Serbs and Bulgarians: A love-hate relationship?
JPhi008
and have in history fought alongside each other and fought against each other.
I wonder what is the overall view of each other? What are the similarities and
the differences? Could it be considered a love-hate relationship?
Thanks from John
Ilya Talev
JPhi008 wrote:
Fought alongside each other? Actually, the Bulgarians
fought, and the Serbs watched them, as was the case in
late 1944 - early 1945. More than 20,000 Bulgarians
dies for the liberation of Yugoslavia. A few memorials
were built, later to be demolished by the Serbs and the
graves of the Bulgarian soldiers buldozed (the biggest
Bulgarian graveyarad was near Kriva Palanka and it is
a nice corn field now).
Abot love-hate? Idiot Bulgarians love the Serbs, and
most of the Serbs hate Bulgarians, as they hate everyone
who is not a Serb.
Stephan Nikolov
> It is understood that Bulgarians and Serbs are closely linked with each other
> and have in history fought alongside each other and fought against each other.
> I wonder what is the overall view of each other? What are the similarities and
> the differences? Could it be considered a love-hate relationship?
> Thanks from John
>
>
Fighting along each other was never really achived: either in the last
century (complete lack of coordination between the Bulgarian planned
uprising in 1876 and the Serbs planning a war against the Ottoman
empire); or in 1944 - 1945 for various reasons.
The war 1912 was kind of alliance against the Turks but the whole unity
thing is somewhat overshadowed by the events from 1913 when the ex-allies
could not divide the conquered lands and it became clear that the Serbs
and the Greeks had their own (secret) ideas, which were rather different
from the ideas of the Bulgarians.Then comes the WWII. For instance, when
the Bulgarian army was advancing westwards via Kriva Palanka (where used
to be a commemoration graveyard for the Bulgarians who died in the fights
-- I wonder how it disappeared !!!), Strazhin and Sracin (monuments now
in ruins), the Serbs
preferred to draw westwards and make sure they will ocupy Croatia before a
new, anti-Nazi Croatian government would emerge and challenge Tito's ideas
for Communist Yugoslavia.
This love hatred scheme really exist to certain degree but while a certain
part of the Bulgarians are ready to compromise over the past for achieving
a modus vivendi for the present and the future, the whole thing is
somewhat overshadowed by the 50-year anti-Bulgarian propaganda in
Yugoslavia (because Macedonia). It must be noted that during communism in
Bulgaria the anti-Yugoslav/Serbian propaganda in Bulgaria never got the
scale and the power of the Serbian/ Makedonist anti-Bulgarian propaganda.
After Tito broke away from the Russians , the Bulgarian propaganda
labelled him with nationalism , revisionism, or whatever, but comparing
the materials in the Serbian media from the 1970's and 1980's with the
Bulgarian media, one will discover that the Bulgarians were strangely
silent about Yugoslavia, while the Serbian anti-Bulgarian stance was
rather upfront.
Very similar is the situation now. Again the Bulgarians speak for
anti-Milosevic actions of the Bulgarian government while the Serbs like
to put Bulgarian pro-Nato policy as a clear product of the longstanding
anti- Serbian attitude of the Bulgarians.
To conclude the attitudes have somewhat failed to reciprocate.
SN
Dimitar Gueorguiev
> J
> Abot love-hate? Idiot Bulgarians love the Serbs, and
> most of the Serbs hate Bulgarians, as they hate everyone
> who is not a Serb.
I don't think that this generalization is correct. For instance, i live with a
serbian roommate and we have never experienced such things as hatred, etc.
Ilya Talev
Dimitar Gueorguiev wrote:
Just wonderful, this is how it should be.
But how about the word "MOST"?
IT
Vassil Mihov
A manifestation of which was the Lepa Brena (a major Serbian pop-star) concert in
1990, and attitudes in BG in general about Serbian pop-folk. (According to the
coverage of the state TV, appropriate for a major news/cultural event, she descended
from a helicopter into the packed and frenzied national stadium). Furthermore, many
Bulgarians fantasized (and probably some still do) about the mythological idea for a
common communist Yugoslavian-Bulgarian state, supposedly drafted by Tito and
Dimitrov.
Vassil
JPhi008
Vassil Mihov
type of "entertainer".
Iordan Iankov
Vassil Mihov wrote in message <3764059F...@mgmt.purdue.edu>...
>No, she is a different one. I don't know Arkan's wife's name, but she is
the same
>type of "entertainer".
>
>JPhi008 wrote:
>
>> Lepa Bena. Is that the same woman married to the war criminal Arkan?
The name of the Arkan's wife is Vesna Zmianatz. But, yes, she is the same
type of "entertainer".
Dimitar Gueorguiev
His wife is the former pop-star Ceca Velikovic - now Raznatovic.
Stephan Nikolov
>
> Vassil Mihov wrote in message <3764059F...@mgmt.purdue.edu>...
> >No, she is a different one. I don't know Arkan's wife's name, but she is
> the same
> >type of "entertainer".
> >
> >JPhi008 wrote:
> >
> >> Lepa Bena. Is that the same woman married to the war criminal Arkan?
>
>
> The name of the Arkan's wife is Vesna Zmianatz. But, yes, she is the same
> type of "entertainer".
>
Tsetsa Velichkovic ... Much worse than lepa Brena i Vesna Zmianac. The
latter at least had the style to appear in Sofia in a chariot :)
SN
Stephan Nikolov
> > Abot love-hate? Idiot Bulgarians love the Serbs,
>
> A manifestation of which was the Lepa Brena (a major Serbian pop-star) concert in
> 1990, and attitudes in BG in general about Serbian pop-folk. (According to the
> coverage of the state TV, appropriate for a major news/cultural event, she descended
> from a helicopter into the packed and frenzied national stadium).
Well, the Serbian music in communist Bulgaria was a substitute of
something that was not there. Now the vacuum is filled with "Chalga" (a
pseudo-folk based music, rather simplistic and easy to listen, completely
lacking meaningful text, but still treating events and features of
every-day reality). Significantly enough, Serbian Lepa Brena -type of
music faded away when Chalga spead in Bulgaria.
Additional factor for the popularity of Brena-Zmianac -type of music was
the fact that they were not tolerated by the communist controlled media,
so the "Sweat - taboo phenomenon also applies.
Thirs reason is that Serbian TV and radio were possible to watch and
listen in Bulgaria, so they would offer something alternative to the
official propaganda in accessible language.
Quite a few factors, I would say, contributed to popularity of that
particular music in Bulgaria in the 1970's and 1980's.
SN
Vassil Mihov
Stephan Nikolov wrote:
> Well, the Serbian music in communist Bulgaria was a substitute of
> something that was not there. Now the vacuum is filled with "Chalga" (a
> pseudo-folk based music, rather simplistic and easy to listen, completely
> lacking meaningful text, but still treating events and features of
> every-day reality). Significantly enough, Serbian Lepa Brena -type of
> music faded away when Chalga spead in Bulgaria.
> Additional factor for the popularity of Brena-Zmianac -type of music was
> the fact that they were not tolerated by the communist controlled media,
> so the "Sweat - taboo phenomenon also applies.
> Thirs reason is that Serbian TV and radio were possible to watch and
> listen in Bulgaria, so they would offer something alternative to the
> official propaganda in accessible language.
>
> Quite a few factors, I would say, contributed to popularity of that
> particular music in Bulgaria in the 1970's and 1980's.
I agree with the offered exlanation, but I do not think these factors fully explain the
reasons for the popularity of Serbian folk in BG. The point remains, why Serbian crap
(pop-folk), but not so much Greek, or even Turkish? While in some regions the Serbian
pop-folk was more popular than in others (same is true for Greek folk-pop), Serbian music
clearly dominated the niche you describe. True, the reach of Serbian TV in Western BG,
and the similarity of our languages definitely contributed to its popularity. (It is an
interesting question, in and of itself, whether the fans of this type of music actually
cared/care about the text of Serbian folk and "Chalga"). On the other hand, I would be
curious to find out whether Serbian folk was popular in Romania, whose (lack of) TV
programming was notorious. Also, while home-made "Chalga" replaced Serbian pop-folk, it
actualy heavily borrowed from its "style", so it sounds like "Srubsko" in Bulgarian.
Still, even when you factor all these (and other possible explanations), I think there is
something idiosyncratic that made many Bulgarians listen to Serbian folk, root for Serbian
soccer teams, etc. Maybe it's the "love-hate" relationship, maybe it's the fact that the
Serbian (Yugoslavian) communism looked sexy to the average person -- a lot less censorship
(at least regarding things not related to politics, like entertainment, or even
pornography, for example), more freedom of movement, relatively liberal currency regime,
so that was probably a way to identify with it, the same way others identified with
Western music.
Vassil
Dimitar Bojantchev
before the age of the mass culture and electronic media, when the
travelling circus represented the primary means of intercultural
exchange, many Bulgarian men fell in love with the notorious Serb
circus actress/entertainer... Before wisdom settled into his brain,
right at the year of 1912, as a young sailor in the new Bulgarian
Navy, my grandfather succumbed to the momentous temptation and had
tattooed her image on his forearm (besides a hefty anchor too) -- a
sin that was never forgiven by my grandma, even after 56 years
together... That, together with other research I've done, comes to
tell me that the common Bulgarian men (excluding some intellectuals
and educated snobs and nerds) have never been particularly resistent
to the bug of some mischivious Serb female entertainer, teasing their
primitive masculine instincts in the most Balkan way of them all...
That's folklor -- do not be condescending. Those who have not read
Kant in school may be slightly limited in their entertainment options...
D.
Stephan Nikolov
On Sun, 13 Jun 1999, Vassil Mihov wrote:
>
> reasons for the popularity of Serbian folk in BG. The point remains, why Serbian crap
> (pop-folk), but not so much Greek, or even Turkish? While in some regions the Serbian
> pop-folk was more popular than in others (same is true for Greek folk-pop), Serbian music
> clearly dominated the niche you describe.
Greek music was popular and again it was the same equivalent. Youy sould
have travelled to the south of Bulgaria and know the people. Attending
weddings in villages is very thoughtprovoking. Then one of the first
eminent "Chalga" singers , so called Popa (from Haskovo, became popular in
1985 to 1988 or 18989) or Ibriam Papazov (in the beginning, again the same
period) in the instrumental section waere very much influenced from
north-east (with strong Turkish flavour) music. This type of foreign music
was clearly predominant in Haskovo, Smoljan, Plovdiv regions.
Greek music has always been popular among the populatioj in the south
Bulgarian Black Sea coast.
True, the reach of Serbian TV in Western BG,
> and the similarity of our languages definitely contributed to its popularity. (It is an
> interesting question, in and of itself, whether the fans of this type of music actually
> cared/care about the text of Serbian folk and "Chalga"). On the other hand, I would be
> curious to find out whether Serbian folk was popular in Romania, whose (lack of) TV
> programming was notorious. Also, while home-made "Chalga" replaced Serbian pop-folk, it
> actualy heavily borrowed from its "style", so it sounds like "Srubsko" in Bulgarian.
>
It is too simplistic. The Serbian element ion Chalga is not that strong.
See, Crystal (originally from Iambol) have some Roma element in their
music. On the other hand, the Serbian music in question is also Roma
influenced (especially Srbezovic, Velichkovic ).
> Still, even when you factor all these (and other possible explanations), I think there is
> something idiosyncratic that made many Bulgarians listen to Serbian folk, root for Serbian
> soccer teams, etc. Maybe it's the "love-hate" relationship, maybe it's the fact that the
> Serbian (Yugoslavian) communism looked sexy to the average person -- a lot less censorship
> (at least regarding things not related to politics, like entertainment, or even
> pornography, for example), more freedom of movement, relatively liberal currency regime,
> so that was probably a way to identify with it, the same way others identified with
> Western music.
>
> Vassil
>
>
Yes, that's what I meant. As for the Rumanians, they watched Bulgarian TV
-- better reception -- even in Bucharest.
SN
>
Iordan Iankov
>> The name of the Arkan's wife is Vesna Zmianatz. But, yes, she is the same
>> type of "entertainer".
>>
>Tsetsa Velichkovic ... Much worse than lepa Brena i Vesna Zmianac. The
>latter at least had the style to appear in Sofia in a chariot :)
>
>SN
>
I am sorry. I have never been competent in these matters :-)
BTW, I can't remember who of the Serbian folk stars attended the wedding of
the Bulgarian "Godfather" - Ivo Karamankski - couple of years ago.
Jordan
p...@nifs.ac.jp
Wolfslang <bf...@endo.com> wrote:
> jph...@aol.com (JPhi008) wrote:
>>It is understood that Bulgarians and Serbs are closely
>>linked with each other and have in history fought
>>alongside each other and fought against each other.
>>I wonder what is the overall view of each other? What
>>are the similarities and the differences? Could it be
>>considered a love-hate relationship?
>> Thanks from John
>
>Serb civilians, it will be years before Bulgarians will be able to
>hold up their heads and look Serbs in the eye.
>
The above is without any sence. The relations between
Bulgarians and Serbs unfortunately have never been good -
and especially in the last hundred years, when - just to
mention - in 1885 Serbian king Milan invaded Bulgaria,
but was defeated, and only the Austro-Hungarian ultimatum
stopped Bulgarian army in Nis; in 1913 Serbian army was
defeated in the Second Balkan War by the Bulgarians, but
the Serbs joined the victors, because of the Romanians,
Turks and Greeks on their side; in 1916 Serbian army was
defeated by Bulgarian and retreated into the Albanian
mountains, from where it was transferred to the Greek
island of Korfu by their allies. After WW I, following
the Neuilly peace treaty, Serbs annexed two quite big
Bulgarian areas (of Tsaribrod and Bosilegrad) and
continue to hold them nowadays. Two weeks ago they have
arrested one of the leaders of Bulgarian minority there -
Dr Marko Shukerov, Chancellor of the Democratic Union of
Bulgarians Living in Yugoslavia. They continue to keep
him in Nis military prison, in spite of the official
protest of the Bulgarian Foreign Affairs Ministry, handed to
the charge d`affairs of the Yugoslav Embassy in Sofia.
The support of NATO actions in Yugoslavia from the
Bulgarian government ought to be expected, as Bulgaria
is a candidate for a full membership of NATO and the EU.
The similarities between Serbs and Bulgarians are
that both nations are predominantly East Orthodox
Christian, and their languages are Slavic ones. But there
are many atheist Bulgarians, Roman Catholic Bulgarians,
and also Muslim Bulgarians, which are not considered as
something different from the others. Also the tensions
with the minorities, living in Bulgaria (especially with
the Muslim Turks) were resolved very cautiously in the
beginning of the 90-es. Nowadays the Turks have the same
rights as the ethnic Bulgarians, and they have abandoned
any ideas about some autonomy, etc.
The difference between Serbs and Bulgarians can be
considered based on the fact, that Bulgarians have
survived a few catastrophes of their national ideal, as
in 1913, when they have lost the predominant part of
Macedonia (formerly given to Bulgaria with the Istanbul
(Constantinople) conference of the Great Powers in 1876,
and the San Stefano Peace Treaty from 1878) to Greece and
Serbia, and Dobrudzha to Romania. Another catastrophe of
the national ideal was the end of WW I, when Bulgaria
lost Aegean Thrace to Greece. Those catastrophes made
Bulgarian more pragmatic and less emotionally motivated.
On the other hand, Serbia was always with the victors in
the last hundred years (in spite of its contribution),
and has gained territory. There was not a single
catharsis, which to sober down the outmost nationalism.
The results are evident. The artificial conglomerate
Yugoslavia (created with force after WW I) was doomed
after the fall of the Berlin wall, as was the artificial
state of Czechoslovakia. But what a big difference -
the peaceful disintegration of Czechoslovakia into the
Czech Republic and Slovakia, which will be again
integrated into the frames of the EU and NATO, and the
silly wars in Yugoslavia following the spirit of the
previous century, which led to destruction, death, and
maybe huge delay in the European integration.
As for the attitude of Bulgarians towards Serbs, I
can claim, that it is a positive one, as for all of
Bulgarian neighbours. A peaceful and prosperious Serbia
and Yugoslavia is more than welcome as Bulgarian western
neighbour.
Regards to all: Plamen Malinov
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Share what you know. Learn what you don't.
petq...@my-deja.com
jph...@aol.com (JPhi008) wrote:
> Lepa Bena. Is that the same woman married to the war criminal Arkan?
ha ha , imagine - the Bosnian muslim Lepa Brena married to Arkan.
Sounds wonderful to be true.
Of course the example bellow is a pure bullshit.
peter
> >A manifestation of which was the Lepa Brena (a major Serbian
pop-star)
> >concert in
> >1990, and attitudes in BG in general about Serbian pop-folk.
(According to
> >the
> >coverage of the state TV, appropriate for a major news/cultural
event, she
> >descended
> >from a helicopter into the packed and frenzied national stadium).
> >Furthermore, many
> >Bulgarians fantasized (and probably some still do) about the
mythological
> >idea for a
> >common communist Yugoslavian-Bulgarian state, supposedly drafted by
Tito and
> >Dimitrov.
> >
> >Vassil
> >
> >
>
>
Vassil Karloukovski
>> Lepa Bena. Is that the same woman married to the war criminal Arkan?
>
>ha ha , imagine - the Bosnian muslim Lepa Brena married to Arkan.
>
>Sounds wonderful to be true.
Lepa Brena is married to a Serbian, isn't she? She also stayed
in Belgrade during the Bosnian conflict and I am not aware of
her being supportive of the Bosnian Muslim side in any way.
Vassil
Nikolay D. Tarkalanov
: the Bulgarian "Godfather" - Ivo Karamankski - ...
Nego maj go pozastreljaha malko s kurshum v glavata neotdavna? Ili gresha?
Vjarno li e, che policiata izbiva mutrite i zastrauvatelite bez sud i
prisuda? (Ili puk im urezhda da se izbivat edin drug?)
Nick
Vassil Mihov
mestonahozhdenieto) i dosazhdali, i nyakakuv izvadil AK47 i izdumkal i nego, i
dvama-trima ot bodigardovete mu. E tova si e to, Kalashnikoff izpod legloto,
a nie tuk diskutirame rezhima na oruzhie v US.
Vassil Mihov
and was quite active durung the anti-Nato concerts. So much for the
bullshit.
Vassil
petq...@my-deja.com wrote:
> In article <19990613152304...@ng-cq1.aol.com>,
> jph...@aol.com (JPhi008) wrote:
> > Lepa Bena. Is that the same woman married to the war criminal Arkan?
>
> ha ha , imagine - the Bosnian muslim Lepa Brena married to Arkan.
>
> Sounds wonderful to be true.
>
> Of course the example bellow is a pure bullshit.
>
> peter
>
Vassil Mihov
>
> Greek music was popular and again it was the same equivalent. Youy sould
> have travelled to the south of Bulgaria and know the people. Attending
> weddings in villages is very thoughtprovoking.
I have. My father is originally from Haskovo region, I grew up in Plovdiv, so I have witnessed
first-hand what you describe. In my grandfather's village, it was a matter of prestige to
invite the most popular folk performers (and some of them were true performers -- "Kanarite",
Kolyo Iliev (Konushenskata grupa) and Ibryama himself), to perform at weddings. Interestingly,
they'd perform all night on Saturday at the village square, where people from the whole village
can enjoy their music, and then the next day they will be up since 5 a.m., performing privately
for the wedding guests. A check for 20,000 leva (for the early 80s this was the black market
price of a new Lada) was quite typical for their services. Still, the popularity of chalga and
greek or turkish pop-folk was not nearly as strong there, as "srubsko" in "shopsko" and in other
regions. That's why I said that "Srubsko" dominated this niche accross the board.
> Then one of the first
> eminent "Chalga" singers , so called Popa (from Haskovo, became popular in
> 1985 to 1988 or 18989)
His artistic name was "Karlovskiyat Pop".
> or Ibriam Papazov
Please do not touch Ibryama :-). He is a true artist, his music has nothing to do with clalga.
He performs true turkish and bulgarian folk music. There are few performers of his magnitude.
Jovko Vaporov
Vassil Mihov <vassil...@mgmt.purdue.edu> schrieb in im Newsbeitrag:
37651947...@mgmt.purdue.edu...
[del]
: > or Ibriam Papazov
:
: Please do not touch Ibryama :-). He is a true artist, his music has
nothing to do with clalga.
: He performs true turkish and bulgarian folk music. There are few
performers of his magnitude.
Ibrjam is simply "THE BEST".
Pomnja kato se javi za pyrvi pyt na Jazz festivala v Ruse. Mnogo se
shashnaha mestnite zvezdi i nai-nakraja dori se opitaha da go poopljujat.
(tipichna narodna cherta) Vypreki vsichko toi vyzplameni publikata.
Nikoga njama da go zabravja toja kontzert.
Jovo
Iordan Iankov
Vassil Mihov wrote in message <37651238...@mgmt.purdue.edu>...
>Az chetoh che bili na nyakakuv kupon v Borovets? (mai gresha
>mestonahozhdenieto) i dosazhdali, i nyakakuv izvadil AK47 i izdumkal i
nego, i
>dvama-trima ot bodigardovete mu
Dokolkoto znam e ubit ot svoj bodigard na kupon v Simeonovo. Razbira se s
AK-47 :-)
Jordan
Stephan Nikolov
On Mon, 14 Jun 1999 petq...@my-deja.com wrote:
> In article <19990613152304...@ng-cq1.aol.com>,
> jph...@aol.com (JPhi008) wrote:
> > Lepa Bena. Is that the same woman married to the war criminal Arkan?
>
> ha ha , imagine - the Bosnian muslim Lepa Brena married to Arkan.
>
> Sounds wonderful to be true.
>
> Of course the example bellow is a pure bullshit.
>
> peter
>
A bre momko, shto ne spresh da se izhvyrljash po suhite pjasaci na USENET.
Lepa Brena is not a Bosnian Muslim. Moreover, she's married for a Serb.
She's citizen of Serbia / Yugoslavia nand attended the liturgy of
Patriarch Pavle for Peace during the NATO bombings. The Sebian TV showed
her with a candle .
SN
Nikolay D. Tarkalanov
popular folk performers (and some of them were true performers --
"Kanarite", : Kolyo Iliev (Konushenskata grupa) and Ibryama himself), to
Kanarite sa naj-golemite skapanjaci. Slushah im edna kaseta i mi
se priplaka. To pulno s prostotii:
Mariika i Ivancho:
"Abe Ivancho shto si tolkoz budala
Tui ne stava bez pari
deto si go mislish ti"
: > Then one of the first
: > eminent "Chalga" singers , so called Popa (from Haskovo, became popular in
: > 1985 to 1988 or 18989)
: His artistic name was "Karlovskiyat Pop".
Chuval sum za Hisarskija pop. I Karlovski pop li ima?
Niki
Vassil Mihov
> se priplaka. To pulno s prostotii:
>
> Mariika i Ivancho:
>
> "Abe Ivancho shto si tolkoz budala
> Tui ne stava bez pari
> deto si go mislish ti"
Veroyatno, az mnogo ne razbiram ot folk-chalga. Vse pak mi se struva cvhe tova
shte da e nova kaseta, a ne ot 80-te.
>
>
> : > Then one of the first
> : > eminent "Chalga" singers , so called Popa (from Haskovo, became popular in
> : > 1985 to 1988 or 18989)
>
> : His artistic name was "Karlovskiyat Pop".
>
> Chuval sum za Hisarskija pop. I Karlovski pop li ima?
A be sushtoiya e, mai az burkam. To Hisar-Karlovo e edin hvirlei, mai za tova sum
se oburkal
>
>
> Niki
GS
Vassil Karloukovski <e.karlo...@uea.ac.uk> wrote in message
news:7k2nut$gga$2...@cpca14.uea.ac.uk...
jph...@aol.com (JPhi008) wrote:
>
> >> Lepa Bena. Is that the same woman married to the war criminal Arkan?
> >
> >ha ha , imagine - the Bosnian muslim Lepa Brena married to Arkan.
> >
> >Sounds wonderful to be true.
>
>
> in Belgrade during the Bosnian conflict and I am not aware of
> her being supportive of the Bosnian Muslim side in any way.
I think she made some statements about not wishing the demise of multiethnic
Yugoslavia along with Emir Kusturica. Duped, of course. Anyone know where
she is today?
>
>
> Vassil
GS
Vassil Mihov <vassil...@mgmt.purdue.edu> wrote in message
news:3764059F...@mgmt.purdue.edu...
> No, she is a different one. I don't know Arkan's wife's name, but she is
the same
> type of "entertainer".
Same type but her voice is not as good. Cece Raznjatovic, currently (after
her marriage to Arkan). If you want to hear her, there are some audio files
on www.bojan.com
>
> JPhi008 wrote:
>
> > Lepa Bena. Is that the same woman married to the war criminal Arkan?
GS
Stephan Nikolov <ou...@sable.ox.ac.uk> wrote in message
news:Pine.OSF.3.95.99061...@sable.ox.ac.uk...
> On Sun, 13 Jun 1999, Iordan Iankov wrote:
>
> >
> > Vassil Mihov wrote in message <3764059F...@mgmt.purdue.edu>...
> > >No, she is a different one. I don't know Arkan's wife's name, but she
is
> > the same
> > >type of "entertainer".
> > >
> > >
> > >> Lepa Bena. Is that the same woman married to the war criminal Arkan?
> >
> >
same
> > type of "entertainer".
> >
> latter at least had the style to appear in Sofia in a chariot :)
Yeah, but Cece looks better in tights
>
> SN
>
GS
Jovko Vaporov <J.Vaporov@*NOSPAM*atrie.de> wrote in message
news:7k37q9$mfr$1...@news10.roka.net...
>
> Vassil Mihov <vassil...@mgmt.purdue.edu> schrieb in im Newsbeitrag:
> 37651947...@mgmt.purdue.edu...
>
> [del]
> : > or Ibriam Papazov
> :
> : Please do not touch Ibryama :-). He is a true artist, his music has
> nothing to do with clalga.
> : He performs true turkish and bulgarian folk music. There are few
> performers of his magnitude.
>
> Ibrjam is simply "THE BEST".
Agreed. Untouchable for wedding music - he almost invented a certain type
of wedding music.
Borislav Simov
[del]
>This love hatred scheme really exist to certain degree but while a certain
>part of the Bulgarians are ready to compromise over the past for achieving
>a modus vivendi for the present and the future, the whole thing is
>somewhat overshadowed by the 50-year anti-Bulgarian propaganda in
>Yugoslavia (because Macedonia). It must be noted that during communism in
>Bulgaria the anti-Yugoslav/Serbian propaganda in Bulgaria never got the
>scale and the power of the Serbian/ Makedonist anti-Bulgarian propaganda.
>After Tito broke away from the Russians , the Bulgarian propaganda
>labelled him with nationalism , revisionism, or whatever, but comparing
>the materials in the Serbian media from the 1970's and 1980's with the
>Bulgarian media, one will discover that the Bulgarians were strangely
-------------------------
>silent about Yugoslavia, while the Serbian anti-Bulgarian stance was
------------------------
>rather upfront.
I do not think it is strange at all. The Russians always courted
Yugoslavia because of its strategic location. The Serbs were arrogant
yet the Soviet Union was willing to swallow the embarassment because
of the Adriatic.
On the other hand, Russians always took Bulgaria for granted. This
is the reason, why Bulgaria could not speak out against Yugoslavia.
For example, even if there was a will (within Bulgarian historians)
to publicise their take on Macedonian history, it had to be subdued
for political reasons.
[del]
>SN
--
Borislav Simov, Graduate Student in Computer Science
Iowa State University, Ames, Iowa, USA
http://www.cs.iastate.edu/~simov/homepage.html