BENGALI MEDIUM VS ENGLISH MEDIUM
Fearsome Shabs
In the past few days, I have noticed that a certain group of people
are bashing english medium schools(EMS) in bangladesh. They have
given "several" reasons for their dislikement of EMS. Well, I would
like to clarify something first. What does EMS represent actually?
They are schools who usually follow the guidelines provided by the
University of London in teaching O/A level education throughout the
world, not just in Bangladesh. The curriculam for every subjects
under O/A level is same for every countries. As a student of
Scholastica('82-'92), I would also like to argue some comments made
by some people in perspective of my education in Scholastica.
Aveekman and Asif were my classmates in Scholastica and best buddies
(still are).
A lot of guys had said that EMS doesn't teach any Bangladeshi
culture. I agree with that...They have also said that EMS students
lack about the knowledge on the culture of Bangladesh. This I find
very resentful. These guys are looking at an EMS just from the
outside, without probing inside...when I was a student in
Scholastica, Scholastica encouraged Bangladeshi culture more than
anything else, although they didn't teach it...we have had several
events on bangladeshi culture...those who are arguing about this
subject, I would like them to check the records of Scholastica where
they would find that how Scholasticans have won numerous medals in
Art, Song, Bengali Literature, Bengali Drama competitions throughout
the country competing with the students from bengali mediums...I
still haven't forgotten the day I watched Scholasticans performed
"Tasher Desh" , a singing Drama by Rabindranath Tagore in front of
public...it was a bold step...and if this doesn't satisfy the critics
complaining about the lack of depth of knowledge about bangladeshi
culture from EMS students, I don't know what will....
Some guys have mentioned History...which was tactfully handled by
aveekman in his article...I don't have to talk about this anyfurther.
I agree that no EMS schools teach their students about geography of
Bangladesh...as it is not included in the curricula...I would also
like to mention that other EMS schools in other countries doesn't
teach about their geography either...But during my education in
Scholastica, I have learned to draw the map of Bangladesh in
Scholastica as our geography teacher took the initiative.
Lastly, a lot of people has said that EMS is just for the rich kids
of the country...I can only laugh at this as this is true! Why should
not it be? I don't know why some guys talk about affording EMS by
middle/lower class...because they can't. The main reason, obviously,
is the tuition expense. Well, do you guys expect that a private
institutions to lower tuition expense when they receive nothing, I
repeat, nothing from the Government unlike other bengali mediums...I
wonder, then, how could this people even compare the tuitions of EMS
and BMS when they are not treated fairly...the final say is that, we
just can't compare the 2 system's benefits and drawbacks unless there
is a fair competition between them. Both possess advantages and
disadvantages...
I, probably, may have angered a lot of people but I had to get the
facts straight. I apologize to those people who have felt angry about
my statements. I shall never try to criticize BMS, since I never had
the experience of attending one. Shobaikay shubeccha janee-a,
ascoolasice
Shabbir Ahmed
e-mail SA7...@cub.uca.edu
phone (501)329-4559
"When the going gets tough, the tough gets going"
- DON'T KNOW.
Pati Mastan
Fearsome Shabs (SA7...@cub.uca.edu) wrote:
: In the past few days, I have noticed that a certain group of people
: are bashing english medium schools(EMS) in bangladesh. They have
: given "several" reasons for their dislikement of EMS. Well, I would
: like to clarify something first. What does EMS represent actually?
: They are schools who usually follow the guidelines provided by the
: University of London in teaching O/A level education throughout the
: world, not just in Bangladesh. The curriculam for every subjects
: under O/A level is same for every countries.
Lets clear something up first: criticism does not definitionally
entail "bashing." That having been said....
What exactly are you getting at? That because the English medium
schools follow the curricula taught in other countries, they are
beyond criticism? The question never has been whether English
medium schools provide education with an international bent;
rather, it is if the process of education in these schools somehow
abet cultural alienation in the context of Bangladesh. Their
existence or emulation of a process in practice elsewhere are
not good enough justifications to warrant immunity from criticism.
[Personal reflections on life in Scholastica deleted.]
: I agree that no EMS schools teach their students about geography of
: Bangladesh...as it is not included in the curricula...I would also
: like to mention that other EMS schools in other countries doesn't
: teach about their geography either...
The lack of schooling in the geography of one's own country is
therefore justified???
But during my education in
: Scholastica, I have learned to draw the map of Bangladesh in
: Scholastica as our geography teacher took the initiative.
The point re. maps that I was getting at is simply this:
Geography is compulsory in SSC, and 40% of it is on Bangladesh;
as a result, anybody attempting to score in excess of 60% *must*
learn how to draw the map of Bangladesh. It is not an option, as
is the case in EMS. Your teacher took the initiative, but how
many teachers do that?
: Lastly, a lot of people has said that EMS is just for the rich kids
: of the country...I can only laugh at this as this is true! Why should
: not it be? I don't know why some guys talk about affording EMS by
: middle/lower class...because they can't. The main reason, obviously,
: is the tuition expense. Well, do you guys expect that a private
: institutions to lower tuition expense when they receive nothing, I
: repeat, nothing from the Government unlike other bengali mediums...
When you speak of Bengali medium schools in this light, are you
including St. Joseph, St. Gregory and Holy Cross as well?
I
: wonder, then, how could this people even compare the tuitions of EMS
: and BMS when they are not treated fairly...the final say is that, we
: just can't compare the 2 system's benefits and drawbacks unless there
: is a fair competition between them.
Sorry, I beg to differ. There is always room for a subjective
evaluation of any two objects as long as there is a common
ground on which to base these comparisons. Since the contention
is a comparison between the schooling systems in a particular
country, and how these systems cater to the inculcation, ingestion
or the alienation of the common culture, there is ample room for
a comparative analysis.
Both possess advantages and
: disadvantages...
Agreed. Unconditionally.
: I, probably, may have angered a lot of people but I had to get the
: facts straight.
You unfortunately overlook some other "facts".
On the claimed superiority of the English Medium Schools:
1. Most of the English medium schools in Bangladesh are
fundamentally a business operation run by the owners, and a
pretty good business investment at that. Schools set up by
renting a building in a residential area with a handful of
friends of the owner helping out as teachers, charge in excess
of Taka 500 per month per student. If the per capita expenses
are calculated with respect to the facilities provided, the
motivation behing running such an institution becomes only
too obvious.
2. Most of the teachers in these schools are otherwise unemployed
housewives, and have received no formal training in teaching.
3. The pay-scale of these teachers is paltry, even without any
subjective comparison to the amount of income that would be
generated by the collective tuition of the students. (Fact:
senior teachers at schools like St. Joseph are paid more than
senior teachers at B.I.T.). Incentive for good teachers, whither?
4. The selectivity of the admission process of these schools is
usually: if you can pay, you're in!
These are certainly true of the neighborhood kindergartens that
one sees in Dhaka, which all claim to provide some degree of
schooling in the English medium. However, more prestigious EMS
schools in Dhaka like Maple Leaf, Scholastica, B.I.T. Sunbeams,
et al also suffer from these malaises.
On to the curricula:
5. The standard of Bengali is not even in contention here.
The interest in Bengali may be, but it has already been shown
that such interest has become more and more rarified.
6. Geography: both Shabbir and Aveek have pointed out that
they learnt to draw the maps out of personal inducement or
initiative. The national geography is not taught at these
schools and and honestly, how many people do you really
believe go out and learn about their country's geography on
their own?
7. Civics: I am pretty certain that the constitution and the
organization of the state of Bangladesh are not taught in EMS,
something taught in classes IV through VII in BMS.
Ultimately what transpires? A lack of grounding and interest
in the language, a Euro-centric education that by definition
focuses on something other than Bangladesh, and a politics of
identity that at the educational level equates with the other
students studying the same curricula elsewhere, but not with
the goings-on surrounding them culturally, linguistically, or
even in some cases, socially.
Please understand that this is not study in the ultimate efficacy
of the EM system, but rather, a indication that given the current
circumstances, the average student in the English medium schools
undergoes a level of cultural alienation that s/he has to strive
against to retain h(er)is proclivity to equate oneself with the
common culture.
I find something inherently wrong with that.
R. "To say nothing of American International School" A.
: ascoolasice
: Shabbir Ahmed
: e-mail SA7...@cub.uca.edu
: phone (501)329-4559
: "When the going gets tough, the tough gets going"
: - DON'T KNOW.
: ascoolasice
Tabassum Jahangir
Kazi Zahin Hasan <ks...@namaste.cc.columbia.edu> wrote:
>In article <2pp8ur$n...@sylvia.smith.edu>, Tabassum Jahangir
><tjah...@grendel.csc.smith.edu> wrote:
>>I maintain that there are still enough BMS's who are only too happy
>>to cast all that is Bangali and join the EMS's in their sordid
>>orgies.
>
> Sordid orgies?! 8-P
That was actually meant as a little bit of sarcasm 8-)
Tabassum
Pati Mastan
: In article <2pp57m$t...@amhux3.amherst.edu>,
: Pati Mastan <rah...@unix.amherst.edu> wrote:
: > The question never has been whether English
: ^^^^^
: > medium schools provide education with an international bent;
: > rather, it is if the process of education in these schools somehow
: > abet cultural alienation in the context of Bangladesh.
: As far as my feeble mind can comprehend, there have been a bunch of issues
: related to the EMS/BMS dichotomy under discussion. Not only the alienation
: part but also exclusiveness, superiority of varying systems, etc.
: Somehow, I would hesitate to use such absolutes as "never" in these
: convoluted scb discussions.
TJ, the sentence reads: "The question never has been whether English
medium schools provide education with an international bent...."
I should say I am justified in using "never" in this regard.
: Peace Rafi, even if it's eurocentric :-)
R. "Anything, Oh! anything to procrastinate...." A.
Tabassum Jahangir
> The question never has been whether English
^^^^^
> medium schools provide education with an international bent;
> rather, it is if the process of education in these schools somehow
> abet cultural alienation in the context of Bangladesh.
As far as my feeble mind can comprehend, there have been a bunch of issues
related to the EMS/BMS dichotomy under discussion. Not only the alienation
part but also exclusiveness, superiority of varying systems, etc.
Somehow, I would hesitate to use such absolutes as "never" in these
convoluted scb discussions.
Btw, I think "criticism" can sometimes be a euphemism for "bashing". If I
were to say something "homo-critical" for example, would I be allowed to
get away with it :-) ?
> The point re. maps that I was getting at is simply this:
> Geography is compulsory in SSC, and 40% of it is on Bangladesh;
> as a result, anybody attempting to score in excess of 60% *must*
> learn how to draw the map of Bangladesh.
Does being able to draw Bangladesh's map really imply deep-rooted affinity for
the culture, love for the land and its people, etc?
I maintain that there are still enough BMS's who are only too happy to cast all
that is Bangali and join the EMS's in their sordid orgies. I have
heard BMS's slate EMS's for coming abroad to study. Well, look at the
sheer numbers of the B's in the US alone. A few have been known to forget
Bangla within a few weeks of being here :-) That is of course their prerogative
English medium schools have enough drawbacks as do Bangla medium schools. It's
unfortunate that there is this needless friction when, it seems, most high
school B-deshis (regardless of language orientation) want the same thing.
Considering the political chaos in the Desh, they all want
an opportunity to get into a good school as far away as possible. This may
sound harsh to some but I think it will ring true for many.
As for being Euro-centric, I don't think any of us can get away from that. To
whatever extent, we all carry that around with us. European colonization
was too massive a juggernaut for anyone to escape from it...besides Gandhi
that is...:-)
Kazi Zahin Hasan
>to cast all that is Bangali and join the EMS's in their sordid
>orgies.
Sordid orgies?! 8-P
Reality check! Dhaka's much-vaunted english medium parties are
not orgies by any stretch of the imagination... if you so much as
speak to a female whom you don't already know personally, you will
start a fight.
Regards.
Zahin Hasan When a stupid man is doing something
ks...@columbia.edu he's ashamed of, he always declares
za...@occs.cs.oberlin.edu that it is his duty.
- George Bernard Shaw
Javed Jahangir
Hai hai Zahin, Scholasticar experience ta miss korla nakee?
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"I drove my karma over my dogma..."
-anon
Al-Kamal M. Karim
Bengoli Medium vs. English Medium:
A ghazal from Zagzit Singh:
Ye doulat bhi lelo, ye shohrot bhi lelo
Bhale chin lo mujse meri zawani
Magar muzko lota do mere buspan ki sawan,Oo kagaz ki kashti
Oo barash ki paani.
(whatever I have take everything but give me back my sweet childhood)
Yes,this is an universal urge and each & everyone of us like to talk
about our childhood memories,our time in schools,colleges,etc.
I should say Scholastica people are also reminiscing there good old days
but why this fight of medium ?
The fight is only because you people compare between the two and EM people
want to sit on the top irrespective to their apptitude level (more often they
forget there are thousands of stuedents from BM going to many top schools
around the world and they think other than themselves everyone changes
after coming to America.I mean they're so prepolished !!).
And that is why we see heading like 'Scholastica,now kadamtoli, what is next
,Bhangarhat ,HA HA.. ??' from scholastica people. I was a bit irritated after looking
at that heading and replied .In reply I was asked not to compare Scholastica
with those bengoli medium school which produce all 'chattel' minded students.
This kind of attitude definitely helps in bashing so-called english-mediumers
not English Medium.English is a universal language and nobody owns that.Everyone
has to speak it while abroad and I guess nobody from BM needs license to speak English
from EM people.
Notre Dame and Dhaka College students also talk about their colleges but that
never lead to a controversy like we see now.
There were lot of good subjcts to write on the net and it used to be.We should
go back to those. Please don't push yourself above a limit where you don't
belong and it might creat another war.
So if you like to remember sweet memories be sweet, not souring others.
Sabbir's words are right and they are af follows..
:
: ascoolasice
: Shabbir Ahmed
: e-mail SA7...@cub.uca.edu
: phone (501)329-4559
:
: "When the going gets tough, the tough gets going"
: - DON'T KNOW.
:
:
It's true a pen is mightier than a sword.
Amin.
Sunando Sen
Al-Kamal M. Karim <amk...@mtu.edu> wrote:
>
>Bengoli Medium vs. English Medium:
>
>A ghazal from Zagzit Singh:
Jagjit Singh.
>Ye doulat bhi lelo, ye shohrot bhi lelo
>Bhale chin lo mujse meri zawani
>Magar muzko lota do mere buspan ki sawan,Oo kagaz ki kashti
>Oo barash ki paani.
This will look vastly better if you replace all the z's except the
last one with j, and the only occurance of j with jh.
Incidentally, is ghazal popular in Bangladesh? I somehow thought that
Urdu would bring back bad memories... Also, how popular are the Hindi
movies? Sorry for the digression.
Regards,
Sunando Sen
mhe...@hamp.hampshire.edu
Whatever. Take your preaching and stuff it.
>
>So if you like to remember sweet memories be sweet, not souring others.
Yeah yeah.
>Sabbir's words are right and they are af follows..
>:
>: ascoolasice
>: Shabbir Ahmed
>: e-mail SA7...@cub.uca.edu
>: phone (501)329-4559
>:
>: "When the going gets tough, the tough gets going"
>: - DON'T KNOW.
>:
>:
>
>It's true a pen is mightier than a sword.
>
>Amin.
>
Ok Mr. Toughy, just get going. Toodles.
Moazzem Hossain
writes:
[deleted]
|> world, not just in Bangladesh. The curriculam for every subjects
^^^^^^^^^^
|> under O/A level is same for every countries. As a student of
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
|> Scholastica('82-'92), I would also like to argue some comments made
[deleted]
|>
|> Lastly, a lot of people has said that EMS is just for the rich kids
^^^^^^^^^^
|> of the country...I can only laugh at this as this is true! Why should
|> not it be? I don't know why some guys talk about affording EMS by
|> middle/lower class...because they can't.
Obviously, it's just not the Bengali culture that is missing from the EMS,
some of EMS students are missing something else as well :-)
|> The main reason, obviously,
|> is the tuition expense.
What are the other reasons?
Allow me to summarize your article:
1. EMS does not teach any Bangladeshi culture. YOU agree with that.
2. Scholastica, an EMS, encouraged Bangladeshi culture more than
anything else, although they didn't teach it...
3. No EMS teach their students about geography of Bangladesh...as it is
not included in the curricula... YOU agree with that.
4. EMS is just for the rich kids - YOU wholeheartedly agree with that; because
EMS should be one of the ways to distinguish between the upper class
and middle/LOWER class kids.
Did I miss something?
|> ascoolasice
|> Shabbir Ahmed
|> e-mail SA7...@cub.uca.edu
|> phone (501)329-4559
|>
|> "When the going gets tough, the tough gets going"
|> - DON'T KNOW.
|>
|>
+----------------------------------------------------------------------+
| Moazzem Hossain Hello: (408) 433-4880 (x7285) |
| Compass Design Automation Fax: (408) 434-7820 |
| 1865 Lundy Avenue, M/S 410 E-mail: moa...@compass-da.com |
| San Jose, CA 95131 |
+----------------------------------------------------------------------+