New Hmong Settlement
DKJ
See how Lao gvmt care of its own innocent people!
This settlement is ready for hmong returnees and VP defectors
Enjoy the new life with new settlement that would be better than Houay
Nam Khao an hundred of times.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/dkj-hmong
I will give more details later
dkj
zhen
that's very impressive. the innocent are given the chance to live a
stone age lifestyle under a cruel and repressive regime.
cwjmem
intention, not for propaganda purposes. If LPDR has a good intention
to take care its own citizen, then there will be peace. Let keep our
fingers crossed.
Thanks.
Born2beHmong
dkj,
thank you, it looks good--if this is what really is from the Lao gvmt,
then they should allow third neutral party to visit these people and
monitor their living condition and well-being.
again, thanks for the update, i hope that all the returnees would be
treated well.
Born2beHmong
vaaj...@yahoo.com
On Jun 22, 11:05 pm, DKJ <dkj.l...@gmail.com> wrote:
brushoff
back to laos, right?
txho...@hotmail.com
zoo heev rau peb cov Hmoob lawm laiv yom. Tiamsi mas, is this what
communist is all about though? Lawv muab khoom thiab kev zoo los
ntxias yus kom yus seej seej lawm ces lawv mam coj cov txivneej ib tus
zujzus mus kawm hov riam thiab de kuatxob li uas lawv ua rau LT thiab
Phasnyas lawv xwb puas yog?
Kuv nco qab mas cov nom uas txiavtxim siab nrog nplogliab nyob rau lub
sijhawm GVP tabtom tsiv tebchaws mas nplogliab muab cov tsheb jeep zoo
zoo thiab tshiab tshiab rau lawv caij luag ntxhwb ntxhi li laiv.
Tiamsi tabqab tsis ntev xwb ces lawv tub raug mus xam mas nas tag lawm
ne. Kuv mas rhiab dhau lawm lauj, kuv ntsia mas ntshe yuav yog tib
txoj kev ntawd xwb laub. Nej sim nug tseem yeej seb ma. Nws tijlaug
tau mus txojkev ntawd dua lawm tiag. Niam no nws tub tsis tau kawm
tiav ne.
Dibiab Iabsiab kawg
On Jun 22, 11:05 pm, DKJ <dkj.l...@gmail.com> wrote:
DKJ
>
> thank you, it looks good--if this is what really is from the Lao gvmt,
> then they should allow third neutral party to visit these people and
> monitor their living condition and well-being.
Born2beHmong,
Like other Hmong settlements, this place is open for all and not far
from Kasi City, VTE province where simple people can drive out to
visit the settlement and enjoy beautiful natural surroundings and
fresh air, of course, with 4X4WD car.
See more photos
http://www.flickr.com/photos/dkj-hmong
dkj
tseemyeej
> Wow, .................................................................
> Dibiab Iabsiab kawg
Txij li thaum koj txiv vp raug txim los no ces noj dabtsi los iab cuag
dib iab li lawm laud yom....Hahaha..
Txog siav laud...
TseemYeej.
txho...@hotmail.com
Koj nyiam nrog kuv tham kawg yom. Kuv los kuj zoo siab uas koj pheej
nrog kuv txuas lus kawg thiab. Yog li koj hais tiag. Tij li thaum
GVP raug txim los ces noj ab tsi los iab siab kawg tiag. Tiamsi, txij
thaum kuv paub tias koj yog LT tus tijlaug los mas kuv noj txhua yam
laj siab npaum dibiab rau qhov at lease GVP will have a fair trial.
Tiamsi koj tus tijlaug xyov nws mus tuag phem li cas. Kuv kuj hlub
nws kawg. Kuv tsis rau txim rau nws, kuv nrog nej khuvxim thiab hlub
nws kawg. Txawm li cas los nws yog peb tib tsob Hmoob. Mob nws los
kuj mob peb thiab. Kheev lam nws txhob tuaj cuam tshuam peb Hmoob tim
HH ces tshe peb Hmoob tub tsis raug poob qab txom nyem npaum li
ntawd.
Koj puas paub, lub sijhawm uas lawv tua cov neeg tim HH ntawd tas mas
cov Hmoob uas rov qab mas tus quaj tus tusiab npaum li cas los muaj.
Muaj ib cov uas tsis muaj nyiaj ntiav kev ces cia li rov qab mus ua ib
siab nyob ua tu siab ntsuav li lawm. Tiamsi cov uas muaj nyiaj ntiav
neeg hla kev tuaj ces, muaj tej txhia raug nplog txhav nyiaj, raug
tua, raug poob dej thiab tua lawm coob tus kawg tiag. Cov dim ces yog
hmoov xwb.
Dibiab Lajsiab tshaj los iabsiab tshaj
tseemyeej
Tham txog kuv tijlaug Lyteck ces nej twb hais los tau 30 plus xyoo no
lawm, it doesn't hurt anymore. As the matter of fact, I've learned how
to be a man and I will stand strong as usual.
Tabsis tus tseem ciaj-j li vp es Zhen cia li lam hais tau tej niag lo
lus txias siab nrog tus siab tsawv tias luag poising nws es nws thiaj
mus pw hospital lawm no. Ab...tsis lam yog Lyteck tso tub txib los to
mus hais plaub saum ntuj pauj?
Kuv xav mas tej zaum koj yuav tau kho koj lub npe mentsis tias:
"dibiab hlabsiab tshaj" no ov.
Good night,
Hasta la vista baby,
Bon soir,
TseemYeej.
zins...@hotmail.com
if only you live in such shelter first and say how good it is then
that would be like lying through your teeth.
this temperory shelter is not good.
why it bamboo. fah mike hear would turn grey and get eaten by beetles.
and dusty. where is the cooking place? inside the hut.
then it would be smoky and dusty.
this is a tropical country with heavy rain. the lower part will rot
very quickly. it should have been raised at least 1 meter. the
foundation is mud. this will wash away.
the roof is corrogated would be very hot to live in during the hot
season and can be very cold at night.
cost per unit 300-500 us$? maybe less
labour from sam k,ofcourse it also done in the usA
money international donations.
> See how Lao gvmt care of its own innocent people!
see how the government fail to know what is good to live in
>
> This settlement is ready for hmong returnees and VP defectors
> Enjoy the new life with new settlement that would be better than Houay
> Nam Khao an hundred of times.
so where can they get to voice their complaint.
>
>
> dkj
thanouxay
Are you born in Laos or USA? Why not to add SPA and fitness centre
facilities for them too...
Be aware that the Government had been respectful of the following when
it built this settlement:
1. An environment which suits to Phinong Hmong;
2. An area where they can have plenty of land along the hillside for
;
3. Shelters suit to Hmong habitat; and
4. Up to them to shoose to live by clan.
This is the first lot of 50 unit. 50 additional units will be built to
accomodate about 100 household.
A first group of about thirty persons of the group of 31 persons who
had been rapatriated last month had been travelling to Ponglak
yesterday. I hope that they will love it.
Sok dee
> > dkj- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
thanouxay
A first group of about thirty persons of the group of 31 persons who
had been rapatriated last month had been travelling to Ponglak
yesterday. You may ask why thirty persons? Is it the entire group
which had been resttled there?
No, most of the thirty one who had been rapatriated were sent back to
their home region where they have families and parents.
Only those who had sold out all their belongings and well before being
lured to Thailand and those who were involved in destructive slash-and-
burn cultuivation will be given a chance to be settled in this new
settlement. Among those who are to be resettled in Ponglak, 2
gentlemen requested the Government to locate and bring their wife to
them. Local Authorities had located the two wifes and their children
that is why the few families totalling about 30.
Be aware that the Government had been respectful of the following
criteria when it built this new settlement:
1. An environment which suits to Phinong Hmong;
2. An area where they can have plenty of land along the hillside for
;
3. Small scale irrigation scheme had already been built and another
big one is to be built to water more ricefield.
3. Shelters suit to Hmong habitat; and
4. Up to them to shoose to live by clan.
This is the first lot of 50 unit. 50 additional units will be built to
accomodate about 100 household.
I hope that they will love it.
Sok dee
drsouk
glad to see that these hmongs have now a better life.
"thanouxay" <than...@hotmail.com> a écrit dans le message de news:
1182583561.2...@i13g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
zins...@hotmail.com
first place. what maybe good in your mind may not be for the
inhabitants
what good is a spa and fitness club? you may enjoy this at sengdara
but it is useless facilties to the hmong.
thats the first I see you call them hmong and not lao sung.
the issue I have raised are very real and valid
did you know that nam ba dan gives people kidney stones.
and being closed to people living place means it can lead to cholera
out break? hope someone advise people to boil their drinking water.
what about fuel for their cooking. are the people supposed to chop
more trees for fire wood?
the location is in the middle of nowhere. where is the nearest town
and how can the people earn their living? who in the world enjoy
subsistent existance? the opportunity for their kids such good
practical education doesn't exist.
if they are ill where is the doctor or you expect them to rely on mor
phee? is this suitable practice?
they would be afraid to even complain. you know this as well as I
do.
Born2beHmong
DKJ,
thank you once again, if it is true as you were saying here. it
would be great for all of us to united and helped to build the
country for better of tomorrow, for all the citizens of Lao. i
sincerely hope that this is how the new generation and new era of
educate people Lao who have love, equality, and equal opportunity for
the country and for all the citizens. its great to know that we all
are coming to be one as for the best of the Lao citizens, and it would
be a long term goal and dream. however, reeducation camp and seminar
would be a secondary from now on, and there would be no more of
secretly seeking take away men from its village and family.
This would be the dream and hope of the future in Lao.
Thank you,
Born2beHmong
Moobsib
If this is true then it is great. We certainly appreciate that. I
worry it might too good to be true. However, I am glad to see some
thing positive from your side. Keep up the good work.
Regard,
MS
Tony
the people? LPDR surely has a quick result responding to the needs of
her citizen. If that was a true intention, the hmong would not have
tried to escape your left hand with guns while your right hand
reaching out with a dove. I just can't believe what I just type,
imagine that.
kee...@yahoo.com
DKJ,
Make sure your words and your pictures reflect the well intention of
the Lao government as well as the returnees. We heard many bad things
had happened to the Hmong returnees after the hand over ceremony. In
fact, some source said that 5 men of the returnees were tortured to
death.
If possible, can you update us about this rumor. The more you (the Lao
government) provides transparency information whereabout the Hmong
returnees as well as those Hmong came out of the jungle, the better
position you are in terms of proving your AMNESTY, INTEGRITY,
ACCOUNTIBILITY, RESPONSIBILITY, and PROSPERITY to the outside world.
FYI, whether GVP is found guilty or not, it doesn't stop the Hmong and
the internation communities to pay more close attention to your
treament of Hmong returnees and those come out of the forests. Since
this year you, DKJ have been posting a lot of good information and
pictures to show the world that you are indeed have good gesture of
loving your citizens, including your poor Hmong citizens who might
have been brain washed by their former GVP and the likes.
I highly regard your courage and your good intention to break the ice-
berg between the Hmong people and the Lao government, but please don't
let your posts, pictures, and words backfire you or your government
later on.
Best regards!
PS: There are many fine young Hmong men/women (not terrorists) abraod
who are dying to come back to help develop their lovely motherland,
but you (lao government) have to open your heart and your arm to
receive their talents.
wrote:
Moobsib
MS
Pajnplaimcua
propaganda xwb os.
Pajnplaimcua
>
> MS
and i'm sure Hitler's gas chambers and barracks for the jews looked
nice and shiny when they were first built.
maxwell
> zins,
> Are you born in Laos or USA? Why not to add SPA and fitness centre
> facilities for them too...
Apologies if I disturb your propagandizing, but zins makes very good points.
Since you 'cleverly' speak of luxury 'why nots?' in order to ridicule zins'
very good points, you might be simple-minded in thinking your reply should
be believed, so a simple explanation is needed:
1. The settlement is 5 km away from a village and _down_ a dirt road, and
located on a plot of land which is _down_slope from hills and one mountain.
2. The buildings of the village _up_ the road are raised on stilts.
3. The huts of the settlement sit on the earth.
4. The region has monsoon rains for some months every year.
5. Water flows _down_ hill, and not only are the huts NOT raised up to allow
water to pass underneath, but no drainage channel cuts have been made to
collect water and allow it to run down hill away from the huts.
6. The footing boards of the huts are not even high enough to allow more
than a fraction of the water flow past the down-slope huts to pass
underneath, though the up-slope huts may escape water washing into their
floors.
7. Nevertheless, the footing boards of all buildings are subject to
immersion in rains and at risk of wash out, while the areas between
buildings, and along the way to the pump and to the two hole shitting hut
will be soaking wet mud.
So, when monsoon rain falls, water runs into and around many huts from the
rain falling on and running down along the ground.
Muddy water, too.
> Be aware that the Government had been respectful of the following when
> it built this settlement:
> 1. An environment which suits to Phinong Hmong;
Are these Hmong known as the Mud People?
> 2. An area where they can have plenty of land along the hillside for
> ;
Mucking about in the mud?
> 3. Shelters suit to Hmong habitat;
Living in primitive little huts in the mud.
> and 4. Up to them to shoose to live by clan.
At least they're together--do you seriously think that makes everything else
okay?
> This is the first lot of 50 unit. 50 additional units will be built to
> accomodate about 100 household.
How many two hole loo for 50 households?
One pump for 50 households?
Where to wash body, where to wash clothing?
> A first group of about thirty persons of the group of 31 persons who
> had been rapatriated last month had been travelling to Ponglak
> yesterday. I hope that they will love it.
Very big hope you have.
Too bad such hope for these Hmong is being taken to such little huts well
away down the road from little town.
Just wondering--nobody else wanted to be there, was that it?
. . or tell me some crap about SPA and fitness centre . .. ;~)
-maxwell
cwjmem
Indeed, it is 10 times better living in your own country than living
in exile. Those shelters will suit well with those Pinong Hmong. As
long as there is a good size, clean river close by, they can use it as
SPA. Let them out of cage and running free like wild horse as long as
they don't break the laws.
However, Laos needs to allow international human right groups to
monitor their well beings. If you do that, all of the ones in Huay
Nam Khao will follow.
> >> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
sako...@yahoo.com
>
> - Show quoted text -
thanouxay and dkj,
Appreciate your pictures which show to us about the Hmong repatriate
resettlement in Kasi. Can the UN or Third party visit or monitor the
Hmong who have been repatriated to this village?
If the LPDR government doesn't allow the Third Party to monitor then
your pictures just be a propagandist to the outside world.
SK
zhen
don't hold your breath.
why repatriate these people back to the boondocks? repatriate them to
vientiane with modern housing and progressive education. show them
LPDR is changing and helping.
otherwise, my prediction is these people will fall back into the same
misery and disillusion only to suffer repatriation.
nkauj...@yahoo.com
>
> - Show quoted text -
HEHEEH NTUJ OS TIJLAUG DIBLIAB AWS
CAS KOJ YUAV HAIS LUS TAU KUV LUAG TSI TAU KIAG LI LAWM
OS........HEHEEH TIAMSIS MAS YEEJ TSI YUAM KEV KIAG LI
OS..........TIJLAUG DIBLIAB AWS NTAWV YOG NPLOG LIAB NPLOG LOJ LUB
TSWV8 MAS.....EHHHE
KUV LOS YEEJ POM LI KOJ TAU HAIS THIAB MAS YOM.....CAS YUAV TSI LEARN
LI LOD FROM QHOV UAS LAWV MUAB LT THIAB PHASNYAS NKAWV MUS LI LAWM NA
YOM.....LUAG TWB QHIA KIAG LUAG LUB SIAB THIAB LUB HLWB RAU YUS LOS
YUS TSEEM PHEEJ TSI POM LI THIAB CES KAWG PAB TU SIAB LOD
HEHEHEEH.......
KUV LOS YEEJ POM THIAB NTSEEG TAU LI KOJ YOG TIJLAUG TAU HAIS TAG LOS
NO.......NO COMPLAINT LI OS....EVEN KUV TWB TSI YOG NEJ LI GENERATION
NA...........HEHEHE
nkauj...@yahoo.com
>
> - Show quoted text -
TIJLAUG DIBLIAB,
LO LUS UAS COV LAUS HAIS TIAS (((((((((( LEEJNIAM LUB KUAMUAG POOB,
CES YUS TXOJ HMOOV YUAV TSI NTEV NO PUAS MUAJ MAS LOS))))))))
THIAB LO LUS TIAS ((((((NEEG DAWB HU TSI TAU UA LI CAS RAU YUS ES YUS
SIAB PHEM TUA LUAG TUAG TAG CES ROV LOS NPAM YUS NO)))))))))))) PUAS
MUAJ THIAB NA LOS?
LUB KUAMUAG DEJ POOB TWB TSI MOB NPAUM LI LUB KUAMUAG NTSHAV POOB
NO.........TSI TAG LI LOS LAWV TIAS ((((((((((MOB CEV NQAIJ TSEEM MUAJ
TSHUAJ LOS KHO .....TIAMSIS MOB LUB SIAB YUAV TSI MUAJ IB YAM DABTSI
LOS KHO TAU LI?))))))))))))))))))))
TOS LUAG TIAS HEEV NEEG MUAJ HEEV NEEG TSIM NO PUAS MUAJ TIAG THIAB
TIJLAUG DIBLIAB........TOS KUV TAU NUG KOJ TXOG COV LUS NO LOS ZOO LI
TUAJ NYEEM KOJ COV POST NO..........LEEJTWG TUB MUAJ ZOO TSWV8 NROG
LAWM ZOO FWJCHIM NWS YEEJ TSI LAM KHAV NWS TSUAS YOG HAIS KOM RAUG
SIAB ROV MUS RAUG NTSW TIAMSIS IB LO LUS TWG NWS HAIS YEEJ YOG HAIS
KOM TXOJ SIA YUAV TU LOS TU TSI TAU TSEEM MOB NPAUM TWG LOS YOG TUS
NYEEM TAU ZOO ZOO PAUB TXOG NWS LUB NTXHAIB LUS NTAWM THIAJ LI MOB
XWB.......ZAMTXIM........YOG KUV HAIS LUS NTAU LAWM.
thanouxay
As I told you that a mini-irrigation dam located about half a
Kilometre from the new village has been completed. Yes this is where,
the kids will love to swim and fish while the adult can find water for
gardening.
The old Ponglak village which is about two kilometres from the
settlement has a dispensary where sick people can be treated and Muang
Med and Kasy where there are district hospital are about 25 kilometres
range.
Yes, they will be free like horses therefore the local authorities
estimated that they (the new settlelers) will move within 20
kilometres radius along the valley and uphill. They are so free to the
extend that among the newly rapatriated from Thailand in the group of
31 and 160, there are about ten families who were resettled in 2006 in
Muang Med. They paid about 10 silver bars to traffickers to bring them
to Thailand with the hope to go to third country and ended up in the
same area again and once again, the burden is on the shoulder of the
Government.
Sok dee
thanouxay
Do you wish that I just switch off everything and no more picture and
no more information, maybe this is what you wish to achieve???
Sok dee
zhen
can they be free like humans instead of like some animal (i.e. horse)?
can you build a school for them so instead of fruitless recreation
they can learn?
sok dee.
zhen
i don't think you can do what tony really 'wishes' for.
don't think what you're doing is a service. we clearly see it for what
it is.
*cheers*
thanouxay
Rumor is rumor and you know that we can never switch off rumor. What
do you think we are doing now by putting picture and explanation to
everybody...
Please be aware that this is a test we are conducting... If too much
negative comment and especially too un-constructive comments, we may
decide to go back to our business as usual and let everybody in the
dark to guess by their own.
Please tell me what do you prefer... Either way is OK for me.
Laos is not a rich country... This pilot project cost us a lot of
money... Sometime we have bad feelings because even for our own people
who have been fighting for us their lifetime, they are still living in
huts with bamboo roofing.
Sok dee
zhen
it's good that you admit LPDR is a closed country. it's good that you
admit your 'business as usual' is to suppress information and
knowledge about laos and its people.
i'll tell you that i prefer you go back to business as usual. can you
do this?
laos is not a rich country. i wonder whose fault is that?
you admitted 2 things that you say are 'rumors': 1) LPDR's business as
usual is to supress information/knowledge about the welfare of its
people and 2) LPDR has made no economic progress within the last 30
years and still remains a 'poor' country.
thanks for the admission of these facts.
thanouxay
Time will come. Don't be too impatient.
Sok dee
> SK- Hide quoted text -
zhen
is 30 years not enough time? how long do you want? how many more
decades and centuries?
ctj
Thank you for sharing the pictures of the new Hmong Settlement. This is a
step in the right direction. Thirty years of conflict is long enough so
let us give peace a chance.
Recent activities have set in motion the healing process. All parties
stand to gain (or lose) as much as they are willing to compromise. The
eyes of the world are on Laos, and she can show the world that she is
indeed ready to join the international community.
Several others have alluded that a third party is needed to monitor the
resettlement process. This approach will greatly increase your
credibility and is a step toward building trust. Your government has
invested a lot thus far in the construction of this new Hmong settlement.
Why not take the last few steps to make sure that it will succeed? How can
we help you get the process of International monitoring in place? May I
suggest that the LPDR and the US Hmong each suggest three representatives
from three different nations to monitor the process? The fall-out from
doing nothing can be disastrous.
I await your reply.
Chong
sako...@yahoo.com
>
> - Show quoted text -
Thanouxay,
When the time will be come in? we have been very patient for many
years. I don't care much about the living standardize; I knew how much
the LPDR government has the burden, waiting to receive the
International donation; but at least they should be providing the
school for children, free to travel any where they want, free to find
their own foods for their family and do not plan to perscute them.
SK
Tony
Your internet information does not match up to your action. Say what
you do and do what you say. Is that too hard for LPDR?
Good one Zhen. He can not grant one if I do have a wish. I never ask
for him to show what a kind heart LPDR had any way and now he wish to
go back to the way it was. I rather not know and it would save me
less headache and prolong a few grey hair.
Mr. Thanouxay, you admitted that LPDR is a poor country and most
people still live in bamboo hut. Did that tell yourself anything? Or
just because you said it and you did not expect to learn anything
from what you were saying?
Thousand of Hmong and Lao visited LPDR each years, brough millions of
dollars. Dr. Pao, your good friend back then but not so sure now,
visited and suggested way to improve the well being of your people
along with many other who would extend their hands to help. But no,
there was fear of those who offered to help rebuild the country.
Since you mentioned a wish that I have not thought of, open your door,
welcome those Hmong and Lao from the past 32 years with an open arm
and truly do what you say and truly say what you do, perhaps you don't
have to try too hard through your internet propaganda which was
worthless. It was / is a waste of time.
I used to live in a bamboo hut. I knew how to weave those bamboo
walls. Since 1975, I rather not live in those bamboo huts. Would you
dream of have a better place for your people to live? If you do, open
the door, extend both hands our with doves, Peace, and the people will
come. Perhaps you have heard the American say, "If you build it, they
will come." What do think about that for my "wish"?
Sok dee to you,
Tony,
Zoo
of settlement is seem no planning at all - just randomly settle and
build.
lao...@hotmail.com
> All,
>
> See how Lao gvmt care of its own innocent people!
>
> This settlement is ready for hmong returnees and VP defectors
> Enjoy the new life with new settlement that would be better than Houay
> Nam Khao an hundred of times.
>
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/dkj-hmong
>
> I will give more details later
>
> dkj
Bravo for LPDR.
Welcome back pinong Hmong. I know this isn't much, but at least you
have roof over your head. We all have to start over sometime in our
lives. This is a good start, you don't have to run, you don't have to
hide.
Send your kids to school and have a new start on life. Life is what
we make of it. I wish you all the best of luck.
TKM
Supat
news:1182654923.7...@g4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
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(703) 4446233
Here is a picture of the Sue Chaisone, the ugly whore:
http://img168.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=30021_Sue_122_536lo.jpg
Here is a picture of the Bryan Chaisone, the dumbass riding on his buffalo
trough the streets of Manassas
http://img168.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=72648_Somchai_122_573lo.jpg
**************************************************
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brushoff
> <laonork_the born buf...@hotpoop.com> spewed in messagenews:1182654923.7...@g4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
>
> **************************************************
> Please visit our new group:
>
> http://groups.google.com/group/abuse-aware-aid?hl=en
> abuse-a...@googlegroups.com
>
>
>
> > On Jun 23, 12:05 am, DKJ <dkj.l...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> All,
>
> >> See how Lao gvmt care of its own innocent people!
>
> >> This settlement is ready for hmong returnees and VP defectors
> >> Enjoy the new life with new settlement that would be better than Houay
> >> Nam Khao an hundred of times.
>
> >>http://www.flickr.com/photos/dkj-hmong
>
> >> I will give more details later
>
> >> dkj
>
> > Bravo for LPDR.
>
> > Welcome back pinong Hmong. I know this isn't much, but at least you
> > have roof over your head. We all have to start over sometime in our
> > lives. This is a good start, you don't have to run, you don't have to
> > hide.
>
> > Send your kids to school and have a new start on life. Life is what
> > we make of it. I wish you all the best of luck.
>
>
> - Show quoted text -
To ugly of the buffalo, chill...BBK will spiper her
adi...@yahoo.com
>
>
>
> > All,
>
> > See how Lao gvmt care of its own innocent people!
>
> > This settlement is ready for hmong returnees and VP defectors
> > Enjoy the new life with new settlement that would be better than Houay
> > Nam Khao an hundred of times.
>
> >http://www.flickr.com/photos/dkj-hmong
>
> > I will give more details later
>
>
> - Show quoted text -
Thznouxay,
Are speaking on behalf your government? Or just yourself? If you spoke
on behalf of the Lao government then I think you have brought a lot of
beer Lao and nam mak phao (coconut juice) here. But if you are on your
own, then you ought to be prepared because some of your statements
shown here look like you are talking in an official capacity which
dealing with state affairs.
DKJ
Would you like to see hmong people dying in these shits:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/troubles/
You can see what and how big is different from below site:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/dkj-hmong/page2/
This should be the real place where hmong people always dream to live
in.
dkj
dougi...@hotmail.com
Yeah, that's a big different between Huay Nam Khao and Lao settlement.
Thank you! The one in Laos look more suitable for our pinong Lao-
soong.
Good day!
Dougi
dougi...@hotmail.com
The one in Huay Nam Khao look like HELL!
There was a news that they will move to another camp near by.
I hope they will find a better camp.
Smoothie
On 6 25 , 12:27, "dougismo...@hotmail.com" <dougismo...@hotmail.com>
wrote:
> > dkj- -
>
> - -
Tshaj...@gmail.com
>
> - Show quoted text -
dkj,
to let you know that we have received 2 phone called from Laos said,
all hmong who forced by thai gov't to laos have been in jail, beat
them, pay 100 dolllar each person fine, and their life are not
warrantee. Please your brother in Laos for help
DKJ
> all hmong who forced by thai gov't to laos have been in jail, beat
> them, pay 100 dolllar each person fine, and their life are not warrantee.
You may get hundreds of phone calls from whoever from Laos, it is not
surprised to me what you just said, but it seems to me that you are
the one of VP ass-licking terrorist group and you will love to see
hmong people dying in these shits:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/troubles/
You should thank to Lao PDR's govenment to find the real place where
hmong people always dream to live in.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/dkj-hmong/page2/
dkj
Pao
Why over 300,000+ Lao decided to leave their beautiful native home
since 1975?
Who would any one wanting to leave everything at home and go for the
iron bar cells in Thailand?? Why the Laonork wanting to stay as
Longnork? Why some Laonai wanting to leave Laos?
It is all about this - "khab thi you dai, khab chai you nyad"
That is the message....
thanouxay
I do hope that you are not part of the problem or be among those who
incite those poor peoples to get lured to live their native land. If
you are, what a pity for you.
Sok dee
Tony
Thanouxay,
Thank you for those photos. That just proof that LPDR's hands were
behind all that. Hmong love their mountainous homeland of Laos. They
would not trade a free country to the little cell behind bar. Did I
just type "free country"? I did. Free the people and they will never
leave their beloved homeland.
Tony,
john...@gmail.com
Thank DKJ for the pictures that is good thing for LPDR at least they
doing
Something to show they care about all ethics in Laos.
Hakpheng John,
Hmong-Lao
There are people who have concerns about this and that, and there are
some people who are biased, but most of us appreciate the kindness of
LPDR government toward it's people who are the victims of human
tracficking. Hope the settlement goes well.
Friends (Hmong/Lao nork),
Nothing to worry. Even though out side governments are not allowed to
monitor, I believe out side individual is allowed to visit freely
(Please confirm DKJ and Thanouxay). And please be aware that every
families has their own relatives in Laos and aboard which will be the
best people to monitor their resettlement. If these returnees are
treated unfair or sent to re-education camp, there may be another
headache to LPDR and that might last another 30 years.
These cabins are much much better than the plastic sheet shelters at
Huai Nam Khao.
Thanks for the update DKJ,
HL
Crazy Larry
Your friend,
Larry
Crazy Larry
>
> Why over 300,000+ Lao decided to leave their beautiful native home
> since 1975?
> Who would any one wanting to leave everything at home and go for the
> iron bar cells in Thailand?? Why the Laonork wanting to stay as
> Longnork? Why some Laonai wanting to leave Laos?
>
> It is all about this - "khab thi you dai, khab chai you nyad"
> That is the message....
You're an idiot!
Your friend,
Larry
none
Do us a favor, next time just leave them in the Thai custody. Once
they leave Laos it's no longer our problem. Let the Thai and the VP
thugs deal with it.
Crazy Larry
>
> - Show quoted text -
That's the best suggestion I've heard all year! Unfortunately, that
doesn't help the people who really needs the help (the Hmongs in Thai
custidy). Don't let what some idiot in SCL say change your views on
some of the Hmongs who fell for the VP's clans' propaganda.
Wil
Your friend,
Larry
adi...@yahoo.com
>
> - Show quoted text -
Thanouxay,
Did you have a chance to shake hand with Dr. Pao when he visited Laos
last year? If so, now you know. Instead of pitying at Dr. Pao, you
should pity at yourself and your government. Dr. Pao is smart enought
to use the Embassy of the Australia as a scapegaot to deliver a
speciall mission. While he was enjoying the Lao beer and dancing with
Lao girls, he sent special envoys to meet the resistance groups in the
jungles. Do you remember that Dr. Pao had requested to visit Long
Cheng on his second proposed trip?
Tshaj...@gmail.com
> Thanouxay,
>
> Indeed, it is 10 times better living in your own country than living
> in exile. Those shelters will suit well with those Pinong Hmong. As
> long as there is a good size, clean river close by, they can use it as
> SPA. Let them out of cage and running free like wild horse as long as
> they don't break the laws.
>
> However, Laos needs to allow international human right groups to
> monitor their well beings. If you do that, all of the ones in Huay
> Nam Khao will follow.
>
> > >> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
Kwv Cwjmem nawb, cov hmoob xa rov qab muaj teebmeem lawm, nej cov
hluas yuav tau nrhia tswv8 mus pab nawb, lawm cov mus tim thaib mus
thaum lub 5 thab 6 hli no, yog tsis them nyiaj rau gov't lostsuas ces
kaws ib leeg 2 xyoo, nyias yuavtsum nrhia nyias teb ua noj tsis muaj
leejtwg pab li, no yog tsab xovtooj tuaj thov nyiaj 6/22/07 no nawb.
DKJ
>
> Do us a favor, next time just leave them in the Thai custody. Once
> they leave Laos it's no longer our problem. Let the Thai and the VP
> thugs deal with it.
none,
We cannot do that as thai authorities will let them live on the middle
of Mekong river like they had done earlier and now thai won't let any
more shits like VP terrorist group be flowed into their country as
they have enough of them in the three southern provinces.
dkj
Crazy Larry
>
> Thanouxay,
>
> Did you have a chance to shake hand with Dr. Pao when he visited Laos
> last year? If so, now you know. Instead of pitying at Dr. Pao, you
> should pity at yourself and your government. Dr. Pao is smart enought
> to use the Embassy of the Australia as a scapegaot to deliver a
> speciall mission. While he was enjoying the Lao beer and dancing with
> Lao girls, he sent special envoys to meet the resistance groups in the
> jungles. Do you remember that Dr. Pao had requested to visit Long
> Cheng on his second proposed trip?
Wow, you, BukTony above and BukPao sound so smart. I bet that all the
Hmong are very happy that they have smart Hmongs like you, BukTony and
BukPao to lead them. You guys rock! Can I be your friend? You guys
sound so smart.
Your friend,
Larry
Tshaj...@gmail.com
> All,
>
> See how Lao gvmt care of its own innocent people!
>
> Enjoy the new life with new settlement that would be better than Houay
> Nam Khao an hundred of times.
>
DKJ, kuv xav tias koj twb yuamkev lawm, los yog koj tsis yog Hmoob 100
percent los koj txub vp losyog YD thiab lwm pawg neeg hmoob twg lawm
cas koj yuav haistias, cov rov qab no tau zoo dua lawm 100 zaus, ntse
koj tus kwvtij ua nom tim ub es lawm tau zoo xwb, ho peb cov neeg
pejxeem rov tim thaib ntau xyoo uas UN xa mus tseem raug suspect txog
sijhawm no. txhua tus hmoob uas tuaj tim thaib es tsis muaj tseeb li
cov neeg dag hais, ho rov mus zwm hom volunteer surrender raug nplua
haistias tsis nyiam gov't lostsuas thiaj khiav tawm no, yog 300,000
kip thiab gov't tivtas nws mus ntau xyoo, tsis yoojyim lam tau lam
hais ub hais no, raug nplua no nyob vanvieng, veescas yog cov hmoob UN
xa mus ntag!!! cov no nyob bang phathao, vanvieng, viencha. phoojywg
txawm tias koj thiab kuv tsis nyiam VP thiab cov niag neeg dag los,
peb tsis nyiam lawv xwb, ho hais txog yus haivhmoob yus yuav tau
protect. yog tsawgzaus los yus hais txog yus cov neeg phem xwb no,
txhob nyob ze hmoob thiab txhob mus nrhiav cov dejnum los yog lagluam
ua rau hmoob losyog nrog Hmoob, yus yuavtsum mus nyob phuag newyork,
phuag hawaii kom txhob nrog hmoob ,thaumkawg yus tuag los txhob hu
hmoob tuaj donation nawb.
none
Honestly, why do the Lao Government care so much about these people? I
mean these ungrateful people! They choose to leave Laos on their own
free will. Let them face their fate in Thai detention facility. It is
no longer a Laos problem once they chosen to leave a free life in Laos
for a Thai jail.
C'mon Lao PDR, do not let these ungrateful people blackmail us. Never
yield to these creatures. Even the U.S. Government are sick and tire
of their bullshit. That's why the U.S. Government is cracking down on
them.
If the Thai Government wants to leave them in the middle of the Mekong
than let them. It's the Thailand's problem. Let the Thai Government
crack down on them VP thugs. The very same thugs that trick those
idiots to Thailand the first place.
Pao
Thanouxay,
I am NOT part of the problem BUT YOU ARE PART OF THIS PROBLEM!
YOU are part of the younger generation that suppose to bring positive
change to Laos but YOU are NOW only good at rhetoric, acusation and
even threatening others. Is that all what a nation Spokeman is good
at now?
dougi...@hotmail.com
People have various talents : good, bad and ugly. Some people have it
all. 555
Smoothie
> at now?- -
>
> - -
none
> On Jun 25, 6:58 pm, thanouxay <thanou...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > Pao,
>
> > I do hope that you are not part of the problem or be among those who
> > incite those poor peoples to get lured to live their native land. If
> > you are, what a pity for you.
> > Sok dee
>
> > On Jun 25, 1:30 pm, Pao <drpao...@dex.hmoob.net> wrote:
>
> > > On Jun 25, 1:50 pm, DKJ <dkj.l...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > Zhen and Tony,
>
> > > > Would you like to see hmong people dying in these shits:http://www.flickr.com/photos/troubles/
>
> > > > You can see what and how big is different from below site:http://www.flickr.com/photos/dkj-hmong/page2/
> > > > This should be the real place where hmong people always dream to live
> > > > in.
>
> > > > dkj
>
> > > Why over 300,000+ Lao decided to leave their beautiful native home
> > > since 1975?
> > > Who would any one wanting to leave everything at home and go for the
> > > iron bar cells in Thailand?? Why the Laonork wanting to stay as
> > > Longnork? Why some Laonai wanting to leave Laos?
>
In fact I think you and the entire current Lao leadership are too
soft on the issue of Lao Separatists and Terrorists activities.
Whatever happened to our strongman General Sisavath. We need a tough
man like General Sisavath at the helm in time like this. Laos cannot
afford to let petty littles Terrorists problem linger this long. These
ungrateful bastards only response to brute forces, they don't
understand goodwill gestures that our Lao government are giving them.
Lets wipe them out once and for all. Do make the same mistake like the
previous Lao King made during the Lao-Siamese war of the 1800's by
letting the rebellious monks and his followers to escape and allied
themselves with the enemy.
> > > It is all about this - "khab thi you dai, khab chai you nyad"
> > > That is the message....
>
> Thanouxay,
>
> I am NOT part of the problem BUT YOU ARE PART OF THIS PROBLEM!
>
> YOU are part of the younger generation that suppose to bring positive
> change to Laos but YOU are NOW only good at rhetoric, acusation and
> even threatening others. Is that all what a nation Spokeman is good
> at now?- Hide quoted text -
Crazy Larry
> Thanouxay,
>
> I am NOT part of the problem BUT YOU ARE PART OF THIS PROBLEM!
>
> YOU are part of the younger generation that suppose to bring positive
> change to Laos but YOU are NOW only good at rhetoric, acusation and
> even threatening others. Is that all what a nation Spokeman is good
> at now?
Buk Pao YOU are part of the problem. Thanouxay is there helping to
keep peace and helpig to make progress for the Lao people and the
country of Laos. You are part of the problem because you are doing
everything you can to try to stop that progress and by supporting
terrorists who wishes to harm Lao people and disturb the peace that
Laos has maintained for some time now. Can you imagine Laos having
another war? Can you imagine our pinong Lao having to start from zero
again? Laos has come a long way, Laos is not America, Laos is not
England, France Germany, Italy. Laos is Laos and Laos has come a long
way despite set backs brought on by the war and more set backs
introduced by Hmong gorilla forces sopprted by collections from
overseas Hmongs like you.
Wake up and see the light. You are a doctor, you have what it takes
to think clearly yet you don't. Your actions HURT Laos and Lao
people!
Your friend,
Larry
Pao
Larry,,,, you are out of your mind!
By working toward reconcilliation between the Laonai and Laonork - so
how the process of getting the Laonai and Laonork to work as one
people has any thing to stop progress in Laos?
http://www.lexicon.net/~lis01085/lao/visit/tmp/laonork.pdf
How is the finding ways to improve the education of the Lao children,
has anything to do stopping progress in Laos?
Here are some long awaited text books that I organise for M1, M2 & M3
students at the Lathouang Secondary School ( Xiengkhouang). - hand-
over on 20th June 2007 to Mr Ly Ying (on the right) , Director of the
Committee of the External Relation in Vientiane (see pic):
http://www.lexicon.net/~lis01085/lao/visit/IMG_0786.jpg
Larry... Are you Laotian? If you are laotian, then you are the BIG
problem to stop Laos to progress to better thing! A country is as
good as the people live in it!!
Crazy Larry
I never said I was sane.
> By working toward reconcilliation between the Laonai and Laonork - so
> how the process of getting the Laonai and Laonork to work as one
> people has any thing to stop progress in Laos?http://www.lexicon.net/~lis01085/lao/visit/tmp/laonork.pdf
>
No that's just your rhetoric, you tried to stop NTR for Laos. You
supported Vang Pao and his terrorist dogs.
> How is the finding ways to improve the education of the Lao children,
> has anything to do stopping progress in Laos?
> Here are some long awaited text books that I organise for M1, M2 & M3
> students at the Lathouang Secondary School ( Xiengkhouang). - hand-
> over on 20th June 2007 to Mr Ly Ying (on the right) , Director of the
> Committee of the External Relation in Vientiane (see pic):http://www.lexicon.net/~lis01085/lao/visit/IMG_0786.jpg
>
That is good, you should do more of this type of support.
> Larry... Are you Laotian? If you are laotian, then you are the BIG
> problem to stop Laos to progress to better thing! A country is as
> good as the people live in it!!
That doesn't make any sense. If I'm Lao then I'm the BIG problem?
What if I'm Kmer then I'm not a problem? What if I'm French then I'm
not a problem? How is it I'm a problem if I'm Lao?
Your friend,
Larry
Phainam_Muang
far i have not read any comments from you condemning the atrocity vp
and his group were planned to bring to vientiane. vp ahd his group
wanted to make 9/11 in the heart of vientiane killing thousands of
innocent people. did you read the report by the fed? yet you come out
here trying to defend vp and his group saying what vp and his group
was trying to do is just and that thier action is no comparasion to
what u.s government did in laos during the vietnam war. you support
vp's action and you support the killing of lao people. it's amazing
that somehow you still want us to view you as a peaceful person. for
in fact your action/comments in here is loud and clear that you are
for the kiling of lao people.
phainam
On Jun 27, 11:54 pm, Pao <drpao...@dex.hmoob.net> wrote:
zhen
it wasn't a report. it was merely allegations yet to have its day in
court. you people seem too happy at the arrest and jump to premature
conclusions.
you people who support LPDR espouse the real killing of innocent
civilians. who violated Laos' neutrality in 1975? who killed the King?
the USA 9/11 terror attacks can never match the horror and terror of
the LPDR regime in the last 30 years.
if dr pao is such a problem, don't let him into your dance clubs any
more!
stop the killing of hmong people. let the world inspect and confirm
the peace. otherwise, let your genocide and killing of the innocent
continue to haunt you in this life to eternity.
Phainam_Muang
i don't understand why you people keep accusing lao pdr of killing/
persecuting the hmong? when in fact in the entire laos history there
had never been a regime that could top the current regime when it
comes to promoting diversity in particular promoting the hmong ethnic
in laos. tell me in what era in laos that an ordinary hmong could
walk side by side with a lao? tell me when and in what era in laos
that hmong were treated equally as lao, that they have a voice in
national assembly, and that they were able to exercise their right
freely and vote as a citizen of laos? was it under king savang vong?
under king srisavang vattana? under vang pao, under touby lyfong? i
don't deny that the current regime has many flaws in term of running
the counrty, but to say that they are killing the hmong for no obvous
reason is bogus and outrageous claim.
lets face it if hmong were being genocided in laos, then how on earth
that hmong population in laos grew from a mere 50,000 in 1975 to over
200,000 today?
me think you people are simply crazy with your own victimized
mentarity. you people need to get out from "hmong are victim"
mentarity that has been haunting you since leaving china, and start to
see yourselves as a stronge, and proggressive people. if you only see
yourself as a victim of other people, then that's who you are, and who
you will be the rest of your life...in this case the rest of hmong
life, whatever that means...so stop it!! no body is killing you
people.
phainam
zhen
why do you people continue to deny LPDR's crimes against humanity
against Hmong people in the jungle? if LPDR is compliant with human
rights, why do LPDR continue to reject the U.N. inspectors? if LPDR is
not killing innocent Hmong, then how do Hmong and Westerners obtain
the footage of so many Hmong being hunted down and pushed into death?
reports of LPDR high crimes in killing the innocent is well
documented.
you ask when did another governing body of Laos include ethnic
minorities; the second coalition government in Laos had incorporated
many ethnic minorities. the royal lao government incorporated ethnic
minority. under the royal lao government, we did not hear of any
killing, if at all, on the scale on which the LPDR is guilty of today.
you people need not lecture us about strength and progression. you
people need to understand it was the hmong that led Laos and Vietnam
the way out of colonialism. do you deny this? tell me which ethnic Lao
and Vietnamese preceded Xiong Mi Chang and Vue Pay Chay in fighting
the imperial French? while the Hmong rebelled against the imperial
pigs, the ethnic Lao and Vietnamese could not be more happier to
acquiesce and resign their fate. you people have reaped what we have
sowed as seeds of liberation and self-determination; but LPDR is too
greedy and heartless, and so they cannot cultivate from the fields all
the different fruits of freedom and democracy.
we hmong have at least a 5,000 years history. we do not feel about
ourselves the way you claim; that is your ignorance. we are proud
people. we continue to fight for "an injustice anywhere is an
injustice everywhere".
can LPDR stop the killing? will LPDR stop the killing? will the U.N.
be allowed in to confirm/verify? if LPDR can stop the killing and
provide liberal democracy for all of its children, then may be our
hearts can rest and have peace. it is the LPDR with the victim
mentality; LPDR feels it is victim to fabrication and accusations;
however, as i stated, we have multiple sources documenting the
extermination of Hmong people in the jungle, and the closed door
policy of LPDR to these regions only further condemns and confirms
their guilt. it is the LPDR's victim mentality calling those who they
kill as terrorists when the truth is these people are helpless &
innocent civilians. running and hiding from helicopters and
biochemical weapons don't match the definition of terrorists; but
using helicopters and biochemical weapons against the helpless &
innocent does resonate with the definition of terrorism.
phainam, if you want all of us to have peace and finality, let some
inspectors come in to the special regions. why are they designated
special regions? what's so special about them? if the report comes
back there is peace, then i promise you, i will go into self-impose
exile forever from these lifeless usenet forums. don't wait too long
after the extermination campaign completes, however. let the
inspectors come today!
paxas...@yahoo.com
> i think lary is right. that you are part of the problem dr pao. so
> far i have not read any comments from you condemning the atrocity vp
> and his group were planned to bring to vientiane. vp ahd his group
> wanted to make 9/11 in the heart of vientiane killing thousands of
> innocent people. did you read the report by the fed? yet you come out
> here trying to defend vp and his group saying what vp and his group
> was trying to do is just and that thier action is no comparasion to
> what u.s government did in laos during the vietnam war. you support
> vp's action and you support the killing of lao people. it's amazing
> that somehow you still want us to view you as a peaceful person. for
> in fact your action/comments in here is loud and clear that you are
> for the kiling of lao people.
>
> phainam
There is no doubt Dr. Pao is supporting Vang Pao Terrorist Group . Who
know what else did he supply this terrorist group with money and
pictures ?
PXL4LIFE.
Crazy Larry
wrote:
It has been documented that VP was behind the bus shooting and the
bandits on route 13. Many Hmongs here have also threatened Laos with
more trouble on these routes. So even before his arrest, VP was
already guilty of terrorist activities on Lao soil.
Many Hmong here have threatened and are still threatening more
violence in Laos. That plainly and clearly shows as to who is the
violent killers.
Your friend,
Larry
Pao
It seems that you are also part of the Paxasonlao + Thanouxay + Crazy
group! You people are the PROBLEM for people escaping from Laos.
People will go where there is hope, love and where their free spirit
can soar... that is why people wanting to leave Laos... and that is
the real reason why many of you, Laonork, who are part of the
Thanouxay camp and jumping up and down licking Thanouxay #@@! but
will NOT return to live in Laos. Hypocrite!!
paxas...@yahoo.com
>
> - Show quoted text -
Vow Dr. Pao is mad when we are telling the truth about him .
PXL4LIFE.
Crazy Larry
>
> It seems that you are also part of the Paxasonlao + Thanouxay + Crazy
> group! You people are the PROBLEM for people escaping from Laos.
> People will go where there is hope, love and where their free spirit
> can soar... that is why people wanting to leave Laos... and that is
> the real reason why many of you, Laonork, who are part of the
> Thanouxay camp and jumping up and down licking Thanouxay #@@! but
> will NOT return to live in Laos. Hypocrite!!
See BukPao,
This clearly shows that you have a Reading Deficit Disorder (RDD). If
you got a real medical certificate from a bonafide medical school,
then you'd be smart enough to know what I'm talking about. None of
the people you have listed argued that there aren't better
opportunities outside of Laos. People will make or find their own
opportunities, some make it in Laos, some make it elsewhere.
We argued that there is NO genocide, NO persecution, NO racial
mistreatment when it comes to pinong Lao Hmong. Do you understand the
gist of the argument now? Do you get it now you pedomorphic dawdling
clod?
Your friend,
Larry
Phainam_Muang
anything to do with the issue of your supporting vp to do 9/11 in
vientiane?
it's either you supporting of vp planning to do 9/11 atrocity in
vientiane or you don't. simple as peeling a banana. so do you
support him or not.
let me tell you one thing dr. pao. i live in boston and have a
handful of hmong friends here some of whom are very well educated.
and here is what they think of vp.
on a personal level becuase they are hmong, and therefor vp is still
considered thier idol, but that doesn't mean they are agreeing with vp
at all times. they condemn vp's action. they think vp's planning to
do 9/11 in vientiane is suicidal and wrong. they oppose how vp and
his group's ways of bringing democracy to laos. they only support a
peaceful solution and not a violence way. bottom line is they still
love vp no matter what, but disapprove of his action and idea.
you see the difference between the real educated hmong and the fake
one? see how honest they are? i don't think anyone will question you
whether you love vp or not. it's your supporting of his action and
political view that boggled everyone's minds especially the lao.
phainam
Phainam_Muang
you have it all wrong. how could you expect lao pdr to except
something that they didn't do? lao pdr has never rejected the UN
inspector. the fact is UN never requested lao pdr for an inspection
of hmong genocide. why? because there is none. and another fact you
should tattoo down on your forehead is, UN has never excepted the
fabricated footages you people claimed of hmong genocide in laos.
what are you talking about that hmong were never been killed by lao
royal army? I think you should ask vp about how many hmong have been
killed or precisely how many have been bombed to death by vp cia
guided bombs?
In fact there were hmong whose political views differed from the royal
lao government, which were put to jail and those managed to escape
were hunted down by the royal lao army. That's why you have hmong
fighting on the communist side.
your claim of only hmong against colonialism is nonsense, all people
of laos fought against colonialists. french didn't leave laos because
of hmong. american didn't leave laos because of hmong. get that fact
straight. vp is an amarican product. some of you even claim that vp
is fighting for america and should entitled a u.s veteran benefit. is
that how you fougth agianst colonialists, by inviting them to your
home, becoming thier hands and feet and helping them bomb your home
to the stone age?
let me ask you this, if hmong are so great and so strong why you
people are on the run all the times from china to america? sorry if i
happen to insult some of my hmong friends here, it is not intended to,
but where is a country called hmong?
If you don't feel about yourselves as i claimed, then why keep playing
the victim card wherever you go, from china to laos, to thailand, to
america? look at what hmong are doing in sacramento begging u.s fed
judge to free vp, to have mercy on vp saying vp and hmong are victim
of lao pdr. some posters at demonstration even suggest hmong are
victim of americans. did you read a poster held up by an old hmong
woman last sunday that said, "we died for american, and this is how
you repay us?"
zhen, you are ignorant of present laos. your view of laos is still in
the 80s. there are no special regions in laos. there used to be a
special zone which was a settlement of hmong war refugees. today,
the said special zone is now become a district like any other
districts in laos.
another fact you need to learn is, there were many new settlements
scattered throughout laos during and after the war. not just hmong
refugee settlements, but other ethnic as well including lao. today,
those refugees and thier settlements are now becomiong a vilage, town,
and district integrating into mainstream of lao society.
phainm
zhen
like i said. you continue to deny the killing. you cannot let UN and
other organizations come in to the special regions. did you see the
ravens documentary by discovery times? this film was made relatively
recently in the 2000's; the interpreter himself did not allow the
former ravens into special regions. in fact, he took the ravens into a
hmong village; which was not hmong at all. LPDR deception is clear.
your statements show how much you are part of the problem by
continuing to deny the truth.
tell me again, will you let organizations to inspect? will the ravens
be let into the special zones?
did i say the RLA never killed hmong? stop putting words in my mouth;
is this the best you can do? your question was which governing body
over laos also had ethnic minority represented. i gave you plenty. now
you try to switch tactics? c'mon. i already proved you wrong twice
now; once on special zones/inspections with the ravens example; and
now with the 2nd coalition + RLG govt's allowing ethnic minority
representation.
like i said, is there any ethnic lao or vietnamese who preceded xiong
mi chang and vue paj chay fighting imperialism/colonialism? i thought
so. your response is weak. you eat from the fruits of our labor and
remain ever so ignorant and disrespectful of the history. this is not
my claim; this is history; even your tripartite president vietnam
revere vue pay chay.
you know you disrespect all hmong when you say we are not great people
because we lack sovereignty. the lao people itself, including you,
also suffered a diaspora; does this minimize ethnic lao too? do you
think you have a country just because of the Laos in LPDR? who really
runs LPDR? it should really be changed to VPDR for Vietnam's Puppet
Democratic Republic. c'mon, you can't argue now you aim to insult?
nothing you can say and your ignorance can never diminish the great
history and hmong people; even Red China reveres our forefathers in
China and cite our contributions. only someone whose heart is like
yours, malicious in intent, will say ignorant things. your thinking is
still stuck in unicellular pre-history times.
like i said; we have proof. stop killing our people. we don't play no
victim card like the LPDR who claim they are victims of terrorists
when they are the real killers. can the LPDR stop playing it's victim
mentality? is this all you think is your best point to raise?
by the way, those hmong people were not begging the american justice
system; they were prostrating themselves asking the Heavens for
justice. that's a big difference. your continual misrepresentation
strategy is obvious. will the educated phainum continue to tell tall
tales as fictitious as they are to suit his false and ignorant
statements? i am sure students from BU are not educated to such
standard, no?
if i am ignorant of laos, i wonder why? did you not hear, thanouxay
himself admitted LPDR is a closed government and their 'business as
usual' is to suppress knowledge/information about the welfare and
state of laos.
so, bring me out from ignorance of laos under the LPDR regime. let the
inspectors and third parties go into the special zones/regions/areas.
can you do this? or will you continue to deny, misrepresent and
insult?
zhen
you need to improve your reading skills. i did not 'claim' hmong were
the 'only' ones fighting against the colonizing french. i stated hmong
people led southeast asia towards and provided the first example of
liberation and self-determination.
here is an article about the oppressive VPDR regime. this is from a
not unknown feller named roger warner. now stop crying 'foul', playing
the 'victim card', denying and insulting.
http://movies2.nytimes.com/mem/movies/review.html?res=9800E7D7163EF93AA35750C0A9629C8B63
March 9, 2004, Tuesday
TELEVISION REVIEW; Ravens Evermore: Secrets of America's Undercover
Warriors in Laos
By ROGER WARNER
During the Vietnam War, the neighboring kingdom of Laos was home to a
sideshow with Alice in Wonderland rules. Because Laos was nominally
neutral, the outside powers kept their presence secret and fought in
part through proxies. The Communist North Vietnamese soldiers
camouflaged themselves as members of the local Pathet Lao. The C.I.A.
ran a three-way anti-Communist alliance of Americans, Thais (who
camouflaged themselves as Laotians) and a guerrilla force of Laotian
tribesmen, principally the Hmong.
The man in the center of this odd alliance was a shy but remarkable
Texan, Bill Lair, who not only started the C.I.A. operation but also
founded the Thai and hill tribe forces.
During the Vietnam War, the neighboring kingdom of Laos was home to a
sideshow with Alice in Wonderland rules. Because Laos was nominally
neutral, the outside powers kept their presence secret and fought in
part through proxies. The Communist North Vietnamese soldiers
camouflaged themselves as members of the local Pathet Lao. The C.I.A.
ran a three-way anti-Communist alliance of Americans, Thais (who
camouflaged themselves as Laotians) and a guerrilla force of Laotian
tribesmen, principally the Hmong.
The man in the center of this odd alliance was a shy but remarkable
Texan, Bill Lair, who not only started the C.I.A. operation but also
founded the Thai and hill tribe forces.
>From the early- through the mid-1960's the operation actually
succeeded against the North Vietnamese regulars. The Hmong enlarged
the territory under their control until they were pushing up against
the North Vietnamese border. This was a huge achievement, accomplished
with a handful of Americans and a minuscule budget. It reflected a
little-known alternative strategy for fighting wars in Southeast Asia,
with as few Americans as possible. But it was the road not taken in
South Vietnam, where eventually the United States stationed a half-
million men, with no better results.
In 1965 and 1966, when the North Vietnamese doubled and then
quadrupled their force in Laos, the guerrillas started retreating. To
compensate, the United States made increasing use of air power from
the main conflict next door. This high-tech solution created fresh
problems. The bombs were inaccurate. The planes couldn't stop the
Communists without the help of strong friendly forces on the ground,
but how could Iron Age tribesmen who didn't speak English coordinate
with the pilots of supersonic planes?
In response the C.I.A. and the United States Air Force created a unit
of forward air controllers that became known as the Ravens, after
their radio call sign. A capable bunch, they had all flown propeller-
driven spotter planes in South Vietnam. They volunteered for Laos, a
looser, more creative war, where they could indulge their disrespect
for authority and unleash their all-out warrior zeal. Their upcountry
headquarters was a kind of Shangri-La for unconventional warfare: Long
Tieng, a secret air base in the Laotian mountains created by Mr. Lair,
who had left Laos. The Ravens were ''sheep-dipped'': they wore
civilian clothes and pretended to be civilians, although nobody was
fooled.
The documentary ''The Ravens: Covert War in Laos,'' on the Discovery
Times Channel tonight, ably portrays what it was like to be a Raven,
and how the experience could forever change a young pilot's life. Well
edited, with surprisingly abundant archival film, this is probably the
best documentary on the Laos war yet made, although it doesn't have
many serious competitors.
The film makes one error of omission, failing to mention the Hmong who
sat behind the pilots in the spotter planes, helping coordinate the
tribal soldiers on the ground with the jets in sky.
A more general complaint may be made against the one-hour documentary
format, which compresses a big, fascinating subject into small
segments. Nevertheless there's terrific eye candy here, along with a
compelling story.
The film follows four Ravens, now middle-aged, on a journey to Laos to
revisit the war of their youth. Their goal is to return to Long Tieng,
where no American war veterans have set foot since Laos fell to the
Communists in 1975.
The deceit and mistrust between the returning Americans and the
Laotian Communist government continues as though the war had never
ended. The Ravens pretend to be ordinary tourists making home movies,
but their Laotian guide, a retired colonel in the Communist army,
meets them at the border wearing a ''Raven'' T-shirt. Blown cover!
For reasons that are never entirely clear, which is typical in Laos,
the Ravens are prevented from returning from Long Tieng. Instead they
are taken to a Potemkin-style Hmong village that turns out not to have
been populated by Hmong after all but by members of a different ethnic
group. It is as though all those involved can't stop lying to one
other. Old habits die hard.
Back in the United States the film crew follows the Ravens to an
annual reunion. These men forged their identities during wartime, and
who can blame them if life has never been as colorful since? In a
poignant scene they fling glasses into a fireplace while reading the
names of fellow Ravens who died long ago in battle. These survivors
were all warriors once, and their wounds from this doomed, secret war
have never entirely healed.
THE RAVENS
Discovery Times, tonight at 8, Eastern and Pacific times; 7 Central
time
Directed by Kirk Wolfinger; written by Rocky Collins; producer, Mika
Holliday Lentz; director of photography, D. J. Roller; narrator,
Miguel Ferrer. Produced by Lone Wolf Documentary Group for the
Discovery Times Channel.
zhen
ethnic hmong and lao people are great people, not because they have
nationhood, but because the persevere against colonial rape and
territorial aggression.
even faced against the odds, even faced against extermination, hmong
people maintain their identity for over 5,000 years. that which can be
taken from the hmong, has been taken by force and trespass.
you yourself should know lan xang's 3 kingdoms were annexed and/or
rendered impotent before french intervention in the late 1800's; do
you claim credit of a supposed ethnic lao nationhood to ethnic lao?
who has kept Laos (unification of the 3 kingdoms; france) and VPDR
(violation of neutrality; vietnam) intact for the last century?
definitely not the ethnic lao. do you now conclude your own ethnic
people are not great? or will you impose a double standard and
continue to misrepresent and mis-characterize? it is not scholarly,
even for BU students, to take credit for others work; is it human to
take credit for other's work?
On Jun 29, 11:50 am, Phainam_Muang <p...@acs.bu.edu> wrote:
Phainam_Muang
you said, "hmong people led southeast asia towards and provided the
first example of liberation and self-determination?" so the burmese
get rid of english yoke becuase of hmong? the cambodia, vietnam,
philipine, indonesia, malasia, all of these southeast asian nations
were able to get rid of thier white colonizers because of hmong? oh
heck why don't we add china, too, i think becuase of hmong self-
determination that led china to uprise against their english
emperialist?
as for a report from roger warner? it doesn't say anything about hmong
being raped and killed in laos. do you know that there is no more
long cheng in laos?
phainam
Crazy Larry
Yes Phainam, didn't you know that the Hmongs incited the Boxer
Rebellion? 55555555 lol
Your friend,
Larry
zhen
like i said, you continue to misrepresent and mis-characterize my
statements; you even go so far as to put words into my mouth. to be
more precise, i was referring by using southeast asia to indochina aka
the tripartite communist regimes ruling laos, vietnam, and cambodia.
why do you stretch other people's statement and neglect answering the
flaws and accounting for the ignorance in your own statements? were
hmong people ever in those country during the western colonial period?
c'mon, put things into context and stop playing the fabrication game.
yes, you can add red china to that list if you want. we hmong have had
arguably the longest history fighting against imperialism, especially
dynastic chinese imperialism. after mao zedong and the communist took
over, they honor the hmong rebels who fought against the yuan, ming
and qing dynasties. there are statues in china honoring the hmong
rebellions and uprisings against dynastic imperial aggression.
about roger warner, it doesn't say such thing b/c they not allowed to
go into the territories where hmong are being killed. there is no more
long cheng? surely the geographic location once referred to as long
cheng has not been swallowed up by mother earth? why were they
prevented from going to this supposedly benign area? of course, these
are rhetorical questions to me. you have read the review article
clearly have you? why is there deception? why do you continue to
neglect and overlook the tough questions and continue on this ignorant
path of denial? why would rather stretch, bend, and fabricate words
and statements coming from my mouth?
let the 3rd party inspectors in. let laos be an open society.
otherwise, we can only make informed decisions based on those who have
actually gone in and documented. what is there to fear by VPDR if
there is nothing to hide?
i'm not sure if your BU education has failed you or you failed your BU
education. *wink*
please address the tough questions. don't think by having the last
word you will appear more valid or victorious. you have side-stepped
enough.
*cheers*
sok dee.
On Jun 29, 2:59 pm, Phainam_Muang <p...@acs.bu.edu> wrote:
Phainam_Muang
they could very well be hmong. oh heck all of china history is based
on hmong. remember hmong has 5000 long history way longer any of us
including the chinese. lol
!
On Jun 29, 3:07 pm, Crazy Larry
zhen
you don't have to believe me and i don't blame you for not knowing.
it's not your area so you speak ignorantly about hmong history as you
do about the killings in laos. go consult the 'chinese' themselves who
was in china before the chinese. consult western references if you
want. they all say the same thing, hmong people are descendants of
zhiyou from jiuli; hmong people were in the middle kingdom before the
chinese.
is this the best a BU education can do for you? is this the best you
can do to represent a BU education? sad.
Phainam_Muang
southest asia could very well be any country in southeast asia which
includes malaysia, indonesia, the philipine, whatnot.
no one is denied that hmong-lao as well as other ethnic minority in
laos (you probably never heard of ethnic "kha" uprising against the
french in the southern laos, did you?) have contributed sinificantly
in liberating laos from western colonialists namely the french, but
to say that lao people were a "resign" type of people who like to
submit to western power is nonsense. lao has a long history of
chasing foriegn invasions out of their land xang kingdom way before
the hmong found themselve a safe heaven in the kingdom of laos.
the polticial situation in laos during the french invasion is more
complicated than you and I could comprehend. there was a good reason
why king savang vong and some of the lao elites wanted to keep french
in laos. and that is to keep laos safe from siamese and vietnamese
incursion especially the siamese. we knew how bad the siamese were
and we played politic to keep them out from laos. if we chose the
hmong way, (the braveheart, or the last mohegan way of fighting a war)
we would be the same as hmong without hmong country for sure...
hmong may have fighting skill to win a battle, they didn't have
political skill to win a war. and that was why they lost to every war
they fought. and that is the truth...
phainam
Tshaj...@gmail.com
>
> - Show quoted text -
Dkj, Larry and other, we do not need you posted any activity in laos
for us to know about it. If you are still part of Laos please go back
and live over there. We know about laos very well. do not tell us. you
go back in laos and kill all hmong which you do not like them or use
them as your slave, now no one can do any thing to you but later on,
the big guy will honor you for excellent Hmong killer.
zhen
i didn't say indochina, but i also didn't say maylasia, burma, etc...
i caught you side-stepping the questions and issues and so you
extravagantly stretched my words out of context. except for burma, i
don't think hmong had a presence in those other southeast asian nation
you mentioned from 1900-1975. if you want to score points on that
stretch of imagination, that is up to you but it still does not answer
my questions and concerns.
i did not say it was hmong alone that fought the french imperialists;
i said there is no other ethnic group recorded before the hmong to
have rebelled against foreign occupation and domination of french
imperialists. again, why continue to stretch and bend my words? is
this not getting routine for you? i give you the benefit of the doubt;
you are better than that.
you contradict yourself; you say ethnic lao did not resign its fate to
French, but then you said the King decided to surrender or hand over
the Kingdom to France? you know very well that the King's government
in Luang Prabang was just a token government; the real administrative
capital was Vientiane and it was dominated by Vietnamese bureaucrats
(and arguably, continues to be to this day). i don't think the King
knew how to play politiks; the last remnant kingdom with lineage to
Lan Xang was on the verge of collapse; it was the French with its
gunboat policy that imposed its will and set the politiks straight
upon the people of Lan Xang. again, you cannot assign credit to the
monarchy for the unification of Laos; this credit is due to France and
its politiking with a gun, for better or for worse.
don't be too proud there is a country named Laos PDR; like i said, it
is more accurately called Vietnam's Puppet DR. we may lack nationhood
in one sense, but there are pockets of region in china where we are
granted self-rule. since we are peace loving people, we compromise
between nationhood and territorial aggression.
remember, our lost of Laos is your lost of Laos. your lost of the
Kingdom of Laos is our lost of the Kingdom as well. Laos is far from
trustworthy and peaceful under the LPDR regime while it continues its
closed-door policy. we ask for so little; we ask for inspection and
confirmation of peace. i would rather have me wrong (about the killing
of hmong people) and you right (about the lack of killing of hmong
people). but, the evidence suggests that my view is a better
regression line than yours.
let the inspectors in. stop the killing.
finally, some truth and enlightenment from you; you may be partially
right regarding why hmong suffered so much historical defeat.
none
Enough with all the fabrication and lies that Laos is systematically
killing the "so called innocent Hmong" in Laos. Lao Soung (Highland
Lao) are citizen of the Lao PDR and they are being treat like any
other Lao citizens, no more, no less. Any Lao citizens regardless of
ethnicity dare seeks to violently overthrow the lawful Lao Government
shall be met with the full might of the glorious Lao Security forces.
Great majority of Lao citizens throughout the Country are enjoying
their carefree and peaceful living. Laos may not be a perfect place
for all but it's home to many of us and there is no place like home.
I've lived in Norway and currently residing in the United States with
my second wife and son and yet my heart always yearn for Laos.
> > > > > Thanouxay,- Hide quoted text -
none
Instead let me ask you this: why 6 Millions Lao citizens remains in
Laos? 300,000 is nothing compare to 6 Milliions. People migrate to
other region for variety of reasons and has been doing that since the
day of human existence. Why do European migrated to the New World? Lao
people are no different than the early European migrants to the
Americas.
On Jun 24, 11:30 pm, Pao <drpao...@dex.hmoob.net> wrote:
> Why over 300,000+ Lao decided to leave their beautiful native home
> since 1975?
> Who would any one wanting to leave everything at home and go for the
> iron bar cells in Thailand?? Why the Laonork wanting to stay as
> Longnork? Why some Laonai wanting to leave Laos?
>
> It is all about this - "khab thi you dai, khab chai you nyad"
> That is the message....
none
> why do you people continue to deny LPDR's crimes against humanity
> against Hmong people in the jungle?
Why do you people continue to accused the LPDR of crimes that they do
not committed and convicted? Are you not heeding your own advice of
pressumption of guilt until proven guilty or that only apply to your
Terrorist groups basing in the U.S.A? No World Tribunal has convicted
Lao PDR of any crimes nor has it ever been charges of any.
>if LPDR is compliant with human
> rights, why do LPDR continue to reject the U.N. inspectors?
The allegation is not valid or credible enough for a UN inspection.
saop...@gmail.com
post is simple pan pok khuay kin, and dkj no need any body tell him to
do or not to do , he do what he want ,you say "we" who we? inclue
phai nam. phidung mo. lary? 5555555, dkj never kill any hmong? u
are liar.
thanouxay
You are absolutely right. Laos is a small and friendly country but it
also has all capacity to defend its sovereignty and territorial
integrity.
Yes Lao Hmong are Lao, no more and no less. They have the same rights
and duties so as all Lao multi-ethnic people. Nobody is more special
and anybody because everybody is already special.
We will attend to it so that this situation will last forever.
Sok dee
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
zins...@hotmail.com
questions later.....
Phainam_Muang
i did point out about the ethnic "kha" or "Khom" rebellion again the
french and lao. ong keo led the khom to fight the french and lao from
1901 to 1937. I think you can find the record available on the net as
well. ask your friend google to help out.
i didn't contradict myself, lao didn't resige our fate to french;
asking french for protection was part of our stragic plan to safe laos
carved out from the sun-tzu's art of war itself, "know your enemy and
know yourself. " look at the end result, laos is till on the world
map, is it not? and that's all that matter...
phainam