Dab noj hli
Hmoob1
txiaszias
> What would the Hmong back in Laos do about this situation?
The Hmong will shoot at the sky!!! Perhaps, the Hmong might forces
their shaman to do the NEEB ritual, too.
txiaszias
Neeb
- lots of zom zeb
- lots of kaus yias
- lots of shooting to the sky
- lots of khob qab lauj kaub thiab raj xyooj rau dej
- and...ib tuag txhom ib tuag lij qhov tso - maybe?
Hmoob1
I won't try to come up with a better name for the total eclipse of the
moon. "Dab noj hli" is quite appropriate as a name. In fact, I think
it's a beautiful figurative sign for this purpose. But I wonder if the
Hmong hunters and soldiers back there realize the range of their
rifles.
Lajntxiag
during their times, Hmong do realize the shooting-range of their
rifles.
But, I think the loud noises, bodily movements, the gathering of
entire villages, etc., rather than the projectiles or objects used,
are central to this ritual [unless somebody wants to contest the use
of the word 'ritual']. There's at least one commonly held belief
among some Hmong individuals that, "dab"* can only hear, not see [in
broad daylight]. So, to some of these people, yuav kom "dab" ceeb
thiab tsum es txhob noj hli, mas Hmoob yuav tsum tau ua lom vab-vab
kom nrov pig pig poog poog--similar to mass demonstrations or public
protests against the government, only in this case, against the "dab"
that's "eating the moon."
From my observations, the word/concept of "dab" is perhaps one of the
most widely misused and misunderstood words/concepts. I have seen it
been exploited by both Christians and non-Christians; by shamans and
priests; by Hmong and non-Hmong; students and scholars. Just to give
one example: There was at least one minor "movement" in a small city
in California to eliminate the word "dab laug," [uncle] from the Hmong
vocabulary. Proponents of this minor movement came up with the
argument that the use of the word "dab" in 'dab laug,' is a violation
of "their" Christian doctrines...or, as some of them would say, "Vaj
Tswv tsis pom zoo rau siv lo lus ntawd."
...Well, let's save that discussion for another day.
--Lajntxiag
Hmo...@hotmail.com (Hmoob1) wrote in message news:<736de6b.03051...@posting.google.com>...
Neeb
(non-scientific sense). When tsov tom ib tus neeg, the whole
villagers would do the same - zom zeb, tuav cos, kaus qab yiag, qab
lauj kaub, shooting at the air as they chase the tsov, and etc. Why
all this? They want to find the body without tsov have consumed it
all. Hmong didn't want dab to consume the whole hli either.
n
Hmoob1
Very well-said. But I get the clear impression that when the elders
were shooting at the moon, they felt the "dab" and "hli" were just
above the village's mountains. Plus, who is to say that the noises
made or any bombing sounds would hum above the valleys to frighten the
"dab"? Were our elders living with too much superstition? Or perhaps
they were too close to the supernatural?
Neeb,
I see. I see...
Hmoob1
Thomas Lee
kom peb paub hais tias yog vim li cas cov laus thiaj ua li ntawd, peb
yuav tsum tau do a little bit more research. Peb yuav tau tsis txhob
thuam cov laus tias lawv ruam vim peb twb tsis muaj ib tug twg mus
tshawb tau lawv lub keebkwm. Dab noj hli nws zoo ib yam li peb ntseeg
tus xob xwb. Western scientists believe thunder caused by the collide
of cloud forces while we believe it actually caused by someone who
intentionally lights up the match. Which one make more sense? I'll
take the Hmong ways that make more sense to me. I still believe the
Hmong kuamis is sensitive and dangerous without a proper use.
Tom,
nee...@yahoo.com (Neeb) wrote in message news:<64da9ee8.03051...@posting.google.com>...
Lajntxiag
Koj hais yeej yog lawm. Niaj hnub nim no, kuj muaj qee leej tig rov
los tshawb fawb txog Hmoob li kab lis kev cai. Tej yam no yeej pom
tias twb hloov zuj zus ib txheej dhau ib txheej los lawm; yog li mas,
yuav tsis muaj tas txhua yam es yog tseem tseem "pog ua tseg yawm ua
cia" los lawm. Tab sis, txawm yog li ntawd los Hmoob haj tseem tshuav
ntau tsav yam txuj ci, kev xav, thiab kev ntseeg es peb cov tub
ntxhais kawm ntawv tsis tau taug txog.
Vim ziag no muaj coob tus tib neeg lawd txoj kev kawm thiab kev xav
mus raws raim li Meskas-Western txoj xwb, qhov no haj tseem ua rau tej
tug ntawm lawd pom tsis khav thiab tsis dav txog lub tswv yim thiab
tus txheej txheem uas Hmoob tsim thiab yog Hmoob li teej tug ntau tiam
dhau los. Muaj ntau zaug, kuj muaj cov es yog Hmoob kiag tab sis
tseem muab Hmoob li kab lis kev cai txhais yam tsis raug raws li qhov
cov Hmoob feem coob cov laus neeg pom thiab ib txwm siv. Thiab haj
tseem muaj ntau zaug es cov tib neeg no muab Hmoob txuj ci saib yam
tsis rau nqi, muab thuam, los yog muab hais yam saib tsis taus Hmoob
kiag. Qhov no, kuv pom tias vim yog ib txhia tsis muaj kev to taub
zoo, los yog tsis xav rua qhov muag los pom qhov tseeb, txog Hmoob li
txuj ci lawm.
Tib neeg txoj kev ntseeg thiab kev xav ces nyaj yuav tsis muaj leej
twg quab yuam tau lawd kom lawv txhob ntseeg yam nyob nraim hauv lawd
nruab siab. Tiam sis, yog tias thaum lawd muab lawd txoj kev ntseeg
coj los caij tsuj luag lwm leej lwm tus txoj kev ntseeg, qhov no yog
ib yam es txawv tsis deb ntawm txoj kev rhuav tsem kev ncaj ncees.
--Lajntxiag
lis...@lycos.com (Thomas Lee) wrote in message news:<a4647f23.03052...@posting.google.com>...
Lajntxiag
If you were to define superstition, how would you go about doing it?
... Must we label one "religion" supersititious [in order] to call
another rational or logical? And if all forms of religion (sets of
thoughts, beliefs, and practices) involve fragments of superstition,
rationality, and logic, then what do we want to call "scientific
reasoning"? Purely scientific? .. If 'they' lived with "too much
superstition" does that make "us"--Hmong-Americans--any less
superstitious?
Perhaps, some did "feel" close to the "supernatural." But, I suspect
that, for many Hmong during these eras, there is really no separation
of the "supernatural" from the "natural." They are one and the same.
The notion of secular space vs. non-secular space is largely a Western
idea. For some Hmong, the ancestors are always present at all times
and places. And, these ancestors can be called upon, sometimes
through sacrifice, to bring messages to the gods in charge of doing
and undoing the ills against human beings.
--Lajntxiag
Hmo...@hotmail.com (Hmoob1) wrote in message news:<736de6b.03052...@posting.google.com>...
sibtham
> What would the Hmong back in Laos do about this situation?
The earth once was flat and one would get kill for saying that it was
round!
"Dab no hli" was real for me as I could barely remember experience
once. But knowledge of our environment would help us to change our
view.
I imagine that thousand years from know, mankind will look us as
primitive because they has discover that God is truly a creation of
the mind and never exist.
Sibtham
SC
My physics teacher said that he felt that one day man can just look at
an object and make it move with his mind. But he said he was sure he
wouldn't live long enough to see that time.
Maybe you are right. Our distant posterity will have a new way of
looking at God.