Inselaffen - has anyone heard this before?
Nick Worley
translate as "island monkeys" or (I suppose) "island oafs", is a humorous
derogatory term used for the Brits.
Have any Germans here heard that before or do you reckon that the people who
told me this just thought it up on the spot?
It's pretty funny either way!
Thanks
Nick
Harlan Messinger
<nick-NOSTALGIA'S-NOT-WHAT-IT-U...@btinternet.com> wrote:
See http://www.inselaffen.de/. (You might want to avoid the "Sex"
link. Try "Fehrnsehn" [sic] instead.)
--
Harlan Messinger
Remove the first dot from my e-mail address.
Veuillez ôter le premier point de mon adresse de courriel.
Dave Devine
<nick-NOSTALGIA'S-NOT-WHAT-IT-U...@btinternet.com> wrote:
Hi Nick,
It's a fairly common expression. Another is "Kalkeimer".
Dave
--
There's a fine line between stupid and clever.
Laura E. Czeschick
> "Nick Worley"
> <nick-NOSTALGIA'S-NOT-WHAT-IT-U...@btinternet.com> wrote:
>
>> A couple of German people have told me that Inselaffen, which could
>> translate as "island monkeys" or (I suppose) "island oafs", is a
>> humorous derogatory term used for the Brits.
>> Have any Germans here heard that before or do you reckon that the
>> people who told me this just thought it up on the spot?
>> It's pretty funny either way!
Hi Nick,
when I saw the word in your header I had no idea that it was supposed to
mean "Brits". Never heard it before except in the context of ethological
research about *real* island monkeys' behaviour. Had somebody used the term
in a conversation about GB, I would have guessed the meaning, of course. But
I don't think this usage is very common.
> See http://www.inselaffen.de/. (You might want to avoid the "Sex"
> link. Try "Fehrnsehn" [sic] instead.)
Harlan, I took a short look at your link - uhm, looks like a private site of
two half-baked teenagers to me. Neither funny nor intelligent, just a waste
of time. Even if "Fehrnsehn" could be meant as an intentional misspelling
(Northern German dialect?), the total amount of spelling mistakes is
impressive.
Laura
Bettina Price
Oh, yeah. When I went back home to my parents the one time, the guy who has
the house in front of theirs said to me "Und du lebst jetzt bei den
Inselaffen? Was willste denn da?".
Bettina
Ian Dawson
<nick-NOSTALGIA'S-NOT-WHAT-IT-U...@btinternet.com> schrieb im
Newsbeitrag news:biou57$bmhas$1...@ID-90070.news.uni-berlin.de...
"Inselaffen" I've heard many a time here in Germany.
My favourite is "Klippenpisser". The first time I heard it the image of
squalling, blue-bellied Belgae pissing on the Roman ships from the safety of
cliff tops cracked me up so much that I could hardly rejoin for laughing. I
can't vouch for the currency, though.
Both terms were applied to me, jocularly. And in a pub.
--
Ian Dawson
There are no Roman fives in my e-mail address
Meine E-Mail-Adresse enthaelt keine roemischen Fuenfen
"Das Entfachen von offenem Feuer in diesen Raeumlichkeiten ist laut
HVV-Beschluss untersagt."
(Fernsehraum, Staatsstudentenwohnheim I, Bochum)
Harlan Messinger
>
>> See http://www.inselaffen.de/. (You might want to avoid the "Sex"
>> link. Try "Fehrnsehn" [sic] instead.)
>
>Harlan, I took a short look at your link - uhm, looks like a private site of
>two half-baked teenagers to me. Neither funny nor intelligent, just a waste
>of time. Even if "Fehrnsehn" could be meant as an intentional misspelling
>(Northern German dialect?), the total amount of spelling mistakes is
>impressive.
It's absolutely awful. I just meant that what little content they've
added so far (except under "Sex") seems to have to do with things
perceived to be English--Teletubbies, Bear in the Big Blue House,
McDonalds--the latter two being American, though.
Evertjan.
> "Laura E. Czeschick" <Laura.C...@t-online.de> wrote:
>>
>>> See http://www.inselaffen.de/. (You might want to avoid the "Sex"
>>> link. Try "Fehrnsehn" [sic] instead.)
>>
>>Harlan, I took a short look at your link - uhm, looks like a private
>>site of two half-baked teenagers to me. Neither funny nor intelligent,
>>just a waste of time. Even if "Fehrnsehn" could be meant as an
>>intentional misspelling (Northern German dialect?), the total amount
>>of spelling mistakes is impressive.
>
> It's absolutely awful. I just meant that what little content they've
> added so far (except under "Sex") seems to have to do with things
> perceived to be English--Teletubbies, Bear in the Big Blue House,
> McDonalds--the latter two being American, though.
This thread has a typo, please go to:
;-)
--
Evertjan.
The Netherlands.
(Please change the x'es to dots in my emailaddress)
Stayka deyAvemta
Yeah, I also heard it before :-) It is a bit derogatory, true,
but actually it is meant way more humorous than as an actual
insult.
Clear Ether!
Stayka
--
Stayka's WoD Stuff at http://stayka.keyspace.de/sqhome/wod/
(Characters, online campaigns, my Frankfurt citybook, fun and more)
Richard Loebner
from "Bettina Price" <bettina...@pappnase.demon.co.uk> contains
these words:
> snip <
> Oh, yeah. When I went back home to my parents the one time, the guy who has
> the house in front of theirs said to me "Und du lebst jetzt bei den
> Inselaffen? Was willste denn da?".
~~~~~~~~~~~~
.. und was hast du ihm erwiedert?
--
Richard,
Crowthorne Berkshire UK
Nick Worley
news:biq2sc$j0$1...@a1-hrz.uni-duisburg.de...
> Nick Worley
<nick-NOSTALGIA'S-NOT-WHAT-IT-U...@btinternet.com> wrote:
> : A couple of German people have told me that Inselaffen, which could
> : translate as "island monkeys" or (I suppose) "island oafs", is a
humorous
> : derogatory term used for the Brits.
> : Have any Germans here heard that before or do you reckon that the people
who
> : told me this just thought it up on the spot?
> : It's pretty funny either way!
>
> Yeah, I also heard it before :-) It is a bit derogatory, true,
> but actually it is meant way more humorous than as an actual
> insult.
It certainly didn't come across as malicious to me, but rather humorous.
And in any case, "Ich bin stolz ein Inselaffe zu sein"! :o)
(Or as a German friend of mine used to say "Ich bin stolz ein Staubkörnchen
im All zu sein").
Regards
Nick
Nick Worley
<nick-NOSTALGIA'S-NOT-WHAT-IT-U...@btinternet.com> wrote in
message news:biqfjn$bqmjj$1...@ID-90070.news.uni-berlin.de...
> "Stayka deyAvemta" <sta...@saint-seiya.de> wrote in message
> news:biq2sc$j0$1...@a1-hrz.uni-duisburg.de...
> > Nick Worley
> <nick-NOSTALGIA'S-NOT-WHAT-IT-U...@btinternet.com> wrote:
> > : A couple of German people have told me that Inselaffen, which could
> > : translate as "island monkeys" or (I suppose) "island oafs", is a
> humorous
> > : derogatory term used for the Brits.
> > : Have any Germans here heard that before or do you reckon that the
people
> who
> > : told me this just thought it up on the spot?
> > : It's pretty funny either way!
> >
> > Yeah, I also heard it before :-) It is a bit derogatory, true,
> > but actually it is meant way more humorous than as an actual
> > insult.
>
> It certainly didn't come across as malicious to me, but rather humorous.
> And in any case, "Ich bin stolz ein Inselaffe zu sein"! :o)
Ooops, shouldn't I have written "Ich bin stolz *darauf* ein Inselaffe zu
sein" or can you say both? i.e. with or without "darauf"?
Thanks
Nick
Bettina Price
> "Nick Worley"
> <nick-NOSTALGIA'S-NOT-WHAT-IT-U...@btinternet.com>
> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
> news:biou57$bmhas$1...@ID-90070.news.uni-berlin.de...
>> A couple of German people have told me that Inselaffen, which could
>> translate as "island monkeys" or (I suppose) "island oafs", is a
>> humorous derogatory term used for the Brits.
>> Have any Germans here heard that before or do you reckon that the
>> people who told me this just thought it up on the spot?
>> It's pretty funny either way!
>> Thanks
>> Nick
>>
>>
>
> "Inselaffen" I've heard many a time here in Germany.
>
> My favourite is "Klippenpisser". The first time I heard it the image
> of squalling, blue-bellied Belgae pissing on the Roman ships from the
> safety of cliff tops cracked me up so much that I could hardly rejoin
> for laughing. I can't vouch for the currency, though.
Mwaa-hah-hah! I haven't heard that one before.
> Both terms were applied to me, jocularly. And in a pub.
What? Us Germany making funny jokes like? That you can laugh at?
<snip>
>"Das Entfachen von offenem Feuer in diesen Raeumlichkeiten ist laut
>HVV-Beschluss untersagt."
>(Fernsehraum, Staatsstudentenwohnheim I, Bochum)
I'd find that funny if I hadn't lived in a Wohnheim for a long time and knew
that it could end up being entirely necessary to make people aware of this
fact.
Bettina
Bettina Price
> "Nick Worley"
> <nick-NOSTALGIA'S-NOT-WHAT-IT-U...@btinternet.com> wrote
> in message news:biqfjn$bqmjj$1...@ID-90070.news.uni-berlin.de...
>
> zu sein" or can you say both? i.e. with or without "darauf"?
Both are fine, but both lack a comma.
Bettina
Bettina Price
I told him that although I could not claim to ever have lain awake at night
thinking "Ooh, I want to move to England", now that I was there it was
rather nice, and that in the long run one place was pretty much like
another.
Bettina
Richard Loebner
~~~~~~~~~~~~
A copout, as we say auf der Affeninsel, gell?
Gruß aus England
Bettina Price
> The message <biqksq$c3g97$1...@ID-138239.news.uni-berlin.de>
> from "Bettina Price" <bettina...@pappnase.demon.co.uk> contains
> these words:
>
>> Richard Loebner wrote:
>>> The message <bipkte$biqlu$1...@ID-138239.news.uni-berlin.de>
>>> from "Bettina Price" <bettina...@pappnase.demon.co.uk> contains
>>> these words:
>>>
>>>> snip <
>>>
>>>> Oh, yeah. When I went back home to my parents the one time, the guy
>>>> who has the house in front of theirs said to me "Und du lebst jetzt
>>>> bei den Inselaffen? Was willste denn da?".
>>>
>>> ~~~~~~~~~~~~
>>>
>>> .. und was hast du ihm erwiedert?
>
>> I told him that although I could not claim to ever have lain awake
>> at night thinking "Ooh, I want to move to England", now that I was
>> there it was rather nice, and that in the long run one place was
>> pretty much like another.
>
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~
>
> A copout, as we say auf der Affeninsel, gell?
>
deeper conversation, too.
Bettina
nyra
>
> Harlan Messinger wrote on 30 aug 2003 in sci.lang.translation:
> > "Laura E. Czeschick" <Laura.C...@t-online.de> wrote:
> >>
> >>> See http://www.inselaffen.de/. (You might want to avoid the "Sex"
> >>> link. Try "Fehrnsehn" [sic] instead.)
> >>
> >>Harlan, I took a short look at your link - uhm, looks like a private
> >>site of two half-baked teenagers to me. Neither funny nor intelligent,
> >>just a waste of time.
Well, yes. Hastily-knocked-together trash.
> >>Even if "Fehrnsehn" could be meant as an
> >>intentional misspelling (Northern German dialect?), the total amount
> >>of spelling mistakes is impressive.
And to think that they somehow managed to operate a computer...
> > It's absolutely awful. I just meant that what little content they've
> > added so far (except under "Sex") seems to have to do with things
> > perceived to be English--Teletubbies, Bear in the Big Blue House,
> > McDonalds--the latter two being American, though.
Oh, the "Sex" area i found somewhat revealing - they consider the
stuff they depicted there perverted, but evidently they took the time
to dig up a nice number of examples. I mean, it's not quite the sort
of thing that gets served on the first web site google finds under the
keyword "England":
www.bankofengland.co.uk
As far as "Inselaffen" is concerned: it's a term of mockery. Usually
used in a purely humorous and inoffensive fashion, but _can_ be used
with the intent to belittle and ridicule.
> <http://www.inselaffen.de/> ?
>
> This thread has a typo, please go to:
>
> <http://www.einschlafen.de/>
Erm, this site does exist. It's some sort of contentless "contact"
page, though.
--
Das Mittel dieser Schrift / Macht, dass dich kein' Kugel trifft.
Asa vitom rahoremarhi ahe menalem renah oremi nasiore ene nahores ore
eldit ita ardes inabe ine nie nei alomade sas ani ita ahe elime arnam
asa locre rahel nei vivet aroseli ditan Veloselas Herodan ebi menises
asa elitira eve harsari erida sacer elachimai nei elerisa.
- H.J.C.v.Grimmelshausen, Simplicissimus Teutsch
Ian Dawson
news:biqkhe$c841v$1...@ID-138239.news.uni-berlin.de...
> What? Us Germany making funny jokes like? That you can laugh at?
>
fortunate enough to know quite a few Germans who appeal to my sense of
humour, which prefers a subtle, ironic analysis of personal shortcomings
that never borders on sarcasm and, although deeply criticising, can never be
construed as insult by the forgiving recipient with insight. It takes a lot
of intuition, tact, and fine judgement to produce this kind of humour, and,
believe it or not, many Germans are quite capable of it, irrespective of
their educational background. A kind of mid-brow wit, if you like. It is a
rare, exquisite treat to see them dismantle wannabes.
I have to admit, though, that the most common kind of humour, in my
experience, is blunt, loud, insistent, shallow and more often than not
appeals more to the baser instincts than to the understanding. This is the
kind of humour that has also been picked up on German independent TV
channels. It can be funny though, if only for the shock effect or absurdity
(for example, a sketch of the Queen Mum before assembled dignitaries
knocking out her clay pipe on the starched white table linen after a
ceremonious banquet).
Applying the term "Inselaffe" is a prerogative of the latter humour
category. Germans of the former would never stoop to such indignity.
--
Ian Dawson
There are no Roman fives in my e-mail address
Meine E-Mail-Adresse enthaelt keine roemischen Fuenfen
"Das Entfachen von offenem Feuer in diesen Raeumlichkeiten ist laut
Martin Möller
as a boring average German I can say:
No, I definitely never heard that before.
(well, on the other hand: my first association that came to me when reading
"Inselaffen" was
Gibraltar, and Gibraltar still belongs to the UK, doesn`t it?... ;-)
Martin
"Nick Worley"
<nick-NOSTALGIA'S-NOT-WHAT-IT-U...@btinternet.com> schrieb im
Newsbeitrag news:biou57$bmhas$1...@ID-90070.news.uni-berlin.de...
John Woodgate
wrote (in <bitcc6$cu1r8$1...@ID-116117.news.uni-berlin.de>) about
'Inselaffen - has anyone heard this before?', on Sat, 30 Aug 2003:
>(well, on the other hand: my first association that came to me when
>reading "Inselaffen" was Gibraltar, and Gibraltar still belongs to the
>UK, doesn`t it?... ;-)
Yes, but the 'apes' are monkeys.
--
Regards, John Woodgate, OOO - Own Opinions Only. http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk
Interested in professional sound reinforcement and distribution? Then go to
http://www.isce.org.uk
PLEASE do NOT copy news posts to me by E-MAIL!
Loekie Ratelkous
"Dave Devine" <david....@arcor.de> schreef in bericht
news:1g0hoov.1czkvu51m61uyaN%david....@arcor.de...
> Nick Worley
> <nick-NOSTALGIA'S-NOT-WHAT-IT-U...@btinternet.com> wrote:
>
> > A couple of German people have told me that Inselaffen, which could
> > translate as "island monkeys" or (I suppose) "island oafs", is a
humorous
> > derogatory term used for the Brits.
> > Have any Germans here heard that before or do you reckon that the
people who
> > told me this just thought it up on the spot?
> > It's pretty funny either way!
> > Thanks
> > Nick
>
> Hi Nick,
>
I see...
In Holland a Brit in shorts is said to expose his 'melkflessen' (Milk
bottles)
L.
Bettina Price
> "Bettina Price" <bettina...@pappnase.demon.co.uk> schrieb im
> Newsbeitrag news:biqkhe$c841v$1...@ID-138239.news.uni-berlin.de...
>> What? Us Germany making funny jokes like? That you can laugh at?
>>
> Now, now, Bettina, don't be too hard on yourself ;-).
I wasn't. I was being sarcastic.
Bettina
Einde O'Callaghan
> I read in sci.lang.translation that Martin Möller <ne...@webortage.de>
> wrote (in <bitcc6$cu1r8$1...@ID-116117.news.uni-berlin.de>) about
> 'Inselaffen - has anyone heard this before?', on Sat, 30 Aug 2003:
>
>
>>(well, on the other hand: my first association that came to me when
>>reading "Inselaffen" was Gibraltar, and Gibraltar still belongs to the
>>UK, doesn`t it?... ;-)
>
>
> Yes, but the 'apes' are monkeys.
In German "Affen" are both apes and monkeys.
Einde
mustermann
> > >>site of two half-baked teenagers to me. Neither funny nor intelligent,
> > >>just a waste of time.
>
> Well, yes. Hastily-knocked-together trash.
Well, try being Scottish in Germany, if you really want to know about
*tedious* racial stereotypes and associated humour. If you want to stoop to
their level I have found that any Hitler joke translated into German pretty
much stops things dead... but be aware, most are probably *criminally*
offensive under Verfassungschutz!
:-)
mustermann
> In Holland a Brit in shorts is said to expose his 'melkflessen' (Milk
> bottles)
U may find the etymology of Yankee interesting...
:-)
mustermann
"Einde O'Callaghan" <einde.oc...@planet-interkom.de> wrote in message
news:biugdm$d38u0$1...@ID-93601.news.uni-berlin.de...
AFAIK:
Primat = monkey
Affe= ape
:-)
> Einde
>
mustermann
>
> Primat = monkey
> Affe= ape
>
> :-)
In any register above "Umgangssprache"
Bettina Price
> AFAIK:
>
> Primat = monkey
> Affe= ape
>
Nope, that's quite wrong. Even in English, apes are primates. In German,
apes/primates are called "Menschenaffen" or "Affen" and monkeys are also
called "Affen". Makes librarian jokes a lot more difficult.
Ook,
Bettina
mustermann
"Bettina Price" <bettina...@pappnase.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:bji67p$jbn4g$1...@ID-138239.news.uni-berlin.de...
Lord only knows how I got an A in my Higher Biology??? A clerical error, I
presume. Still, I knew there was some distinction. Common sense really,
since Germans don't have widely different concepts of biology... and the
non-talking varieties aren't indigenous.
Thanks!
:-)
> Ook,
>
> Bettina
>
>
Gary Vellenzer
bettina...@pappnase.demon.co.uk says...
Once, when I was a child, at table after dinner, apropos of something
one of us children said, my uncle exclaimed: You mean that's the
difference between apes and monkeys? Monkeys have tails and apes don't?
I've been speaking English for the last twenty years and of course I
know what's an ape and what's a monkey, but I never realized the why of
it until now.
Before anybody jumps in with a correction, there is an exception to the
rule. "Barbary apes" are monkeys.
Gary
Einde O'Callaghan
>>>>>Harlan, I took a short look at your link - uhm, looks like a private
>>>>>site of two half-baked teenagers to me. Neither funny nor intelligent,
>>>>>just a waste of time.
>>
>>Well, yes. Hastily-knocked-together trash.
>
>
> Well, try being Scottish in Germany, if you really want to know about
> *tedious* racial stereotypes and associated humour.
Although not Scottish, I find the association of Scottishness and
stinginess in German advertising grossly offensive and tedious. I've
even come across a budget shop, what might be called a "pound shop" in
Britain, which is called MäcGeiz and is plastered all over with tartan
decorations just to make sure that people get the point.
Regards, Einde O'Callaghan
Einde O'Callaghan
Regards, Einde O'Callaghan
Nick Worley
news:MPG.19c67456f...@news.CIS.DFN.DE...
> [snip]
> Monkeys have tails and apes don't?
All monkeys have tails.
Dogs have tails.
Therefore dogs are monkeys!
John Woodgate
<einde.oc...@planet-interkom.de> wrote (in <bjihqu$jkn2e$1@ID-
93601.news.uni-berlin.de>) about 'Inselaffen - has anyone heard this
before?', on Mon, 8 Sep 2003:
>
>Although not Scottish, I find the association of Scottishness and
>stinginess in German advertising grossly offensive and tedious.
Why do the Germans pick on the Scots for this, when the Dutch are so
much nearer? (Ducks!) (;-)
Germans who think the Scots are ungenerous should take a holiday in
Scotland, especially north of the Highland Line.
John Woodgate
se.demon.co.uk> wrote (in <bji67p$jbn4g$1...@ID-138239.news.uni-berlin.de>)
about 'Inselaffen - has anyone heard this before?', on Mon, 8 Sep 2003:
him a monkey. But others can be translated by using the specific 'Oran-
utan' (spelling?).
John Woodgate
<nickw...@btinternet.com> wrote (in <bjimei$jr3he$1...@ID-90070.news.uni-
berlin.de>) about 'Inselaffen - has anyone heard this before?', on Mon,
8 Sep 2003:
Gary Vellenzer
nickw...@btinternet.com says...
Gary
Nick Worley
news:T9BBpnEOcOX$Ew...@jmwa.demon.co.uk...
> >All monkeys have tails.
> >Dogs have tails.
> >Therefore dogs are monkeys!
> >
> >
> No, dogs are aeroplanes.
LOL - I had to think about it for a bit, but I got there in the end!
Based on that reasoning then dogs are also comets!
LOL.
Nick Worley
It is now - good coining! :o)
Peter Twydell
<nickw...@btinternet.com> writes
Greyhounds, Whippets, Terriers, Camels, Elephants, Dolphins, etc. etc.
--
Peter
Ying tong iddle-i po!
Loekie Ratelkous
"John Woodgate" <j...@jmwa.demon.contraspam.yuk> schreef in bericht
news:MNwG1PEJJOX$Ew...@jmwa.demon.co.uk...
> I read in sci.lang.translation that Einde O'Callaghan
> <einde.oc...@planet-interkom.de> wrote (in <bjihqu$jkn2e$1@ID-
> 93601.news.uni-berlin.de>) about 'Inselaffen - has anyone heard this
> before?', on Mon, 8 Sep 2003:
> >
> >Although not Scottish, I find the association of Scottishness and
> >stinginess in German advertising grossly offensive and tedious.
>
> Why do the Germans pick on the Scots for this, when the Dutch are so
> much nearer? (Ducks!) (;-)
Because the Dutch have been quite generous from time to time in offering
sufferings to the Mannschaft, whereas the Scots were always quite greedy
on this subject :-) .
Spass beiseite (?): there is no reason in idiom or cultural behaviour.
L.
mustermann
"John Woodgate" <j...@jmwa.demon.contraspam.yuk> wrote in message
> I read in sci.lang.translation that Einde O'Callaghan
> <einde.oc...@planet-interkom.de> wrote (in <bjihqu$jkn2e$1@ID-
> 93601.news.uni-berlin.de>) about 'Inselaffen - has anyone heard this
> before?', on Mon, 8 Sep 2003:
> >
> >Although not Scottish, I find the association of Scottishness and
> >stinginess in German advertising grossly offensive and tedious.
>
> Why do the Germans pick on the Scots for this, when the Dutch are so
> much nearer? (Ducks!) (;-)
>
> Germans who think the Scots are ungenerous should take a holiday in
> Scotland, especially north of the Highland Line.
I meet a lot of the ones who do. They are generally very nice. The ones who
are there for the first time often iniate an observation at how Scottish
people are so friendly and generous. I am fair and point out that sadly it's
often only the case when it comes to "guests" and their is a general problem
with violent and antisocial behaviour- well not so much in out on the hills
heehee!
You go walking in the Highlands?
:-)
mustermann
"Einde O'Callaghan" <einde.oc...@planet-interkom.de> wrote in message
news:bjihqu$jkn2e$1...@ID-93601.news.uni-berlin.de...
Yeah, it's very odd, the shop thing. I was aghast when I was last living
there and Post bought into a stationary chain called MacPaper & Co. If proof
could be found for these companies using racial stereotypes there would be
big trouble under the Grunggesetzt (Constitution) and most likely EU law.
I think the tartan embellishment just goes to show what kind of shallow
mentalilty they are pitch to! I suppose giving your surname, you have had
your fair share of tedious jokes?
I don't know, there just to be far more fun in cticiscing each other for
things we *have* done, and probably not enough of it going on, to be making
things up!
;-)
> Regards, Einde O'Callaghan
>
Nick Worley
news:bjihqu$jkn2e$1...@ID-93601.news.uni-berlin.de...
> Although not Scottish, I find the association of Scottishness and
> stinginess in German advertising grossly offensive and tedious. I've
> even come across a budget shop, what might be called a "pound shop" in
> Britain, which is called MäcGeiz and is plastered all over with tartan
> decorations just to make sure that people get the point.
My initial reaction to "MäcGeiz" was to laugh - I mean, on one level it's
pretty funny (all political correctness aside (of which I'm not a big fan at
the best if times)). But having said that, I spent a year on the (Indian
Ocean) French island of "La Réunion" (next to Mauritius) in the 1980s and
after a year of putting up with all the English stereotypes (e.g. that all
English people have a stiff upper lip & are totally unspontaneous), I
started to get royally pissed off with it. And this from a person who for
years had told all sorts of stereotypical jokes based on someone's home
country. Anyway, it started to piss me right off and I had some words with a
couple of people. Their objection was that I had no sense of humour. It
kinda reminded me of situations where I'd witnessed blacks/Asians being told
the same thing in the UK after objecting to stereotypical black/Asian jokes
in the UK. It kinda changed my point of view because for the first time I
was in the ethnic minority and on the receiving end. Anyway this isn't
exactly a coherent, well-thought-out argument, but rather me thinking out
loud.
Regards
Nick
John Woodgate
<muste...@musterland.gov> wrote (in <BTh7b.54$z06.102134@newsfep1-win.
server.ntli.net>) about 'Inselaffen - has anyone heard this before?', on
Tue, 9 Sep 2003:
>You go walking in the Highlands?
I don't have any opportunity to do so.
Bettina Price
> "Einde O'Callaghan" <einde.oc...@planet-interkom.de> wrote in
> message news:bjihqu$jkn2e$1...@ID-93601.news.uni-berlin.de...
>> [snip]
>> Although not Scottish, I find the association of Scottishness and
>> stinginess in German advertising grossly offensive and tedious. I've
>> even come across a budget shop, what might be called a "pound shop"
>> in Britain, which is called MäcGeiz and is plastered all over with
>> tartan decorations just to make sure that people get the point.
>
> My initial reaction to "MäcGeiz" was to laugh - I mean, on one level
> it's pretty funny (all political correctness aside (of which I'm not
> a big fan at the best if times)). But having said that, I spent a
> year on the (Indian Ocean) French island of "La Réunion" (next to
> Mauritius) in the 1980s
In the 1980s? You were about four then, right?
Bettina
mustermann
"John Woodgate" <j...@jmwa.demon.contraspam.yuk> wrote in message
> I read in sci.lang.translation that mustermann
> <muste...@musterland.gov> wrote (in <BTh7b.54$z06.102134@newsfep1-win.
> server.ntli.net>) about 'Inselaffen - has anyone heard this before?', on
> Tue, 9 Sep 2003:
> >You go walking in the Highlands?
>
> I don't have any opportunity to do so.
Shame! They're quite something. I'm gagging to get off up there atm
:-(
nyra
>
> "Einde O'Callaghan" <einde.oc...@planet-interkom.de> wrote in message
> news:bjihqu$jkn2e$1...@ID-93601.news.uni-berlin.de...
> > mustermann wrote:
> > > Well, try being Scottish in Germany, if you really want to know about
> > > *tedious* racial stereotypes and associated humour.
> >
> > Although not Scottish, I find the association of Scottishness and
> > stinginess in German advertising grossly offensive and tedious. I've
> > even come across a budget shop, what might be called a "pound shop" in
> > Britain, which is called MäcGeiz and is plastered all over with tartan
> > decorations just to make sure that people get the point.
>
> Yeah, it's very odd, the shop thing. I was aghast when I was last living
> there and Post bought into a stationary chain called MacPaper & Co. If proof
> could be found for these companies using racial stereotypes there would be
> big trouble under the Grunggesetzt (Constitution) and most likely EU law.
>
> I think the tartan embellishment just goes to show what kind of shallow
> mentalilty they are pitch to!
Yes, the german stereotype is that scotsmen are
1) stingy
2) wearing kilts (and optionally playing bagpipes)[1]
3) called Mc<something>
[1] it doesn't include a dresscode for scottish women, but it seems
that racial/national/regional stereotypes in general are usually
targetted at males.
Very shallow and tiresome, and i sure wouldn't like to be on the
receiving end of this sort of "humour". By the way, i possess a
trecking supply item produced for and sold by a shop named "McTreck,
der Outdoor-Schotte". Really.
There also are stereotypes of inhabitants of different german regions;
targets of derogatory humour are usually people from eastern Freesia
and (more recently) from Saxonia. I find these jokes offensive and
tiresome, too, and not just because my native dialect is very close to
saxon.
> I suppose giving your surname, you have had
> your fair share of tedious jokes?
I don't think a name like O'Callaghan would provoke any golden german
humour. I'm not aware of popular Irenwitze.
--
Das Mittel dieser Schrift / Macht, dass dich kein' Kugel trifft.
Asa vitom rahoremarhi ahe menalem renah oremi nasiore ene nahores ore
eldit ita ardes inabe ine nie nei alomade sas ani ita ahe elime arnam
asa locre rahel nei vivet aroseli ditan Veloselas Herodan ebi menises
asa elitira eve harsari erida sacer elachimai nei elerisa.
- H.J.C.v.Grimmelshausen, Simplicissimus Teutsch
Owain
| Which, of course are also aeroplanes - along with Pups, Bulldogs,
| Greyhounds, Whippets, Terriers, Camels,
But Camels are (were) aeroplanes.
So it's true. If you smoke the right sort of cigarette you end up feeling
like you're flying.
Owain
John Woodgate
<3F5DF9FD...@gmx.net>) about 'Inselaffen - has anyone heard this
before?', on Tue, 9 Sep 2003:
>racial/national/regional stereotypes in general are usually targetted at
>males.
Yes, except Welsh. The Welsh women's traditional dress doesn't seem to
have a male version. Rugby kit doesn't count.
mustermann
"nyra" <ny...@gmx.net> wrote in message news:3F5DF9FD...@gmx.net...
Well, I guess that makes it 75% true... at least on special occassions.
> [1] it doesn't include a dresscode for scottish women, but it seems
> that racial/national/regional stereotypes in general are usually
> targetted at males.
Good point. Never thought of that. I wonder if any has done any good
psychologoy on this subject? I have read some interesting stuff on the more
extreme end of the mentality...
> Very shallow and tiresome, and i sure wouldn't like to be on the
> receiving end of this sort of "humour". By the way, i possess a
> trecking supply item produced for and sold by a shop named "McTreck,
> der Outdoor-Schotte". Really.
I can laugh now, sitting in bosom of Glasgow, but it really did get to the
point of my heart sinking and becoming quite rude when I lived in Germany...
Like the gent further up the thread, it was a real lesson: it's just not
funny! I guess that any joke than you have heard umpteen times loses its
shine... if it ever had one.
> There also are stereotypes of inhabitants of different german regions;
> targets of derogatory humour are usually people from eastern Freesia
> and (more recently) from Saxonia. I find these jokes offensive and
> tiresome, too, and not just because my native dialect is very close to
> saxon.
You forgot good ol' Schwaben...Strange how, no-one pucks on Baden tho,
probably the most insular of the lot from my experience- I have friends who
just plain never speak Hochdeutsch.
> > I suppose giving your surname, you have had
> > your fair share of tedious jokes?
>
> I don't think a name like O'Callaghan would provoke any golden german
> humour. I'm not aware of popular Irenwitze.
Yeah. I know, like most of the rest of the World (i.e. not England) they
think the Irish are the bees knees :-)
Peter Twydell
<muste...@musterland.gov> writes
There are hundreds of thousands in GB, maybe even a couple of million.
Irish citizens are even entitled to vote in the UK. My paternal
grandmother came to England when she was very young, so I suppose I do
have a biased point of view.
>> --
>> Das Mittel dieser Schrift / Macht, dass dich kein' Kugel trifft.
>> Asa vitom rahoremarhi ahe menalem renah oremi nasiore ene nahores ore
>> eldit ita ardes inabe ine nie nei alomade sas ani ita ahe elime arnam
>> asa locre rahel nei vivet aroseli ditan Veloselas Herodan ebi menises
>> asa elitira eve harsari erida sacer elachimai nei elerisa.
>> - H.J.C.v.Grimmelshausen, Simplicissimus Teutsch
>>
>
>
--
mustermann
"Peter Twydell" <pe...@nospam.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:YC39kIAq5kX$Ew...@ntlworld.com...
Ah, so stereotypes of "thick paddies", and harrsassment of people with
Irish accents during IRA "mainland" activity never happens?
I wouldn't so stupid to suggest that EVERYONE in England is like that, but
when I lived in London I even saw in the local news that the latter was a
serious problem and from what I have read on the Race Relations act there
have been quite a few attempted prosecutions for racial harrassment of Irish
too. And that's not even going down the road of the blatant discrimination
of old, not hopping across the sea to the days of occupation etc...
I'm raised Scottish, half English and of Irish (and Scots Irish) descent,
which doesn't seem to be a minority group haha (bit of Dutch and
American(???) too) and lived in London for 15 years. I'm not sure if any of
that plays a part in any bias??? Probably does, whether I like it or not...
I know one thing for sure. Racism won't go away, by wishing it away.
We all have our ignorant elements in our social groups. In fact, it's pretty
much subjective as to who those ignorant are after all... I guess the world
we be one dull place if it weren't so to *some* degree?
:-)
Peter Twydell
mustermann <muste...@musterland.gov> writes
>
<snip>
I'm not denying there's all sorts of major and minor discrimination
going on all the time against all sorts of people.
My post was in response to your implication that the English think less
of the Irish than do other nationalities.
<snip>
Nick Worley
news:bjkr7s$k97ro$1...@ID-138239.news.uni-berlin.de...
> [snip]
> In the 1980s? You were about four then, right?
LOL, you'd think so, but I'm a lot older than I come across from my puerile
posts.
Regards
Nick
John Woodgate
<no....@hotmail.com> wrote (in <bjnltb$esh$1...@online.de>) about
'Inselaffen - has anyone heard this before?', on Wed, 10 Sep 2003:
>those "trecking
>supply items"
Just for the record, it's 'trekking', one of the few words in British
English that has 'kk' in it. The root word is 'trek', which is a
borrowing from Dutch/Afrikaans.
Einde O'Callaghan
Irishwoman, for that matter) - of course, some of us do try to live up
to this reputation! ;-)
With a forename like Einde, pronounced something like the German word
"Ende", there are a number of jokes, but I heard them all in school many
decades ago. ;-)
Regards, Einde O'Callaghan
Michael Hemmer
> No jokes, but one stereotype is of the heavy-drinking Irishman (or
> Irishwoman, for that matter)
I don't think this stereotype extends to Irishwomen
(regardless of the color of their hair).
Michael
Michael Hemmer
> I read in sci.lang.translation that Hans-Peter Fischer
> <no....@hotmail.com> wrote (in <bjnltb$esh$1...@online.de>) about
> 'Inselaffen - has anyone heard this before?', on Wed, 10 Sep 2003:
>>those "trecking
>>supply items"
>
> Just for the record, it's 'trekking', one of the few words in British
> English that has 'kk' in it.
The same holds for German, though you can sometimes find "Trecking" as well.
Michael
Bettina Price
Hieß das nicht mal wandern?
Bettina
Richard Loebner
from "Bettina Price" <bettina...@pappnase.demon.co.uk> contains
these words:
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I am told that the English term "trecking" is an anglicised version of
the Dutch (Afkrikans) "trekking" which was a form of homeseeking.
If term is now synonymous with "Wandern" then we have witnessed a subtle
change in meaning, oder?
Any help?
Gruß aus England
--
Richard,
Crowthorne Berkshire UK
mustermann
"Richard Loebner" <rich...@zetnet.co.uk> wrote in message
news:200309110...@zetnet.co.uk...
Like any word the register depends on the user and context...
To me... a trek can either be any long walk or arduous walk, this will often
come to mean any walk of such where the people were unsure of the route or
even desination: We trekked round town all day...
It can also mean a long/arduous walk with a specific goal, where the
traveller is in full knowledge of the task, even to the point of it sounding
grandiose (nearing pilgrimage): He went off an a trek to India
Then amongst recreational walkers a trek and associated will often refer to
long distance walking, often implying abroad. There may have once been a
more technical definition than this, but if there was it seems now to be
inundated with the 'long foreign walk in scenic territory' one that is
popular with the tourist industry.
I do suspect however, the first definition I gave is more common, but seems
to be rare in print?
"Wandern" as I understand it, is just any recreational countryside walking,
in a "walker's" context?
Personally, I regurarly walk 100+ miles with a heavy backpack and would
tailor my vocab thus:
Talking to another "walker", I would say I have been simply "walking"
To a non-"walker" I would say "hill walking"
I have noticed any hint of their being a clear convention in this use.
People seem to say whatever they like... as per usual ;-)
:-)
Gruss aus Schottland!
as itinerary/Coach/Walking and trekking. [p] Comment: Summer temperatures
trip takes six days and involves trekking across a dusty savannah, often
Tropical Biak Island [/h] After our trekking adventure, we make our way to
the
included while camping, hiking or trekking, and these are usually prepared
by
t anyone told us this was serious trekking and we would be climbing
Although abseiling, canoeing and trekking are involved, no previous
Tennis, swimming, sailing and pony-trekking are all available nearby and
the
sailing, horse riding and pony trekking are all nearby. The standards
of
majority of backpackers, my year trekking around Asia passed without
serious
tropical islands in the south, to trekking by elephant river rafting and
plates, cutlery etc). A typical trekking day is governed more by the
Asian
here including horse riding, trekking, fishing, jet-boating, forest
51 563038 [p] GUIDEBOOKS: Pakistan Trekking Guide and Introduction to
A Londoner decided to try a pony-trekking holiday for a change, though he
32, was heading for a four-week trekking holiday. Her father Dr Colin
Leon
city of Petra, plus a day's camel trekking in the wildly beautiful oasis
of
This expedition includes 8 days trekking in the little known northern
lunch. You can also go llama trekking in the South Downs (Saddler's
very little else to do. The people trekking in the Hindu Kush or serving
with the expense. Bredenkamp was trekking in the Himalayas when the
Trek/Support Vehicle. [p] Comment: Trekking is rated as moderate involving
High altitude and long distance trekking make this a journey (average 6-
until August at Boughton, before trekking north to his Scottish estates
at
[p] [p] PHOTO WITH CAPTION Pony trekking on the Gower Peninsula in South
of the UK cost. You'll need a trekking permit for at least 21 days
pound;
faint hearted. She does not have trekking ponies; we rode full-blooded
harks back to `my day", yet trekking round the US at coaching
clinics,
generously enriched during the trekking season with a profusion of wild
nomad/Simon Fox [p] 4 Energetic trekking/Steve mchardy [p] [h] Morocco
[/h]
[/h] [p] Whether hacking or pony trekking, the wealth of tracks and
bridle
dispensing with a sector of lowland trekking. Then set out to walk through
blue
on using Morse code. While trekking through the jungle junior Army
spend their time mountaineering, trekking through the jungles of Borneo
and
of villagers have fled on foot, trekking through the mountains over
donkey
to the sunrise on canvas - and trekking to the privy in the dark to the
of larger-than-life characters trekking to the North Pole or climbing
the
Chogeria roadhead (10,800'), begin trekking via Mugi Hill to Lake Ellis (4-
activities including cycling, pony trekking, watersports, golf and
climbing.
and waiting to wed another (and trekking west). Then there is a
itinerary/Coach/Train. [p] Comment: Trekking with ponies is moderately
"Trek" didn't yield anything more diverse in Cobuild.
Loekie Ratelkous
"Einde O'Callaghan" <einde.oc...@planet-interkom.de> schreef in
bericht news:bjo57i$ksf6t$1...@ID-93601.news.uni-berlin.de...
[...]
>
> With a forename like Einde, pronounced something like the German word
> "Ende", there are a number of jokes, but I heard them all in school many
> decades ago. ;-)
>
> Regards, Einde O'Callaghan
>
Now that you mention it yourself: Be glad not to live in Holland: here
such a name could very well finish you ... :-)
L.
Laura E. Czeschick
True. But unfortunately some of us remember the once famous "Dubliners" and
their hilarious song "Seven drunken nights" - or happened to read Frank
McCourt's novel "Angela's Ashes" ... so, if you think it's a stereotype
don't fuel it that nicely! Btw there's the stereotype of heavily drinking
Russians as well, and when my Russian friends from St. Petersburg come for
their annual visit, I ask myself how much of a stereotype it really is :-))
(And from an Italian point of view it's the Germans who are heavy drinkers.)
Laura
Michael Hemmer
> Michael Hemmer wrote:
>>Einde O'Callaghan wrote:
>>>No jokes, but one stereotype is of the heavy-drinking Irishman (or
>>>Irishwoman, for that matter)
>>
>>I don't think this stereotype extends to Irishwomen
>>(regardless of the color of their hair).
>
> their hilarious song "Seven drunken nights"
... or this line from "[I wish I was in] Carrickfergus":
"I'm drunk today, but I'm seldom sober"
Michael
Evertjan.
> I am told that the English term "trecking" is an anglicised version of
> the Dutch (Afkrikans) "trekking" which was a form of homeseeking.
Not quite:
Dutch and Afrikaans [aa!] has "trek" and the verb "trekken":
"trekken" has the meaning of a more days travelling from one place along
a specified route to a specific other destination.
cf: the half yearly [bird] "vogeltrek"
The basic meaning of "trekken" is "to pull".
vo·gel·trek (de ~ (m.))
1 het trekken van vogels naar andere streken op geregelde tijden en langs
vaste routes
> If term is now synonymous with "Wandern" then
> we have witnessed a subtle change in meaning, oder?
Ge. "Wandern" is probably just being on youe way without a route or
destination. English "trekking" still has the idea of route, moredayness
and destination that is not the same as the starting point. You cannot go
trekking just for two hours.
Then again Dutch has:
"rondtrekken" which is more or less Ge: "wandern"
"vertrekken" = "to depart".
--
Evertjan.
The Netherlands.
(Please change the x'es to dots in my emailaddress)
Richard Loebner
from "Laura E. Czeschick" <Laura.C...@t-online.de> contains these words:
> snip <
> don't fuel it that nicely! Btw there's the stereotype of heavily drinking
> Russians as well, and when my Russian friends from St. Petersburg come for
> their annual visit, I ask myself how much of a stereotype it really is :-))
> (And from an Italian point of view it's the Germans who are heavy drinkers.)
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Do not forget the Finns, they have an equally sordid reputation for
becoming legless on Vodka, or any strong drink you care to mention.
Michael Hemmer
> Ge. "Wandern" is probably just being on youe way without a route or
> destination. English "trekking" still has the idea of route, moredayness
> and destination that is not the same as the starting point. You cannot go
> trekking just for two hours.
That's probably why German has adopted "Trekking". (Usual marketing
considerations still apply, of course.) However, my feeling is that
"Wandern" *does* imply having a route and/or a destination. Anything
else is probably just "Spazierengehen".
Michael
Bettina Price
"Wandern" shouldn't be confused with the English "to wander". The latter
does sort of imply aimlessness, but the German word means to travel (far) on
foot. Wanderschaft also used to be the year-long journey a journeyman would
go on. "Auf Wanderschaft im Himalaya" would be "Trekking in the Himalayas".
Bettina
Richard Loebner
from Hans-Peter Fischer <no....@hotmail.com> contains these words:
> snip <
> They all apparently differ in mph and the kind of ridiculous movements
> you make while propelling your flabby carcass forward and, most
> importantly, require a different "Outfit".
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I recall "Traininganzug" (ca. 1931), but "Outfit" is outragishly new
(2003) to me.
Perhaps 2004 will produce "Strip"?
Gary Vellenzer
> On 11/09/03 09:41, Bettina Price wrote:
> > Hieß das nicht mal wandern?
>
> nicht "Halloween". ;-)
>
Habe die Deutschen den Nicholaus tatsaechlich nach Ende Oktober verlegt?
Gary
Bettina Price
No, but you do something like trick or treating on Nikolaus, but without the
blackmail aspect (if you don't count the threat of singing carols at
people).
Bettina
Einde O'Callaghan
as regards the jar, as both her own testimony and her repertoire show.
And I've certainly known a number of other Irish women who could hold
their own in any company of men, indeed they have been known to drink
many men under the table. Not stereotypes, but real individuals.
Regards, Einde O'Callaghan
John Woodgate
<mhemmer@nospam_samson.de> wrote (in <3f601...@news.arcor-ip.de>)
about 'Inselaffen - has anyone heard this before?', on Thu, 11 Sep 2003:
'A fine, big, strong lump of an aggericultural ((ethnic spelling) Irish
girl is Mary Anne McCool...'
'... if there's any gin around, it's Mary Anne that takes it.'
and '...the fill of your arms of Irish love is Mary Anne McCool.'
I can't say that I find any of those assertions disagreeable. (;-)
John Woodgate
<Laura.C...@t-online.de> wrote (in <bjplqo$nqt$05$1@news.t-
online.com>) about 'Inselaffen - has anyone heard this before?', on Thu,
11 Sep 2003:
>Btw there's the stereotype of
>heavily drinking Russians as well, and when my Russian friends from St.
>Petersburg come for their annual visit, I ask myself how much of a
>stereotype it really is :-)) (And from an Italian point of view it's the
>Germans who are heavy drinkers.)
But for every bottle of Piesporter Goldtropchen (10% ethanol if you are
lucky) the Germans drink, the Russians drink one bottle of Stolichnaya
(20% ethanol or more).
John Woodgate
<rich...@zetnet.co.uk> wrote (in <200309111...@zetnet.co.uk>)
about 'Inselaffen - has anyone heard this before?', on Thu, 11 Sep 2003:
>becoming legless on Vodka, or any strong drink you care to mention.
Vodka is not the best leg-paralyser. Rough scrumpy takes some beating.
You feel quite OK, UNTIL you try to stand up. (;-)
John Woodgate
about 'Inselaffen - has anyone heard this before?', on Thu, 11 Sep 2003:
true German consonant combination, surely?
Einde O'Callaghan
> I read in sci.lang.translation that Richard Loebner
> <rich...@zetnet.co.uk> wrote (in <200309111...@zetnet.co.uk>)
> about 'Inselaffen - has anyone heard this before?', on Thu, 11 Sep 2003:
>
>>Do not forget the Finns, they have an equally sordid reputation for
>>becoming legless on Vodka, or any strong drink you care to mention.
>
>
> Vodka is not the best leg-paralyser. Rough scrumpy takes some beating.
> You feel quite OK, UNTIL you try to stand up. (;-)
Yes, I remember the feeling. In a pub in Zummerzett where they would
only sell teh scrumpy by teh half-pint. I had two halves and then tried
to go to teh toilet, but my legs kept going in another direction to teh
one my brain wanted to go, but i felt absolutely stone-cold sober. weird
experience. ;-)
Regards, Einde O'Callaghan
Einde O'Callaghan
> I read in sci.lang.translation that Michael Hemmer
> <mhemmer@nospam_samson.de> wrote (in <3f601...@news.arcor-ip.de>)
> about 'Inselaffen - has anyone heard this before?', on Thu, 11 Sep 2003:
>
>>John Woodgate wrote:
>>
>>>I read in sci.lang.translation that Hans-Peter Fischer
>>><no....@hotmail.com> wrote (in <bjnltb$esh$1...@online.de>) about
>>>'Inselaffen - has anyone heard this before?', on Wed, 10 Sep 2003:
>>>
>>>>those "trecking
>>>>supply items"
>>>
>>>Just for the record, it's 'trekking', one of the few words in British
>>>English that has 'kk' in it.
>>
>>The same holds for German, though you can sometimes find "Trecking" as well.
>>
>
> Surely that a calque for a non-existent English spelling? 'CK' isn't a
> true German consonant combination, surely?
Well, there's "backen" and "Bäcker" among other. It indicates that the
vowel before is short. The combinattion "-kk-" is unusual in German.
Regards, Einde O'Callaghan
John Woodgate
se.demon.co.uk> wrote (in <bjp93g$lk3qp$1...@ID-138239.news.uni-berlin.de>)
about 'Inselaffen - has anyone heard this before?', on Thu, 11 Sep 2003:
perhaps may not) be much more purposive than 'wandern', as I understand
the words:
Das Wandern ist des Müllers Lust,
Das Wandern!
Das muß ein schlechter Müller sein,
Dem niemals fiel das Wandern ein,
Das Wandern.
John Woodgate
<muste...@musterland.gov> wrote (in <HpX7b.175$P14...@newsfep1-gui.se
rver.ntli.net>) about 'Inselaffen - has anyone heard this before?', on
Thu, 11 Sep 2003:
>To me... a trek can either be any long walk or arduous walk, this will
>often come to mean any walk of such where the people were unsure of the
>route or even desination: We trekked round town all day...
This, IMHO, is an incorrect usage.
>
>It can also mean a long/arduous walk with a specific goal, where the
>traveller is in full knowledge of the task, even to the point of it
>sounding grandiose (nearing pilgrimage): He went off an a trek to India
yes, specific goal is right, even if it's just a Scout trek, where the
specific goal is purely recreational.
>
>Then amongst recreational walkers a trek and associated will often refer
>to long distance walking, often implying abroad. There may have once
>been a more technical definition than this, but if there was it seems
>now to be inundated with the 'long foreign walk in scenic territory' one
>that is popular with the tourist industry.
It doesn't have to be foreign.
>
>I do suspect however, the first definition I gave is more common, but
>seems to be rare in print?
Because it's a relatively recent corruption of the original meaning. It
might even be a corruption of 'schlepping'!
John Woodgate
.net> wrote (in <Xns93F3A4AC...@194.109.133.29>) about
'Inselaffen - has anyone heard this before?', on Thu, 11 Sep 2003:
>moredayness
Pardon?
nyra
But the exact date is regional, no? Where i come from, the winterly
"Heischebrauch" took place on 30 November (St. Andreas); and in other
places, it's connected to the Dreikönigstag (a.k.a. Epiphanias, 6
January). Nikolaus was just a tradition where small gifts were put in
one's boots at night.
German christmas "folklore" has copy-pasted a lot of english/american
christmas tradition recently, like Father Christmas often being
labelled "Santa Claus", and reindeer making an appearance as the
steeds that pull his sleigh, instead of the more reasonable horses.
--
Das Mittel dieser Schrift / Macht, dass dich kein' Kugel trifft.
Asa vitom rahoremarhi ahe menalem renah oremi nasiore ene nahores ore
eldit ita ardes inabe ine nie nei alomade sas ani ita ahe elime arnam
asa locre rahel nei vivet aroseli ditan Veloselas Herodan ebi menises
asa elitira eve harsari erida sacer elachimai nei elerisa.
- H.J.C.v.Grimmelshausen, Simplicissimus Teutsch
John Woodgate
'Inselaffen - has anyone heard this before?', on Thu, 11 Sep 2003:
>The wheel is turning but the hamster is dead.
What is that a Babelfish translation of? (;-)
John Woodgate
about 'Inselaffen - has anyone heard this before?', on Thu, 11 Sep 2003:
>No, but you do something like trick or treating on Nikolaus,
When is Nikolaus? December 6?
> but without
>the blackmail aspect (if you don't count the threat of singing carols at
>people).
You can sing carols to me at any time (but the pay rate may be
unattractive).(;-) Do you sing 'Sďo gan' (as my dictionary has it, or
'Suo gan' as I've also seen) to your baby?
John Woodgate
<3F60E53B...@gmx.net>) about 'Inselaffen - has anyone heard this
before?', on Thu, 11 Sep 2003:
>Das Mittel dieser Schrift / Macht, dass dich kein' Kugel trifft.
>Asa vitom rahoremarhi ahe menalem renah oremi nasiore ene nahores ore
>eldit ita ardes inabe ine nie nei alomade sas ani ita ahe elime arnam
>asa locre rahel nei vivet aroseli ditan Veloselas Herodan ebi menises
>asa elitira eve harsari erida sacer elachimai nei elerisa.
>- H.J.C.v.Grimmelshausen, Simplicissimus Teutsch
>
What IS this stuff?
Evertjan.
> I read in sci.lang.translation that Evertjan. <exjxw.hannivoort@interxnl
> .net> wrote (in <Xns93F3A4AC...@194.109.133.29>) about
> 'Inselaffen - has anyone heard this before?', on Thu, 11 Sep 2003:
>
>>moredayness
>
> Pardon?
No.
nyra
>
> I read in sci.lang.translation that Bettina Price <bettina+usenet@pappna
> se.demon.co.uk> wrote (in <bjp93g$lk3qp$1...@ID-138239.news.uni-berlin.de>)
> about 'Inselaffen - has anyone heard this before?', on Thu, 11 Sep 2003:
> >Michael Hemmer wrote:
> >> John Woodgate wrote:
> >>> I read in sci.lang.translation that Hans-Peter Fischer
> >>> <no....@hotmail.com> wrote (in <bjnltb$esh$1...@online.de>) about
> >>> 'Inselaffen - has anyone heard this before?', on Wed, 10 Sep 2003:
> >>>> those "trecking
> >>>> supply items"
> >>>
> >>> Just for the record, it's 'trekking', one of the few words in British
> >>> English that has 'kk' in it.
> >>
> >> The same holds for German, though you can sometimes find "Trecking"
> >> as well.
> >>
> >
> >Hieß das nicht mal wandern?
Das Verb ist nach wie vor in Gebrauch. Ich habe noch nie jemanden
sagen hören, er wäre von A nach B "getrekt", "gewalkt"[x] oder
"ge-nordic-walkt".
[x] "walken" gibt's auch, aber es findet sich fast nur in der
Zusammensetzung "durchwalken", ein Synonym von verbleuen, verdreschen,
versimsen, verkloppen, usw.
> I *think* I understand that, and my answer is that 'trekking' *may* (or
> perhaps may not) be much more purposive than 'wandern', as I understand
> the words:
>
> Das Wandern ist des Müllers Lust,
> Das Wandern!
> Das muß ein schlechter Müller sein,
> Dem niemals fiel das Wandern ein,
> Das Wandern.
Written by Wilhelm Müller (1794-1827). Seriously.
'Wandern' only describes the general activity and doesn't imply
anything about purpose or direction; it can describe a vague "being on
the move" like above just as well as purposeful travel from one place
to another:
Ein Stiefel wandern und sein Knecht
von Knickebühl gen Entenbrecht.
(Chr. Morgenstern, Der Gingganz)
--
Richard Loebner
from nyra <ny...@gmx.net> contains these words:
> snip <
> 'Wandern' only describes the general activity and doesn't imply
> anything about purpose or direction; it can describe a vague "being on
> snip <
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Is that so?
What about Wandervögel?
A borrowing from "migrating birds" to signify people dedicated to
roaming the countryside, called ramblers in England where there is an
Association of that name.
nyra
>
> I read in sci.lang.translation that nyra <ny...@gmx.net> wrote (in
> <3F60E53B...@gmx.net>) about 'Inselaffen - has anyone heard this
> before?', on Thu, 11 Sep 2003:
> >
> What IS this stuff?
A Trithemius-style cypher. The incipit actually is the key.
--
John Woodgate
before?', on Fri, 12 Sep 2003:
>John Woodgate schrieb:
>>
>> I read in sci.lang.translation that nyra <ny...@gmx.net> wrote (in
>> <3F60E53B...@gmx.net>) about 'Inselaffen - has anyone heard this
>> before?', on Thu, 11 Sep 2003:
>> <.sig; see below>
>> >
>> What IS this stuff?
>
>A Trithemius-style cypher. The incipit actually is the key.
>
'Trithemius'.
Bettina Price
> I read in sci.lang.translation that Bettina Price
> <bettina+usenet@pappna se.demon.co.uk> wrote (in
> <bjqj82$lsfec$1...@ID-138239.news.uni-berlin.de>) about 'Inselaffen -
> has anyone heard this before?', on Thu, 11 Sep 2003:
>
>> No, but you do something like trick or treating on Nikolaus,
>
> When is Nikolaus? December 6?
>
>> but without
>> the blackmail aspect (if you don't count the threat of singing
>> carols at people).
>
> You can sing carols to me at any time (but the pay rate may be
> unattractive).(;-) Do you sing 'Sďo gan' (as my dictionary has it, or
> 'Suo gan' as I've also seen) to your baby?
Nope. At the moment, her favourite one is "Backe, backe Kuchen" when she is
lying on the changing table.
Bettina
Michael Hemmer
> "Wandern" shouldn't be confused with the English "to wander". The latter
> does sort of imply aimlessness,
This reminds me of a Linux fortune cookie:
"Don't let your mind wander. It's too little to be let out alone."
Michael
Jan Willem
>John Woodgate schrieb:
>>
>> I read in sci.lang.translation that nyra <ny...@gmx.net> wrote (in
>> <3F60E53B...@gmx.net>) about 'Inselaffen - has anyone heard this
>> before?', on Thu, 11 Sep 2003:
>> <.sig; see below>
>> >
>> What IS this stuff?
>
>A Trithemius-style cypher. The incipit actually is the key.
It is. Take the middle road or you'll get shit onto.
Jan Willem from Odijk, Netherlands
e-mail in From-field is wrong, real e-mail is:
jw.van.dormolen @ hccnet.nl (without the spaces)
--
And then there's this:
What this world needs is someone who knows what this world needs.
Jan Willem
<rich...@zetnet.co.uk> wrote:
>The message <bjplqo$nqt$05$1...@news.t-online.com>
>from "Laura E. Czeschick" <Laura.C...@t-online.de> contains these words:
>
>> snip <
>
>> don't fuel it that nicely! Btw there's the stereotype of heavily drinking
>> Russians as well, and when my Russian friends from St. Petersburg come for
>> their annual visit, I ask myself how much of a stereotype it really is :-))
>> (And from an Italian point of view it's the Germans who are heavy drinkers.)
>
>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>
>Do not forget the Finns, they have an equally sordid reputation for
>becoming legless on Vodka, or any strong drink you care to mention.
And the Swedes (I've seen them crawl home on hand and feet). And
Polish. And...
Jan Willem from Odijk, Netherlands
e-mail in From-field is wrong, real e-mail is:
jw.van.dormolen @ hccnet.nl (without the spaces)
--
And then there's this:
It is easier to fight for one's principles than to live up to them.
Alan Crozier
news:9qs2mvss3f1o6k566...@4ax.com...
> On Thu, 11 Sep 2003 13:40:15 +0100, Richard Loebner
> <rich...@zetnet.co.uk> wrote:
>
> >The message <bjplqo$nqt$05$1...@news.t-online.com>
> >from "Laura E. Czeschick" <Laura.C...@t-online.de> contains these
words:
> >
> >> snip <
> >
> >> don't fuel it that nicely! Btw there's the stereotype of heavily
drinking
> >> Russians as well, and when my Russian friends from St. Petersburg come
for
> >> their annual visit, I ask myself how much of a stereotype it really is
:-))
> >> (And from an Italian point of view it's the Germans who are heavy
drinkers.)
> >
> >~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> >
> >Do not forget the Finns, they have an equally sordid reputation for
> >becoming legless on Vodka, or any strong drink you care to mention.
>
> And the Swedes (I've seen them crawl home on hand and feet).
... and I've seen some of them just returning to Sweden after a bloody long
crawl from the Netherlands, looking the worse for the wear, and some of them
still with a long way to go from the south coast ...
Alan
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Alan Crozier
Skatteberga 1392
247 92 Södra Sandby
Sweden
TO REPLY BY E-MAIL: change Crazier to Crozier
mustermann
"Einde O'Callaghan" <einde.oc...@planet-interkom.de> wrote in message
news:bjqmoj$ln67o$1...@ID-93601.news.uni-berlin.de...
Lol! The only time I have puked on alcohol as an adult was after drinking 2
liters of Scrumpy over the course of a party???
:-)
> Regards, Einde O'Callaghan
>
mustermann
> <rich...@zetnet.co.uk> wrote:
>
> >The message <bjplqo$nqt$05$1...@news.t-online.com>
> >from "Laura E. Czeschick" <Laura.C...@t-online.de> contains these
words:
> >
> >> snip <
> >
> >> don't fuel it that nicely! Btw there's the stereotype of heavily
drinking
> >> Russians as well, and when my Russian friends from St. Petersburg come
for
> >> their annual visit, I ask myself how much of a stereotype it really is
:-))
> >> (And from an Italian point of view it's the Germans who are heavy
drinkers.)
> >
> >~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> >
> >Do not forget the Finns, they have an equally sordid reputation for
> >becoming legless on Vodka, or any strong drink you care to mention.
>
> And the Swedes (I've seen them crawl home on hand and feet). And
> Polish. And...
Try a Saturday in Glasgow's Sauchiehall St, you'll get the whole gamut.
People crawl, puking, crying, shouting, fighting etc. For a more comedic
angle try wandering around the City of London at kicking out time on a
Friday. You'll wonder how on earth we have managed to sustain a position in
the G7 nations!
;-)
mustermann
"John Woodgate" <j...@jmwa.demon.contraspam.yuk> wrote in message
news:n9JMpxGSNOY$Ew...@jmwa.demon.co.uk...
> I read in sci.lang.translation that mustermann
> <muste...@musterland.gov> wrote (in <HpX7b.175$P14...@newsfep1-gui.se
> rver.ntli.net>) about 'Inselaffen - has anyone heard this before?', on
> Thu, 11 Sep 2003:
>
> >To me... a trek can either be any long walk or arduous walk, this will
> >often come to mean any walk of such where the people were unsure of the
> >route or even desination: We trekked round town all day...
>
> This, IMHO, is an incorrect usage.
> >
> >It can also mean a long/arduous walk with a specific goal, where the
> >traveller is in full knowledge of the task, even to the point of it
> >sounding grandiose (nearing pilgrimage): He went off an a trek to India
>
> yes, specific goal is right, even if it's just a Scout trek, where the
> specific goal is purely recreational.
> >
> >Then amongst recreational walkers a trek and associated will often refer
> >to long distance walking, often implying abroad. There may have once
> >been a more technical definition than this, but if there was it seems
> >now to be inundated with the 'long foreign walk in scenic territory' one
> >that is popular with the tourist industry.
>
> It doesn't have to be foreign.
> >
> >I do suspect however, the first definition I gave is more common, but
> >seems to be rare in print?
>
> Because it's a relatively recent corruption of the original meaning. It
> might even be a corruption of 'schlepping'!
Hmm,in respect to US-En, I suspect that may even agree with the first usage
I gave? I assume it had some to do with "dreck"... going for the obvious as
per usual!
;-)