Looking for source of paper (or Mylar) tape with prepunched sprocket holes

[eric.mack]

I'm looking at a mystery paper tape punch mechanism (just the punch, no electronics) and thinking about restoring it, perhaps with an H10 interface.

I realize that I would need a source of paper tape, so I thought I'd start with this group for suggestions. So far, the few rolls I found on eBay do not have the sprocket holes.

Does anyone know of/have a source of paper (or Mylar) tape with prepunched sprocket holes?

[eric.mack]

While I'm at it, I'm curious to know if the H10 paper tape punch was friction feed or if it used a sprocket and required paper tapes with prepunched sprocket feed holes? (Sorry if I am not using correct terms - I'm willing to learn)

[dwight]

When I've used punches in the past, there was sprocket wheel on the output side. One would pull that tape slightly while entering rubouts or feeds. It would start cutting holes to match. You'd only need to do it when changing reels.
Dwight

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From: se...@googlegroups.com <se...@googlegroups.com> on behalf of eric.mack <Eric...@FasterAtWork.com>
Sent: Monday, September 23, 2019 2:03 PM
To: SEBHC <se...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: [sebhc] Re: Looking for source of paper (or Mylar) tape with prepunched sprocket holes

 

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[Douglas Miller]

I don't know about your punch, but at least ASR33 Teletypes punch the sprocket holes along with any data holes. Any punch that used standard paper tape would have to do the same. Otherwise, you have a nightmare situation trying to ensure the sprocket holes are aligned with the data punches.

[eric.mack]

OK, that explains a lot. For all I know, this mechanism may have come from an ASR33. All I have is the punch mechanism, which I have traced all wires and mechanisms to.

Here is a top view photo with the chad cover removed.

There are 9 dies, so that makes sense, then, that the 4th one up from the bottom is to punch the timing holes. That leaves 3 holes below and 5 above for 8 bit Baudot code, I think.

So, I can order 1" paper tape with no holes from a local surplus house and try that.

Douglas, what threw me off was the sprocket at the intake as well as the out feed (see photo). So does the intake sprocket function just like a friction roller for unpunched paper?

On Monday, September 23, 2019 at 2:58:34 PM UTC-7, durgadas311 wrote:

I don't know about your punch, but at least ASR33 Teletypes punch the sprocket holes along with any data holes. Any punch that used standard paper tape would have to do the same. Otherwise, you have a nightmare situation trying to ensure the sprocket holes are aligned with the data punches.

On 9/23/19 4:03 PM, eric.mack wrote:

While I'm at it, I'm curious to know if the H10 paper tape punch was friction feed or if it used a sprocket and required paper tapes with prepunched sprocket feed holes? (Sorry if I am not using correct terms - I'm willing to learn)

On Monday, September 23, 2019 at 2:02:12 PM UTC-7, eric.mack wrote:

I'm looking at a mystery paper tape punch mechanism (just the punch, no electronics) and thinking about restoring it, perhaps with an H10 interface.

I realize that I would need a source of paper tape, so I thought I'd start with this group for suggestions. So far, the few rolls I found on eBay do not have the sprocket holes.

Does anyone know of/have a source of paper (or Mylar) tape with prepunched sprocket holes?

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[Douglas Miller]

Oh! you have a paper tape reader, not a punch. That's why there are sprockets.

The ASR33 punches were strictly friction-feed, although they actually had "knurled" wheels that drove the tape and actually imprinted a subtle pattern along the center where they gripped the tape.

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[eric.mack]

No, this mechanism is definitely a PUNCH, with no provision fro reading.

There are no electronics. Just 9 solenoid driven levers to the punch pins, a cam that turns to force them through the paper, and 3 micro switches to sense paper in/out and rotation of the cam.

Really quite fascinating how it works. Took me a long time to figure it what it was and how it worked. I plan to build a board/arduino circuit to show status of the sensors and to let me punch something and then, perhaps, someday, when my H8 is running, make an interface.

I have no idea why tape readers and punched are so seductive except that it brings back memories of school when computing made noise, whether it was a tape punch, an 029 Keypunch, or the card readers/sorters or the IBM Selectric terminals. It was fun to hear computers at work.

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[Mike Loewen]

On Mon, 23 Sep 2019, eric.mack wrote:

> OK, that explains a lot. For all I know, this mechanism may have come from
> an ASR33. All I have is the punch mechanism, which I have traced all wires
> and mechanisms to.

Definitely not from an ASR33. Here are some good pictures of the ASR33
punch and reader mechanisms:

https://www.pdp8.net/asr33/pics/punch_front.shtml?small
https://www.pdp8.net/asr33/pics/rdr_front.shtml?small


Mike Loewen mlo...@cpumagic.scol.pa.us
Old Technology http://q7.neurotica.com/Oldtech/

[eric.mack]

Douglas wrote (in another thread, by accident):

OK, if I squint just right I can imagine a 3rd dimension to the photo and the tape must then pass under that metal (die) block. That does make the sprocket wheel on the input rather odd. You certainly didn't want that sprocket to perforate the tape, as it would mess up alignment during reading. The sprocket teeth look different on that wheel - are they spring loaded? or somehow more gentle?

Eric responds:

Douglas, inspired by what you shared and still figuring out how this mechanism works, I stuffed a post-it note under the die (you are correct about that) and manually tripped the pins and rotated the mechanism that drives the pins through the paper. It's quiet and as you can see it does indeed perforate the tracking/timing/feed holes - which I did not realize. if you look closely, you can see small indentations on the feed side that show how it grips the paper. both sprockets are fixed, however, the covers, are spring-loaded which allows some flexibility.

Now, I just need to find a source for some paper tape and also for some sample tapes that I can see if I can read.

[eric.mack]

Here is the photo:

[Norberto Collado]

Ebay is your best choice. For example:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Numeridex-Laminated-Control-tape-CNC-Paper-punch-tape-NOS-sealed-1000-ft/183945636210?hash=item2ad403a972:g:164AAOSwtZJddVjY

Also a nice article related to same topic:

https://www.instructables.com/id/DIY-Paper-TapePunch-Card-Maker-and-Reader/

Norberto

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