Contractors for small commercial heat pump bids

[Kjell Anderson]

Hi all - my church has two smallish buildings (2,000-3,000 sf), each with 3-4 gas furnaces. We have allocated some money to heat-pump-ify or install solar. I'm trying to convince the group to go for heat pumps. Anyone have recommendations for contractors to call? The buildings are smaller than some houses but I'm guessing a contractor would need to know the commercial code. It's in Shoreline near I-5 and 145th.

Thanks!

Kjell

[Jonlin, Duane]

Kjell,

I don't know the answer to your question, but I do have a couple of suggestions.

First thing, get an electrical contractor in to see in there's enough capacity on your SCL service and main panel. If there doesn't appear to be enough, you might try metering the buildings for a month to see what the peak load is - then there's a routine in the electrical code that allows you to assume that any capacity beyond that load plus 25% is available. If you have to replace your utility service and main panel, it might put the heat pumps out of reach.

The second thing is to use the "virtual solar panel," the VSP, as your metric for explaining the relative value of non-visible things like heat pumps to the rest of the congregation. It would be pretty easy to approximate the annual power production you'd get from solar panels in that location, probably something like 1.2 kW per installed watt. And then you can demonstrate the annual energy savings of your heat pumps based on how many solar panels it would take to equal the same savings. I'm picturing all your Sunday School kids holding up painted cardboard "solar panels" out in front as a visual aid.

DJ

	Duane Jonlin, FAIA Energy Code and Energy Conservation Advisor City of Seattle Department of Construction and Inspections P.O. Box 34019, Seattle, WA 98124-4019 P: 206.233.2781 |  duane.jonlin@seattle.gov
	As stewards and regulators of land and buildings, we preserve and enhance the equity, livability, safety and health in our communities.

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From: seattle-home-e...@googlegroups.com <seattle-home-e...@googlegroups.com> on behalf of Kjell Anderson <kjella...@gmail.com>
Sent: Thursday, August 17, 2023 9:32 PM
To: Western Washington Home Electrification <seattle-home-e...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Contractors for small commercial heat pump bids

 

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Hi all - my church has two smallish buildings (2,000-3,000 sf), each with 3-4 gas furnaces. We have allocated some money to heat-pump-ify or install solar. I'm trying to convince the group to go for heat pumps. Anyone have recommendations for contractors to call? The buildings are smaller than some houses but I'm guessing a contractor would need to know the commercial code. It's in Shoreline near I-5 and 145th.

Thanks!

Kjell

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[Tom Balderston]

Great ide about the virtual solar panel. I would add to phrase it in terms of carbon emissions also rather than just energy savings.  Energy savings of an HP over gas is there, but not huge, where the carbon savings is.

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[Jonlin, Duane]

HP has triple the energy efficiency of a gas boiler, right?

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From: Tom Balderston <ecod...@gmail.com>
Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2023 4:26:48 PM
To: Jonlin, Duane <Duane....@seattle.gov>
Cc: Kjell Anderson <kjella...@gmail.com>; Western Washington Home Electrification <seattle-home-e...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: Contractors for small commercial heat pump bids

 

[Tom Balderston]

not exactly...   triple  the energy efficiency of an electric resistance heater. Yes the same is true of gas but the cost of gas per btu is much lower -    As far as energy cost goes,   i would guess   a very efficient  heat pump would be 10-20% savings over gas 

--

Tom Balderston
BALDERSTON ASSOCIATES
11208 1st Ave NW
Seattle WA, 98177

[Jonlin, Duane]

Right. Energy savings.

Increasing gas costs seem to have recently tilted the energy cost issue towards HP, but perhaps not enough to cover the increased equipment cost.

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From: Tom Balderston <ecod...@gmail.com>
Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2023 10:21:09 PM

[Rob Harrison cPHc]

Duane, 

Is that true, that gas equipment is still cheaper  if you take into account the IRA rebates and tax credits on heat pumps? 

Rob Harrison cPHc

HARRISON architects

(206) 794-2738

via iPhone….

http://harrisonarchitects.com/

lyrical sustainable design  ::  passivhaus

On Aug 20, 2023, at 10:35 PM, 'Jonlin, Duane' via Western Washington Home Electrification <seattle-home-e...@googlegroups.com> wrote:



To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/seattle-home-electrification/SJ0PR09MB62551420F6244492D9663D36811EA%40SJ0PR09MB6255.namprd09.prod.outlook.com.

[Jonlin, Duane]

Rob,

Good question.

I don't know the answer, and the net cost difference would also be impacted by whether or not you would subtract the cost of the entire gas supply infrastructure.

DJ

	Duane Jonlin, FAIA Energy Code and Energy Conservation Advisor City of Seattle Department of Construction and Inspections P.O. Box 34019, Seattle, WA 98124-4019 P: 206.233.2781 |  duane.jonlin@seattle.gov
	As stewards and regulators of land and buildings, we preserve and enhance the equity, livability, safety and health in our communities.

---

From: Rob Harrison cPHc <r...@harrisonarchitects.com>
Sent: Monday, August 21, 2023 1:38 AM
To: Jonlin, Duane <Duane....@seattle.gov>
Cc: Tom Balderston <ecod...@gmail.com>; Kjell Anderson <kjella...@gmail.com>; Western Washington Home Electrification <seattle-home-e...@googlegroups.com>

[Kjell Anderson]

Thanks. We have 400A at the main building, with 200A of that submetered to the second building.

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Kjell Anderson

[Alex Leon]

Sure we can help each other find more work and be more open about our bidding process, then again each company runs differently and we need to acknowledge that each of have a role in one anothers success to the point of it making more sense to help each other.

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