OT: Tips for building speed?

[Cameron Scott]

Hi,

I'm a relatively new cyclist but a long-time runner. I'm training for an Olympic triathlon -- 25 mile bike portion. I have no trouble with the endurance aspect of rides up to 50 miles. But I'm slow. Slower than makes sense to me given my strength and endurance. (10.5 mph average on Marin Headlands ride, peak speeds on flat surfaces without full-on sprinting of 14 maybe 16 mph)

And, yes, I've been doing intervals!

Is there something I'm missing in terms of technique? I have clips and try to think about pushing through the bottom arc as if I were wiping something off the bottom of my shoe.

Is it my bike? I have a Specialized Sirrus Elite (city hybrid), which has road components except MTB shifters. The tires are Continental -- not race tires but light and thin for the rims. When I've asked at bike stores, they indicate that a true road bike could shave a few minutes off my time, but they don't say the bike is totally the wrong bike to ride to get a decent time.

Thanks in advance for any tips!

Cameron

[Ken MacInnis]

For a short race like that, I wouldn't bother with a new bike - yet. I'd focus on transition times and techniques. You'll save more time with brick workouts (a run after a bike being more valuable than a bike after a swim, here). Breaking the mental barrier of "my legs don't work like I expected!" when the run starts is a big deal.

All the technique in the world won't help if you bonk your nutrition strategy or mental game two+ hours into a grueling workout like this, so spending some time with a full-length simulation will be worth it.

A road bike will eventually be useful. Remember to learn how to change a flat quickly if you haven't!

Ken

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[Carlin Eng]

I've never done a triathlon, but from a pure road cycling perspective, aerodynamics is a huge part of speed, and body position is the biggest component of aerodynamics. A city hybrid likely has flat bars, which leave you very upright and significantly impact your speed. Over a 25 mile TT (probably > 1 hour long), I'm guessing that a lower, more aerodynamic position that aerobars or drop handlebars offer will shave a fair amount of time.

[Lina Mårtensson]

Assuming you actually enjoy riding bikes, get a road bike. I think you'd be a lot faster on it, but more importantly, it would also be more fun.

On Fri, Jun 6, 2014 at 10:42 AM, Cameron Scott <camer...@gmail.com> wrote:

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[Ken MacInnis]

Very true. I assumed the race was soon and that wholescale changing his training wouldn't help more than optimizing it. There's plenty of opportunity to buy a new bike after this race if the bug sticks. :)

A road bike with clip-on bars (and a speed bottle or rigged-up aerobar bottle) is a really good setup for 99% of the racers out there. I like the Speedfil since in a longer race, you can just dump a bottle or two of water in them at a bottle exchange, instead of throwing away your own. Even so, you need to spend time training on the aerobars and using the muscles they activate, otherwise you're just going to get sore a third of the way in and end up slower than without them. But, like Lina says, it's probably worth picking up a road bike anyway.

A TT/tri bike is overkill for most people. The aggressive positioning is great for muscle activation and the cockpit is optimized for straightline speed, but you need to spend a lot of dough on a very specialized machine if you want noticeable benefits over a good tri-optimized road setup, and even that mostly at 70.3+ distances. And then you've got a fairly heavy tool you can't use in most other training or race cases.

Ken

[Cameron Scott]

Aerobars: check. Will buy. Pronto.

[Jacky Schuler]

A road bike would definitely help but I agree that it might not be worth it yet unless you are ready to get serious about it and spend a decent amount of money (I would say $1500+). It would help but the difference probably won't be big enough to warrant buying a new bike. 

What really helped me was riding SF2G and trying to hold on to the faster rides. I kept getting dropped but eventually I didn't. Of course, a training plan would have helped more but that's a lot of effort. If you are serious, though, that's really what you need...

Also, check these out:

http://www.amazon.com/The-Cyclists-Training-Bible-Friel/dp/1934030201

http://www.amazon.com/The-Time-Crunched-Cyclist-2nd-Ed/dp/193403083X

http://www.amazon.com/The-Time-Crunched-Triathlete-Race-Winning-Fitness/dp/1934030619

Funemployment or not, I am going to Zambia! Click here to learn more about Bike Zambia and donate!!

On Fri, Jun 6, 2014 at 11:00 AM, Carlin Eng <carl...@gmail.com> wrote:

[Jacky Schuler]

I don't know if I would necessarily put aerobars on a hybrid. The geometry isn't right for it. 

Also, are you trying to be super-competitive or just finish in a halfway decent time? 

Funemployment or not, I am going to Zambia! Click here to learn more about Bike Zambia and donate!!

[Lina Mårtensson]

Well, generally riding SF2G on a hybrid bike isn't recommended either... ;)

Carlin is spot on about the aerodynamics though. A hybrid makes you a lot slower.

And yeah, I wouldn't recommend putting aerobars on a hybrid either.

[Cameron Scott]

I'd like to beat 3 hours. Times for run & swim are in line with that. Time for bike is not. I'll ask about the hybrid geometry. Thanks for the book recs!

[Ben Kochie]

I would suggest against aero bars, and focus more on fit of your bike than what kind of bike you have. 

To me it sounds like your saddle is out of position and you are not using your energy efficiently.  Your saddle might feel comfortable, but it may not be in the right place for you to make use of your muscles, even with clips.

[Ken MacInnis]

You're not going to want aerobars on a flat bar setup. Won't get much out of them if you can even get into them at all. I'd do this race, see how it goes, pick up a road bike at some point, and if you want to race again consider aerobars for your next race or two out - they do take some getting used to, handling-wise.

ObBSNYC:  if you really like flat bars you can always go back. Or join the lone wolf pack.

[Jacky Schuler]

Yeah, a hybrid on SF2G would be tough....but I have seen people do it and keep up. You could always rent a road bike for the event but I personally don't think it's a great idea to ride a bike you haven't been training on.

Also, I agree with Ben. Fit is key! I haven't used aero bars so I can't say much about that. 

But yeah, if you are serious about getting into cycling/triathlons a road bike would definitely be a good investment!

Funemployment or not, I am going to Zambia! Click here to learn more about Bike Zambia and donate!!

[Nathan Dushman]

Rent a nicer bike for a day. Pacific Bikes in SOMA rents decent road and tri bikes: http://pacbikes.com/articles/bikes-travel-cases-race-wheels-pg126.htm I'm sure other shops do too. See how you like it and how much faster it is. If you're not ready to buy a bike, you could rent one for a day or two of training (to make sure you're comfortable on it) and on the race day; ask if the shop will give you part of the rental cost as credit towards a later purchase.

Nathan

[Ben Kochie]

When I first started doing SF2G I had flat bars on my lemond cross bike.  I got a fitting from Bespoke in the process of getting my road bike.  The fitting change to the lemond increased my speed by 2mph average.  Basically style 3 to style 2.

[Cameron Scott]

Now that's what I want to hear! Boom, 2 mph!

[John Murphy]

Do you have clip less pedals?

John Murphy - ta...@murphstahoe.com

[Guilherme Germoglio]

from the book Faster: The Obsession, Science and Luck Behind the World's Fastest Cyclists 

"If you do the sums for the 2012 World Championships time trial course, a reasonably hilly 46km, you find that every kilo you saved in weight would gain something around six seconds. Every five watts you saved in aerodynamics gained about 16 seconds. For a serious bike rider on a serious bike, a kilo is a world of weight, and it has to be balanced against the consequent loss of power. Five watts, on the other hand, could be the difference between wearing sunglasses and putting a visor on your helmet. It’s a few centimetres of exposed gear cable. It’s nothing. There is probably no rider in the world who couldn’t take five watts off his position or equipment for a time trial."

(-:

[Matt Redmond]

As an aside, I hate how many sources quote drag figures in watts, rather than grams...

[Peter Chang]

2014-06-06 12:44 GMT-07:00 Matt Redmond <mttr...@gmail.com>:
> As an aside, I hate how many sources quote drag figures in watts, rather
> than grams...

shouldn't it be newtons (or ergs or maybe pounds) as a unit of force?

\p

[Ted Ketai]

Well technically it should be in the dimensionless Drag Coefficient ....