Re: Complete Interview of General Hamid Gul on CNN
sk_...@yahoo.com
"inerview" with Rehana & Asmaa.
On Dec 14, 6:34 pm, Muhammad Javed Iqbal <kaleemjavediq...@gmail.com>
wrote:
> Friday 12th December, 2008
>
> Alex Jones: Well, ladies & gentlemen, out of the gates, we have Gen.
> Hamid Gul, and of course he was the head of Pakistani intelligence ISI
> back in the 1980’s, he went on CNN on Sunday night on one of their
> international programs and talked about the fact that he believed 9/11
> was an inside job, and that the Mumbai attacks, formerly Bombay, were
> also an inside job.
>
> As you know, we have detailed that that was a False Flag attack,
> carried out by western intelligence, clearly, in India , as a pretext
> to start World War III between the two nations. There were also calls,
> the Pakistani government said were officially made, confirmed with the
> phone records, from the Indian Foreign Ministry, saying “we are going
> to attack you”, attempting to trick the Pakistanis into launching some
> type of attack, and that almost happened.
>
> So, for the next thirty minutes I’m very honored to be joined by Gen.
> Hamid Gul, and General, joining us from Pakistan , thank you so much
> for coming on with us today.
>
> Hamid Gul: You are welcome.
>
> Alex Jones: Uh, just out of the gates, I was told by your son that you
> were not happy with the CNN interview, that they edited you. So,
> you’ve got the floor, sir. We’re not going to edit you. You are live,
> so tell the world what is really going on.
>
> Hamid Gul: Well, at the moment, we have to look at this human — great
> human tragedy that took place in Bombay . I sympathize with India ;
> they’ve been rocked very badly. And their response was a bit nervous.
> They want to go to war with Pakistan if Pakistan does not behave or
> does not hand over whoever they want from us. They have given a list
> of people.
>
> But I think that there has been a long record of the Indians accusing
> Pakistan whenever something like this happens, and in the past they
> have turned out to be every time wrong. Of course Pakistan is willing
> to cooperate. And I think that is a very good position that President
> Zardari has taken, that “you provide the evidence and we will try them
> out; we will arrest them we will put them to trial, and you can come
> and watch, see, and let the international cameras come and see. And
> there shall be a transparent, open trial, and if that does not satisfy
> you, then what else will?”
>
> So, this is the situation where we stand today: there is an ominous
> tack from India , and America seems to be partly patting them on the
> back, and asking Pakistan to do whatever India is demanding. Now this
> is an unfair position, because India is not like America . America
> demanded from Pakistan back in — after 9/11 to cooperate and hand over
> anybody that Pakistan could lay their hands on. Seven hundred or so
> people were caught in Pakistan , they were sent to Guantanamo Bay , to
> Baghram and to Kandahar jail. And nothing came out — Khalid Sheikh
> Mohammad was the only one who was tried in that case: all others have
> been let off.
>
> So, to get innocent people like that, just because you accuse them,
> and you don’t even provide the evidence, you pick them up and shove
> them in jails, this is not on [misses ]. I think that this belittles
> the values that particularly democracies uphold, and they talk so much
> about. And so I think that my son-in-law putted it good enough, and
> today Pakistan backed down on some of the defunct organizations — in
> fact these were banned in the year 2002, immediately after 9/11, but
> there could be some maverick elements among them who would still — I
> won’t rule out, could carry out uhhh [bumper music begins in
> background]— in — uh, on their own or in conjunction with some other
> forces [“partic”??] that kind of atrocities. But we have to wait and
> see, how it goes.
>
> Alex Jones: OK, Mr. — uh, Mr. Gul, General Hamid Gul, please stay with
> us. We’re gonna break and come back in a long segment, uh, plenty of
> time for you to break down what’s going on, the serious tensions, uh
> being, un being risen due to what happened a few weeks ago in India.
> Please stay with us.
>
> [break]
>
> Alex Jones: Reading from Wikipedia, “General Hamid Gul, served as
> director general of Pakistan ’s Inter Service Intelligence, ISI,
> during ‘87-‘89, mainly in the time when Benazir Bhutto was Prime
> Minister of Pakistan . He was instrumental in the anti-Soviet support
> of the mujahideen in the Afghan War, ’79 to ‘89, a pivotal time during
> the Cold War, and the estab — “ and it goes on. And we have him on
> line with us. We of course yesterday played the CNN, uh, TV interview
> that he did. This is live, and is not edited. Going back to him in
> Pakistan we’ve tried three different lines, this is the best one we
> have, we apologize our audio is not very loud to him, not very
> audible, and his back to us is very, very broken up. But we
> nevertheless have him joining us, we’re very thankful.
>
> Uh, sir, continuing, on the CNN program, at least what they edited you
> to say, you talked about 9/11, the evidence being that nine eleven was
> an inside job, and the attacks in Bombay, now Mumbai, of a few weeks
> ago, that the evidence was, it was an inside job. Can you go over the
> evidence that you believe that these were False Flag events, sir, and
> why these False Flag events are being staged.
>
> Hamid Gul: Are you talking about 9/11?
>
> Alex Jones: Yes, sir.
>
> Hamid Gul: Well, I have my own reasons, you know, Rod Nordland was the
> CNN reporter here, I think he was based in Islamabad at that time, and
> he came to me immediately after 9/11, and his version that, uh, that I
> put out, it was given to the Newsweek, and unfortunately it was
> blocked, but it appeared on the internet, on the website of the
> Newsweek. And you can see it, I think it is dated 16th or 17th of
> September, 2001. [Note: the article is Prejudice In Pakistan: Why Is
> Islamabad Reluctant To Pressure Neighboring Afghanistan Into Turning
> Over Osama Bin Laden?, by Rod Nordland, dated 9/14/2001].
>
> And in that I had said the same thing, and I still maintain that
> that’s my position. I have [“seven”??] reasons for it:
>
> a. that 9/11 took place on the American soil, not a single person has
> been caught inside America, even though for doing such a job I think a
> huge amount of logistic support is required in the area where such
> operation is carried out.
>
> b. Secondly, the air traffic control, when they saw the four aircraft
> were changing direction — going from east coast to west coast where
> they were headed, they started traveling in different directions. And
> it is quite amazing that for a very long period of time the air
> traffic control did not report this, nor did the US Air Force act in
> time. If, er, one were to calculate from the first flight, when it
> took off from Logan , till the first aircraft, and the solitary
> aircraft that took off was an F16 that took off from Langley , which
> is CIA headquarters, instead of one of the operational bases. So many
> of them are available in that area. And then a single aircraft never
> takes off, because we have been told that whenever the aircraft
> scramble they scramble in twos. And the time that it took was
> enormous. It took a hundred and twelve minutes! A hundred twelve
> minutes is a very long time in which to react. Was the US Air Force
> sleeping? And if it was sleeping, which heads will roll?
>
> c. Second [NB: his third point] it was a huge intelligence failure,
> and no heads have been rolled, nobody has been taken to task, not a
> single person has resigned for this.
>
> d. Thirdly, the air traffic control should have been rehashed, they
> should have been turned inside out, but nothing of the sort happened.
>
> e. And finally, how come this is a coincidence that all transponders
> did not work, and it is not possible — and the direction is changed
> and it is not noticed?
>
> f. Secondly, the US Air Force has the ability, because in the past
> whenever a plane has been hijacked, the record is that within seven
> minutes the US aircraft has been on the wing of the hijacked aircraft.
> In this case it — uh, it did not happen. The US alert system is so
> high, and it is so sophisticated, that if a missile were to take off
> from Moscow , and were to head toward New York , it takes about eighty
> minutes. And the US Air Force, and the missile systems, is supposed to
> intercept it within nine minutes — that means only Atlantic : around
> the Pacific it must stop that missile from coming in.
>
> The system is in place, but it didn’t work, and nobody tried to
> question this.
>
> g. Lastly, no inquiry has so far been held formally into the incident,
> and the whole world has been turned upside down, so many people have
> been killed, the American economy is going into a meltdown, and
> everything is gone wrong with the world, and yet no formal inquiry has
> been ordered by the US government. So I really don’t know. There are
> so many questions which hang in the balance.
>
> h. And then to top it all, they say that [Obama Hamodu??(Hani
> Hanjour)] took the training by light aircraft in the army for six
> months, he could have maneuvered a jumbo 745 — uh, 757 from a height
> where it was traveling — that height was 9,000, and it came within
> seconds to a height of 1000, and then went straight into its target.
> Now this is not possible for a person who has been trained on a light
> aircraft to be able to do this.
>
> Alex Jones: Yes, sir.
>
> Hamid Gul: And there is no mention of the second aircraft, and so
> there are a number of things which remain unanswered.
>
> Alex Jones: Yes, sir.
>
> Hamid Gul: Whenever the journalists come, and visit me here, and I ask
> them these questions, that “why haven’t you taken the answers about
> this?”, and they say that “Patriotic Act comes in the way”, and we are
> not supposed to ask that question”.
>
> Alex Jones: General — we are talking to General Hamid Gul, the former
> head of Pakistani ISI, during the key period of fighting the Russians,
> he was also, before he was the head of ISI, one of the chiefs
> according to our media, running operations against the Russians. And
> of course working with the United States closely, as well as the Saudi
> Arabians, and the British. Y’know, if that’s incorrect, correct me.
>
> Uh, General Gul, what are the motives? We have the PNAC, with Dick
> Cheney saying we need a Pearl Harbor event, we have 44,000 US troops
> massing in Tajikistan and Uzbekistan in the days before 9/11, we have
> Bush on September 10, Newsweek reported ordering the launch of attacks
> the next week, we have, of course, the buildings being blown up with
> explosives, and all of the witnesses to that, now the government
> admits that Building 7 did fall in freefall, was not hit by a plane —
> specifically, sir, motives. Why would the Military Industrial Complex
> controlling the United States , why would they stage a 9/11 attack?
>
> Hamid Gul: Well, I think there’s also the Cold War, when the —
> Reaganomics it was known as, the inflation was very high, and,
> domestic issues had to be addressed, but, uh, Bill Clinton, [two and
> hammose??] they really amassed a lot of money, American economy went
> booming, and he left a lot of money, and the — hard boys, Cold
> Warriors, when they came in they — they found that the situation was
> ready, they had money and they had resources, and they looked upon the
> conquest of the world, for which there was an opportunity window.
>
> The Muslim world was lying prostrate, Russia was not still picking up
> from the — it’s foreign position, China was not ready yet, and
> therefore they looked upon it as an opportunity to go and do the
> [forming??]. And in this, I am a soldier, and I know that there has to
> be a single aim, but they mixed up the aims and they have botched up
> everything. First they said that they would go into such specific
> areas where there was no US presence before, as — such as the western
> Asia and South Asia — South Asia, where there was no American [???]
> present, and they wanted it there.
>
> They had to keep the Chinese off from getting into the Middle East,
> they had to lay their hands on the energy tap of the world, which
> presently lies in the Middle East, but in future it will be in Central
> Asia, and so Afghanistan is the gateway to Central Asia, and finally
> to suppress any resistance, particularly which could threaten the
> state of Israel.
>
> Now that is where they, instead of pursuing the American objectives,
> they started pursuing the Israeli objectives, and that is where they
> went wrong. You have to pick out a single aim, that is the first
> principle of war, and I don’t know why the generals and the
> politicians of America, they could be so naïve and so ignorant, that
> they started mixing aims, and they went into this war, without a
> buildup, without particular preparation, and without the American
> support behind them.
>
> Because if they had gone to war, and asked for the support of the
> American people, they would never given them their support. So they
> had to create a pretext, and this was the pretext that they created.
>
> Alex Jones: General, we’re gonna break in a second, and come back for
> the final segment. I’m hoping I can get you to stay a little longer,
> because I want you to speak unedited to the American people and the
> people of the world. I want to shift gears into Mumbai, what happened
> in India . Clearly the evidence of even the Indian intelligence chief,
> as you know, was saying that the Indian government was staging terror
> attacks on the train, an army captain was caught doing that and
> arrested, the chief of anti-terror was threatened, he was killed that
> day when it started in Mumbai, now they have caught an anti-terror
> police officer giving cell phones to the supposed terrorist that
> they’re saying came from Pakistan, we know the West is deeply in bed
> with some of the blocks of the former mujahideen, uh, can you speak to
> that?
>
> General?
>
> Hamid Gul: Can you hear me — I can’t hear you properly, can you hear
> me all right?
>
> Alex Jones: Yes, sir, I can hear you. When we come back, we will s —
> we will speak to what happened in India . Did you hear that?
>
> Hamid Gul: Yes, yes, yes, yes.
>
> Alex Jones: Good. Why they are staging terror attacks there, the
> evidence of False Flag/Inside Job in India . So when we return after
> this quick break [music begins] with the former head of Pakistani
> intelligence, uh, General Hamid Gul, joining us from Pakistan . I am
> coming to you from Austin , Texas , hence the phone troubles. We will
> work on those, sir, during the break. My websites of course are
> InfoWars.com and PrisonPlanet. com.
>
> Stay with us, we’ll be right back with this exclusive interview.
>
> [break]
>
> Alex Jones: We are back live. It is Dec. 9th, 2008. Gen. Hamid Gul,
> one of the most famous members of the — and commanders of Pakistani
> intelligence, who worked in — with the United States in the whole
> operation against the Russians — was the commander of those operations
> — is our guest, with us graciously until forty after.
>
> Uh, General, uh, not wasting any more time, I listed earlier the fact
> that Indian intelligence captains in the army have been caught in
> India staging bombings. That’s Indian news. Uh, that Indian
> intelligence and police have been caught giving cell phones to the
> supposed shooters. The police stood down, and only the anti-terror
> commanders that had said that India was staging terror, they were
> killed in the initiation of the attacks in Mumbai. That’s some of the
> evidence of Mumbai being an inside job. Namely, why do you believe
> Mumbai is a staged event two weeks ago, (A), and (B), what is the
> motive?
>
> Hamid Gul: Well, the motive is very simple, that, uh, Americans want
> India to come on board with them in their War Against Terror,
> especially when they run out of troops in Afghanistan . The NATO
> allies are pulling out, they are dragging their feet, they are not
> prepared to fight there, but they want to make it an Indian cause, and
> they want nearly 150,000 troops in Afghanistan.
>
> That is one reason where there is an American motive. There is an
> Israeli motive, which is similar, that the Americans should not pull
> out of Afghanistan just because they are short of troops, so they must
> have more troops there. Because if they go away without denuclearizing
> Pakistan , the state of Israel will remain under perpetual danger. So
> they have an innate fear that Americans will lose heart and pull out
> of this region, they’re already going out of Iraq . And if they were
> to go out of Afghanistan , Israel — this will be an unfinished agenda,
> and Israel will be at the losing end.
>
> So, the NeoCons and the Zionists, they together want to hatch a
> conspiracy so that Obama gets trapped into a situation where for next
> four years he keep on sorting out this embroglio.
>
> As far as the ability is concerned, which is the other element, can
> you imagine that people traveling from Karachi in two rickety boats,
> they can travel all the way to Bombay and then go into action
> immediately and fight a battle for seventy-two hours, and there are
> just ten of them, and in each group there were two? This is
> impossible. They were carrying so much of munitions with them, and
> that, uh, that munition lasted till fighting withstood the — crack
> troops of India for so long.
>
> And you know that in Nariman House, the five Jewish hostages, they
> were killed by the Indian commandos. They were not killed by these
> people. So why would the Indian commandos kill them? And Israelis
> suppressed this information. It initially came out in one of the
> Indian dail — eh, Israeli dailies, but then it was suppressed.
>
> So if you go by the record of the Indian accusations against Pakistan,
> in the past ten years, uh, 2001 on December 13, there was an attack on
> the Indian Lok Sabha [lower house of Parliament], and they blamed
> Pakistan and Lashkar-e-Taiba for it, but it turned out that these were
> Indian Kashmiris themselves, and because India is causing so much
> atrocities in Kashmir, therefore there’s a good reason for them that
> they would — carry out something like that.
>
> Then the — again in 2006, there was the Samjhota Express case, in
> which 68 passengers, mostly Pakistanis were killed, and this train was
> stopped at an obscure railway station in Haryana, and then doors were
> locked and the train was set on fire, and again this was proclaimed
> that it was Pakistani Lashkar-e-Taiba, and they had done it because
> they wanted to derail the peace process. But, uh, Marshal Purohit,
> Shrikant Purohit has been caught in it, and there are other Indian
> officers who are, uh, or were his accomplices, and he has a big net
> worth — they — took the RDX from the Deolali depot, which is a
> military depot —
>
> Alex Jones: the explosives —
>
> Hamid Gul: so one can say there is a deep penetration of the militant
> Hindus in military and intelligence organizations in India .
>
> So in this case, why would they not do that, because they want to
> again derail this process, and when Obama says that he will mediate on
> Kashmir , and there is a Kashmiri [music begins] political movement
> picking up momentum, and in this situation he says that he would, uh,
> send, uh, Bill Clinton as the mediator. Obviously the militants in
> India do not want this to happen and they had to preempt it.
>
> So, Pakistan doesn’t gain, Pakistani ISI doesn’t gain anything from
> it. The next beneficiary is either the militant Hindu —
>
> Alex Jones: Stay there, sir, we have to break.
>
> Hamid Gul: who have their eye on the next election —
>
> Alex Jones: we have to break —
>
> [break]
>
> Alex Jones: Well, ladies and gentlemen, a rare interview, extremely
> enlightening. We’re talking to the former head of Pakistani
> intelligence, the ISI. I want to thank Paul Watson, who will be on the
> line. He’s gonna pop in with a question or two. I want to thank, uh,
> Simon over in the UK for getting us this number. Thank Aaron for
> staying up late last night to get the producing job done to get this
> interview right here on the GCN Radio Network. Uh, General, continuing
> with motive, I have the headline here, “Pakistan Asserts ‘Hoax’ War
> Call Was Real — Press Minister fingers Indian High Commission as
> source of reports that threatening call was fake”.
>
> As you know this was in most of the Pakistani papers. The government
> has the caller ID and the phone records, that the threatening call,
> saying that India was going to attack within minutes of the terrorist
> attacks beginning in Mumbai a few weeks ago, this provocative call
> within minutes saying India was going to attack Pakistan, attempting
> to get Pakistan to move troops to the border and have a conflict, and
> the media saying possible war between the two thermonuclear powers was
> narrowly averted. Can you speak to that?
>
> Hamid Gul: Yes, indeed. I think the Americans and the Indians both
> have been very responsible about it, because Condoleezza Rice’s
> statement in America and in India when she went and visited Delhi .
> They were very threatening towards Pakistan , and it was sort of a
> dictation that “you have to satisfy India ”. Now this is amazing, that
> Pakistan has to satisfy India . On what score? Indians have still to
> come out with the evidence. And as far as this one man whom they have
> caught, who knows that this is not a bogey, and that this man was
> loitering around somewhere. There’re plenty of Pakistanis who crossed
> the border illegally or legally, and he could have been picked up, and
> he’s become the front man for singing on those stories.
>
> So one doesn’t really know. It’s too early to start threatening war
> against Pakistan because Pakistan is a nuclear country, and if they
> brandish their power, conventional power, then I can assure you that
> as a soldier I will say that conventional war, limited war, within the
> nuclear environment is not possible in the subcontinent.
>
> And if it comes to an exchange of nuclear weapons, then this becomes a
> Third World War. China cannot stay out. Russia will not stay out.
> Russia is already showing its belligerence towards the — America and
> Europe . And China of course is a very major economic power. They are
> a nuclear power, and if this thing happens in their back yard they
> will not accept it.
>
> So this is a very dangerous situation. I think it is playing with the
> fire. So the whole thing is getting — could get out of hand. It is
> again, as I told you that the part of the unfinished agenda that the
> NeoCons had in their mind. And they think back now, “well, we carry it
> out, even though the Americans wanted a change.”
>
> But let’s look at what change means. I mean Obama has not too very
> clearly enunciated what change would be.. But one can assume that
> change means focusing on the domestic issues. There is an economic
> meltdown, the car industry is going sick, and many other things are
> happening inside America , the social welfare and the Medicare extra
> trust.
>
> So as in all these things, there is a need for the new administration
> to focus entirely on the domestic issues —
>
> Alex Jones: well, General —
>
> Hamid Gul: and for that it will have to disengage externally.
>
> Alex Jones: General — as you know, in the last three months, before
> Obama was even elected, he said Pakistan and Afghanistan would be his
> main focus. The strikes inside Pakistan — it’s clear that his change
> means what Zbigniew Brzezinski wants, shifting — uh, what the RAND
> Corporation has said they want, shifting the war out of the Middle
> East into Central Asia .
>
> So I believe the change is gonna be these provocations. Look at the
> NeoCons, with Israeli and NATO-backed forces launching the sneak
> attack on the Russian held South Ossetia on 8/8/8. So it appears they
> are trying to launch a major — uh, larger than a theater war, as the
> RAND Corporation said a month ago, they want a major new war.
>
> Hamid Gul: Yes, indeed you’re right, because this is an old theory,
> [weet ul josaperry??] theory, first put out by MacKinder and then by
> Mahan, who was an admiral in the US Navy, that this is the rimland,
> you’ve got to first control the rimland in Asia before you can strike
> in the heartland of Asia. So this heartland/rimland thing, I think it
> tricked into the story —
>
> Alex Jones: geopolitical
>
> Hamid Gul: it tricked into the picture that, if they have a conflict
> in the rimland, and they can control it, then it becomes so much
> easier to go into the heartland.
>
> This is really asking too much when America is really not in a very
> healthy economic condition. So I think that this is brinkmanship of
> the highest order, and if they enlarge the area of conflict in this
> war against terrorism, and if they prolong the period of conflict,
> then America will definitely lose.
>
> Alex Jones: General —
>
> Hamid Gul: Because I know that when you are fighting the [illevel
> of??] fighters, and then the area of conflict is enlarged, let’s say
> you extend it into the tribal areas of Pakistan, or it is pushed into
> Kashmir as well, so the [canna??] can be monitored and watched quite
> easily, then the area will become larger and the US simply does not
> have the troops. And there is not a moral cause strong enough for the
> American people to be mobilized behind it.
>
> Alex Jones: So that’s why they staged
>
> Hamid Gul: So I don’t know — this is pure madness to be thinking of
> such things at this time.
>
> Alex Jones: So that’s why they need proxies like India to destabilize
> the region for the encirclement of Russia , and of course China ,
> blocking those pipelines.
>
> Now, sir, in the time we’ve got left, you worked with the United
> States and Saudi Arabia , with Israel , or at least Pakistan did,
> fighting the Russian invasion. Uh, of course, if these reports are
> incorrect, correct me, but you were one of the main commanders helping
> the mujahideen. You were the head of Pakistani intelligence right at
> the time you had the victory against the Russians.
>
> It is reported here that al-Qaeda was founded by the new Secretary of
> Defense Gates and Zbigniew Brzezinski, uh, or, or that they were the
> Wahabist fighting corps, and that they are now being used to try to
> bring down the Pakistani government and to try to stage attacks inside
> India. So can you speak with your particular expertise to that, and
> then, also the fact that they are now trying to list you as a
> terrorist, and then thirdly, did you ever meet Osama bin Laden? Is
> Osama bin Laden dead many years ago of kidney failure, as Benazir
> Bhutto said?
>
> Hamid Gul: Well, uh, I was actually in charge of operations against
> the Soviet occupation of Afghanistan , and the Americans were
> providing the logistic support, and the Saudis were sharing one half
> of the budget for this war. And it was a cheap war because in all —
> there was uh ten years that we were fighting the Russians, we spent
> not more than five billion dollars out of the American exchequers. So
> it was a very cheap war for the Americans to have defeated the
> Russians and rid the whole of the West of this Red Menace that they
> used to call.
>
> So, at that time, Osama bin Laden and his, uh colleagues, they were
> admired and romanticised by the CIA operators. I had never met him
> then. I had nothing to do with him, because I was only busy training
> the Afghans. We had to win a war, we had a task on our hands, it was a
> very big task, and we were so occupied with the training only the
> Afghans. No other nation was trained by the ISI. I can vouch on that.
> Not a single person, not even a Pakistani was trained by them.
>
> Osama bin Laden was — you know, I — had never met him, but to the —
> these people used to come and talk glowingly about him. I met Osama
> bin Laden after my retirement from the army, in 1993 December in
> Khartoum, and then again in year, uh, 1994 November when I was went —
> I was there invited by a Hassan bin-Turabi to an international
> conference, and during that conference, Osama invited us to a banquet.
> And it was all in an open place, and, uh, where there were many other
> people present. I, uh, he struck me as a pretty normal human being,
> not the bloodthirsty animal that he is being presented by the CIA now.
>
> At that time no conversation between him and me took place. I don’t
> know whether he’s living or dead. But so far Ayman — Ayman al-Zawahiri
> has been given — eh, representing him in various interviews of Osama
> that have been put out.
>
> So one doesn’t really know. But the last interview, which was a voice
> interview, in that the CIA and the other US intelligence agencies
> authenticated that it was Osama’s voice. So one doesn’t really know
> whether he is living or dead.
>
> Alex Jones: Well, sir —
>
> Hamid Gul: But even if he is not living, he is a symbol. Al-Qaeda is a
> franchise. Whoever created that, and for whatever reason they created,
> I think it wasn’t there until 1996 when he was lodged in Khartoum .
> Later on he was —
>
> Alex Jones: General —
>
> Hamid Gul: — invited by [later Afghan President] Burhanuddin Rabbani,
> who is now part of the Northern Alliance in Kabul , and he came over
> and he set up his headquarters in a place called Tora Bora near
> Jalalabad. But, uhhh, that’s where one started hearing of al-Qaeda and
> the activities
>
> Alex Jones: Yes.
>
> Hamid Gul: of Osama bin-Laden.
>
> Alex Jones: General —
>
> Hamid Gul: And also the fact that his commander was responsible for
> bringing the “Blackhawk down” in the fierce operation in Mogadishu
> where an American aircraft was brought down by a Stinger, which had
> probably been supplied in Afghanistan to Afghan mujahideen.
>
> Alex Jones: OK, General —
>
> Hamid Gul: Yes —
>
> Alex Jones: General, I need to — in the time left here because we’ve
> only got a few minutes left with you here — uh, maybe five minutes and
> then we’re going to break and I don’t want to keep you any longer — we
> can perhaps have you back in the future.
>
> Specifically, though, we know his CIA control name was Tim Osman, we
> know he was the bagman for a lot of the Saudi money and the Israeli
> money going in, I know that was compartmentalized and separate from
> Pakistani intelligence, from what I’ve read from different
> perspectives and US intelligence.
>
> So — so I believe you. My whole point here is — is that al-Qaeda — al-
> CIAda didn’t carry out the attacks of 9/11 as you yourself have said.
> His first interview said that he didn’t do it. Then they produced
> these computer-morphed videos and fake audios that have been checked.
> And the Intel Center , headed up by Rumsfeld’s former lieutenant, the
> private group was caught putting the same video layer in with the
> original video. So it’s been proven that they’re creating these fake
> videos.
>
> Hamid Gul: There is no doubt about it, that this video which was put
> out in November by George Bush and — and said this was Osama bin-Laden
> and was high cheekboned like the mongoloid features, he wasn’t as tall
> as Osama bin-Laden was. And one could clearly make out that this was
> doctored, and had been created on purpose to justify the attack on
> Afghanistan .
>
> I think there are many things which are going wrong are being done on
> the behest of the government by the CIA which are not correct. The CIA
> used to be good when they were working with us. But I don’t know what
> happened thereafter. I think it was overarching ambition.
>
> Alex Jones: Well, sir —
>
> Hamid Gul: — or it is the fear that America will lose it’s clout.
> Whatever is the reason. Or perhaps it is the Israeli fear that they
> are surrounded by a sea of hostile enemies, who could, if the
> Americans don’t, uh, now at this point in time, the don’t deliver a
> fatal blow to all their enemies, then Israel will have a short shelf
> life, otherwise also because it is an artificial state, that they
> would, uh, probably not exist, or they would —
>
> Alex Jones: General —
>
> Hamid Gul: — have — fi —
>
> Alex Jones: General: as you know, in the time we have left, they have
> over four hundred nukes, they have total dominance, no one could
> attack them with nukes, they have the anti-missile defense systems. I
> believe it’s a red herring that they want to start World War III, uh,
> for their “safety”. It’s World War III that will destroy Israel .
>
> Hamid Gul: Yes, indeed, and I think this 2006 September experience, I
> think, if it is any indicator for them, when they —
>
> Alex Jones: Hezbollah —
>
> Hamid Gul: — went into southern Lebanon and they got such a buffeting
> at the hands of — of Hezbollah, I think they’ll not do something like
> that, because it would mean annihilation of Israel. And in any case
> Palestinian question is a very thorny question, and I do not know why
> the US administration is not addressing it differently —
>
> Alex Jones: OK
>
> Hamid Gul: — instead of these two different states there should be one
> Abrahamic state of Palestine .
>
> Alex Jones: General!
>
> Hamid Gul: Because all of the three religions which claim that they
> are divine religions they have been origined in Palestine, and I think
> that something new has been — has to be thought about.
>
> Alex Jones: All right —
>
> Hamid Gul: But unfortunately Bush administration in its very
> [?????????] it said that they would sort out this Palestinian issue by
> creating two states. After eight years we have gotten nowhere at all!
>
> Alex Jones: All right General, we’re almost out of time, two final
> questions, and I’m gonna let you go, and you can — any websites, any
> books, any materials you’d like to point people at to see your side of
> the story, we’d love to see it. Two questions, let me give ‘em both to
> you and then answer them, please:
>
> #1 — why are they trying to, now, list you as a terrorist, (A), when
> they admittedly worked with you (B) why do they always betray people
> like Saddam who they worked with and set up..
>
> So (A) why are they trying to set you up, and (B) do you see the West
> staging more terror?
>
> Hamid Gul: Yes, of — I think they are simply afraid of me because I
> worked with them, I understand them, I can measure them up and I talk
> loudly about it, I mak — mince no words, I pil — pull no punches, and
> they are afraid that I preempt whatever scheming they do. And I am —
> loud-voiced, there is no doubt about it. And I speak the truth, they
> are trying to frame me, there is no truth in it. If they had anything
> about me when I applied for a renewal of my VISA to America why did
> they not give it to me? Because if they have something, they are
> looking around for terrorists, while this terrorist wants to come over
> and visit America, nab me, interrogate me, take me to bar, take me to
> court, do whatever you like. It only shows that they have a mala fide.
>
> As far as Saddam is concerned, it is a habit, it is a very bad habit.
> They cultivate friends who become, like Pervez Musharraf, dictators,
> and then they make use of them, and then they turn upon them and then
> infect [?] the nation because of their policies.
>
> And, what was the last part of your question?
>
> Alex Jones: All right, I’m gonna do a s —
>
> Hamid Gul: was it in India/Pakistan relations?
>
> Alex Jones: Sir, hold on one moment, General. John —
>
> Hamid Gul: Ju —
>
> Alex Jones: Ge — hold on, General — uh, General, hold on one moment
> because we’ve only got a few minutes left. John, skip this network
> break. For stations: I’m skipping, ‘cause I’me gonna let him go in
> three minutes. I don’t want to hold him any longer, but I’m skipping
> this break, because this is too newsworthy.
>
> Yes sir, I’d like you to answer that question, uh, about what do you
> think, knowing them, working with the globalists, the New World Order,
> in the past, when it was still America, before we were totally
> dominated, what do you think their next moves are probably — uh, most
> probable, (A).
>
> And then, finally, the attacks against the government in Pakistan ,
> uh, using Muslim fronts. Does that appear to be the West trying to
> destabilize your government? They keep trying to kill the government,
> they killed Bhutto, they keep bombing government buildings, they keep
> bombing hotels, it appears the West is using false mujahideen to try
> to overthrow Pakistan .
>
> Hamid Gul: No, Benazir was not killed by any of the terrorists. She
> was removed by the Americans, because she had violated her agreement,
> because they wanted to keep Pervez Musharraf there, and he slapped
> another [mustel???] on Pakistan . So she had become rebellious, and
> such a person, who is a popular leader of a third world country, the
> head of the largest political party, a woman whom they could not
> attack as fundamentalist because she was so westernized, therefore it
> was very important for them to remove her, because they have a
> mischievous plan which they want to put through.
>
> So, they have installed instead Mr. Zardari, whom they can blackmail
> very easily, but they have allowed him to keep the powers of a
> dictator. And in fact he’s the one who’s calling all the shots in
> Pakistan , so as Pakistan is already completely destabilized
> politically. .
>
> Our po — um, uh be — judicial institution simply does not exist,
> because the judicial crisis recently dethroned Chief Justice of
> Pakistan —
>
> Alex Jones: Yes — who is staging the terror attacks, because they’re
> clearly aimed at the government, or is that the government staging
> them as a pretext to crack down —
>
> Hamid Gul: No, no, no — this is because it — [Lombostit???] was
> attacked, and I think that George Bush addressed his nation on radio
> immediately after that, said “this was part of our plan in War Against
> Terrorism”, because Pakistan army and Inter Services Intelligence were
> not fully cooperating, and because they did not consider it was their
> war, therefore they created this situation, where the terrorists out
> of sheer revenge — this is called Pakhtunwali. This is a tradition
> which has nothing to do with Islam. It is the Afghans holding to this
> tradition long before they became Muslim, and they are still carrying
> it on. When you take action against an Afghan, kill his daughter or
> his wife or his sister, he will take revenge no doubt what happens. He
> does not behave like a Muslim, or any other entity.
>
> So this was a thing which was created. And of course Pakistan is now
> in a very difficult position. We only have a military which can
> control the institutions. And we have an ISI, but the Americans are
> almost every day attacking the ISI and attacking the military, saying
> this is not under the control of the political parties.
>
> Alex Jones: Sir —
>
> Hamid Gul: political powers.
>
> Alex Jones: Sir — General —
>
> Hamid Gul: But what is political power, when Parliament is sinecure?
> It does not work, it has no authority at all.
>
> Alex Jones: General, going back to 9/11, Pakistani papers, BBC
> reported, New York Times reported, $100,000 was reportedly wired by
> Gen. Mahmood Ahmed, the head of Pakistani intelligence to the lead
> hijacker, who we know was a US government decoy, trained at US bases,
> that’s Newsweek, AP, Reuters. General Mahmood Ahmed, do you believe he
> was really controlled by the CIA, did he wire $100,000 to Mohammed
> Atta?
>
> Hamid Gul: Not at all. Mahmood is a friend of mine. I met him very
> recently in Lahore , and he categorically denies this. I think this is
> all disinformation, which has been adopted as a very sophisticated
> intelligence art.
>
> Alex Jones: So, just to be clear, we’re gonna let you go, we’re very
> thankful and respectful of your time, uh, you believe that the
> bombings and shootings and terror attacks that we’ve seen in the last
> few months in Pakistan are because the Predator drones and helicopters
> are killing weddings — you always notice it’s a wedding — that’s meant
> to stir up the people there, because it kills whole families, it’s a
> huge insult, and then of course they blow up NATO cars, of course they
> then attack the government. Is that what you’re saying?
>
> Hamid Gul: It is retaliatory, and they will retaliate. I can tell you
> that Afghanistan nation is a fact that over 5,000 years, nobody has
> won against them, and I think that Americans cannot win, unless
> American intention is to stir up a Third World War at this point I
> think there’s no point in staying in Afghanistan. You should negotiate
> with the opposition. This is a national resistance now. It is no
> longer Taleban. Specific, it is the Afghan nation.
>
> I approve of their position. They are resisting ferociously.
>
> Alex Jones: General, how long can the Mayor of Kabul stay in power,
> and isn’t this really just about the West controlling the opium?
>
> Hamid Gul: Well, he’s the puppet of Kabul , and he will not stay very
> long. I can assure you that, eh, he’s already started showing signs of
> nervousness. He wants to reach out to the Taleban, but Taleban won’t —
> eh, even throw a crumb at him. I can assure you the Taleban, or, any
> other resistance fighters, they will have nothing to do with —
>
> Alex Jones: Well, Reuters is reporting, as you know, every major city
> is now encircled, and only a few cities are controlled by the US
> force.
>
> Hamid Gul: I — I have no idea, but I think the Right is started coming
> out, like Robert Kagan’s article in the Washington Post on December
> 2nd, it, eh, echoes what is the [CFR] World At Risk Report. Uh, it is
> similar. They are focusing on Pakistan , because Pakistan ’s nuclear
> capability is undigestible by State of Israel, and by India ,
> therefore there is —
>
> Alex Jones: All right —
>
> Hamid Gul: every possibility that Pakistan becomes a target.
>
> Alex Jones: In closing — in closing, and this is it, and we appreciate
> all your time — this hour’s over, two minutes, sir, I know you can’t
> predict the future, but do you see them staging a nuke attack? Do you
> see them staging more terror attacks? Do you see India sneak
> attacking? Uh, do you see a more radical government coming in after
> the staged events? What do you see happening, bad case scenario?
>
> Hamid Gul: No, Indians are not so stupid. I think they are seeing thru
> the game, and these far Leftist parties, that is the Left Front, they
> are called, the Communist party of India , are very strong. India is
> slowly turning t’the world of its own problems. The Shine India,
> Shining India, Feel-good India , this is all make believe. I can tell
> you that this is a propaganda hype. I can tell you that India is in a
> miserable state. Their economy is dwindling. And four hundred millions
> are living on less that one dollar a day.
>
> And this is beginning to have an effect because last year alone
> 108,000 farmers in India committed suicide. And this will not go on.
> Out of 608 districts in India , 231 are already in turmoil, and mostly
> under the control of Maoists and the Bhakti-lite.
>
> Alex Jones: So they are collapsing?
>
> Hamid Gul: Yes. So India itself has lots of problems of their own.
>
> Alex Jones: You’re right. The GMO cotton made ‘em commit suicide,
> cause it destroyed their lives.
>
> Well, General, General Hamid Gul, thank you so much for joining us.
> Any websites, any books, any materials you think people should read to
> learn more?
>
> Hamid Gul: Thank you.
>
> Alex Jones: Uh, any websites, any books, any materials you think
> people should read to learn more?
>
> Hamid Gul: Oh, I don’t have a website, unfortunately, but I think you
> have a website. You can read all my talk.
>
> Alex Jones: Absolutely. We’ll post the audio and a transcript at
> InfoWars.com. Let me say bye to you, as this hour ends, as we go to
> break, sir. Ladies and gentlemen, we’ll be back with the second hour.
> Again I want to thank Gen. Hamid Gul. Uh, an amazing exclusive, folks,
> unedited live.
>
> http://www.prisonplanet.com/ alex-jones- interviews- lt-gen-hamid-
> gul-full- transcript. html
>
> M. Javed Iqbal