Bangla amar Amma/Ma (Re: transliterated bangla)
Naeem Mohaiemen
Saif Ahmed wrote:
> Is it just me or do other people find transliterated Bangla really
> difficult to read. I've given up on reading long segments because of
> it. Some set of phonetic standards would be great. Any volunteers....
You might want to cross-post on s.c.bengali on this topic.
I have noticed that Calcutta folks vs Bangladesh folks, we seem to be
using a far more geyo/cholitho/rough/slang-mishano bangla, and opar-er
bangla-e besh chandrabindu, more formal, more inflections in brackets,
etc.
Subaltern vs High-falutin'?
Ami oboshhyo dui-nouka-e amar bangla'r bela-e.
--
Naeem Mohaiemen
HBO Interactive Media
Shoumyo Dasgupta
Soumitra Bose wrote:
>
> Poschim Banglai je bangla radio TV te bola hoi ba ja sadharon manush >bole thaken tate ekti shobdoteo proyojoner otirikto chnadrobindu nei .
Thik, tobe Poshchim Bonger keu keu 'hNashi' ar 'hNashpatal' bolen ebong
lekhen. Eta nirbhor korchchey Bangla shikhkhar "quality"-r opor, ebong
baRite bola Bangla-r ghorana-r opor.
Monindrokumar Ghosh-er "Shamoyiki" ebong "Bangla Banan" naame duto boi
aachchey. Tar ektate uni ei chondrobindu-shomoshyar katha ullekh
korechchen. Bolchchen, amra, Purbo-bongiyora, pNaach bolina, boli paach.
Orthat amra, purbo-bongiyora, bhul boli. Kintu kothyo bhashar to ar
bhul/thik hoyna, tai dosh nei. Kintu mushkil hoy lekhar shomoy.
Oi ancholik dhNaach-ta kolome beriye poRe, serious probondho lekhar
shomoyeo.
>Bangladeshi jara NY er kagoje lekha lekhi koren tander modhye sothik >bangla banane
> ekti poripurno lekha khub kom powa jai.
Eta, lojjar shone shwikar korchchi, shotyi. Karon oi ayk-i. Bangla
shikhkhar "quality". Amar naame prokashito ekta lekhateo enra jo-phola
dyan-ni. Amar nijer manuscript dekheo kyano je enra eta bar bar koren,
ke jaane. Hoyto oNder bishshash je amar namer banan-ta jophola-heen howa
uchit.
Dui-Banglar shobar-i Shongskrito EBONG Pharsi eishoth holeo jana uchit.
Eti amar shahoshi prostabona. Prothom bhashati Banglar jonok, tai
byakoron-ta shikhle ei dhoroner bhul hoyna. Dwitiyo bhashati Bangla-ke
bideshi bhashagulir modhye shobcheye beshi shomridhdho korechchey. Karon
eti court language chchilo. ("Arshi, Arshi, amar shwami poRuk
Pharshi"...). Farhad Mazhar tNar kobitay cheshta korchchen resh-take
phiriye anar, eta khub anonder.
> Dhaka theke je shob kagoj
> bar hoi (ja ekhane ashe) tate erokom bhrom er sonkhya khub komii
> peyechi .
Eta thik noy. Dhakar kagojeo, Kolkatar kagojer motoi, prochur prochur
banan bhul. Jonioko borshiyan shompadok ekbar amake bolechchilen je
mudron promad aachche bolei anek protishthito lekhok bNechey gyachchen!
Shoumyo.
Soumitra Bose
Naeem , doya kore erpor theke e dhoroner comment korar age obhidhan
dekhe kotha bola ta onek budhimottar porichoi hobe . Byaktigoto bhabe
amai Poschim bongye jonnmano bangal hoia sotteo bolte pari je Poschim
Banglai je bangla radio TV te bola hoi ba ja sadharon manush bole
ki amader sei shob tothakothito shobdo gulo dekhate paro . Bangladeshi
jara NY er kagoje lekha lekhi koren tander modhye sothik bangla banane
niyomito "Thikana" pathatam , jate se lekha gulo theke bhul banan gulo
bar kore , karon ta bar kora bhishon sohoj. Dhaka theke je shob kagoj
bar hoi (ja ekhane ashe) tate erokom bhrom er sonkhya khub komii
Ami kanghusho shunechi je chandrobindu ta naki 'Hinduani" .Hashbo na
HAnchbo na BAdkormo debo bujhe uthte parini, oboshyo eta tader mukh
thekei shunechi jara ekti sompurno rochona sothik bangali likhte paren
na .Bangladeshe er media er theke onek tai mukto , ekhon ei probasher
media mukto hote chai kina seta proshno. Jai hok parle emon shobdo jodi
pao jekhane proyojoner otirikto chandrobindu byobohar kora hoiechhe
poschim-bongye r bhashai dekhio , badhito thakbo..
In <32D65D...@hbo.com> Naeem Mohaiemen <naeem.m...@hbo.com>
writes:
sayan bhattacharyya
Shoumyo Dasgupta <txd...@silmaril.smeal.psu.edu> wrote:
>
>Thik, tobe Poshchim Bonger keu keu 'hNashi' ar 'hNashpatal' bolen ebong
>lekhen.
I (a ghoTi) pronounce the words as hNashi and hNashpatal, but don't
use the chondrobindu while writing.
My father (another ghoTi) uses the chondrobindu even more liberally
than me (for example, he says "ghNoRa" for horse, "ghNuRi" for kite,
etc). He doesn't use the chondrobindu while writing either.
I think that regional variations in pronunciation are perfectly all
right and should be welcomed. Variety is the spice of life, and
diversity of speech makes a language richer. If speech never varied
or changed, then Bengali would never have evolved at all and we
would have all been speaking Sanskrit today! Surely we don't want
that kind of strait-jacketing of speech.
Soumitra Bose
In <32DA6F...@silmaril.smeal.psu.edu> Shoumyo Dasgupta
<txd...@silmaril.smeal.psu.edu> writes:
>Soumitra Bose wrote:
>>
>> Poschim Banglai je bangla radio TV te bola hoi ba ja sadharon
manush >bole thaken tate ekti shobdoteo proyojoner otirikto
chnadrobindu nei .
>
ebong
>baRite bola Bangla-r ghorana-r opor.
Proshno ta hochhe lekha niye ba maan bangla bola niye . Jara maan
bangla bolen taNder modhye eta hoi na . Shobcheye boro kotha , jodi keu
nijer modhye bole thake , tar byapokota kotodur seta niye sondheo ache
Jemon ami pray 30 ta bochor Dakshin 24 Porgonai boro hoiechhi , kauke
bolte shunini, Medinipur,NAdia,Murshidabad,Bardhaman kono ba uttar
bongyeo bolte shunini. Kothai bola hoi janina.
Purbobangyer lokeder modhye chandrobindu bola hoi na . Mul karon amra
ektu beshi druto kotha shari , tai chandrobindu jatio ongshogulo bad
pore jai. Tobe ami Poshcim banglar kono bangal ke lekhai chandrobindu
bad diye likhte dekhini. Ei NY e eshe dekhchi chandrobindu na lekhata
ekta ritimoto gorber byapar. Otai somosya r udrek kore...
>
>Monindrokumar Ghosh-er "Shamoyiki" ebong "Bangla Banan" naame duto boi
>aachchey. Tar ektate uni ei chondrobindu-shomoshyar katha ullekh
>korechchen. Bolchchen, amra, Purbo-bongiyora, pNaach bolina, boli
paach.
>Orthat amra, purbo-bongiyora, bhul boli. Kintu kothyo bhashar to ar
>bhul/thik hoyna, tai dosh nei. Kintu mushkil hoy lekhar shomoy.
>
>Oi ancholik dhNaach-ta kolome beriye poRe, serious probondho lekhar
>shomoyeo.
>
>>Bangladeshi jara NY er kagoje lekha lekhi koren tander modhye sothik
>bangla banane
>> ekti poripurno lekha khub kom powa jai.
>
>Eta, lojjar shone shwikar korchchi, shotyi. Karon oi ayk-i. Bangla
>shikhkhar "quality". Amar naame prokashito ekta lekhateo enra
jo-phola
>dyan-ni. Amar nijer manuscript dekheo kyano je enra eta bar bar koren,
>ke jaane. Hoyto oNder bishshash je amar namer banan-ta jophola-heen
howa
>uchit.
Joto bar amar naam chapano hoeichhe , totbari bhul . Amake ek shalish
bolechehen "Hindu" naam naki bhalo kore ashe na .Amar naam ta Hindu na
, bangalee .Kono Obangali Bharotiyo to kokhonoi uchharon korte pare na
Moja hochhe Dhakar "Mussalmanera" kintu amar naam kokhono bhul banane
lekhen na , ba kokhono uchharone bhul koren na . Tobe ki NY er
bangladeshiira "onno" bangla shikhechen , taNraoto jotodir jani Dhaka
Chattogram thekei porashuno (ba poralekha - jake amra poshcim banglai
bole thaki "lekhapora") korechen.
>
>Dui-Banglar shobar-i Shongskrito EBONG Pharsi eishoth holeo jana
uchit.
>Eti amar shahoshi prostabona. Prothom bhashati Banglar jonok, tai
>byakoron-ta shikhle ei dhoroner bhul hoyna. Dwitiyo bhashati Bangla-ke
>bideshi bhashagulir modhye shobcheye beshi shomridhdho korechchey.
Karon
>eti court language chchilo. ("Arshi, Arshi, amar shwami poRuk
>Pharshi"...). Farhad Mazhar tNar kobitay cheshta korchchen resh-take
>phiriye anar, eta khub anonder.
Eta ekebare amar moner kotha , prai shobai ke ami boli. Amar dukho
Pharsii Jani na , Songskritoo ekdom bhule gechi . Pharsii amader Matul
Bhasa , Maithili Janani , Sangskrito Amader Ogrojo . Egulo janle koto
bahloi hobe ....
>
>> Dhaka theke je shob kagoj
>> bar hoi (ja ekhane ashe) tate erokom bhrom er sonkhya khub komii
Samir Bhattacharya
Shoumyo likhechhen:
>Soumitra Bose wrote:
>>
>> Poschim Banglai je bangla radio TV te bola hoi ba ja sadharon manush >bole thaken tate ekti shobdoteo proyojoner otirikto chnadrobindu nei .
>Thik, tobe Poshchim Bonger keu keu 'hNashi' ar 'hNashpatal' bolen ebong
>lekhen. Eta nirbhor korchchey Bangla shikhkhar "quality"-r opor, ebong
>baRite bola Bangla-r ghorana-r opor.
Ghorana'r opor likhito bhasha-ki nirbhor kore? Mone hoyna. Ami to
jantum egulor banaane chandrobindu nei. Kintu bolaar shomoye oneke
chandrbindu'r byabohar koren. (Shei karone roman horophe egulo
transliteration-er shomoye "lekhateo" chandrobindu eshe poDbe, bishesh
kore jodi keu kathyo-bhashanujayi translate koren roman horophe. Tobe
shetar kotha ekhane hochhe-na.)
Bangla shikkha'r quality'r tathporjyo-ta bujhlum-na.
>Monindrokumar Ghosh-er "Shamoyiki" ebong "Bangla Banan" naame duto boi
>aachchey. Tar ektate uni ei chondrobindu-shomoshyar katha ullekh
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>korechchen. Bolchchen, amra, Purbo-bongiyora, pNaach bolina, boli paach.
>Orthat amra, purbo-bongiyora, bhul boli. Kintu kothyo bhashar to ar
>bhul/thik hoyna, tai dosh nei. Kintu mushkil hoy lekhar shomoy.
Thik "shomoshya" je kothay keno bujhchhi-na. Kathyo bhasha kobe theke
abar likhito bhasha'r shompurno onugoto hoyechhe?
...
Shubhechha,
Samir
Shoumyo Dasgupta
Samir Bhattacharya wrote:
> Ghorana'r opor likhito bhasha-ki nirbhor kore?
>Mone hoyna. Ami to
> jantum egulor banaane chandrobindu nei. Kintu bolaar shomoye oneke
> chandrbindu'r byabohar koren. (Shei karone roman horophe egulo
> transliteration-er shomoye "lekhateo" chandrobindu eshe poDbe, bishesh
> kore jodi keu kathyo-bhashanujayi translate koren roman horophe. Tobe
> shetar kotha ekhane hochhe-na.)
Apnar proshNo jodi "kora uchit?" hoye thakey, tahole to oboshyoi na.
Apnar proshNo jodi "Korey thakey?" hoy, tahole bolbo, amader obhigyota
onujayi, oboshyoi kore.
Obhigyotar byaparta ami kichchuta to aage boleichchi, orthat dui Banglar
kagoj-potre kimba boipotre kemon bananer herpher dekhechchi. Naamer
katha jodi baad-o diyi, shadharoN Bangla shobder-o bananer tartomyo
dekha jabey nanan jaygaay.
Eta ki lokhkhyo korechchen, dontyo-show-ke dui Bangla miliyei (hoyto
Bangladeshe beshi) "chchaw" lekha hoy ? "Salam" shobdo-tike aneke lekhen
"Chchalam "?"Budhdhibrittir Notun Binyash" naamer ekti oshamanyo
probondho-grontho aachchey, jar lekhoker naam Ahmad Sofa. Boi-er
shironaame kintu lekhoker dwitiyo naam-ti "Chchofa" lekha aachche. Ami
oi banan onujayi bhul poRar por ekjon Bangladeshi bondhu amar uchcharoN
shudhre dilen. Tarpor shikhlam, jehetu Banglar ekti bishaal ongsher
manush "chchaw"-ke "saw" -uchcharoN kore thaken, tai anek khetrei chchaw
ebong dontyo show rodbodol hoye jay. E to matro ekta udahoroN.
Bangla M.A. porikhkhar khatateo ami bohu bohu udahoroN bochchorer por
bochchor dekhechchi jekhane nanarokom banan lekhen shobai, ebong ontoto
ekta boRo ongsher "bhul" bananer "rokompher" hoy ei karoNe je eNra
eibhabe shobdoguli "boley" thaken.
Shutorang, hNya, lekhar shomoye bohu manush-i tnader obhigyotar
shorashori lipyontor koren, eta notun kono katha noy. Ei kothyo bhashar
obhigyotakei bolchchilam "GhoraNa".
>
> Bangla shikkha'r quality'r tathporjyo-ta bujhlum-na.
>
Amader ekekjoner ishkul-jeebon ekek-rokom, griho-shikhkhar obhigyota
(Baba-Ma, tutor, dada/didi ityadi) ekek-rokom, paaTher obhigyota
ekekrokom. Ei tinter dosh-guN je shorashori amader shikhkhar quality-ke
probhabito kore, sheta to maanben ?
Ingreji madhyome jNara poRechchen, tNader shokoler-i hoyto shujog hoyni
bhalo kore byakoroN poRbar;
Shongskrito jNara poRenni, tNader shujog hoyni bohu shobder dhaatu-goto
uthpotti ebong rupantor-er niyom shikhbar;
JNader baba-ma Bangla poRanor dikey temon nojor debar shomoy o gurotto
dyanni, tNara hoyto bangla bhasha-r shikhkha-take khanik-ta tuchcho
korei eshechchen;
Banglay paaThyokromer baire jini jaan-ni, tnar pokhkhe bojha shombhob
noy Jogodish Bhattacharjer Robindronather opor lekha Kobimanoshi
bujhbar, kimba Waliullah-shaheber Lal Shaluk onudhabon korbar,
tai na ?
> >Monindrokumar Ghosh-er "Shamoyiki" ebong "Bangla Banan" naame duto boi
> >aachchey. Tar ektate uni ei chondrobindu-shomoshyar katha ullekh
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> >korechchen. Bolchchen, amra, Purbo-bongiyora, pNaach bolina, boli paach.
> >Orthat amra, purbo-bongiyora, bhul boli. Kintu kothyo bhashar to ar
> >bhul/thik hoyna, tai dosh nei. Kintu mushkil hoy lekhar shomoy.
>
> Thik "shomoshya" je kothay keno bujhchhi-na. Kathyo bhasha kobe theke
> abar likhito bhasha'r shompurno onugoto hoyechhe?
Ta to bolini. Bolechchi ulto-ta. Likhito bhasha anek shomoyei kothyo
bhashar onugoto hoye thaake, ebong sheta shwabhabik.
Shamoyiki, Kolkata Bishwobidyaloyer Banan Shongskar Shomitir 1921-er
ebong 1964-er prostaabona, Dhakar Bangla Academyr ebong Dhaka
Bishshobidyaloyer Bangla bibhager notun bananer khoshRa, egulite anek
gobeshonar por prostab dewa hoyechchey kibhabe kichchu shobder banan
"likhito" howa shuru korechchey uchcharoN-anugo bhabe, ebong tar modhye
kono-konoti ayto guruttwo peye gyachchey, je amader meney nitey hobey
eishob banan.
"ShompurNo" aanugotyer kathao ami bolini. Bolechchi "probhaaber" katha.
Eta Thik je byakoron toiri hoyechchilo ekta shringkhola aanbar jonyo;
kintu lokhkho manusher obhyesher jey shokti, taake to amra upekhkhao
korte parina, tai na ?
Shubhechchay,
Shoumyo.
> Shubhechha,
>
> Samir
Carlos Torrejon
Samir Bhattacharya (s...@hogpa.att.com) wrote:
q
: Shoumyo likhechhen:
:
: >Soumitra Bose wrote:
: >>
: >> Poschim Banglai je bangla radio TV te bola hoi ba ja sadharon manush >bole thaken tate ekti shobdoteo proyojoner otirikto chnadrobindu nei .
:
: >Thik, tobe Poshchim Bonger keu keu 'hNashi' ar 'hNashpatal' bolen ebong
: >lekhen. Eta nirbhor korchchey Bangla shikhkhar "quality"-r opor, ebong
: >baRite bola Bangla-r ghorana-r opor.
: Ghorana'r opor likhito bhasha-ki nirbhor kore? Mone hoyna. Ami to
: jantum egulor banaane chandrobindu nei. Kintu bolaar shomoye oneke
: chandrbindu'r byabohar koren. (Shei karone roman horophe egulo
: transliteration-er shomoye "lekhateo" chandrobindu eshe poDbe, bishesh
: kore jodi keu kathyo-bhashanujayi translate koren roman horophe. Tobe
: shetar kotha ekhane hochhe-na.)
: Bangla shikkha'r quality'r tathporjyo-ta bujhlum-na.
:
:
: >Monindrokumar Ghosh-er "Shamoyiki" ebong "Bangla Banan" naame duto boi
: >aachchey. Tar ektate uni ei chondrobindu-shomoshyar katha ullekh
: ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
: >korechchen. Bolchchen, amra, Purbo-bongiyora, pNaach bolina, boli paach.
: >Orthat amra, purbo-bongiyora, bhul boli. Kintu kothyo bhashar to ar
: >bhul/thik hoyna, tai dosh nei. Kintu mushkil hoy lekhar shomoy.
:
: Thik "shomoshya" je kothay keno bujhchhi-na. Kathyo bhasha kobe theke
: abar likhito bhasha'r shompurno onugoto hoyechhe?
: ...
:
: Shubhechha,
:
: Samir
:
:
: