Return of the Nihon Kaigun ?
Dott.Piergiorgio
http://www.asahi.com/english/Herald-asahi/TKY200507090150.html
If this bill pass, JMSDF return to be the IJN.....
Also, wandering here and there on the Net, seems that the first of the new
"DDH" (actually CVL) is already laid down, sometimes around 2004, in the
Ishikawajima yard.
(Please feed this *actual* Naval topic ! ;) )
Best regards from Italy,
Dott. Piergiorgio.
Jack Linthicum
http://www.geae.com/aboutgeae/presscenter/marine/marine_20050504.html
GE to Supply IHI with LM2500 Gas Turbines to Power Japan's 16DDH
Destroyer
May 4, 2005 -- EVENDALE, Ohio - GE Transportation's marine
gas turbine business announced it will supply Ishikawajima-Harima Heavy
Industries, Co. Ltd. (IHI) with four GE LM2500 aeroderivative gas
turbines. The engines will power the first of a new class of Japan
Maritime Self-Defense Force's (JMSDF) helicopter-carrying destroyers.
The first vessel will be know as the 16DDH, and it is anticipated that
at least one additional DDH destroyer will be built in the coming
years.
The 13,500-ton DDH destroyer will use two propulsion trains, each
consisting of two LM2500s in a COmbined Gas turbine And Gas turbine
configuration (COGAG), driving a propeller through a gearbox. The
engines will each provide 25,000 shaft horsepower.
"This is an exciting project for the JMSDF as it marks the first of
these new helicopter-carrying destroyers," said Karl Matson, general
manager of GE Transportation's marine business in Evendale, Ohio.
Through its partnership with IHI, GE has supplied the JMSDF with 57
LM2500 and 27 LM500 gas turbines, currently in service on Kongou- and
Murasame-class destroyers, and on the Ichi Go-class missile boats and
Hayabusa-class patrol boats, respectively. In fact, by 2009 when all
ships currently on contract are commissioned, there will be 65 GE
LM2500 gas turbines operating on 22 JMSDF vessels.
Matson added, "We are pleased that the JMSDF has selected the LM2500
for the novel 16DDH application. Through the infusion of more than $473
million for research and development over the past decade, GE keeps its
LM product line on the cutting edge of gas turbine technology. In fact,
GE has made improvements to hot section materials and other components
to increase the power capability and reliability of these gas
turbines."
The LM2500 is a popular choice with 29 navies worldwide for use in a
variety of propulsion system configurations in vessels such as
frigates, corvettes, patrol boats and aircraft carriers. The LM2500 is
also applied for diverse commercial marine projects including fast
ferries and cruise ships. The current fleet of over 1,200 LM2500 gas
turbines has logged more than 50 million hours in service.
GE will supply the LM2500 gas turbine kits to be assembled by IHI at
its Mizuho April 16 and 17 from 9:00 a.m. to 5:00 p.m. Saturday and
Sunday, April 23 and 24 and Kure plants in Japan. The gas turbine
marine modules will be delivered for installation aboard the first
destroyer in the second quarter 2007. The 16DDH will be commissioned in
the first quarter 2009.
GE Transportation's marine business is one of the world's leading
manufacturers of a variety of marine products for military and
commercial marine applications - in the 1,600 to 57,330 shaft
horsepower range - including aeroderivative gas turbines, diesel
engines and main reduction gearing. GE gas turbines range from 6,000 to
57,330 shaft horsepower. The GE diesel family of medium speed engines
includes 8, 12 and 16 cylinder V configurations ranging between 1,400
and 4,500 hp for both commercial marine and industrial applications.
Dott.Piergiorgio
>
> http://www.geae.com/aboutgeae/presscenter/marine/marine_20050504.html
>
> GE to Supply IHI with LM2500 Gas Turbines to Power Japan's 16DDH
> Destroyer
I have already seen this link; actually is the link whose gives the more
detailed info available.....
About the "already laid down" thing, the fact was implicit in two sites, one
being an post in a commentary on JapanToday of April 2005, and the other,
in Italian, in an article in a defense site dated sept.20 2004 (for Alan,
the link is http://www.paginedidifesa.it/2004/tani_040920.html )
Jack Linthicum
I am looking up anything that hits on 16DDH (16 is the reign year, by
the way) and has a naval content, cf
http://www.ships-net.co.jp/homee.htm and
http://www.ships-net.co.jp/detl/200405/indexe.html
http://www.naval-technology.com/contractors/weapon_control/thales5/press9.html
radar
http://www.network54.com/Forum/thread?forumid=211833&messageid=1091472879&lp=1091624027
Thru deck style version of the 16DDH
Dott.Piergiorgio
> I am looking up anything that hits on 16DDH (16 is the reign year, by
> the way) and has a naval content, cf
> http://www.ships-net.co.jp/homee.htm and
> http://www.ships-net.co.jp/detl/200405/indexe.html
Su ships-net.co.jp, look carefully in this page:
http://www.ships-net.co.jp/backs/additional/misce.html
(slight past the middle of the page)
You can notice that in the "Aircraft carriers of the world" there are also
the Osumis, officially landing ships....
Jack Linthicum
I skipped over this paragraph when I saw it as sort of irrelevant:
14.) The Osumi-class "landing ship tank," although having the
appearance of a through-deck aircraft carrier, has neither the
elevators nor reinforced deck necessary for modern Vertical/Short
Takeoff and Landing (VSTOL) fixed-wing aircraft. However, initial
reports on the 16DDH design, funded in the 2004 Japanese Defense
Budget, show that it will have the capability to carry 13-17 VSTOL
aircraft. Japanese interest in the F-35 Joint Strike Fighter program (a
VSTOL-capable design) is well documented. See Yoshitaka Sasaki, "Does
Japan Need a Light Aircraft Carrier?" Asahi Shimbun, 3 October 2003;
and Richard Halloran, "Japan Rethinks Issue of Self-Defense," Honolulu
Advertiser, 13 July 2003.
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0IBR/is_2_34/ai_n6090454/pg_6
There are some budget numbers in this:
www.carlisle.army.mil/ssi/pubs/2004/paths/paths.pdf
which I assumed you had
John Redman
"Dott.Piergiorgio" <dott.Pierg...@SORYUfastwebnet.it> wrote in
message news:K4xAe.13440$b93....@tornado.fastwebnet.it...
> interesting bill draft:
>
> http://www.asahi.com/english/Herald-asahi/TKY200507090150.html
>
> If this bill pass, JMSDF return to be the IJN.....
As long as they call their CVL 'Zuikaku', I have no problem with this.
Brian Allardice
dott.Pierg...@SORYUfastwebnet.it says...
>
>interesting bill draft:
>
>http://www.asahi.com/english/Herald-asahi/TKY200507090150.html
>
>If this bill pass, JMSDF return to be the IJN.....
>
>Also, wandering here and there on the Net, seems that the first of the new
>"DDH" (actually CVL) is already laid down, sometimes around 2004, in the
>Ishikawajima yard.
>
>(Please feed this *actual* Naval topic ! ;) )
Sorry, Doctor, but this instantly becomes political, not here but there.
There is a strong current of Japanese opinion which takes their constitution
very seriously indeed, to the extent of opposing participation in UN missions.
flying a particular flag, and singing a particular song.
Having first written the constitution and then undermining it at every turn,
the Americans and their Japanese poodles have turned the place into a nation of
cynics. This is not to say that there is not a strong irredentist current as
well, witness the "nazi-mobiles" continually zipping around the Tokyo streets,
but these are not the guys with whom one would like to - although it is clear
one often must - associate with American influence. Odd how it all works
out...
Cheers,
dba
BF Lake
"John Redman" <johnphil...@hotmailREMOVETHEBLEEDINOBVIOUS.com> wrote in
message news:dav0hi$31k$1...@newsg3.svr.pol.co.uk...
generally good to call a bird farm a bird's name, though. Any bird will do.
How about "Wrentit?"
Regards,
Barry
Dott.Piergiorgio
>> As long as they call their CVL 'Zuikaku', I have no problem with this.
>>
> What's so good about "Lucky Stork?" Why not "Crane" like her sister? It
> is generally good to call a bird farm a bird's name, though. Any bird
> will do. How about "Wrentit?"
Collective reply to both:
Firstly, Seems to me that "kaku" in Zuikaku means "crane" and not "stork";
actually the Kanji is the that of"crane". Personally I'm more oriented for
"Hosho" for the incoming CVL not only because the old Hosho was also the
first Japanese CV (1922 or so) but also because this means "Rising Phoenix"
and seems to me very fitting, considering the ashes spread across the
Pacific from Coral Sea to Kure......
John Redman
"Dott.Piergiorgio" <dott.Pierg...@SORYUfastwebnet.it> wrote in
message news:NaIAe.14116$b93....@tornado.fastwebnet.it...
> BF Lake wrote:
>
>>> As long as they call their CVL 'Zuikaku', I have no problem with this.
>>>
>> What's so good about "Lucky Stork?" Why not "Crane" like her sister? It
>> is generally good to call a bird farm a bird's name, though. Any bird
>> will do. How about "Wrentit?"
>
> Collective reply to both:
>
> Firstly, Seems to me that "kaku" in Zuikaku means "crane" and not "stork";
> actually the Kanji is the that of"crane".
Yup, AIUI 'Zuikaku' means 'auspicious crane' which is a cool name for a ship
compared to, oh, "John C Stennis" for instance.
Trouble with 'Hosho' is that it evokes an itty-bitty experimental ship with
minimal power and negligible fighting history.
I could go with 'Hiryu' or 'Soryu' or 'Ryujo' too though.
Dott.Piergiorgio
> Trouble with 'Hosho' is that it evokes an itty-bitty experimental ship
> with minimal power and negligible fighting history.
Name meanings and history aside, the fact is that the (first?) Hosho was the
beginnings and testbed of that whose eventually became the Kido Buitai.
And Hosho will also means a new start... After all, German Navy restart
twice their U-count, having three U-1....
> I could go with 'Hiryu' or 'Soryu' or 'Ryujo' too though.
My bet on names is this: Hosho for the first "DDH" and Ryujo for the
second. ;)
BF Lake
"Dott.Piergiorgio" <dott.Pierg...@SORYUfastwebnet.it> wrote in
message news:NaIAe.14116$b93....@tornado.fastwebnet.it...
1942 Janes says that ZUIKAKU means Lucky Stork and SHOKAKU means Crane.
Janes is never wrong, so that's that! :)
Regards,
Barry
tw
"Dott.Piergiorgio" <dott.Pierg...@SORYUfastwebnet.it> wrote in
message news:NaIAe.14116$b93....@tornado.fastwebnet.it...
I'm afraid that sounds ominous as well as fitting...
Joe Osman
Juergen Nieveler wrote:
> "Dott.Piergiorgio" <dott.Pierg...@SORYUfastwebnet.it> wrote:
>
> > If this bill pass, JMSDF return to be the IJN.....
>
>
> Juergen Nieveler
> --
> Tagline? What Tagline??
I noticed that you used "Honour" instead of "Honor" for a book written
by an American. I'm curious as to your accent when you speak English.
Does it sound more British or American? I wonder what percentage of
non-native English speakers are taught the British spelling? Anyone
know?
Joe
Peter Kemp
wrote:
Can't help with your question, but it's worth noting that my British
copy of Tom Clancy is 'Debt of Honour'. Can't be bothered to check the
whole book for Anglicised spelling, but I assume more books in English
sold in Europe run to British rather than US spelling, since they'll
probably come from the same supply chain as the UK stores (excepting
the various PX on US installations who seem to ship everything from
the US (I once encountered some mineral water that had been botteld in
France, shipped to the US, then flown to the UK!).
--
Peter Kemp
"Life is short...drink faster"
Brian Allardice
Joseph...@verizon.net says...
>I noticed that you used "Honour" instead of "Honor" for a book written
>by an American. I'm curious as to your accent when you speak English.
>Does it sound more British or American? I wonder what percentage of
>non-native English speakers are taught the British spelling? Anyone
>know?
I wouldn't claim to actually know, but casual observation in Japan and China,
insofar as anyone can tell, indicates a pretty random mix with American
predominating (barbarisms such as 'center' being very common). However, to
illustrate the difficulty of making such a determination, I include a verbatim
transcript of a menu item from the Ming Tien Cafe, a national chain in China:
"Air Flight Sirloin Steak: Coming from the cold cow in fresh west in air
freight in BingJing picks all through disinfectto handles with the
vacuum-packed, because of fresh this its meat quality pole with delicate
slippery."
Perhaps best considered "English with Chinese Characteristics"
Cheers,
dba
Jack Linthicum
Must we wait until 2040 to have an aircraft for these carriers properly
named "Zero"? Type 0 Carrier Fighter, taken from the Imperial year 2600
(1940).
Duke of URL
--
Moses.D...@gmail.com
Cliologist, Philanthropologist, Prothonotary Wibbler,
Paleoconservative, Surface Warrior Squid
Brian Allardice
>
>GODWIN! And I claim the $5!
No! No! You really have to see those things, they're hilarious!
Cheers,
dba
John Redman
"BF Lake" <nos...@nospam.com> wrote
> 1942 Janes says that ZUIKAKU means Lucky Stork and SHOKAKU means Crane.
> Janes is never wrong, so that's that! :)
Is that the edition that reckoned there was a third of the class called
'Ryukaku' and that there was a liner conversion called 'Hayabusa'?
Gernot Hassenpflug
Dott> John Redman wrote:
>> Trouble with 'Hosho' is that it evokes an itty-bitty
>> experimental ship with minimal power and negligible fighting
>> history.
Dott> Name meanings and history aside, the fact is that the
Dott> (first?) Hosho was the beginnings and testbed of that whose
Dott> eventually became the Kido Buitai.
Dott> And Hosho will also means a new start... After all, German
Dott> Navy restart twice their U-count, having three U-1....
>> I could go with 'Hiryu' or 'Soryu' or 'Ryujo' too though.
Dott> My bet on names is this: Hosho for the first "DDH" and Ryujo
Dott> for the second. ;)
What makes me so sad is that since WW2 the ships of what eventually
became what is still called the JMSDF (whew, deep breath...) are
written in hiragana, thereby losing a lot of the charm of the name
that can only be transferred by lovely flowing brushstrokes shaping
the complex characters. Perhaps once the Japanese government has put
in all those characters that were removed from post-war syllabuses,
the navy will get around to using them again - and calling itself a
navy, as any self-respecting would (not just in secret, via
codewords).
Oh well, I guess when Ishihara gets elected as prime minister, and I
get kicked out of the country....
--
G Hassenpflug RASC, Kyoto University
Jack Linthicum
The JMSDF fan page on the net is called I Love Navy
http://www.love-navy.net/bbs/ibbs.cgi?mode=res&namber=181&page=0&RES=26-40&H=tp&no=0
Duke of URL
--
Once a suicide bomber, always a suicide bomber
Dott.Piergiorgio
> Perhaps once the Japanese government has put
> in all those characters that were removed from post-war syllabuses,
> the navy will get around to using them again - and calling itself a
> navy, as any self-respecting would
Do you have read the link I put in the opening post ? ;)
About Kanji&Kana, actually ships of IJN has the name written in Kana on
their sterns (many pre and during WWII photos shows clearly this) with the
exception of the Chin Yen end Pin Yen whose mantain on the stern the
original chinese Hanzi (that was technically prize names, as, for example,
in HMS Sans Pareil or USS Prinz Eugen)
The Kanji, I surmise, was used in documents, paperworks & similia, and
actually, sites in Japanese use the Kanji for IJN ships and Kana for JMSDF
ships, whose sincerely, is useful to me when I search for, say, one of the
two Kongo....
Best regards from Italy,
Dott. Piergiorgio.
Duke of URL
> Brian Allardice wrote:
>> In article <11d818q...@corp.supernews.com>, MacB...@kdsi.net
>> says...
>>>
>>> GODWIN! And I claim the $5!
>>
>> No! No! You really have to see those things, they're hilarious!
>>
> Email me a picture or three, please.
Brian send me a photo of one. He's right - they're so deranged, they're
funny.