konsento
Paul Pieper
I have a vocabulary book ("Japanese Vocabulary", Eguchi/Yamada) that lists
コンセント (konsento) as meaning "electrical socket/outlet". What is the
origin of this? Is this the typical japanese term for an electrical outlet?
Seeing that word in Katakana, I would have guessed that it meant
"consent".
Another question while I'm at it - does anyone in Japan still say だいだ
い色 (daidaiiro) instead of the apparently more popular オレンジ？ I don't
really know enough about this to comment on it, but part of me finds it
absurd that a loanword is necessary for something as fundamental as a color.
Paul Pieper
Kevin Wayne Williams
>
> I have a vocabulary book ("Japanese Vocabulary", Eguchi/Yamada) that lists
> コンセント (konsento) as meaning "electrical socket/outlet". What is the
> origin of this? Is this the typical japanese term for an electrical outlet?
Yes, it is typical. My understanding is that it come from "concentric
plug", which is apparently a British term for a particular type of
electrical outlet.EDICT backs that derivation, and my Japanese
instructor agreed.
KWW
Sean Holland
ppi...@peoplepc.com wrote on 02/01/03 9:59 AM:
1. According to EDict, コンセント derives from "concentric plug," an English
term not familiar to me, a native speaker of English who has done a fair bit
of home wiring.
2. I have heard 橙色, but it is nowhere near as common as オレンジ色. How
about khaki, beige, maroon and so on? Before the raj, could English speakers
talk about the colour khaki? Perhaps they used beige. But what did they say
prior to the Norman invasion?
And here's an excerpt from
http://www.worldwidewords.org/articles/colour.htm
"The colour orange derives originally from the Sanskrit word narangah for
the fruit, whose name moved westwards through Persian narang and Arabic
naranj to Spanish (the Arabs imported it into Europe via Moorish Spain in
medieval times); in French it became corrupted to orange, in part by the
process called metanalysis but also through being strongly influenced by the
name of the town of Orange in south-eastern France which used to be a centre
of the orange trade."
It would seem to me that colour words are somewhat susceptible to change
through fashion. Just ask an interior designer to talk about colour. You'll
probably hear a lot of words you didn't know were English.
---
http://www.nowhereradio.com/artists/album.php?aid=2238&alid=-1
http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/456/sean_r_holland.html
http://www3.telus.net/seanworld/
Charles Eicher
>
>
>
>I have a vocabulary book ("Japanese Vocabulary", Eguchi/Yamada) that lists
>コンセント (konsento) as meaning "electrical socket/outlet". What is the
>origin of this? Is this the typical japanese term for an electrical outlet?
> Seeing that word in Katakana, I would have guessed that it meant
>"consent".
consento=Concentric plug, as others have noted.
>Another question while I'm at it - does anyone in Japan still say だいだ
>い色 (daidaiiro) instead of the apparently more popular オレンジ？ I
>don't
>really know enough about this to comment on it, but part of me finds it
>absurd that a loanword is necessary for something as fundamental as a color.
Color isn't really that fundamental, it was not widely understood until Newton
published his Opticks book in 1704. Most of the previous nomenclature came from
artists, who have many different ways of thinking about colors. A broad, cheap
spectrum of colors only really became available in the 19th century when the
Germans invented anniline dyes. This roughly corresponds to the Meiji era, when
foreign colors became wildly popular. I'm not sure why these color names don't
retain germannic sounds, since German is a huge source of gairaigo. I think a
lot of these colors were imported originally by the Dutch. I note that my
kogojiten has a list of Classical Japanese color names, with swatches to show
the colors. Alas I can't find it just this moment, or I'd do some further
research.
In any case, how would YOU create kanji for colors like pink or magenta? Or for
that matter, what would you call modern artificial colors like Day-Glo Yellow?
Dale Walker
wrote:
>in article v18vogf...@corp.supernews.com, Paul Pieper at
>ppi...@peoplepc.com wrote on 02/01/03 9:59 AM:
>
>>
>>
>> I have a vocabulary book ("Japanese Vocabulary", Eguchi/Yamada) that lists
>> コンセント (konsento) as meaning "electrical socket/outlet". What is the
>> origin of this? Is this the typical japanese term for an electrical outlet?
>> Seeing that word in Katakana, I would have guessed that it meant
>> "consent".
>> Another question while I'm at it - does anyone in Japan still say だいだ
>> い色 (daidaiiro) instead of the apparently more popular オレンジ？ I don't
>> really know enough about this to comment on it, but part of me finds it
>> absurd that a loanword is necessary for something as fundamental as a color.
>>
>> Paul Pieper
>>
>>
>1. According to EDict, コンセント derives from "concentric plug," an English
>term not familiar to me, a native speaker of English who has done a fair bit
>of home wiring.
They're those little plugs that fit into Walkmans and most other
portable electronic devices.
-------------------------------------------------------------
| Dale Walker London Techno Events Saiko! |
| da...@sorted.org lon...@sorted.org sa...@sorted.org |
| London, UK london.sorted.org saiko.sorted.org |
-------------------------------------------------------------
Kevin Wayne Williams
> On Thu, 02 Jan 2003 18:34:52 GMT, Sean Holland <seanh...@telus.net>
> wrote:
>
>
>>in article v18vogf...@corp.supernews.com, Paul Pieper at
>>ppi...@peoplepc.com wrote on 02/01/03 9:59 AM:
>>
>>
>>>
>>>I have a vocabulary book ("Japanese Vocabulary", Eguchi/Yamada) that lists
>>>コンセント (konsento) as meaning "electrical socket/outlet". What is the
>>>origin of this? Is this the typical japanese term for an electrical outlet?
>>>Seeing that word in Katakana, I would have guessed that it meant
>>>"consent".
>>>Another question while I'm at it - does anyone in Japan still say だいだ
>>>い色 (daidaiiro) instead of the apparently more popular オレンジ？ I don't
>>>really know enough about this to comment on it, but part of me finds it
>>>absurd that a loanword is necessary for something as fundamental as a color.
>>>
>>>Paul Pieper
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>1. According to EDict, コンセント derives from "concentric plug," an English
>>term not familiar to me, a native speaker of English who has done a fair bit
>>of home wiring.
>>
>
> They're those little plugs that fit into Walkmans and most other
> portable electronic devices.
Isn't there some form of outlet for the household main electrical supply
that is called a "concentric outlet" in British? コンセント is used for
household style outlets.
KWW
Farrell
news:l9a91v42vld2ba83j...@4ax.com...
> On Thu, 02 Jan 2003 18:34:52 GMT, Sean Holland <seanh...@telus.net>
> wrote:
>
> >in article v18vogf...@corp.supernews.com, Paul Pieper at
> >ppi...@peoplepc.com wrote on 02/01/03 9:59 AM:
English
> >term not familiar to me, a native speaker of English who has done a fair
bit
> >of home wiring.
>
> They're those little plugs that fit into Walkmans and most other
> portable electronic devices.
>
or 2.5mm, 3.5mm, 1/4in plugs etc
never, ever, concentric
however, I have found a page where you can see what a concentric plug
actually is:
http://www.switchedmode.com/4450LT.htm
in the image, left hand side.
--
Iain Farrell
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Charles Eicher
>
>"Dale Walker" <da...@sorted.org> wrote in message
>news:l9a91v42vld2ba83j...@4ax.com...
>> On Thu, 02 Jan 2003 18:34:52 GMT, Sean Holland <seanh...@telus.net>
>> wrote:
>>
>> >in article v18vogf...@corp.supernews.com, Paul Pieper at
>> >ppi...@peoplepc.com wrote on 02/01/03 9:59 AM:
>> >1. According to EDict, コンセント derives from "concentric plug," an
>English
>> >term not familiar to me, a native speaker of English who has done a fair
>bit
>> >of home wiring.
>>
>> They're those little plugs that fit into Walkmans and most other
>> portable electronic devices.
>>
>I've always called those jack plugs...
>or 2.5mm, 3.5mm, 1/4in plugs etc
>never, ever, concentric
>
>however, I have found a page where you can see what a concentric plug
>actually is:
>http://www.switchedmode.com/4450LT.htm
>in the image, left hand side.
No. This is a concentric plug:
http://geo.ya.com/travelimages/electric-plugs.html
Look at Plug Type I. Note that it has an indented lip around the socket, and a
matching rim on the plug. The plug and socket rims are perfectly concentric when
fully engaged. As I understand it, this plug is a modification of an even
earlier type (which I couldn't find) that had the plug holes also arranged in a
concentric arrangement.
Dale Walker
wrote:
>"Dale Walker" <da...@sorted.org> wrote in message
>news:l9a91v42vld2ba83j...@4ax.com...
>> On Thu, 02 Jan 2003 18:34:52 GMT, Sean Holland <seanh...@telus.net>
>> wrote:
>>
>> >in article v18vogf...@corp.supernews.com, Paul Pieper at
>> >ppi...@peoplepc.com wrote on 02/01/03 9:59 AM:
>> >1. According to EDict, コンセント derives from "concentric plug," an
>English
>> >term not familiar to me, a native speaker of English who has done a fair
>bit
>> >of home wiring.
>>
>> They're those little plugs that fit into Walkmans and most other
>> portable electronic devices.
>>
>I've always called those jack plugs...
>or 2.5mm, 3.5mm, 1/4in plugs etc
>never, ever, concentric
I was taught that *officially* a jack is the socket where the plug
fits (i.e. the female side of a plug). Of course, common usage is not
necessarily the same. In my experience, 'jack plugs' are commonly used
to describe phono plugs (but never concentric plugs).
The name 'concentric' gives a massive clue to the format.
There are different types of plug and in the case where the plug
consists of a single shaft, there are several types, the phono plug
(used on headphones etc) and concentric (used to power low voltage
devices) and the RCA plug (mostly used with connecting bits of stereo
together). There's also the less common EIAJ Plug which is pretty
similar to the concentric plug and is also used to power low voltage
devices. I'll ignore the various kinds of shielded plugs used for TV
aerials, etc.
I think Americans might call concentric plugs, 'barrel plugs'
Try http://www.accesscomms.com.au/outputplugs.htm for a details of the
differences.
Dale Walker
<nih...@paxonet.kom> wrote:
>> They're those little plugs that fit into Walkmans and most other
>> portable electronic devices.
>
>
>Isn't there some form of outlet for the household main electrical supply
>that is called a "concentric outlet" in British? コンセント is used for
>household style outlets.
Nope. Only the little low power plugs connected to step down
transformers.
Torben Mikael Hansen
news:av2d1d$bg0ne$1...@ID-47035.news.dfncis.de...
> or 2.5mm, 3.5mm, 1/4in plugs etc
> never, ever, concentric
>
> however, I have found a page where you can see what a concentric plug
> actually is:
> http://www.switchedmode.com/4450LT.htm
> in the image, left hand side.
A more clear image can be found here
http://afholdsforeningen.dk/torhans/plug.jpg
(from http://www.rs-components.dk)
They are usually called "DC Adaptor Plugs" and as Dale wrote they are used
for connecting AC/DC adaptors to various portable devices.
Cheers
Torben
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Dale Walker
Sorry but that is definitely not a concentric plug. OK, the lip rim
might be concentric but that's the case with E, H, F and possibly C.
Surely the concentric part relates, as you say to the connectors
themselves.
Louise Bremner
> Isn't there some form of outlet for the household main electrical supply
> that is called a "concentric outlet" in British?
If so, I've never seen one, despite encountering some weird and
wonderful varieties of ancient wiring....
________________________________________________________________________
Louise Bremner (log at gol dot com)
If you want a reply by e-mail, don't write to my Yahoo address!
Charles Eicher
Right, just like I said. There is no image on any page I could find of a true
concentric plug. A true concentric has an external shape like Plug Type I but
the pins are arranged more like Plug Type H. Notice that Plug H has its pins
offcenter in the modern design.
Ross Klatte
>Date: 2003-01-02 18:42 Eastern Standard Time
>Message-id: <av2im4$bkb13$1...@ID-176039.news.dfncis.de>
>
>"Farrell" <SPAM...@tfhl.net> wrote in message
>news:av2d1d$bg0ne$1...@ID-47035.news.dfncis.de...
>> "Dale Walker" <da...@sorted.org> wrote in message
>> I've always called those jack plugs...
>> or 2.5mm, 3.5mm, 1/4in plugs etc
>> never, ever, concentric
>>
>> however, I have found a page where you can see what a concentric plug
>> actually is:
>> http://www.switchedmode.com/4450LT.htm
>> in the image, left hand side.
>
>A more clear image can be found here
>http://afholdsforeningen.dk/torhans/plug.jpg
>(from http://www.rs-components.dk)
>
>They are usually called "DC Adaptor Plugs" and as Dale wrote they are used
>for connecting AC/DC adaptors to various portable devices.
On the other hand,
http://www.protek.co.jp/kosher/sp9/index.html
has a picture of a surge protector with nine konsentos.
This konsento is clearly just a simple outlet for house current.
Since these outlets arrived long before modular phone jacks,
stereo plugs, RCA plugs, USB plugs, etc. there ought to have been
a time when "concentric" in English, either UK or US, meant
simply a wall outlet, or the simple two-flat-prong plug that is
inserted into a wall outlet. None of the plugs shown so far as
candidates for the original "konsento" meet that.
Ross Klatte
Roebuck, South Carolina
http://community.webshots.com/user/ross_klatte
Michael Cash
<fo...@paradis.dk> triumphed over native shyness and said:
>"Farrell" <SPAM...@tfhl.net> wrote in message
>news:av2d1d$bg0ne$1...@ID-47035.news.dfncis.de...
>> "Dale Walker" <da...@sorted.org> wrote in message
>> I've always called those jack plugs...
>> or 2.5mm, 3.5mm, 1/4in plugs etc
>> never, ever, concentric
>>
>> however, I have found a page where you can see what a concentric plug
>> actually is:
>> http://www.switchedmode.com/4450LT.htm
>> in the image, left hand side.
>
>A more clear image can be found here
>http://afholdsforeningen.dk/torhans/plug.jpg
>(from http://www.rs-components.dk)
>
>They are usually called "DC Adaptor Plugs" and as Dale wrote they are used
>for connecting AC/DC adaptors to various portable devices.
Of course, we all realize that the line the argument is taking is
getting us nowhere nearer understanding just how it is that the
current style of home electrical outlet in Japan came to be called a
コンセント, don't we?
I'm going to point out a few things, just as something to think about.
1. Even today, Japanese homes (by American standards, at any rate)
have a woeful shortage of electrical sockets in the wall. There just
aren't that many. Even in the short time I have been in Japan, though,
I have noticed there is a trend to increasing the number of sockets
and placing them in more convenient locations. I would speculate that
in the dim mists of antiquity, when the term was first adopted, there
were even fewer sockets in Japanese homes.
2. Long ago, even in western countries, people used to use an adapter
from an overhead light socket to make up for the shortage of wall
sockets. Unscrew the lightbulb, screw in an adapter, and presto! you
have a standard socket you can use to plug in your toaster.
3. Now, how many of you have ever had the joy of moving into a
Japanese home/apartment only to discover that overhead light fixtures
aren't included? You often have to provide your own. Now, if you've
ever seen one of the sockets the light fixtures attach to, try to
recall what it looked like. (I'll post a jpg later for those who have
never seen one). You have two prongs, each having a radius (not flat).
They fit into two slots on the ceiling receptacle. These two slots
also have a radius. In fact, if you extended the curve of the two, you
would end up with a circle.
Could this be the source of the "concentric" thing?
--
Michael Cash
"No, Mr. Cash, I never said you would lose jewelry at the beach. I said
if you swam in the ocean you would leave a ring."
Prof. Ernest T. Bass
Mount Pilot College
http://www.sunfield.ne.jp/~mike/
http://www.oldies.jp
Chris Kern
the following:
>I note that my
>kogojiten has a list of Classical Japanese color names,
Genji Monogatari is well-known for having a huge number of words for
colors, some of which aren't clear today. Good taste mandated wearing
clothes of the correct color to suit the mood and the season, and
correspondingly there are a lot of color names.
Tyler's translation contains a 5-page glossary at the end devoted
entirely to color names (and a few clothing words).
-Chris
Michael Cash
triumphed over native shyness and said:
And it doesn't strike you as an exercise in masochism to read a tome
which requires a 5 page glossary at the end just to tell you what the
*colors* were?
Dale Walker
wrote:
But why? Concentric means "having a common centre". There has never
been such a plug for household mains use that I'm aware of in the UK
or the US for that matter. I can see no reason why anyone would want
to call a plug that is non-concentric "concentric". This has just got
to be another case of severe Japlish.
Chris Kern
<mike...@sunfield.ne.jp> posted the following:
>And it doesn't strike you as an exercise in masochism to read a tome
>which requires a 5 page glossary at the end just to tell you what the
>*colors* were?
I wouldn't say that it *requires* the glossary. Such a glossary would
really only be of interest to those who were studying the culture of
the period; it's not necessary to enjoy the story. I'm not really
sure why Tyler included it in the book.
-Chris
cei...@inav.net
>
>On 2 Jan 2003 11:16:19 -0800, Charles Eicher <cei...@inav.net> posted
>the following:
>
>>I note that my
>>kogojiten has a list of Classical Japanese color names,
>
>Genji Monogatari is well-known for having a huge number of words for
>colors, some of which aren't clear today. Good taste mandated wearing
>clothes of the correct color to suit the mood and the season, and
>correspondingly there are a lot of color names.
It wasn't just a matter of good taste, it was mandated by law in later eras. I
have heard these laws referred to as "sumptuary laws" although my research is
stymied because I have no idea what this law would be called in Japanese. We
used to have someone in slj who knew all about this stuff, that's where I heard
it from. I wonder where she went..? Anyway, sumptuary laws still exist in some
vague form, like the rule about what day students change from summer to winter
uniforms.
>
>Tyler's translation contains a 5-page glossary at the end devoted
>entirely to color names (and a few clothing words).
You should see the Obunsha kogojiten, it's got dozens of pages of detailed
illustrations of clothing, most of it seems specifically targeted at Genji
readers..
Charles Eicher
One of my teachers assures me this sartorial detail is essential to
understanding Genji, he says there are whole sections of the text which are just
detailed lists of clothing and regalia, each item and the sequence they come in
builds to some crescendo of sentiments, IF you know the symbology.. or something
like that. I don't know for sure, I dropped that class because the teacher only
showed up 3 times in the first 10 class sessions. I hunted him down once and he
was in his office making hiking maps for his upcoming vacation instead of
teaching the class. Ah, the things you can get away with when you have tenure...
MatthewOutland
is what an old salaryman needs so he can bang a 14 year old high school chick.
Michael Cash
triumphed over native shyness and said:
>"konsento"
>is what an old salaryman needs so he can bang a 14 year old high school chick.
1. 14 year old chicks would be in junior high, not high school.
2. It would still be illegal, even with consent.
Zachary Uram
>
>"konsento"
>is what an old salaryman needs so he can bang a 14 year old high school chick.
That would be pedophilia and is illegal in both Japan and the US. If
he did that he should be sent to prison.
Zach
Ross Klatte
> Date: 2003-01-02 22:18 Eastern Standard Time
> But why? Concentric means "having a common centre". There
> has never been such a plug for household mains use that
> I'm aware of in the UK or the US for that matter. I can
> see no reason why anyone would want to call a plug that
> is non-concentric "concentric". This has just got to be
> another case of severe Japlish.
Are we sure that "konsento" is gairaigo?
根線戸 could be Door-to-the-Line-to-the-Source
Fabian
"Michael Cash", who was busy planting flowers as I typed this, wrote:
> On 3 Jan 2003 00:35:15 -0800, moutla...@yahoo.com (MatthewOutland)
> triumphed over native shyness and said:
>
> >"konsento"
> >is what an old salaryman needs so he can bang a 14 year old high
school chick.
>
> 1. 14 year old chicks would be in junior high, not high school.
> 2. It would still be illegal, even with consent.
I was under the impression that each prefecture made the laws regarding
age of consent for women, so that it varied throughout the country
(allegedly 13 being the lowest), and the national limit of 18 referred
to the age at which a commercial transaction would be legal.
Of course either way, a) they're too young to be of interest to me that
way, and b) I am sure some of my students care not for such laws.
--
--
Fabian
Conspiracy theories are nothing more than a conspiracy to get people to
believe in conspiracies so that they can really conspire to do
something.
Michael Cash
triumphed over native shyness and said:
>On 3 Jan 2003 00:35:15 -0800, moutla...@yahoo.com (MatthewOutland)
>wrote:
>>
>>"konsento"
>>is what an old salaryman needs so he can bang a 14 year old high school chick.
>
>That would be pedophilia and is illegal in both Japan and the US.
Since when is pedophilia illegal?
dareka
> In article <v18vogf...@corp.supernews.com>, "Paul says...
> >
> >
> >
> >I have a vocabulary book ("Japanese Vocabulary", Eguchi/Yamada) that lists
> >origin of this? Is this the typical japanese term for an electrical outlet?
> > Seeing that word in Katakana, I would have guessed that it meant
> >"consent".
>
> consento=Concentric plug, as others have noted.
>
If what I read in google is not wrong, it is from 'konsento-plug',
a product a company began to sell in the late Taishou era.
Why it was named so is not known, so said in the source.
It's most likely that it is named after a product or products
in the UK or in the USA which it based the design on or they imported.
> >Another question while I'm at it - does anyone in Japan still say $B$@$$$@ (B
> > $B$$?' (B (daidaiiro) instead of the apparently more popular $B%*%l%s%8!) (B I
> >don't
> >really know enough about this to comment on it, but part of me finds it
> >absurd that a loanword is necessary for something as fundamental as a color.
>
> Color isn't really that fundamental, it was not widely understood until Newton
> published his Opticks book in 1704. Most of the previous nomenclature came from
> artists, who have many different ways of thinking about colors. A broad, cheap
> spectrum of colors only really became available in the 19th century when the
> Germans invented anniline dyes. This roughly corresponds to the Meiji era, when
> foreign colors became wildly popular. I'm not sure why these color names don't
> retain germannic sounds, since German is a huge source of gairaigo. I think a
> lot of these colors were imported originally by the Dutch. I note that my
> kogojiten has a list of Classical Japanese color names, with swatches to show
> the colors. Alas I can't find it just this moment, or I'd do some further
> research.
> In any case, how would YOU create kanji for colors like pink or magenta? Or for
> that matter, what would you call modern artificial colors like Day-Glo Yellow?
I don't think they don't say 'daidai' in Japan in these days.
I don't know whether 'orange' is more prefered than 'daidai' to mention the
color in Japan, but....
If you are interested, here is a link to a color chart which have Japanese
color names.
Chris Kern
the following:
>One of my teachers assures me this sartorial detail is essential to
>understanding Genji,
It depends on what you mean -- if you mean a *full* understanding on
the level that Murasaki's intended audience would have had, then yes
you do (but that's not really possible anyway).
I agree with Tyler, who says in his introduction that all the notes
and glossaries are helpful, but not required. I believe that Cindy's
recent reading of Genji did not have any sort of footnotes or cultural
background texts, and she seemed to enjoy it fine.
> he says there are whole sections of the text which are just
>detailed lists of clothing and regalia, each item and the sequence they come in
>builds to some crescendo of sentiments, IF you know the symbology.. or something
>like that.
Hmm, I only recall a few times where the colors actually affected the
story, but I'm no Genji scholar.
-Chris
Paul Blay
>
> "Michael Cash", who was busy planting flowers as I typed this, wrote:
> > On 3 Jan 2003 00:35:15 -0800, moutla...@yahoo.com (MatthewOutland)
> > triumphed over native shyness and said:
> >
> > >"konsento"
> > >is what an old salaryman needs so he can bang a 14 year old high
> > >school chick.
> >
> > 1. 14 year old chicks would be in junior high, not high school.
> > 2. It would still be illegal, even with consent.
>
> I was under the impression that each prefecture made the laws regarding
> age of consent for women, so that it varied throughout the country
> (allegedly 13 being the lowest), and the national limit of 18 referred
> to the age at which a commercial transaction would be legal.
I believe the laws, and / or implementation of same, have been tightened up
recently. I'm pretty sure Mike's statements are correct for the 'old salaryman'
in question, I'm not so sure what the position[*] is if a 14 year old 'junior high
school' boy was her partner.
[*] No jokes, please.
Zachary Uram
wrote:
>I was under the impression that each prefecture made the laws regarding
>age of consent for women, so that it varied throughout the country
>(allegedly 13 being the lowest), and the national limit of 18 referred
>to the age at which a commercial transaction would be legal.
>
>Of course either way, a) they're too young to be of interest to me that
>way, and b) I am sure some of my students care not for such laws.
13 and 14 year olds are still emotionally and usually intellectually
children and have no business having sex.
Zach
Zachary Uram
<mike...@sunfield.ne.jp> wrote:
>
>Since when is pedophilia illegal?
Since 1999.
Child Pornography Banned in Japan
Source: Yahoo News*, AP, May 18, 1999
Excerpts:
TOKYO - Japan's lower house of Parliament today banned the production
and sale of child pornography and outlawed sex with a minor, answering
mounting criticism over the country's lax sex-crime laws.
The new law bans the sale, distribution, production, possession and
trading of child pornography and imposes punishments of up to three
years in prison or fines of up to $24,400 for violators.
The legislation also makes it illegal to have sex with a minor 17 or
younger. Violators will face a prison term of up to three years and
fines of up to $8,100.
Michael Cash
triumphed over native shyness and said:
No, what you have demonstrated is that acts of pedophilia and the
sale, distribution, production, possession and trading of certain
depictions of acts of pedophilia are illegal. One is free to *be* a
pedophile, so long as one doesn't take any action.
If merely *being* a pedophile were illegal, half the male population
of Japan would be behind bars.
Don Kirkman
article <3E14B3E2...@paxonet.kom>:
>Dale Walker wrote:
>> On Thu, 02 Jan 2003 18:34:52 GMT, Sean Holland <seanh...@telus.net>
>> wrote:
>>>in article v18vogf...@corp.supernews.com, Paul Pieper at
>>>ppi...@peoplepc.com wrote on 02/01/03 9:59 AM:
>>>>I have a vocabulary book ("Japanese Vocabulary", Eguchi/Yamada) that lists
>>>>コンセント (konsento) as meaning "electrical socket/outlet". What is the
>>>>origin of this? Is this the typical japanese term for an electrical outlet?
>>>>Seeing that word in Katakana, I would have guessed that it meant
>>>>"consent".
>>>>Another question while I'm at it - does anyone in Japan still say だいだ
>>>>い色 (daidaiiro) instead of the apparently more popular オレンジ？ I don't
>>>>really know enough about this to comment on it, but part of me finds it
>>>>absurd that a loanword is necessary for something as fundamental as a color.
>>>1. According to EDict, コンセント derives from "concentric plug," an English
>>>term not familiar to me, a native speaker of English who has done a fair bit
>>>of home wiring.
But you speak English (American/Canadian), not English (As She is
Spoke).
>> They're those little plugs that fit into Walkmans and most other
>> portable electronic devices.
Those are more likely to be banana plugs (now rare) or RCA plugs, IME.
They fit into jacks rather than outlets or sockets.
>Isn't there some form of outlet for the household main electrical supply
>that is called a "concentric outlet" in British? コンセント is used for
>household style outlets.
That seems to be the concensus. My mental picture is of three or so
prongs equally spaced from the center rather than the two parallel
prongs (plus grounding contact) in the US.
--
Don
don...@covad.net
Don Kirkman
<BA39C64B.12180%seanh...@telus.net>:
>in article v18vogf...@corp.supernews.com, Paul Pieper at
>ppi...@peoplepc.com wrote on 02/01/03 9:59 AM:
>> I have a vocabulary book ("Japanese Vocabulary", Eguchi/Yamada) that lists
>> コンセント (konsento) as meaning "electrical socket/outlet". What is the
>> origin of this? Is this the typical japanese term for an electrical outlet?
>> Seeing that word in Katakana, I would have guessed that it meant
>> "consent".
>1. According to EDict, コンセント derives from "concentric plug," an English
>term not familiar to me, a native speaker of English who has done a fair bit
>of home wiring.
".. コンセント 和製英語で concentric plug の略らしい。 壁などに
付けられた差込口をさす ... wall) socket，power point ともいうらし
い ... "
[www2.nsknet.or.jp/~azuma/r/r0034.htm]
Can't vouch for the authenticity. Perhaps we needs some NSEE for
guidance?
--
Don
don...@covad.net
Don Kirkman
<q6j91vsjf6rir5smp...@4ax.com>:
>On Thu, 02 Jan 2003 21:51:33 GMT, Kevin Wayne Williams
><nih...@paxonet.kom> wrote:
>>> They're those little plugs that fit into Walkmans and most other
>>> portable electronic devices.
>>Isn't there some form of outlet for the household main electrical supply
>>that is called a "concentric outlet" in British? コンセント is used for
>>household style outlets.
>Nope. Only the little low power plugs connected to step down
>transformers.
Perhaps another example of shifting meanings. ISTM home electronics
must have been scarce when コンセント came to or was invented in Japan.
FWIW, what now seem to be called concentric plugs (multiple contact
rings strung along a single shaft) used to be called RCA plugs, at least
in US electronics.
If there's anyone who might know, were early Japanese wall outlets and
plugs configured such that they could reasonably be called "concentric"?
--
Don
don...@covad.net
Daniel Giaimo
"Zachary Uram" <net...@stargate.net> wrote in message
news:rljb1vc660eq0iagc...@4ax.com...
Whereas all the 18 year olds that are going around having sex
are fully formed adults.
--
Daniel Giaimo
Louise Bremner
> >Isn't there some form of outlet for the household main electrical supply
> >that is called a "concentric outlet" in British? コンセント is used for
> >household style outlets.
>
> That seems to be the concensus. My mental picture is of three or so
> prongs equally spaced from the center rather than the two parallel
> prongs (plus grounding contact) in the US.
Does that arrangement count as concentric?
I suspect that this is one of the terms that came into Japanese by
accident, and only later was it labelled as being English--like "wicket"
(for "ticket barrier") or "crossing" (for "cross-roads"). As soon as
someone says "but that's not English", the reply was "maybe not in the
variety of English you speak, but it's standard usage in <fitb>
English", where <fitb> refers to whichever nationality is not present.
________________________________________________________________________
Louise Bremner (log at gol dot com)
If you want a reply by e-mail, don't write to my Yahoo address!
Curt Fischer
>
> No, what you have demonstrated is that acts of pedophilia and the
> sale, distribution, production, possession and trading of certain
> depictions of acts of pedophilia are illegal. One is free to *be* a
> pedophile, so long as one doesn't take any action.
>
> If merely *being* a pedophile were illegal, half the male population
> of Japan would be behind bars.
Errrr, what? I thought of killing somebody once. Am I a murderer?
--
Curt Fischer
Fabian
he decided to throw it in the fire and write this instead:
Tell that to the Dutch.
But seriously, how can anyone keep a straight face while saying that all
humans above a certain age are emotionally, intellectually, and
physically mature enough to do any particular act? About the only one of
those that can be measured objectively is physical, and even that
depends on the person.
Kevin Wayne Williams
No, but if being homicidal was a crime, you could have been jailed.
Being homicidal is to being a murderer as being a pedophile is to being
a child molester.
KWW
Curt Fischer
What? You think just because you have the dictionary on your side
that'll for one minute beli....
I mean, dammit, I'm a native speaker of Engli...
...
<looks ashamedly at feet>
....ooops.
--
Curt Fischer
Michael Cash
triumphed over native shyness and said:
Two different things. Unless you think a person who is a latent
homosexual is guilty of sodomy or pedastery.
Michael Cash
triumphed over native shyness and said:
See?
Zachary Uram
<dgi...@rgiaimo.net> wrote:
>
> Whereas all the 18 year olds that are going around having sex
>are fully formed adults.
No most of them also immature. I belief it should wait for marriage
but that isn't the view in popular culture where people shag anything
that moves 24x7 it seems.
Zach
Hirofumi Nagamura
>
> I was under the impression that each prefecture made the laws regarding
> age of consent for women, so that it varied throughout the country
> (allegedly 13 being the lowest),
You've got it the other way around. The national criminal code (刑法)
sets the age of consent at 13:
（強姦）
第一七七条 暴行又は脅迫を用いて十三歳以上の女子を姦淫した者は、強姦
の罪とし、二年以上の有期懲役に処する。十三歳未満の女子を姦淫した者
も、同様とする。
Most prefectures have local laws, usually called 青少年保護条例 or
something along those lines, which raise the age of consent to 18. I
think I've heard there's just one prefecture that had no such law, but
I forget which.
> and the national limit of 18 referred
> to the age at which a commercial transaction would be legal.
Nah. The Prostitution Prevention Law (売春防止法) sayeth:
（売春の禁止）
第三条 何人も、売春をし、又はその相手方となつてはならない。
Doesn't say anything about age.
Cheers,
--
Hirofumi Nagamura
Kobe, Japan
James Annan
> That seems to be the concensus. My mental picture is of three or so
> prongs equally spaced from the center rather than the two parallel
> prongs (plus grounding contact) in the US.
Although UK plugs have 3 prongs, they could not be reasonably described
as concentric - it's an isosceles triangle (and was way back when round
pin 5 and 15A plugs were used, before the modern 13A standard). Anyway
concentric means sharing a common centre, not rotationally symmetric.
Incidentally, does the Japanese household electricity system seem feeble
to USAians too, or is yours similarly crippled? 10A (or 40A for the
whole house) seems pretty pathetic when it's only a 100V supply.
Especially when it is used so much for heating.
James