Lus teb Naisphoo Vaj Pov thiab "Lauj Vaj Tsab Lis Thoj Yaj Muas"
Tou...@asianavenue.com
Hnub no kuv, Lis Nplooj LisNyiajVws, yuav teb Naisphoo Vaj Pov cov lus
nws tau hais nrog tus Hmoob PathetLao hu ua "Lauj Vaj Tsab Lis Thoj
Yaj Muas" (LVTLTYM) uas Radio Hmoob LosTsuas tau tso tawm rau suavdaws
mloog thaum March, 2007. Lub tswvyim ntawm daim cassette mas yog
Naisphoo Vaj Pov xav rhuav kuv tsev neeg thiab cov kwvtij Hmoob Lis
xwb. Vim li cas cov lus dag thiaj sawv tuaj mas yog li no. Tsis ntev
dhau los no Naisphoo Vaj Pov tau tawm ib zag tswvyim rau VamNtxawg Vaj
mus ntxias kuv tus kwv TsavFoom Lis lub khw Asia Super Market (Fresno,
CA) hloov mus ua Hmoob Vaj tug. Thaum January, 2007 nkawv txeeb tsis
tau ces Naisphoo Vaj Pov thiaj nrhiav teebmeem rau peb tsev Hmoob Lis
kom raug ntiajteb cem. Nws tau txhawb nqa LVTLTYM cov lus kom suavdaws
rau hauvncoo siab siab mloog cov lus tseemceeb heev. Hauv daim
cassette LVTLTYM kuj tau hais ntau yam, tej yam kuj zoo khaws xws li
nws nqua hu kom Hmoob txhob tua Hmoob lawm, tiamsis feemcoob yog cuav
thiab kev txw kom Hmoob havzoov, Hmoob LosTsuas raug tua ntxiv lawm
xwb. Cov khub lus kuv yuav teb LVTLTYM raws li no: nws hais tias
Lyteck (Lis Teeb) thiab Lis Tub yog ob tug tua cov Hmoob nyob HinHeup;
cov Hmoob Lis ua qhov ntsej qhov muag rau cov PathetLao tuaj rau hauv
LoojCeeb; thiab nws tau ua ib daim ntawv cawm xa Colonel Ntsuab Vaj
Lis tawm ntawm PathetLao tes.
LVTLTYM liam hais tias Lyteck thiab Lis Tub yog ob tug tua Hmoob nyob
HinHeup. Nws piav tias nws yog cov Koosthav PajCai es thaum nws tuaj
pem Salaphoukhoun rau HinHeup nws pom Lyteck thiab Lis Tub nkawd nyob
saum tsheb tua peb cov Hmoob hauv tus choj HinHeup tuag ntau tus yog
li thiaj muab rooj plaub no pov rau nkawd ev. Muab ua zoo xyuas cov
lus no tsis meej pem vim rau qhov tias yog cov Hmoob PathetLao yuav
mus LoojCeeb li nws hais mas lawv yuav tsum tuaj txoj kev 13 pem
Salaphoukhoun los txog HuoyMo ces lem sab laug mus Nasou rau LoojCeeb
lawm, tsis yog tuaj txog HinHeup ces mam lem rov qab mus pev. Qhov
tseeb thaum lub sijhawm May, 1975 ntawd yog Colonel Deuane Sounarath
lawv cov (pawg nrubnrab fee rau sab lauj) xub tuaj rau VangViang thiab
Nasou/LoojCeeb. Twb ntev tom qab no lawm pab Koosthav PajCai mam tuaj
rau PhabKheb. Qhov no qhia tau hais tias tus LVTLTYM lam puab dabneeg
coj los pha kov cov neeg tsi paub keebkwm zoo yuav kev xwb.
LVTLTYM zaj dabneeg hais ntxiv tias Lis Tub yog tus neeg "paigtxig."
Ntuj qub qab 32 xyoo dhau los Lis Tub tseem hluas heev nws tsis tau
muaj fwjtxwv. Qhov no qhia tau hais tias LVTLTYM yeej yog tus neeg
nyob America teb xwb nws thiaj pov Lis Tub zoo li ntawd. Tsis tas li
xwb thaum ub tsuas hnov neeg iabliam rau Lyteck ib leeg nkaus xwb, ua
li cas xyoo 2007 ho muaj kiag Lis Tub xyaw ntxuag lawm thiab? Yog yuav
hais lus cuav raws li nws hais xwb mas kuj muaj ntau leej ntau tus
hais los lawm thiab; Xyoo 1996 Vaj Npis thiab Vaj Tswb tau hais tawm
tias Lyteck tua 1,000 tus Hmoob Vaj tuag nyob HinHeup. Hos Niam Vaj
Npis Nom Hawj ntxiv loo tias Lyteck tua raug 30 tus Hmoob Vaj duav lov
tas. Xyov ua li cas Lyteck cov mostxwv yuav tua ncaj ua luaj es raug
tib co Hmoob Vaj nkaus xwb.
Qhov tiag lub sijhawm thaum Hmoob raug tua May 29, 1975 Lyteck nws
nyob nram Vientiane tabtom sawv kev tuaj xyuas kuv nyob Lack-52 (60 km
tshem tawm ntawm HinHeup) nws yeej tua tsis tau cov Hmoob nyob pev.
Hnub ntawd muaj Lyteck, TubNpis LisFoom, LaujFoom PajNpliam, Txhiaj
Yeeb Lis, Zeb Lis, PajCai Yaj, kuv, thiab 5-6 leej tus phoojywg nyob
ntawm kuv tsev sibtham tseem yuav noj ib tug tshis ci uake. Niaj hnub
no yeej tseem muaj cov neeg ua qhov muag povthawj xws li Txhiaj Yeeb
Lis, Zeb Lis (Sacramento,CA), thiab PajCai Yaj (Pontiac,MI). Povthawj
ntxiv ntawm nov mus muaj Niam Nom Cib Vaj (California), Niam Nyiaj
Thoob Muas (Spartanburg,SC), Maiv Yias Muas (Spokan,WA), Niam Nkaj Pov
Yaj (Pontiac,MI), Khwb Vaj thiab Nyiaj Vaj tsev neeg (Lacrosse,WI)
twb nyob pem tus choj HinHeup lawv twb tsis pom Lyteck los Lis Tub
kiag li. Muab cov povthawj los nthuav saib xyuas mas pes tau hais tias
tus LVTLTYM txhob txwm txw neeg liam kuv tsev neeg xwb. Yog xav paub
tseeb tshaj qhov no ces mus xyuas kuv daim ntawv "Hmoob Raug Tua Nyob
Hin Heup" (March 22, 1997).
Ntxiv ntawd no mus LVTLTYM tau hais tias cov Hmoob Lis yog cov "ua
qhov ntsej qhov muag" rau PathetLao tuaj rau LoojCeeb. Nws cov lus pes
tau hais tias cov Lis yog cov ntxeevsiab. Cov lus no tsis muaj tseeb.
Ua li cas nws tsis qhia loo cov npe rau peb suavdaws paub nad? Ib qho
ua nws zaj dabneeg tsis muaj nqi mas yog qhov nws siv lub npe dag. Lub
npe "Lauj Vaj" mas peb Hmoob kuj muaj tiag, tiamsis "Tsab Lis Thoj Yaj
Muas" yog npe cuav uas pog yawg yeej tsis tau muaj dua los. Qhov ob
uas tsis txaus ntseeg mas nws yug xyoo 1952 es xyoo 1966, thaum nws
muaj 14 xyoo xwb, nws tseem siv mus kawm mavthabnyoo (college) thiab
kevcai ua tsov ua rog siab tshaj plaws nyob rau NyablajTeb thiab tseem
tau sawvcev ntawm cov PathetLao mus sablaj nrog Naisphoo Vaj Pov tus
neeg hu ua "Lis Txos" nyob Phati lawm. Lub caij 1965 rau 1967 kuv yog
tus sawvcev ntawm Naisphoo Vaj Pov nyob rau Xeev Samneua teeb lookam
nyob Phati thiab tseem ua tus sawvcev ntawm Cobkheem Samneua tom hauv
ntej thiab tus thawj tswjfwm (xaynatikan) kev ua tsovrog nyob Nakhang
kuv yeej twb tsis hnov txog qhov kev sablaj Phati thiab tus hu ua Lis
Txos.
Kuv yeej paub cov nais tseemceeb, nais tubrog nyob thaj tsam ntawd tag
nrho. Cov neeg ntawd xws li no: Cov nyob kev tiv thaiv Pathi muaj
"Pawg 261" uas Captain Nkias Tub Vaj yog tus coj; hos cov nyob ncig
lees ntawd muaj "Zone 13" uas Caubmoos Lauj Thaiv Vaj thiab Naiskoo
Lis Xab ua ob tug thawj; "Zone PhouNgoua" kuj muaj txiv Phias Xwm Muas
thiab Muas Xwm; "Zone 14" nyob HongNone muaj Lauj Tuam, txiv Vam Lis
Lauj, Xovxoom Tsab Kim Xyooj thiab Xovxoom Lauj Xeeb; "Zone 15" nyob
lub roob Phouchicknou muaj Captain Lis Lauj. Hos nyob ntawm kev tiv
thiav Nakhang muaj "Koospha 26" uas yog Lt-Colonel Thong Vong Rassmi
yog tus coj. Thaum nws tuag lawm ces Lt-Colonel Phanh Siharat los ua
tus tuav. "Koospha 27" kuj muaj Major Douangta Norasinh. Hos pawg
"SGU" kuj yog Major Ntsuab Vaj Lis ua tus saib xyuas. Yeej tseem
tshuav ntau pab xws li Captain Lis Teeb (Hmoob SanhLouang, Vaj Pov tus
yawmyij), Captain Lis Pov Npuag Tsig thiab Captain Nom Ko LisFoom.
Txhua hnub peb suavdaws tau mus sibtua nrog cov PathetLao-Vietminh
nyob rau thaj tsam Nakhang, Phati, HouaMoung, PhouVieng, nqis mus rau
nram tiaj BanBan, kuv twb tsis paub tsis hnov txog qhov sablaj Phati
los tus hu ua Lis Txos. Hos yog kev sablaj ntawm Pathi muaj tseeb tiag
no mas pes tau hais tias Naisphoo Vaj Pov zais siab coj tsis ncaj rau
peb suavdaws thiab nws koom siab nrog PathetLao-Vietminh tua pejxeem
fuabfwm Nplog lawm.
Qhov LVTLTYM tau ua daim ntawv rau Colonel Ntsuab Vaj Lis khiav tawm
LoojCeeb ntawm PathetLao thiaj tsis mag txhom mas yeej tsis muaj.
Thaum Naisphoo Vaj Pov khiav tawm hauv LoojCeeb May 15, 1975, Naisphoo
Chao Manivong kuj raug tsa los ua tus saib xyuas tsoom tubrog "Nqe 2"
hos Col Ntsuab Vaj Lis tau ua tus yau ntawm nws. Thaum lub 6 hli yuav
luag kawg ntawd nkawv, cov tubrog, tus Cobkheem Khamsing Phetlompham
ntxuag cov neeg ua haujlwm rau tseemfwv Xeev Xiengkhouang raug Kham
Oun Boupha (tus Deputy Defence Minister) sau ntawv tshem lawv suavdaws
tag nrho los mus nyob rau Vientiane. Col Ntsuab Vaj Lis yeej muaj
ntaub ntawv raws kevcai nws thiaj nqis nrog suavdaws los rau
Vientiane. Tsis yog hais tias tus LVTLTYM ntawd ua tus cawm nws.
Tej dabneeg LVTLTYM piav txog ntawm Lyteck thiab Lis Tub tua Hmoob
nyob HinHeup, nws mus sablaj nyob Phati nrog Lis Txos, cov Hmoob Lis
ntxeevsiab ua qhov ntsej qhov muag rau PathetLao, thiab qhov nws ua
ntawv cawm Col Ntsuab Vaj Lis no tsis muaj li. Nws lam muab tej zaj
dabneeg cuav ntxiv tej qho tiag xyaw uake kom cov neeg pejxeem fuabfwm
tsis paub keebkwm meej txaus ntseeg xwb. Nws qhov tswvyim tiag mas yog
dag kom neeg cem kuv tsev Hmoob Lis thiab txw kom peb cov Hmoob nyob
sab ntuj America, Australia, Canada thiab France no siab kub heev es
pib rog tshiab rau Nplog nyob LosTsuas. Thaum muaj kev nyuab siab dua
lawm ces cov neeg li Naisphoo Vaj Pov thiab nws cov ntseeg siab no
khaws xyeem sau neeg nyiaj noj dua li lawv tau ua ntau xyoo los lawm.
Ntxiv no mus kuv yuav piav qhia nej suavdaws txog Naipshoo Vaj Pov lub
siab nyoos yav ntuj qubqab. Qhov nws tsis haum suavdaws yog vim Tub
Lwj Muas thiab Ham Choj ua ob tug ntxeev lus tsav txhawb nws pluajsiab
limhiam. Cov neeg raug teebmeem ntawm nws raws li no: Tub Npis
LisFoom, Tub Liab LisFoom, Ntxhw Xwm LisFoom, Lis Vaj Tooj Pov, Lis
Npawv LisNpuagFwm, Chaokhouang Tooj Pov Lis, Chaokhouang Ntsuab Pov
Yaj, Colonel Suav Yaj, Lieutenant Txhiaj Sawm Xyooj, Captain Lauj
Xeeb, Lis Nav Zam Laum, Lis Cawv LisNyiajVws, Lyteck LisNyiajVws thiab
Lis Nplooj LisNyiajVws. Tseem tshuav ntau leej ntau tus thiab. Cov
neeg no tsis tau khwv ib yam phem rau nws kiag li (ib co tseem tau
cawm nws txoj sia yam thauv) taimsis nws txob plaub rau lawv yam tsis
muaj povthawj li.
Cov neeg raug Naisphoo Vaj Pov tua muaj ntau leej. Cov uas raug tua
tiamsis tsis tuag xws li no: Major Lis Fwm Npliaj Mim, TwvYeej
LisNyiajVws thiab tsev neeg (2 tug mob), Lis Nplooj Ntxoov Xeeb thiab
tsev neeg, Lis Qhua LisFoom thiab tsev neeg. Hos cov nws tua tuag lawm
mas raws li no: Colonel Txooj Kuam Vwj, Major Lis Zeb, Major Vaj Txooj
Neeb, Major Txawj Toog Vwj, Lis Nus tsev neeg, Lis Npawv LisNpuagFwm
thiab 5 tug kwvtij, Muas Zeb thiab tsev neeg, Hawj Vaj, Lauj Paj Vws
Vwj, Tooj Ntxawg Lauj thiab tsev neeg (2 tuag), Soob Lwj Yaj thiab
tsev neeg (5 tuag, 1 mob), Ntxoov Lis Yaj thiab tsev neeg (11 tuag, 5
mob, thiab tseem raug nyuavhoom T-28 raws tuav ntxiv), thiab Tooj
Txawj Nyas [nws yog Naisphoo Vaj Pov tus tub tua neeg (assassin)].
Tseem tshua ntau leej tiamsis muab npe npaum no xwb.
Thaum 1981 cov Hmoob nyob sab Mokphasouk, MoosCab, PhouBia, BanNa,
PhouFa, BounLong, muaj ze ntawm 200,000 leej neeg, ib txhia kuj nyob
taus tusyees nrog tseemfwv tshiab lawm, Naisphoo Vaj Pov tso nws ib co
neeg, ib tug hu ua Colonel Txawj Pov Muas, mus dag ntxias kom suavdaws
sawv tua txoj kevcai communist ntawd thiaj ua rau Hmoob tuag lawm
coob. Xws li sab BounLong tuag yuav luag txog 2,000 hos lwm qhov tuag
rau nruab roob nruab hav kuj muaj coob muaj ntau. Lub txim no yuav
muab pov rau PathetLao ev xwb los kuj tsis tau. Yuav tsum muab faib
rau Naisphoo Vaj Pov thiab nws cov neeg uas mus ntxias dag ntawd tau
nrog ev thiab. Lub zog lwm tebchaws yuav pab Naisphoo Vaj Pov twb tsis
muaj lawm los tseem dag haistias "Peb yuav mus noj pebcaug
Vientiane...Phone Savanh" kom suavdaws "ua tiag tiag peb twb yuav tau
teb tau chaw."
Tsis tas li no xwb Naisphoo Vaj Pov tseem nqa nws lub siab phem tuaj
ua rau tebchaws America thiab. Lub Koomhaum Kwm Choj (North Carolina)
thiab Koomhaum Txoov Xyooj (Kansas) tseem raug nws foob poob tag. Hos
Fwj Hawj lub xovtoojcua "Hmoob Thooj Siab Koom Ntsws" (Fresno, CA)
tseem raug nws txeeb yuav.
Txoj kev noj neeg nyiaj thiab zog Naisphoo Vaj Pov yeej ua ntev thiab
ua dua los lawm. Lub 12 hli, 2003 nws tau xa Lauj Vaj (uas yog Pov Lis
Muas tus qub tubrog tau tshais los nyob hauv Naisphoo Vaj Pov tsev)
mus LosTsuas dag yuav Hmoob nyiaj nyob LuangPrabang, HoueSai thiab lwm
qhov. Nws hais tias Naisphoo Vaj Pov thiab tseemfwv America yuav sau
cov Hmoob mus nyob rau America tebchaws tag nrho. Tsev neeg loj, me,
twg, los xijpeem yuav tsum them $200 US los yog 2 choj nyiaj ua tus
nqi ntaub ntawv tawm ntawm ThaibTeb mus rau America. Pab twg xub mus
txog ThaibTeb ces pab ntawd yuav raug xa tawm mus ua ntej. Thaum kawg
nws hais rau lawv hais tias nws rov mus Bangkok mus npaj ntaub ntawv
tos lawv. Yog li no xyoo 2004 thiaj muaj ze ntawd 8,000 tawm tus Hmoob
tau tso vajtsev tsiajtxhu tseg khiav mus rau ThaibTeb lub zos DejDawb
Petchaboon, Nongkhai thiab Bangkok ua teebmeem loj kawg nkaus rau
pejxeem fuabfwm Hmoob, Nplog, Thaib thiab thoob ntiajteb.
Cov povthawj saum no qhia tau hais tias Naisphoo Vaj Pov yeej muaj tus
cwjpwm limhiam pog ntuj qubqab los txog niaj hnub no nws thiaj nrhiav
tau lub siab ua tej yam tsi ncaj tsi ncees pov rau kuv tsev neeg thiab
lwm tus. Yam nws ua phem yav tas los peb tseem niaj hnub npog nws lub
qe tswlwj tiamsis zaum no nws muab dag tshaj qhov peb uv taus lawm.
Yog li no kuv nqua hu tag nrho peb haiv Hmoob thiab txhua txhua xeem
nyob thoob qab ntuj no paub hais tias peb suavdaws ev tsis taus
Naisphoo Vaj Pov qhov dag ntxuag nws cov neeg ua pojntxoog de rev
nplooj los vov qhov muag dag noj dag haus, txeeb luag lwm tug mus ua
lawv tug, ntxias tij tsi hauv nrog kwv, ntxias pawg neeg no tsis haum
pawv tov. Sawv los peb uake mus tshem tej yam phem phem uas peb
suavdaws tsis hmov tsis ntshaw kom ploj mus thiab sibpab nrhiav txoj
kev zoo los rau peb suavdaws tau siv mus yav tom ntej. Qhov peb
suavdaws ntshaw yog kev ncajncees kom muaj nqi, kev ncajncees kom muaj
povthawj thiab sibhlub sibpab. Ua nej suavdaws tsaug.
Lis Nplooj LisNyiajVws
Hmong-Lao
Vam hais tias Lis Nplooj cov lus no yuav muaj pov thawj txhua nqi.
Thiab yog muaj tseeb li hais ces kuj muab tso xov tooj cua rau Hmoob
ntiaj teb hnov thiab los pob. Ob peb hnub ntawm i kuv tau hais tias
ntshe yog yawg hlob tas zim txwv rau Hmoob hwm lawm no; zaum no ntshe
yuav muaj tseeb tiag lau!
Li cas los xij, nws yeej muaj qhov zoo thiab qhov phem sib xyaws pes
daws. Peb Hmoob feem coob yeej tseem hwm yawg hlob GVP li peb tus Vaj.
Thov sawv daws cia kom lub tsev kawm ntawv no mus taus lawm tso peb
mam sib dig tom qab puas tau?
HL
kwv...@aol.com
nas.
tus kwv moobsib thiab tus tij laug thornsp-- hmoob puas phem npaum li
no tiag mas.
peb cov laus ces twb tos hnub mus ntuj ceeb tsheej lawm xwb es yog nej
tseem ua npaum li no tiag thiab ces ntshe kawg yuav tau mus txia ua
mab ua suav kom ntsej tsis txhob hnov muag tsis txhob pom nej hmoob
txoj kev sib do lau.
Hmong-Lao
rau peb cov hluas saib no zoo li ho phuj dhau heev lawm. Cia rov los
cheem dua ib ob los ntxiv.
Ob hnub ntawm i, GVP twb nkag mus nyog qhuas ntxhias hauv Koos Paj Cai
(LPDR) lub nyuag tawb piv lawm. Tam sis no, yam li Lis Nplooj tab tom
nkag nuj nav lawv qab mus ntxiv thiab, nws tab tom cev cev taw rau
LPDR tus tswj tsiag thiab. Yog thaum pob tawb txhais npluav no ntshe
cov nyuag noog no yuav nti plig plawb xwb ntag lau. Yaiv yaiv, tsis
yog Hmoob cov thawj coj es muaj peevxwm thiab peevthev li no xwb ntag
los?
Note: Tus neeg hais cov lus ntawd, txawm yuav yog leej twg los nws
yeej tsis muaj good intention rau GVP. Tiam sis GVP tseem qaug quav
rau thiab. Li no es kuv thiaj pheej hais tias yog tas kee lawm no
ntag.
Hais siab leej twg lawm los thov zam txim pub nawb,
HL
HL
phwvnyawm
Hmoobnplog,
Peb hmoob mas thaum twg cov coj yuav hais dab tsi........yuav tsum yog
nws yuav li sawv daws pom zoo thiab hais txij li sawv daws cia nws
hais xwb mas thiaj yuav tsis yuam kev.
Yus tus coj ntxiab twb yuav tais tes los cov tseem txhaub tias kav
tsis ces tes ko tus tswj tsiag..........thaum ntxiab tais tes lawm mam
paub tias yog ntxiab ces lig dhau lawm os.
Npaj no yuav muaj ceem lauj.
Siv Yis
Kuv yog ib tug me nyuam yaus xwb tab sis kuv xav hais me me rau neb ob
tug ua tij los ua txiv. Yav tas lawm ces cia muab ua dab neeg hais
qhia rau tej me tub me nyuam kawm xwb, thov neb txhob coj los mus hais
sib rhua. Lis Nplooj txawm koj yuav hais npaum li cas los (you cannot
go back and fix history). Vaj Pov txawm yuav hais npaum li cas los
(thing will never get better). Qhov yuav kom zoo ces yog neb ob tug
yuav tsum los sib tuav tes ua kev es sib koom siab sib hlub (forgive
the past) ua tus yam ntxwv zoo peb tej hluas no coj ua lub neej mus
lawm yav tom ntej xwb.
Ua cas nej cov ua tij, ua txiv tsis ua yam ntxwv zoo rau peb es nej
tseem niaj hnub muab tej qub lus 32 xyoo dhau los lawm coj los sib cav
sib ceg ...
Please forget/forgive history, make the most use of the present time,
and prepare for the future.
Stop playing like a child - show your true leadership to us (young
generation).
Thov zam txim rau me yaus tej lus thiab.
SY.
Born2beHmong
>
> - Show quoted text -
Phwvnyawm aws,
tej no miv miv xwb os, txhob poob siab li os....tus hais daim cassette
no los tsua yog tej neeg tsi paub qab paub haus thiaj li yuav ntseeg
xwb og. cov neeg zoo li peb cov no, yeej tsi ntseeg ib qhov li lawm
nawb--hais plam ib los lus xwb ces tagnrho nws cov lus hauv cov
content ntawd povtseg tagnrho lawm os.
hos cov lug ua hais hauv daim post no los, tsua yog hearsay ib ham
thiab hais tsi tag lus li thiab--thaum no cov content los yeej tsi
txaus ntseeg rau cov neeg nkagsiab thiab nyob level peb no lawm thiab
og--tsua yog tej neeg dog pe dig thiaj li lam sib cam thiab sib tham
xwb og.
yog li tej lus no, yog hmoob hais lus sib chob thiab sib ntswvsiab
xwb---cov neeg nyob li peb cov level no lawm, peb hais tias tej no yog
tej kev sib cam tom vaj tom tsev lawm xwb, tsi yog hais kom muaj kav
li kev taug--li txoj xov mus tau los nyog--es yuav judge tej evidence
as incredible li nawb.
yog li mas, tej lus li hauv Daim Cassatte los tsi muaj neeg paub, tej
lus hais no los tsi muaj leeg twg paub....qhov no yog qhov cov neeg
nkagsiab li peb cov no txoj kev xav thiab ntshaws. yog li peb yuav zoo
npaum li no, peb haivneeg hmoob thiaj li yuav zoo tau thiab mus tau
deb, los ua pab ua pawg thiab los au tau ib tsob nawb.
koj kwv Born2beHmong
zhen_
now i understand your bitterness against GVP a bit more. you do know that
this is 'personal' between you (your people) and GVP (his people), do you?
i am afraid we cannot talk about this personal matter objectively or
without disrupting people's emotional stability.
is tsavfoom lis a little kid that can be 'ntxais'? could you elaborate why
GVP would want to overtake his store?
on your point on the HinHeup bridge massacre: how come your theoretical
reconstruction of the events go against multiple eyewitness testimonies?
are you saying that they also have an agenda against your family? i think
you will have to not only discredit GVP but also Path Lao Hmong and
Pro-democracy Hmong too.
furthermore, were you there during the massacre? or are you basing your
reconstruction based on biased accounts? by biased accounts, i mean those
who would speak of lyteck favorably. have you interviewed one person who
experienced that tragedy that said it was not lyteck? if so, could you
give me a name?
i think you are wildly spraying your counter-attacks against all and
anyone who would say lyteck was responsible. why would so many people on
all sides conspire collectively against your family? do you mean to say
they just don't like your family and even go so far as to say the hate
your family to the point of spreading false statements to destroy your
family?
i think if you mean the above, that seems to be paranoia.
please don't take my comments personally. i too want to get to the bottom
of this tragedy. but everytime you bring it up, you seem to group anyone
who would state lyteck's responsiblity on the massacre into the category
'they don't like my family' or 'they want to destroy my family'.
Moobsib
Lis Nplooj, lwm tug mas kuv tsis paub zoo tawm sis thaus kuv pum koj
muab Lt. Col. Txooj Neeb Vaaj, Major Txawj Toog Vwj hab Lt. Col. Txooj
Kuam Vwj coj lug lam tas yog naiphoo VP tua ces kuv xaam pum tas koj
cov lug los muaj phuas taum xyaw huv lawm. Koj cov lug yuav muaj nqes
zog yog tas koj teev cov tseemx rua xwb naj.
Tsi taag le ntawd xwb nyob huv LVTYM cov lug, nwg tub lob Txooj Tub
Lis Nyiajvws rua huv lawm ces haj yam ua rua qhov accusation ntawd yim
muaj phuas taum cuav ntau ntxiv lawm xwb. Tsis to taub tas yog vim le
caag gvp ho moog txhawb cov lug ntawd?
Hmong-Lao, koj has yog kawg lawm. Kuv los yeej pum le koj has hab..
Tawm sis tej zag yug cov nam dem dawg ntshij nuav lub zeem muag yuav
tsi leej hab tsi tseeb. Cas sab tas tej laug pom xeeb ua lawd nyaj
luas yuav saib zoox lawm luas maam ua.
MS
zhen_
would you not say this problem of 'hmoob havzoov' and constant armed
struggle is not due to GVP? would it be more to their stupidity?
if what you are saying is true, how can one group of people repeatedly
subject themselves to a corrupted and evil leader?
have you heard the saying, 'fool me once, shame on you. fool me twice,
shame on me.'
according to what you said, GVP has fooled us more than once, so the shame
is on us. i think if what you are saying is true, then instead of attacking
GVP, maybe you should criticize Hmong people for their blind faith and call
them to an awakening. do you think that is more productive than words such
as 'qe tswlwj'?
in the end, it seems you are just out to beautify your family's reputation
at the expense of GVP and you yourself are not any higher moral grounds by
resorting to foul language.
Thorn...@yahoo.com
Thank you for your story. Good idea that today you step up to share
the dark side of our hero. Kuv xav yog ib qhov zoo uas neb muab tshaj
tawm rau hauv no rau peb suav daws tau nyeem, yog neb tsis muab tej
secret no qhib tawm ces peb twb tsis paub txog. Luag tej laus piv txoj
lus tia tu tub ntsuag tau yeeb ncuab ces yog tej no tiag cov hluas.
Zaum no luag tus hlob qhib txoj hau kev no rau nej taug lawm mam xyuam
xim nawb, kev pob zeb xwb tej zaum yuav muaj taug.
Hmong213
Vientiane ces hnub twg tsis muaj nyiaj siv ces mus pem Looj Ceeb nq
Hmong213
>
Npab....twb sau tsis tau tas los twb muab xa lawm. Kuv rov qab hais
dua.
*Hais txog tej no mas kuv xav luag xwb...Hahahaha........ Thaum sawv
daws nyob Vientiane ces hnub twg tsis muaj nyiaj siv ces mus pem Looj
Ceeb nqa tau 2 - 3 puas txhiab nyiaj los siv lawm no ces tej niag lus
zoo li no ntshai yuav tsis muaj hais tawm li.
Thaum ub GVP muab nyiaj pub pab twg siv dawb ntau tshaj mas tam sim no
pab ntawd cem GVP heev tshaj ntag. Thaum nyob Looj Ceeb, GVP hlub
thiab muab nyiaj ntau tshaj plaws rau pab Hmoob Lis thiab pab Hmoob
Yaj, tam sim no ob pab no yog ob pab uas against GVP heev dua cov. Kav
tsij nrau niag laus tiag tiag nawb vim hais tias niag laus lub hnub
twb yuav dua nraum roob lawm. Tsuas tshuav ci meme xwb twb yuav dua
toj tiag tiag laiv. Cov Hmoob tam sim no nyiam thiab tuaj GVP tog yog
tib co thaum ub GVP yeej tsis tau pub lawm ib xees nyiaj liab li xwb
nas.
Kuv pab los kuj muaj tus pauv tau thiab tiam sis lawv ho tau tsawg
zog. Tab sis lawv cov tau no lawv kuj yog cov against GVP tib yam
thiab. Tsuas yog lawv tau tsawg ces lawv ho cem thiab against meme
xwb.
Kuv tus no tsis tau ib kis liab tias yog GVP pub rau kuv li. Kuv yeej
tsis nyiam thiab tsis ntxub yawm GVP li. Ua neeg nyob mas cov nej
hlub hlub mas lwm hnub cov ntawd laub yog nej cov xav tus loj (enemy).
hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha...........
Hm213
Thorn...@yahoo.com
Raws li kuv tus laus no xav mas cov tau tau nyiaj los ntawm yawg loj
los ces twb yog cov nyob ze ze yawg loj thiab paub yawg lub "qe tsw
lwj" zoo zoo lawm ne, ces ziag no luag kawg muab tsoo rau suav daws
hnia xwb yog tseem tsis pub nyiaj ua dej siab thiab nas. Qhov tseeb
tos li lub sij hawm ntawd lawv cov ntawd ho tau nyiaj los twb yog li
hais ne, lawv yog cov paub yawg loj qhov weakness thaum twg tsis tau
nyiaj ces kawg tsoo kiag lub "qe tsw lwj" kom tawg xwb, yog thaum zoo
li no lawm ces kawg luag tus ua hlob yuav tsum swb xwb las as. Tsis
muab nyiaj tiag ces kawg pom xwb ne. Dhau li ntawd, koj mentioned txog
cov Hmoob Lis tau nyiaj ntawm yawg loj mas kuv ho pom txawv zog. Kuv
pom tias tag nro Hmoob nyob teb chaws nplog yawg hlob vp tsuas ntshai
lawv pab Hmoob Lis ntawd nkaus xwb, hos lwm pab ces yawg loj kawg
npuaj pob tw thiab tso paus rau hniav xwb tiam sis txog pab Hmoob Lis
ces kawg yuav tau po tw rau xwb las as yog tseem tsis pub nyiaj thiab
ces kawg twg zog loj twg tuaj sau toj xwb ne. Koj puas xav tias yawg
hlob yuav lam kam risk li ntawd nab, nyiaj txiag khwv tau nas. Tej lus
no mas yog lus tham pem ua si xwb ov, nej cov hluas txhob muab thwm
xav li cas, niag neeg laus lawm lam tham lus me nyuam yaus xwb los lam
mloog.
Tubcajceszoo
qhov nej hais no Muaj tseeb nawj,,,,Kuv twb pom kiag ntawm qhov muag
ntag tseem tias tsis muaj thiab, Peb yeej muaj cov neeg paub tab pom
tsis hais kom tua hmoob xwb , yeej hais hmoob tsis zoo nyob rau dong
dok hauv vientiane xyoo 1975 ua syog muaj Lis teeb , lis tub nkawv ob
kwv tij tuaj hais nyob tim dong dok.
qhov no ces peb yuav paub zoo npaum twg los cia twj ywm rau hauv hmoob
siab ua keeb kwm tseg, Yog yuav hais kom meej tshaj no los yeej tau,
Tiam si twb dhau mus lawm peb tsis hais yog hais ces haiv hmoob poob
ntsej muag xwbyuav tsis zoo rau peb thiab.
TubCajces zoo
zhen
yog muaj tseeb li koj hais. yog muaj tseeb li touly hais. ces qhov
tiag yog qhov twg?
raws li touly hais mas, yog neeg ntxub touly tsev neeg thiaj li cem
lyteck tsis zoo. koj puas yog zoo li ntawd?
tabsi, raws li koj hais mas, tsis yog hmoob ntxub touly tsev neeg,
tabsi twb yog lyteck ntxub haiv hmoob xwb.
raws li kuv hnov mas, lyteck yeej tau nrog nplog liab ua ke vim nws
xav ua nom. nplog thiaj li txib nws khiav tej dej num phem rau hmoob.
Tou...@asianavenue.com
> tou ly,
> i am afraid we cannot talk about this personal matter objectively or
> without disrupting people's emotional stability.
Well Zhen, if that's how you feel then you'll just have to watch the
exchanges between other people and I.
> is tsavfoom lis a little kid that can be 'ntxais'?
I think you meant "ntxias." Obviously not since GVP and Vam Ntxawg Vaj
never got the store.
> could you elaborate why GVP would want to overtake his store?
I'll let my uncle TseemYeej do this part. I'm sure in time he'll show
up and the pieces will fall in place.
> on your point on the HinHeup bridge massacre: how come your >theoretical reconstruction of the events go against multiple >yewitness testimonies?
Goes against witnesses like who? Lauj Vaj Tsab Lis Thoj Yaj Muas? Or
screen names on SCH? Every time somebody on SCH says they saw this and
that at Hin Heup, they never ever reveal their real names. Why is
that? And how can I or anybody disprove somebody who doesn't have a
real identity?
On the other hand the people/witnesses I listed are real people. They
can be found and their locations are shown in the original post.
> are you saying that they also have an agenda against your family?
Some do have agendas. Many are inaccurate. Others are just plain
ridiculous. Did you read the story about Lis Tub and Lis Teeb wearing
masks? This was posted by a a current SCH member 2 years ago or so.
> i think you will have to not only discredit GVP but also Path Lao >Hmong and Pro-democracy Hmong too.
"Pro-democracy" such Vaj Npis? He wouldn't even return my father's
phone calls.
"Pathet Lao" like Lauj Vaj Tsab Lis Thoj Yaj Muas? Do you believe him
and his story?
GVP? Yes, we're in the process of showing his misdeeeds and motives.
My father and uncles have held his past for long enough. They might
not even expose him if he didn't pull off this "Lauj Vaj Tsab Lis Thoj
Yaj Muas" stunt on Hmong LosTsuas Radio. They used to think, like many
Hmong do, yog lawv rhuav nws ces ib yam li rhuav peb suavdaws tag
nrho, yog li no lawv thiaj pheej npog nws lub qe. But not anymore. GVP
doesn't seem to care and will use underhanded tactics against people,
why should anybody, especially the parties affected by his propoganda,
care too?
> furthermore, were you there during the massacre?
No, I wasn't.
> or are you basing your reconstruction based on biased accounts? > by biased accounts, i mean those who would speak of lyteck >favorably.
Yes, I would have to say that most do speak favourably of Lyteck.
However speaking favourably does not automatically equate perjury.
Feel free to interview them.
> have you interviewed one person who experienced that tragedy that > said it was not lyteck? if so, could you give me a name?
Myself personally interviewing them? No. My father has. And their
names are listed on the very first post already. My father stands by
what he writes.
> please don't take my comments personally. i too want to get to the >bottom of this tragedy. but everytime you bring it up, you seem to >group anyone who would state lyteck's responsiblity on the >massacre into the category 'they don't like my family' or 'they want >to destroy my family'.
Zhen, you said you want to get to the bottom of this Lyteck and
HinHeup matter. I think it's a task you should pursue. You're very
much interested in Hmong history. You're not only knowledgable in many
areas, like the Hmong in China and their history, of which I have very
little clue about, but you can convey your thoughts effectively and
articulately. Sometimes you spin things a little, nevertheless your
focus on the issue remains intact--at least that's my assessment of
you. I think tackling this HinHeup incident would be something you can
achieve. Somewhere on another thread I read that you'd be willing to
give out your name or something if a certain condition was met.
Anyways, should you accept to do so my witnesses will be readily
accessible.
Tou Ly
Mysterious King
You read too much into the Lauj Vaj Tsab message. My take on his
message was that Hmong should stop killing another Hmong. Had you not
mentioned it, I would have missed the point that Ly Teck and Ly Tou
were the killers at Hin Heup. To me, the characters in his story were
not important, what was important was the moral or message of his
story. The crux of the story: Hmong should stop killing another
Hmong. I think VP lend his support to the LVT's story not because Ly
Teck and Ly Tou were antagonists in the story but because the story
advocates against Hmong killing Hmong.
You would do yourself and the Ly family a lot of good by using the Ly
Teck and Ly Tou accusations to preach peace. The more you stir the
Hin Heup incident, the more reminders you bring to Hmong minds about
Ly Teck and Ly Tou's involvements. There are people who had loved
ones died that day who believed Ly Teck/Ly Tou were there. Because
you and I were not there, we cannot say this happened or that did not
happened. Time will take us far away from that ugly day.
Ly Teck and Ly Tou were individuals, free to make their impressions in
history. What they did, they were willing to take credit for.
Neither you nor the Ly family had control over them. Your continual
defense of them makes it seem like you did have a hand in their
decisions. Ly Teck is dead and he can neither be defamed nor
defended. Regarding you and the Ly family, do you really feel that
you were defamed? My take is that you would do a lot of good by
investing your energy and resources in places that matter and will
matter in the future. Pa Cha once had the reputation of being one of
the richest Hmong person and many had high hopes for his line. Some
of his descendants are now millionnaires, including Ly Tou and Cha
Fong. Why not use your family's resources to present your good side?
Rattle in the bad and you will attract the bad light.
Tou...@asianavenue.com
It's easy to say let it go and move when "Lauj Vaj Tsab Lis Thoj Yaj
Muas" didn't directly accuse your family of something they didn't do.
If he and GVP pulled that stunt on radio about MysteriousKing's family
would he/you just "let it go" also? Didn't you say in another post
that'd you fight for freedom, just cause, and something along that
line? I don't think you'd sit there and let somebody saibxyuas tsis
taus koj too.
Furthermore, LVTLTYM's accounts of historical events are inaccurate
and wrong. Just ignore it?
I don't see how you can say that our continual defense of Lis Teeb and
Lis Tub would make it seem we're complicity to the killings. If that's
your reasoning that any one of us, you, zhen, whoever, defending
against McCoy's accusation of GVP (and us) trafficking heroin would
make us seem complicit as well. You seem thoughtful enough, I don't
know why you would take such a stance.
Pacha wasn't that rich. He lived a little better than most, but not
lavish in any capacity. He was even a farmer at times.
Your other suggestions are well taken however.
Tou Ly
On May 25, 12:14 pm, Mysterious King <mysteriousk...@hotmail.com>
wrote:
Tou...@asianavenue.com
It's easy to say let it go and move when "Lauj Vaj Tsab Lis Thoj Yaj
Muas" didn't directly accuse your family of something they didn't do.
If he and GVP pulled that stunt on radio about MysteriousKing's family
would he/you just "let it go" also? Didn't you say in another post
that'd you fight for freedom, just cause, and something along that
line? I don't think you'd sit there and let somebody saibxyuas tsis
taus koj too.
Furthermore, LVTLTYM's accounts of historical events are inaccurate
and wrong. Just ignore it?
I don't see how you can say that our continual defense of Lis Teeb and
Lis Tub would make it seem we're complicit to the killings. If that's
your reasoning then any one of us, you, zhen, whoever, defending
against McCoy's accusation of GVP (and us) trafficking heroin would
make us seem complicit as well. You seem thoughtful enough, I don't
know why you would take such a stance.
Pacha wasn't that rich. He lived a little better than most, but not
lavish in any capacity. He was even a farmer at times.
Your other suggestions are well taken however.
On May 25, 12:14 pm, Mysterious King <mysteriousk...@hotmail.com>
wrote:
ntsuabxwm
dab tsi. Sawv daws yeej paub lawm hais tias Lyteck yog tus order qhov
shooting nos that why he got to the reeducation camp. Peb yog hmoob ib
yam tsi tas los sib cam lawm.
Hmong213
> Twb tau muaj 30 xyoo nos lawm tseem yuav muab nthuav coj los hai ua
> dab tsi. Sawv daws yeej paub lawm hais tias Lyteck yog tus order qhov
> shooting nos that why he got to the reeducation camp. Peb yog hmoob ib
> yam tsi tas los sib cam lawm.
>
I agree with you Ntsuabxwm. I want to say more but I thought I better
shut up. But I totally agree with your statement above. Thanks.
Hmong213
> dab tsi. Sawv daws yeej paub lawm hais tias Lyteck yog tus order qhov
> shooting nos that why he got to the reeducation camp. Peb yog hmoob ib
> yam tsi tas los sib cam lawm.
>
I agree with you Ntsuabxwm. I want to say more but I thought I better
kwv...@aol.com
mas tus tub hluas tou ly no nws cov lus tsis yog muaj phuas taum xyaws
xwb, nws cov lus yog second hand los yog heardsay lus xwb. koj seb
zehn nug nws, nws twb teb tsis tau li ne. nws tseem hais tias nws
txiv thiaj yog tus interviewer xwb, nws tsuas muab nws txiv cov lus
nws txiv qhia nws coj los tham xwb no. ib qho ntxiv yog qhov zehn nug
txog tsav foom lub taj laj takeover, nws tseem hais tias nws tsis paub
cia nws tus uncle mam li los tham. yus twb tsis paub dab tsis es yus
sawm siv tuaj tham cuag li yus yog tus cob cuj los yog tus phub kiaj.
nov ces mekas hais tias, you just make a fool of yourself no xwb.
hais lus li no ces yog hais rau peb cov laus no hnov xwb ces peb twb
xav rho khauj tsiav rau lawm xwb nav.
qhov no tsis yog kuv hais cem nws, kuv tsuas xav kom nej cov hluas ua
dab tsi yuav tau ua twb zoo xyuam xim xwb.
Hmong213
sawm siv tuaj tham cuag li yus yog tus cob cuj los yog tus phub kiaj.
> nov ces mekas hais tias, you just make a fool of yourself no xwb.
> hais lus li no ces yog hais rau peb cov laus no hnov xwb ces peb twb
> xav rho khauj tsiav rau lawm xwb nav.
Koj tus laus txhob rawm rho khauj tsiav rau cov hluas tsam ib chim
lawv xuas karate tuaj koj ho maim tsis dhau nawb.....hahahaha...cas
yuav hais tau khws ua luaj ne.
Tou...@asianavenue.com
Nyob ntawm daim original post ntawv tus twg yog tus sign nad? Kuv los
kuv txiv? Muaj dabtsi txhaum yog kuv muab kuv txiv cov lus sau tawm
rau suavdaws paub? Nws twb muab nws lub npe guarantee lawm es kom
tseem tsis txaus siab dabtsi thiab? Yog koj xav hnug dabtsi ntxiv ces
kuj nug nws xwb? Koj hnug tas, kuv qhia nws, nws hais kuv, kuv sau
tuaj. It's pretty simple. Seems like everybody else understood it
except you.
How do you conclude that when I pass on information on behalf of my
father it's hearsay?
Tou Ly
Nojn...@yahoo.com
Yog tus txawj noj mov ces noog kiag xwb yeej paub lawm hais tias cov
lus uas (LVTLTYM) hais ntawd yog lus hais kom Hmoob rov sibntxub Hmoob
xwb. Niag lus dag, lus cuab kom cov ruam ntseeg xwb. Luag cov muaj
hlwb, luag yeej tsis ntseeg tej nyuag lus dag no. Mloog kiag lub npe
xwb twb paub tias dag lawm. Nim muaj neeg hu ua Lauj Vaj Tsab Lis Thoj
Yaj Muas. Uacas ho tsis hais txog Xyooj Ham Hawj Khab Kwm Tseej Phab
thiab Faj maj.
Cov lus hais ntawd yog koj muab coj lo xam twb tsis raug li hais li.
Cov niag tsis paub mas nim qhuasqab qhuastsau tias nws yog ibtug
tseemceeb. Cov paub ces tej niag lus hais ntawd yog lawv ntiav nws
hais xwb. Tsis tag nkim koj lub sijhawm teb.
Nnk
Thorn...@yahoo.com
kuj tsis yog phem kiag li, yawg rov qab ua voj hluas zawm luag caj dab
xwb, ua li tus kwv HL hais os, ntshai luag tus laus kee tag lawm los
cas luag pheej yuav rhuav luag tus kheej ua luaj li ntawd. Nej cov
hluas tias self-destruction no ces yog tej ntawd los mas cov hluas.
Nej cov hluas tsis txhob nyuaj nyuaj siab, nej twb tias yus cog yam
qoob loo twg ces thaum kawg yuav tau sau yam ntawd rov qab no ned, tej
no ces yog nuj nqis ntawd txoj kev tua tus kheej nruab pliag xwb mas.
nyiamxai...@gmail.com
Nakhang and many places. Luckily, he was not dead that was why he
struck back and had killed or injured some highly experienced swordmen
that Tou has mentioned on his post.
While I was visited my brother-in-law; Col. Lis Pov Npuag Tsig in
France in 2005, he told me that Captain Heu Tou had saved naisphoo Vaj
Pov's life and knew who was the real assassin and the rest of the
conspiracy swordmen so they had killed him after that to protect
themselves. Lis Pov confessed on his dying bed to God and said that
Nom Ko Lis had known this story very well.
When they had killed Heu Tou, Lis Pov had checked his body to make
sure that he had died and found out that he had 50,000 kip in his
pocket so he had taken the money to Heu Tou's wife in Long Cheng and
said that he was killed by the Pathet Lao.
They almost killed gvp during a hunting trip but for some reason he
always had survived. He must be born to be a Hmong war heroe and
leader.
Long live the general!
Wayne Yang
tseemyeej
On May 27, 2:44 am, nyiamxaisnyiam...@gmail.com wrote:
> Naisphoo Vaj Pov was a very nice man until they tried to kill him at
> Nakhang and many places.
You may be too young to remember that Nakhang situation was 1964, but
vp had ordered NpliasjYob Thoj to kill NpuagFwm Lis earlier than
that, in the late 50. Worse of all, how about the genocide in
LongCheng and PhaKhao, 60-63? All these happened way before he was
shot, yes or no? As a Yang, you should ask ZamNplooj Yaj in NC or Txos
Yaj in MN (the son of VamKaim Yaj), they are survivors of vp horrible
execution.
If you believe that "they tried to kill him", you should also believe
that he has something to do with the death of cobmoos TxiajXab Muas
too.
TseemYeej.
Thorn...@yahoo.com
you know well about the assissanation events why not tell in here so
we the young and the old learn from the black side together. I very
interesting to learn because I not live in longcheng region and not
know much accept heard from other people about the dirty stuff. though
I got experience once in 1978 when we were in the jungle acting of
chaofa soldier to fight for freedom and was almost got killed by some
people who got ordering by the top top man in america, it was good
thing that my life paper was not end and I can escaped from death.
some of my conrade got killed, I mean got killed by this group. later
when I have free time I will talked about the incident in here.
Tou...@asianavenue.com
Right now we are putting this retort on the internet and soon we are
going to print it and pass it to whoever is interested. We do have the
intention to make a cassette and put in on radio, but we're not sure
if Hmong LosTsuas Radio or any other radio would allow us the
opportunity like how they affored "Lauj Vaj Tsab Lis Thoj Yaj Muas"
and GVP.
Tou Ly
On May 24, 1:33 pm, Hmong-Lao <Hmlao...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> Wow!
> Vam hais tias Lis Nplooj cov lus no yuav muaj pov thawj txhua nqi.
> Thiab yog muaj tseeb li hais ces kuj muab tso xov tooj cua rau Hmoob
> ntiaj teb hnov thiab los pob. Ob peb hnub ntawm i kuv tau hais tias
> ntshe yog yawg hlob tas zim txwv rau Hmoob hwm lawm no; zaum no ntshe
> yuav muaj tseeb tiag lau!
> Li cas los xij, nws yeej muaj qhov zoo thiab qhov phem sib xyaws pes
> daws. Peb Hmoob feem coob yeej tseem hwm yawg hlob GVP li peb tus Vaj.
> Thov sawv daws cia kom lub tsev kawm ntawv no mus taus lawm tso peb
> mam sib dig tom qab puas tau?
> HL
Moobsib
teev nwg lub npe xwb ces nwg cov lug txawm yuav muaj kuab npaum twg
los yeej tsis make any difference le lawm. Tsi to taub tas yog vim le
caag luas tej laug tseem endorsed tej lug zoo le ntawd. Tawm sis yog
mej ua zoo noog mas tsoom laug kws tis paub hab tsi pum dleb mas cov
lug ntawd txhaab puab lub zug kawg nkaus. Kuv muaj cov txheebze kws
yog puab cov ntawd mas ib asthiv puab sis ntsib 2 zag lug thaam hab
dlha puab cov dlej num.
MS
Born2beHmong
yawmsib,
taus yog tej neeg tsi taustaub thiab paubtab thiaj li tham txog tej no
xwb, tej no yog second hands lus tagnrho xwb--thaum tham ces tus neeg
ntawd tsua hais kom zoo li nws zaj dabneeg rau ib tug mloog tag ces
coj mus tham ntxiv lawm xwb. peb cov neeb paubtab thiab nkagsiab, tsi
lam taug tej niag lus xaiv li no li.
only our hmong people who will be enjoying to talk and gossip for
second hands and hearsay--those should be only for the uneducated
people to talk about. if we were to point finger, it happened for so
many reason--even in the wild wild west, we have bounty hunters who
were took care all the posses and outlaws, who were living in the
edge. In America, we were systematic and manufacturing doing this
type of business in the open in the 1800 and early to mid and late
1900. therefore, if we were educated enough we would too assess the
situation fairly from our stand point to the rest of the world, as how
they were standing, to be able to move on in our lives.
yog nej yuav los muab tej nrab no los lob kom los plaubhaus mas---ntuj
aws, nej rov mus thaug seb yog vim li cas Lor BliaYao tsevneeg thiab
cov hmoob ua tau mus koom rau tog comminist lawm yog vim thiab tim li
cas los--es thiaj li los txog rau tej me lus nej taug no. vim tej lus
nej tham no, yog tib txog kev ua lawv mus nyob rau tog tom Communist
lawm xwb mas nawb.
Born2beHmong
Hmong-Lao
Koj twb niaj zaus hais tias Hmoob tsis ntse nyob ib level. Yog thaum
muaj ib tug uas nws muaj pluaj siab rhuav Hmoob txoj kev sib haum
xeeb, rhuav Hmoob lub npe, rhuav Hmoob cov thawj coj li yawg LVTLTYM
no. Cov uas muaj txoj kev ntse tsis coj los tham kom tshab rau peb cov
nyob level qis ces peb suav daws yov yuam kev tag phab tag pheev ntag,
txog thaum zoo li no ces kev piam sij kuj raws cuag xwb.
Koj puas xam pom (Koos Paj Cai) lawv qhov strategy rhuav gvp lub koob
meej ma? Luag hais tias muab nyuag roj kib nyuag txhav, thiab hais
tias qiv luag tes tuag neeg ces yog li no ntag tiag. Nws hais ib co
lus qhuas qhuas GVP, hais kom Hmoob tsis txhob rov tua Hmoob, accuse
lwm tus uas GVP yeej tau muaj kev tsis sib haum xeeb nrog los lawm.
Tej lus no ces thiaj ua rau GVP tsa nws tw ntxiab heev. Tab sis GVP
tsis pom hais tias ntawm tus tw ntxiab ntawd twb caws ib rooj nta npuj
rau lawm thiab. Rooj nta npuj thiab qiv luag tes tua neeg ntawd ces
yog cov neeg uas raug accused ntawd yuav tig rov los hlib GVP tawb
quav uas suav daws pheej sib sib pab npog ntag. Thaum no ces quav yuav
tsw thoob ntiaj teb li ntag los hos.
Hint: GVP yog neeb plua nuj, muaj nyiaj txog millions nyob rau Swis.
HL
Moobsib
MS
indige...@hotmail.com
Kuv yog ib tug menyuam Hmoob yug tom qab poob tebchaws. Tej xwm
txheej no kuv yeej paub tsis txog. Ziag no kuv tseem tab tom tshawb
fawb npaj los txuas ib daim Hmong Documentary. Nej txhuas tus Hmoob
tuaj hauv no, kuv thov caw kom nej txhua tus muab kev koom tes. Yog
nej leej twg muaj FIRSTHAND experience txog Hmoob cov xwm txheej uas
ua rau peb haiv Hmoob pheej tseem niaj hnub sib cov nyom ziag no kuv
thov interview nej individually.
Kuv vam thiab cia siab hais tias nej sawvdaws, txhua txhia tus yuav
hlub Hmoob thiab txhawb Hmoob. Thov email tuaj rau kuv ntawm
indige...@hotmail.com mog.
Ua tsaug!
Born2beHmong
HmongLao,
kuv nkagsiab koj cov lus, vim yog hmonb tsi ntse nyob ib level, es
thiaj li muaj tej xwmtxheej zoo li no ntag mas. tabsi cov ntse los twb
paub zoo lawm hais tias, tej niag lus xaiv, lub cuas xws li LVTLTYM no
tsua yog "second hands" thiab hais zoo tsawv raws li "Saub" xwb. yus
tseem mus lob tej niag lus noj coj los ua chaw caub chaw chim, kuv
nkagsiab koj zoo, yog hais txog ntawm former GVP, vim nws laus lawm--
nws ua txiv tsi mloog lus tog, nws hnov ib cov lus xwb nws twb zoosiab
hlo hais tias, yog hmoob yuav hlub hmoob tiag tiag, thiab yuav ua rau
yuav haivneeg kom zoo--yuav ua li cas tiag thiaj li zoo. nws missed
interpretation cov lus "Saub--ua yog lus Gossip, xws li tej neeg tsi
paubtab hais lawm xwb.
yog thaum peb yog cov neeg nkagsiab thiab paubtab lawm, peb tsi tsim
nyog los sib Tshum, sib Iab liam, thiab Sib ntxo li no lawm--yog tej
niag lus Saub thiab lus Dag li no, peb tseem coj los ua ib qhov chaw
cobnyeej zias, coj los ua xaiv ua lus, coj los sib Iab liam--ces yus
los tsua zoo kiag li cov neeg ntawd lawm xwb.
xws li kuv ib txwm hais os, yog kuv tsi tau ua muaj mas txawm yuav cem
kuv npaum li neeg hais rau kuv hauv SCH no los kuv "luag ntxhi kiag 3
suab rau xwb" vim kuv paub zoo hais tias, vim yog nws tsi nyob yus ib
level lawm--koj mus tham ntau los, yeej tsi sib nkagsiab thiab tsi
tostaub yus txoj kev xav. yog yuav sib "Tshum" lus li peb Hmoob/Moob
niaj hnub ua no xwb mas, kuv tos tsi nyoo koj hais ib los lus, koj tos
tsi nyoo kuv hais ib los lus..yeej yuav ua kom "Lajkas dhi" xwb mas
thiaj li zoo yus lub siab. tej no, peb tuaj txog rau roojteb no lawm,
peb puas tau paubtab meej meej txog hais tias, tej niag lus gossips
no, tsua yog tham tom havnyom thiab tshavpuam xwb--nothing li hais no
will work under the rule of laws. yog thaum peb nkagsiab li no lawm,
peb thiaj li tsi chim chim siab thiab mob mob siab--yog thaum peb
tivthaiv peb tuskheej heev heev mas, zoo li yog peb yeej tau ua lawm
tiag, es lam hais ciaj hais tuag kom tag lus xwb. yog li no, peb
txhob xyaum ua li no lawm, peb haivneeg thiaj li yuav zoo tau...
vim peb twb prove hais tias, LVTLTYM cov lus no yog lus cuav, lus tsi
muaj povthawj ua tshwjxeeb--tej neeg ruamqauj xwb thiaj li ntseeg no.
peb kuj cia li lawm los pob, koj puas xav li thiab? ua li kuv hais
rau kuv tus Yawmyij nad, nws hais tias, dablaug koj puas tau hnov tus
neeg hais lus tawm hauv xovtooj cua hmong/lao radio ua yog LVTLTYM
hais, nws kaws tau cov lus rau cassette tibsis es yuav tso rau kuv
mloog no....kuv hais ib los lus xwb--kuv tus Yawmyij ua twjywm thiab
tsum kiag lawm......LOL! kuv hais rau hais tias, tsua yog tej neeg
ruam thiab tsi paubtab thiaj li ntseeg tej niag lus hais tsi muaj
povthawj thiab tshwjxeeb li no, luag cov neeg ntse, mloog kiag tagnrho
xwb--luag twg luagntxhi hais tias--twb tuaj kawm tau 30 xyoo no lawm
es tseem muaj tus ruam npaum li cas nyob rau hauv hmoob lub neej lawm
thiab....LOL?
thanks,
Born2beHmong
Hmong-Lao
I believe the "Lauj Vaj Tsab Lis Thoj Yaj Muas" tape is a trap. Many
people including the Hmong Lao Radio, Hmong Mojthem Radio and GVP are
trapped and now your family will also be. I don't think for a bit that
GVP has an intention to destroy you family's reputations. You might
have to ask yourself, what do you have as a thread to GVP today? Why
should he has to make this tape up to destroy other's reputations
while he is the most honorable Hmong leader today and those people
that he accused are ordinary Hmong, and could make him more stronger
if he has good relation with them?
Please calm down and think twice before you put all these ugly things
up on the radio. This will not solve your problems but will worsen
your relationship with GVP and his followers. An honest suggestion
from Hmong-Lao, your friend in cyberspace. (Note: I am not closely
related to GVP's family nor yours other than Hmoob neej Hmoob tsav)
HL
Hmong-Lao
Ua tsaug os phooj ywg Moobsib. Kuv lam hais li qhov kuv ntseeg xwb,
xyov puas muaj tseeb. Tej zaum yog kuv saib movie Suav heev dhau lawm
es kuv thiaj xav tau li no xwb.
HL
mua...@yahoo.com
Tseemyeej,
Zamnplooj Yaaj ( he was a teenage at the time they have been
arrested ) and his father have been arrested and put in jail in
Phakhao but his father has been excuted, who ordered the genocide in
6--63 in Phakhao and kill his father we don't know?. Zamnplooj Yaaj
has been released and lived with Col. Soua Yang. Later he became a
soldier and served under Army Region 2 commanded by GVP. He was a
military trainer and served at Military Training Camp in Long Cheng
and Mouangcha back in 1971-73. After the M-18 mind hit the Lo family
in Mouangcha, 1973 or 1974, he and his family left, escaped, with
the Lo families to the Comminist Territory. After the country fall,
maybe 1981, his family escaped and crossed Mekong river to Thailand
but he was voluntarily joined the Chaofa group to go to China. After
the trip to China he decided to come to U.S as a ordinary Hmong/Mong
refugee. Now he is living with his family in NC.
Yang Chao ( Txos Yaaj ) refused and argued with GVP's order to go to
the battle field. Then GVP ordered to kill him but he managed to
escape with out harm.
MT
tseemyeej
Listening to that cassette, it tells that vp will never stop having
illusions. At his age, he still keeps trying to create momentum for
his restless obsessions. Promotions, powers and wealths are among his
thirst. This type of ambition is his life style, as he had stated in
the past:- " Raug ib phom tau nce ib lub xaab (rank). Phom thiab
mostxwv thiaj yog txoj kev muaj yeej". In his real life, he feared no
death and has no mercy to it; many of his own clan members, many of
his own friends, many thousands of his p.o.w had perished in his
hands, he shows no remorse. He is a blood thirster, lives have no
meaning for him, only ambition rules his world. This vp doesn't live
in the world of reality anymore, he is a sick man. Our family had
became the punching bag for vp to relieve his pain, his anger, his
defeat. We are his habitual scapegoat. Some of Hmong in the U.S,
including ill intellectuals, are so brainwashed, they can't figure out
why are we so hated.
This time, he has used us again to extend his propaganda to the other
side of the world, we are vp's imaginary ennemy. He wants himself to
be recognized as the only hmong hope. He is supposed to be hmong
immortal idol, their perfect role model. We are the black sheep of
hmong society, period. Some people are so ill, they won't accept any
further explanation to justify the fact. There is nothing we can do,
let's accept that as a temporay fact. Yeah, we are the black sheep who
holds a GOOD DECK of CARDS, the cards of TRUTH and REALITY.
After I have received 4 dead threat calls, I believe that vp has just
waken me up to be a real MAN. I have figured out that, as long as I am
a strong believer in faith, I will be in good hands, the MAN above
will always watch me. I believe that when the time comes, justices
will always be served. We should give chance to truth, faith, peace
and justice like little David who had defeated mighty Goliath, who
knows? Waiting for that moment, we should not KOWTOW to any ILL
DICTATOR. Where ever crimes occured, justices will always be served.
We are holding a GOOD DECK of CARDS, the cards of TRUTH and REALITY.
My nephew, let him promote hatred, some day, when the cloud is lifted,
the sky will be clear, we will see them people slashing each other's
throat, vp has cloned too many monsters.
TseemYeej.
Tshaj...@gmail.com
Cov phoojywg!!!!!, zooli nej cov tham lus no, ib cov mas muaj teebmeem
loj rau cov lus sibtham no, muaj ib cov mas, tseem ua si ua dog ua dig
li cov me nyuam yau, ho muaj ib cov mus xav tuaj saib nej hais txog
dabtsi xwb!!!. Kuv saib mas yog nej to taub mas peb tshuas tus yeej
tsis tau txo peb tshuatus lub hwjchim li es, tos peb nyob puag
suavteb, lostsuasteb, thaibteb thiab meskas teb no los peb mus tsis
txog twg li, vim peb muaj cov cwjpwm tsis kam sibhwm li no. Muaj nej
cov tswvyim uas thaum nej muaj mus dag kom nej cov pojniam los yuav
nej i los mus ua ib yam luam rau peb haiv hmoob seb peb puas muaj
nyiaj los mas, cas yuav siv nej cov sijhawm tuaj mus hais ub hais no,
kom lwm tus mob siab li.
Uatsaug, Tshajplaws
Tshaj...@gmail.com
Cov kwv, uas nej tuaj tham lus nyob rau hauv no, kuv xav kom nej hais
cov lus zoo nkauj es lwm tus tsis tau paub peb cov lus zoo zoo los
lawv ho coj mus kawm tau, thiab tsis tas li no los peb haivhmoob tsawg
tsawg li, tuaj tau tsawg tus xwb, leej twg hais tau siab leejtwg lawm
los tsuas hais rau paub xwb, ho tus tau hais los kom txo nws lub
hwjchim thiab es, peb haiv hmoob nyob txog twg los pheej ua lino, mus
tag ib tiam dau ib tiam li no, xwb ces qhov peb yuav muaj neej zoo
nrog ntiajteb ua ces yog tsawg xwb nawb.
ua tsaug, kuv yog Tshajplaws
Tou...@asianavenue.com
The four death threats you received are correlated to the "Lauj Vaj
Tsab Lis Thoj Vaj Muas" cassette which GVP endorsed and played a part
in. All these years no one has done anything egregious to you or any
one of the uncles/fathers until now that's why we cannot just "let it
go."
Like my father said to you, "yog lawv heev txaus kov lawv tuaj loo. "
You haven't done anything wrong. Don't worry about anybody or any law.
My father's getting up there with age, but he's still mentally tough.
I still remember well 10 years ago in 1997 when my younger brother Cai
and cousin Ntho Moo, your two nephews, were stabbed by three Lao guys
(who have the support of Viets) for being involved in a dispute (which
they had no direct part in), it was my dad who told us not to be
afraid. When very few Hmong in the community (and you know our number
is little) would physically and morally support us against a much
larger number of Lao and Viets my father, in his 60's, showed courage.
He picked up his 12 gauge and and stood by us. We didn't accept his
participation, but heeded his message. And he's right. Why back down
when somebody has injured you for something you're innocent of? The
only logical course was to get even. Hence Txiv Pos's son, NujSisLoob,
and I went to pay a visit to the Lao guys. We were few. We were young.
We were unsure. But we had to do what we had to do. When we caught one
of the guys we let him know through our fists that he and his friends'
violation won't go unanswered. Never heard them talk low about Hmong
or threatening to harm any community member again.
Stay strong and know that you have many sons and nephews.
Nephew Tou Ly
Tshaj...@gmail.com
cov phoojywg yog nej sibtham no, tsis txhob tham ua dog ua dig, es
muab nej cov tswvyim zoo los mus hais tias peb yuav ua licas es thiaj
yuav yeej no xwb, kuv pom nej cov kwv tuaj hais lus no, mas zoo li sib
cav hom tsis zomzem li.
kuv yog tijlaug Tshajjplaws
tseemyeej
On May 29, 10:07 pm, Tshajpl...@gmail.com wrote:
> cov phoojywg yog nej sibtham no, tsis txhob tham ua dog ua dig, es
> muab nej cov tswvyim zoo los mus hais tias peb yuav ua licas es thiaj
Yog koj xav kawm tswv yim ces cia kuv qhia ib zag pub koj nawb. Thaum
twg txiv fuabtais vp lam nrog menyuam yaus li kuv sib ceg lawm ces
txhais tau hais tias kuv sawv txij nkaus vp lawm ntag nawb.
Txij no rov tod ces, nej yuav pom tias vp thiab kuv wb yog ruam los
ruam tib yam hos ntse los ntse tib yam ntag nawb.
TseemYeej.
Hmon...@yahoo.com
CALLING FOR THE MOBILIZATION OF OUR HMONG PEOPLE
THE PROFANATION OF THE SEPULTURE OF OUR FELLOW HMONG IN THAILAND
Our ways of protesting:
I intend to go alone to demonstrate, eat, sleep, live and to protest
in front of the residence of the ex-prime minister of Thailand
THAKSIN
SHINNAWATT in London, in England.
Why am I going alone? I don't want to disturb the law and order and
I
will, of course, have all the necessary authorisation to
demonstrate...
(at this stage, it is not the number that counts but the act in
itself
and
its principle)
Our actions for justice
To put all the demands for an investigation
(such as lodging a complaint or a demand for an investigation)
- to the justice of Thailand
- to the justice of England
( ask for the cancellation of Thaksin's tourist visa )
- to the A.S.E.A.N
- to the EUROPENNE UNION COMMUNAUTY
- to the UNITED NATION ORGANISATION. etc...
We demand
- that all the institutions condemn those profanation
- that Thailand recognizes their act of profanation and ask for
pardon
- that Thailand authorize the creation of a funeral monument
- that such acts won't happen to anyone in the future
we ask for your support
We need financial help for the lawyer's and logistic' s fees.
All other kind of help are welcome.
HELP US BY PARTICIPATING IN OUR ACTIONS AND BY GIVING FUNDS TO OUR
ASSOCIATION
F I D H - PEUPLE HMONG
7 RESIDENCE DES CEDRES 11150 VILLESICLES FRANCE
TEL:(33) (0) 6 28 43 96 42 HMONGFIDH @YAHOO.COM
CREDIT AGRICOLE 11006 93020 52107951385 84
IBAN ETRANGER FR76 1100 6930 2052 1079 5138 584 BIC
AGRIFRPP 810
APPEL A LA MOBILISATION GENERALE DE NOTRE PEUPLE HMONG
LA PROFANATION DES SEPULTURES DE NOS COMPATRIOTES HMONG EN THAILANDE
Nos actions de protestations :
Je compte aller tout seul manifester , manger, dormir , vivre et
protester devant le domicile de l'ex-premier ministre thaïlandais
THAKSIN SHINNAWATT à Londres, en Angleterre.
Pourquoi tout seul... pour ne pas troubler l'ordre public, et bien
sur
avec toutes les autorisations nécessaires pour manifester ( à ce
stade, ce n'est pas le nombre qui compte mais l'acte en lui-même et
son principe).
Nos actions auprès de la justice :
introduire des demandes de mise en examen
( tels que porter plainte ou demande de mise en examen. )
1 auprès de la justice thaïlandaise
2 auprès de la justice a n g la i s e
(demande d'annulation du visa touristique de THAKSIN. S )
3 auprès de l'A.S.E.A.N
4 auprès de l'ORG UNION EUROPEENNE
5 auprès de l'ORG DES NATION UNIS. etc
nos revendications :
6 que les instances internationales condamnent les profanations.
7 que la thaïlande reconnaisse les actes de profanations et
demande
pardon.
8 que la thaïlande autorise la création d 'un monument funéraire.
9 que plus jamais de tels actes ne se reproduisent dans le
futures.
Nos demandes de soutien :
Nous avons besoin notamment d'un soutien financier pour les
frais d'avocat et frais logistiques. Toute forme d'aide et
toutes
les bonnes volontés sont les bienvenue.
AIDEZ NOUS EN PARTICIPANT A NOS ACTIONS ET EN FAISANT
DES DONS A NOTRE ASSOCIATION
F I D H - PEUPLE HMONG
7 RESIDENCE DES CEDRES 11150 VILLESICLES FRANCE
TEL (33) (0) 6 28 43 96 42 HMONGFIDH @ YAHOO.COM
CREDIT AGRICOLE 11006 93020 52107951385 84
IBAN ETRANGER FR76 1100 6930 2052 1079 5138 584 BIC
AGRIFRPP 810
NQUA HU PEJ XEEM HMOOB SAWV DAWS SAWV SIB PAB, TXOJ KEV CAIJ TSUJ
HMOOB NYOB THAIB TEB TEJ TOJ NTXAS THIAB NTSUJ PLIG, RAUG TSEEM
FWV
THAIB TSO NEEG TUAJ RHUAV TSHEM HLA TXOJ CAI NYOB HAUV NTIAJ
TEB.
Lub hom phiaj uas peb tsis txaus siab.
Kuv yog ib tug uas yuav mus leg txoj hauj lwm ntawm thawj pw tsav
thaib qub yawg THAKSIN SHINNAWATH uas nyob hauv tuam ceeb
nroog Londres Askiv teb chaws.
Qhov uas peb tsis txaus siab peb thiaj thov
mus hais tom tsev txiav txim,muaj li nram no.
Peb thov kom muab tso rau txoj cai ntsuam xyuas thiab txiav txim.
1. Mus hais hauv thaib txoj kev ncaj ncees.
2. Mus hais hauv Askiv txoj kev ncaj ncees.
(Thiab thov kom Askiv txhob tso cai rau yawg THAKSIN
SHINNAWATH tuaj nyob Askiv lub teb chaws )
3. Mus hais hauv txoj cai ncaj ncees ............ A .S.E.A.N.
4. Mus hais hauv lub rooj ncauj lus..... ( Union Européen )
5. Mus hais hauv lub rooj ncauj lus hauv ntiaj teb ( ONU )
6. Thiab txuas txuas ntxiv mus.
Qhov uas peb xav tau
1. Thov kom ntiaj teb tig los nrog pom, thiab rau txim txhob
pub thaib ua ntxiv lawm.
2. Kom thaib lees paub txoj kev tsim txom cov neeg tuag
cev nqaij daim tawv thiab ntsuj plig.
3.Thov lub teb chaws thaib tso cai rau peb hmoob mus ua
lub tsev tso plig rau cov neeg tuag nyob thaib teb.
Peb thov kev pab rau txoj kev siv.
1. Cov tub tuav cai ............ ( Avocat thiab Logistiques ).
2. Txhua txhia yam kev pab, peb zoo siab txais tas nrho.
F I D H - PEUPLE HMONG
7 RESIDENCE DES CEDRES 11150 VILLESICLES FRANCE
TEL (33) (0) 6 28 43 96 42 HMONGFIDH @ YAHOO.COM
CREDIT AGRICOLE 11006 93020 52107951385 84
IBAN ETRANGER FR 76 1100 6930 2052 1079 5138 584 BIC
AGRIFRPP 810
Tubcajceszoo
Tus yawg nej hais ntawv cov lus txawm tias hais qhuas Vp los , muaj
tej lo lus yeej tseem ceeb heev rau haiv hmoob.
Peb haiv hmoob mas txawm yuav yog tus txawj thiab ntse los yeej muaj
siab phem ua ntu zus los lawm, zaum no peb hmoob pawg sib ntseeg siab
tiag yuav tau siv zog tiag tiag.
Hmoob lub neej ces yuav pib qhov me mus rau qhov loj, sawv daws yuav
tau kom lub hom phiaj mus li txoj kev npau suav thiab txoj hmoo uas
yog tus tswv ntuj yuav pom thiab muab rau peb lawm xwb.
Kuv thov kom nej txhua tus hmoob txhob hais lus phem thuam peb haiv
hmoob lawm mog.
Tub caj ces zoo
Moobsib
Txhob thovx luas, yug pib ua ntej ntaag mas txhaj le yog. Yug yog ib
tug nav kaasmoos yuav tau khu yug ua ntej tshaaj plawg..
MS
Tou...@asianavenue.com
> is tsavfoom lis a little kid that can be 'ntxais'? could you elaborate why
> GVP would want to overtake his store?
Zhen and others,
In light of the recent arrest of the former General Vang Pao over the
plot to overthrow the LPDR you can infer for yourselves why he and Vam
Ntxawg Vaj wanted TsamFoom Lis' store. Funds to buy arms and run the
military operation?
Now it makes sense and is evident why the "Lauj Vaj Tsab Lis Thoj Yaj
Muas" audio recording appeared. The agendas are these:
1) Malice on the PajTsab children using the HinHeup Incident since one
of their members, TsavFoom Lis, didn't given in on VP's intermediary's
demand.
2) Blame and discredit the Lis' who are VP's percieved enemies (Well
some are real whereas others are not, but this is because he caused it
to go that way. They were never his enemies to begin with until he
attacked them).
3) Generate moral outrage against the LPDR.
4) Garner support, mobolize and recruit Hmong as soldiers.
It would be interesting to see if the FBI actually uncovered
ancilliary information in their "Coup" investigation which would show
that VP and some of his associates made up the LVTLTYM propaganda to
garner support.
Personally I feel bad for VP today. He had a noble cause back in the
60's and 70's, but he used the wrong methods to achieve it. He
attacked and called anybody, such as Lyteck, who dissented against his
views and tactics a "communist traitor." He made foes out of people
who could've (and wanted to) helped him fight the Hmong fight. And
after 32 years he still uses the same tricks as he did back in Laos.
Had he approached TsavFoom Lis and the PajTsab's differently they
could've forged something beneficial. Instead they are left attacking
one another today. Let it be known that VP drew first blood.
Tou Ly
> on your point on the HinHeup bridge massacre: how come your theoretical
> reconstruction of the events go against multiple eyewitness testimonies?
> are you saying that they also have an agenda against your family? i think
> you will have to not only discredit GVP but also Path Lao Hmong and
> Pro-democracy Hmong too.
>
> furthermore, were you there during the massacre? or are you basing your
> reconstruction based on biased accounts? by biased accounts, i mean those
> who would speak of lyteck favorably. have you interviewed one person who
> experienced that tragedy that said it was not lyteck? if so, could you
> give me a name?
>
> i think you are wildly spraying your counter-attacks against all and
> anyone who would say lyteck was responsible. why would so many people on
> all sides conspire collectively against your family? do you mean to say
> they just don't like your family and even go so far as to say the hate
> your family to the point of spreading false statements to destroy your
> family?
>
> i think if you mean the above, that seems to be paranoia.
>
> please don't take my comments personally. i too want to get to the bottom
> of this tragedy. but everytime you bring it up, you seem to group anyone
> who would state lyteck's responsiblity on the massacre into the category
> 'they don't like my family' or 'they want to destroy my family'.
zhen
i believe your remarks about the store is expo facto. as you stated
about YOB, it seems you are taking aim at GVP during his time of
turmoil to advance your allegations. it would have made a significant
difference upon the credibility of the reasons why and your own
character had you presented this speculation earlier rather than now.
it is NOT evident, as you claimed, that one (GVP trying to take over
the store, as you claim) is necessarily related to the other (the
charged conspiracies).
my question to you is can your family co-exist with anyone who has
offended your family? you exist in this world with so many hmong and
other people. do you need to air your personal dirty laundry on the
national and international political stage (i have yet to hear any
reason from you why Hmong people should care about your personal
problems or how your personal problems with GVP have mattered for
Hmong people and history)? what good can come about with you
constantly attacking GVP directly about personal matters to the hmong
people (especially when we do not directly observe GVP reciprocating)?
from studying hmong history in the last 100 years, i think the lyfoung
and lobliayao personal problems were much more serious than your
alleged problems with GVP. yet, lyfoung and lobliayao posterity still
managed to live with one another (although many western authors would
have you believe otherwise) and maintain the class and taste to not
speak ill of one another. i can tell that the PajTsab family is very
retaliatory, to say to the least.
many great leaders and thinkers in history have been arrested. it is
too soon to say anything conclusive. as many sch'ers have speculated,
this could be a good thing and possibly the best thing ever for the
hmong people in the new mellinium. i do not feel bad for GVP. i
continue to be proud of GVP. who else can do what GVP does for the
hmong people?
if the PajTsab family is truly looking for reconciliation and
something beneficial for hmong people, i am willing to give your
family the benefit of the doubt to be the better man, abandon personal
differences, and reach out to other leaders including GVP. i think
this is the best option for your family, in my opinion, rather than
continue on this defensive path of protecting your family's legacy---a
legacy, good or bad, that i think did not matter all that much in the
big picture---at the imaginary expense of others. if you disagree, i
would save my pity for myself if i were you.
respectfully,
zhen.
dony
>
> - Show quoted text -
Tou,
Qhov koj muab lub Asia Super Market los hais no koj puas tau muab los
xav kom tog tog lawm los tsis tau? Peb yog ib tsob Hmoob thiab yog
neej yog tsav thiab yog cov hluas paub tab peb yuav tau mam xav mam
hais......
tseemyeej
On Jun 5, 6:26 pm, dony <phiaj...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> Tou,
> Qhov koj muab lub Asia Super Market los hais no koj puas tau muab los
> xav kom tog tog lawm los tsis tau? Peb yog ib tsob Hmoob thiab yog
> neej yog tsav thiab yog cov hluas paub tab peb yuav tau mam xav mam
Koj tham txog hmoob neej hmoob tsav mas koj twb nyob nram Fresno ko
koj kuj mus nug kiag Dan thiab VamNtxawg nkawd xwb las mas. Nug seb
yog vim li cas Dan thiab VamNtxawg nkawd thiaj tsov tes plau lawm xwb.
Koj nug tau tseeb no ho qhia pub peb cov SCHers paub thiab nawb. Hais
txog vp rooj plaub mas kuv tsis muaj comment li nawb.
TseemYeej.
Tou...@asianavenue.com
I certainly do disagree.
I won't pity myself and you don't need to pity me either. But I do
pity those that can't see VP's wrong doings for whatever reasons. This
says more about their characters rather than my timing.
You do realize that I posted this retort to GVP on May 24th, 2007,
before I learnt about his arrrest on June 4th, 2007 right? And you do
know that I said VP wanted to acquire TsavFoom's store in the
introductory paragraph too, right? And you don't recall that I said I
was going to expand my thread (I just haven't done so yet)?
Furthermore you asked that I elaborate as to why VP would
"ntxais" [ntxias] to take over the store? ...I resent you saying I'm
being like YOB here.
We already knew that he and his people made up the character and story
of LVTLTYM to further their agendas. His arrest only further confirms
that he wanted TsamFoom Lis' store for a "cetain usage." And now the
motive is exposed. And yet despite this you continue to deny and
minimize GVP's underhanded tactics. If he needed the store to run
"business" he should've approached it differently. Instead when he
didn't get his way he went out to smear people. Do you think this is
fair? The 4 death threats Lis Tub recieved are definitely correlated
to the "PathetLao LVTLTYM's" propoganda. I'm letting the word out. If
you find it mundane, don't read.
There was a time not too long ago when the PajTsab were in a
reconcialotry mood with VP. I still recall my father saying that if he
and VP ever meet again they would hug one another. But that chance is
over now due to VP's radio stunt.... But who knows. Oneday when he
realizes and acknowledges his offences and apologizes the PajTsab are
soon to forget and can be quite accomodating also.
Respectfully also,
Tou Ly
kwv...@aol.com
luam ua cas tseem mus tham li koj nas. "acquire" no txhais li cas
nas. "acquire" mas raws li kuv tus laus no paub mas tsis yog "steal"
laiv.
in american business, only two things can happen under acquisition.
1. you owe them a lot of money
2. they simply buy it from you.
nws zoo li no xwb es tseem ho hais tias muaj teeb meem thiab no. yog
li koj kuj piav qhov teeb meem tuaj rau peb mloog los mas tus hluas.
koj tus uncle twb tsis paub txog thiab nes vim nws twb tsis los teb
thiab.