DC Books and dictionary
rastignak
foisting upon the people of Kerala in the form of a dictionary. This
fraud of a book is known as English- English- Malayalam Dictionary and
is unscrupulously named after Ramalingam Pillai. In fact Ramalingam
Pillai has not got anything to do with this dictionary. He died
sometime in the late sixties and this dictionary was first published
in the early eighties. Please do not think that Mr Pillai compiled
this dictionary when he was alive and DC later published it. He
compiled another dictionary. It is a three-volume monster very
outdated by today's standards. The first DC edition of this came out
in 1976. N.V Krishna Varier was the editor. It is a good example for
the ignorance of our dictionary editors. That monster lacks any sort
of organisation. Idioms and phrases are altogether missing. But it
would not be worthwhile to examine the merits and defects of a
dictionary that has become part of the history. What is notable here
is that Ramalingam Pillai didn't compile the one volume dictionary
sold after him. The DC's claim is that some other "scholars" abridged
this monster and gave it the present form. This claim is also
fraudulent. A major part of this dictionary comprises of phrases and
idioms (in most cases ignorantly and unimaginatively culled and
wrongly rendered and interpreted). As I have said earlier the
so-called original has no idioms. Instead of abridging Mr. Pillai's
dictionary the DC's editors have actually added a considerable amount
of information. It should be so and there is nothing unworthy in it
provided that the additions are development of the original. But in
the case of this dictionary, additions mean the worsening of the
original, bad as it is. Those who worked behind this lousy book must
have been thoroughly ignorant persons. Just look at these examples.
"sun- the body which is the gravitational centre and source of light
and heat"
Gravitational centre- of what? The editor is ignorantly copying the
Chambers Dictionary. The Chambers give this meaning. "The body, which
is the gravitational centre and source of light and heat for our
planetary system." The foolish scholar apparently does not know that
devoid of the omitted part the definition is nonsense.
"pioneer- way-clearer" It is not the job of the dictionary editor to
create new words. His job is to record the words that are already in
use. But the foolish editor coins a collocation which is not an
accepted one in Standard English.
"play of words" It is defined in Malayalam to mean a pun. But the
phrase that carries this meaning is "play on words".
"plebeian- uncultured common" This is nonsense. "Common" in the modern
sense does not have the meaning of 'common people'.
"flutist"- One who plays flute is a flautist. Flutist is its US form.
"capitalism- system which generates, tolerates, and is run by private
capitalists". Not bad! Tolerate and generate what? We all know that
capitalism (Ravi DC's sort and not the western sort) generates and
tolerates (and even confers the title of "scholar" to) such
ignoramuses like this dictionary editor.
"swivel- a turning linker" Have you ever come across a word like
"linker"? You will find it in Webster's. But not in real use.
"plover- lapwing gallatorial bird" There is no word like
"gallatorial". The correct word is "grallatorial". However the
correction in spelling will not make the definition meaningful. It is
based on the ignoracne of the edtior.
"look-... have or afford out look in some direction; manifest or
influence by a book" What nonsense these two definitions are I don't
know.
"dog fired" (in stead of dog-tired; under the entry 'dog')
"prunes and prims"( in stead of prunes and prisms; under prune),
"lift- helping a traveller by taking upon a vehicle" What does it
mean?
See these two examples for "proverb" and "specimen".
(under proverb)- "He is a proverb for punctuality."
(under specimen)- "She is an excellent specimen of Indian womanhood."
The foolish editor thinks that these statements are fine. The fact is
that both of them are loaded statements. They are either sarcastic or
ironic. Any one who is fairly familiar with literary language can
understand their true sense. But not the ignorant editor.
"right about turn or face" (under right) See how the foolish fellow is
presenting the two words 'about-face' and 'about-turn'.
"tidy- seasonable" There is an obsolete sense for tidy which would
mean "timely or seasonable". But that meaning in a concise bilingual
dictionary is unnecessary. The editor chose to give this meaning out
of his ignorance. This is clear since Malayalam definitions for the
word do not have such a meaning.
More to come.
K.Kunju
> This is meant to expose the fraud that the DC Books, Kottayam is
> foisting upon the people of Kerala in the form of a dictionary. This
> fraud of a book is known as English- English- Malayalam Dictionary and
> is unscrupulously named after Ramalingam Pillai. In fact Ramalingam
> Pillai has not got anything to do with this dictionary.
Evident in the write up here is your bitterness expressed as an
outrage against a "fraud foisted on the people of Kerala by DC Books".
I agree that there are many errors in the dictionary, but can you
call the book itself is a fraud? The original 3-volume of dictionary
by Ramalingam Pillai was also published by DC Books and is still
available (although out of print) for scrutiny by those who are
interested and for comparison with the abridged one volume version
currently sold by DC Books. So let the user make a decision by
himself whether it was proper to associate Ramalingam Pillai's name
with the dictionary. Dictionaries need to be continually revised and
updated to keep up with new words that come into use and with the
changes in meaning the existing words.
> He died
> sometime in the late sixties and this dictionary was first published
> in the early eighties. Please do not think that Mr Pillai compiled
> this dictionary when he was alive and DC later published it. He
> compiled another dictionary. It is a three-volume monster very
> outdated by today's standards. The first DC edition of this came out
> in 1976. N.V Krishna Varier was the editor. It is a good example for
> the ignorance of our dictionary editors.
I personally don't care who the compiler of a dictionary is as long as
it serves its intended purpose. Most of the available Malayalam
dictionaries do not always meet my needs, and there are many glaring
errors and many omissions in all of them. If we think the meanings
of certain words are not correctly given then it is our duty to point
out those errors to the publisher so that they can make necessary
changes in the next edition. I have a copy of the 36th edition of the
Ramalingam Pillai's English-English-Malayalam dictionary published in
1994. If they made extensive changes in the contents and format of
the original dictionary the publisher should explicitly state that the
present dictionary is based on the 3-volume dictionary of Ramalingam
Pillai but not an exact reproduction. Many scientific publications
bear the name(s) of the original author(s), although the latest
versions have very little resemblance to the originals. Examples are
the Bilestein series on Chemicals, and Bergmeyer series on Enzymatic
Analysis. This is a common practice in publishing business. The
first edition of the English-English-Malayalam dictionary that bears
the authorship of Ramalingam Pillai was published in 1983. Scarcity
of other dictionaries or popularity of the present one made it a best
seller.
Mistakes and omissions can escape even the best of the linguists
especially when dealing with dictionaries. I wouldn't label NV
Krishna Warrier an ignorant person. He was a genius who was loved and
admired by everyone who became aware of his contributions that
enriched the Malayalam language. Those of us who publish are many
times embarrassed of our own oversight in detecting some obvious
mistakes and misstatements. Such mistakes are more common among
Indian authors and publishers mainly because of our lack of
thoroughness in doing anything.
It looks like that you are a linguist or a person who is very much
interested in words, expressions and idioms. Whenever the meanings of
words are incorrectly given, we could point out the mistakes, and give
alternate or better definitions and meanings. I heard that in the
fifties a scholarly panel under the chairmanship of Shuranad Kunjan
Pillai was appointed to compile all Malayalam words and expressions
with definitions and meanings. I do not what happened to the efforts
of that commission.
One difficult thing about the Malayalam-Malayalam dictionary is the
order of compilation. It is not easy to locate a Malayalam word in a
Malayalam dictionary. With computerization the task may become
easier. Finding a Malayalam word in a Malayalam dictionary is far
more difficult than locating the name of a person in the Malayalam
telephone directory. Everyone will agree the latter is a frustrating
task.
> More to come.
Indian
I am having a copy of the above mentioned dictionary and frankly
speaking, for day-to-day use, I am finding it really useful. I am
relying on this to find the Malayalam meaning of the word rather than
the English one. For advanced use, why dont you rely on Websters or
Oxford dictionary, as the one from DC Books is for general /
day-to-day use.
Could you please point out a better E-E-M dictionary, if this is full
of errors?
-Indian
kku...@hotmail.com (K.Kunju) wrote in message news:<604fa706.0311...@posting.google.com>...
rastignak
> > This is meant to expose the fraud that the DC Books, Kottayam is
> by Ramalingam Pillai was also published by DC Books
It was edited by NV Krishna Varier. I do not know who published the
earlier edition(s).
> of certain words are not correctly given then it is our duty to point
> out those errors to the publisher so that they can make necessary
> changes in the next edition.
many errors? How much time will you spend on correcting it supposing
you are not a lexicographer?
I have a copy of the 36th edition of the
> Ramalingam Pillai's English-English-Malayalam dictionary published in
> 1994.
stead you will find "seista". The pronounciation also fits the
incorrect form.
Scarcity
> of other dictionaries or popularity of the present one made it a best
> seller.
is hunderd times better than this disgraceful thing. It is edited by S
Guptan Nair. I won't say it is a good dictionary either. But it is 100
times better than this.
> I wouldn't label NV
> Krishna Warrier an ignorant person.
if this label is stuck on him.
He was a genius who was loved and
> admired by everyone who became aware of his contributions that
> enriched the Malayalam language. Those of us who publish are many
> times embarrassed of our own oversight in detecting some obvious
> mistakes and misstatements.
> It looks like that you are a linguist
Not me!
or a person who is very much
> interested in words, expressions and idioms.
Yes, I am and I consider logophilia(love for words) as a perversion.
Every lexicographer is a pervert. The more a pervert he is the better
his work tends to be.
rastignak
> Hi,
>
> I am having a copy of the above mentioned dictionary and frankly
> speaking, for day-to-day use, I am finding it really useful. I am
> relying on this to find the Malayalam meaning of the word rather than
> the English one. For advanced use, why dont you rely on Websters or
> Oxford dictionary, as the one from DC Books is for general /
> day-to-day use.
>
> Could you please point out a better E-E-M dictionary, if this is full
> of errors?
>
> -Indian
>
>
If the thing is something that extends from your mouth to rectum then
it is okay. Look up fistula. You will find "nadee vranam", nadee
kshatham etc. For "declutch" you will find a definition that would
mean "lose control". Do you know that the phrase "to put it on" has
the meaning of getting a batsman out in cricket? If you don't just
look it up in the dictionary. It is really enlightening. Do you know
what "throw" in cricket would mean? It means "to strike the ball
illegally". A pitcher in baseball is one who strikes the ball. Do you
want more examples? Then ask people at DC. They have a rather long
list with them. Don't know whether they will divulge it.
Regards
Rasta
K.Kunju
> kku...@hotmail.com (K.Kunju) wrote in message news:<604fa706.0311...@posting.google.com>...
> > rast...@indiatimes.com (rastignak) wrote in message news:<c61f3e18.03110...@posting.google.com>...
> > > This is meant to expose the fraud that the DC Books, Kottayam is
> The original 3-volume of dictionary
> > by Ramalingam Pillai was also published by DC Books
> Not so. DC published Mr Pillia's work for the first time in 1976.
> It was edited by NV Krishna Varier. I do not know who published the
> earlier edition(s).
The publisher's (DC Books) note in the 36th edition of the E-E-M
dictionary says that they published the 3-volume dictionary in 1976,
1986, 1990 and 1993. Since I have not seen the 3-volume series I
cannot comment on that and I take your word that NV Krishna Warrier
was the editor that undertaking. The abridgement of the 3-volume into
one volume was done by MS Chandrashekhara Warrier. I guess he should
bear the responsibility for errors and inaccuracies of the abridged
version. I find that ECG Sudarshan was also associated with the
publication of the abridged version, although I do not know in what
capacity.
> > of certain words are not correctly given then it is our duty to point
> > out those errors to the publisher so that they can make necessary
> > changes in the next edition.
> What if every page of this dictionary has several or in some places
> many errors? How much time will you spend on correcting it supposing
> you are not a lexicographer?
I agree it would be a monstrous task to revise a dictionary that has
too many errors. Gone are the days of Webster and Johnson, where
they spent their lifetime to put together the dictionaries they
authored. Even the best lexicographer cannot be hoped to know all the
words, their origin, meanings and correct usage. An expert committee
must go through every word, and if necessary they must call for the
help of other experts. It may be easier to create an entirely new
dictionary. But who will shoulder the responsibility for such a
massive undertaking?
> I have a copy of the 36th edition of the
> > Ramalingam Pillai's English-English-Malayalam dictionary published in
> > 1994.
> Will you please look up the word "siesta" in it? You won't find it. In
> stead you will find "seista". The pronounciation also fits the
> incorrect form.
The word is correctly spelled, with the correct pronunciation and
meaning. May be they caught the mistake and corrected it in this
edition.
> Scarcity
> > of other dictionaries or popularity of the present one made it a best
> > seller.
> Not the case. There is (or should I say was?) another dictionary which
> is hunderd times better than this disgraceful thing. It is edited by S
> Guptan Nair. I won't say it is a good dictionary either. But it is 100
> times better than this.
I have that dictionary too. (Because I live in a foreign country I
thought it would be handy to have these dictionaries). It was
published by NBS under the title NBS Concise English-Malayalam
Dictionary. The original compiler of the dictionary was C. Madhavan
Pillai and it was revised and abridged by Prof. Guptan Nair. I never
made a comparative evaluation of the two dictionaries.
We don't a have good Malayalam-Malayalam or Malayalam-English
dictionary. I find that the Malayalam-English dictionary published
by Assissi and prepared by M Parameswaran Pillai is very inadequate.
> > I wouldn't label NV
> > Krishna Warrier an ignorant person.
> If the 1976 dc dictionary is his handiwork then I wouln't be surprised
> if this label is stuck on him.
I don't think so.
> He was a genius who was loved and
> > admired by everyone who became aware of his contributions that
> > enriched the Malayalam language. Those of us who publish are many
> > times embarrassed of our own oversight in detecting some obvious
> > mistakes and misstatements.
> You seem to be a writer.
I am writer in the sense that I write and publish research papers of
my scientific work and scientific reviews that are related to my work.
Those are published under my official name, but here I use an
abbreviated version of my pet name.
> > It looks like that you are a linguist
> Not me!
> or a person who is very much
> > interested in words, expressions and idioms.
> Yes, I am and I consider logophilia(love for words) as a perversion.
> Every lexicographer is a pervert. The more a pervert he is the better
> his work tends to be.
Hope you have heard about Rayiru Nair who contributed significantly by
providing information about the origin, roots, and variations in the
meaning of many English words. The publishers of the English
dictionary (I do not remember which) acknowledged his contributions
and thanked him. We all can contribute our mite in developing this
part our language by taking an interest. I hope DC books will become
cognizant of your criticism.
rastignak
pronounciation for the word "siesta". I checked the fiftieth edition
(1997) and found the word entered incorrectly. The ninetieth edition
no longer have this mistake. Will you check the following entries.
break down- vandi mariyuka
platoon- vallikkettu
debris- polinja kappal (wrecked ship)
crotch- partaking of branches
kabba, kabala- (the name of the mosque in Mecca)
anabasis-ability to regain life after apparent death (this meaning
eblongs to another word,"anabiosis")
I have very low esteem for the so-called scholars in Kerala. I am
afraid being abroad you may tend to see things through a nostalgic
gaze. The fact is that the English comprehension capacity of most of
our scholars is extremely poor. Poorer than some fellows who write and
post pornographic stories on Internet. Since you have said you have
Guptan Nair's Dictionary I would like you to look up some entries
beginning with "wh" for their pronounciation. wheel,wheat,
whale,where,wheeze. You will be shocked. (The shitty thing sold after
Ramalingam Pillai mimicks Guptan Nair here.) The poor man who claims
that he taught phonetics many years doesn't know the phenomenon called
"aspiration" in phonetics. He says he used Daniel Jones'
Pronounciation Dictionary in preparing the thing. It is sad that he
doesn't know how to interpret the italicized "h" at the beginning of
IPA transcription of the pronounciation of the given words. And this
man is a "renowned scholar" of Kerala. If these people confined their
work to their own native language there would have been no reason to
complain.
K.Kunju
> I am surprised that the edition you have have the correct spelling and
> pronounciation for the word "siesta". I checked the fiftieth edition
> (1997) and found the word entered incorrectly. The ninetieth edition
> no longer have this mistake.
I checked again. The 36th edition (1994) does not have this mistake.
I wonder why the mistake crept back into the later edition. I have a
theory. Later edition(s) was not really a new edition and it was
merely a reprint and for that purpose they either "copied" from an
earlier version of the dictionary which had the mistake or merely used
an earlier linotype plate from their storage (archives).
I am really surprised that between 1994 and now, 54 more editions (90
- 36 = 54) of the dictionary have been published. Imagine what would
have been the potential market for a truly scholarly dictionary with
fewer mistakes!
> Will you check the following entries.
> break down- vandi mariyuka
The meanings given are "thakarkuka" and "vislashikuka". I did not see
the "meaning" you cited here.
> platoon- vallikkettu
I know what platoon is, but don't have a clue what vallikkettu means.
> debris- polinja kappal (wrecked ship)
That is hilarious. It may be an acquired meaning in Malayalam like
having "a small" or "a large" or the expression "mood out". Only we
know the intended meaning of these expressions. :) :)
> crotch- partaking of branches
I wonder how branches are partaken or how they partake.:)
> kabba, kabala- (the name of the mosque in Mecca)
Shows clear carelessness in writing.
> anabasis-ability to regain life after apparent death (this meaning
> eblongs to another word,"anabiosis")
I agree. There is no connection between the word and the given
meaning.
> I have very low esteem for the so-called scholars in Kerala. I am
> afraid being abroad you may tend to see things through a nostalgic
> gaze. The fact is that the English comprehension capacity of most of
> our scholars is extremely poor. Poorer than some fellows who write and
> post pornographic stories on Internet.
I agree with you on this point. Ever since setting up schools and
providing education became a business, should I say a racket, role of
education in developing young minds has become secondary to making
profits and finding jobs for people who can pay. I was expecting
children educated through English medium would have higher
proficiency at least in English. Their command of English is only
average and they are not any better in other subjects. When I read
some Malayalam newspapers I get a feeling that I am reading a foreign
language. The reason is that the writers are literally translating
English articles. When they are not sure of the meaning of a word or
an expression they turn to English-Malayalam dictionary and use the
Malayalam word found there. Many times I had to guess the meaning by
translating back to English. The situation becomes a mockery when
idioms and expressions are translated literally. I wish I noted down
some germs of these hilarious translations. One finds it hilarious
only if one is very familiar with English expressions and its style.
Here is one translation from the English subtitle in a Malayalam
movie.
Malayalam: Acha odi waayo
English subtitle given: Father come running.
Somehow the English translation sounds ridiculous.
Unfortunately I never had a chance to read any of the works by Prof.
Guptan Nair, but I heard that he was an excellent Malayalam professor.
NV Krishna Warrier was a phenomenon in the Malayalam literary field
and he was a polyglot with many exceptional talents. One incident
was narrated to me by an old timer about his exceptional skill in
translating from one language to another. Dr. Radhakrishnan was the
keynote speaker at the 1954 Sahitya Parishat at Ottapalam and NV
Krishna Warrier was translator of the speech for the Malayalee
audience. The translation was so exceptional, that the audience who
knew both languages agreed that the Malayalam version was to the
point, accurate and even more powerful than the original because of
the skillful use of appropriate syntax. The person who told me the
story recited part of the English speech of Radhakrishnan and its
Malayalam translation by Krishna Warrier. I wish I had written down
that. All I remember is that I was very impressed by the translation.
Nevertheless our criticism must be constructive rather than a
reflection of our negative attitude towards nearly everything. In
spite of the flaws in our character and the faults of our system, I
will admit I am a product of that system and I cannot totally condemn
the system that gave me a start and set me up to go the way I
eventually chose.
> Since you have said you have
> Guptan Nair's Dictionary I would like you to look up some entries
> beginning with "wh" for their pronounciation. wheel,wheat,
> whale,where,wheeze. You will be shocked. (The shitty thing sold after
> Ramalingam Pillai mimicks Guptan Nair here.) The poor man who claims
> that he taught phonetics many years doesn't know the phenomenon called
> "aspiration" in phonetics. He says he used Daniel Jones'
> Pronounciation Dictionary in preparing the thing. It is sad that he
> doesn't know how to interpret the italicized "h" at the beginning of
> IPA transcription of the pronounciation of the given words. And this
> man is a "renowned scholar" of Kerala. If these people confined their
> work to their own native language there would have been no reason to
> complain.
I am not very familiar with the topics you are discussing here. It
would have been appropriate if Prof. Guptan Nair sought the help of
scholars in certain specific fields such as pronunciation/enunciation.
Sometimes ego stands in the way!
Who needs English-Malayalam dictionary? During the early stages of
English education Children will need the help of such dictionaries,
but later they can go to the English-English dictionary. Translators
always will need dictionaries. Technical terms can be made
intelligible only by proper explanation and by providing with
equivalent expressions. That is a process by which a language evolves
and grows.
Expert
H&C Publishing House Thrissur publishing a portable unique cost
effective handbook for students, names "The Students
Handbook"-Learning Strategies.
"The Students Handbook" helps students assimilate more benefit from
currently spending time and effort. "The Students Handbook" tailor
made to keralite students.
In today's competitive times parents and teachers exert a huge amount
of pressure and spent a lot of money on education, while extolling
students to study at all times, little realizing the importance of
proper guidelines that prepare the student to study smart. ĺ…¨tudy,
Study' is the mantra but even teachers haven't yet mastered the art of
imparting knowledge. The Students' Handbook aims to correct this
anomaly by being a handy manual for students to keep along with their
text and note books.
I suggest this is a gift to every student in kerala.
regards,
Expert
kku...@hotmail.com (K.Kunju) wrote in message news:<604fa706.03111...@posting.google.com>...