NTR destoyer of corrupt Reddy Rajyam
Anonmy7327
handed, eccentric, melodramatic.
There is one contribution which he made to Andhra politics which overrides
all his faults and is his main contribution. He destroyed effectively the
caste based corrupt politics of succesive Reddy chief ministers
The list of corrupt Reddy Chief ministers include
1) Sanjeev Reddy who was indicted in transport nationalization scam and
forced to resign as chief minister.
This man was fountainhead of caste based politics with nepotism to Reddy
caste. This man at one time had 80% reddys as his ministers.
2) Chenna Reddy was the most corrupt CM that A.P. had. Corruption was
institutionalised during his rule with open pricing for every favour.
This man also played a parochial, inflammatory role in Telangana agitation
to get back his power. Indira gandhi's aide Thapar discribes in his book
how this politician dipped into the Govt kitty while he was the Union
minister for steel. This is the same person who split the Telugu community
in North America because the refusal of the office holder's to hand the
relief money to him
3)Janardana Reddy who openly tried to sell the franchise for medical
colleges for 1 crore each. This represented the high point of Congressi
Reddy corruption
4)Brahmananda Redddy , another notorious politician who favoured his caste
NTR used his charism with people to destroy the corrupt Reddy order in
A.P. Let us give him the credit!!!!
P. Subhash C. Reddy
>There are many faults that NTR had including being self-obsessed, high
>handed, eccentric, melodramatic.
>There is one contribution which he made to Andhra politics which overrides
>all his faults and is his main contribution. He destroyed effectively the
>caste based corrupt politics of succesive Reddy chief ministers
Yeah!, and supplanted his own corrupt regime dominated by his caste.
That has done tremendous service to Telugus because the whole state is
made up of only these castes and none else.
No, it did not destroy one caste's corruptive practices but it just
doubled the amount of corruption by supplimenting it. That may be the
contribution.
However, I suggest that we pay our respects to the leader instead of
creating catse flames again.
Subhash
Ramana Juvvadi
> 1) Sanjeev Reddy who was indicted in transport nationalization scam and
> 2) Chenna Reddy was the most corrupt CM that A.P. had. Corruption was
> 3)Janardana Reddy who openly tried to sell the franchise for medical
> 4)Brahmananda Redddy , another notorious politician who favoured his caste
Hm! You did leave out three other Reddys, Bhavanam Venkatrami Reddy,
Anji Reddy, Vijayabhaskar Reddy. Perhaps you do find them honest.
Was corruption limited to only Reddys? To the extent I could tell a politician
is a politician. For that matter, why blame only politicians? The entire
system is corruption-ridden. Why single out Reddys?
Ramana
Nagesh Yerneni
been 13 Kamma ministers compared to five in '85-89 and 8 reddys as Channa,
Janardhan and KVK had filled up.If he had done something for his caste
like the congi guys he would have never lost Guntur and Krishna dist ZP
elections in '87. That was a premonition of things to come in the '89
elections. His indifference was the reason why we were hated by everybody
in the state in 1989 and why the riots happened in 1988. I think he
realised it later and gave minisstries to 7 of them in '94.
Everybody knows Sanjeeva Reddy's caste politics. He was the originator
of caste politics in AP. It was because of him that we lost Bellary dist
to Karnataka, Because he wouldn't be able to dominate Ananthapur dist
politics and Rayalaseema politics if Bellary was there.
There are a lot of people in Krishna and Guntur dists who sacrificed a
lot for NTR and suffered a lot because of that .
NTR WAS NOT A CHEAP CASTEIST POLITICIAN
Nagesh V Yerneni
Vijaya Sajja
Mr. Reddy,
You just could not wait to answer this one. This proves what I have
suspected all along. You are a casteist guy. From now onwards do not try
to put some sugar around what you say on the net. Do you know the percentage
of Kamma ministers in NTR's Governments?
Vijaya Sajja
P. Subhash C. Reddy
>P. Subhash C. Reddy (sred...@ix.netcom.com) wrote:
>: Yeah!, and supplanted his own corrupt regime dominated by his caste.
>: That has done tremendous service to Telugus because the whole state is
.......<deleted>
I did not respond to thos items because it will be an unending thread
and I do not think we will be able to reach any reasonable conclusion.
>: made up of only these castes and none else.
>NO. I want to see a BC/SC leader as the CM. But, Mr. Reddy you've
>already shown, like Vijay Sajja pointed out, enough of your true
>colors.
Mr. Patibandla, I have never concealed any "colors" that I may have.
One thing I may be guilty of is to speak my mind pointedly and
forthrightly and without resorting to flaming (like "destroy corrupt
reddy rAjyam ..." ).
> Kumar Chunduru type of gullible nettors might fall prey to
>your sugar coated sanctimonious preachings but please don't take other
>nettors for granted.
I will Mr. Kumar Chunduru to respond to your statement because he is
perfectly capable of doing it without my interference.
> We have some IQ level. We can tell who is
>innocent and who is artful innocent, who is hypocrite and who is not.
>Once again, please, for Christ Sake, don't preach anything on the net.
>This is the best service that you can do to SCIT community.
I have no doubt that all of us on this net have some IQ level and
probably a fairly high IQ at that. IQ, however, does not translate
automatically in to civility and politeness and respectful of others.
I have no intention of preaching on the net and I did not. If my
unwillingness to resort to flaming and disrespectful and uncivil
behavior on the net gets to any of you, I cannot help it. If you all
call that "preaching" and "sugar coated", I am willing to accept your
"compliments". In that sense, I may not be able to do the kind of
"service" to the SCIT community.
>: However, I suggest that we pay our respects to the leader instead of
>: creating catse flames again.
>:
>: Subhash
My above suggestion still holds good and still is pertinent.
>:>Sudhakar
Subhash
P. Subhash C. Reddy
>There are many faults that NTR had including being self-obsessed, high
>handed, eccentric, melodramatic.
>There is one contribution which he made to Andhra politics which overrides
>all his faults and is his main contribution. He destroyed effectively the
>caste based corrupt politics of succesive Reddy chief ministers
Yeah!, and supplanted his own corrupt regime dominated by his caste.
That has done tremendous service to Telugus because the whole state is
made up of only these castes and none else.
No, it did not destroy one caste's corruptive practices but it just
doubled the amount of corruption by supplimenting it. That may be the
contribution.
However, I suggest that we pay our respects to the leader instead of
Ramana Juvvadi
> PS: I wonder, why this impartiality (of Mr. Ramana) flares up only
> when someone talks about those castes that have been associated
> with cong. but not always. Why this impartial tone maintains
> silence when some nettors, who belong to those castes that have
> been associated with Cong. since ages, talk about TDP's caste
> politics? Inquisitive mind wants to know (tired out phrase?)
The answer is Ramana has a full time job for what he gets paid for
and that always takes the priority over replying in SCIT. Ramana
responds only when he has time and energy to respond. If you find any
caste partiality in my posts that is your problem.
Believe it or not, Ramana was as disgusted with Cong-I as you are now. Ramana
started leaning towards cong-I only after PVNR introduced economic
liberalization.
Ramana
Sudhakar Patibandla
P. Subhash C. Reddy (sred...@ix.netcom.com) wrote:
: Yeah!, and supplanted his own corrupt regime dominated by his caste.
: That has done tremendous service to Telugus because the whole state is
I don't know about the service to Telugus but that has done a lot of
service to NTR's community.
Proof:
1. Jayapuram Massacre.
2. Killing 70 year old people in Vijayawada.
3. Torching educational institutes/Business establishments that
belong to NTR's community.
4. Death of dozens of innocent people (probably they're not innocent
since they belong to NTR's community) in 1988 Dec. last week.
5. Loot of property(that belongs to NTR's community) worth hundreds of
crores of rupees in 1988 Dec.
6. Loot of property(that belongs to NTR's community) worth crores
of rupees in 1991 May after Rajiv Gandhi's death.
on top of it,
7. Lifting cases against the rioters.
8. Gullible voters' electing those very same murderers as MLAs.
(Blame jews for Holocaust; Blame sikhs for Delhi Massacre;
Blame Muslims for Bombay mayhem).
: made up of only these castes and none else.
NO. I want to see a BC/SC leader as the CM. But, Mr. Reddy you've
already shown, like Vijay Sajja pointed out, enough of your true
colors. Kumar Chunduru type of gullible nettors might fall prey to
your sugar coated sanctimonious preachings but please don't take other
nettors for granted. We have some IQ level. We can tell who is
innocent and who is artful innocent, who is hypocrite and who is not.
Once again, please, for Christ Sake, don't preach anything on the net.
This is the best service that you can do to SCIT community.
Sudhakar
: No, it did not destroy one caste's corruptive practices but it just
:
Sudhakar Patibandla
I've problem with the tone of the original poster. I wish he had
expressed it in a polite manner without hurting anybody. With that out
of the way, I want to participate in this thread.
Ramana Juvvadi (juv...@research.att.com) wrote:
:
: Hm! You did leave out three other Reddys, Bhavanam Venkatrami Reddy,
: Anji Reddy, Vijayabhaskar Reddy. Perhaps you do find them honest.
Yes, compared with the four Reddy CMs that the original poster has
talked about, the above three were relatively better. Honesty is
anathemic to politicians; the original poster might be talking about
the degree of corruption.
:
: Was corruption limited to only Reddys? To the extent I could tell a
Certainly not.
:politician
: is a politician. For that matter, why blame only politicians? The entire
: system is corruption-ridden. Why single out Reddys?
Singling out Reddys is not a good thing. NTR's family is corrupt
and so is PVNR's family(ever heard about gold star deals?). But the
point is, public can tolerate politicians' corruption only to some
extent.
To quote Cong-I leader (former Pradesh Congress Committee president)
V. H. Rao:
"Chandala Reddy and Dhanarjana Reddy compete with each other for
creating Guinness records in corruption".
From India Today (not exact quote)--after Cong-I's defeat in 1994
elections:
"Vijaya Bhaskar Reddy could not repair the damage that Chenna Reddy
and Janardhan Reddy have caused to the State Cong-I".
That means, even the gullible Indian voters can't tolerate the
corrupt politicians like Chenna Reddy, Janardhana Reddy, etc. This
does not, however, mean that Vijaya Bhaskara Reddy, NTR, PVNR, etc. are
not corrupt but they're within the limits (read Indian standards).
Sudhakar
: Ramana
P. Subhash C. Reddy
>Nagesh V Yerneni
Seems like we are getting in to another caste war. So be it !.
Before you go on atangent on this subject, just pause and look at the
Telugu Desam party politics and organisation. There is no other major
party in India which is not only dominated exclusively by the caste
you are talking about but entirely by one family only !. What more
evidence do you want about nepotoism and caste politics ?. MunJeti
KadiyAniki addamEla ?
Subhash
P. Subhash C. Reddy
>Mr. Reddy,
>Vijaya Sajja
Mr. Sajja:
Please do not get in to personal attacks. I had not said anything
about the number of kamma ministers in NTR's ministry. I have not
paid attention to that aspect. It may be too late for me to collect
any statistics even if I am interested; which I am not.
And what is your problem about my responding prompting to the
blantantly casteist (flaming) posting on the net ?. Is it
inappropriate to do that just because one's last name is Reddy ? And
why are you advising me about "putting some sugar around what I am
saying, from now on wards" ? If my statements are polite and
respectful of others, that is even better which seems to be wanting on
this net.
Please accept the fact that all of us have equal access and equal
freedom and rights to express one's self without resorting to personal
criticism and personal attacks.
Subhash
P. Subhash C. Reddy
>P. Subhash C. Reddy (sred...@ix.netcom.com) wrote:
>: ZQL...@prodigy.com (Nagesh Yerneni) wrote:
>: >If NTR had supplanted the cabinet with his own caste there would have
>: >been 13 Kamma ministers compared to five in '85-89 and 8 reddys as Channa,
><deleted>
>: >NTR WAS NOT A CHEAP CASTEIST POLITICIAN
>:
>: >Nagesh V Yerneni
>:
>: Seems like we are getting in to another caste war. So be it !.
>: Before you go on atangent on this subject, just pause and look at the
>: Telugu Desam party politics and organisation. There is no other major
>: party in India which is not only dominated exclusively by the caste
>: you are talking about but entirely by one family only !. What more
....<deleted>... for brevity
>Let me open this challenge with the information from my side. I invite
>every body who is familiar with AP politics to correct me if I post any
>wrong information.
>Don't chicken out. Accept this challenge, stick to point and don't
>divert the issue by saying NTR did this, NTR did that....blah, blah.
>I'm not the one who started this, you're the one who started talking
>about NTR's caste politics. Had you ignored that anon poster's flame,
>it would have ended up peacefully but you added more fuel to that flame
>by talking about those issues that you've no idea about. You've left
>India 25 years back. What do you know about AP politics, Mr. Subhash?
>Where do you get your info. from? Deccan Chronicle or your friends,
>relatives or Kumar Chunduru type of ignorants? from where?
>Anyway, where you get your info. from is none of my business. I will
>wait for your comments/statistics about MLAs, Minsiters, ZP chairmans,
>Civil servants, etc. in both the governments.
>: evidence do you want about nepotoism and caste politics ?. MunJeti
>: KadiyAniki addamEla ?
>Munjeti Kadiyaniki addamu akkaraledu, kani nijalu palakadaniki
>Dhiryam kavali.
>:
>: Subhash
>:
>Sudhakar
Mr. Sudhakar, I will be glad to respond if you agree to focus on the
issues and to avoid commenting about others as ignorants. If not, I
will ignore.
I do not accept your challenge about digging the trenches deeper. I
can use my time for a better purpose than collecting statistics on the
number of kamma ministers and kamma civil servants, etc. I understand
and according to your statement in this posting, kammas are strong
only in about 3 districts out of the 21 (?) or more districts in AP,
while the other caste you are referring to have been and are pretty
active and well represented in the political arena. You can't equate
the numbers.
There is no party that I know of which has split and both factions are
headed by the members of the same family (forget about caste !). Even
congress could not do it. On top of it, the government is also headed
by member(s) of the same family.
Enough of this stuff of which I am losing all interest because it is
stale and is not going to change in near future. And reagarding your
statement that if I had let go of the statements (anon) on caste, it
would have ended peaceful (?). So any body who questions blatant
casteist postings is the culprit ?.
And please avoid making statements about chickening out. I think it
does not belong in discussions between worthy opponents. Pleasure is
yours.
Subhash
U41...@uicvm.uic.edu
population of Andhrapradesh is kamma and Reddy. It is natural to see more
Reddys in the cabinet and other Governmental positions because there are
more Reddys in AP than any forward caste. As far as corruption is concerned
a person cann't be a politician with out corruption. Only question is who
is more corrupt. You think NTR is not corrupt. He took the AP state into
backwardness by his cheap vote getting policies. Now AP is way behind
other Southern States in attracting Outside Investors due to lack of
infrastructure and now the family is fighting over a dead body. Lp was thrown
out of the vehicle carrying NTR deadbody while thousands of people are
out of the vehicle carrying NTR deadbody while thousands of people are
watching by NTRs sons. What a shame ? NTR came to power because of women
voters and he treated women of his state like his own sisters. Now his own
wife was treated very badly infront of thousands of people. What is going
to be the image of Andhra's in India. NTRs sons are acting like monkeys
over a piece of cocunut because they tasted it (power).It looks like
AP is their Property the way they are acting. The state cann't go forward
unless there is stable government. It looks like there is not going to be
one in the near future until the family rule or feud is ended.
Finally stop this caste war and apply some common sense.
regards
SANROCK
Krishna Rao
|> : Hm! You did leave out three other Reddys, Bhavanam Venkatrami Reddy,
|> : Anji Reddy, Vijayabhaskar Reddy. Perhaps you do find them honest.
|>
|> Yes, compared with the four Reddy CMs that the original poster has
|> talked about, the above three were relatively better. Honesty is
|> anathemic to politicians; the original poster might be talking about
|> the degree of corruption.
WHAT a statement ! WHAT a statement !!
Tell me how you can include the longest-served CM of AP,
Sri Kasu Brahmananda Reddy in the list of corrupt CMs.
Give me one convincing incident, that's enough.
If you look at our hystory, there was much less corruption
in AP till 1978 (Chenna Reddy's arrival). Brahmananda Reddy
and Sanjeeva Reddy tried their best to improve their regions
(to the extent of diverting irrigation canals). For your info,
let me remind you that Brahmananda Reddy was the 1st CM to
be forced out despite the fact that he has absolute majority
in CLP. So much was his influence, no one from coastal andhra
was willing to join the puppet govt of PVNR in AP.
Brahmananda Reddy was forced out because of Telangana agitation.
DO NOT jump to accuse him for raising Jai Andhra movement.
He was not the one to raise it.
If Brahmananda Reddy was slave minded like others and
not believed that (1) the law of the land is superior to
individuals and (2) Congress could survive without any
member from Nehru-family, he would have adorned
one of the 2 big positions in India (as a President or
as a PM after Indira Gandhi and Rajive Gandhi).
But that was his big mistake and paid heavily for it.
Then coming to the other Reddy CMs mentioned above, Who was
this Anji Reddy ? Do you know the history of AP (at least the
list of CMs) ? I accept that Vijayabhaskar Reddy is not as
corrupt as Chenna Reddy and Janardan Reddy. In fact, I wonder
why Vijayabhaskar Reddy was not selected as the successor of
Brahmananda Reddy. He was finance minister in Brahmananda Reddy's
cabinet and more over, he is from Rayalaseema (neither Coastal
Andhra nor Telangana). This is some thing I cannot understand.
Coming to Bhavanam Venkatrami Reddy, he is 2nd (or 3rd) puppet
CM to be imposed from above. He has no base. I wonder if he
has even won an assembly election. Though his wife (Jayaprada)
was our MLA till 1978 and a minister in Vengala Rao's cabinet.
That's all for now.
Regards,
-Krishna
Sudhakar Patibandla
: issues and to avoid commenting about others as ignorants. If not, I
: will ignore.
: I do not accept your challenge about digging the trenches deeper. I
But you want to stick to your rhetoric, right?
: can use my time for a better purpose than collecting statistics on the
: There is no party that I know of which has split and both factions are
: headed by the members of the same family (forget about caste !). Even
I, myself, have said "it is a family party but it is no worse a
casteist party than BJP or Cong-I".
: congress could not do it. On top of it, the government is also headed
: by member(s) of the same family.
: Enough of this stuff of which I am losing all interest because it is
: stale and is not going to change in near future. And reagarding your
: statement that if I had let go of the statements (anon) on caste, it
: would have ended peaceful (?). So any body who questions blatant
No, no, no. You've every right to defend your caste. If I were in
your position that's what I would have done (or for that matter any
normal human being would have done the same thing). But you consider
yourself as a saint. You've been preaching on the net, for the past
four months, to give up caste feelings and you portrayed yourself as a
saint. I've expected that you would stick to your principles. Here,
I'm talking about your double standards but not about your efforts to
defend your caste.
: casteist postings is the culprit ?.
: And please avoid making statements about chickening out. I think it
: does not belong in discussions between worthy opponents. Pleasure is
: yours.
I got carried away and I apologize for that.
:
: Subhash
Sudhakar
Sudhakar Patibandla
: >If NTR had supplanted the cabinet with his own caste there would have
: >been 13 Kamma ministers compared to five in '85-89 and 8 reddys as Channa,
<deleted>
: >NTR WAS NOT A CHEAP CASTEIST POLITICIAN
:
: >Nagesh V Yerneni
:
: Seems like we are getting in to another caste war. So be it !.
: Before you go on atangent on this subject, just pause and look at the
: Telugu Desam party politics and organisation. There is no other major
: party in India which is not only dominated exclusively by the caste
: you are talking about but entirely by one family only !. What more
Yes, there are two parties, BJP and Cong-I. In national level BJP is
dominated by one caste and in state level Cong-I is dominated by
another caste. I don't need to mention those castes because it is
known for every one who is familiar with Indian/AP politics. As
regards to your comments about TDP, I agree partially--it is a family
party but it is no worse a casteist party than BJP or Cong-I. NTR
appointed some of his close relatives as his secretaries and in other
high positions and he might have showed some caste prejudices on some
occassions but he was not as blatant as Cong-I chief ministers in
practicing caste politics.
When Yerneni compared ministers of TDP and Cong., you tried to
cleverly escape by saying that you don't have any statistics. This
is open challenge to you. If you can prove that NTR is more casteist
than most of the Cong-I chief ministers (I'm not mentioning their
caste), I would never enter SCIT in my life time. Take your own
time, do your own research and come up with statistics about
ministers, bureaucrats, civil servants and their castes in Cong-I/TDP
governments.
And for God's sake, don't come up with Deccan Chronicle news.
Cite credible resources like Indian Express or The Hindu.
Let me open this challenge with the information from my side. I invite
every body who is familiar with AP politics to correct me if I post any
wrong information.
Yerneni already talked about Ministers in TDP/Cong-I govts. Now let
me talk about Zilla parishad chairmans who got elected under TDP
banner in 1987. TDP swept all ZP chairman posts but three--Krishna,
Gunturu, Karnool (correct me if I'm wrong). NTR's community is
supposed to be strong in Krishna and Gunturu. But they went to
Cong-I. That means even large %ge of voters from his own caste did not
vote for NTR. Of all those ZP chairmans who got elected under TDP
banner only four (Chekuri Kasaiah--Khammam Dist. and I forgot the other
three names) belong to NTR's caste but more than 10 ZP chairmans belong
to another caste in AP (I don't need to mention that caste).
Next time, I will talk about MLAs in TDP and I will show to which caste
max. no. of MLAs in TDP belong.
Sudhakar Patibandla
U41...@uicvm.uic.edu wrote:
: Before you say all this you should first know what percentage of total
<deleted>
: Finally stop this caste war and apply some common sense.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
As far as I'm concerned, this is not a caste war. This is purely a
debate (euphemistic phrase for mudslinging) between me and Subhash
Reddy. This gentleman has been constantly harping, for the past four
months, about caste politics while portraying himself as a saint and
gave sanctimonious lectures about giving up caste feelings. This is
what(I mean, his double standards) I've been referring to all along
in this thread.
I ask the above poster not to make any attempts to attach my name
with that so called "Caste war".
: regards
: SANROCK
Sudhakar
Sudhakar Patibandla
P. Subhash C. Reddy (sred...@ix.netcom.com) wrote:
: Mr. Patibandla, I have never concealed any "colors" that I may
: have.
: One thing I may be guilty of is to speak my mind pointedly and
You think you speak pointedly and forthrightly but let me show how
pointedly you speak.
The first time, I've noticed your name on SCIT was in 1995 April.
(I'm not as senior nettor as you're).
Do you remember that article in which you talked about
"TANA organizers' larger than life size egos"? Now, let me ramble
here for a minute. Every one knows that in North America there are
two big Telugu Associations and it is perceived by many that they're
dominated by two different castes. But it is equally true that many
people from both these castes are genuinely concerned about uniting
these organizations(just like there are casteist elements on both
organizations). Any matured person will try to bring an
understanding between the organizers of these two organizations.
But what did you do? You talked about larger than life size egos
of TANA organizers and you've not even mentioned a single word about
that organization to which your caste is associated with. If a
neutral person who does not belong to either one of these castes
talks about any one of these organizations then it would have made
sense. But when you belong to one of these castes and when you talk
negatively about only one of these associations (but not about the
one to which your caste is associated with) you'll definitely
be considered as a casteist.
And that's what many people did but you never realized this. You got
carried away with those applause that you've received from the likes
of Kumar Chunduru but you never cared to think about what you're
posting on the net and what many other people on the net think about
your posts.
I could have pointed out your artful innocence (I mean deliberately
ignoring the other association) at that time, but I did not want to
because it was the first article of yours that I've noticed on the
net. But I could not resist myself for too long and I showed how
balanced you're when you talked about Cong. and TDP two months later
when we had a big thread in August when NTR was dethroned. I could
cite some more incidents but due to lack of time I want to stop it
here.
On all those occassions, you posted your slanted arguments thinking
that you're posting pointedly. If you're a student/youngster like
myself, then many people would not have given much importance to you.
But you're a senior citizen:-). You expect some respect from other
people. You preach other people. Then, either you should stay away
from controversial stuff or maintain maximum balance. But you can
do neither of these things and you still think that you're posting
pointedly and forthrightly.
It is astonishing that I need to belabor this sensitive point to a
doctorate degree holder.
: forthrightly and without resorting to flaming (like "destroy corrupt
: reddy rAjyam ..." ).
You've every right to defend your caste. I also defend my caste if
somebody tries to insult me. But it did not occur to you that when
you preached, to other nettors, about giving up caste feelings and
talked about promoting inter-caste marriages people expect you to
practice those virtues that you're preaching. But you, like any other
ordinary Indian(like myself), reacted quickly to that flame. You
should have left it for youngsters from your community (or for those
people who participate frequently in flames) but you did not wait and
you never thought about what other people think about you. Still you
think that you're talking pointedly and forthrightly. Not only did
you react like a casteist person (when you talked about giving up
caste feelings just a few months back) to that flame but you indicated
that you've a chip on your shoulders. On numerous occassions you
placed yourself in caste related threads by constantly talking
about TANA, NTR, TDP while maintaining silence (or mild criticism)
about those parties/organizations to which your caste is associated
with. Actually that's what most people (including myself) do. But
most of these people who participate in these flames don't preach
anything. But you're different. On some threads you preach like a
saint as if you've no emotional feelings about your caste and on other
threads you act like a reactionary when the topic of the discussion
involves your caste.
I said "you've shown your true colors" not because you defended
your caste or criticized my caste (if I were in your position probably
that's what I would have done) but because you gave sanctimonious
speeches continuously for four months and finally acted like an
average Indian who can't give up his own caste feelings but gives
sermons to other people.
Had you made it clear, in the beginning, that you would get
offended if somebody criticizes your caste nobody would have said that
you've shown true colors. But you preached something about caste
feelings on the net. Preaching offends least when you practice those
virtues that you're preaching.
: I have no doubt that all of us on this net have some IQ level and
: probably a fairly high IQ at that. IQ, however, does not translate
: automatically in to civility and politeness and respectful of others.
: I have no intention of preaching on the net and I did not. If my
You did. Ask other nettors.
: unwillingness to resort to flaming and disrespectful and uncivil
I'm not talking about your comments about uncivil behavior but your
preachings about giving up caste feelings.
: behavior on the net gets to any of you, I cannot help it. If you all
: call that "preaching" and "sugar coated", I am willing to accept your
: "compliments". In that sense, I may not be able to do the kind of
: "service" to the SCIT community.
Read above.
: Subhash
Sudhakar
Ramana Juvvadi
> Then coming to the other Reddy CMs mentioned above, Who was
> this Anji Reddy ? Do you know the history of AP (at least the
> list of CMs) ? I accept that Vijayabhaskar Reddy is not as
I was the person who wrote Anjiah as Anji Reddy. I can't recollect
exactly now, but Anjiah was either born as a Reddy or raised as a Reddy.
Probably, somebody knowledgeable can explain.
Ramana
Ramarao Chetlapalli
> In national level BJP is dominated by one caste and in state
>level Cong-I is dominated by another caste. I don't need to
>mention those castes because it is
Can you substantiate the accusation that BJP is dominated
by one caste at national level?
At the most one can say BJP is dominated by upper castes.
But I do not think the leaders at national level
are from any dominating caste. Even if it is true,
many of the national political parties in their infancy are
dominated by that caste.(including communist parties).
Further in North India, Brahmins are not insignificant
either in their number or in their economic power.
Many parties in north India have Brahmin domination till
recently.
I do not know castes of all the BJP leaders. Even if those
leaders belong to one caste, only if you can ascribe that
they are in that dominating leadership positions solely
based on the caste affliations, then you can say BJP
is a castiest party. I am not telling that BJP
is completely clean in its electoral practices
with respect to castes. Here are the names of
some of well known BJP leaders.
LKAdvani, Vajpayee, MuraliManohar Joshi,
VijayRaje Sindhiya, Bhaironsingh Shekawat, M.L.Khurana,
KalyanSingh, Uma Bharathi, KesuBhai Patel, SankarSinh Vaghela,
Sundarlal Patwa, Pramod Mahajan, Venkayya Nayudu,
Yaswant Sinha, Shatrugna Sinha, B.L.Sharma. V.SantaKumar,
Govindacharya.
To me only Vajpayee, Joshi, Govindaacharya and Sharma
appear to belong to one caste. Vajpayee and Govindaacharya
are fulltime pracharaks who started working for BJP.
All of them worked for a cause and were with the party
for several years. They did not become national leaders
and derived their strengths from their castes.
Do not analyze TDP successes or failures
on the basis of caste, there could be several
reasons why TDP failed in Kamma dominated
areas.(every party will nominate kamma persons
in those areas and other castes may collude to avoid
being ruled by TDP Kamma candidate and so on.)
Do not say NTR is
less castiest because he does not have same
proportion of Kammas in his cabinet as that of
proportion of Reddys in cong-i government. Even if
he wanted to have more proportion, he can not,
as he has to run his governement. Do not say
NTR is less castiest because Kammas suffered
under his regime. It only shows that NTR cares
more for his family and less for his caste.
Being more selfish does not make him less
castiest, unless it is proven that he is not
castiest in his actions when his self interest
is not affected. Probably NTR is as castiest as
other leaders.
-rama
Krishna Rao
Tanguturi Anjiah does not belong the caste Reddy to which
other Reddy CMs belong. He belongs to BC caste Reddy.
So, he is the 2nd dalit CM of AP (after Damodara Sanjeevaiah).
Let me also add, he is not that corrupt either. I admire him
to have reached such high levels from a poor background.
He used to be refered to as 6 anAla mukyamantri by Jaipal
Reddy. Anjiah does not get hurt by such references, but
takes pride from it (quite rightly).
I would like to remind the 1984 Parliament elections, when
he defeated Dattatreya of BJP (which is in alliance with TDP)
and he is 1 of the 6 cong MPs elected from AP. It's quite
interesting to note that he should have got the Medak seat
(given that he was MLA from Ramayampet) and P Shiv Sankar
should contest Secunderabad. But, since Shiv Sankar was
close to Rajiv, he got the Medak seat (which was held by
Indira till her death) as a safe bet and Anjiah was given
Secunderabad seat (unsolicited) as it's expected that BJP
will win it any way. BJP contested Secunderabad and
Hanmakonda seat (against PVNR). PVNR lost to Janga Reddy
and Anjiah defeated the Gen Secr of BJP Dattatreya.
That shows what Anjiah is and that `humble is not equal to weak'.
Rajiv had realised his folly of 1982 (of insulting Anjiah)
and made him minister for Labour. Anjiah shown in that post
very well until he was shifted to Cong organization (I do
not understand this at all).
Sudhakar Patibandla
:
: Looks like the logic of Rush limbaugh is widely prevalent in the land
: and on SCIT. If I say it is black, then some body will point it out
: that I am aginst white. If I say it is white, then others will accuse
: me that I am biased against black.
But if you criticize blacks 99%time and whites 1%time then you'll
definitely be considered as a skinhead. Noone, in his right mind, can
say that you're speaking pointedly and forthrightly (except gullible
ones).
:
: I have never (NEVER) defended a particular caste, especially Reddy
If you can't defend your caste I would have considered you as a person
with low self esteem. Once again, I'm not against your defence but
all that I'm saying is don't act like a hypocrite. Stop preaching
other people about giving up caste feelings because when you can't
practice those things that you're preaching you have no moral right
(is that an alien concept for you?) to give sermons.
: caste. Yes, I criticised TANA leaders for their ego because the
: subject was TANA and not any thing else. It would be foolish to bring
Relevancy, it seems, is the reason for evading difficult topics. Yet
another example!
: in a different subject matter when that is not the matter under
: discussion.
:
: I have never preached inter-caste marriages and in fact I was accused
: by some that I was supporting castes. What I insisted was that
: abolishing caste was not the answer but that people should not use
: caste to suppress or deny others of their rightful share of jobs or
: business, etc. I said caste, like religion, is personal and should
: not become a public policy. Marrying outside one's caste is a
: personal matter based on personal feelings but not to make a public
: statement.
Actually, I'm the one who expressed the above sentiments but now
you're trying to hijack it. (I still remember what you posted in reply
to Dr. Bapa Rao's follow-up to Dr. Partha Banerjee's article about
caste marriages). Anyway, it is too silly, for me, to fight about
who posted what. Atleast, in future, let's make clear our positions
to everybody on the net.
:
: If speaking out righteously is preaching and is sanctimonious, I am
: proud of it and I will be only too pleased to continue doing so. You
If you're proud of being self-righteous and if you want to continue
your hypocritic sugar coated sanctimonious speeches then go ahead and
do it. But don't expect respect from other people.
Sudhakar
: or any body else has every right to feel and perceive any way you want
: to. I have no objection.
:
: Subhash
U41...@uicvm.uic.edu
thank you
sanrock
Lost+Found
Ramana Juvvadi <juv...@research.att.com> wrote:
>
>> Then coming to the other Reddy CMs mentioned above, Who was
>> this Anji Reddy ? Do you know the history of AP (at least the
>> list of CMs) ? I accept that Vijayabhaskar Reddy is not as
>
>I was the person who wrote Anjiah as Anji Reddy. I can't recollect
>exactly now, but Anjiah was either born as a Reddy or raised as a Reddy.
>Probably, somebody knowledgeable can explain.
>
His name is Tanguturi Ramakrishna Reddy. He supposedly worked as a
'Aaranala Koolie' so to go with that image he changed his name to Anjaiah.
perhaps he is the only Chief minister who accepted a degradation in promotion
to state rank as 'karmika mantri' after his tenure as CM of Ap.
Subba
--
| Submission to passion is Human Bondage |
| But the excercise of reason is Human Liberty. |
| http://http.tamu.edu:8000/~s0k7152 * -Somerset Maugham |
| Phone(Off):(409)862-1608 * Email: Su...@tamu.edu |
Ramana Juvvadi
> Tanguturi Anjiah does not belong the caste Reddy to which
> other Reddy CMs belong. He belongs to BC caste Reddy.
> So, he is the 2nd dalit CM of AP (after Damodara Sanjeevaiah).
I don't know how many flavors of Reddys are there. I got an email
from one of the netters that one of his parents is Reddy and the
other is a BC. Apparently, he used to pose as a champion of the BCs in public
but show pride of his Reddy lineage in private. In any case, both his
daughters got married to Reddys.
<stuff deleted on Anjiah's career>
With all the jokes on Anjiah, I must say I have a soft corner for this
person. Contrary to the popular opinion, he is not an illiterate, he is
a matriculate. While I don't go to the extent of saying his administration
was any better than others I am happier to see him as a CM than Chenna Reddy,
a personification of corruption.
Ramana
P. Subhash C. Reddy
>P. Subhash C. Reddy (sred...@ix.netcom.com) wrote:
...deleted...
>:
>: Subhash
>Sudhakar
Please, no need to apologize. All I am saying is that we may
criticise our ideas and opinions but not personalities.
And, I have no interest in defending either mine or any body else's
caste. What I am defending against ?. I am against baseless comments
and flames. I did not say that the said Reddy CMs were not corrupt
but that NTR was no better and actually added to the same corrupt and
scandalous and nepotistic rule. If I said that those Reddy CMs were
not corrupt, then I can understand your ire. When two bandits are in
the picture, I do not extoll one bandit's acts as virtues. I would
say both are bandits (call a spade a spade).
Subhash
P. Subhash C. Reddy
Looks like the logic of Rush limbaugh is widely prevalent in the land
and on SCIT. If I say it is black, then some body will point it out
that I am aginst white. If I say it is white, then others will accuse
me that I am biased against black.
I have never (NEVER) defended a particular caste, especially Reddy
caste. Yes, I criticised TANA leaders for their ego because the
subject was TANA and not any thing else. It would be foolish to bring
in a different subject matter when that is not the matter under
discussion.
I have never preached inter-caste marriages and in fact I was accused
by some that I was supporting castes. What I insisted was that
abolishing caste was not the answer but that people should not use
caste to suppress or deny others of their rightful share of jobs or
business, etc. I said caste, like religion, is personal and should
not become a public policy. Marrying outside one's caste is a
personal matter based on personal feelings but not to make a public
statement.
If speaking out righteously is preaching and is sanctimonious, I am
proud of it and I will be only too pleased to continue doing so. You
or any body else has every right to feel and perceive any way you want
to. I have no objection.
Subhash
>P. Subhash C. Reddy (sred...@ix.netcom.com) wrote:
>: Mr. Patibandla, I have never concealed any "colors" that I may
>: have.
>: One thing I may be guilty of is to speak my mind pointedly and
>You think you speak pointedly and forthrightly but let me show how
>pointedly you speak.
>: Subhash
>Sudhakar
Sudhakar Patibandla
: if it is a debate between you and somebody, please use your e-mail
: not scit.
: thank you
: sanrock
Though I disagree with you that this discussion should be carried out
on e-mail, I've felt it is unfair on my part to continue posting in
this thread with the above title. I feel uncomfortable in
participating those threads with the titles "Corrupt Reddy Raj" or
"Kammas' Goonda Raj". Tomorrow, I'll try to change the title (to open
a new thread) or I'll remain silent for a while until this thread
dies down.
Sudhakar
Anonmy7327
you do not believe in caste , it is commendable.
But do not try to ignore the issue .
Responsibilty of institutionalised corruption can be clearly laid on the
foot steps of Reddy CM's who ruled for the most of the time after
independence.
Most of the Reddy's come from dirt poor Telangana and Rayalaseema which
form the caste base of Reddis.This caste benefited greatly from
institutionalised corruption of series of Reddi CMs. People coming from
resource poor regions became multimillionares by sharing the loot from the
govt treasury dispensed as public work contracts, favouritism in awarding
Bus transport routes, posting their caste people in spots where corruption
is a norm(Irrigation, Road transport,TTD devastanum etc)
In 60's one of the Reddi minister from Rayalaseema misused the TTD
resources at the time of his Daughter's marraige which was a big public
scandal at that time.
Where do you think all this prosperity of Telangana and Rayalaseema
Reddi's come from? From the fertile lands? My foot!!!!!!
NTR destroyed the long rule of successive corrupt CMs. People voted for
him on the anti- corruption plank. It is true that people close to him
took advantage of him and indulged in corruption.But you cannot blame him
of systematic institutionalised corruption on basis of caste as the Reddy
CM's.
Some of the offspring of this Reddi legacy, are the same people who became
the splitters at the instigation of notorious Chenna Reddi, and started
ATA. Roll call of ATA organization is" who is who Reddi"
If there are posters who are incensed at this posting , you should be
incensed at ATA which is caste organization
P. Subhash C. Reddy
>In article <JUVVADI.96...@juvvadi.tempo.att.com>, juv...@research.att.com (Ramana Juvvadi) writes:
>|>
>|> > Then coming to the other Reddy CMs mentioned above, Who was
>|> > this Anji Reddy ? Do you know the history of AP (at least the
>|> > list of CMs) ? I accept that Vijayabhaskar Reddy is not as
>|>
>|> I was the person who wrote Anjiah as Anji Reddy. I can't recollect
>|> exactly now, but Anjiah was either born as a Reddy or raised as a Reddy.
>|> Probably, somebody knowledgeable can explain.
>|>
> Tanguturi Anjiah does not belong the caste Reddy to which
> other Reddy CMs belong. He belongs to BC caste Reddy.
> So, he is the 2nd dalit CM of AP (after Damodara Sanjeevaiah).
> Let me also add, he is not that corrupt either. I admire him
> to have reached such high levels from a poor background.
> He used to be refered to as 6 anAla mukyamantri by Jaipal
> Reddy. Anjiah does not get hurt by such references, but
> takes pride from it (quite rightly).
...<deleted>......
> That's all for now.
> Regards,
> -Krishna
That was quite a good article from Mr. Krishna. I concur with his readings
about Late T. Anjaiah (ex- CM). I knew him peronally since he was a labor
leader and President of the 4th class employees. Perhaps he was the most
honest and least corrupt of all the political leaders of A.P. Late D.
Sanjeeviah (the poet and most literate of all CMs) is another such honorable
person.
Sincerely,
Subhash
P. Subhash C. Reddy
>P. Subhash C. Reddy (sred...@ix.netcom.com) wrote:
>: spat...@rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu (Sudhakar Patibandla) wrote:
>:
>: Looks like the logic of Rush limbaugh is widely prevalent in the land
>: and on SCIT. If I say it is black, then some body will point it out
>: that I am aginst white. If I say it is white, then others will accuse
>: me that I am biased against black.
>But if you criticize blacks 99%time and whites 1%time then you'll
>definitely be considered as a skinhead. Noone, in his right mind, can
>say that you're speaking pointedly and forthrightly (except gullible
>ones).
I do not think I can make discuss issue with you, Mr. Patibandla. Let us leave
this here. I will stop responding to your postings with no disrespectful
feelings towards you.
Subhash
>Sudhakar
>: or any body else has every right to feel and perceive any way you want
P. Subhash C. Reddy
>The fact is that caste is a dominant factor in politics and society. If
>you do not believe in caste , it is commendable.
>But do not try to ignore the issue .
>Responsibilty of institutionalised corruption can be clearly laid on the
>foot steps of Reddy CM's who ruled for the most of the time after
>independence.
>Most of the Reddy's come from dirt poor Telangana and Rayalaseema which
>form the caste base of Reddis.This caste benefited greatly from
>institutionalised corruption of series of Reddi CMs. People coming from
>resource poor regions became multimillionares by sharing the loot from the
>govt treasury dispensed as public work contracts, favouritism in awarding
>Bus transport routes, posting their caste people in spots where corruption
>is a norm(Irrigation, Road transport,TTD devastanum etc)
I think the writer's arrogance shows through (very transparent) in his
calling "dirt poor Telangana... and Rayalaseema..". In addition most
of the loot from the state treasury through contracts, jobs, etc. were
enjoyed by the people from coastal andhra and not rayalaseema or
telangana because those people in your own words were dirt poor and so
did not have the necessary financial support to engage in trade.
>In 60's one of the Reddi minister from Rayalaseema misused the TTD
>resources at the time of his Daughter's marraige which was a big public
>scandal at that time.
>Where do you think all this prosperity of Telangana and Rayalaseema
>Reddi's come from? From the fertile lands? My foot!!!!!!
This is exactly what I am referring to "arrogance".
>Some of the offspring of this Reddi legacy, are the same people who became
>the splitters at the instigation of notorious Chenna Reddi, and started
>ATA. Roll call of ATA organization is" who is who Reddi"
I have been associated with both TANA and ATA for good many years!.
This blanket statement that ATA is Chenna Reddy's instigation would be
fine if the author accepts that TANA is exclusively Kamma. I do not
subscribe to such a simplistic argument.
>If there are posters who are incensed at this posting , you should be
>incensed at ATA which is caste organization
I am not incensed by your posting but rather amused !. We still have
many people who seem to entertain such narrow minded view of things
which may not be to your liking. You have every right to your
opinion!.
It would help if you post with your identity.
Subhash
P. Subhash C. Reddy
>In <JUVVADI.96...@juvvadi.tempo.att.com>, juv...@research.att.com (Ramana Juvvadi) writes:
....<deleted>....
>>
>Why everybody so interested in Caste.. Does it really matter??
>We are in U.S (Equal Opportunity Country) and fighting about rotten Indian
>Castism.. I thought, people forget about all those after coming here..
>We should discuss about what he did or not, not what Caste he is
You and I, if I support your contention, are at risk being labelled as
"pontificating" to have such values. Seems like it is fashionable to
exhibit very basic instincts without constraint.
Subhash
Anonmy7327
**** I think the writer's arrogance shows through (very transparent) in
his
calling "dirt poor Telangana... and Rayalaseema..". In addition most
of the loot from the state treasury through contracts, jobs, etc. were
enjoyed by the people from coastal andhra and not rayalaseema or
telangana because those people in your own words were dirt poor and so
did not have the necessary financial support to engage in trade****
@@@@ ordinary people in Rayalaseema and Telangana continue to remain dirt
poor thanks to institutionalised caste Reddy corruption which benefited
only the few Reddys@@@@@.
****This blanket statement that ATA is Chenna Reddy's instigation would be
fine if the author accepts that TANA is exclusively Kamma. I do not
subscribe to such a simplistic argument.****
@@@ I fail to see connection between truth about Chenna(?Chinna) Reddy
and TANA@@@@
***** We still have
many people who seem to entertain such narrow minded view of things
which may not be to your liking. You have every right to your
opinion!.****
@@@ Narrow minded about what that acknowledging the dominant role of Reddy
politics in institutionalising Corruption in Andhra@@@
*** It would help if you post with your identity***
@@@ What identity you are talking about? I do not have a dog tail as caste
identity at the end of my name@@@@.
P. Subhash C. Reddy
>****This blanket statement that ATA is Chenna Reddy's instigation would be
>fine if the author accepts that TANA is exclusively Kamma. I do not
>subscribe to such a simplistic argument.****
>@@@ I fail to see connection between truth about Chenna(?Chinna) Reddy
>and TANA@@@@
Let me help you !. People like you who believe that ATA was formed by the
instigation of Mr. Chenna Reddy, then TANA is dominated by kammas by the
instigation of Late Mr. N.T. Rama Rao. I am trying to shoe the absurdity of
such a statement which you seem to profess.
>***** We still have
>many people who seem to entertain such narrow minded view of things
>which may not be to your liking. You have every right to your
>opinion!.****
>@@@ Narrow minded about what that acknowledging the dominant role of Reddy
>politics in institutionalising Corruption in Andhra@@@
Yes!. Corruption is not the exclusive domain of any one group whether it be
caste, creed, religion, or sex. Attributing such is narrow minded.
>*** It would help if you post with your identity***
>@@@ What identity you are talking about? I do not have a dog tail as caste
>identity at the end of my name@@@@.
One's identity is from his given name. I am sure you have one. If you no dog
tail, I am delighted. I did not know that humans had a dog tail (even if it is
name). Perhaps you really desire one and you are compalining that you don't
have one. Is that your gripe ?
Subhash (This is my name and identity) !