water heater question

[Robin Briggs]

Our (tankless) water heater has broken and needs to be replaced. It sits in a corner of an unfinished basement that also holds a furnace, heat ducts, etc. The basement itself isn't heated. Would it be better to get a water heater tank with a heat pump on top, or a simple old-style electric water tank heater? Or is there another possibility I am missing? I wasn't really expecting this, and am trying to come up to speed quickly. 

Thanks!

 - robin

[Amy Wheeless]

Hi Robin! That sounds stressful - sorry!  I'm not sure I have specific advice for your situation, but I lean toward heat pump water heaters. It sounds like it could work with your set-up. Here's a recent NRDC article on this: https://www.nrdc.org/stories/whats-most-energy-efficient-water-heater 

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[Robin Briggs]

Thanks! I think that may end up being the best for us, I was a little concerned about whether it would end up leaching heat from the furnace -- sounds like I shouldn't be too worried about that since the basement isn't heated. Really impressed by the $500 rebate from SCL for it!

[Jonlin, Duane]

Robin,

A heat pump water heater in the basement will certainly make the basement colder. If there's no insulation between the basement and the main living space, it would make the floor colder to the touch, and will draw heat down out of the main living space. (This could be a good thing on a hot summer day, but I digress...)

That's why I'm more enthused about the split system CO2-based heat pumps - the heat pump itself sits outside, so it doesn't cool your home. Those Sanden units are very quiet, work well on very cold days, and the CO2 refrigerant won't exacerbate global warming. 

DJ

Duane Jonlin, FAIA Energy Code and Energy Conservation Advisor City of Seattle Department of Construction and Inspections P.O. Box 34019, Seattle, WA 98124-4019 P: 206.233.2781 |  duane.jonlin@seattle.gov

As stewards and regulators of land and buildings, we preserve and enhance the equity, livability, safety and health in our communities. SDCI’s offices are closed to in-person services until further notice. Visit the SDCI website and read our Building Connections blog for service change updates. Thank you for your continued flexibility and patience as we provide online services to help reduce the risk of spreading the COVID-19 virus.

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[hollytownes]

Robin

You won't be ribbing your furnace that much if it is a big space.  Better if it is right next to it though. The only air your furnace would be getting is combustion air . Your basement will be a little colder. When you get it setpoints for electic strip heat kicking in will be critical to whether it is really efficient. Have them show you where and how to set these. 

I am available if you want to talk more. Be sure your basement door is weatherstripped.

Holly

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From: Robin Briggs <rbrig...@gmail.com>

Date: 12/23/20 12:29 PM (GMT-08:00)

To: Western Washington Home Electrification <seattle-home-e...@googlegroups.com>

Subject: Re: water heater question

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[hollytownes]

Robbing not ribbing

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[Kristen Dotson]

Just had this happen to me a couple of months ago too. I actually wanted the split system CO2 Sanden, but was quoted a $15,000 price tag for it. A super efficient heat pump tank would only run about $5000.

So I went with the cheapest unit I could get to buy myself time (life without hot water + 2 little kids is miserable). Hoping to get a CO2 unit or even an R134 heat pump in a few years when I've saved up some cash and can schedule the replacement on a more relaxed schedule.

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[Robin Briggs]

Thanks to everyone for the advice! To update you on what ended up happening -- we got the old one fixed under warranty. We still had to pay for labor, and it means we have invested more in gas, which we were trying to avoid. But we couldn't find someone who would come and do electrical work before the holiday.

Some of what I found out, for whoever comes next:

- The split system CO2 Sanden sounds great, I didn't get a price on it, but is backordered until Feb. They are coming out with a new model which requires recertifying.

- The hybrid electric with heat pump on top seems good, more affordable, but we were concerned it would chill down the basement, and the floors. It looks like you can get it to vent outside, which would keep the basement from getting cold (except for the hole in the envelope, I guess). It says online that it shouldn't be anywhere that gets below freezing; not a concern now, but I have no idea how cold the basement would get if we removed the furnace.

We will continue using the (fixed) water heater, and will replace it with electric after we've replaced the furnace.

- robin