THE MYTH OF THE HINDU RIGHT by David Frawley

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Apr 30, 2007, 10:06:57 PM4/30/07
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Part II.10

The Myth of the Hindu Right

By David Frawley

In media accounts today, any group that identifies itself
as Hindu or tries to promote any Hindu cause is immediately
and uncritically defined as "right-winged". In the leftist
accounts that commonly come from the Indian press, Hindu
organizations are also routinely called militants and
fascists. However, if we look at their actual views, Hindu
groups have a very different ideology and practices than
the political right in other countries. In fact many Hindu
causes are more at home in the left in the West than in the
right.

The whole idea of the "Hindu right" is a ploy to discredit
the Hindu movement as backward and prevent people from
really examining it. The truth is that the Hindu movement
is a revival of a native spiritual tradition that has
nothing to do with the political right-wing of any western
country. Its ideas are spiritually evolutionary, not
politically regressive, though such revivals do have a few
extremists. Let us examine the different aspects of the
Hindu movement and where they would fall in the political
spectrum of left and right as usually defined in the West.

Hinduism and Native Traditions

The Hindu cause is similar to the causes of native and
tribal peoples all over the world, like native American and
African groups. Even Hindu concerns about cultural
encroachment by western religious and commercial interests
mirrors those of other traditional peoples who want to
preserve their cultures. Yet while the left has taken up
the concerns of native peoples worldwide, the same concerns
of Hindus are styled right-wing or communal, particularly
in India!

When native Americans ask for a return of their sacred
sites, the left in America supports them. When Hindus ask
for a similar return of their sacred sites, the left in
India opposes them and brands them as intolerant for their
actions! When native peoples in America or Africa protest
against the missionaries for interfering with their
culture, the left supports them. Yet when Hindus express
the same sentiments, the left attacks them. Even the Hindu
demand for rewriting the history of India to better express
the value of their indigenous traditions is the same as
what native Africans and Americans are asking for. Yet the
left opposes this Hindu effort, while supporting African
and American efforts of a similar nature.

In countries like America, native traditions are minorities
and thereby afforded a special sympathy. Leftists in
general tend to support minority causes and often lump
together black African and native American causes as
examples of the damage caused by racism and colonialism. In
India, a native tradition has survived the colonial period
but as the tradition of the majority of the people.
Unfortunately, the intellectual elite of India, though
following largely a leftist orientation, has no sympathy
for the country's own native tradition. They identify it as
right-wing in order to express their hostility towards it.
They try to portray it as a majority oppression of
minorities, when it is the movement of a suppressed
majority to regain its dignity.

Not surprisingly, the same leftists in India, who have long
been allied to communist China, similarly style the Dalai
Lama and the Tibetan cause as right-wing and regressive,
though the Dalai Lama is honored by the American left. This
should tell the reader about the meaning of right and left
as political terms in India. When one looks at the Hindu
movement as the assertion of a native tradition with a
profound spiritual heritage, the whole perspective on it
changes.

Hindu Economics

The Hindu movement in India in its most typical form
follows a Swadeshi (own-country) movement like the Swadeshi
Jagaran Manch. It emphasizes protecting the villages and
local economies, building economic independence and self-
reliance for the country. It resists corporate interference
and challenges multinational interests, whether the
bringing of fast food chains to India, western
pharmaceuticals or terminator seeds.

Such an economic policy was supported by Mahatma Gandhi
with his emphasis on the villages, reflected in his
characteristic usage of the spinning wheel. Its
counterparts in the West are the groups that protest the
World Trade Organization (WTO), the World Bank and the
International Monetary Fund (IMF). However, these protest
groups are generally classified as "left-wing" by the
international press.

The international press considers the economic right-wing
to be the powers of the multinational corporations,
particularly, the oil industry, which certainly are not the
allies of Hindu economics. Clearly Hindu economics is more
connected with the New Left in the West and has little in
common with the right. The Republican right in America,
with its corporate interests, would hardly take up the
cause of Hindu economics either.

Meanwhile the BJP, the so-called Hindu nationalist party in
India, has been responsible for much the economic
liberalization if the country, sometimes even to the dismay
of some votaries of Hindu economics. It has been the main
opponent of the socialist policies of the previous Congress
and left governments that had communist leanings. While
such a movement is to the right in the political spectrum,
the policies of the BJP are a movement towards western
capitalism from the left, they are not a movement from it
to the right. At most they emulate a more open capitalist
society as in the West but one that retains a dharmic
background.

Hindu Ecology and Nature Concerns

Hindu groups are well known for promoting vegetarianism and
animal rights, particularly the protection of cows. The
Hindu religion as a whole honors the Divine in animals and
recognizes that animals have a soul and will eventually
achieve liberation. Hindu groups have tried to keep fast
food franchises, which emphasize meat consumption, out of
India. Such a movement would be part of consumer advocacy
movements that are generally leftist or liberal causes in
the West. Again it is hardly an agenda of the right-wing in
America, which has a special connection to the beef
industry; or to the right-wing worldwide, which has no real
concern for animal rights and is certainly not interesting
in spreading vegetarianism.

Hindus look upon nature as sacred, honoring the rivers and
mountains as homes of deities. They stress the protection
of Mother Earth, which they worship in the form of the cow.
They have a natural affinity with the western ecology
movement and efforts to protect animals, forests and
wilderness areas. This is also hardly a right-wing agenda.

Hindu Religious Pluralism

The Hindu religion is a pluralistic tradition that accepts
many paths, teachers, scriptures and teachings. One cannot
be a Christian without accepting Christ or a Buddhist
without accepting Buddha, but one can be a Hindu without
accepting any single figure. In fact there are Hindus who
may not follow Krshn, Ram, Shiv, Vishnu or other Hindu
sages or deities and still count as Hindu.

Hindus have been at the forefront in arguing for the cause
of religious diversity and the acceptance of pluralism in
religion, rejecting the idea that any single religion alone
can be true. This Hindu idea of religion -- which is also
subscribed to by so-called right wing Hindu groups like RSS
-- is obviously not part of the agenda of the religious
right in the West. The American Christian right is still
sending missionaries to the entire world in order to
convert all people to Christianity, the only true religion.
It is firmly fixed on one savior, one scripture and a
rather literal interpretation of these. Yet when Hindus ask
the pope to make a statement that truth can be found
outside of any particular church or religion they are
called right-wing and backwards, while the pope, who
refuses to acknowledge the validity of Hindu, Buddhist or
other Indic traditions, is regarded as liberal! Such
pluralism in religious views is hardly a cause for any
right-wing movement in the world, but is also considered
progressive, liberal, if not leftist (except in India).

Hinduism and Science

Unlike the religious right in the West, the Hindu movement
is not against science or opposed to teaching evolution in
the schools. Hinduism does promote occult and spiritual
subjects like astrology, Ayurvedic medicine, Yoga or
Vedanta, but these are the same basic teachings found in
the New Age in the West, generally regarded as a liberal or
leftist movement, not those of the religious right in the
West. Many leaders of the Hindu movement are in fact
scientists. For example, RSS leaders like former chief
Rajinder Singh, or BJP leaders like Murli Manohar Joshi
have also been professors of modern physics.

In fact we could compare Hinduism as a whole with the case
of Ayurved. Ayurved as a form of mind-body medicine
emphasizing the role of consciousness in health and disease
is part of the alternative medicine movement in the West
and considered to be progressive, while the medical
establishment that emphasizes allopathy is regarded as
conservative, if not right-wing. However, in India it is
Ayurved, because it is a tradition of the country, which is
regarded as backwards, while modern medicine is regarded as
progressive.

The Hindu Movement and Caste

The Hindu right is often defined in the media in terms of
caste, as favoring the upper castes over the lower castes.
This is another distortion that is often intentional.
Modern Hindu teachers have been at the forefront of
removing caste. This includes great figures like
Vivekanand, Mahatma Gandhi and Aurobindo. It includes major
Hindu movements like the Arya Samaj, the largest Vedic
movement in modern India, and the Swadhyaya movement.

The RSS, the largest so-called Hindu right wing group,
rejects caste and works to remove it from Hindu society,
giving prominence to leaders from lower classes and working
to open the Hindu priesthood to members of all castes.
While caste continues to be a problem in certain segments
of Hindu society, it is generally not because of these
current Hindu social, religious and political movements,
but because their reform efforts are resisted.

The Hindu Movement and Women's Rights

Generally, the right wing in the West is defined as opposed
to women's rights. However, there are many women's groups
and active women leaders in the Hindu movement and in the
Hindu religion. Being a woman is no bar for being a
political or religious leader in India as it often is in
the West. Hinduism has the world's largest and oldest
tradition of the worship of the Divine as Mother, including
as India itself. Great female Hindu gurus like Ammachi
(Mata Amritanandamayi) travel and teach all over the world.
The Hindu movement worships India on a spiritual level as a
manifestation of the Divine Mother (Shakti).

Hindus were very protective of their women during the
period foreign and kept them sequestered, which was often
for their own safety. Unfortunately, this trend has
continued among some Hindus in the modern world when it is
no longer necessary. So while there is poor treatment of
women in some parts of Hindu society, this has not been by
modern Hindu teachers or movements that have tried to raise
the status of women as Shakti.

The Hindu Bomb

Perhaps the main thing in recent years used to define
Hindus in India as right-winged is India's testing of the
nuclear bomb in 1998. Yet India's concern for its military
welfare and need for a nuclear deterrent is certainly no
more than what the democratic party in the United States
has asked for. The Indian government has at the same time
argued for complete nuclear disarmament, which it would be
happy to comply with. Note that the Dalai Lama supported
India's nuclear testing. He can hardly regarded as a right-
wing leader (except by the Chinese communists and their
Indian counterparts).

The Indian Left: The Old Left

In India, the political terminology of right and left is
defined by Marxists, who like to call anyone that opposes
them right-wing or fascists, which they used to do even
with socialists. In their view anything traditionally Hindu
would have to be right-wing on principle, just as their
views are always deemed progressive, even if supporting
Stalinist tactics. This means that in India such subjects
as Yoga, natural healing, vegetarianism and animal rights
are all automatically right-wing because they are causes of
the Hindu mind, with antecedents in ancient Indian culture.
Great Hindu yogis and sages from Shankaracharya to Sri
Aurobindo are classified by modern Marxists as right-wing,
if not fascist.[1]

However, the Indian left is mainly the Old Left,
emphasizing a failed communist ideology and state economic
planning such as dominated Eastern Europe in the decades
following World War II and took it nowhere. It wreaked the
same havoc with the economy and educational systems of
India and kept the country backward. Indian communists are
among the few in the world that still proudly honor Stalin
and Mao (while warning of the danger of Hindu
fundamentalism)! Communist ruled Bengal still teaches the
glory of the Russian revolution for all humanity, though
Russia gave up communism ten years ago! The Old Left was
itself intolerant, oppressive and dictatorial, sponsoring
state terrorism and genocide wherever it came to power.
Indian leftists have never rejected these policies and look
back with nostalgia on the Soviet Union!

Therefore, we must remember that the leftist criticism of
Hinduism coming from the Indian left is that of the Old
Left. This old left in India does not take up many of the
causes of the new left like ecology or native rights. It
even sides with the policies of the political right-wing in
western cultures upholding the rights of missionaries to
convert native peoples and continuing colonial accounts of
Indic civilization.

The communist inspired left in India has tried to demonize
the Hindu movement as a right-wing phenomenon in order to
discredit its spiritual orientation. The aim of the Indian
left is to keep the Hindu movement isolated from any
potential allies. After all, no one likes fascists, which
is a good term of denigration that evokes negative emotions
for both communists and capitalists.

Hinduism and the Left

The causes taken up by the Hindu movement are more at home
in the New Left than in right wing parties of the West.
Some of these resemble the concerns of the Green Party. The
Hindu movement offers a long-standing tradition of
environmental protection, economic simplicity, and
protection of religious and cultural diversity. There is
little in the so-called Hindu right that is shared by the
religious or political right-wing in western countries,
which reflect military, corporate and missionary concerns.
The Hindu movement has much in common with the New Age
movement in the West and its seeking of occult and
spiritual knowledge, not with the right wing in the West,
which rejects these things. Clearly, the western right
would never embrace the Hindu movement as its ally. Right-
winged labels have been cast on the Hindu movement in an
uncritical way. Usually it has been little more than a
casting of labels or stereotypes.

To counter this distortion, some Hindus are now arguing for
a new "Hindu Left" to better express the concerns of Hindu
Dharma in modern terms. They would see the New Left as more
in harmony with Hindu concerns and a possible ally. Hindu
thought has always been progressive and evolutionary,
seeking to aid in the unfoldment of consciousness in
humanity and not resting content with material or political
gains as sufficient. Hindu Dharma should be reexamined by
the New Left and the distortions of by the Old Left
discarded. The New Left will find much in Hindu Dharma that
is relevant to its concerns.

The Hindu movement can be a great ally to many social
movements throughout the world. It has a base of nearly a
billion people and the world's largest non-biblical
religious tradition, with a long tradition of spiritual
thought and practice. The Hindu movement can be an ally for
any native causes, environmental concerns, women's
spiritual issues and movements toward economic simplicity
and global responsibility, to mention but a few.

Groups espousing such causes may have looked upon Hinduism
as an enemy, being taken in by leftist propaganda. They
must question these distortions of the Old Left. They
should look to the Hindu view for insight, even if they may
not agree with it on all points. They should not trust the
anti-Hindu stereotypes of the Old Left, any more than they
trust the views of the now defunct Soviet Union.

Towards a Non-Political Social Order

However, the entire right-left division reflects the
conditions of western politics and is inaccurate in the
Indian context. We must give up such concepts in examining
Indic civilization, which in its core is spiritually based,
not politically driven. It reflects older and deeper
concerns that precede and transcend the West's outer
vision. As long as we define ourselves through politics our
social order will contain conflict and confusion. Democracy
may be the more benign face of a political order, but it
still hides the lack of any true spiritual order. We must
employ the vision of dharma and subordinate politics to it,
which should be a form of Karma Yoga.

The New Left also contains various distortions from a Hindu
perspective. True liberalism requires a responsibility to
the entire universe, not just an assertion of individual
human rights, which can be to the detriment of larger
social groups or to the natural environment. It looks to
the spiritual human being, our immortal consciousness, and
not to the bodily-based ego as the real human being. It
helps preserve organic social orders and avoids
interference with natural cultural development.

We cannot look to politics to change the world, but to
spirituality to change politics. Hindus should not try to
remake Hinduism according to current images of political
correctness, but should connect the world to a greater idea
of humanity than political concerns. These follow the
vision of the great yogis and sages who have stood outside
of western political concerns and viewpoints.

What is said to be "politically correct" is often
"spiritually incorrect". It consists of simplistic outer
solutions that do not go to the root of the human problem,
which is one of consciousness, not only social or material
equality. We must look back to an organic and spiritual
order to society that cannot be defined by either the left
or the right of western politics, and which will hopefully
set both aside. This is what Hindu Dharma can offer.

- - -

[1] For example, in the United States where I live, I have
supported ecology, animal rights and -- the cause of
pluralism in religion, which the right wing here opposes.
But in the Indian context I am labeled right wing or even
fascist for raising the same issues.

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hari....@indero.com

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May 1, 2007, 10:10:30 AM5/1/07
to
"THE MYTH OF THE HINDU RIGHT by David Frawley"

Another westerner preaching to s. asians about how to be real s. asians
and have a real religion. Our local example is jay stevens,aka dr. jai
etc., who sits as an american thousands of km away and preaches as an
american to real indians and hindus about how to conduct their affiairs.
He is a white bigot.

The right radicals in india are different only in content born of the
local situation in s. asia. In principles and objectives they are proud
members of right radicals the world over. This is why during ww ii they
were the natural and active supporters of hitler and tojo in their world
views and practices.

Marcus Aurelius

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May 1, 2007, 12:22:53 PM5/1/07
to

Slaves should aid their masters and not seek freedom, eh Uncle Tom?
May the Great Hindu Gods have mercy on your pathetic soul.

Adi Anant

harmony

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May 1, 2007, 12:40:33 PM5/1/07
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"Marcus Aurelius" <arya...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1178036573....@n59g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...

uncle toms listened to the crazy white guys in funny white robes instead,
and fell victim to anti-family jesus mission. the hindus have a phrase for
them: dhobi ka kutta, na ghar ka, na ghat ka.


hari....@indero.com

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May 1, 2007, 12:50:44 PM5/1/07
to

>> Another westerner preaching to s. asians about how to be real s. asians
>> and have a real religion. Our local example is jay stevens,aka dr. jai
>> etc., who sits as an american thousands of km away and preaches as an
>> american to real indians and hindus about how to conduct their affiairs.
>> He is a white bigot.
>>
>> The right radicals in india are different only in content born of the
>> local situation in s. asia. In principles and objectives they are proud
>> members of right radicals the world over. This is why during ww ii they
>> were the natural and active supporters of hitler and tojo in their world
>> views and practices.
>
>Slaves should aid their masters and not seek freedom, eh Uncle Tom?
>May the Great Hindu Gods have mercy on your pathetic soul.

Heed the words of a would be slave, had hitler had his way. The author
of the below would be able to lick clean hitler's boots instead of just
kissing his arse, because it would have been on his neck as a member of
one of the inferior races of disposable slaves:

THE HATE-MINORITIES MESSAGE OF THE `RSS BIBLE'

"The foreign races in Hindusthan must either adopt the Hindu culture
and language, must learn to respect and hold in reverence Hindu
religion, must entertain no idea but those of the glorification of the
Hindu race and culture, i.e., of the Hindu nation and must loose their
separate existence to merge in the Hindu race, or may stay in the
country, wholly subordinated to the Hindu Nation, claiming nothing,
deserving no privileges, far less any preferential treatment -- not
even citizen's rights. There is, at least, should be, no other course
for them to adopt. We are an old nation; let us deal, as old nations
ought to and do deal, with the foreign races, who have chosen to live
in our country".

-- Madhav Sadashiv Golwalkar's, We or Our Nationhood Defined

Marcus Aurelius

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May 1, 2007, 1:13:26 PM5/1/07
to

Why is it, uncle tom, that you wish everybody to emulate their white
massah's, but emulating the Hindu culture is a no no?

Why is it, uncle tom, that you approve of whites calling for "one
country, one language, one culture ", but you disapprove of others
calling for the same thing?

Why is it, uncle tom, that you consider whites to be so benign that
the millions of Indians who died under british rule because of
starvation or other oppressions, were not worthy enough to besmirch
the white rule?

Why is it, uncle tom, that you think that the genocides against the
natives of americas, australia, africa, India, large parts of asia etc
- all were good things that brought on by the whites?

Perhaps, uncle tom, you still rue the day that the apartheid regime in
S Africa lost its absolute political power. You would, no doubt, give
your left arm and leg just to be able to enjoy the heydays of british
lordship over your pathetic pigmented ass, merely because you feel
some kinship with the former white rulers owing to your conversion to
their religion?


Adi Anant


hari....@indero.com

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May 1, 2007, 1:44:40 PM5/1/07
to


Very good, hitler had his own versions of the above tirade, replacing
the german name for "uncle tom". He made the same appeals to sameness
of language and culture and "race". He too saw himself the victum of
others and put great great store on a mythological past of a glorious
german culture that had been deminished and corrupted and need to be
purified.

He like the part of the book of above radical nutter had the same
solution and answer. Read it again and feel the rise of the glory of
putting your foot on the neck of all those dirty unworthy "others" of s.
asia when the "real" "pure" indians come to power and have full rein.
Forget all that rule of law stuff, like the muslims of old, either
become one of us, leave, or become our slaves and kiss our arses.

All radical religious and political clowns have the same kinds of
excuses for why they are superior and why all must agree and why they
desirve to rule over others just because they have the power to do so.
Use of power and violence and distruction are then a valid excuse that
those not having the power must learn from their betters to accept.

Read the book section again and then answer why the radical nutters
during ww ii found common ground and even admiration for hitler and tojo
and why the nutters of today would not mind doing likewise if given the
chance.

Marcus Aurelius

unread,
May 1, 2007, 2:25:45 PM5/1/07
to

Why use Hitler as a whipping boy, uncle tom? He loved your genocidal
heroes:

==

"In Zweites Buch, Hitler portrayed the U.S. as a dynamic, "racially
successful" society that practiced eugenics and segregation and
followed what Hitler considered to be a wise policy of excluding
"racially degenerate" immigration from eastern and southern Europe....
By 1928, Hitler seems to have heard about the massive industrial
wealth of the U.S., the Immigration Act of 1924, segregation and the
fact that several American states had eugenics boards to sterilize
people who were considered mentally defective, and was favorably
impressed. Hitler proclaimed his admiration for these sorts of
policies and expressed his wish that Germany would do similar things,
though on a much greater scale."


==

Hitler's love for the british empire:

"I am willing to help defend the British Empire by force if called
upon"
Adolf Hitler - 1933

"A European war could be the end of all our efforts even if we should
win, because the disappearance of the British Empire would be a
misfortune which could not be made up again" - Adolf Hitler

"No sacrifice would have been too great in order to gain England's
alliance" Adolf Hitler - 1936

==

Was Hitler a warmonger?

"Germany will be perfectly ready to disband her entire military
establishment and destroy the small amount of arms remaining to her,
if the neighboring countries will do the same thing with equal
thoroughness. Germany is entirely ready to renounce aggressive weapons
of every sort if the armed nations, on their part, will destroy their
aggressive weapons within a specified period, and if their use is
forbidden by an international convention. Germany is at all times
prepared to renounce offensive weapons if the rest of the world does
the same. Germany is prepared to agree to any solemn pact of non-
aggression because she does not think of attacking anybody but only of
acquiring security"

- Adolf Hitler

==


"If the Nuremberg laws were applied, then every post-war American
president would have been hanged"
-Noam Chomsky

==


Adi Anant

hari....@indero.com

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May 1, 2007, 4:46:32 PM5/1/07
to
>Why use Hitler as a whipping boy, uncle tom? He loved your genocidal
>heroes:

Hitler admired all who he thought "arayans",ie. from n. europe and some
others. He like you thought those who rose up to put him down traitors
to the arayan heritage,ie. "uncle toms".

Smile, when in a corner change the subject. I use hitler because he is
an example of the end result of what radical religious and political
nutters in s. asia would want. Read again the book segment below.

I use hitler because the radical religious and political nutters in s.
asia of the mid 20 cent. admired him and adopted many of his attitudes
and ideologies about what to do about those "others" who defile the
"pure" and rightful rulers who are victums and have the right to destroy
to regain their rightful place in history, to regain a glorious history
once their's and now taken from them.

I Iuse hitler because his is an example of how right wing radicals the
world over have similar ideology and methods and goals. And we can
compare that sameness by the following:

Marcus Aurelius

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May 1, 2007, 5:20:27 PM5/1/07
to
On May 1, 3:46 pm, hari.ku...@indero.com wrote:
> >Why use Hitler as a whipping boy, uncle tom? He loved your genocidal
> >heroes:
>
> Hitler admired all who he thought "arayans",ie. from n. europe and some
> others. He like you thought those who rose up to put him down traitors
> to the arayan heritage,ie. "uncle toms".

You are too dense to understand even the crap you write.
Hitler admired the americans for racism and genocide. He admired the
british empire because it engaged in wholescale slaughter all over the
world.

The british empire was THE inspiration for Nazism.

Just like it is inspiring your kind, who converted to feel close to
the whites.

> Smile, when in a corner change the subject. I use hitler because he is
> an example of the end result of what radical religious and political
> nutters in s. asia would want. Read again the book segment below.

What kind of shit fills your heard, asswipe? You argue like a 5th
grader and believe that you kow what you are talking about! This is
preposterous!!

> I use hitler because the radical religious and political nutters in s.
> asia of the mid 20 cent. admired him and adopted many of his attitudes
> and ideologies about what to do about those "others" who defile the
> "pure" and rightful rulers who are victums and have the right to destroy
> to regain their rightful place in history, to regain a glorious history
> once their's and now taken from them.

WHICH "ideology" of Hitler was "adopted" by any Hindu group? Name ONE,
you stinking converted piece of trash.

Does the Indian majority, native and majority, not deserve to create
the country in the way it wants?! Scum like you is too retarded to
grasp the meaning of anything.

> I Iuse hitler because his is an example of how right wing radicals the
> world over have similar ideology and methods and goals. And we can
> compare that sameness by the following:

Scum, YOU are the right wing converted piece of shit who wants to deny
Hindus the same rights that majorities enjoy all over the planet.
Genocide is anathema to Hinduism, while your heroes have been doing it
for centuries.

Who were Hitler's (and uncle tom's here) heroes? The genocidal
cultures that this scum uncle tom is holding up as "ideal":

==

==

==

Was Hitler a warmonger?

- Adolf Hitler

==

==

You disgust me with your retarded arguments, your hatred of the rights
of the natives, and your absolutely asinine comparisons of apples and
oranges. To top it all, you believe that you know what you are talking
about, when it is abundantly clear that you are a freaking lunatic,
ranting about how great the ideology of destroying natives and their
cultures, is.

You sicken me. But it seems that you suffer from self-hatred more than
your hatred of Hindus. You are a pathetic spiritual black hole that
seeks to abuse those that avoided your hellish fate.


Adi Anant

hari....@indero.com

unread,
May 1, 2007, 7:03:23 PM5/1/07
to
"You disgust me with your retarded arguments, your hatred of the rights
of the natives, and your absolutely asinine comparisons of apples and
oranges. To top it all, you believe that you know what you are talking
about, when it is abundantly clear that you are a freaking lunatic,
ranting about how great the ideology of destroying natives and their
cultures, is.

You sicken me. But it seems that you suffer from self-hatred more than
your hatred of Hindus. You are a pathetic spiritual black hole that
seeks to abuse those that avoided your hellish fate."

There is a term used in psychology called projection. It means that
when a person attacks it can be exactly what is held as their own inner
thoughts they fear are in fact true of themselves.

I'm for the inherent human rights of all and the rule of law and
complete equal status before the law regardless of ethnic group or
religion or gender.

Given that specific expression of my values, exactly which "natives" do
you have in mind? In the context of s. asia the tribals are the
"natives". In the main the tribals are not hindu for having their own
cultures and language and religions by the scores.

I do not hate anyone, even you. I hate oppression and crude radical
chauvinism, all puffed up like a peacock with self glory. I hate when
people give themselves the absolute right to rule over others who are
unlike themselves and to treat those others in any fashion that suits
the radical agenda; including murder.

It is a fact of history that the mid 20th cent. s. asian radicals
admired and imitated the fascists of europe and japan. Specific mention
of those fascists and open embracing of their objectives can be found in
other passages of the book below; those parts can be posted if you wish.
And least we forget, let us mention the arse kissing fool bose and his
antics with the fascists.

How about the marching about with the imitation of uniforms in
paramilitary events with blood and guts speeches to turn up the passions
of the people about how much they are victums and how embracing a "pure"
version of some ideel retaking by force some past eutopia that never
existed, even to the point of riot and murder. That even today is pure
aping of european fascists movements. When the apple puts itself into
the basket with other apples then oranges are not suggested. To extend
the metafore, one rotten apple can corrupt all fruit.

Here is an example of the fascists worldview of the radical mid 20th
cent. s. asians, which with a few changes of place names and ethnic
reference could be a pure eurpean fascist speechof 1939:

Marcus Aurelius

unread,
May 1, 2007, 7:30:13 PM5/1/07
to
On May 1, 6:03 pm, hari.ku...@indero.com wrote:
> "You disgust me with your retarded arguments, your hatred of the rights
> of the natives, and your absolutely asinine comparisons of apples and
> oranges. To top it all, you believe that you know what you are talking
> about, when it is abundantly clear that you are a freaking lunatic,
> ranting about how great the ideology of destroying natives and their
> cultures, is.
>
> You sicken me. But it seems that you suffer from self-hatred more than
> your hatred of Hindus. You are a pathetic spiritual black hole that
> seeks to abuse those that avoided your hellish fate."
>
> There is a term used in psychology called projection. It means that
> when a person attacks it can be exactly what is held as their own inner
> thoughts they fear are in fact true of themselves.

There is a term in psychology called denial. It means that a perverted
person like yourself will do anything except face up to the fact he is
the source of evil, not the native cultures and religions of India.
You can rant all year, but you will never learn to look in a mirror.
You are scared of your own demons - like the loss of your identity,
which made you take on the uncle tom identity.

> I'm for the inherent human rights of all and the rule of law and
> complete equal status before the law regardless of ethnic group or
> religion or gender.

The hell you are. Even distributed human rights produce majority
rule.

You are a dark skinned convert to the ideologies of the white-skinned
genocidal cultures. You feel so emasculated in your own life that you
vicariously view the world through the eyes of white skinned racist
bigots. And you will do anything to curry favor with them.

> Given that specific expression of my values, exactly which "natives" do
> you have in mind? In the context of s. asia the tribals are the
> "natives". In the main the tribals are not hindu for having their own
> cultures and language and religions by the scores.

The natives of India are those that owe allegiance to local cultures
and religions. The rest are unassimilated leftovers of imperial
invasions.

> I do not hate anyone, even you. I hate oppression and crude radical
> chauvinism, all puffed up like a peacock with self glory. I hate when
> people give themselves the absolute right to rule over others who are
> unlike themselves and to treat those others in any fashion that suits
> the radical agenda; including murder.

Your words are so detached from your hatreds that I am beginning to
think that I overestimated your grade level earlier.

What happened to your claims that Hindu groups were "adopting Hitler's
ideologies". I asked you to name one and you went in this rant mode
about you being this and that shit.

I already know what you are. I want the world to know it too. Give
specifics when you attack Hindu groups. Insinuations and innuendos
will not do, sicko.

> It is a fact of history that the mid 20th cent. s. asian radicals
> admired and imitated the fascists of europe and japan. Specific mention
> of those fascists and open embracing of their objectives can be found in
> other passages of the book below; those parts can be posted if you wish.
> And least we forget, let us mention the arse kissing fool bose and his
> antics with the fascists.

It is a fact of history that enslaved people will tend to aid their
oppressor's enemies.
It is a fact of history that the british empire that you love so much
was THE inspiration behind Nazism.
It is a fact of history that millions of Indians died to starvation
under the british empire.
It is a fact of history that england got rich at the expense of
falling living standards in India.

And here you are - praising the evils of whites just because you or
your ancestors converted to their religion. Sickening.

> How about the marching about with the imitation of uniforms in
> paramilitary events with blood and guts speeches to turn up the passions
> of the people about how much they are victums and how embracing a "pure"
> version of some ideel retaking by force some past eutopia that never
> existed, even to the point of riot and murder. That even today is pure
> aping of european fascists movements. When the apple puts itself into
> the basket with other apples then oranges are not suggested. To extend
> the metafore, one rotten apple can corrupt all fruit.

ENOUGH of your inane rants already!
You have NO idea what you are talking about.
Do you even know WHAT fascism is?!?
Did I not show you that Nazism was INSPIRED by the british empire you
love so much, sicko?

HOW THE F*CK DID A GENOCIDAL EMPIRE BECOME YOUR IDEAL?!?

And you claim to be sane?!?? Pathetic sicko!

==

==

==

Was Hitler a warmonger?

- Adolf Hitler

==

==

Adi Anant

hari....@indero.com

unread,
May 1, 2007, 8:17:36 PM5/1/07
to
"HOW THE F*CK DID A GENOCIDAL EMPIRE BECOME YOUR IDEAL?!?

And you claim to be sane?!?? Pathetic sicko!"

Smile, it is interesting that all of the above is of your imagination
and inner agitation, nowhere have I said any such thing nor praised the
brits in this discussion. They can speak for themselves. The
discussion at hand are the s. asian fascists who must stand or fall on
their own merit and historical behaviorss, such as they are.

In addition to human rights for all and full equality before the law
regardless of ethnicity and religion and gender I also believe in full
freedom of speech. It is by that means as they give full voice to their
real inner convictions that we can know the nutters and radicals and
those irrelevant among the chatter and guard ourselves against them..

You give yourself the excuse to act as a fascist today and excuse the
radical excess of the s. asians of 70 years ago by the bad deeds in
past of the brits? We don't need the brits as a reference to see the
fascists, using your suggestion one need only look in the mirror and
relative to theeuropean fascists that were aped to an extent even today.

Do you think the girls find that smart uniform and all that parading
about fetching? And do the fellows down at the local tea shop look with
admiration when they see their own home grown fascists as a point of
pride because of it?


You ask me for an example of s. asian fascists, the name of one was
there in every one of my posts, for your benefit and memory aid,
recalling too my offer to post from the same book the specific
references to hitler and other fascists as having the right turn of mind
and solutions:

Marcus Aurelius

unread,
May 1, 2007, 8:40:41 PM5/1/07
to
On May 1, 7:17 pm, hari.ku...@indero.com wrote:
> "HOW THE F*CK DID A GENOCIDAL EMPIRE BECOME YOUR IDEAL?!?
>
> And you claim to be sane?!?? Pathetic sicko!"
>
> Smile, it is interesting that all of the above is of your imagination
> and inner agitation, nowhere have I said any such thing nor praised the
> brits in this discussion. They can speak for themselves. The
> discussion at hand are the s. asian fascists who must stand or fall on
> their own merit and historical behaviorss, such as they are.

Retard, the original article by Frawley makes the distinctions and you
contested the distinctions. Without making any specific argument, I
might add.

You have done NOTHING to refute the contents of the original article.
You merely repeat the inane labels that the brits applied to Indians.

> In addition to human rights for all and full equality before the law
> regardless of ethnicity and religion and gender I also believe in full
> freedom of speech. It is by that means as they give full voice to their
> real inner convictions that we can know the nutters and radicals and
> those irrelevant among the chatter and guard ourselves against them..

Do you even understand the words you write?

> You give yourself the excuse to act as a fascist today and excuse the
> radical excess of the s. asians of 70 years ago by the bad deeds in
> past of the brits? We don't need the brits as a reference to see the
> fascists, using your suggestion one need only look in the mirror and
> relative to theeuropean fascists that were aped to an extent even today.

Again, do you even know WHAT fascism means, retard?
Why are you shying away from getting to specifics, rather than
continue in your deluded rants attacking Hindus?

> Do you think the girls find that smart uniform and all that parading
> about fetching? And do the fellows down at the local tea shop look with
> admiration when they see their own home grown fascists as a point of
> pride because of it?

Are you senile? Can you say anything that is specific and relevant,
rather than foam at the mouth about Hindu revivalist movements?

> You ask me for an example of s. asian fascists, the name of one was
> there in every one of my posts, for your benefit and memory aid,
> recalling too my offer to post from the same book the specific
> references to hitler and other fascists as having the right turn of mind
> and solutions:

You ARE demented.

You equate Golwalker, who wanted assimilation - the same thing people
in Europe and US are asking of immigrants, with Nazism. What a sick
piece of trash you are. Nazism was inspired by imperialism, which used
christianity to justify itself. Should the world forget the subversive
roles played by the religions foreign to India?


Adi Anant

hari....@indero.com

unread,
May 2, 2007, 9:26:34 AM5/2/07
to
If anyone is still reading this thread and wants more in depth
consideration of the issues of s. asian fascism as history and as
reflected today see:

http://www.sabrang.com/gujarat/rssbible.htm

http://www.geocities.com/indianfascism/fascism/organizations.htm

Regardless of name and excuse for doing so, would the s. asian fascism
embrace all ethnic groups as equals and brothers, all religions as
private matters with equal standing, all people and gender having human
rights only because they exist, full equal standing before the law and
rule of law and not rule of the strong over the weak, the right for each
person to decide how to live as long as it does not harm others?

Compare the above with this and each can decide:

Marcus Aurelius

unread,
May 2, 2007, 1:03:41 PM5/2/07
to
On May 2, 8:26 am, hari.ku...@indero.com wrote:
> If anyone is still reading this thread and wants more in depth
> consideration of the issues of s. asian fascism as history and as
> reflected today see:
>
> http://www.sabrang.com/gujarat/rssbible.htm
>
> http://www.geocities.com/indianfascism/fascism/organizations.htm

Brainwashed idiots who don't know the meaning of the world "fascism"
are hardly to be believed about their labels. Add Hindu-haters in the
mix and you get outrageously poisonous groups like sabrang, FOIL, SAJA
etc.

> Regardless of name and excuse for doing so, would the s. asian fascism
> embrace all ethnic groups as equals and brothers, all religions as
> private matters with equal standing, all people and gender having human
> rights only because they exist, full equal standing before the law and
> rule of law and not rule of the strong over the weak, the right for each
> person to decide how to live as long as it does not harm others?

If is communalism to say that that a minority, being weak in numbers,
should be equal to the majority, which is strong in numbers. It is
anti-democratic. India has no obligation to bring equality between
religions - only to bring equality in political rights of every
citizen.

> Compare the above with this and each can decide:
>
> THE HATE-MINORITIES MESSAGE OF THE `RSS BIBLE'
>
> "The foreign races in Hindusthan must either adopt the Hindu culture
> and language, must learn to respect and hold in reverence Hindu
> religion, must entertain no idea but those of the glorification of the
> Hindu race and culture, i.e., of the Hindu nation and must loose their
> separate existence to merge in the Hindu race, or may stay in the
> country, wholly subordinated to the Hindu Nation, claiming nothing,
> deserving no privileges, far less any preferential treatment -- not
> even citizen's rights. There is, at least, should be, no other course
> for them to adopt. We are an old nation; let us deal, as old nations
> ought to and do deal, with the foreign races, who have chosen to live
> in our country".
>
> -- Madhav Sadashiv Golwalkar's, We or Our Nationhood Defined

Asking disparate and unassimilated groups to work on assimilation or
be treated as hostile is what Europe and USA are doing to immigrants
today. Not to mention that the unassimilated groups in India, like
many mohamedans and christians, are remnants of viciously murderous
invasions of the Hindu subcontinent. Any sane mind would try to make
those memories of slavery and slaughter of Hindus be forgotten, and
not kept alive by refusing to assimilate into the majority culture.

If you really want to see what hatred is, read the Bible or the
Koran.


Adi Anant

hari....@indero.com

unread,
May 2, 2007, 2:37:21 PM5/2/07
to
"Asking disparate and unassimilated groups to work on assimilation or
be treated as hostile is what Europe and USA are doing to immigrants
today. Not to mention that the unassimilated groups in India, like
many mohamedans and christians, are remnants of viciously murderous
invasions of the Hindu subcontinent. Any sane mind would try to make
those memories of slavery and slaughter of Hindus be forgotten, and
not kept alive by refusing to assimilate into the majority culture.

If you really want to see what hatred is, read the Bible or the
Koran."

Indeed, the same principles of fascism the world over, whereever and
whenever it rases its ugly head. This was my original point, the right
in india is very real as above and it differes only in content not
principles from all fascism where and when it occurs.

We are victums and to find justice we will in turn find our own victums.
Oh where oh where can we find them. Of course, find someone whose
ethnicity or language or religion is different and make them the handy
victum so we can feel like real humans. The powerful can only be so if
there the complimentary weak to flatter the master's self glory.

Aside from those from other countries who choose to live in s. asia for
individual reasons, all people of s. asia are of ethnic groups who have
been there for thousands of years. Ahindu can become a buddist or a
buddist a hindu and neither suddenlly erase the thousands of generations
who have gone before. At one time buddism was dominate from afganistan
to viet nam. Does this mean all today in the same areas are
"outsiders"? From what area did all those outsider hindus come to
populate much of s. asia? The tribals, non-hindu, are the original
peoples of s. asia. Who then is the outsider and who must assimilate
with whom?

India has chosen to live and let live as to one's choice as to ethnic
expression, language, and religion until and unless to do so harms
others. Indians decided to do this, not outsiders. The below is a
failed program that has been rejected in all places it has been tried.
Why should india who is finally finding its place on the global scene
decide to imitate the same failures?

Marcus Aurelius

unread,
May 2, 2007, 3:04:18 PM5/2/07
to
On May 2, 1:37 pm, hari.ku...@indero.com wrote:
> "Asking disparate and unassimilated groups to work on assimilation or
> be treated as hostile is what Europe and USA are doing to immigrants
> today. Not to mention that the unassimilated groups in India, like
> many mohamedans and christians, are remnants of viciously murderous
> invasions of the Hindu subcontinent. Any sane mind would try to make
> those memories of slavery and slaughter of Hindus be forgotten, and
> not kept alive by refusing to assimilate into the majority culture.
>
> If you really want to see what hatred is, read the Bible or the
> Koran."
>
> Indeed, the same principles of fascism the world over, whereever and
> whenever it rases its ugly head. This was my original point, the right
> in india is very real as above and it differes only in content not
> principles from all fascism where and when it occurs.

The right doesn't even exist in India yet.
You want the majority, and native at that, to not use its rights. You
are a pathetic self-centered lowlife with anti-democratic, anti-Hindu
and anti-majority prejudices.


> been there for thousands of years. Ahindu can become a buddist or a
> buddist a hindu and neither suddenlly erase the thousands of generations
> who have gone before. At one time buddism was dominate from afganistan
> to viet nam. Does this mean all today in the same areas are
> "outsiders"? From what area did all those outsider hindus come to
> populate much of s. asia? The tribals, non-hindu, are the original
> peoples of s. asia. Who then is the outsider and who must assimilate
> with whom?

The native majority must rule - that is the very definition of a
democracy. Your communal poison, advocating equality between imperial
hateful religions and the rights of the native beliefs, is so far
beyond mere hate that it fits in well with your violent middle-eastern
religious books. Those are incompatible with the Indic civilization.

Indic civilization must assimilate the hateful books of your kind by
changing the allegiance and beliefs of their followers. Anything else
would be giving in to the communal hatred of your kind, which wants to
deny the Indian majority their rights to rule.

> India has chosen to live and let live as to one's choice as to ethnic
> expression, language, and religion until and unless to do so harms
> others. Indians decided to do this, not outsiders. The below is a
> failed program that has been rejected in all places it has been tried.
> Why should india who is finally finding its place on the global scene
> decide to imitate the same failures?

Because the ideologies of the imperial hateful religions that invaded
India not be allowed to be equated with the inclusive basis of the
Indic civilization. Assimilate into the superior Indic cultures, or be
treated as hostile to Indian majority - that is the rational choice
before the remnants of those hatreds that persecuted India for
centuries, and even now demand to be taken as equal to the Indian
majority.

All symbols of the old hatreds against Indian faiths must be removed
from sight. Just like statues of Lenin were removed from Eastern
Europeans countries, all mosques/churches built upon demolished
temples must be destroyed.

Your kind wishes to perpetuate the symbols of hatred because of some
feeling of kinship with the invaders rather than with the Indian
persecuted majority. Your kind wants the persecuting imperial faiths
to be given equal importance as the native faiths that grew up in
India and are its majority. Your kind is a sick mentality trying to
infect India again, while India is trying to get back to health.


Adi Anant

hari....@indero.com

unread,
May 2, 2007, 3:55:20 PM5/2/07
to

It is amusing you try to make me the subject of the thread, you know
nothing about me in the least, smile. You do however project the
obvious hatred unto me as some form of object of all you dislike. I
gladly accept that burden if for no other reason that fascism may be
revealed in all its ugliness.

The majority of india has spoken and continues to speak, human rights
for all regardless of ethnicity or language or religion. Equal status
before and the rule of the law over rule of ruthless force.

If by nose count most of those who voted happen also to be hindu, and
none can agree even what that is, then indeed your very wish has come
true. The major religion has chosen the above path. Count the noses
and weep, sometimes we are punished by getting what we ask for.

Most of all, thank you for confirming in detail your path of fascism, as
it conforms to the below. A question if you please, in your glorious
future, how will all the "must" statements below be implemented, don't
hold back now, do tell us how all will be achieved? Will you borrow any
of the methods of the one eyed mulla of the taliban with which the below
has much in common in spirit?

Marcus Aurelius

unread,
May 2, 2007, 4:36:43 PM5/2/07
to

You are a pathetic self-centered lowlife with anti-democratic, anti-
Hindu and anti-majority prejudices.

Your kind has led to India's downfall countless times in the past, and
you still keep poisoning India with your malice against Hindus.

But the Indic civilization, based upon Hinduism, is becomig more and
more immume to your venom. Keep ranting, but the juggernaut of Indian
native awakening will keep gaining strength.

And I shall so enjoy you squirming in despair that your hatred of
Hindus has become impotent when rid of its facade of "equality".


Adi Anant

hari....@indero.com

unread,
May 2, 2007, 5:29:02 PM5/2/07
to
"You are a pathetic self-centered lowlife with anti-democratic, anti-
Hindu and anti-majority prejudices."

I declare that all humans should have equal rights in full and equal
status before and under the rule of law. I'm, nay my ideas, are very
dangerous for fascism because it can not thrive in its light.

"Your kind has led to India's downfall countless times in the past, and
you still keep poisoning India with your malice against Hindus.

I stand beside one small man who was there when the brits left. I smile
with great pride that fascism failed to see brit blood running in the
streets when in '47 one flag came down and another went up and all shook
hands and went home.

"But the Indic civilization, based upon Hinduism, is becomig more and
more immume to your venom. Keep ranting, but the juggernaut of Indian
native awakening will keep gaining strength."

There was never such. The history of s. asia has constantly been one of
political conquest with some areas under control and then collapse into
small local groups. That is why there is no single ethnicity nor
language nor religion but a vast complex patchwork of each. India is
not hinduism and hinduism is not india. The largest of these political
periods in history was a buddist period. I too hope the "native",ie the
tribal, strength increases.

"And I shall so enjoy you squirming in despair that your hatred of
Hindus has become impotent when rid of its facade of "equality"."

You know nothing about me, smile. You know nothing about my personal
religious, or lack thereof, views. That is as it should be, these are
matters of personal choice and as little or as much of those views made
open as one chooses.

If one is alive in india and a citizen as the constitution describes,
then one is fully indian.

Is the implied threat above your first small step in answer to my
question? How will all the "musts" of below be realized? Come now,
don't shrink back, tell us exactly what will be done with me and those
majority of indians, as the nose count and the ballot box testifies, who
stand in the way of fascism as in the agenda below? The rest of the
world wants to know, including all those on the world stage which india
now is joining in business and political matters.

Marcus Aurelius

unread,
May 2, 2007, 5:46:25 PM5/2/07
to

You are a pathetic self-centered communal lowlife with anti-


democratic, anti-Hindu and anti-majority prejudices.

That about sums it all up. Your gobbledygook pretensions
notwithstanding, you are poison for humankind.


Adi Anant

hari....@indero.com

unread,
May 2, 2007, 7:01:04 PM5/2/07
to
"You are a pathetic self-centered communal lowlife with anti-
democratic, anti-Hindu and anti-majority prejudices.

That about sums it all up. Your gobbledygook pretensions
notwithstanding, you are poison for humankind."

Before going on, do yu have one of those so smart paramilitary uniforms
the girls find so fetching and the fellows down at the tea shop so
admire?

Jiten

unread,
May 2, 2007, 8:09:25 PM5/2/07
to

> The Myth of the Hindu Right
>
> By David Frawley
>
> In media accounts today, any group that identifies itself
> as Hindu or tries to promote any Hindu cause is immediately
> and uncritically defined as "right-winged". In the leftist
> accounts that commonly come from the Indian press, Hindu
> organizations are also routinely called militants and
> fascists. However, if we look at their actual views, Hindu
> groups have a very different ideology and practices than
> the political right in other countries. In fact many Hindu
> causes are more at home in the left in the West than in the
> right.

In the midst of the learned treatise on our dharma by Swami David
Frawley,
wonder if I can give an outline of my longish life in Britain and
state that but
for the understanding of our dharma I would have been reduced to a
trembling
skeleton in a secure Happy Farm.

Who knows some good may come of the following:

Please note: For thirty-odd years I have been seeking redress of
horrid official
wrongs in the U.K. At first to have father's access to my child and
now that the
child is a young lady living somewhere in the UK, to assuage her
wounded heart
by somehow letting her know that I did not abandon her, the
officialdom named
below had decreed so. Any help in forcing the official child-snatchers
either to
clear their name in court or redress the gross miscarriage of justice
would be
welcome with thanks, is my cri de coeur.

British courts suffused with slave-master itch
by
Jiten Bardwaj
Internet to help redress horrid official wrongs in the land of
mother of
parliaments

All but forty years ago the British officialdom decided I was an
awkward squaddie,
a nobody and an Indian pagan to boot. Three if not four pillars of the
establishment
armed with all the expertise gleaned in the erstwhile empire of how to
be shot of
uppity natives then set about putting me in my place, days of guns is,
well, passe.

As past masters of the divide and rule dictum they had a perfect foil
in me even
though I had a thing in common with their leader of the pack Nathan
Miller: we
were both immigrants albeit he was from South Africa, begotten of the
master
race and trained as a lawyer under the apartheid regime. There was one
more
thing in common but it snapped with a bang and I became Ex-zionist
when I
found out he was Jewish, such was his nazi bent.

I will try to write as I usually speak, in courtly language and dulcet
of tone. My
native instinct tells me it is safer to shout from the roof-tops. That
is why I keep
contesting parliamentary elections when money permits and write
pamphlets
that name names.

Some letters of mine couched in semi-humorous vein have appeared in
the
Times (London) and other national papers but they refuse to publish
how my
young family was torn apart on spurious grounds.

Then there is the small matter of my being hounded about by the
servants of
the state till I became a pensioner recently. Now I get court summons
only: at
present a case against me is being repeatedly adjourned as the police
fail to
turn up at the Stevenage Magistrates court.

We will mention miracles below but lets make a detour to India and
highlight some
of our gifts to the human family: Yoga and meditation will set us free
from our own
yoke; cuisine that pleases and nourishes; ditto KamaSutra; the decimal
system
and the power of zero; fast forward to Vedic Maths which adds lustre
to the digits.
I share my knowledge of the first and the last named in this list
gratis with all who
are interested.

One would think that along with the sacrifices of my kith and kin with
valour second
to none in world war after world war (both my elder brothers served in
the last war),
not to mention the resources from the colonies worth billions off-
loaded around the
white cliffs of UK, one would think official Britain would have zero
racism but no, racism
rules ok. Lets put some nuance to my nuisance.

I was married to an Englishwoman* (see next para), the mother of our
baby daughter.
According to Nathan Miller's Torah I had thereby sinned, nay,
committed a crime. It was
after about two years of Millers' affidavits, injunctions, threats of
more legal actions that
I got to know of his antecedents.

[*My wife a graduate and a school teacher but alas! was terrified of
authorities, she had
seen her mother taken away by the British police never to see her
again, was put in a
children's home and then adopted. When the police started coming to
take me she used
to be petrified. Eventually she fell in with the lies of Millers & Co
and I was denied access
to our daughter.]

My 'real crime' was that I had stood for election to parliament to
proclaim that I had
been convicted on trumped-up charges at Bow Street court of assaulting
police Sgt
Hole outside the House of Commons. MPs like Ivor Clemitson, Jack
Straw, Marion Roe,
Michael Howard QC, Martin Bell, Peter Lilley, police chiefs of Essex,
Beds, London,
Herts, Hants et al merrily go on aiding & abetting crime and cover-up.

If we cannot use the parliament method, sired by Due Process out of
Proper Channels,
to highlight a gross miscarriage of justice then where and what do the
Biggerwigs
suggest we do? Join one of the terrorist outfits? Even the great
warrior Blair is ever
ready to open the No 10 door to welcome bombers and gunmen provided
they are
'one of us' in skin colour and / or of Abrahamic lineage. Sorry a bit,
Tony Blair, I no can
do gunning or bombing, no know Abraham from Adam.

After a total of nearly six years of shenanigans in the courts by
Miller & Co, F Phillimore
and later by Wms & Co and Miskin the imperial dictum had borne fruit:
I was sans wife
and daughter, our house usurped, my money and liberty regularly looted
and trampled
on by the powers-that-are the courts, the police and the bailiffs.
What a dish of ghoulash
to set before the Afghani, Iraqi & Co.

Yes, I have contested a few more parliamentary elections and never
been had up for
anything but more trumped-up charges and being officially duffed-up.
The authorities are
right to be aggrieved at my going-on after nearly forty years of
persecution. More than
once I stopped my campaign but the system is not for the non-one-of-
us.

To survive I needed some miracles to escape the traps the judicial
system springs on me.
Thanks to the cosmos coming to my aid in the shape of a god in human
form or by some
other means, so with one leap I would go free. There is a limit to
what the greatest judicial
system in the world can do to pervert the course of justice, no? Yea,
there was another
putrid miscarriage of justice against me in the high court last year,
in Jan 2006.
Judge John Privet QC, barrister Jane Phillips, solicitors Thakrar &
Co, all representing ISKCON,
perverted the course of justice just like the US did against Jack
Johnson, the first black
heavyweight world champion.

In the next piece I will again work-in the bit on how I won the Six-
day war for Israel when
almost all the Jewish and other visitors had fled back to the safety
of Europe, US, Canada,
Argentine etc and I paid, oh dear, dearly for it a few years later in
the U.K.

I hold the world record for most appearances in courts, some 200 give
or take a baker's
dozen, almost all on trumped-up charges and losing every one of them,
even the few times
I instigated the proceedings. This breaks all the laws of averages,
chance, Sod's and
Murphy's, toss of the coin, probability, game theory, relativity,
(relativity?), all combined.

So with all the ups and downs we the elders have brought you the next-
Gen to the new
century, it is in your hands to keep the wonder and ecstasy of love
and shining humanity
alive and well till, till the last bugle call, after which the cosmic
dance-drama will start again.

Jiten Bardwaj, Yoga & Meditation prospective parliamentary candidate;
editor COPS
Gazette - just an arresting name. 25 April 2007.

Marcus Aurelius

unread,
May 2, 2007, 9:52:34 PM5/2/07
to
On May 2, 6:01 pm, hari.ku...@indero.com wrote:
> "You are a pathetic self-centered communal lowlife with anti-
> democratic, anti-Hindu and anti-majority prejudices.
>
> That about sums it all up. Your gobbledygook pretensions
> notwithstanding, you are poison for humankind."
>
> Before going on, do yu have one of those so smart paramilitary uniforms
> the girls find so fetching and the fellows down at the tea shop so
> admire?
>
> Is the implied threat above your first small step in answer to my
> question? How will all the "musts" of below be realized? Come now,
> don't shrink back, tell us exactly what will be done with me and those
> majority of indians, as the nose count and the ballot box testifies, who
> stand in the way of fascism as in the agenda below? The rest of the
> world wants to know, including all those on the world stage which india
> now is joining in business and political matters.

You are a pathetic self-centered communal lowlife with anti-
democratic, anti-Hindu and anti-majority prejudices.

That just about sums it all up.

It is people like you who make Gowalkar realize the poison that
unassimilated leftovers of imperial invasions, and covert missionary
operations, can be.


Adi Anant

ranjit_...@yahoo.com

unread,
May 3, 2007, 8:03:35 AM5/3/07
to
On Apr 30, 9:06 pm, use...@mantra.com and/or www.mantra.com/jai (Dr.

Jai Maharaj) wrote:
> The Hindu Movement and Caste
> The Hindu right is often defined in the media in terms of
> caste, as favoring the upper castes over the lower castes.
> This is another distortion that is often intentional.

Disortion? Is there an instance of the Hindu right having come to the
lower castes' rescue, in a situation where they have met a sorry fate
at the hand of upper castes?

> Modern Hindu teachers have been at the forefront of
> removing caste. This includes great figures like
> Vivekanand, Mahatma Gandhi and Aurobindo.

Sorry; none of these even attempted to remove either varna or jati. Or
is caste something other than varna and something other than jati?

> It includes major Hindu movements

Is there any major Hindu movement that accepts jati but rejects
chaturvarna? Rejects chaturvarna entirely, that is, not just birth
based varna.

> like the Arya Samaj, the largest Vedic
> movement in modern India, and the Swadhyaya movement.

The Arya Samaj does not reject varna. The Arya Samaj (in theory)
rejects jatis which would automatically imply rejection of the notion
of assigning varna according to one's jati.

> The RSS, the largest so-called Hindu right wing group,
> rejects caste

Do they reject varna? Can you produce the following statement from the
RSS?
"Chaturvarna is nonsense; there are no brahmanas, kshatriyas, vaishyas
or sudras"?

> and works to remove it from Hindu society,


> giving prominence to leaders from lower classes

What is an example of a "lower class" RSS leader bossing over "upper
class" RSS leaders?

> and working
> to open the Hindu priesthood to members of all castes.

> While ...
>
> read more »


hari....@indero.com

unread,
May 3, 2007, 10:22:35 AM5/3/07
to
"It is people like you who make Gowalkar realize the poison that
unassimilated leftovers of imperial invasions, and covert missionary
operations, can be."

Would that be the muslims the buddists, the jainism the sikhism the
lingayat the zoroastrians the christians the jews Zor the hundreds of
tribal religions? Does it include the many many sub divisions of
hinduism? More important does it include those who have no or little
religious views beyond enjoying religious holidays? That latter group
might be in fact the largest of all groups.

Do "leftovers" mean also those whose political or cultural or ethnic
views don't confirm your's? Does it include all those who have adopted
global views of industry and education and science and human rights and
equality before and under the rule of law? Should we even raise the
language question? Does it include those english speaking trained in
science and business people who have made the recent economic progress
possible because of their value on the global scene with those skills?

Do speak boldly, what is to be done with all those "unassimilated" above
in your new eutopia to come under the below banner of fascism of the
masters? Will there be camps, forced migration, slavery, forced
conversions, forced language use, forced arse kissing toward the
"superior" group, consultation with the taliban, close expection of
german records, etc. etc.?

harmony

unread,
May 3, 2007, 11:28:16 AM5/3/07
to

"Marcus Aurelius" <arya...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1178157154.3...@q75g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...

> On May 2, 6:01 pm, hari.ku...@indero.com wrote:
>> "You are a pathetic self-centered communal lowlife with anti-
>> democratic, anti-Hindu and anti-majority prejudices.
>>
>> That about sums it all up. Your gobbledygook pretensions
>> notwithstanding, you are poison for humankind."
>>
>> Before going on, do yu have one of those so smart paramilitary uniforms
>> the girls find so fetching and the fellows down at the tea shop so
>> admire?
>>
>> Is the implied threat above your first small step in answer to my
>> question? How will all the "musts" of below be realized? Come now,
>> don't shrink back, tell us exactly what will be done with me and those
>> majority of indians, as the nose count and the ballot box testifies, who
>> stand in the way of fascism as in the agenda below? The rest of the
>> world wants to know, including all those on the world stage which india
>> now is joining in business and political matters.
>
> You are a pathetic self-centered communal lowlife with anti-
> democratic, anti-Hindu and anti-majority prejudices.
>
> That just about sums it all up.
>
> It is people like you who make Gowalkar realize the poison that
> unassimilated leftovers of imperial invasions, and covert missionary
> operations, can be.
>
>
> Adi Anant
>

qed


Marcus Aurelius

unread,
May 3, 2007, 2:36:50 PM5/3/07
to
On May 3, 9:22 am, hari.ku...@indero.com wrote:
> "It is people like you who make Gowalkar realize the poison that
> unassimilated leftovers of imperial invasions, and covert missionary
> operations, can be."
>
> Would that be the muslims the buddists, the jainism the sikhism the
> lingayat the zoroastrians the christians the jews Zor the hundreds of
> tribal religions? Does it include the many many sub divisions of
> hinduism? More important does it include those who have no or little
> religious views beyond enjoying religious holidays? That latter group
> might be in fact the largest of all groups.

You get more pathetic with each response.
To hide your own malevolence, you try to hide behind outrightly
ludicrous arguments.
Buddhists, Jains, Sikhs, Zoroastrians etc are not imperial faiths.
They do not owe allegiance to forces, people or places outside India
any more than they do to Indians. They do not rant against Hindus the
way your kind does.
As such, they are considered assimilated and NATIVE to India. Just
like the tribal gods and atheists who do not wish harm to any other
native faith of India.

> Do "leftovers" mean also those whose political or cultural or ethnic
> views don't confirm your's? Does it include all those who have adopted
> global views of industry and education and science and human rights and
> equality before and under the rule of law? Should we even raise the
> language question? Does it include those english speaking trained in
> science and business people who have made the recent economic progress
> possible because of their value on the global scene with those skills?

The "leftovers" are those groups which act as agents of outside
interests in the Hindu subcontinent - the radical mohamedans and the
missionary supporters, for example. The marxists, who seek to impose
communism - which is an imperial faith, are unassimilated "leftovers".
The "leftovers" are those uncle toms who still cling to the anti-Hindu
ideas fed to them for centuries by the western media, such as
yourself.

> Do speak boldly, what is to be done with all those "unassimilated" above
> in your new eutopia to come under the below banner of fascism of the
> masters? Will there be camps, forced migration, slavery, forced
> conversions, forced language use, forced arse kissing toward the
> "superior" group, consultation with the taliban, close expection of
> german records, etc. etc.?

How retarded can you be? You think that rule by majority is "fascism"?
You just demonstrated the poison of unassimilated groups that I was
talking about.

Your kind would rather worship a white, blue eyed Jesus rather than a
dark skinned Kali. Your self-hatred is what poisons the Indian
subcontinent. Your despair over your own origins is what poisons the
Indian subcontinent. Your venomous hatred for the native faiths is
what poisons the Indian subcontinent.

The whites had a healthy self-esteem. They changed Jesus to look like
them. They changed the bible to reflect themselves. The chinese
changed Buddha to look chinese. They also changed Buddhism to take on
chinese characteristics. So did the Japanese.

Your kind hates anything that looks like you.

Your kind is poison. Assimilation is the only way for India to remove
the source of such poisons.


Adi Anant

hari....@indero.com

unread,
May 3, 2007, 4:07:41 PM5/3/07
to
"How retarded can you be? You think that rule by majority is "fascism"?
You just demonstrated the poison of unassimilated groups that I was
talking about.

Your kind would rather worship a white, blue eyed Jesus rather than a
dark skinned Kali. Your self-hatred is what poisons the Indian
subcontinent. Your despair over your own origins is what poisons the
Indian subcontinent. Your venomous hatred for the native faiths is
what poisons the Indian subcontinent.

The whites had a healthy self-esteem. They changed Jesus to look like
them. They changed the bible to reflect themselves. The chinese
changed Buddha to look chinese. They also changed Buddhism to take on
chinese characteristics. So did the Japanese.

Your kind hates anything that looks like you.

Your kind is poison. Assimilation is the only way for India to remove
the source of such poisons."

Come now, have we chinese/japanese done all that really? Are the voices
that wisper in your ear about me a small weak mumblin voice or a clear
strong one?

This is what I have been asking you to step up and declare, how will the
"assimilation" be accomplished? I note some desperation from you
wanting to be able to put a label on me, smile, you know nothing. If
one can label then one can dispatch, in the new eutopia of the
"assimilated".

Will the camps have computer internet connections and tv and as part of
the re-education program? Will the camps divide by label of ethnicity,
caste, language, religion; or absence thereof; and the other ways the
weak are identified that the masters may take their proper place as the
"majority" in controling them?

Am I retarded to think the below is pure thinking of "fascism so popular
at the time it was written, not to mention the specific admiration for
the success of "fascism ineurope of "cleaning" the "unassimilated" in
other parts of the book? Am I so indeed when you reflect the same
thinking today using other code words and allusions admiring the same
principles of "fascism using the same tactics of victom and regaining a
glorious past taken from you?

Marcus Aurelius

unread,
May 3, 2007, 4:39:13 PM5/3/07
to
On May 3, 3:07 pm, hari.ku...@indero.com wrote:
> "How retarded can you be? You think that rule by majority is "fascism"?
> You just demonstrated the poison of unassimilated groups that I was
> talking about.
>
> Your kind would rather worship a white, blue eyed Jesus rather than a
> dark skinned Kali. Your self-hatred is what poisons the Indian
> subcontinent. Your despair over your own origins is what poisons the
> Indian subcontinent. Your venomous hatred for the native faiths is
> what poisons the Indian subcontinent.
>
> The whites had a healthy self-esteem. They changed Jesus to look like
> them. They changed the bible to reflect themselves. The chinese
> changed Buddha to look chinese. They also changed Buddhism to take on
> chinese characteristics. So did the Japanese.
>
> Your kind hates anything that looks like you.
>
> Your kind is poison. Assimilation is the only way for India to remove
> the source of such poisons."
>
> Come now, have we chinese/japanese done all that really? Are the voices
> that wisper in your ear about me a small weak mumblin voice or a clear
> strong one?

Get a grip, retard. Are you even capable of comprehension of written
text?

> This is what I have been asking you to step up and declare, how will the
> "assimilation" be accomplished? I note some desperation from you
> wanting to be able to put a label on me, smile, you know nothing. If
> one can label then one can dispatch, in the new eutopia of the
> "assimilated".

Assimilation will happen when poisons like yourself are made impotent.
And that means that the majority learns to use its rights, rather than
pandering to unassimilated leftovers of imperial ideologies.

> Will the camps have computer internet connections and tv and as part of
> the re-education program? Will the camps divide by label of ethnicity,
> caste, language, religion; or absence thereof; and the other ways the
> weak are identified that the masters may take their proper place as the
> "majority" in controling them?

The majority has no masters. Your poison is showing, retard.
The majority will rule by democratic means, and that means native
rights shall not be ignored just to appease poisonous unassimilated
segments.
Tell your masters, whether in arabia, rome or texas, that their hatred
of Hindus shall not be tolerated in India, anymore.

> Am I retarded to think the below is pure thinking of "fascism so popular
> at the time it was written, not to mention the specific admiration for
> the success of "fascism ineurope of "cleaning" the "unassimilated" in
> other parts of the book? Am I so indeed when you reflect the same
> thinking today using other code words and allusions admiring the same
> principles of "fascism using the same tactics of victom and regaining a
> glorious past taken from you?

Where does it say "cleaning", retard?
Ethnic cleansing is foreign to Hinduism, which is inclusive and
assimilative.
Your poison is showing, retard.

The glorious past that Hindus talk of was self-rule with high
prosperity. Why are you suggesting that somehow it was less good than
the imperial rule of minority mohamedans or christians where tens of
millions died due to neglect and abuse?
Your poison is showing, retard.

It is _you_ show is fascist, and wants to deny self-rule to the Indian
majority. It is _you_ who hates his own identity so much that he hates
anything Indian, especially the Indian majority.

It is _you_ who wants to remain as an agent of foreign hostile
ideologies. You are the poison in India.

> THE HATE-MINORITIES MESSAGE OF THE `RSS BIBLE'
>
> "The foreign races in Hindusthan must either adopt the Hindu culture
> and language, must learn to respect and hold in reverence Hindu
> religion, must entertain no idea but those of the glorification of the
> Hindu race and culture, i.e., of the Hindu nation and must loose their
> separate existence to merge in the Hindu race, or may stay in the
> country, wholly subordinated to the Hindu Nation, claiming nothing,
> deserving no privileges, far less any preferential treatment -- not
> even citizen's rights. There is, at least, should be, no other course
> for them to adopt. We are an old nation; let us deal, as old nations
> ought to and do deal, with the foreign races, who have chosen to live
> in our country".
>
> -- Madhav Sadashiv Golwalkar's, We or Our Nationhood Defined

It doesn't advocate killing anybody. It doesn't advocate ethnic
cleaning. It doesn't advocate being hostile to friends.

It does advocate being hostile to hostile ideologies.

And a retard like you calls that "fascism"?

Now you know why I call you "poisonous" to the Indian identity.


Adi Anant

hari....@indero.com

unread,
May 4, 2007, 9:09:40 AM5/4/07
to
"It doesn't advocate killing anybody. It doesn't advocate ethnic
cleaning. It doesn't advocate being hostile to friends.

It does advocate being hostile to hostile ideologies.

And a retard like you calls that "fascism"?

Now you know why I call you "poisonous" to the Indian identity."

Oh what smooth sweet words of comfort. The majority of indians, the
hindu majority, say "no" in the voting box to your program. Why do you
resist the hindu majority? When that majority stands up to say "no" in
your future mythical eutopia, what will be done to them? When the
millions of non-hindu stand and say "no" what will you do? Tell us
again, and be exact if you please, how the "musts" in the below will be
realized?

hari....@indero.com

unread,
May 4, 2007, 1:22:48 PM5/4/07
to
"It doesn't advocate killing anybody. It doesn't advocate ethnic
cleaning. It doesn't advocate being hostile to friends.

It does advocate being hostile to hostile ideologies.

And a retard like you calls that "fascism"?

Now you know why I call you "poisonous" to the Indian identity."

Oh such smooth sweet words of comfort. The majority rules in india and
that majority is hindu. Your problem is that you can not accept the
wish of the majority.

Whenthat majority stands up in your face in the new eutopia and says
"no", what will you do? When the millions of non-hindus stands up in
your face along side the hindus and says "no" to your program, what will
you do?

If you please, in the eutopia of the new glory to come, exactly how,
details details, don't be shy; how will the "musts" of the program you
embrace and expressed below be done? With all the "nos" ringing your
ears, how will they be done?

Marcus Aurelius

unread,
May 4, 2007, 2:57:44 PM5/4/07
to
On May 4, 8:09 am, hari.ku...@indero.com wrote:
> "It doesn't advocate killing anybody. It doesn't advocate ethnic
> cleaning. It doesn't advocate being hostile to friends.
>
> It does advocate being hostile to hostile ideologies.
>
> And a retard like you calls that "fascism"?
>
> Now you know why I call you "poisonous" to the Indian identity."
>
> Oh what smooth sweet words of comfort. The majority of indians, the
> hindu majority, say "no" in the voting box to your program. Why do you
> resist the hindu majority? When that majority stands up to say "no" in
> your future mythical eutopia, what will be done to them? When the
> millions of non-hindu stand and say "no" what will you do? Tell us
> again, and be exact if you please, how the "musts" in the below will be
> realized?

LOL, so now you are the _defender_ of the "Hindu Majority"?!? Well,
let's see how you feel about Hindus:

http://groups.google.com/group/alt.fan.jai-maharaj/tree/browse_frm/thread/8a7d5f1404c0e384/1c156ddb6b38ba52?rnum=1&q=hindu&_done=%2Fgroup%2Falt.fan.jai-maharaj%2Fbrowse_frm%2Fthread%2F8a7d5f1404c0e384%2F7d7758c59444262f%3Flnk%3Dst%26q%3Dhindu%26rnum%3D12%26#doc_1c156ddb6b38ba52
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.indian/tree/browse_frm/thread/fc389b831c349d75/c69e6f78e3bd5e1a?rnum=1&q=hindu&_done=%2Fgroup%2Fsoc.culture.indian%2Fbrowse_frm%2Fthread%2Ffc389b831c349d75%2F3cd38c8962e55b36%3Flnk%3Dst%26q%3Dhindu%26rnum%3D62%26#doc_3cd38c8962e55b36

convert uncle tom, you are the "victum" of your own retardation, and
live in your own "eutopia", where the whites are gods and you are
their head butler. :)


Adi Anant

hari....@indero.com

unread,
May 4, 2007, 6:08:21 PM5/4/07
to
> Oh what smooth sweet words of comfort. The majority of indians, the >
hindu majority, say "no" in the voting box to your program. Why do you >
resist the hindu majority? When that majority stands up to say "no" in >
your future mythical eutopia, what will be done to them? When the >
millions of non-hindu stand and say "no" what will you do? Tell us >
again, and be exact if you please, how the "musts" in the below will be >
realized?

"LOL, so now you are the _defender_ of the "Hindu Majority"?!? Well, let's
see how you feel about Hindus:

http://groups.google.com/group/alt.fan.jai-maharaj/tree/browse_frm/thread/8a7d5
f1404c0e384/1c156ddb6b38ba52?rnum=1&q=hindu&_done=%2Fgroup%2Falt.fan.jai-mahara
j%2Fbrowse_frm%2Fthread%2F8a7d5f1404c0e384%2F7d7758c59444262f%3Flnk%3Dst%26q%3D
hindu%26rnum%3D12%26#doc_1c156ddb6b38ba52
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.indian/tree/browse_frm/thread/fc389b
831c349d75/c69e6f78e3bd5e1a?rnum=1&q=hindu&_done=%2Fgroup%2Fsoc.culture.indian%
2Fbrowse_frm%2Fthread%2Ffc389b831c349d75%2F3cd38c8962e55b36%3Flnk%3Dst%26q%3Dhi
ndu%26rnum%3D62%26#doc_3cd38c8962e55b36

convert uncle tom, you are the "victum" of your own retardation, and live
in your own "eutopia", where the whites are gods and you are their head
butler. :)"

Smile, entertaining to see you continue to attempt to put a label to me.
Yes I stand in defense of the majority of indians, of which group you
are not included by definition.

As to the messages you mention above they say nothing. The first was a
context I don't recall. It was a cut and paste from the web page
included in it. Are there in fact any errors in fact in it?

In the second I was correcting a flawed logic within a context defined
by another. I corrected that logic in the same context by providing the
accurate historical facts. Again, are there any flaws in fact you care
to mention?

I don't discuss my religious views, or lack of them. I do in the great
majority of cases correct distortions of fact and logic of radical
religious and political views relating to history and science. I have
repeatedly said that most such groups within all religions the world
over share similar views and tactics. That fact as you continue to
illustrate amply.

I do stand with the hindu majority, of which religion I could be
included for all you know, and with all who defend our inherent human
rights against the radicals and bigots. My religious views, or lack
thereof, are not relevant to that end.

What is relevant are the radicals and bigots who should have every
chance to refresh our knowledge of them and their evil agenda, of any
religion. Here is the one at hand:

Marcus Aurelius

unread,
May 4, 2007, 11:34:43 PM5/4/07
to

On May 4, 5:08 pm, hari.ku...@indero.com wrote:
> > Oh what smooth sweet words of comfort. The majority of indians, the >
>
> hindu majority, say "no" in the voting box to your program. Why do you >
> resist the hindu majority? When that majority stands up to say "no" in >
> your future mythical eutopia, what will be done to them? When the >
> millions of non-hindu stand and say "no" what will you do? Tell us >
> again, and be exact if you please, how the "musts" in the below will be >
> realized?

You are way too dense to educate.
Return back to the first article in the thread and read it.
Let's see if you can learn something - like the meaning of the words
like democracy, native faiths, imperial religions etc.

Or you can keep pretending like a lunatic that you represent some high
moral that tells you to hate Hindus.

Adi Anant

> "LOL, so now you are the _defender_ of the "Hindu Majority"?!? Well, let's
> see how you feel about Hindus:
>

> http://groups.google.com/group/alt.fan.jai-maharaj/tree/browse_frm/th...
> f1404c0e384/1c156ddb6b38ba52?rnum=1&q=hindu&_done=%2Fgroup%2Falt.fan.jai-mahara
> j%2Fbrowse_frm%2Fthread%2F8a7d5f1404c0e384%2F7d7758c59444262f%3Flnk%3Dst%26q%3D
> hindu%26rnum%3D12%26#doc_1c156ddb6b38ba52http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.indian/tree/browse_frm/thr...

hari....@indero.com

unread,
May 5, 2007, 10:37:06 AM5/5/07
to
"You are way too dense to educate. Return back to the first article in
the thread and read it. Let's see if you can learn something - like the
meaning of the words like democracy, native faiths, imperial religions
etc.

Or you can keep pretending like a lunatic that you represent some high
moral that tells you to hate Hindus."

All those things you wish me to learn are not the solution, they are
used by bigots to continue the problem. The majority of indians, a
hindu majority has stood to say clearly and loudly "no"! The rss and
like minded bigots, including bigotry toward fellow hindus of a
different mind, is the real minority stamping their feet and waving
their hands and schreeching against the hindu majority.

We don't even need to consider other religions, the bigotry of the rss
is example enough within hinduism to reject it. The radicals, like the
taliban, want to be the sole power source to decide what and who is
hindu and to whip all others into their mold. That too is typical of
the radical religious and political groups the world over and for which
s. asia is no exception, the original article notwithstanding.

I repeat my original response to the original post, another westerner
trying to tell indians as a whole how to be real hindus and indians,
just like jay stevens,aka dr. jai etc., who sits thousands of km away in
his native country of america and preaches as a non-indian about how to
be a real hindu and indian. And the radicals excuse his complete fraud
and lies because they like his cut and paste postings all the while
knowing him exactly for what he is.

Marcus Aurelius

unread,
May 5, 2007, 9:34:32 PM5/5/07
to
On May 5, 9:37 am, hari.ku...@indero.com wrote:
> "You are way too dense to educate. Return back to the first article in
> the thread and read it. Let's see if you can learn something - like the
> meaning of the words like democracy, native faiths, imperial religions
> etc.
>
> Or you can keep pretending like a lunatic that you represent some high
> moral that tells you to hate Hindus."
>
> All those things you wish me to learn are not the solution, they are
> used by bigots to continue the problem. The majority of indians, a
> hindu majority has stood to say clearly and loudly "no"! The rss and
> like minded bigots, including bigotry toward fellow hindus of a
> different mind, is the real minority stamping their feet and waving
> their hands and schreeching against the hindu majority.
>
> We don't even need to consider other religions, the bigotry of the rss
> is example enough within hinduism to reject it. The radicals, like the
> taliban, want to be the sole power source to decide what and who is
> hindu and to whip all others into their mold. That too is typical of
> the radical religious and political groups the world over and for which
> s. asia is no exception, the original article notwithstanding.

A majority asking for its democratic rights is "radical"? Your poison
is showing, retard.

> I repeat my original response to the original post, another westerner


> trying to tell indians as a whole how to be real hindus and indians,
> just like jay stevens,aka dr. jai etc., who sits thousands of km away in
> his native country of america and preaches as a non-indian about how to
> be a real hindu and indian. And the radicals excuse his complete fraud
> and lies because they like his cut and paste postings all the while
> knowing him exactly for what he is.

You are an anti-Hindu, anti-majority and anti-democratic lowlife uncle
tom scum whose sole purpose it to poison societies so that your kind
can scavenge on the rotting communities.

The good news is that your kind is getting gradually weakened in
India. :)

So keep ranting, while you have any poison left in you. Do snakes have
swan songs?

Adi Anant

Vishal Singh

unread,
May 6, 2007, 4:17:55 AM5/6/07
to
On May 3, 5:03 pm, "ranjit_math...@yahoo.com"

<ranjit_math...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Disortion? Is there an instance of the Hindu right having come to the
> lower castes' rescue, in a situation where they have met a sorry fate
> at the hand of upper castes?

Where is a instance of Hindu right coming to any upper Hindu caste's
rescue!


>
> > Modern Hindu teachers have been at the forefront of
> > removing caste. This includes great figures like
> > Vivekanand, Mahatma Gandhi and Aurobindo.
>
> Sorry; none of these even attempted to remove either varna or jati. Or
> is caste something other than varna and something other than jati?
>
> > It includes major Hindu movements
>
> Is there any major Hindu movement that accepts jati but rejects
> chaturvarna? Rejects chaturvarna entirely, that is, not just birth
> based varna.
>
>

What movement ? Is it technically possible to have a Hindu movement
and Say if RSS
says there is no Brahman,Kshatriya,Shudra. Will it make a difference?
Will all Hindus accept.

> What is an example of a "lower class" RSS leader bossing over "upper
> class" RSS leaders?

Kalyan Singh over Lalji Tandaon..

Marcus Aurelius

unread,
May 7, 2007, 3:05:48 AM5/7/07
to
On May 5, 9:37 am, hari.ku...@indero.com wrote:

You are an agent of interests foreign to India.
You are an anti-Hindu, anti-majority and anti-democratic lowlife scum,
who hides his hatred for Hindus behind nebulous concepts that allow
scum like you to preach hatred of Hinduism within India. Anybody who
exposes your diseased agenda is called "radical Hindu" by your kind.
It is funny really, that you wish to hide your sick hatreds behind a
rhetoric of freedom.
You are a poison to the Indian civilization, since you deride the
concept of assimilating the remnants of imperial ideologies in India,
within the Indic culture.

Your filth lies exposed. No amount of abuse you shower on people who
despise your kind of poison is going to give you cover again.


Adi Anant

hari....@indero.com

unread,
May 7, 2007, 9:28:39 AM5/7/07
to
"You are an agent of interests foreign to India. You are an anti-Hindu,
anti-majority and anti-democratic lowlife scum, who hides his hatred for
Hindus behind nebulous concepts that allow scum like you to preach
hatred of Hinduism within India. Anybody who exposes your diseased
agenda is called "radical Hindu" by your kind. It is funny really, that
you wish to hide your sick hatreds behind a rhetoric of freedom. You are
a poison to the Indian civilization, since you deride the concept of
assimilating the remnants of imperial ideologies in India, within the
Indic culture."

"Demoncratic/majority" are interesting words. If those are your
objective then we agree. In which case the majority voice today in
india who by demoncratic action is fully in place. That majority also
happens by nose count to be hindu. Your wish is reality but you reject
your own wish because the particular flavor of hinduism you wish to
force on that majority of fellow hindus is a minority view and
demoncratticaly rejected.

Those words do not mean dictatorship of the majority over the minority,
in this instance you are the miniorty. No one forces their view on you
as to how to worship and what religious or political views to hold and
express. Likewise you and all other minorities are protected to
continue doing so because all individual indian citizens hold human
rights as defined in the constitution which the views of the majoirty
can not erase because that would be dictorship of the majority.

"Your filth lies exposed. No amount of abuse you shower on people who
despise your kind of poison is going to give you cover again."

Smile, if you please, as to the implied threat, what exactly will your
minority do to we of the majority when the new eutopia is realized? How
exactly will the "musts" below be put in place? Your continued silence
on this point speaks more loudly then all the voices of your minority in
combination:

Marcus Aurelius

unread,
May 7, 2007, 1:23:21 PM5/7/07
to

You are not only a disease, but also a retarded one.

You are an agent of interests foreign to India. You are an anti-Hindu,
anti-majority and anti-democratic lowlife scum, who hides his hatred

for Hindus.

Indian democracy is not a suicide pact for Hindus, scum. Indian
democracy is a gift of rights from the Hindus to the rest. It can be
taken away, if you keep poisoning India with your hatreds.

Adi Anant

hari....@indero.com

unread,
May 7, 2007, 2:52:26 PM5/7/07
to
"You are not only a disease, but also a retarded one.

You are an agent of interests foreign to India. You are an anti-Hindu,
anti-majority and anti-democratic lowlife scum, who hides his hatred
for Hindus.

Indian democracy is not a suicide pact for Hindus, scum. Indian
democracy is a gift of rights from the Hindus to the rest. It can be
taken away, if you keep poisoning India with your hatreds."

Smile, as I have said before, I defend free speech for all as much and
as often as they wish to speak. It is how we spot the nutters and the
irrelevant. I will be happy to extend this thread as long as you feel
the need to speak.

The hindu majority governs today in india. It doesn't rule because no
group regardless of size has the right to rule as a master over slave or
remove basic rights all indians enjoy. That is the rule of law and all
stand equal before it.

The minority of which you are a part is fully protected and live and
operate freely except when it comes to violence and destruction, then it
is simply criminal and should be treated as such.

Your rights as citizens of india can not be taken away by the hindu
majority who speak through the ballot in the world's largest democracy.

I enjoy your ever more explicit threats. What will you do with the
majority who think as I do when the below is put fully into place? You
deny us the pleasure of that critical bit of information, what lies in
the future? I would like to see the gleem in your eyes and the pride
rise in your face as you tell us just how purity at last will be
realized!

Marcus Aurelius

unread,
May 7, 2007, 3:05:34 PM5/7/07
to

Playing victim again, eh retard? Or as you would say it, "victum".

You are an agent of interests foreign to India. You are an anti-Hindu,
anti-majority and anti-democratic lowlife scum, who hides his hatred
for Hindus.

Indian democracy is not a suicide pact for Hindus, scum. Indian
democracy is a gift of rights from the Hindus to the rest. It can be
taken away, if you keep poisoning India with your hatreds.

Adi Anant

hari....@indero.com

unread,
May 7, 2007, 3:42:47 PM5/7/07
to
"Playing victim again, eh retard? Or as you would say it, "victum".

You are an agent of interests foreign to India. You are an anti-Hindu,
anti-majority and anti-democratic lowlife scum, who hides his hatred for
Hindus.

Indian democracy is not a suicide pact for Hindus, scum. Indian
democracy is a gift of rights from the Hindus to the rest. It can be
taken away, if you keep poisoning India with your hatreds."

Smile, please do continue speaking. I'm not a victum/victim and that
fine status will continue in a free society where a minority does not
dictate to the majority of hindu indians who vote freely. On that basis
lies your freedom to speak as you do and I say all the more if you
please.

However, there are a few points not yet clear about the great glorious
future eutopia where the minority will rule. Please do tell us how the
"musts" below will be realized? Please tell us how the current hindu
majority will be treated who say clearly and loudly "no" you do not
speak for me?

Marcus Aurelius

unread,
May 7, 2007, 4:07:30 PM5/7/07
to

You seem to think that being a pest is a good thing.

Perhaps that's where you are on the evolutionary scale. That certainly
would explain your retarded and repeated rants about the same things
over and over without comprehension of what the words democracy,
rights and poison mean in a society.

You would rather destroy India rather than curtail the hatred that the
missionaries have for it.

And that is exactly why you are poison to India, uncle tom. Your
hatred for Hindus will consume you, eventually. Hindus will get their
cohesive society they yearn for, your kind of poisonous groups
notwithstanding.

Adi Anant

hari....@indero.com

unread,
May 8, 2007, 1:33:32 PM5/8/07
to
"You seem to think that being a pest is a good thing.

Perhaps that's where you are on the evolutionary scale. That certainly
would explain your retarded and repeated rants about the same things
over and over without comprehension of what the words democracy,
rights and poison mean in a society.

You would rather destroy India rather than curtail the hatred that the
missionaries have for it.

And that is exactly why you are poison to India, uncle tom. Your
hatred for Hindus will consume you, eventually. Hindus will get their
cohesive society they yearn for, your kind of poisonous groups
notwithstanding."

Smile, such sweet smooth words chosen to sooth the heart of all indian
citizens. The democratic majority of indians have spoken, a hindu
majority who has put in the constitution the kind of country within
which they wish to live and prosper. It is where all have equal rights
just because they live and have breath as free citizens with no litmus
test of ethnicity, religion, language nor any other test to have and
enjoy those basic human rights.

The minority of which you are a member hates that hindu majority because
it does not bend to its "superior" and "pure" will of the masters who
know best how all indian citizens should live. They parade about in
those smart paramilitary uniforms that the girls find so fetching and
the fellows down at the tea shop so clever and which makes the wearer
feel so manley. In their gut and blood speeches they never fail to tell
the followers how they are the victims of evil "others" and are forced
to live along side the "unpure" people who don't deserve to do so except
as they might be enslaved for the agenda of the masters.

You know nothing about me. I'm a handy scapegoat upon which to pile
bigotry. But the bigots need such people, it is by definition part of
what makes a bigot.

You are far too shy, come let us draw you out some little bit, come and
speak your mind. What will you do to put in place in today's free india
who has sole control of its future the below program, how will the
"musts" be realized?

Marcus Aurelius

unread,
May 8, 2007, 1:53:11 PM5/8/07
to

Still ranting, retard?

Well, nothing better can be expected of unassimilated leftovers of
imperialist ideologies, which are loyal to interests outside India,
can it?

The interests of the Indian majority, however, necessitate regarding
poisons like you with great supervision and to keep a spotlight on
your kind. Your kind thrives in shadows and in the dark. Denied the
cloak of darkness, your kind withers. So, retard, I will keep the
spotlight on your poisons - it doesn't matter how long you keep being
a pest.


Adi Anant

hari....@indero.com

unread,
May 8, 2007, 2:58:14 PM5/8/07
to
"Still ranting, retard?

Well, nothing better can be expected of unassimilated leftovers of
imperialist ideologies, which are loyal to interests outside India,
can it?

The interests of the Indian majority, however, necessitate regarding
poisons like you with great supervision and to keep a spotlight on
your kind. Your kind thrives in shadows and in the dark. Denied the
cloak of darkness, your kind withers. So, retard, I will keep the
spotlight on your poisons - it doesn't matter how long you keep being
a pest."

Smile, the below was withdrawn from publication in the '50's because the
rss wanted to clean up its image, not to change the objective but to
offer it up as a sweet smooth smile with its evil heart remaining. The
light of a free demoncratic hindu majority forced this change because
the light of being free was more then such evil can stand. We keep the
light on by allowing the nutters and irrelevant to speak as much and as
often as they wish, be my guest.

Marcus Aurelius

unread,
May 8, 2007, 3:03:06 PM5/8/07
to

Wolfish imperial ideologies in religious clothing:

*The Hindu View of Christianity and Islam
by Ram Swarup

In The Hindu View of Christianity and Islam, Ram Swarup quotes the
noted Amercan writer Gore Vidal: "From a barbaric Bronze Age text
known as Old Testament, three anti-human religions have evolved - -
Judaism, Christianity, and Islam." Vidal calls them "sky-god
religions," which, observes Swarup, "would have been no harm if they
had been a yogic sky-god, for a yogic sky-god is in all the gods and
includes all other gods - - gods of the earth as well as of the heaven
and beyond - - as man is kin both to the earth as well as to the sky.
But the trouble is that the prophetic god is not a yogic god; in fact,
he is hardly a spiritual being; he is a fanatic entity, an intolerant
and hegemonic idea."

Prior to their prophet Moses, the Jews did not worship an exclusive
sky-God. "While Jehovah revealed himself to Moses as the only God of
the Jews, they were worshipping another God under the symbol of a
Bull." Swarup wonders whether this had "something to do with Nandi of
Hinduism." Moreover, worship of Jehovah under the form of a Bull or
golden calf continued for many centuries. In his famous book Moses and
Monotheism, Sigmund Freud reasoned that a militant and exclusive God,
Jehovah, was "suited to a people who were starting out to occupy a new
homeland by force," and who promised them "a land flowing with milk
and honey," while urging them to exterminate its inhabitants "with the
edge of the sword." In Deut. 7.1-6, Jehovah says: "Thou shalt smite
them, and utterly destroy them; thou shalt make no covenant with them,
nor show mercy unto them...thou shalt destroy their altars, and break
down their images, and cut down their groves... For thou art an holy
people unto the Lord."

The concept of one God and his chosen, holy people, writes Swarup,
"brought in the concept of two humanities and religious aggression
became the highest duty and morality. Religion itself became dogmatic
and lost its inwardness and vision. People both individually and
collectively felt empty inside." In contrast, spiritual religions such
as Hinduism and European Paganism have "multiple Gods but one
humanity; Semitic religions have one God but at least two humanities:
believers on one hand and unbelievers or infidels or heathens on the
other. The division is not social, or racial, or cultural; it is
metaphysical. Believers owe nothing to infidels, not even ordinary
ethical behaviour." Witness the Quranic injunction (chapter IX, verse
5): "Slay the idolaters wherever ye find them, and take them captive,
and besiege them, and prepare for them each ambush. But if they repent
[i.e. convert to Islam] and establish worship and pay the poor-due,
then leave them free. Lo! Allah is forgiving, merciful." However,
Allah's mercy is exclusively reserved for his chosen, holy people, the
Muslims. According to a hadis (Sahih Muslim, 6665-6669) "if there
would be people among the Muslims with as heavy sins as a mountain,
Allah would forgive them and he would place in their stead the Jews
and Christians... on the Day of Resurrection, Allah would deliver to
every Muslim a Jew or a Christian and say: 'That is your rescue from
Hell-Fire.' "

The historic record of the Christians is equally blood-soaked -- for
example, the mass slaughter of natives in South America for refusal to
convert to Christianity. Citing the record of the Portuguese in
coastal pockets of India around 1540 AD, Swarup writes: "They had
nothing to learn from their Muslim counterparts. A. K. Priolkar, in
The Goa Inquisition, provides a list of 131 villages in the three
islands of Goa, Salsete, and Bardez with 601 temples, all from
official sources, which were destroyed by Christians. Franciscan
friars who were active in Bardez 'destroyed 300 Hindu temples where
false Gods were worshipped. Jesuits, more active in Salsete,
destroyed, at about the same time, 280 temples."

Although the Christians destroyed idolatrous temples in Goa and in
South America, they themselves have "idols in thousands in their
churches as in St. Peter's in Rome and St. Paul's in London; they are
representational and there is not even an attempt to give them an
iconic form." Moreover, the Christian worship of relics is widespread:
"In France, Voltaire counted six foreskins of Jesus to which barren
women made pilgrimage. Calvin found so much wood in the relics of the
Cross that not even three hundred men could carry them. Similarly, the
Virgin's milk was aplenty. San Bernardino of Siena tells us that 'all
the buffalo cows of Lombardy would not have as much milk as is shown
about the world.' "

In Islam, particularly among the Sufis, grave worship is pervasive.
The "dargah" of Muinuddin Chisti in Ajmer -- founded on the ruins of a
Hindu temple -- is a much publicized example. Contrary to the
propaganda ofIslamic apologists, many Sufi "saints" were instigators
and enthusiastic participants in jihad as documented in R. M. Eaton's
scholarly study Sufis of Bijapur, published by Princeton University
Press, 1978.

Swarup's central thesis is that Semitic religions are not religions at
all -- in the sense of spiritual religions -- but political
ideologies. Spiritual religions, in contrast to Semitic religions,
focus on the seeker's inner life and the essential oneness of the
universe. Historically, Christianity is an imposition on the
indigenous spiritual religions of Europe and, later, South America.
Likewise, Islam is an imposition on the spiritual religions of Arabia,
Egypt, and West Asia. Swarup sees a growing recognition of these
impositions: "Europe is witnessing a revival of its ancient
religion... it's trying to throw off the yoke of Christianity....
Prudence Jones, spokesperson for the U.K. Pagan Federation, observed
that all the world's indigenous religions have three features in
common: they are nature-venerating, seeing nature as a manifestation
of Divinity; they are polytheistic and recognize many Gods, many
Manifestations; they recognize the Goddess, the female aspect of
Divinity as well as the male. She showed how European Paganism was
similar to Hinduism, Shintoism, and the North American tradition."

===


Adi Anant

hari....@indero.com

unread,
May 8, 2007, 3:39:11 PM5/8/07
to
Smile, if you can't dispatch the truth put a label on it and all is
settled. You continue to label me without knowing anything in the least
about same. I understand why, when caught out it is better to change
the subject then to dance in the light, to use your metafore.

It is also a fundimental impulse of a bigot, for which state you have
provided ample evidence.

If I did not exist the below can not be erased from the stage of history
in
s. asia. You want to dance about and ignore the now oft asked question.
What will you do with all those of millions of indian hindus who reject
the
below program, even being bored with it?

What will you do with the millions of those of the several other
religions
and ethnic groups and language groups etc. etc. who will stand beside
their
hindu brothers to say "no" too.

All of the foot stamping and hand waving and screeching you have done
thus
far are empty words until you answer this simple question. All the
citizens of a free india want to know.

Marcus Aurelius

unread,
May 8, 2007, 3:57:17 PM5/8/07