starting out as a jr scrum resource

[JM]

woujld someone who has lots of professional experience in customer service, human resources, sales, be able to get an entry-level career as a scrum master if they did the following:

1) get their csm/cspo
2) get side (at home) mentoring and direction from an experienced csm/cspo for 1 month 

3) 3-day training on jira admin and setup.

can someone get a job as a scrum master or product owner, with this as a start?

[Tom Mellor]

No. And we don't use the word "resouece" to describe people. We use "people" or "person." And, we generally detest JIRA, but do favor individuals and interactions over processes and tools. Certification won't make you a Scrum Master.

[JM]

Only used the word "resource" in "human resources" as that's the name of the dept, in almost all companies. Otherwise what else are you referring to?  Certification **does make you a scrum master**, do they know what they are doing, maybe not. Cert == what employers look for, whether that's good or bad, personally, I've met too many CSM that have no clue what they are doing.

So are you saying there is no way to get into agile scrum master or pm whatever you want to call this, as a jr?  I disagree. 

[John Miller]

Pair with an experienced SM.

Get certified. 

Continue education, formally and informally, especially around facilitation at first, then coaching,  and of course Agile. 

Thanks,

John Miller

Scrum Alliance Certified Enterprise Coach

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[Andy Watkins]

Jeff, 

I think what Tom is getting at is that there's a big difference between "being a good Scrum Master", and "getting a job with the title of Scrum Master". A job description for a "scrum master" may cover anything from "we understand Scrum" to "Scrum but..." to "we're pretending to do agile ...". Having a CSM or CSPO certification may be enough to land you your first job with such a title, but being a scrum master requires more experience than that.

Do you have any experience of writing software (or the equivalent if you're considering scrum for another industry)? Knowing what the troops actually do day to day can be helpful.

Regarding Jira, please don't fall into the trap of assuming that Jira == Scrum. Jira is a tool, one of many. Some consider it useful, some consider it harmful, but it is popular. Again, having a bit of Jira experience may land you the job, but won't make you a good SM. Read up on everything Tom and I have mentioned, search for all the above phrases on Youtube. 

Watch this https://youtu.be/q3t8twm3aUk and this https://youtu.be/P6v-I9VvTq4 for starters

Good luck, and let us know how you get on. It won't be easy.

Andy Watkins

an...@wis.co.uk

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[Rixt]

Hi JM,
I recently started coaching an HR tram that wants to increase their agility so that they can deliver value to their customers earlier. To support this they choose to experiment using scrum practices to prioritise, plan, track and validate their work.
They don’t write software but work together with software delivery teams to get some of their services automated.
The HR team experiments with the ProdictvOwner role and the scrum master role without any of them having a certification, yet. They may decide to do so after having gained some insights from their experiments. The role is complementary to their actual job in HR.

Point I am making is that I see Scrum practiced together with Agile principles and values being adopted in other areas than IT. Scrum Master and Product Owners are roles, I don’t consider them as ‘jobs one can apply for’ but reality is that I see a lot of job adds for ScrumMaster. Let that not discourage you to learn more about the role. If you enjoy coordinating teams to support them manage their workflow, and have a passion to bring diverse people together to build valuable stuff for customers, just do it.
If you however want to enter the potentially well paid software industry by getting a sm certification and get tutored at home (?), then I suggest you to re-consider your intentions.
Good luck!

[JM]

I guess I did not explain my question very well.  This was not for me, I just wanted to see opinions of others. I know someone who wants to get into agile/pm/scrum role, in a new company, probably a software company.

I told this person I could mentor them (i'm 22 years exp in sw engineering, and agile for 10, so I know some things) and point them to articles, books, training, certs, etc... and after a few months, they may be able to quit their job and start a jr role somewhere else.  This person is currently a data analyst for a SaaS company but has no future there for reasons I won't get into.  I know this person well and felt they would fill the sm role well, but need enough training to get a "foot in the door" somewhere, to give them a chance (as a jr resource).

Thanks, everyone.

[Mark Levison]

JM - well if they need reading material - here you go: https://agilepainrelief.com/scrummaster-resources-and-references 

I hope your friend has fun changing roles.

Cheers

Mark

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[John Miller]

Just read Mark’s site...enormous info.  

Thanks,

John Miller

Scrum Alliance Certified Enterprise Coach

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