Double Vision when I relax my eyes - Convergence of images - left eye image is off to the right of right eye image
Duncan Harriss
the dominant one, my left feels almost completely unused most of the time. I
can compensate for this double vision and use my left eye to pull the two
images into line, however I think this is causing another much more
aggravating problem, which is that the muscles in the left-hand side of my
face are almost always tight and when tired twitch. This is really
uncomfortable. this feeling happens when i focus/concentrate on sth and oull
the images into line. I feel this is probably the reason for the muscle
strain in my face. This I have told my optometrist who recommended trying
prisms in contact lenses. I tried to wear a number of different types of
these but found them too uncomfortable to wear. My glasses now have prisms
in them, which seem to help, but they seem to only correct half the
convergence in the images. however
I am not sure exactly how bad the convergence between the images are, as
everyone can relaxx their eyes and see double if they want. Ie How much is
psychosomatic, how much are my eyes compensating for this, and
I am worried about ending up with a lazy eye, either because I don't correct
the problem quick enough, or because I actually overcorrect the problem and
pull my eyes the other way. The problem definately only feels due to the
left eye, my right eye and side of face pretty much always feels fine. But
the prism correction in my glasses is for both eyes, and is it only my left
eye and face that feels uncomfortable because my right eye is the dominant
one?
The vision in both eyes WITH contacts or glasses is good.(except, obviously,
for the problem above) Without, my left eye is slightly more astigmatic than
my right eye (just over 1, to just under 1), but the vision in both is
about -6 - fairly shortsighted
Could the problem be anything to do with having a toric left lense but no
right lense (not worth correcting, lowest correction is 1), or just due to
the astigmatism itself?
Anyone know of anyone at all who has complained of a similar problem. Or
anyone I can see to sort this out - It's driving me mad!!
Thanks
Duncan
My next move now is I have booked an appointment with a Dr Gartry at
Moorfields Eye Hospital, but this is mainly because I am interested in the
Lasik procedure (- Another story, but I feel at least being able to see
(even if it is two clear images is better than being able to not see at
all) ) but I will take the opportunity to chat to him about this.
I have scoured the web for information on both my problem (main concern) and
Lasik, of which there is stacks of information about the latter but they all
seem to be American sources of info and no English equivalents anywhere.
Anyone have any recommendations of good Lasik centres and/or surgeons to
check out in London - and even wider, England?
I don't really know where to start now, and who to see about my convergence
problem, do I see a cornea expert or what? What type of specialist do I need
to see? Anyone know of some good specialists to see in the Pinner, N.W.
London/London area?
Mike Tyner
You're supposed to do some yourself, usually.
In contacts you have to deal with physics: it's VERY hard to get
horizontal prism in contacts.
-MT
Duncan Harriss <dun...@harriss1.freeserve.co.uk> wrote in message
news:7nft0r$dof$1...@news4.svr.pol.co.uk...
LASIK nightmare
Before my LASIK nightmare began, I was highly myopic, and noticed that
I had the "ability" to relax my eyes in such a way that my vision became
blurry. However, I didn't know what that meant. Otherwise, I was -5.25 OD,
and -7.00 OS. I don't entirely understand the technical definition of the
numbers ...
suffice it to say that I was very myopic. I was also very good at working "up
close" -- soldering a capacitor the size of a grain of sand to a circuit board,
for
example.
About four months after the LASIK surgery, I realized that I was, indeed,
seeing double. I have subsequently been diagnosed with esotropia in one of
my eyes -- it pronates, it's pigeon-toed, however you want to put it.
If you do a search for "LASIK" at
http://www.fda.gov/search.html
you will get about 42 "hits". If you refer to hit #13 (approximately), you will
find the entire recorded transcribed minutes of Day 2 of the Ophthalmic Devices
Panel, held on Tuesday Oct. 21, 1997 at a Holiday Inn in Maryland.
On pages 178 and 186 of that report, you will find a fascinating (for me, at
least) exchange between the doctors about latent strabismus. To quote Dr.
M.: "They are at risk for developing strabismus if you treat them."
That is one of the few references you will find to latent strabismus manifesting
after laser surgery that you will find in the medical literature.
Strangely, my own doctor has failed to file a Medical Device Report with the
FDA, which is (theoretically, at least) Standard Operating Procedure in the
event of complications following a new clinical procedure.
Also, if you visit the Surgical Eyes website at
http://www.surgicaleyes.org/
and read the story of "Phil", you will read the story of another patient who
manifested strabismus (CROSS-EYED-NESS) after refractive laser surgery.
One other medical complication that is frequently mentioned in the medical
literature and the FDA clinical devices trials -- "foreign body sensation" and
"dry eye syndrome". It is acknowledged in the medical community that
corneal surgery, of which LASIK comprises two incidences, both the
"flap" and the "zap", has the tendency to exacerbate corneal disease.
That is, you may very well have the two complications mentioned, and
not be aware of if. I wasn't ... I'd never used an eyedrop in my life before
LASIK. Now I'm going through a BOX a WEEK -- six times a days,
flooding the eyes with artificial tears for momentary, fleeting relief.
Now, to "fix" the UNDISCLOSED side effects of the LASIK surgery,
I am offered the options of new "medicine" -- NEW eyeglasses with an
extreme prismatic correction, having my tearducts cauterized shut to
stop tears from draining away, and a daily regime of care for my eyes --
things I never DREAMED of before the LASIK surgery.
One other note about "loss of contrast sensisitivity", which you will find
on the standard LASIK informed consent form. I happen to be a big
science fiction fan. That means watching movies with fairy-tale creatures
skulking in the shadows. When the screen is dark and the contrast is low,
I can't see what's happening on the screen. Whereas before the LASIK I
could.
For example, you know that scene in Return of the Jedi, when Jabba
the Hutt drops Luke Skywalker into the lair of the Bantha ?? Then,
the door slowly rises, and a creature becomes visible behind the rising
door, the famed Bantha ?? I can't see the action in this segment of the
movie anymore -- just the clip where Luke sticks the bone into the creatures
jaw, and then the end-part where another door crashes down on the Bantha's
head.
It's almost like being blind -- relying on my own memory of the movie to
know that Luke is picking a rock up off the floor of the Bantha cage to
throw at the switch ... because, post-LASIK, I can no longer see Luke
picking up the rock.
You know the part at the beginning of the movie -- where the big, bold
latters pan across the screen ?? I can't see that either -- not with both
eyes open. And there's some pretty big letters there. I watched Return
of the Jedi at the local cheap movie theater back in '83-'84, and I never
had a problem seeing those three paragraphs with glasses.
Suffice it to say, when you step in that LASIK chair, there is a 1% to
10% chance that you will end up with impaired vision. The LASIK
doctors and the medical device manufacturers have quite a gravy train
going and are not reporting the complications.
You can have one of THE most experienced, intelligent doctors in the
world -- but that doesn't mean he/she will tell you the risks about the
procedure.
Suffice it to say that LASIK is a form of "Russian Roulette" you play
with your eyes -- except in Russian Roulette you know what the odds
are.
The same can be said for RK and PRK.
Another medical website you might want to visit -
http://www.slackinc.com/eye/eye.htm
Slack Inc. publishes the major medical journals in the ophthalmological
field. A keyword search for "LASIK" at the site listed will bring up
abstracts to NUMEROUS articles. I'd highly suggest reading some of
those articles BEFORE your LASIK surgery.
Regards,
LASIK nightmare
Duncan Harriss wrote:
<...>
William Stacy
> I do know this about optics, but am not an optician. If you have two
> different corrections in the two lenses and you are not looking
> through the centroid, there will be double vision.
There will be a disparity of the lines of signt, but not necessarily double
vision. Most such disparities are easily compensated for by actions of the
extraocular muscles. Only if the binocular system is unable to overcome the
disparity is there actual double vision.
Bill
Brad
should not have gotten the treatment. For me and
countless others the procedure has made a drastic,
positive change in our lives. After reading many of
the negative stories relating to Lasik a pattern emerged.
Then one day I remembered something..
A few years ago a friend of mine bought a computer
monitor from a major manufacturer. It was identical
to mine (I had recommended he get the same model).
Later that month he told me he was on his third one
(he had returned two) and was about to return that one.
I asked why? He invited me over to his apartment and
showed me the monitor. "See", he said, "look at that!
It's awful". (I looked and didn't see ANYTHING at all
wrong with the monitor.) "What is wrong?" I said.
He pointed to the top left corner of the screen. The
rectangle making up the screen was not a perfect
mathematical rectangle. It was very slightly curved at the
very last 1/16 of an inch in the corner. "It's crap. I won't
accept it!". I left and thought on the way home that there
was no way to make this guy happy. No way.
Well.. This story reminds me that there will always be a group
of people who are very, very, picky about things. They see
the smallest flaw in something and amplify it 10000 times.
There is nothing wrong with them. We are all individuals and
this diversity makes life rather interesting. On the other hand,
I seriously think there ought to be a psychological exam given
to all potential Lasik patients to see if they are one of these
people. Do you think the monitor guy would be happy with
Lasik. He could get the same results I got and be totally
unhappy, even though I couldn't be more satisfied. Do I see
halo's at night? Yes. Big ones. Doesn't bother me AT ALL.
Do I see worse than 20/15 (my vision with glasses)? Yes.
Doesn't bother me at all. I can see so much I couldn't see
before. My wife's face in the middle of the night, a boat
load of friends on the lake (where I couldn't wear glasses
before). I love my new world!
(psst.. did you check your monitor corner yet?)
=BRAD=
Lasik's May 21, 1999
LASIK nightmare wrote:
> Hello Duncan,
>
> Before my LASIK nightmare began, ..
> ..LASIK is a form of "Russian Roulette" you play
> with your eyes -- except in Russian Roulette you know what the odds
> are.
> ..
>
> The same can be said for RK and PRK.
> Regards,
>
> LASIK nightmare
>
>
John C. Polasek
vertical. I wear eyeglasses about -5 -6 continuous trifocals (I cant
think of their trade name).
I do know this about optics, but am not an optician. If you have two
different corrections in the two lenses and you are not looking
2d derivative of curvature that gives you the diopters, there is a
continually increasing wedge as you go off center. That's
mathematically inescapable. If your glasses sit crooked in any way you
can get double vision. I told my optometrist about my problem about 4
prism diopters as I reckoned it and he put in some prism, but really,
he said, we'll leave it the way it is. I guess it could happen with
contacts if they sit off center of your line of sight.
John Polasek
On Sun, 25 Jul 1999 21:46:36 +0100, "Duncan Harriss"
<dun...@harriss1.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:
>When I relax my eyes I see two separate images. My right eye is definately
>the dominant one, my left feels almost completely unused most of the time. I
>can compensate for this double vision and use my left eye to pull the two
>
>Thanks
>
>Duncan
>
>
Mike Tyner
Brad <nos...@nosplam.com> wrote
>
> A few years ago a friend of mine bought a computer
> monitor from a major manufacturer. It was identical
> to mine (I had recommended he get the same model).
> Later that month he told me he was on his third one
> (he had returned two) and was about to return that one.
> I asked why? He invited me over to his apartment and
> showed me the monitor. "See", he said, "look at that!
> It's awful". (I looked and didn't see ANYTHING at all
> wrong with the monitor.) "What is wrong?" I said.
> He pointed to the top left corner of the screen. The
> rectangle making up the screen was not a perfect
> mathematical rectangle. It was very slightly curved at the
> very last 1/16 of an inch in the corner. "It's crap. I won't
> accept it!". I left and thought on the way home that there
> was no way to make this guy happy. No way.
Hey.. that guy was in my office last week. Twice!
-MT
John C. Polasek
<wst...@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
It's not that simple. If I stare through vertical blinds across the
street and see two cars that are the same car, but separated by a
space sufficient for another car, then I get the feeling that things
are not right, and sure I can force a match, just as I can cause two
strereograms to come together without a stereoscope.
And if I find I cannot read the text on the TV screen, until I left
the right half of my glasses about 1/4" to get congruence, then there
is a problem.
These problems exist and after the glasses are produced, I don't
recall ever having been tested for prism.
John Polasek
Duncan Harriss
sight. It was exactly the same with me, in that if I lifted my glasses about
1/4" the images would converge. It is definately a problem, I can pull the
images together which i do daily as (being stubborn) I wear my lenses during
the day. By the end of the day however my left eye is knackered and needs
resting. You'll find that difference between the two images is worse the
closer you are to what your looking at - eg when reading.
The problem is that the muscles in my face are always tight and pulling and
this can be quite uncomfortable, and my left eye has a tendency to sort of
shut off.
Does anyone else have problems with the muscles in their face straining in
pulling the eye(s) into line?
John C. Polasek <joh...@magicnet.net> wrote in message
news:379fdfc...@news.magicnet.net...