Estimating my time spent on GreenSense/eCG

[John CC]

For the past few years I've been working full time on GreenSense/eCG.

Actually considering I'm borderline obsessed (note my email address haha) I've been working on it beyond full time, since before the sun comes up most days (Tibi and Ken can vouch for that considering we often start chatting online when it's 5 or 6am here) until either after the sun goes down or until I burn out and my brain starts to melt.

I generally work through weekends and holidays. I rarely take days off. Making stuff is my life, and GreenSense has been the primary focus for a very, very long time.

I'm attempting to figure out a reasonable estimate for the amount of time I've spent working on it so I can log it into the VAS, because I haven't logged my time for quite a while (yes that's a bit slack on my part).

One advantage in terms of me logging an estimate of my time spent is that people can look through my GitHub repositories and see that I've made commits pretty much every day for the past few years. Getting more and more frequent and pushing myself even harder the past year or two.

So people can verify a lot of the work I've done.

You can also just look at how much code there is in the GreenSense index, all the devices, and the utility apps I created to make the whole thing work.

Plus there's all the photos of the infrastructure and live systems I've built which I've posted along the way.

You can also look at the fact the latest GreenSense index hardware test number is #1497 (meaning tests have been run that many times). And I'm fairly sure I've reinstalled the hardware test server a few times since I started which means that test number would have been reset a number of times, so it's actually run many more times than that.

I'm thinking an estimate of around 3 years worth of full time work might be reasonable to log. But to be totally honest I'm not entirely sure exactly how much time I've spent on it.

What does everyone think of this?

Is this an overestimate? Or an underestimate? Is it reasonable?

I've actually been working on it for longer than 3 years. The first prototypes were created around 5 or 6 years ago. But I wasn't working full time on it back then I disappeared now and then taking long breaks from tech. And I did actually log much of that time in the early days.

I don't want to overestimate and cause other contributors to lose out when it comes to receiving dividends.

I don't want to underestimate too much because I have put a massive amount of effort into the project as most people are probably well aware. And I want to make enough money from this project to fund new projects and for it to eventually allow me to earn a living from it.

I am prepared to underestimate my time to some extent partly because I don't want to rip off everyone else who has contributed, and because a lot of my time has been what I call "university" time. It was time spent learning. People don't get paid to go to university.

I earned knowledge through that time. I'll reuse that knowledge (and a lot of the code) over and over again so that is its own payment.

I'll be churning out new projects once GreenSense is solid and a self sustaining organization so I'll be earning money from those new projects as well.

Also I would rather underestimate my time slightly so I'm not receiving pretty much all of the dividends and other contributors are receiving almost nothing. I would rather other contributors receive a good share of the dividends so they are incentivised to keep contributing, and so hopefully it pays their bills and puts food on the table eventually, allowing them to put even more time into GreenSense because they don't need to have another job to pay the bills.

But considering I built the system and have worked on it pretty much full time for years it makes sense that I am likely to hold the majority share in the project.

Let me know what you think.

Should I increase that estimate? Should I reduce it? Should I go with that?

I'm not quite sure.

Cheers,

John

[Bob Haugen]

One other factor: if and when we in Wisconsin get some GreenSense
buyers, we will need to decide if we want to manufacture locally from
GreenSense recipes (which we would prefer). If we do, we will big-time
cite John in our local value equation, or maybe cite the GreenSense
project, so that any income can get to all of the other contributors
like Kenneth or the Montreal crew.

I can't promise that we will ever get any buyers or do any local
manufacturing, but you might have that in the back of your mind
somewhere, because it could come up in other situations.

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[Tiberius Brastaviceanu]

Hi John,

The best way to go, in my opinion, is to get on a call next week and discuss about it, decide on some metrics (ways to estimate) and even try to brake all that into % in different roles (software, hardware, communication, documentation, facilitation,... ) I did this before and you'll see it's easy and in the end we can reach a sense of fairness. 

In parallel to that, people here can provide their ideas/opinions. 

Once John and I finish the estimation process we present it here. 

John, can we set a date next week? 

Can do the same with Ken.

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[Kenneth O'Regan]

Hi,

It’s good that these topics are being examined. Given my level of input to the development of GreenSense with John, I think that should minimally be a 3 way conversation rather than a series of one to one’s.

Speak soon,

Kenneth

[Bruce Merlo]

Hi John

   You are core member of the team.  I am more than guilty for not logging my time.  Perhaps if you can give an estimate of your time on a daily, weekly or monthly basis, or just go by your regular rutine.  Even add  time to those inspirational ideas, that you have in your sleep.

Cheers

Bruce

   

[John CC]

Sorry for the slow reply on this one. As usual I've been swamped.

I'm definitely open to having a conference/meeting on how to quantify and categorise my contributions. I'd like to have others double check my estimates and confirm that they are indeed fair.

It's difficult to quantify because my work is often erratic but for the past few years I've been working on GreenSense/GrowSense almost every day, often from when the sun comes up (or before it comes up) to when the some goes down (or long after many times). Including working through weekend and holidays.

That is about as close as I can get to specifying a routine.

To come up with a ball park figure I was thinking 3 years, times 50 weeks (per year excluding 2 weeks for "holidays" or time off), times 5 days per week, times 8 hours per day.

While often I work much more than 8 hours per day and more than 5 days per week at times my day gets interrupted with things like helping out with renovations, etc. So I figured that kinda balances it all out.

But I'm definitely prepared to discuss other ways of estimating my time. Or even just coming up with a monetary value for what I've built. Whatever work best and whatever everyone is happy with.

Could we organise a group meeting/conference at some point?

I also need to point out that in the past year(ish) Ken and I have been brainstorming pretty much every day on the direction the tech, documentation, infrastructure, administration, and business side of things should go. So he has been invaluable in terms of helping me figure out how best to go about what I'm doing. As well as helping me solve technical issues I've been having. And as such we need to figure out how to quantify Ken's contributions and get him credited for them.

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[Tiberius Brastaviceanu]

Hi all, 

Nothing to be worried about. We've done it in the past and we almost finished the process with John this time, 2 hours of work for 3 years worth of logging. 

We have a method for this and here how it looks in John's case. John is still tweaking the numbers.  

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1l129ZtlEcQr2XBhpiCejeJtn6Dv8q1_HBGOPAiOA9AI/edit?usp=drivesdk

But this time I went a step further, and I created a spreadsheet template to help others in the future to use the same methodology. I still need to write a text in there, with instructions about this methodology. 

Note that doing this requires a bit of knowledge about how the NRP (where the data will be transferred) represents the economic reality of the network, including your contributions in the context of a project. 

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/16BVWymzVs2Gu-sPQ-og69H_3-ORlBNRLOIw0Fne1gaA/edit?usp=drivesdk

Feel free to contact me if you want to use this template. 

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