What is this "New Engine" to replace X-33 ???
Colin Gregg
On a documentary on UK TV recently, the topics X-33, DC-X and the
X-Prize were discsussed.
In this program, the narrator said something along the lines of:
"Even as work starts on the X-33, scientists at NASA are designing
an engine more advanced than the X-33's engine..."
What is this "more advanced engine" ? Is it some sort of hybrid
air-breathing jet/rocket? Anybody any ideas?
Thanks.
[ For the interested: this was one of those TV gems that come up about
once a year on British TV. It ran under the Equinox series and was
titled "A Day Trip to Space", looking at the currrent activities which
promise cheaper access to space. It had interviews with all the players
in X-33 (including the LockMart & DC-X teams) and the X-Prize (including
Burt Rutan, Roton and Pioneer Rocketplane). ]
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Scott, the Evil Little Dog
Colin Gregg wrote:
>
> On a documentary on UK TV recently, the topics X-33, DC-X and the
> X-Prize were discsussed.
>
> In this program, the narrator said something along the lines of:
>
> "Even as work starts on the X-33, scientists at NASA are designing
> an engine more advanced than the X-33's engine..."
>
> What is this "more advanced engine" ? Is it some sort of hybrid
> air-breathing jet/rocket? Anybody any ideas?
My guess would be that they are referring to things like ramrockets/ducted
rockets/ejector ramjets. Which, by the way, are under development at more
organization than just NASA.
> [ For the interested: this was one of those TV gems that come up about
> once a year on British TV. It ran under the Equinox series and was
> titled "A Day Trip to Space", looking at the currrent activities which
> promise cheaper access to space. It had interviews with all the players
> in X-33 (including the LockMart & DC-X teams) and the X-Prize (including
> Burt Rutan, Roton and Pioneer Rocketplane). ]
What would be the chances of that airing in the US? Or getting a properly
formatted videotape of it? Anybody know?
William Wiesel
Colin Gregg <co...@majomaca.demon.co.uk> writes:
>On a documentary on UK TV recently, the topics X-33, DC-X and the
>X-Prize were discsussed.
>In this program, the narrator said something along the lines of:
> "Even as work starts on the X-33, scientists at NASA are designing
> an engine more advanced than the X-33's engine..."
>What is this "more advanced engine" ? Is it some sort of hybrid
>air-breathing jet/rocket? Anybody any ideas?
Some guesses, perhaps in ascending order of how far away from the X-33
project we get:
The Venture Star (the full size X-33 followon) will require a larger
engine. The X-33's engines are being cobbled together out of Apollo era J-2
engine parts. The TV correspondant could mean these engines, whose
development is part of the X-33 project, although they won't fly on the X-33.
Work is being done to bring Russian engines and their technology into this
country. Perhaps the correspondant believes (or was told) that these engines
are "more advanced" than the X-33 engines.
Both NASA and the Air Force are funding work in advanced rocket engines.
(Actual rockets, not propeller-turbojet-ramjet-scramjet-rocket engines with 17
operating modes.)
And yes, people are still working on advanced engines which do have 17
operating modes......
These are my own personal opinions, and do not necessarily
represent those of the Air Force, Department of Defense, or U.S.
Government.
William E. Wiesel ph: 513-255-6565 ex 4312
Professor of Astronautical Engineering net: wie...@afit.af.mil
Department of Aeronautics & Astronautics fax: 513-476-7621
Air Force Institute of Technology
Wright-Patterson AFB, OH 45433-7765
Kelly McDonald
Colin Gregg <co...@majomaca.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>On a documentary on UK TV recently, the topics X-33, DC-X and the
>X-Prize were discsussed.
>In this program, the narrator said something along the lines of:
> "Even as work starts on the X-33, scientists at NASA are designing
> an engine more advanced than the X-33's engine..."
>What is this "more advanced engine" ? Is it some sort of hybrid
>air-breathing jet/rocket? Anybody any ideas?
>Thanks.
>
It may be a improved version of the Areospike engine planned for the
X-33
Kelly McDonald
madr...@metronet.com
"Scott, the Evil Little Dog" <sc...@rocketplane.com> wrote:
>Colin Gregg wrote:
>>
>> On a documentary on UK TV recently, the topics X-33, DC-X and the
>> X-Prize were discsussed.
>>
>> In this program, the narrator said something along the lines of:
>>
>> "Even as work starts on the X-33, scientists at NASA are designing
>> an engine more advanced than the X-33's engine..."
>>
>> What is this "more advanced engine" ? Is it some sort of hybrid
>> air-breathing jet/rocket? Anybody any ideas?
>My guess would be that they are referring to things like ramrockets/ducted
>rockets/ejector ramjets. Which, by the way, are under development at more
>organization than just NASA.
Sorry, almost certainly talking about the AeroSpike engine being
developed for the Lockheed/Martin X-33 and Venture Star.
The DC-X's grand-daddy was thePegasus study done by McDonnell Douglas
back in the 1960s. That was a 1 1/2 stange vehicle with drop tanks
and an AeroSpike Engine.
For more details on the curent project do a Web search on "RLV and
NASA" to get the Marshall Space Center's home page.
Bob Lyle
Scott Lowther
In <5b7d3s$e...@newnews.metronet.com> madr...@metronet.com writes:
>
>"Scott, the Evil Little Dog" <sc...@rocketplane.com> wrote:
>
>>Colin Gregg wrote:
>>>
>>> On a documentary on UK TV recently, the topics X-33, DC-X and the
>>> X-Prize were discsussed.
>>>
>>> In this program, the narrator said something along the lines of:
>>>
>>> "Even as work starts on the X-33, scientists at NASA are
designing
>>> an engine more advanced than the X-33's engine..."
>>>
>>> What is this "more advanced engine" ? Is it some sort of hybrid
>>> air-breathing jet/rocket? Anybody any ideas?
>
>>My guess would be that they are referring to things like
ramrockets/ducted
>>rockets/ejector ramjets. Which, by the way, are under development at
more
>>organization than just NASA.
>
>Sorry, almost certainly talking about the AeroSpike engine being
>developed for the Lockheed/Martin X-33 and Venture Star.
Ummm... part of the quote was: "Even as work starts on the X-33,
scientists at NASA are designing an engine more advanced than the
X-33's engine..."
Something can't be more advanced than itself. Now, they could be
talking about the aerospike for the VentureStar, which will be
different than the aerospike for the X-33; but probably not much more
advanced (just bigger).
Michael P. Walsh
Scott Lowther wrote:
>
>
> Ummm... part of the quote was: "Even as work starts on the X-33,
> scientists at NASA are designing an engine more advanced than the
> X-33's engine..."
> Something can't be more advanced than itself. Now, they could be
> talking about the aerospike for the VentureStar, which will be
> different than the aerospike for the X-33; but probably not much more
> advanced (just bigger).---
---
---
It really depends upon what you mean by more advanced. The aerospike for
the VentureStar has not only higher thrust, but a higher chamber pressure.
I believe the X-33 engine chamber pressure is 700-800 psi while the
VentureStar is to be 2,000 psi.
The 2000 psi chamber pressure is 1,000 psi below the chamber pressure
of the SSME, but that isn't the full story. Since it uses a gas generator
cycle instead of a staged combustion cycle the pump pressure requirements
are much lower than those of the SSME. Therefore, it should be possible
to upgrade the VentureStar engine chamber pressure and hopefully still
produce a reusable engine with low maintenance requirements.
Mike Walsh
Dave Weinstein
In article <32D45A...@rocketplane.com>, "Scott, the Evil Little Dog"
<sc...@rocketplane.com> writes
>Colin Gregg wrote:
>>
>> On a documentary on UK TV recently, the topics X-33, DC-X and the
>> X-Prize were discsussed.
>>
>> In this program, the narrator said something along the lines of:
>>
>> an engine more advanced than the X-33's engine..."
>>
>> air-breathing jet/rocket? Anybody any ideas?
>
>My guess would be that they are referring to things like ramrockets/ducted
>rockets/ejector ramjets. Which, by the way, are under development at more
>organization than just NASA.
>
>
>> once a year on British TV. It ran under the Equinox series and was
>> titled "A Day Trip to Space", looking at the currrent activities which
>> promise cheaper access to space. It had interviews with all the players
>> in X-33 (including the LockMart & DC-X teams) and the X-Prize (including
>> Burt Rutan, Roton and Pioneer Rocketplane). ]
>
>What would be the chances of that airing in the US? Or getting a properly
>formatted videotape of it? Anybody know?
--
Dave Weinstein
A Yankee Abroad
pat
In article <32DA79...@pacbell.net>, mp_w...@pacbell.net says...
>
>Scott Lowther wrote:
>>
>
>>
>> Ummm... part of the quote was: "Even as work starts on the X-33,
>> scientists at NASA are designing an engine more advanced than the
>> X-33's engine..."
>> talking about the aerospike for the VentureStar, which will be
>> different than the aerospike for the X-33; but probably not much more
>> advanced (just bigger).---
>---
>---
>It really depends upon what you mean by more advanced. The aerospike
for
>the VentureStar has not only higher thrust, but a higher chamber
pressure.
>
given the vagaries of TV news, etc, what you are probably seeing
is a puff piece on the X-33 ground technology spending.
something like $500 million is being bled off X-33 by MSFC as
a ground technology study plan. We should see some really
excellent view-graphs, some really excellent animations,
some AIAA papers, but i am dubious on us seeing hardware.
From what i hear, $500M is going to Ground technology and
$300 million to engine studies, sothat's what we will see.
pat