Rattle can painting over powder coat?
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Rob Hawks
Jun 5, 2017, 8:56:07 PM6/5/17
to SF Randonneurs
Hi,
I have an old Follis 172 that is my commute bike (and occasional rando bike!). It is the bike I put most of my miles on annually, and with this current down time forced on me I'm thinking it might be a good chance to get it looking a bit nicer. A powder coat finish seems the most appropriate for a commute bike, but there are some details, coarse as they were in the early 1970s, to the original paint job that I'd like to match. Has anyone painted over powder coating with a rattle can paint? I need to apply some contrasting paint to the head lugs, and some details elsewhere to match the original design. Any caveats?
rob
Michael Svihura
Jun 5, 2017, 9:11:18 PM6/5/17
to Rob Hawks, SF Randonneurs
We painted an old Motobecane as an ornament for our backyard. I used some Rustoleum from a spray can, two coats of primer and two coats of final. It's held up quite well in our garden, especially the frame. The results are here: https://flic.kr/p/8qVQZa
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Derek Ching
Jun 6, 2017, 11:21:49 AM6/6/17
to mic...@svihura.com, Rob Hawks, SF Randonneurs
I've done a re-paint using a rattle can paint. The best results I've had was after thoroughly removing all previous paint (down to base metal) and then removing all oils from the frame prior to applying the primer and then the new paint and top coat.
Spray lightly and keep the can moving. I got best results with lighter coats and wet sanding with "000" and "0000" grit before applying the next coat. Once the coats have been applied, tape and then paint the joints. Two coats of top coat will protect your project for a long time.
Good luck.
Rob Hawks
Jun 6, 2017, 11:28:26 AM6/6/17
to Derek Ching, Michael Svihura, SF Randonneurs
NB: the topic not rattle can vs. Powder coat. It is asking about applying rattle can spray paint *on top of* powder coat (for the purpose of adoing minor details to the design that may not be practical or cost effective with powder coating).
Bruce Berg responded with some on point advice regarding sanding the powder coated surfaces that will have a layer of spray paint applied.
Rob
Drew Carlson
Jun 6, 2017, 11:55:53 AM6/6/17
to rob....@gmail.com, Derek Ching, Michael Svihura, SF Randonneurs
Sometimes items are powdercoated with parts taped off, so they don't get coated. Is there a reason you couldn't first paint parts you want painted, let it cure, then tape those portions off, and have remainder of frame powdercoated?
On Tue, Jun 6, 2017 at 8:28 AM Rob Hawks <rob....@gmail.com> wrote:
NB: the topic not rattle can vs. Powder coat. It is asking about applying rattle can spray paint *on top of* powder coat (for the purpose of adoing minor details to the design that may not be practical or cost effective with powder coating).Bruce Berg responded with some on point advice regarding sanding the powder coated surfaces that will have a layer of spray paint applied.Rob
On Jun 6, 2017 8:21 AM, "Derek Ching" <dchi...@gmail.com> wrote:
I've done a re-paint using a rattle can paint. The best results I've had was after thoroughly removing all previous paint (down to base metal) and then removing all oils from the frame prior to applying the primer and then the new paint and top coat.Spray lightly and keep the can moving. I got best results with lighter coats and wet sanding with "000" and "0000" grit before applying the next coat. Once the coats have been applied, tape and then paint the joints. Two coats of top coat will protect your project for a long time.Good luck.
On Mon, Jun 5, 2017 at 6:11 PM, Michael Svihura <mic...@svihura.com> wrote:
We painted an old Motobecane as an ornament for our backyard. I used some Rustoleum from a spray can, two coats of primer and two coats of final. It's held up quite well in our garden, especially the frame. The results are here: https://flic.kr/p/8qVQZa
On Mon, Jun 5, 2017 at 5:56 PM, Rob Hawks <rob....@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi,I have an old Follis 172 that is my commute bike (and occasional rando bike!). It is the bike I put most of my miles on annually, and with this current down time forced on me I'm thinking it might be a good chance to get it looking a bit nicer. A powder coat finish seems the most appropriate for a commute bike, but there are some details, coarse as they were in the early 1970s, to the original paint job that I'd like to match. Has anyone painted over powder coating with a rattle can paint? I need to apply some contrasting paint to the head lugs, and some details elsewhere to match the original design. Any caveats?rob
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Rob Hawks
Jun 6, 2017, 12:04:08 PM6/6/17
to Drew Carlson, Derek Ching, Michael Svihura, SF Randonneurs
Yes.
I'm told by a professional painter that powder coated frames often suffer from the metal surface not being prepped properly when the shop skips proper prep. I would assume it would be better if the powder coating shop could prep the frame without dealing with taped off portions. It seems to me that the more simple and straightforward you make the task for the powder coater the less likely problems could occur when a detail has been overlooked.
Rob
On Jun 6, 2017 8:55 AM, "Drew Carlson" <w.drew....@gmail.com> wrote:
Sometimes items are powdercoated with parts taped off, so they don't get coated. Is there a reason you couldn't first paint parts you want painted, let it cure, then tape those portions off, and have remainder of frame powdercoated?
On Tue, Jun 6, 2017 at 8:28 AM Rob Hawks <rob....@gmail.com> wrote:
NB: the topic not rattle can vs. Powder coat. It is asking about applying rattle can spray paint *on top of* powder coat (for the purpose of adoing minor details to the design that may not be practical or cost effective with powder coating).Bruce Berg responded with some on point advice regarding sanding the powder coated surfaces that will have a layer of spray paint applied.Rob
On Jun 6, 2017 8:21 AM, "Derek Ching" <dchi...@gmail.com> wrote:
I've done a re-paint using a rattle can paint. The best results I've had was after thoroughly removing all previous paint (down to base metal) and then removing all oils from the frame prior to applying the primer and then the new paint and top coat.Spray lightly and keep the can moving. I got best results with lighter coats and wet sanding with "000" and "0000" grit before applying the next coat. Once the coats have been applied, tape and then paint the joints. Two coats of top coat will protect your project for a long time.Good luck.
On Mon, Jun 5, 2017 at 6:11 PM, Michael Svihura <mic...@svihura.com> wrote:
We painted an old Motobecane as an ornament for our backyard. I used some Rustoleum from a spray can, two coats of primer and two coats of final. It's held up quite well in our garden, especially the frame. The results are here: https://flic.kr/p/8qVQZa
On Mon, Jun 5, 2017 at 5:56 PM, Rob Hawks <rob....@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi,I have an old Follis 172 that is my commute bike (and occasional rando bike!). It is the bike I put most of my miles on annually, and with this current down time forced on me I'm thinking it might be a good chance to get it looking a bit nicer. A powder coat finish seems the most appropriate for a commute bike, but there are some details, coarse as they were in the early 1970s, to the original paint job that I'd like to match. Has anyone painted over powder coating with a rattle can paint? I need to apply some contrasting paint to the head lugs, and some details elsewhere to match the original design. Any caveats?rob
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--- Drew -
Bryan Kilgore
Jun 6, 2017, 12:32:05 PM6/6/17
to San Francisco Randonneurs
Most powder coaters I've used have bead blasted the frame before applying the powder coat. I think you may be able to request masking and multiple colors for an up charge. I think John Fitzgerald powder coats many of his frames. Maybe he would have more info.
-Bryan
Rob Hawks
Jun 6, 2017, 12:39:36 PM6/6/17
to Bryan Kilgore, SF Randonneurs
Bryan,
Simply sand or bead blasting the frame is the incomplete approach and is what leads to rusting later (in the opinion of the professional painter I spoke with. His advice was to ask for metal prep after blasting). The metal prep would be chemical.
John sends his powder coating jobs to West Coast in SSF.
Rob
On Jun 6, 2017 9:32 AM, "Bryan Kilgore" <kool...@gmail.com> wrote:
Most powder coaters I've used have bead blasted the frame before applying the powder coat. I think you may be able to request masking and multiple colors for an up charge. I think John Fitzgerald powder coats many of his frames. Maybe he would have more info.
-Bryan
nm matt
Jun 6, 2017, 1:16:54 PM6/6/17
to San Francisco Randonneurs
rob, i'd be curious to hear about the chemical treatment if you have more information, as i have always just mediablasted a frame then pre-baked it to make sure all the grease, etc is burned off before applying powder.
a heat resistant tape which can withstand the heat of the oven is readily available, but to mask intricate lugs can be a bit tricky as it is not especially malleable and may lead to the adhesive lifting from an area to be masked.
if painting over powder, i agree a light sanding to promote adhesion of paint is paramount. equally important, however, is using a quality, high solids paint. most of the volume in a big box rattle can is vehicle which allows the paint to atomize well, but results in a thin, and often brittle finish. if the paint has to be from a rattle can, perhaps a better bet would be to make a visit to an auto paint supply house. the paint will be more expensive per oz., but will offer better adhesion and, in my experience better UV resistance.
good luck, matt
a heat resistant tape which can withstand the heat of the oven is readily available, but to mask intricate lugs can be a bit tricky as it is not especially malleable and may lead to the adhesive lifting from an area to be masked.
if painting over powder, i agree a light sanding to promote adhesion of paint is paramount. equally important, however, is using a quality, high solids paint. most of the volume in a big box rattle can is vehicle which allows the paint to atomize well, but results in a thin, and often brittle finish. if the paint has to be from a rattle can, perhaps a better bet would be to make a visit to an auto paint supply house. the paint will be more expensive per oz., but will offer better adhesion and, in my experience better UV resistance.
good luck, matt
Larry Sokolsky
Jun 6, 2017, 2:09:41 PM6/6/17
to matt.br...@gmail.com, San Francisco Randonneurs
A good powder coater will apply a zinc phosphate or iron phosphate coating as soon as the frame is stripped and cleaned. Failure to do this soon after stripping will make the powder coat much more likely to adhere poorly with the frame.
Larry
Larry
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