities with either my time or money
>but I always research them first. I understand what you mean; I used
>to get accosted on a regular basis usually outside the ILAC center.
>When I wouldn't cough up to complete strangers for unknown charities,
>a couple of times they got downright rude and aggressive. I don't
I've come across this as well... even when it wasn't just money but a
signature they wanted. I remember being accosted under the GPO pillars
by a young woman who wanted me to sign an anti-abortion petition, which
I refused to do... at which point she started into a personal attack on
me and told me that it was "people like me" who by our inactions led to
the deaths of innocent children, and informed me I was a murderer.
Charming.
Like yourself, I prefer to support a small number of charities that I've
checked out in advance... I supported the ISPCC for ages though (until
they started getting so damned liberal that it was pissing me off), so I
guess you can't always tell if you're doing the right thing.
I'm all for taking the collection boxes off the street, or at least
restricting the right to collect to charities who have applied well in
advance with a good reason (I don't object to the Cancer Society's
Daffodil Day, or the Concern/Trocaire 24 hour fasts, as it's only once a
year). And I'm certainly with Tommy on the issue of kids collecting. How
about prohibiting anyone under the age of 16 from collecting on the
street? I'd vote for it...
Mata ne!
Rob
--
Robert Fahey - rob...@iol.ie
SymbioSyS Software
IRC/Quake2/Web - 'Shinji-kun'
-Games Editor, dot-IE; .-----.
-Reviews Editor, G4 Magazine | <*> |
-Site Editor To-Be, Gamer OnLine '-----'
Current Listening: Castlevania X Soundtrack
Whitewolf
> > but I always research them first. I understand what you mean; I used
> > to get accosted on a regular basis usually outside the ILAC center.
>
> things like breast cancer groups, rape crises centres, worthwhile
> idegious cultural and employment efforts. I use to give money to
> Trocaire and GOAL but after that catholic priest made the statement on
> RTE a while back about Irish people being "misers" and seeing endless
> photo-ops of John O'Shea in tuxedos I said 'fuck it'. No more. I am not
> going to be blackmailed with spritual or moral guilt.
>
> tommy - kfuz...@tinet.ie
I think you are doing the damn right thing too - supporting local
charities, it's the only thing to do... I agreed with your other
post too about the church sending out boys and girls to collect
money for the third world.
Charity should begin and remain at home... As you pointed out Unki,
we owe them nothing, we never created the situation, we should not
feel guilt for it's existance... Let the nations who created the
problem deal with it...
Regards to you Unki and nice to see you back on the newsgroup
again!!!
Ray
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~--------------
"When the facts change, I change my mind. What do you do?"
--Economist, John Maynard Keynes.
Please direct email to: ra...@iol.ie
Homepage: http://www.geocities.com/capitolhill/7652
~~~~~~-~~~~~~~~~~~----~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gearóid Mac Cuinneagáin
>Charity should begin and remain at home... As you pointed out Unki,
>we owe them nothing, we never created the situation, we should not
>feel guilt for it's existance...
Ray, go now, and read again your own website & what you've written
about British attitudes to famine in Ireland...
--
An Cuinneagánach
abardubh at wwa dot com
Read the Damn FAQ at http://www.muc.de/~cpm/irish-faq
Whitewolf
>
> Whitewolf wrote:
>
> >Charity should begin and remain at home... As you pointed out Unki,
> >we owe them nothing, we never created the situation, we should not
> >feel guilt for it's existance...
>
> Ray, go now, and read again your own website & what you've written
> about British attitudes to famine in Ireland...
That wasn't a famine, that was genocide, it is depicted as a famine
to placate the brits, but their removal of food and all the other
things they did made it genocidal, the famine was their opertunity
to try and destroy us... they failed, but not for the want of
trying...
Irish people should support Irish charities first... and then
consider other outside charities... if you feel the need to..
Whitewolf
>
> Whitewolf <lsch...@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
>
> > I think you are doing the damn right thing too - supporting local
> > charities, it's the only thing to do...
>
> you give locally you see the fruits of your donation. Mind-you the local
> Clerical groupie came to the front door a few months back and handed me
> a box of envelops and told me it "was for the church collection". She
> did not ask if I would "like to give" or anything like that. I was just
> handed the box and it was assumed I would give cash with no questions
> asked to some arsehole who could be shagging his housekeep or alterboys.
> I handed back the box and told her very nicely neither my wife or I are
> catholics. The old Biddy did not say "Oh no problem!" She just got into
> her car and said nothing not even "bye, bye" or anything like that. She
> was so rude.
Yeah... I agree with you... When I was younger, our local Catholic
church
decided to try the same stunt, giving out envelopes for a years supply
of money... so they handed them out from door to door (so I guess, even
if you didn't go to the church you couldn't escape), like yourself, we
refused the box of enevelopes on the grounds that we'd no idea what
or where the money might go... we have better things to do with our
money then supply the priest with a new house and car (that's what
he got)... So you are right, pick a local charity, but look into
them too to make sure they are not ripping you off or exploiting
some group to make profits for themselves...
>
> > I agreed with your other
> > post too about the church sending out boys and girls to collect
> > money for the third world.
>
> Yes it is humiliating and depressing for the kids. It is almost like the
> church is telling them that begging is normal and you should use moral
> guilt to get money off people. It is all very wrong. There was a letter
> in the Evening Herald last year from a Spanish gentleman living in Cork
> who said that he stopped going to mass in Ireland because he could not
> deal with the endless barrage of collectors and other speculators
> outside his local church on Sunday's. He made a very good point about
> the deliberate tactic of using the church grounds as a 'moral trap'
> making people feel obliged to hand over some cash.
If you ask the kids about what the collection is for, and what benefit
it might have, they (in my experience) have only a slight clue, mostly
they claim they were just given the box and told fill it... As for
begging outside the church, yeah, that should be stopped, it is
blackmail... Remember a few years ago when they told politicians
and their workers to stay away from polling boots, the same should
be done with the begging outside the church...
>
> > Charity should begin and remain at home... As you pointed out Unki,
> > we owe them nothing, we never created the situation, we should not
> > feel guilt for it's existance... Let the nations who created the
> > problem deal with it...
>
> However, I think we should support the efforts to write-off the
> Third-World debt which is currently gaining momentum. This way everybody
> wins and the under-developed world get a fair chance.
Absolutely! It should be done...
>
> > Regards to you Unki and nice to see you back on the newsgroup
> > again!!!
>
> Thanks Ray, but it's only via crossposting.
Welcome, but why only through crossposting, can't you get SCI
or is there some other reason?
>
> --
> tommy - kfuz...@tinet.ie
Regards,
Whitewolf
>
> Whitewolf wrote:
>
> >Gearóid Mac Cuinneagáin wrote:
> >>
> >> Whitewolf wrote:
> >>
> >> >we owe them nothing, we never created the situation, we should not
> >> >feel guilt for it's existance...
> >>
> >> about British attitudes to famine in Ireland...
> >
> >That wasn't a famine, that was genocide, it is depicted as a famine
> >to placate the brits, but their removal of food and all the other
> >things they did made it genocidal, the famine was their opertunity
> >to try and destroy us... they failed, but not for the want of
> >trying...
>
> should begin at home, the Irish should help themselves, England owed
> Ireland nothing because the Irish created the situation themselves by
> over-reliance on one crop, etc etc
That's not entirely the situation though, Then English were responsible
for Ireland at the time, responsible for the law and order, and for the
people... England shirked it's responsibility at best, and exploited it
to try and destroy the Irish at worst...
Since most overseas charity are for African nations that were owned by
other European countries at one time or another, I feel *they* if
anybody should be responsible for giving aid to try and ensure that
starving kids are fed, etc...
>
> >Irish people should support Irish charities first... and then
> >consider other outside charities... if you feel the need to..
>
> I'm sure the Times would have agreed WRT British funding of famine
> relief in Ireland.
Britain were responsible for Ireland at that time, they bore a
moral responsiblity for the people, if not a legal one too, and
they shirked it, probably out of hatred for the Irish, or as
an attempt to try and quell any movement towards independance...
Tommy
> Welcome, but why only through crossposting, can't you get SCI
> or is there some other reason?
I am very shallow and am the usenet version of club-hopper. I just hang
out at a place until everybody has bought me drinks and then I move on
to the next joint. I can't help it - all happened in London during the
swinging 60's when I spent most of my life in the clubs around Mayfair
and spent many evenings with my good friends like Glenda Jackson,
Michael Caine and Sian Phillips. Have you ever rolled over after a night
of drinking 200 vodka and lemons only to see Cilla Black on the pillow
next to you! Unfortunately unlike Keith Richard's I can still remember
the 60's.
Well after Harold McMillan' Labour Government came in with his "you
never had it so good" deal and forced us to hand over most of our moola,
well then I had to leave. I was siting in Stringfellows with Vidal
Sasoon and I was in a terrible state as Ronnie and Reg got sent to
Wormwood Scubs. I said "Vidal me ol China, wot you say we head off to
meet some of them California Dolly Birds?" He said "alright" and we
hopped on the next BOAC flight to LA. This was the time all the British
celebs left for America. Siting in seats on either side of me was Oliver
Reed and David Frost who like me, were both clutching large bags of
gold.
So the plane touch down at LA International and the heat was crap. This
little Polish fella with a massive bulge in his trousers came over and
said "Hello" Impressed by the sheer volume of blood circulating in and
around his throbbing member, I handed him my baggage and said get me a
Taxi and he replied "I'm am sorry comrade, I am famous Hollywood
director Roman Polanski do you want to be in my movie?" Naturally I had
no interest in being in this self-indulgent shit until he introduced me
to his wife Sharon Tate.
"Fuck me" I though to myself perhaps this Hollywood place has some
benefits. So Mr Polanski's and his wife drove me to their Beverly Hills
home. I sat in the back seat with her. All the while she kept rubbing my
leg and said how she was looking forward to getting to know me better.
Things were looking up and here I was thinking to myself "This America
place is weird but on the plus side I am going to get my hole tonight
off some delicious blond".
After we made it to the Polanski Pad, I did not think much of her mates
who were all wankers. Anyway, I got pissed-off and went for a walk down
Rodeo Drive. On the way out of the house I met this gang of hippies who
apart from having nazi symbols on their heads and smelling of dog shit
seem fairly normal. I even obliged one of them and lit his pot cigarette
with my Ronson lighter that still had Cilla's pubic hairs on it.
With my huge flared trousers flapping in the southern Californian air, I
made my way past all the movie star houses. I decided on the gaff I was
going live in and then I bought some cocaine and sniffed between the
legs of some smelly prostitute with a huge Afro just for the
cross-cultural experience. After a while I got pissed off again, and
when back to Polanski's gaff in "the Hills" and lo-and-behold some cunt
went and killed half the fuckers in the house including the bird I was
intending to shag! "Ah bollox I though to myself this is terrible, I
really fancied the idea of getting the leg over yer wan and now the
silly cow has gone and got herself killed".
Well Ray that was how I got to America but for the life of me I still
have no fucking how in the name of Jaysus I ended-up living in Sligo! I
am not expecting a 6 page spread in Hello Magazine these days.
--
tommy - kfuz...@tinet.ie
Tommy
> Since most overseas charity are for African nations that were owned by
> other European countries at one time or another, I feel *they* if
> anybody should be responsible for giving aid to try and ensure that
> starving kids are fed, etc...
I agree with most of this statement. But it is mostly banks and other
finalcial corporation keeping the misery gong.
>
> Britain were responsible for Ireland at that time, they bore a
> moral responsiblity for the people, if not a legal one too, and
> they shirked it, probably out of hatred for the Irish, or as
> an attempt to try and quell any movement towards independance...
I disagree Ray. The British food convonys orgnised and financed by the
House of Commons in the wake of the initial blight were turned back at
Cork Harbour because of objections from Irish Famers who felt the influx
of free gain would cut into the profits.
Also the largest amount of money raised for the poor in Ireland between
1946-48 was raised by English mill workers in Lancashire and Yorkshire
who were well aware of the suffering in Ireland because they themselves
were just as opressed by the Bririth Empire as the poor in Ireland at
the time. Blaming the English for the famine is like blaming the Eskimos
for the Titanic.
Look behind every history of war, famine, and human misery and you will
find bankers and capitalists pulling the strings. It still happens to
this day. (i.e; Iraq, East Timor and on and on and on)
--
tommy - kfuz...@tinet.ie
Tommy
> > >That's not entirely the situation though, Then English were responsible
> > >for Ireland at the time, responsible for the law and order, and for the
> > >people... England shirked it's responsibility at best, and exploited it
> > >to try and destroy the Irish at worst...
Ray I have a link to a the Loaded site on my own page with a picture of
Liz Hurley topless. Try looking at that instead.
I also have a link to a Sid the Sexist screen saver.
--
tommy - kfuz...@tinet.ie
Tommy
> Actions like that win them about as much support as picketing the court
> where that 13-year old was applying for permission for an abortion last
> year. I don't think I've ever been so disgusted at a group like that...
> IMO, religious Nazis are worse than the racist ones...
That's because the Nazi's were a religion themselves in many ways. The
SS even had it own church. Bottom line: as soon as they start making
their own uniforms your're generally fucked.
> In most cases, yes. I figure once you're over 16 its your own choice...
> I know that I collected on the streets for Concern when I was 16, of my
> own free will - myself and a few friends decided to do the 24-hour fast
> on the street, worst thing being that it snowed. I haven't often had a
> tougher 24 hours since, but it certainly gave me a great sense of
> achievement (and a rotten cold to boot).
I used to break the seal and buy sweets and comics with money.
--
tommy - kfuz...@tinet.ie
Tommy
> In article <36d55dd6...@news.newsguy.com>, Gearóid Mac Cuinneagáin
> <Ger@r.d> writes
>
> >Whatever. Point is, it happened because they believed that charity
> >should begin at home, the Irish should help themselves, England owed
> >Ireland nothing because the Irish created the situation themselves by
> >over-reliance on one crop, etc etc
>
> I think you'll find that our over-reliance on one crop was mainly
> because all the other crops were being exported by the English.
Really? I just thought Irish farmers were shit at growing stuff.
--
tommy - kfuz...@tinet.ie
Tommy
> Hello, my name is Tommy and I amm an s.c.i. addict....
>
> Sweeney
Hello my name is Sweeney and I am a Tommy addict.
--
tommy - kfuz...@tinet.ie
Tommy
> I've come across this as well... even when it wasn't just money but a
> signature they wanted. I remember being accosted under the GPO pillars
> by a young woman who wanted me to sign an anti-abortion petition, which
> I refused to do... at which point she started into a personal attack on
> me and told me that it was "people like me" who by our inactions led to
> the deaths of innocent children, and informed me I was a murderer.
> Charming.
During the early 1980's a young woman from the anti-abortion crowd came
up to me in Westmoreland Street and asked me for support. I politely
said "no" and she came back with "see where that gets you on Judgement
Day!" I turned around and told her to "fuck off" and she came back with
"Jesus loves you even though you hate him"
> And I'm certainly with Tommy on the issue of kids collecting. How
> about prohibiting anyone under the age of 16 from collecting on the
> street? I'd vote for it...
Yes the kids are being blackmailed and exploited.
I think the efforts to cancel Third-World debt is an excellent idea. If
will give the developing world it's dignity back and allow them escape
the paralysis of poverty and stagnation. Sadly I do not expect this to
happen.
--
tommy - kfuz...@tinet.ie
Tommy
> I think you are doing the damn right thing too - supporting local
> charities, it's the only thing to do...
Well I need to know that the people whom I give it to - get it and when
you give locally you see the fruits of your donation. Mind-you the local
Clerical groupie came to the front door a few months back and handed me
a box of envelops and told me it "was for the church collection". She
did not ask if I would "like to give" or anything like that. I was just
handed the box and it was assumed I would give cash with no questions
asked to some arsehole who could be shagging his housekeep or alterboys.
I handed back the box and told her very nicely neither my wife or I are
catholics. The old Biddy did not say "Oh no problem!" She just got into
her car and said nothing not even "bye, bye" or anything like that. She
was so rude.
> I agreed with your other
> post too about the church sending out boys and girls to collect
> money for the third world.
Yes it is humiliating and depressing for the kids. It is almost like the
church is telling them that begging is normal and you should use moral
guilt to get money off people. It is all very wrong. There was a letter
in the Evening Herald last year from a Spanish gentleman living in Cork
who said that he stopped going to mass in Ireland because he could not
deal with the endless barrage of collectors and other speculators
outside his local church on Sunday's. He made a very good point about
the deliberate tactic of using the church grounds as a 'moral trap'
making people feel obliged to hand over some cash.
> Charity should begin and remain at home... As you pointed out Unki,
> we owe them nothing, we never created the situation, we should not
> feel guilt for it's existance... Let the nations who created the
> problem deal with it...
However, I think we should support the efforts to write-off the
Third-World debt which is currently gaining momentum. This way everybody
wins and the under-developed world get a fair chance.
> Regards to you Unki and nice to see you back on the newsgroup
> again!!!
Thanks Ray, but it's only via crossposting.
--
tommy - kfuz...@tinet.ie
Gearóid Mac Cuinneagáin
>Gearóid Mac Cuinneagáin wrote:
>>
>> Whitewolf wrote:
>>
>> >Charity should begin and remain at home... As you pointed out Unki,
>> >we owe them nothing, we never created the situation, we should not
>> >feel guilt for it's existance...
>>
>> Ray, go now, and read again your own website & what you've written
>> about British attitudes to famine in Ireland...
>
>That wasn't a famine, that was genocide, it is depicted as a famine
>to placate the brits, but their removal of food and all the other
>things they did made it genocidal, the famine was their opertunity
>to try and destroy us... they failed, but not for the want of
>trying...
Whatever. Point is, it happened because they believed that charity
should begin at home, the Irish should help themselves, England owed
Ireland nothing because the Irish created the situation themselves by
over-reliance on one crop, etc etc
>Irish people should support Irish charities first... and then
>consider other outside charities... if you feel the need to..
I'm sure the Times would have agreed WRT British funding of famine
relief in Ireland.
--
Gearóid Mac Cuinneagáin
>Gearóid Mac Cuinneagáin wrote:
>> Whatever. Point is, it happened because they believed that charity
>> should begin at home, the Irish should help themselves, England owed
>> Ireland nothing because the Irish created the situation themselves by
>> over-reliance on one crop, etc etc
>
>That's not entirely the situation though, Then English were responsible
>for Ireland at the time, responsible for the law and order, and for the
>people... England shirked it's responsibility at best, and exploited it
>to try and destroy the Irish at worst...
And then used exactly the same line I've seen in this thread to
justify inaction.
>Since most overseas charity are for African nations that were owned by
>other European countries at one time or another, I feel *they* if
>anybody should be responsible for giving aid to try and ensure that
>starving kids are fed, etc...
*We* were part of one of those colonizers at the time. Irish soldiers
helped keep the Union flag flying around the world, Irish speculators
invested in those colonies...
>> >Irish people should support Irish charities first... and then
>> >consider other outside charities... if you feel the need to..
>>
>> I'm sure the Times would have agreed WRT British funding of famine
>> relief in Ireland.
>
>Britain were responsible for Ireland at that time, they bore a
>moral responsiblity for the people, if not a legal one too, and
>they shirked it, probably out of hatred for the Irish, or as
>an attempt to try and quell any movement towards independance...
And as a resident of one of the richer nations on Earth, you don't
have a moral responsibility to those in poorer nations?
Bren
> Charity should begin and remain at home... As you pointed out Unki,
> we owe them nothing, we never created the situation, we should not
> feel guilt for it's existance... Let the nations who created the
> problem deal with it...
Then Whitewolf wrote:
> Irish people should support Irish charities first... and then
> consider other outside charities... if you feel the need to..
There is a discrepancy here Ray, either it remains at home or it
doesn't.
Of course we should help them. Should a doctor refuse to treat
a patient on the grounds that he wasn't the one who beat him
up in the first place?
bren
Robert Fahey
<kfuz...@SPAMJAMtinet.ie> writes
>Robert Fahey <rob...@iol.ie> wrote:
>
>> I've come across this as well... even when it wasn't just money but a
>> signature they wanted. I remember being accosted under the GPO pillars
>> by a young woman who wanted me to sign an anti-abortion petition, which
>> I refused to do... at which point she started into a personal attack on
>> me and told me that it was "people like me" who by our inactions led to
>> the deaths of innocent children, and informed me I was a murderer.
>> Charming.
>
>During the early 1980's a young woman from the anti-abortion crowd came
>up to me in Westmoreland Street and asked me for support. I politely
>said "no" and she came back with "see where that gets you on Judgement
>Day!" I turned around and told her to "fuck off" and she came back with
>"Jesus loves you even though you hate him"
Actions like that win them about as much support as picketing the court
where that 13-year old was applying for permission for an abortion last
year. I don't think I've ever been so disgusted at a group like that...
IMO, religious Nazis are worse than the racist ones...
>> And I'm certainly with Tommy on the issue of kids collecting. How
>> about prohibiting anyone under the age of 16 from collecting on the
>> street? I'd vote for it...
>
>Yes the kids are being blackmailed and exploited.
In most cases, yes. I figure once you're over 16 its your own choice...
I know that I collected on the streets for Concern when I was 16, of my
own free will - myself and a few friends decided to do the 24-hour fast
on the street, worst thing being that it snowed. I haven't often had a
tougher 24 hours since, but it certainly gave me a great sense of
achievement (and a rotten cold to boot).
If I had been forced into doing it, I would have resented it. And if I
had been any younger, I wouldn't have understood properly why I was
doing it.
Mata ne!
Rob
--
Robert Fahey - rob...@iol.ie
SymbioSyS Software
IRC/Quake2/Web - 'Shinji-kun'
-Games Editor, dot-IE; .-----.
-Reviews Editor, G4 Magazine | <*> |
-Site Editor To-Be, Gamer OnLine '-----'
Current Listening: Castlevania X Soundtrack
Robert Fahey
<Ger@r.d> writes
>Whatever. Point is, it happened because they believed that charity
>should begin at home, the Irish should help themselves, England owed
>Ireland nothing because the Irish created the situation themselves by
>over-reliance on one crop, etc etc
I think you'll find that our over-reliance on one crop was mainly
because all the other crops were being exported by the English.
Mata ne!
Gearóid Mac Cuinneagáin
>In article <36d55dd6...@news.newsguy.com>, Gearóid Mac Cuinneagáin
><Ger@r.d> writes
>
>>Whatever. Point is, it happened because they believed that charity
>>should begin at home, the Irish should help themselves, England owed
>>Ireland nothing because the Irish created the situation themselves by
>>over-reliance on one crop, etc etc
>
>I think you'll find that our over-reliance on one crop was mainly
>because all the other crops were being exported by the English.
Did I suggest otherwise?
Fergus O'Rourke
(snip)
>I think the efforts to cancel Third-World debt is an excellent idea. If
>will give the developing world it's dignity back
"You're so useless and stupid that we'll let you off what you freely agreed
to pay"
Some dignity!
Whitewolf
>
> First Whitewolf wrote:
>
> > Charity should begin and remain at home... As you pointed out Unki,
> > we owe them nothing, we never created the situation, we should not
> > feel guilt for it's existance... Let the nations who created the
> > problem deal with it...
>
> Then Whitewolf wrote:
>
> > Irish people should support Irish charities first... and then
> > consider other outside charities... if you feel the need to..
>
> There is a discrepancy here Ray, either it remains at home or it
> doesn't.
First I was speaking about official state overseas aid, which
should be cut. - to offset the loss, like Tommy (unki) I'd
like to see the money these nations owe in loans wiped clean.
> Of course we should help them. Should a doctor refuse to treat
> a patient on the grounds that he wasn't the one who beat him
> up in the first place?
Apples and oranges.
Whitewolf
>
> Whitewolf <lsch...@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
>
> > Welcome, but why only through crossposting, can't you get SCI
> > or is there some other reason?
>
> I am very shallow and am the usenet version of club-hopper.
Snip - extremely funny history.. I loved this!!!! :-) :-) :-)
You are anything but shallow my friend!!!
> Well Ray that was how I got to America but for the life of me I still
> have no fucking how in the name of Jaysus I ended-up living in Sligo! I
> am not expecting a 6 page spread in Hello Magazine these days.
Well, I hope you are enjoying your time in Sligo, I guess you are...
Thanks to INS rules, I can't still go home for another 15 months,
so no holiday home for me this year... Enjoy your time in Ireland,
you'll find no better place!
Whitewolf
>
> Whitewolf wrote:
>
> >Gearóid Mac Cuinneagáin wrote:
>
> >> should begin at home, the Irish should help themselves, England owed
> >> Ireland nothing because the Irish created the situation themselves by
> >> over-reliance on one crop, etc etc
> >
> >for Ireland at the time, responsible for the law and order, and for the
> >people... England shirked it's responsibility at best, and exploited it
> >to try and destroy the Irish at worst...
>
> And then used exactly the same line I've seen in this thread to
> justify inaction.
But Britain had a moral (if not legal, which they probably had too) to
intervene in the "famine" since they were responsible for the deaths
of millions of Irish by taking away our own food supplies... Irish
people didn't die for want of food, but because the food that we
had was taken away... I've got a lot about this on my webpage.
>
> >Since most overseas charity are for African nations that were owned by
> >other European countries at one time or another, I feel *they* if
> >anybody should be responsible for giving aid to try and ensure that
> >starving kids are fed, etc...
>
> *We* were part of one of those colonizers at the time. Irish soldiers
> helped keep the Union flag flying around the world, Irish speculators
> invested in those colonies...
Ireland as a nation didn't invade African nations, individual soldiers
may have fought under the Union flag, but that's another issue...
The speculators may well have invested, but that's not the Irish
people in general, just some individuals.
>
> >> >Irish people should support Irish charities first... and then
> >> >consider other outside charities... if you feel the need to..
> >>
> >> I'm sure the Times would have agreed WRT British funding of famine
> >> relief in Ireland.
> >
> >Britain were responsible for Ireland at that time, they bore a
> >moral responsiblity for the people, if not a legal one too, and
> >they shirked it, probably out of hatred for the Irish, or as
> >an attempt to try and quell any movement towards independance...
>
> And as a resident of one of the richer nations on Earth, you don't
> have a moral responsibility to those in poorer nations?
I'm in America, but still Irish... What America does for foreign
aid doesn't concern me yet... I can't vote, can't work here, and
don't feel that until I can that I have any right to try and
criticise the US foreign aid policy... I'm only here a few months
I lived in Ireland all before that, and I still feel I have a
right to talk about that country unless I renounced my citizenship.
Whitewolf
> > other European countries at one time or another, I feel *they* if
> > anybody should be responsible for giving aid to try and ensure that
> > starving kids are fed, etc...
>
> finalcial corporation keeping the misery gong.
>
> >
> > moral responsiblity for the people, if not a legal one too, and
> > they shirked it, probably out of hatred for the Irish, or as
> > an attempt to try and quell any movement towards independance...
>
> House of Commons in the wake of the initial blight were turned back at
> Cork Harbour because of objections from Irish Famers who felt the influx
> of free gain would cut into the profits.
I don't know if you already did, but have a look at my webpage, where
I describe the "famine" as the "Irish Holocaust", I've got information
about food removal ships, and political thought by British at the
time...
The overall thing is that the blight hit more then Ireland, but only
Ireland had millions die, and only Ireland was under the rule of
the British at the time, who were removing our food, either in
a planned hope of cutting our numbers down, or out of racial
hatred towards the Irish...
>
> Also the largest amount of money raised for the poor in Ireland between
> 1946-48 was raised by English mill workers in Lancashire and Yorkshire
> who were well aware of the suffering in Ireland because they themselves
> were just as opressed by the Bririth Empire as the poor in Ireland at
> the time. Blaming the English for the famine is like blaming the Eskimos
> for the Titanic.
I didn't hear about the mill workers before, and I'm sure you are right,
but overall the policy of the British was to try and kill us off, or
at least cut back our numbers - making it easier for them to control
and less chance of rebellion etc...
>
> Look behind every history of war, famine, and human misery and you will
> find bankers and capitalists pulling the strings. It still happens to
> this day. (i.e; Iraq, East Timor and on and on and on)
Not all wars though, some are fought for racial/political reasons.
BTW, what newsgroup is su.org.irish?
Sweeney the Wanderer
>
> Sheela na Gig <She...@prehension.com> wrote:
>
> > I have supported a number of charities with either my time or money
> > but I always research them first. I understand what you mean; I used
> > to get accosted on a regular basis usually outside the ILAC center.
>
> Both my wife give-up for local charities here in Sligo. I give money to
> things like breast cancer groups, rape crises centres, worthwhile
> idegious cultural and employment efforts. I use to give money to
> Trocaire and GOAL but after that catholic priest made the statement on
> RTE a while back about Irish people being "misers" and seeing endless
> photo-ops of John O'Shea in tuxedos I said 'fuck it'. No more. I am not
> going to be blackmailed with spritual or moral guilt.
So you are letting the blather of some priest control your actions?
You're still hooked, Sheridan; they still own you.
Sweeney
Sweeney the Wanderer
> > Regards to you Unki and nice to see you back on the newsgroup
> > again!!!
>
> Thanks Ray, but it's only via crossposting.
Hello, my name is Tommy and I amm an s.c.i. addict....
Sweeney
Christian Murphy
Tommy <kfuz...@SPAMJAMtinet.ie> wrote:
>Whitewolf <lsch...@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
>
>
>Look behind every history of war, famine, and human misery and you will
>find bankers and capitalists pulling the strings. It still happens to
>this day. (i.e; Iraq, East Timor and on and on and on)
Indeed. They also sponsor several of the more inflammable individuals
on soc.culture.irish. Next time you see one, just think, this flame
is brought to you by the AIB and the Chamber of Commerce.
Regards,
-christian
Robert Fahey
<Ger@r.d> writes
>Robert Fahey wrote:
>
>>In article <36d55dd6...@news.newsguy.com>, Gearóid Mac Cuinneagáin
>><Ger@r.d> writes
>>
>>>should begin at home, the Irish should help themselves, England owed
>>>Ireland nothing because the Irish created the situation themselves by
>>>over-reliance on one crop, etc etc
>>
>>because all the other crops were being exported by the English.
>
>Did I suggest otherwise?
On rereading your post, I realise that you were saying that this was the
opinion held by the English at the time (at least I *think* that's what
you're saying)... Apologies, I was misreading you there.
Gearóid Mac Cuinneagáin
>I also have a link to a Sid the Sexist screen saver.
Where?
Whitewolf
> > > >for Ireland at the time, responsible for the law and order, and for the
> > > >people... England shirked it's responsibility at best, and exploited it
> > > >to try and destroy the Irish at worst...
>
> Liz Hurley topless. Try looking at that instead.
Naw, I don't find anything interesting about her...
>
> I also have a link to a Sid the Sexist screen saver.
I might have a look at that... you read VIZ?
Tommy
> Well, I hope you are enjoying your time in Sligo, I guess you are...
> Thanks to INS rules, I can't still go home for another 15 months,
> so no holiday home for me this year... Enjoy your time in Ireland,
> you'll find no better place!
I heard Dustin say that on the TV today in fact. "Deres nah beter place
on urt dan Urland!" and then he said something about Fianna Fail. Show
me another coutry where a children's puppet rips apart political and
entertainment figures on the TV everyday and get's away with it.
other than Charlie Rose on PBS in America that is. (I wonder whose fist
is up his arse?)
--
tommy - kfuz...@tinet.ie
Brendan Heading
<calla...@tinet.ie> writes
>"You're so useless and stupid that we'll let you off what you freely agreed
>to pay"
"Freely" ? They had bugger all choice in the matter.
--
Brendan Heading, Belfast, Northern Ireland
ICQ # 24010538
Is fearr Gaelige bhriste, ná Béarla cliste.
Tommy
> Tommy wrote in message <1999021722...@p22.sligo1.tinet.ie>...
> >Sweeney the Wanderer <ban...@hotnail.com> wrote:
> >
> >> Hello, my name is Tommy and I amm an s.c.i. addict....
> >>
> >> Sweeney
> >
> >Hello my name is Sweeney and I am a Tommy addict.
> >
> Hello, my name is Conway and I am a Tommyknocker.
Hello my name is Tommy and there is a fairly good chance I'll be
shagging your wife someday.
--
tommy - kfuz...@tinet.ie
Tommy
> Tommy wrote:
> >
> > I also have a link to a Sid the Sexist screen saver.
>
> I might have a look at that... you read VIZ?
Did you see this months issue with the baby hitler doll? I must have
laughed for a hour straight!
Anybody else seen it? Quirkey, Chris?
--
tommy - kfuz...@tinet.ie
Tommy
> Tommy wrote:
> >
> > Whitewolf <lsch...@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
> >
> > > Welcome, but why only through crossposting, can't you get SCI
> > > or is there some other reason?
> >
> > I am very shallow and am the usenet version of club-hopper.
>
> Snip - extremely funny history.. I loved this!!!! :-) :-) :-)
>
> You are anything but shallow my friend!!!
And Jaysus Ray it didn't end there either oh no! As soon as I was
cleared of the murder of those eejits who names I have already forgotten
I took a Greyhound bus from LA up to San Francisco. On the way to the
place I had to get a liver transplant in Monterey and I met this
metaphysical New Age slapper who could tell the future by measuring the
bowl movements of Scorpions. I am not talking about actual Scorpions
here Ray. What I am referring to is the bowl movement of the German
heavy metal band The Scorpions. She was a mad bitch and the last thing I
remember was robbing her gas meter.
Well anyway, I eventually made if to San Francisco a few months later
and with my huge flared trousers flapping in the breeze, I went down to
the Haight-Ashbury to score some heroin. Christ it was a nightmare! All
these horrible hippies making shite music. I thought there were all
tossers until I saw the kind of money you could make you could make from
this "Hard Rock" shite.
So I formed a band called The Ambiguous Snails and we had a record deal
in two weeks. This was the golden age of Arena Rock and I was the
frontman of the biggest hard rock group on earth. We had it all;
groupies, booze and drugs and all the trappings of success. The rock
culture of the time was pure excess with money being no problem. I
didn't give a shit and wasted millions durng this period. I use to hire
a 747 Jumbo Jet just to fly my herpes scab from gig to gig. It was some
ride until legal problems destroyed the 'Snails'. Then it all fell apart
so quickly.
The in-fighting in the group was terrible and I was arrested for
statutory rape of 16 year old fan in Ann Arbor. Which was bollox because
she was 14 at the time. Then some kid in Ohio killed his whole family
and claimed it was inspired by a message in a song from our 1972 album
Drippin' Hot Pussy. In retrospect, I really should have not recorded a
song called 'Kill You Mother and Father Now and Eat Their Brains'. Bad
move! But the whole affair was a farce and the record company dumped us.
Suddenly I had no band, no record deal, no liver and over $450 million
in debt. Things were looking band and I sunk into the dark depths of
human misery. I think it was about the time I tried to get high by
snorting the telephone book that I knew I was fucked.
But that was all to change when I met my 18th wife while on trail for
soliciting her on the docks in Oakland. She was a great pillar of
strenght to me mannnnnnnnnn. She made me believe in myself again
mannnnnnnnnn. So the week following my prison release we went into
Electric Blanket studios in Eureka and I recorded what was to be the
consumate solo album of the 1970's; If You Tolerate This, Then The
Second Album Will Be Next. It was a smash hit and my hardcore audience
came out in their millions to fill stadiums across the USA and Canada.
This led to my groundbreaking double-live album Sheridan Comes
Frequently and the world was my oyster again.
Then punk happen and you should consult the Salvation Army/St. Vincent
DePaul files if you want to know the rest.
--
tommy - kfuz...@tinet.ie
Tommy
> Madra Dubh wrote:
> > Hello, my name is Conway and I am a Tommyknocker.
>
> ROTFL! I've occasionally wanted to knock Tommy, but I'd have to start
> reading all of his posts. I long ago came to the conclusion that he's
> Huntbach's alter-ego.
SCI must be really gone to shit! Is this par for the course these days?
--
tommy - kfuz...@tinet.ie
Tommy
> Tommy wrote:
> Snip - This was brilliant!!! When I read yesterdays (part1) I sent
> a copy to Lee, I know she'll get a great laugh from it too, and now
> you follow up with this... amazingly funny stuff! I say fuck your
> critics, when you shine, you shine bright!! Reading your replies
> to me has been a breath of fresh air to my jaded eyes, you should
> come to SCI officially again, it needs you...
That's up the tinet lowering their prices. Thanks Ray give Lee my
regards for me.
> > Then punk happen and you should consult the Salvation Army/St. Vincent
> > DePaul files if you want to know the rest.
>
> Awe, come on, finish the story, don't let me hang in limbo....
oh wait until I get to the part where I enter the Preisthood. You think
the sex, drink and drugs from the 60's and 70's was bad!
--
tommy - kfuz...@tinet.ie
Tommy
> You still haven't figured it out, have you? You unimaginative little
> squawker.
Christ Sweeney, whatever the fuck you do don't take any more cases on a
'No Win, No Fee' basis.
> Sweeney, the Greatest Confrontational Ironist of Them All
then iron my trousers.
--
tommy - kfuz...@tinet.ie
Tommy
> Tommy wrote:
> > SCI must be really gone to shit! Is this par for the course these days?
>
> Without you here to guide us...
*sob* You are free now and *sob*, you must go and make your own way
*sob*.
born free.......
--
tommy - kfuz...@tinet.ie
Tommy
> Tommy wrote:
> >
> Hah! Southern woman have much higher standards than the slappers you
> knew in New York did.
>
> Sweeney
Exhibit A: Bill Clinton's sex life
I rest my case
--
tommy - kfuz...@tinet.ie
Tommy
> Robert Fahey wrote:
>
> >>Really? I just thought Irish farmers were shit at growing stuff.
> >
> >Well, they are now. Surprisingly good at getting money for being shit at
> >growing stuff, though.
>
> These days they're as likely to get money for not growing shit.
Some deal! I have a little weed-ridden field filled with barrels of
chemicals and the rusted remains of a Morris Minor.
Where the fuck is my cheque?
--
tommy - kfuz...@tinet.ie
Tommy
> Tommy wrote:
>
> >I also have a link to a Sid the Sexist screen saver.
>
> Where?
Is Viz this month they claim to have a Sid-the-Sexist and Fat Slags
screensavers that you can download from their site.
--
tommy - kfuz...@tinet.ie
Tommy
> I long ago came to the conclusion that he's
> Huntbach's alter-ego.
Low blow. Now that hurt me.
--
tommy - kfuz...@tinet.ie
Tommy
>
> Ireland was part of the UK. The UK was a colonial power.
Is this some part of some sinister plan by Ger to make all of Ireland
feel collectively guilty for Daniel O'Donnell?
--
tommy - kfuz...@tinet.ie
Madra Dubh
Tommy wrote in message <1999021722...@p22.sligo1.tinet.ie>...
>Sweeney the Wanderer <ban...@hotnail.com> wrote:
>
>> Hello, my name is Tommy and I amm an s.c.i. addict....
>>
>> Sweeney
>
>Hello my name is Sweeney and I am a Tommy addict.
>
Bren
> Bren wrote:
> >
> > First Whitewolf wrote:
> >
> > > Charity should begin and remain at home... As you pointed out Unki,
> > > we owe them nothing, we never created the situation, we should not
> > > feel guilt for it's existance... Let the nations who created the
> > > problem deal with it...
> >
> > Then Whitewolf wrote:
> >
> > > Irish people should support Irish charities first... and then
> > > consider other outside charities... if you feel the need to..
> >
> > There is a discrepancy here Ray, either it remains at home or it
> > doesn't.
>
> First I was speaking about official state overseas aid, which
> should be cut. - to offset the loss, like Tommy (unki) I'd
> like to see the money these nations owe in loans wiped clean.
>
Who wouldn't? But I don't agree in cutting off all overseas aid.
> > Of course we should help them. Should a doctor refuse to treat
> > a patient on the grounds that he wasn't the one who beat him
> > up in the first place?
>
> Apples and oranges.
One of these keeps the doctor away? :)
bren
Gearóid Mac Cuinneagáin
>But Britain had a moral (if not legal, which they probably had too) to
>intervene in the "famine" since they were responsible for the deaths
>of millions of Irish by taking away our own food supplies... Irish
>people didn't die for want of food, but because the food that we
>had was taken away... I've got a lot about this on my webpage.
And African countries in part are poor because "the West" has, in the
past and present, exploited their resources. "We" have insisted they
move from food to cash crops. "we" have fomented the situations where
wars lead to food crises. We are rich, because they are poor.
>Ireland as a nation didn't invade African nations, individual soldiers
>may have fought under the Union flag, but that's another issue...
>The speculators may well have invested, but that's not the Irish
>people in general, just some individuals.
Ireland was part of the UK. The UK was a colonial power.
[..]
>> And as a resident of one of the richer nations on Earth, you don't
>> have a moral responsibility to those in poorer nations?
>
>I'm in America, but still Irish... What America does for foreign
>aid doesn't concern me yet...
I wasn't talking about the US. Ireland is a rich country too.
Terry McT.
> Gearóid Mac Cuinneagáin wrote:
> >
> > Whitewolf wrote:
> >
> > >Gearóid Mac Cuinneagáin wrote:
> >
> > >> Whatever. Point is, it happened because they believed that charity
> > >> should begin at home, the Irish should help themselves, England owed
> > >> Ireland nothing because the Irish created the situation themselves by
> > >> over-reliance on one crop, etc etc
> > >
> > >That's not entirely the situation though, Then English were responsible
> > >for Ireland at the time, responsible for the law and order, and for the
> > >people... England shirked it's responsibility at best, and exploited it
> > >to try and destroy the Irish at worst...
> >
> > And then used exactly the same line I've seen in this thread to
> > justify inaction.
>
> But Britain had a moral (if not legal, which they probably had too) to
> intervene in the "famine" since they were responsible for the deaths
> of millions of Irish by taking away our own food supplies... Irish
> people didn't die for want of food, but because the food that we
> had was taken away... I've got a lot about this on my webpage.
Jesus Christ, Ray. You beat this argument to death back in your Fingal
days. You're going to have to call Pete back in here to remind us all of
how much you've changed soon.
--
Terry
tam...@usl.edu
MacHamish
wrote:
>I heard Dustin say that on the TV today in fact. "Deres nah beter place
>on urt dan Urland!" and then he said something about Fianna Fail. Show
>me another coutry where a children's puppet rips apart political and
>entertainment figures on the TV everyday and get's away with it.
>
>other than Charlie Rose on PBS in America that is. (I wonder whose fist
>is up his arse?)
You haven't seen the Hannity and Colmes show on Fox News Network
perhaps? That's *Sean* Hannity (or maybe he spells it Shawn, I don't
know). They follow another show called "The O'Brian Factor".. These
guys aren't puppets, but they slag the politicians and entertainers
pretty good. Interesting that they're both of Irish descent. Or
should I have said "appropriate"?
MacHamish
Sweeney the Wanderer
ROTFL! I've occasionally wanted to knock Tommy, but I'd have to start
reading all of his posts. I long ago came to the conclusion that he's
Huntbach's alter-ego.
Sweeney
Robert Fahey
<kfuz...@SPAMJAMtinet.ie> writes
>> In most cases, yes. I figure once you're over 16 its your own choice...
>> I know that I collected on the streets for Concern when I was 16, of my
>> own free will - myself and a few friends decided to do the 24-hour fast
>> on the street, worst thing being that it snowed. I haven't often had a
>> tougher 24 hours since, but it certainly gave me a great sense of
>> achievement (and a rotten cold to boot).
>
>I used to break the seal and buy sweets and comics with money.
Practical application of the "charity begins at home" maxim? ^_^
Robert Fahey
<kfuz...@SPAMJAMtinet.ie> writes
>> >Whatever. Point is, it happened because they believed that charity
>> >should begin at home, the Irish should help themselves, England owed
>> >Ireland nothing because the Irish created the situation themselves by
>> >over-reliance on one crop, etc etc
>>
>> I think you'll find that our over-reliance on one crop was mainly
>> because all the other crops were being exported by the English.
>
>Really? I just thought Irish farmers were shit at growing stuff.
Well, they are now. Surprisingly good at getting money for being shit at
growing stuff, though. I guess thats the main difference between now and
1840, eh?
MacHamish
<calla...@tinet.ie> wrote:
>Tommy wrote
>(snip)
>>I think the efforts to cancel Third-World debt is an excellent idea. If
>>will give the developing world it's dignity back
>
>"You're so useless and stupid that we'll let you off what you freely agreed
>to pay"
>
>Some dignity!
Good point.
Maybe someone will forgive my debts while they're at it. Harhar.
I'd say it's up to their creditors to make any decision on forgiving
third world debts -- and to suffer the consequences thereof.
But here's how it works. A consortium of big banks holds some shaky
third world debt. The loans aren't "performing". They send their
best bag men to Washington with some big checks made out to the
campaign funds of some very influential politicians, not the least of
which is Bill Clinton and his ilk. The politicians begin to spread
the word through their media lackeys that something needs to be done
about third world debt. The bleeding-heart liberals take up the cause
and wring their hands in agony over the plight of the poor bastards
whom the former colonial powers have exploited. The wailing builds to
a crescendo. In a (formerly) smoke filled room, a deal is made to wipe
the slate clean. It's the humanitarian thing to do. The deal
probably involves several other costly political favors passed between
the politicians. That's how they muster up the votes in the
legislature. Share the candy, lads.
It's announced in the media that the debts are to be forgiven, and we
all feel very good about our government's largess, but what's missing
in the media reports is that the consortium of bankers are to be fully
reimbursed out of the government's treasury. The banks that made the
bad loans are made whole, while the poor slobs who work half the year
to pay their taxes, and never did a single thing to exploit third
world countries, are left footing the bill and holding the bag.
What a system!!
Of course, we can't let the banks go belly-up, either.
FYI. The annual budget of the U.S. government exceeds $1.75 TRILLION.
You can sweep a lot of bullshit under the rug with that kind of money
at your disposal.
MacHamish
Sweeney the Wanderer
>
> Madra Dubh <m...@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
>
> > Tommy wrote in message <1999021722...@p22.sligo1.tinet.ie>...
> > >Sweeney the Wanderer <ban...@hotnail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > >> Hello, my name is Tommy and I amm an s.c.i. addict....
> > >>
> > >> Sweeney
> > >
> > >Hello my name is Sweeney and I am a Tommy addict.
> > >
> > Hello, my name is Conway and I am a Tommyknocker.
>
> shagging your wife someday.
>
Sweeney the Wanderer
>
> > > Hello, my name is Conway and I am a Tommyknocker.
> >
> > reading all of his posts. I long ago came to the conclusion that he's
> > Huntbach's alter-ego.
>
You still haven't figured it out, have you? You unimaginative little
squawker.
Sweeney, the Greatest Confrontational Ironist of Them All
Gearóid Mac Cuinneagáin
>>Really? I just thought Irish farmers were shit at growing stuff.
>
>Well, they are now. Surprisingly good at getting money for being shit at
>growing stuff, though.
These days they're as likely to get money for not growing shit.
--
James C. Woodard
MacHamish wrote in message <36d7a1e5...@news.concentric.net>...
>
>FYI. The annual budget of the U.S. government exceeds $1.75 TRILLION.
>You can sweep a lot of bullshit under the rug with that kind of money
>at your disposal.
>
>MacHamish
What I like are those mental games to help people understand how much money
$1.75 trillion is: A stack of $100 bills equal to 1.5 trillion dollars
would reach halfway to Mars. That sort of thing.
Whitewolf
>
> Whitewolf wrote:
>
> >But Britain had a moral (if not legal, which they probably had too) to
> >intervene in the "famine" since they were responsible for the deaths
> >of millions of Irish by taking away our own food supplies... Irish
> >people didn't die for want of food, but because the food that we
> >had was taken away... I've got a lot about this on my webpage.
>
> past and present, exploited their resources. "We" have insisted they
> move from food to cash crops. "we" have fomented the situations where
> wars lead to food crises. We are rich, because they are poor.
I like the "we" in quotes, because I doubt Ireland had much to do
with that, but I might be wrong...
>
> >Ireland as a nation didn't invade African nations, individual soldiers
> >may have fought under the Union flag, but that's another issue...
> >The speculators may well have invested, but that's not the Irish
> >people in general, just some individuals.
>
> Ireland was part of the UK. The UK was a colonial power.
That's a weak argument... we were colonised too by them...
>
> [..]
> >> And as a resident of one of the richer nations on Earth, you don't
> >> have a moral responsibility to those in poorer nations?
> >
> >I'm in America, but still Irish... What America does for foreign
> >aid doesn't concern me yet...
>
> I wasn't talking about the US. Ireland is a rich country too.
I'm sorry, I misunderstood, then to answer your point, I don't
think Ireland is in a great position, despite the Celtic Tiger and
all that guff... When Euro aid is stopped, Ireland will be doing
well not to fall back into a slump again... It's too socialist,
and it badly needs reform in the tax and unemployment benefit
schemes... The money saved from taking life long dole away from
people unwilling to work could be used for investing in small
businesses again... Anyway.. I waffled on too much, I still
say we have no moral or legal obligation to third world countries.
Ray
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~--------------
"When the facts change, I change my mind. What do you do?"
--Economist, John Maynard Keynes.
Please direct email to: ra...@iol.ie
Homepage: http://www.geocities.com/capitolhill/7652
~~~~~~-~~~~~~~~~~~----~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Whitewolf
> > >
> > > > Welcome, but why only through crossposting, can't you get SCI
> > > > or is there some other reason?
> > >
> > > I am very shallow and am the usenet version of club-hopper.
> >
> > Snip - extremely funny history.. I loved this!!!! :-) :-) :-)
> >
> > You are anything but shallow my friend!!!
>
> And Jaysus Ray it didn't end there either oh no!
Snip - This was brilliant!!! When I read yesterdays (part1) I sent
a copy to Lee, I know she'll get a great laugh from it too, and now
you follow up with this... amazingly funny stuff! I say fuck your
critics, when you shine, you shine bright!! Reading your replies
to me has been a breath of fresh air to my jaded eyes, you should
come to SCI officially again, it needs you...
> Then punk happen and you should consult the Salvation Army/St. Vincent
> DePaul files if you want to know the rest.
Awe, come on, finish the story, don't let me hang in limbo....
Ray
Whitewolf
> >
>
> Did you see this months issue with the baby hitler doll? I must have
> laughed for a hour straight!
>
I used to read it when I was in Ireland, but since I came here.. I've
not seen it... It's a shame, because I really liked it...
> Anybody else seen it? Quirkey, Chris?
>
> --
> tommy - kfuz...@tinet.ie
Rose
>
> Sweeney the Wanderer <ban...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Madra Dubh wrote:
>
> > > Hello, my name is Conway and I am a Tommyknocker.
> >
> > ROTFL! I've occasionally wanted to knock Tommy, but I'd have to start
> > reading all of his posts. I long ago came to the conclusion that he's
> > Huntbach's alter-ego.
>
> SCI must be really gone to shit! Is this par for the course these days?
Without you here to guide us...
--
Rose
*********************************************
See my webpage at: http://www.nd.edu/~jrose1/
*********************************************
Robert Fahey
<Ger@r.d> writes
>Robert Fahey wrote:
>
>>>Really? I just thought Irish farmers were shit at growing stuff.
>>
>>Well, they are now. Surprisingly good at getting money for being shit at
>>growing stuff, though.
>
>These days they're as likely to get money for not growing shit.
Preee-cisely.... :/
MacHamish
Let's make it really mind blowing.
A dollar bill is 6 1/4 inches long. If you laid 1.75 trillion of
them end to end, how far would that be? Cyphering was never my best
subject, but I make it like this:
63,360 inches to the mile divided by 6.25 = 10,137 dollars to the
mile.
$ 1,750,000,000,000 divided by 10,137 = 172,634,902 miles rounded to
the nearest mile.
Let's round it to 172.635 million miles.
That means it would reach the sun and over 80% of the way back to
Earth. Of course, a lot of it would burn up in the process.
It would also stretch around the earth at the equator almost 7,200
times.
Is that what you had in mind, James?
MacHamish
Tommy
> A dollar bill is 6 1/4 inches long. If you laid 1.75 trillion of
> them end to end, how far would that be?
Almost enough to fill Oprah's knickers.
--
tommy - kfuz...@tinet.ie
Tommy
> unki I told you before about that, I hope it isn't near your well.
> Seriously. You have no idea how many farmers came to me with water
> samples and some were so bad I called them immediately and told them
> to stop drinking the water from that well at once. I got so concerned
> when I saw how bad their well water was I started telling them to tell
> their friends I'd do the tests at cost if they'd just bring their
> water samples in.
No pet, I get my water from the town supply. I live on a main road just
outside the town. Even though I live in the country I have all the local
services. The water is excellent. My neighbour across the street works
for the water-company and I give him free stuff all the time so I know
he hasn't pissed in it.
The mystery barrel frightens the shite out of me because it is full, but
rusty. It's a bleedin timebomb and I want to keep the area clean. I
would like to plant trees on it some day and i would hate fom the soil
to get comtaiminated. If I called the EPA and told them about it would
they take it away for free?
--
tommy - kfuz...@tinet.ie
Laura
>Sheela na Gig <She...@prehension.com> wrote:
>
>> unki I told you before about that, I hope it isn't near your well.
>The mystery barrel frightens the shite out of me because it is full, but
>rusty. It's a bleedin timebomb and I want to keep the area clean. I
>would like to plant trees on it some day and i would hate fom the soil
>to get comtaiminated. If I called the EPA and told them about it would
>they take it away for free?
I believe that I told you once that it was the remains of a leprechaun. Ger
kidnapped the one at ND, stuffed it in the barrel and "hid" it on your
property. You can't call the EPA, but you can light a few cnadles so that
his relatives can find him, I believe his name was Phil.
Laura
--
Not the most coherent duck on the lake...
James C. Woodard
MacHamish wrote in message <36dde155...@news.concentric.net>...
>>What I like are those mental games to help people understand how much
money
>>$1.75 trillion is: A stack of $100 bills equal to 1.5 trillion dollars
>>would reach halfway to Mars. That sort of thing.
>
>Let's make it really mind blowing.
>
> A dollar bill is 6 1/4 inches long. If you laid 1.75 trillion of
>them end to end, how far would that be? Cyphering was never my best
>subject, but I make it like this:
>
>63,360 inches to the mile divided by 6.25 = 10,137 dollars to the
>mile.
>$ 1,750,000,000,000 divided by 10,137 = 172,634,902 miles rounded to
>the nearest mile.
>
>Let's round it to 172.635 million miles.
>
>That means it would reach the sun and over 80% of the way back to
>Earth. Of course, a lot of it would burn up in the process.
>
>It would also stretch around the earth at the equator almost 7,200
>times.
>
>Is that what you had in mind, James?
>
More or less.
Sheela na Gig
wrote:
>Some deal! I have a little weed-ridden field filled with barrels of
>chemicals and the rusted remains of a Morris Minor.
>
>Where the fuck is my cheque?
unki I told you before about that, I hope it isn't near your well.
Seriously. You have no idea how many farmers came to me with water
samples and some were so bad I called them immediately and told them
to stop drinking the water from that well at once. I got so concerned
when I saw how bad their well water was I started telling them to tell
their friends I'd do the tests at cost if they'd just bring their
water samples in.
_______________________________________________
Behind every great fortune lies a great crime.
Sutal
In article <36ce0edb....@news.mindspring.com>, She...@prehension.com
wrote:
>unki I told you before about that, I hope it isn't near your well.
>Seriously. You have no idea how many farmers came to me with water
>samples and some were so bad I called them immediately and told them
>to stop drinking the water from that well at once. I got so concerned
>when I saw how bad their well water was I started telling them to tell
>their friends I'd do the tests at cost if they'd just bring their
>water samples in.
Sheela, ..that group I'm involved with does well drilling projects in a major
way. Once you are over your flu, you and smelly can come help us do some wells
instead of building little houses! Next stop: Honduras!
...tell me tales about Ireland.....
Sheela na Gig
wrote:
>> A dollar bill is 6 1/4 inches long. If you laid 1.75 trillion of
>> them end to end, how far would that be?
>
>Almost enough to fill Oprah's knickers.
>
Jesys don't mention that name. Can we stick with Larry Flynt instead?
He's in my angel network. I giz the hustler channel a ring whenever I
feels blue. He's my hero.
Sheela na Gig
wrote:
>No pet, I get my water from the town supply. I live on a main road just
>outside the town. Even though I live in the country I have all the local
>services. The water is excellent. My neighbour across the street works
>for the water-company and I give him free stuff all the time so I know
>he hasn't pissed in it.
Lucky man to have town water in, emm, is it Tubbercurry? I has some
people I know grew up there, come to think of it there were
tubbercurry boys in farrah pants at the party when I got home from
getting married in vegas. Don't know if they are there or here now.
>The mystery barrel frightens the shite out of me because it is full, but
>rusty. It's a bleedin timebomb and I want to keep the area clean. I
>would like to plant trees on it some day and i would hate fom the soil
>to get comtaiminated. If I called the EPA and told them about it would
>they take it away for free?
You'd be better off calling the county council, they might send
someone out to take a sample and send it for testing. They won't move
it until they characterize it. When they do characterize it though
they might take it for free of they might go after you to pay as it's
on your land, I'm not quite sure, I think it's really up to how they
feel that day and how much you've kissed their butts and did your
cousin give them a nice blow job one day.
ACooper213
I don't know how it works in Sligo, but my approach would be to make a phone
call to the local authorities early one morning. In a high-pitched, excited
voice tell them that you saw a lorry with painted over plates stopped on your
land earlier that morning. Tell them several large men in hooded sweatshirts
threw the barrel off the back of the lorry and drove off hell-for-leather.
The authorities will confiscate the barrel, bring in a squad of experts from
Dublin to examine it, and the subsequent inquiry will take at least six months.
You will be free and clear, and might even have your pic in the local rag
labeled "Concerned Squire Foils Plot".
Greig will write 489 posts (three original, and 486 replies to himself)
claiming RUC involvement based on the newspaper story.
Brendan H will get involved in the thread, but misplace Sligo on the map. He
will think it is in Arizona and that the whole imbroglio is a result of a weak
U.S. Constitution. Ger will write an addendum to the FAQ on whose turn it is
in the barrel. Bren V. will see the pic in the paper and compliment you for
looking so trim.
Next, call the National Enquirer and whisper two words: "barrel" and "Hoffa".
You will make more money than Camilla's pedicurist.
As a good turn, recommend Sheela to the Forensic Flying Squad as an expert "in
this type of thing". She'll get a fee, stand you a round, and report to SCI
what a nice guy you are. Everyone wins.
.
Tony aka: ACoop...@aol.com
"As I slide down the banisters of life,
I will always remember Orlando as a
splinter up me arse." (Unknown Irish Footballer)
Fergus O'Rourke
>MacHamish <rus...@concentric.net> wrote:
>> A dollar bill is 6 1/4 inches long. If you laid 1.75 trillion of
>> them end to end, how far would that be?
>Almost enough to fill Oprah's knickers.
Once again you have succeeded in making me nostalgic for the days of
theocracy when such comments were not made in public
Eddie Wall
Looks like he has decided to pitch his tent here.. you will have to
get used to it.
LOL
Eddie
||| But how far, is too far ? |||
Fergus O'Rourke
LadyKrysti
In article <7alnse$7m$1...@spitting-spider.aracnet.com>, "James C. Woodard"
<gwy...@aracnet.com> writes:
>>>What I like are those mental games to help people understand how much
>money
>>>$1.75 trillion is: A stack of $100 bills equal to 1.5 trillion dollars
>>>would reach halfway to Mars. That sort of thing.
>>
>>Let's make it really mind blowing.
>>
>> A dollar bill is 6 1/4 inches long. If you laid 1.75 trillion of
>>them end to end, how far would that be? Cyphering was never my best
>>subject, but I make it like this:
>>
>>63,360 inches to the mile divided by 6.25 = 10,137 dollars to the
>>mile.
>>$ 1,750,000,000,000 divided by 10,137 = 172,634,902 miles rounded to
>>the nearest mile.
>>
>>Let's round it to 172.635 million miles.
>>
>>That means it would reach the sun and over 80% of the way back to
>>Earth. Of course, a lot of it would burn up in the process.
>>
>>It would also stretch around the earth at the equator almost 7,200
>>times.
>>
>>Is that what you had in mind, James?
>>
>More or less.
>
It seems to me that ALL of you have a wee bit too much time on your hands.
Krystie Rose
James C. Woodard
LadyKrysti wrote in message
<19990220121920...@ngol07.aol.com>...
>
>
>It seems to me that ALL of you have a wee bit too much time on your hands.
>
>
>Krystie Rose
Aye, and too much of summat else *in* me hand, but if you'll dorp by we can
probably do something about both problems.
Jim
Terry McT.
kfuz...@SPAMJAMtinet.ie (Tommy) wrote:
> Rose <Ros...@nd.edu> wrote:
>
> > Tommy wrote:
>
> > > SCI must be really gone to shit! Is this par for the course these days?
> >
> > Without you here to guide us...
>
> *sob* You are free now and *sob*, you must go and make your own way
> *sob*.
>
> born free.......
I think Tommy's living out an S.C.I. version of the film Trainspotting.
He's made his trip to London, and here we all are dragging him back.
--
Terry
tam...@usl.edu
Laura
>TOMMY FUZZBOX WANTS TO GET OUT OF THE BARREL:
[story snipped]
>As a good turn, recommend Sheela to the Forensic Flying Squad as an expert
"in
>this type of thing". She'll get a fee, stand you a round, and report to
SCI
>what a nice guy you are. Everyone wins.
Damnit Tony, I want to be the psychic in the story who accurately predicts
that it's the remains of the ND leprechaun.
eala liath
Fergus O'Rourke wrote:
>>Once again you have succeeded in making me nostalgic for the days of
>>theocracy when such comments were not made in public
>>
>Looks like he has decided to pitch his tent here.. you will have to
>get used to it.
>Eddie
Not for long, thanks to the nerdies developing filters. Avoiding cyberweirdies
will be even easier than it is with Forté Agent, hallelujah! They thrive on
even negative attention. If you don't want them, delete them unread;
or if you simply must respond, do it with a capitalised SNIP, it really hurts.
If you decide to compose a reply, use a tight, pithy cheap shot.
Kooks love wordy, wounded, defensive material.
Well thought-out cheap shots are not to be pooh-poohed;
this is the ideal forum! Cheaper to download too.
Make every word count so your post is a killer.
Your opponent certainly will.
Eddie's a master at the snipping strategy, watch him.
Her husband is to her the sea.
He tastes of salt, his unwashed hair
a net that holds an ancient, briny catch.
In sleep, she breathes him deep.
M. MacKinnon
eala liath
wrote:>
HaHaHa!
The "dorp" typo is magic in this context!
James C. Woodard
eala liath wrote in message <36cf2aa9...@news.directcon.net>...
>On Sat, 20 Feb 1999 11:11:08 -0800, "James C. Woodard"
<gwy...@aracnet.com>
>wrote:>
>>LadyKrysti wrote in message
>><19990220121920...@ngol07.aol.com>...
>>
>>>It seems to me that ALL of you have a wee bit too much time on your
hands.
>>>Krystie Rose
>
>>Aye, and too much of summat else *in* me hand, but if you'll dorp by we
can
>>probably do something about both problems.
>>Jim
>>
>HaHaHa!
>
>The "dorp" typo is magic in this context!
>
Jim(I am not a dorp) Woodard
James C. Woodard
eala liath wrote in message <36d21f85...@news.directcon.net>...
SNIP
>or if you simply must respond, do it with a capitalised SNIP, it really
hurts.
>If you decide to compose a reply, use a tight, pithy cheap shot.
>Kooks love wordy, wounded, defensive material.
>Well thought-out cheap shots are not to be pooh-poohed;
>this is the ideal forum! Cheaper to download too.
>Make every word count so your post is a killer.
>Your opponent certainly will.
>
>Eddie's a master at the snipping strategy, watch him.
>
Madra Dubh
Tommy wrote in message <1999021817...@p56.sligo1.tinet.ie>...
>Madra Dubh <m...@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
>
>> Tommy wrote in message <1999021722...@p22.sligo1.tinet.ie>...
>> >Sweeney the Wanderer <ban...@hotnail.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >> Hello, my name is Tommy and I amm an s.c.i. addict....
>> >
>> >Hello my name is Sweeney and I am a Tommy addict.
>> >
>> Hello, my name is Conway and I am a Tommyknocker.
>
>shagging your wife someday.
>
Hello my name is Conway and I still have a wife.
Madra Dubh
Sweeney the Wanderer wrote in message <36CDB4...@hotmail.com>...
>Tommy wrote:
>>
>> Madra Dubh <m...@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
>>
>> > Tommy wrote in message <1999021722...@p22.sligo1.tinet.ie>...
>> > >Sweeney the Wanderer <ban...@hotnail.com> wrote:
>> > >
>> > >> Hello, my name is Tommy and I amm an s.c.i. addict....
>> > >
>> > >Hello my name is Sweeney and I am a Tommy addict.
>> > >
>> > Hello, my name is Conway and I am a Tommyknocker.
>>
>> Hello my name is Tommy and there is a fairly good chance I'll be
>> shagging your wife someday.
>>
>Hah! Southern woman have much higher standards than the slappers you
>knew in New York did.
>
The slappers he knew in New York required the money up front.
-Conway
Madra Dubh
>> >
>
>> Hah! Southern woman have much higher standards than the slappers you
>> knew in New York did.
>
>
>I rest my case
>
Exhibit B: Monika ain't from the South. Paul is from the South and Paula
gigged the bum for $800,000.
Madra Dubh
Sweeney the Wanderer wrote in message <36CD9E...@hotmail.com>...
>
>ROTFL! I've occasionally wanted to knock Tommy, but I'd have to start
>reading all of his posts. I long ago came to the conclusion that he's
>Huntbach's alter-ego.
>
I'm glad he's back, Sweeney. It was gettin' dull as hell around here what
with all the book reviews and such (Hi Jake! Didn't see you there!!)
-Conway
Madra Dubh
-Conway
(And don't miss our recipe section)
--
"Sean Ghall"
To confer with the Old Grump privately, please remove "md@" and replace with
"ccaine@")
Tommy wrote in message <1999021817...@p56.sligo1.tinet.ie>...
>
Eddie Wall
liath) wrote:
SNIPPPPPPP >>
>Eddie's a master at the snipping strategy, watch him.
>
Your too kind. !
Tommy
> Tommy wrote in message <1999021901...@p90.sligo1.tinet.ie>...
> >MacHamish <rus...@concentric.net> wrote:
> >> A dollar bill is 6 1/4 inches long. If you laid 1.75 trillion of
> >> them end to end, how far would that be?
> >Almost enough to fill Oprah's knickers.
>
>
> Once again you have succeeded in making me nostalgic for the days of
> theocracy when such comments were not made in public
I am not surprised. I understand how difficult reality and personal
freedom frightens people like you. Please don't send me to the Magdelene
Laundries!
--
tommy - kfuz...@tinet.ie
Tommy
> Eddie Wall wrote in message <36cf9ec6...@news.indigo.ie>...
> >On Sat, 20 Feb 1999 08:57:39 -0000, "Fergus O'Rourke"
> ><calla...@tinet.ie> wrote:
> >
> >>Tommy wrote in message <1999021901...@p90.sligo1.tinet.ie>...
> >>>MacHamish <rus...@concentric.net> wrote:
> >>>> A dollar bill is 6 1/4 inches long. If you laid 1.75 trillion of
> >>>> them end to end, how far would that be?
> >>>Almost enough to fill Oprah's knickers.
> >>
> >>
> >>Once again you have succeeded in making me nostalgic for the days of
> >>theocracy when such comments were not made in public
> >>
> >Looks like he has decided to pitch his tent here.. you will have to
> >get used to it.
>
>
> We will see.
I am hardly surprised you religious types always resort to book banning,
witch burning and censoring people who refuse to be bullied by your
doctrines. I wouldn't expect otherwise.
If you want to know what Dev would have done about USENET then just look
at our Ferus here.
--
tommy - kfuz...@tinet.ie
Tommy
> You'd be better off calling the county council, they might send
> someone out to take a sample and send it for testing. They won't move
> it until they characterize it. When they do characterize it though
> they might take it for free of they might go after you to pay as it's
> on your land, I'm not quite sure, I think it's really up to how they
> feel that day and how much you've kissed their butts and did your
> cousin give them a nice blow job one day.
Quirky said more or less the same thing whe I showed it to him this
morning. (eh, the barrel that is)
Thanks.
--
tommy - kfuz...@tinet.ie