Periscope leakage protection
Jeff Dixon
This ignorant civilian would like to know how leaks are prevented around
submarine periscopes. I'm thinking that there is some sort of packing
around the periscope that might squeeze to a tight fit at increased
depths. Does the periscope packing trickle or weep (couldn't think of a
better term off the top) at certain depths as a normal occurrence? If
not, is there a lubricant used on the periscope? Further, I was thinking
that there is probably a depth below which the periscope becomes locked
tight in place due to pressure but I wondered whether there is ever a
need for a submarine to raise its pericsope at these depths. (Oh, no
sexual innuendos intended.) can anyone clue me on how periscopes are
sealed?
Thanks in advance,
Jeff Dixon
jh...@psu.edu
Mike Miller
> SMNers,
>
> This ignorant civilian would like to know how leaks are prevented around
> submarine periscopes.
Are periscopes even through-pressure-hull penetrations anymore?
I got the impression they were external, mast-mounted cameras in
the sail with relays to a traditional periscope viewing whatsit
on the bridge.
Mike Miller, Materials Engineer
--Who needs some work on his periscope terminology
Peter McLelland
"Mike Miller" <cra...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:5dcb47db.01110...@posting.google.com...
> Jeff Dixon <jh...@psu.edu> wrote in message
news:<3BE08C04...@psu.edu>...
> > SMNers,
> >
> > This ignorant civilian would like to know how leaks are prevented around
> > submarine periscopes.
>
> Are periscopes even through-pressure-hull penetrations anymore?
> I got the impression they were external, mast-mounted cameras in
> the sail with relays to a traditional periscope viewing whatsit
> on the bridge.
>
standards on the masts so that they were as near true cylinders. Foe non
rotating masts the tightness of the gland was not too much of a problem as
the power raising machinery would overcome the tightness. Actual periscopes
had to be rotated by hand which meant that the gland had to be tight enough
to stop the water coming in, yet free enough to allow the periscope to be
easily turned. Later periscopes have a 'torque assist' motor to assist the
operator which makes life much easier.
Peter
Robert J. Kolker
Mike Miller wrote:
> Are periscopes even through-pressure-hull penetrations anymore?
> I got the impression they were external, mast-mounted cameras in
> the sail with relays to a traditional periscope viewing whatsit
> on the bridge.
Even so, don't wires have to go through the hull?
Bob Kolker
Mark Borgerson
Yeah, but those would be fixed connectors. There are
lots of those on subs---going to the radar, running
lights, bridge instruments and sonar transducers. Standard
underwater connectors are usually rated to about 5000PSI--
and we don't do too many submersibles that need to go
deeper than about 10,000 feet!
Mark Borgerson
M.J.Powell
@baesystems.com> writes
Supplementary Question: Are/were periscopes ever used on the surface to
use the increased height of observation?
Mike
--
M.J.Powell
john Szalay
"M.J.Powell" wrote:
> In aSupplementary Question: Are/were periscopes ever used on the surface to
> use the increased height of observation?
>
> Mike
> --
> M.J.Powell
According the Dick O'Kane's book on the war patrols of the Tang, Yes, the
Scope
was part of their surface lookout/watch routine..
Peter McLelland
"M.J.Powell" <mi...@pickmere.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:7SA8OnAS...@pickmere.demon.co.uk...
check up on the OOW on the bridge.
Small periscopes were widely used in the army especially in trench warfare
so that they could see over the 'top' without exposing themselves.
Peter
DeepSea
M.J.Powell wrote in message <7SA8OnAS...@pickmere.demon.co.uk>...
>Supplementary Question: Are/were periscopes ever used on the surface to
>use the increased height of observation?
>
>Mike
>--
>M.J.Powell
Yes. At least one periscope is manned on the surface by a designated
watchstander called a Contact Coordinator (or an assistant). His job is to
assist the Officer of the Deck in detection and track of surface contacts.
The added height of eye, combined with magnification is useful in detecting
smaller contacts farther out than could be seen with the naked eye or with
binoculars from the bridge. The main drawback is that the field of view is
somewhat limited, requiring a regular scan routine to ensure full coverage.
DS
M2 GE Flt
> SMNers,
>
> This ignorant civilian would like to know how leaks are prevented around
> submarine periscopes. I'm thinking that there is some sort of packing
> around the periscope that might squeeze to a tight fit at increased
> depths. Does the periscope packing trickle or weep (couldn't think of a
> better term off the top) at certain depths as a normal occurrence?
German Submarines have periscopes penetrating the pressure hull. The
periscope is in fact a near perfect cylinder packed by a normal sort of
technical packing.
For greater depths an additional packing is used. It´s like some kind of
tube fixed around the periscope cylinder. To tighten the packing you just
have to blow up the tube.
All packings are normally tight (no trickling).
> If not, is there a lubricant used on the periscope?
No.
> Further, I was thinking
> that there is probably a depth below which the periscope becomes locked
> tight in place due to pressure but I wondered whether there is ever a
> need for a submarine to raise its pericsope at these depths.
It makes absoutely no sense to raise the periscope in depths with no light.
Mike Miller
Electrical/data through connects are relatively easy compared to
a mechanical seal. You can weld them to the hull and chemically
bond/seal the wires to surrounding material. The wires don't
*move* - that makes life easy.
On the other hand, propellers and periscopes need to move, so
welding, gluing, and duct tape are right out. Propellers seem
fairly simple - they only rotate, you can use a labyrinth seal.
Periscopes, OTOH, not only rotate but slide up and down.
I know WWII subs used through-hull periscopes, but do modern
sub periscopes penetrate the hull or are they just remote cameras?
I didn't see that quite answered (or in simple language I
immediately recognized as yes/no.)
Mike Miller, Materials Engineer
Tom Schoene
> I know WWII subs used through-hull periscopes, but do modern
> sub periscopes penetrate the hull or are they just remote cameras?
> I didn't see that quite answered (or in simple language I
> immediately recognized as yes/no.)
Modern subs still use through-hull periscopes. For the US, the first
non-hull-penetrating optronic periscope will be in the Virginia-class SSNs
currently under construction. The British were to have adopted this for the
V-boats, but I think they changed their mind; their Astutes may be the first
RN subs with non-hull-penetrating periscopes.
--
Tom Schoene (replace "invalid" with "net" to email)
We must welcome the future, remembering that soon it will be the
past; and we must respect the past, knowing that once it was all that
was humanly possible. - George Santayana
Peter McLelland
periscopes today. The ability to have a non penetrating EO mast has only
become practical in the last ten years.
Peter
Keith Willshaw
Yes and No
The all electronic type is sometimes referred to as an
Optronic Mast
http://www.zeiss-optronik.de/uk/231000.html
http://www.zeiss-optronik.de/uk/232000.html
http://www.zeiss-optronik.de/uk/233000.html
Keith
Matt Clonfero
Miller <cra...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>Jeff Dixon <jh...@psu.edu> wrote in message news:<3BE08C04...@psu.edu>...
>> SMNers,
>>
>> This ignorant civilian would like to know how leaks are prevented around
>> submarine periscopes.
>
>Are periscopes even through-pressure-hull penetrations anymore?
>I got the impression they were external, mast-mounted cameras in
>the sail with relays to a traditional periscope viewing whatsit
>on the bridge.
The next generation ones are non-hull penetrating. At the moment, we use
systems that are essentially the same as a WWII submariner had -albeit
with night vision et al.
Aetherem Vincere
Matt
--
To err is human
To forgive is not
Air Force Policy
Mick Nicholson
"Tom Schoene" <tasc...@starpower.invalid> wrote in message
news:9ru42q$jsq$1...@bob.news.rcn.net...
Vanguard has a non-penetrating optronics mast, but it also has a
conventional scope. Virginia and Astute will be the first boats that will
ONLY have non penetrating masts.
-------------------------------
Mick Nicholson
RBS
Peter McLelland <peter.m...@baesystems.com> kirjoitti
viestissä:3be17f08$1...@pull.gecm.com...
(snip)
> Some RN Frigates had periscopes in the Ops Room so that the captain could
> check up on the OOW on the bridge.
> Peter
>
Must have really fostered a feeling of professional self-confidence in the
OOW. ; )
-RBS-
David & Linda Feller
usually see contacts first due to the wider field of view of the naked
eye or binoculars. Plus, searching through a periscope for hours on end
is very exhausting.